Guild Wars 2

Pardon my rage in game the other day, as I’m still stuck on why chill is allowed to hurt eles so badly.

Your crit dmg should go to around 35-40% post patch (free balling that number) full zerks will be able to pull around 60% and a balanced build like we run may stick around 40-50%.

I wish I could say this wasn’t an indirect buff to the condi meta, but it is. Know how serious I am when I say I’m considering switching to thief on the 15th.

It could be quite good. But it will be difficult to tell when your sigil procs.

Am I right in assuming it will stay 9 seconds or is there a chance it could go to 5 seconds?

Lol at Deany.

I have 5 80s, working on the last three slowly (They nerfed craft leveling.)

I think mobility is the king. If you’re not mobile, you’re nothing in an outnumbered situation.

I think that’s what makes warriors so great at the moment. They have great mobility. I don’t think they should be nerfed even (just GS rush). I think other classes like necro should be brought up to join them. (I do not play necro).

I think this should bring into account balance. You should spec for more mobility at a cost of some of your fighting ability. Don’t ask me how, it’s just an opinion.

Before I say what I say next I’d like to note that I am a roamer in wvw. I never run with more than 15, and even then that high of a number is a rare occasion. I prefer 5 mans or duo roaming. I enjoy solo roaming when people leave me alone lol.

So I’d like to say the health of roamer classes based on my perspective is Warrior>Thief>Ele/Ranger/Engineer>Mesmer/Guardian>Necro.

That’s where I believe the overall health is at, but I will also say conditions have an unhealthy position at the moment. They’re far too strong in a solo/small team position, yet far too weak in zergs. That needs to be addressed, as classes that downright shouldn’t touch condi specs are trying conditions out and sticking with them (for roaming and dueling.)

My best,
Nex

Dervish please. Scythe ftw.

I believe this is relevant to bring to the top again, especially given a topic I saw about thieves not affected by chill.

So. TTT.

I’m signed for 12.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

If you only play Ele and you’re terrified of being killed by only Impale, I don’t know what to tell you, since on its own, that skill should never kill you. Eles are garunteed to have at least one condition cleanse available (in fact, on a weapon skill, the only class that has this garuntee, I might add).

I recognize that Torment is very rarely the only condition that gets applied, but Impale on its own should never kill an ele.

When have I said I’m terrified of impale.. I swear some people can’t read.. It was a kittening test I did. I’ve died to conditions before, and it’ll happen again a hundred times. Same with power.

Eles specifically are more weak to conditions than other classes, however. Perhaps that’s why I see things differently than others in this thread, but don’t disrespect me by twisting my words for it.

No. They didn’t. There will still be options to at least hit 60%.

Dalanor.5387:

Mbelch.9028:

Sutek.3189:

So you die on condi, so what. Oneshot from thief way worse because you cannot see it coming and cannot cleanse it with condition removal.

I don’t personally get one shotted by thieves.

But Impale kills you. ROFL

No, Impale doesn’t kill me. I did a fun test while standing still and letting the condition tick off. It would have killed me. Just an interesting observation that I feel gives credence to the fact that conditions need some type of reform. You have terrible reading comprehension.

Sutek.3189:

Mbelch.9028:

Sutek.3189:

So you die on condi, so what. Oneshot from thief way worse because you cannot see it coming and cannot cleanse it with condition removal.

I don’t personally get one shotted by thieves.

Try playing Ele on any speck. If both have maximased gear it will still be oneshot from thief to Ele. Ele even can wear power/toughness/vitality gear…still oneshot. Not to mentation the perma hide thiefs.

I lol’d at you asking me to play ele. Check my post history. I’m only an ele.

oZii.2864:

Something that I thought about the other day in this whole Condi v Power debate.

Many people say that condition players don’t have to sacrifice anything whereas the power players do sacrifice. A Power player gets a 916 stat headstart on a condition player. At 80 no traits no gear you have 916 power and 0 condition damage. That 916 power you start with effects how you build if you throw any defense gear on your build at all. Everyone has thresholds that they like for certain stats imagine your build -916 power. You would probably move some of your defense stat points toward power to compensate.

This is very interesting to note. It’s glaringly obvious, but frequently overlooked. I’m just wondering if even at full Condi dmg + toughness/vitality, they’re still doing the condi dmg of a near/half zerk power player. That’s a question. It’s something I don’t know. It sure feels like it.

I’m not sure about all that, but I feel that condition builds should have a system of crits as well, and the system should be then balanced around that.

Plain and simple, I feel like knocking full zerkers down to ~50% crit dmg, when they were previously at ~100-115 is a huge nerf. A lot more than 10%, especially when considering those builds only build to that crit dmg when they know they’ll crit often.

I hope they’ll take under consideration shaving down this nerf to more along the lines of bringing the full zerk crit dmg to 65-80%.

I also want to say (and here we will go again with me being flamed by condi users) that if there aren’t changes to conditions, this change will throw the balance of the game off by a lot. There’s no longer going to be a reason to not play a condi build on any class. I’ll likely begin playing one as well.

Sutek.3189:

So you die on condi, so what. Oneshot from thief way worse because you cannot see it coming and cannot cleanse it with condition removal.

I don’t personally get one shotted by thieves.

That bolded text is annoying bud. I didn’t demand everything. While I think some skills like killshot backstab and a handful of others do need scaling back, I think there are more condi skills to be looked at. But yes power is getting a nerf already mate. They’ll talk about that today

Conditions can be dodged. This is very true. It is just that many major condition skills deal a high amount of damage, can be stacked effectively and don’t have the best tells.

Culprits of these highly damaging power skills are well telegraphed. That’s all..

Amonatory.2453:

He tried to do the same for my thief build and failed. This isn’t the first time he’s done this, idk why he does it tbh. It’s probably because he loses to every player in a duel. He really needs to get a life and stop giving people’s stuff away, play the game.. Stop acting like a 12 year old.

Indeed. Remind me not to talk with nor fight him.

Who are you to reveal someone else’s build? That’s dirty.

Ansau.7326:

I think there’s only 2 problems with conditions:

- Some builds that can apply tons of them and continuosly.

- Stat combinations allows condi builds to have very high condition damage while also having high defensive stats. However, power builds have to sacrifice defensive stats to reach good numbers, as the rely on burst.

Apart from that, condi cleansing is fine. Maybe eles and mesmers need to have more reliable cleansing. That doesn’t mean they don’t have it, just they need to invest a lot of traits and skills to have decent amount of cleansing.

I think this is the most sensible thing said in a long time in this thread. Lol.

Chill and immob aren’t too much for some classes to handle. But this https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvX-Change-how-Chill-interacts-with-Ele/page/4#post3702716

That thread is 3k views worth of good reasons why ele’s should be affected differently by chill.

Amonatory.2453:

Mbelch.9028:

Amonatory.2453:

ShadowNinja.1238:

Amonatory.2453:

Mbelch.9028:

ComeAtMe.5932:

what server are you on I would love to duel people like you. I love dueling

The best matchup for dueling eles is Mag v SoS v FA.

It’s been that way for a few weeks. I was looking for my topic I made stating just that but couldn’t find it.

Anyways.

IMO the best eles to duel are on Mag and FA (Sorry Moj ), so if you’re not looking to be somewhere permanently, hop on SoS.

Yeah, but remember the best thief for you to duel is on SoS

Kronos isn’t on SoS though.. But snuffles and silent Myra are!

Oh, im sorry I should rephrase. The best thief for you to face that doesn’t use cheese is on SoS

Kronos doesn’t run cheese at all.

Wasn’t talking about him.

Goose!

Amonatory.2453:

ShadowNinja.1238:

Amonatory.2453:

Mbelch.9028:

ComeAtMe.5932:

what server are you on I would love to duel people like you. I love dueling

The best matchup for dueling eles is Mag v SoS v FA.

It’s been that way for a few weeks. I was looking for my topic I made stating just that but couldn’t find it.

Anyways.

IMO the best eles to duel are on Mag and FA (Sorry Moj ), so if you’re not looking to be somewhere permanently, hop on SoS.

Yeah, but remember the best thief for you to duel is on SoS

Kronos isn’t on SoS though.. But snuffles and silent Myra are!

Oh, im sorry I should rephrase. The best thief for you to face that doesn’t use cheese is on SoS

Kronos doesn’t run cheese at all.

Enjoy those 15 second attunement CDs. That won’t be fun.

ComeAtMe.5932:

what server are you on I would love to duel people like you. I love dueling

The best matchup for dueling eles is Mag v SoS v FA.

It’s been that way for a few weeks. I was looking for my topic I made stating just that but couldn’t find it.

Anyways.

IMO the best eles to duel are on Mag and FA (Sorry Moj ), so if you’re not looking to be somewhere permanently, hop on SoS.

FC, you likely fought Redshift. He’s definitely a good ele.

Heck yeah. I want to fight SoS and FA forever. Such a tight matchup, OS is the best it can get and roaming isn’t dead. Anything else will honestly pale in comparison.

T1 is too tier1-ey. T3 is dead. T2 is jussssst right.

Shameless bump for good ele play.

Serane and I wanted to make an ele dueling mashup.

Let the thread die. Make a new one that isn’t full of crap and devoid of skill.

Why was he laid off? Shouldn’t they be hiring, not firing?

Mhhmm. I see how it is. You’ll be heavily featured in my first video then.

Nice vid, Fork. Saw myself in the background, but no duels! How come :p.

Not sure if we connected yet, but it’s not too late. Hit me up when you see me on or have spoons connect us.

To you, perhaps. You aren’t more than one person. Most people I talk to agree conditions aren’t in a good place.

You quite literally make me tired. I don’t actually care enough to argue with you over a game in an Internet forum. If you want to argue, do it with yourself.

As I said, I knew there would be a consortium of people who love conditions and staunchly defend them. I love when two people with strong views look to simply post more than their opponents so as to overwhelm them.

I haven’t made any “claims” to disprove, bud. I don’t get downed in one hit by most things. Like I said, backstabs don’t. Evisetates don’t. Churning earth doesn’t. Killshot doesn’t usually, but if it crits on a full Acended + full stack war potentially can. Meteor shower would from a full glass ele. As would firey rush from any glass class against a wall.

Thing about many of those skills is the real investment you have to make. To do damage as a zerk like that, you die when an uplevel ranger touches you.

To do a comparable amount of damage, just over time with condis, you just have to build tanky. That’s a tad bit absurd.

I simply propose the armor system should be different.

The more condition damage you want to do, the glassier you are.

It doesn’t invalidate conditions, simply gives them the same risk and reward power builds have.

—

If you think I’ll be discussing this further, you’re wrong. You turned a funny thing that happened to me in obsidian sanctum into something frankly sad to look at. Continue on, engie and necro condi crew. You tire me out here just like you do in WvW.

I’m with you here Thibash, there’s a reason eles have a deep skill floor and high skill ceiling.

I don’t want to be warrior 2.0, and to be honest other than the fact that warriors can run away far too easily, I don’t want warriors to be nerfed to their former level of uselessness. Good players are already handicapped on warriors. It’s just the bad ones who start to pose an issue.

I don’t actually have a horrible bias against conditions. You have a love for them though, you two, and man that’s just dandy. People like you who spread disinformation and fight just oh so hard to keep your easy builds overpowered. Well you guys are keeping guild wars from being balanced. Enjoy.

I’m a GW1 player who wishes conditions were more like that game. And to call my views invalid just shows how truly ignorant you are.

If you use many of those things, you’re asking for a death sentence vs power builds. Just saying.

Technically I’m not “Bursty” by thief standards. But every hit I do is at least 1.5k dmg and I hit a 6k hit every 10 seconds.

I heal the group well, and with 75% boon duration my protection, regen and swiftness are appreciated.

I don’t recommend support ele. Not very engaging. But back line sniping can be.

We have builds that work incredibly well with this heal. Stop crying because staff isn’t amazing with it.

There are multiple heals on each class so people can theory craft different builds.

I use two skills per second on average. I’m a d/d ele, and I know S/D eles can use many more.

Eggcellent song. Thanks. Almost better than the original.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Anecdotal evidence is not that great for proving a point, but I have two different gear sets for my necro. Dire and Knights (I don’t like being squishy).

Here are the two gear sets and trait setups I use:
Knights: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vQAQRAnd4Yjc0UTbLNW2whbCB6RuULOTUhjh6x64OfIA-zAEBoLAINwYNgoNQEEgk0w0FAEGQJQFRjtEMaVRhtcKIKZoqaAqbY6XKyAA-e
Dire: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vQAQNArYWjc00dbNNW2webiASx7xV0DiFskRpocpD-zwCBYhAoMQINg0CgUFQk3AZSFRjtGsIasKZJVdDTHTQGA-e

It’s apparent I put more effort into my condition damage set, as I have an ascended weapon, plus appropriate ascended amulet, back-piece, and trinket. Yet, I do nearly double the DPS with my power set. My DPS with conditions is roughly 1k, but my Knight’s build (which is less focused on the offense, stat-wise) is usually running 2-4k DPS.

Similar levels of durability, yet one deals a lot more damage.

Your subjective DPS doesn’t fly.

Your condis may on average tick for 1k, but that’s 1k always.. Also you’re ignoring what your actual damage ticks for.

I’m going to guess they tick roughly evenly.

Power builds can’t hit their DPS every second, which makes your DPS lower than you think. Certainly not 2-4k per second.

Think about it. Do you hit people for 40k health, down each person within 10 seconds with a power build? No.

Do you usually hit people for 20-30k health in 20 seconds with conditions, downing them? Yes.

Nice work there haha. Looks fun. I’ve always said X/F is a fun dueling spec but can’t hang in the roaming game. Love the bursty action though.

What version of whistling dixie is that?

warriorjrd.8695:

I could drop a meteor shower on you and walk away only to return to your corpse, that is if you were foolish enough to stand in it, which you wouldn’t be (I hope). Same goes for condi, you wouldn’t be foolish enough to keep it on the entire duration, you have cleanses use them, that’s what they’re there for. Conditions are damage over time, glad you grasped that, so you are obviously going to be able to walk away after throwing your condition on them and have them suffer the damage.

This is the only logical power skill that I think you’re 100% right and I’m wrong with. Nice thought. Full zerk ele would likely down me if I stood in meteor shower.

And LOL at some people for still not understanding the discussion, and talking about ‘L2P’ and how ‘skilless’ I must be for testing the true danger of a skill. Much troll on your end.

To the people actually logically discussing. Thank you.

This thread may be pointless to some of you. If so, kitten off lol.

You can’t say anything about skill. Yes, I swapped to water attunement and saved myself before death, but the point is someone can throw one skill, walk away, fight someone else and his target will die.

No power build can do that. And if you say it can, prove it with video evidence. It’s just not possible.

Im just staying in general that I feel condis need a shave down. Coglin, you are a condi engie who will forever want condi buffs. I’m happy for you. You can stand down, As I already know your position.

A warrior could 100b me, but the one skill wouldn’t kill me. It could kill shot me, but it wouldn’t kill me. A thief could backstab me, but even at its glassiest, the thief can’t 1 hit me unless it gets sigil procs.

And again, if you don’t understand the point of the thread, why comment? I’m remarking about how nuts it is that a skill can be thrown, a person can walk away, and the opponent is hit by enough damage that one skill would down the person. That is crazy in my opinion, no matter how much counter play there is for it.

Thanks FC. I change my build up frequently. But I always have evasive arcana. That’s a safe bet on my traits if I’ve got a tough fight upcoming.

I run a bursty D/D spec. It all comes down to skill.

Gotcha. I didn’t know that. I haven’t seen a Dev confirm.

stof.9341:

Isn’t Impale 5 stacks of 12s of Torment? With +100% condition duration it turns to 5 stacks of 24s of Torment.

Yup I believe so.

This is more a statement about the insanity that can be condi skills and builds.

He had no might stacks. Just 5 stacks of torment. It was on there for a long time.

Brando.1374:

Mbelch.9028:

I have 15.5k hp. I can’t tell you details about the warrior, but it got me down in 10-15 seconds and I was amazed.

Any might stacks.
Did you notice how much the dmg floaters ticked for? That will help determine a lot.

Nope I just had him throw his skill cold and leave. It didn’t seem like they were ticking for more than 750.

Go D/D. I think staff is boring anyways.

Really? Thanks for the reply. Could I trouble you to link your source?

Also, there really aren’t skills that down people with 15.5k health and 1700 toughness in one hit that aren’t easy as hell to dodge. But who is to know one little sword thrown at you could take all your life.

I have 15.5k hp. I can’t tell you details about the warrior, but it got me down in 10-15 seconds and I was amazed.