Guild Wars 2

just had a match where we were down 410ish to 120ish. Came back and won it. So ye, NEVER give up.
The better argument for never give up is that you are committed to the match no matter what, you can choose to waste your time and just lose or you can chose to try your best and maybe pull a rabbit out of your kitten . Sure you’ll fail 99/100 times but won’t you have more fun trying to win rather than just accept the loss?

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Mogar.9216:

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Mogar.9216:

it’s face roll vs zerker players with low skill level. It’s not really oped at all. I actually started to save my dazes for defense lately rather than using it to land shatter. A decent player knows a shatter is inc once they get mantra stuned and will pop a breaker and dodge so the stun really becomes a tell for your opponents.

You can time the stun with your burst so that they can’t stunbreak it in time 99.999999% of the time unless you have a teleport like blink.

That WAS true before they nerfed mirror blade. You can cast mirrior blade and then stun blink and shatter. But ever since they nerfed mirror blade damage by nearly a 1/3 it’s no longer possiable to shatter burst someone 100-0 anymore. The shatter damage is never instant. You have to cast MB, hit stun, blink and shatter. while blink and shatter are both insta you still need to wait for blink to happen before hit shatter which is enough time to stun break and dodge.

Yeah, it depends on what class your fighting and what build depending on the one shot. But it’s still a lot of damage that has very little counterplay. And I’m a bit confused by what your saying. While blink and shatter are both insta you still wait for blink to happen? When it’s instant? Think you meant to say mirror blade. Which is true butttt you can time it so they don’t have time to stun break. Simply start casting GS 2, before they have time to react and dodge pop CS and by that time it’s normerly too late.

You want to shatter while you are on top of the player because you want to make sure you shatter yourself for more damage. While blink casting is instant the blink itself is not really instant. The sequence goes like this: You see target, Cast gs2, While gs2 is in air daze stun the target, blink there and shatter + gs 3 . If you use a macro you can maybe pull it off as a insta but in real life that is awful a lot of keys to press where 2 of them are ground targeted. So in real life there is usually time to react when you are stuned. Not a large window but enough never the less, I do it on my mesmer all the time both landing and try to avoid bursts .

you missed the boat by a month man, nerf already happened and mesmer is no longer meta.

TheFrighteningFrenchFry.3275:

Mogar.9216:

it’s face roll vs zerker players with low skill level. It’s not really oped at all. I actually started to save my dazes for defense lately rather than using it to land shatter. A decent player knows a shatter is inc once they get mantra stuned and will pop a breaker and dodge so the stun really becomes a tell for your opponents.

You can time the stun with your burst so that they can’t stunbreak it in time 99.999999% of the time unless you have a teleport like blink.

That WAS true before they nerfed mirror blade. You can cast mirrior blade and then stun blink and shatter. But ever since they nerfed mirror blade damage by nearly a 1/3 it’s no longer possiable to shatter burst someone 100-0 anymore. The shatter damage is never instant. You have to cast MB, hit stun, blink and shatter. while blink and shatter are both insta you still need to wait for blink to happen before hit shatter which is enough time to stun break and dodge.

it’s face roll vs zerker players with low skill level. It’s not really oped at all. I actually started to save my dazes for defense lately rather than using it to land shatter. A decent player knows a shatter is inc once they get mantra stuned and will pop a breaker and dodge so the stun really becomes a tell for your opponents.

2 sec per clone would be insanely op , lol 8 secoonds on full shatter !!! one can only dream…. edit: imagine that shared to the whole team!!

I’m going to throw out a wild theory. Lets start with the following assumptions and 1 fact.

Assumption 1 : Anet is not trying to screw over solo players on purpose by placing us in bad matches over and over.

Assumption 2: Anet does use a match making algorithm that’s bases on individuals MMR

Fact: knowing the above we still get long streaks of winning and losing matches. So this lead to the following conclusions:
1 The way MMR is calculated is flawed, it doesn’t reflect the skill of a player good enough to let match making make even matches.
or
2 The match making algorithm is flawed , it is not using mmr in an effective enough way to make good matches
3 The game is simply too chaotic , a small change in an even match will define the out come of a match at certain skill level. for example blue team lands 1 lucky hit with treb and killed 4/5 players on red team in mid at the start of the match .
or
A combo of all 3.

Anyhow I hope Anet hear the message in this thread and try to improve match making more.

Beetamus.6403:

Mogar.9216:

Zietlogik.6208:

Mogar.9216:

Impact.2780:

I too, noticed that you avoided mentioning the fact that stealth (and vanish) expire after a short time (with the exception of Prismatic Understanding buffed stealth which I argue should never have existed).

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!#$$ there are SOOOO MANY ways to chain stealth it’s not even funny the fact each stealth skill only give you a short period of stealth is meaningless .

There is alot of meaning, stealth in games like WoW dont even really use a skill, it is just a profession button you hit and you are in stealth. GW2 you need to use your combos, you need to use skills, utilities, you need to specc for it, it isn’t just something that is available to every build a thief has freely, you need to put some effort into being stealthed for longer periods of time…and even then, very very rarely perma.

dagger + a pistol = perma stealth no matter what build. off hand dagger hit anything = perma stealth, I still have ‘fond’ memories of thieves only fight beside walls to free cnd off it for stealth. I can keep on going if you want and I don’t even main thief.

Off hand dagger hit anything equals perma stealth? It’s pretty obvious you don’t main a thief.
1. If you use Cloak and dagger while stealthed, you get revealed.
2. If you use Cloak and dagger to stealth, well you weren’t stealthed to begin with.

lol you fail to point out all you need to do is wait for stealth to wear off for a fraction of a second to cnd again to regain stealth to get around revealed. So yes it’s not ‘perma’ stealth but for all practical purposes it might as well be. The best player in the world would not be able to do anything in that split second to attack you let along even to see where you are at.

Zietlogik.6208:

Mogar.9216:

Impact.2780:

I too, noticed that you avoided mentioning the fact that stealth (and vanish) expire after a short time (with the exception of Prismatic Understanding buffed stealth which I argue should never have existed).

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!#$$ there are SOOOO MANY ways to chain stealth it’s not even funny the fact each stealth skill only give you a short period of stealth is meaningless .

There is alot of meaning, stealth in games like WoW dont even really use a skill, it is just a profession button you hit and you are in stealth. GW2 you need to use your combos, you need to use skills, utilities, you need to specc for it, it isn’t just something that is available to every build a thief has freely, you need to put some effort into being stealthed for longer periods of time…and even then, very very rarely perma.

dagger + a pistol = perma stealth no matter what build. off hand dagger hit anything = perma stealth, I still have ‘fond’ memories of thieves only fight beside walls to free cnd off it for stealth. I can keep on going if you want and I don’t even main thief.

Vapour.7348:

Mogar.9216:

Vapour.7348:

TheGuy.3568:

Pimsley.3681:

It goes like this…you lose 3 in a row and decide to queue again to make up but then Murphy’s Law happens and you end up losing 7-8.

Quite comical actually but still annoying

You could just be bad (not saying you are). Or you could be focused squarely on the win and not how well you played personally. So many break it down to wins and loses but I have won and felt like I put in a kitten poor effort. I have lost and felt good because I was winning my match ups. Perception is key here. I could get a great or bad team based on the stats. I rather be a great player myself win or lose.

That player is anything but bad I assure you. He swaps classes at the beginning of matches to help balance out comps and rotates points like a madman. I know because he was active during test ladder seasons and I’d get teamed with or against him. If he was placed with a team of imbeciles, there isn’t much he or anyone else in his position could do.

If there were no match making at all and someone losses 10 in a row then yes he/she must be bad player. The WHOLE pt of match making is to match you vs similar skilled players no matter how good or bad you are. So even if you are in the last 5% of players in terms of skill you should still never lose over and over because competent match making would have matched you with other players who are just as bad and give you around 50% win rate.

You failed at understanding how matchmaking really works as it was explained by the devs. Unfortunately your false perception of how matchmaking functions doesn’t apply.

I read first and try to understand the situation before posting hastily.

I looked thru that person’s attached images and when matchmaking worked during BW3, he had an almost 70%win rate and the matches looked fair because the team scores were close.

When that person linked the image during the bad streak of losses, the team scores looked like an absolute failed mismatch, like he was placed with a team full of F2P people going after dailies…which in my opinion, isn’t fair.

His bad streak of losses ALSO happened around the same time as it did some of posters on this thread.

lol read my post before you dis me man. I’m on your side. I messed up on my quote. My reply was aim at the guy who think bad losing steak mean bad player skill.

Impact.2780:

I too, noticed that you avoided mentioning the fact that stealth (and vanish) expire after a short time (with the exception of Prismatic Understanding buffed stealth which I argue should never have existed).

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!#$$ there are SOOOO MANY ways to chain stealth it’s not even funny the fact each stealth skill only give you a short period of stealth is meaningless .

Zietlogik.6208:

Those games also have an infinite duration for stealth, GW2 does not. I am not a fan of the stealth mechanics currently (at least Stealth in combat) but that is a big big thing you glossed over.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Feedback-In-Combat-stealth/first

you are fooling yourself if you think perma stealth doesn’t exist in GW2. the perma stealth is worse in GW2 than any of those games because you can start your perma stealth any time, no cooldown at all.

Vapour.7348:

TheGuy.3568:

Pimsley.3681:

It goes like this…you lose 3 in a row and decide to queue again to make up but then Murphy’s Law happens and you end up losing 7-8.

Quite comical actually but still annoying

You could just be bad (not saying you are). Or you could be focused squarely on the win and not how well you played personally. So many break it down to wins and loses but I have won and felt like I put in a kitten poor effort. I have lost and felt good because I was winning my match ups. Perception is key here. I could get a great or bad team based on the stats. I rather be a great player myself win or lose.

That player is anything but bad I assure you. He swaps classes at the beginning of matches to help balance out comps and rotates points like a madman. I know because he was active during test ladder seasons and I’d get teamed with or against him. If he was placed with a team of imbeciles, there isn’t much he or anyone else in his position could do.

If there were no match making at all and someone losses 10 in a row then yes he/she must be bad player. The WHOLE pt of match making is to match you vs similar skilled players no matter how good or bad you are. So even if you are in the last 5% of players in terms of skill you should still never lose over and over because competent match making would have matched you with other players who are just as bad and give you around 50% win rate.

still not working 100%. before patch the charging of heal mantra would give you swiftness as well as firing off any charge to get healed. Now the charging of mantra does NOT apply swiftness any more.

so is air rune, heal for swiftness not working at all.

lol I was thinking the same almost 10 min now. Well might as well play another game .

necro damage can be losed and dodged , vs a good mesmer you are screwed 1 v 1 nothing you can do about it.

mostly just know when you disengage and not panic.

sounds great . lets see how things go when I play good to see that you guys are working to make match making better

been using it since patch. it`s very strong because you help not only yourself but everyone around you avoid a burst.
……
edit whatever down side it has it`s more than made up by how good it is.

good mesmer have timing bad ones don’t.

really? what the kitten more do you want? mesmer is number 2 behind ele right now can’t get any better than we have it already.

play another class

SPESHAL.9106:

It’s not the algorithm…it’s the fact that the game is dead and nobody is playing…no algorithm can match things that aren’t available.

I tried RANKED today and was immediately put in a group with ALL solo players against a full premade that included Abjured.

Think about that one second…How is that even possible?

Not even Hotjoin could put you in a worse possible matchup.

No algorithm could be that bad unless there just aren’t players available to do a fair match.

Of course, it was a waste of time to even play the game. It was a miserable waste of time queing and playing.

There are repercussions for bad decisions (i.e. mixing premades with solo), ignoring PvP, and poor internal testing to identify things like d/d eles.

It snowballs, and we are seeing it now where very few people enjoy waiting for a match and then getting something so absurd for “matchmaking”.

That should never happen unless there are ONLY 10 players queing ranked. Pvp may well be dead but it still have more than 10 players playing I bet. What I suspect is happening is that solo que players are used to give the few premades fast que times. MMR is not even used in match making in 1/2 or more of the matches just so that they can give the premades less than 5 min que times. If they had shown everyone’s mmr this would be come clear and everyone who isn’t in the 10 wts teams would cry murder and quit. That’s why they don’t show mmr .

they refuse to list ppl’s mmr for some reason. I’m guessing the guy who’s job is to do match making is afraid of losing his job if everyone knew what their mmr is and have real data to prove how bad match making really is in this game.

in pvp yes, in wvw no.

Go to meta battle and just use their pvp PU build.

stealth rocks, I don`t run pu and I still use torch. mesmers have plenty of dps with GS. The second set is for defense sword and torch both offer great defense with short cool down on distortion and stealth.

almost all lvl 1 in ranked are good players. Most do it to get ppl all bent out of shape on purpose.

Archon.6480:

Yes, yes, of course. My favorite alternate strategy, when playing spvp, is to run straight to the point and cap it. I find that running to mid in the beginning and putting everything into winning that fight really throws the opponents off guard. This is especially effective when one player on the enemy team decides to avoid mid, for some odd reason.

Another excellent alternate strategy is to wait for an enemy player to get out of position and use that opportunity to create a +1 scenario against the other enemy players. I find the 4v3 battle to be the all time best way to win the game. You’ll usually end up wiping half the enemy team, then it will be 5v2 for a little while. The chances are they’ll never recover from this.

My all time favorite strategy is to decap the enemy home point when their players rotate out of position and hold it as long as possible, or simply decap it and run back to mid (to avoid a -1 fight there…

lol +1

dodge, invul , blink, stealth, blind…we have so many ways of avoid hits you just need to use them wisely. Really with 1200 blink + stealth you should be able to disengage from any fight as long as you realize a hopeless situation early enough. The beauty is even when someone get to you, that is the time to shatter in their face make them eat 7-10k of damage and get blinded.

I pop f4 to rez people all the time don’t think it helps the downed person but I often down zerker class trying to dps me while I rez by shatter f1-f4 while I rez

Vieteriukko.6075:

I was just in a match that had both teams 2-1-1-1. I was one of the soloers. In the beginning a few in our team said “hi”. No other team communication after that.

We won 500-150. One guy from the losing team said in say channel: “Nice to lose to a premade”.

I think that big part of complaints regarding matchmaking is related to ignorance and inability.

I think most people who post here know how to right click on leader board to find out if ppl are in a team or not. it maybe be hard to tell between a 5 man or a 3+2 but it’s unlikely anyone with decent mmr wouldn’t know a 2 1 1 1 from a 5 man.

had a few 4 v5 wins in ranked . In general I feel pretty good when I carry a match or get a come back win.

Both those classes are built around boons and both have low hp pool. The trick is to time your burst when they are not super protected. Then don not let up , don’t wait to build up another burst just throw everything at them to down them.

sigh, you do not need to run pu condi, you do not need to play reactionary. Standard shatter / interrupt build. You have 3 things on thief, 1 you got range, 2. you have distortion. 3 Shatter damage is AE so stealth does not save them at all.
Play aggressive hit them with a daze and just unload.
if they jump you, shatter 4 then 3 at the same time. That will counter their burst and most likely daze them. This gives you 1-2 seconds to burst them. Refuge won’t save them from a shatter burst + spike. I killed plenty of thieves while they are stealthed. The only problem I have is with theives who can kill me 100-0 when they get the jump but those guys are so glassy you can down them 100-0 in a blink too.

shatter is your friend. You can blind him right back via shatter ….

Their stealth doesn’t last long. Just don’t stand in one place. If they turn you into moa just use skill 5 to sprint away. Their burst is ground based you won’t get killed if you are not in it.

I don’t agree DD is hardest to play, it has a high skill ceiling but it’s also dead easy to pick up and do decent with it for a new player.

runes of centaur + mirror heal.

halting strike (the damage from power block) does crazy amount of damage that is AFTER they nerfed it once already. That alone makes it worth while.

The nerf didn’t hurt much but it did make life more painful to have to manage mantras again. At least they stopped nerfing inspiration

Mogar.9216:

DD ele does it much better.

We’re not in the ele forums, we’re in the mesmer forums, where people who want to play mesmers tend to come. Maybe you got lost?[/quote]

>>>>>>>
I think you know exactly what I’m saying, a DD ele fills the role of a condi mesmer much much better. There is no reason to take a condi mesmer over a DD ele in a team , I believe this is something the op should consider when weighting the pros/cons of the 2 specs.

condi is bad for pvp because it’s weak in 2 v 2 or 3 v 3 fights. It’s great when you are fighting total noobs and win a 1 v 2 or 1 v 3 but you are not going to get away with that as you fight better opponents.
in general mesmer is not a good wear them down class because you will lose the point as you stealth . DD ele does it much better.

never met a thief before I’m guessing

had 2 player qq at each other before the start of match then they BOTH went afk lol. No much you can do about stuff like that.

you can get unlucky and just get horrid matches at times. I think it’s mostly due to a small pool of pvpers.

fixed lol. do you really think forcing people to fire off unused charges for no reason is good design? They could have 2x the mantra recharge timer and achieved the same result and still reward intelligent play .

Daniel Handler.4816:

Mogar.9216:

lol watch the QQ fly as everyone respec to pu max shatter. They nerfed lockdown but not shatter because all the mesmers in wts teams are playing pu shatter. This patch is just forcing us melt people even faster than before.

That would be a balance. Current pu cant deal well with condI burst.

If you are in a team you don’t need condi cleanse as your team mates will do that for you. When you are not in a team you can simply replace portal with mantra cleanse .

lol watch the QQ fly as everyone respec to pu max shatter. They nerfed lockdown but not shatter because all the mesmers in wts teams are playing pu shatter. This patch is just forcing us melt people even faster than before.