Guild Wars 2

SoR has held ppt lead in Oceanic and SEA for at least three nights this week alone. A rallying cry is hardly warranted, much less one that cries so hard as if the situation was that desperate.

Visit mos.millenium.org and click o the server name to see score evolutions right down to the hour and you’ll see which servers need the help.

Kuchi kuchi koo!

Your server still wins frequently so I don’t know why you’re sweating about it so much. And it’s not close matches when you win.

Are you still playing the underdog despite your demonstrated advantage over the other servers?

oxide.8324:

Dunno how you only manage 10-30 ppt with a full map zerg running around JQ BL

In it for the fights and not caring about PPT.

magikfox.9658:

Neuromancer.2148:

To any Oce/SEA guilds who are thinking of transferring right now:

Please consider the evidence and data of the tier and see the patterns in the scores. SoR does NOT tick at this low a PPT unless they intend it. Just yesterday they were in the high 200s and even hit 300 on average. At worst they were not far behind in the low 200s. This week, they made up for a 2k lead and extended it to 12k in their favor in a single day.

No one can stop you from going where you please, but please do consider the balance of the matchups for the sake of the WvW community at large. One super-server will upset the game for everyone.

Wow, that gave me a headache…

Are people actually kitten enough to think that SoR would purposefully ride their PPT this low to recruit guilds? Kitten, you’re hopeless bunch, honestly. What a crock of horse piddle.

Next you’ll be accusing SoR of freakin’ chemtrails.

Not only is it bonkers, to even state this is highly offence to the guys out there who are trying their best to fight any bit of score they can. I’m more then tolerant to the enemy when their PPT and presence aren’t the best, but this is complete and utter bullkitten.

To ANYBODY who believes this is something SoR is doing for the lulz than I’m sorry, you do have problems. I mean, both BG and JQ have great PPT and then this is something that you are actually worried about?

A little humility. And maybe go see a specialist…

My apologies, but it won’t be the first time it has happened. I don’t think it disrespectful. Devious, sneaky, yes. But not really illegal or illicit.

Geez, when BG is ticking low the forum is laughing about how we’re getting kicked out of T1. People cry foul, but no one accuses anyone of having “problems.” That’s just….I don’t even know what to say.

To any Oce/SEA guilds who are thinking of transferring right now:

Please consider the evidence and data of the tier and see the patterns in the scores. SoR does NOT tick at this low a PPT unless they intend it. Just yesterday they were in the high 200s and even hit 300 on average. At worst they were not far behind in the low 200s. This week, they made up for a 2k lead and extended it to 12k in their favor in a single day.

No one can stop you from going where you please, but please do consider the balance of the matchups for the sake of the WvW community at large. One super-server will upset the game for everyone.

Eyefinity – expensive, elite equipment not everyone has access to.
Potions – available to all for a reasonable price.

Not quite the same.

Also, I’m not complaining about the state of T1. I’m just giving facts and encouraging people to do the same before saying anything. I quite enjoy the fierce battles on field.

Zen, common sense, man.

How OFTEN does BG tick at 300+ during NA ?

What about SoR?

Since IRON moved in, what has been your EU’s average ppt?

What is BG’s average SEA ppt?

A quick look at a chart is all it takes.

Fannwong.3059:

Thanks again for explaining.

However with your opening paragraph, about dominance being a perception, therein lies the problem the discussion thread is going.

There can be no serious discussion to reach a definite conclusion to the matter when there are no hard numbers and stats that we work from. Folks from BOTH servers can shift the perceived baseline to their bias and prejudice.

Take care,
FW

I said it’s partially perception. But there are superior and inferior points of view. One arguing out of ignorance, oblivious to facts, has an inferior point of view. This is easily demonstrable by a quick glance at MOS on who has a more informed perspective.

Also, while I agree we can’t force definitions on people, there needs to be an attempt to come to common ground, otherwise ALL dialogue is impossible.

Fannwong.3059:

Could we further clarify when an advantage becomes dominance, from 2 hours? and at what PPT?

There are no set rules and numbers. Dominance is also perception.

But you can look at the history of data and draw more accurate conclusions from there. For example: SoR’s NA consistently ticks in the high 300s, almost without fail. Therefore, SoR dominates the NA timezone of the tier. That they are ticking at 240 ppt now is a fluke, and so it would be ignorant for anyone to say “lolz look BG dominating, they’re so stacked!!!1one”

It would also be ridiculous to say our Oceanic and SEA timezones are stacked, because SoR has proven they can tick at 300 + + when they feel like it (i.e BG has a higher score) and JQ’s SEA force is still active and formidable. That’s why BG taking more SEA guilds is generally not frowned upon – it is a highly competitive environment and anyone who transfers to either of the three servers will not find empty battlefields to scour.

EU is a whole different story, which is why troll rhetoric that relates the SEA guilds BG recently acquired with the EU guilds SoR acquired is comparing apples to airplanes.

Conclusion: people should just keep their ignorant opinions to themselves. (yeah I know that’s left field. I just felt like saying it)

morrolan.9608:

Neuromancer.2148:

BG NEVER dominated the tier. HoD dominated. SoS dominated. JQ dominated. Whenever BG wins, it’s coming out of a hard-pressed, uphill battle. Transfer onto the server and see for yourself.

I’d hardly say that SOR is dominating the tier though.

No, it’s not.

Which is why the transfer of guilds is being frowned upon. The balance was already there. Blackgate’s last victory was due to the return of its EU, albeit inconsistent, AND the suspect absence of SoR’s SEA and EU.

From the data, you’ll see that SoR rarely ever ticks 100 and below during those timezones, but that is what we were seeing during the matchup BG won. Little did we know it was all a ruse to artificially deflate PPT to entice more EU transferees.

(The first two paragraphs are fact. The last is opinion, but I believe a correct and accurate one)

Fannwong.3059:

Hello guys,

Please allow me to share some thoughts about the conversation that BG and SOR are having.

Part of the reason why there’s a lot of back and forth is the use of terms used very loosely, eg ‘pvdoor’, ‘dominance’, etc.

As Israel has kindly stated the meaning of ‘pvdoor’. Could we set the actual meaning of ‘dominance’ also? For some dominance is about the score difference (kudos to BG and JQ, solid pushes) and some it’s about numbers on the field, and some its about PPT/time. And then for some it’s about having wvw guilds on when the other servers had little or no manpower, of which I think 3 servers had that scenario at some point in the last 5 months.

Just so this thread doesn’t get locked. Please help each other out, at the end of the day we are all gamers in gw2, one day we are enemies and the next day we could be allies on the warfront.

FW

Neuromancer.2148:

morrolan.9608:

Kathy K.6812:

salluks.6017:

From what i see is the only way BG/JQ can keep up with SOR is to double team the kitten out and still lose.

must suck not being SOR

The only thing that sucks is SoR imbalancing T1 and calling the match-up “Even”.

But it was OK when BG did it right.

BG NEVER dominated the tier. HoD dominated. SoS dominated. JQ dominated. Whenever BG wins, it’s coming out of a hard-pressed, uphill battle. Transfer onto the server and see for yourself.

Dominance is a demonstrated, consistent advantage, in the case of WvW, it is ‘winning the timezone’. Summing up all the timezones where a server is dominant equals victory or defeat.

Notice that the key word is consistent. Ticking at 400 then dropping to 200 ppt within an hour is NOT dominance. That’s an instance of advantage. Winning one match-up sporadically is not dominance, it’s competition.

That’s what happens when people use words without really thinking about what they’re saying. The words end up losing any sort of meaning and the whole conversation becomes confused.

morrolan.9608:

Kathy K.6812:

salluks.6017:

From what i see is the only way BG/JQ can keep up with SOR is to double team the kitten out and still lose.

must suck not being SOR

The only thing that sucks is SoR imbalancing T1 and calling the match-up “Even”.

But it was OK when BG did it right.

BG NEVER dominated the tier. HoD dominated. SoS dominated. JQ dominated. Whenever BG wins, it’s coming out of a hard-pressed, uphill battle. Transfer onto the server and see for yourself.

No, its especially strong because what was already a fairly balanced matchup is now threatened because of a large population influx in the most crucial timezone of the game. Seriously, had SoR made an earnest push last week, they could have close the gap to the low thousands, or even stolen the win from BG.

Besides, except for ONE vocal troll, people are just pointing out that the EU transfer is not the best thing that could have happened for the tier. The complaints come in when one server posts blatant misinformation and lies about another.

Azure.8412:

Kaidengaran.3528:

FEAR have been endlessly accused of exploiting and there have been plenty of images and videos to show it.

Even if its this approved wider FOV system anet have approved, this guild is still pathetic for resorting to such tactics.

It’s morally exploiting and I for one would never do it on principle.

It’s also embarrassing on Anet’s behalf of allowing such a thing, hopefully they see this thread and the video of where AC’s can hit with this technology.

This aside I’m sure the fights this week will be good again…even if lame guilds resort to cheap tactics.

How is it an exploit if Anet approves of this app? It is not morally wrong either, to do that. FEAR is pathetic? I highly suggest NOC fight them head on. Let’s see who is more pathetic, shall we.

Wow responding to a valid criticism with a challenge to a fight. Thats some supr srs roleplaying there, that of a medieval brute.

I think some people hold seances to figure out BGs next move.

A very patient mesmer would be my guess?

Looking forward to great fights this week! Good luck to all the servers.

Burl.9567:

Kathy K.6812:

SoR is so stacked on EU, why would they go there :/

BG is so stacked during Oceanic/SEA, why would those four new guilds go there?

Oceanic and SEA timezones are very competitive. No one server consistently dominates the board at those times.

EU is another question entirely. No server other than SoR can field consistent, massive numbers on a nightly basis. This week was a good showing for all three servers however, with the PPT balanced almost equally across these hours. Everyone knew RG is leaving, and that [HB] doesn’t log every night, so bringing in another large EU guild will give SOR a considerable advantage in a timezone they already dominate.

^ Good stuff! Can’t wait for next week.

ANYWHERE except SoR. They have a powerful EU presence already.

Mighty Assasin.3816:

Evalana.5480:

Mighty Assasin.3816:

I mean I guess if that’s the guild you want to be, to each their own.

Awww I still like you! ::HUG::

Sorry – Not going to shun good militia

I mean the guild who can’t do anything without the map.

There there. All guilds are special. We’re all special.

I was about to congratulate everyone for all the great fights this week and the fact that we had kept the thread clean and civil for many many pages. It was a reflection of the balanced matchup we had this week.

Then I read page 11 onward. Sigh.

Well, congratulations anyway! Let’s not allow the trolls to spoil the party for everyone. Someone threw rocks at BG’s hornet nest so some of us are coming out very defensively. The tagged posters just don’t like people insinuating that BG didn’t earn their win, that somehow it was handed to them on a silver platter. Or that they worked too hard. A game is a game, and the simple truth for this one is the one who shows up more consistently during the week wins. The “overtime” comments are ridiculous and everyone should see that.

As for the untagged trolls..well, just ignore them. They do not reflect the opinions of the whole server.

Good luck to all three servers!

Why is most of SoR not showing up? This is impossible PPT for you guys typically. You guys on break or something?

Great fights out there! Enjoy reset everyone and please ignore ALL the trolls

Zen.8497:

Neuromancer.2148:

Volcanus.2756:

Zen.8497

Zen.8497:

No it’s not. SoR has done it anyone can do it as well. We are talking about large guilds and not individual players. The leaders of such guilds are level headed and looking for a challenge so they would listen to what the servers have to say because in the end they want to be welcomed there and to be part of the community. It is amusing to think otherwise.

I don’t see how that refutes my point, and everyone has turned away transfers at this point. BT and IRON did their research, neither SoR or BG had final say on their transfers.

Any guilds looking to transfer to T1 can ascertain on their own the strength of each server. MOS is brilliant that way. It’s JQ’s responsibility to appeal to potential tranfers, if they want any, in the community sense.

I have not heard of any guilds that were turned down by BG and/or recommend them to join a different server. Please do not take this the wrong way but, unfortunately, beyond explanations or excuses it reflects the server image and it is only up to BG to change that or not.

No one publicizes “BG REJECTS GUILD” on the forums.

The mentality of labeling the guilds involved in such process as rejects in big bold letters too… That alone tells the true story and contradicts everything that you said.

Stop trying to spin things to make it look bad plztnx. It was an intentional fake sensationalizing as tabloids are wont to do and certain trolls loooove to use as their forum tactics.

Volcanus.2756:

Zen.8497

Zen.8497:

No it’s not. SoR has done it anyone can do it as well. We are talking about large guilds and not individual players. The leaders of such guilds are level headed and looking for a challenge so they would listen to what the servers have to say because in the end they want to be welcomed there and to be part of the community. It is amusing to think otherwise.

I don’t see how that refutes my point, and everyone has turned away transfers at this point. BT and IRON did their research, neither SoR or BG had final say on their transfers.

Any guilds looking to transfer to T1 can ascertain on their own the strength of each server. MOS is brilliant that way. It’s JQ’s responsibility to appeal to potential tranfers, if they want any, in the community sense.

I have not heard of any guilds that were turned down by BG and/or recommend them to join a different server. Please do not take this the wrong way but, unfortunately, beyond explanations or excuses it reflects the server image and it is only up to BG to change that or not.

Of course you wouldn’t, because you’re not in the Blackgate’s leadership. No one publicizes “BG REJECTS GUILD” on the forums, and you only get to hear about the new tags on the battlefield. To set the record straight, here’s a statement: BG has discouraged guilds from joining its ranks, and attempted to redirect other guilds into servers, in hopes of promoting a healthy, competitive environment.

That we still accept transfers is an obvious need reflected in our score. Say whatever you want, but we fight intense uphill battles, keep assaults so well-timed some of our pugs swear that they’re coordinated across servers, and attrition (it happens to everyone, and it will happen to you) and still remain competitive. Our interest is to keep our battlefields full, and thus keep everyone else interested in battle.

AvengerCap.7983:

iola.9374:

Warlord.9074:

We have a theory about this. Some of us think that BG does overtime on the weekends pulls 24/36/48 hour shifts. This is why they always have such a good start and dominate the scoreboard on the weekend. Then they burn out and by the begining of the weekday they are either too tired to play or the other part of this strategy is to demoralize the other server by pushing so kitten weekends and get far enough ahead of them that the other server will be too demoralized and behind to win. Then they they have a weak showing on monday and early week becasue all of thief pugs think “haha yea we are sooo good we won this matchup already, lets go do pve” Then next time they check the score board BG isnt winning anymore. and then they are like" SoR and JQ double teams us they cheat"
If this is true IDK its just a theory.

Hmm, I’m a BG, and I pull around 6-10 hours shifts in weekend and 3 hours on weekdays (work), I don’t PVE, and I’ve never mentioned 2V1/cheat in my gaming life ever, so your theory isn’t quite right there :P

As a scientist IRL, I’d like to say that this sample size is a terrible representation of the population as a whole. Your opinion makes this study inconclusive. More data is needed. Theory is still sound…

As a scientist, don’t you think it’s wrong to formulate a hypothesis then accept or reject evidence based on whether or not it supports your hypothesis?

I can make any random statement and call it valid based on lack of evidence..especially on such an inaccurate and uncertain sample like an internet forum.

I recommend you take any posts about specific servers from users who are not from that particular server with a grain of salt.

Here’s a crazy idea for blowout matches: focused 2v1.

MagiKarp.8201:

Without us for a week and already missing us, this just cannot work, Sanctum of Rall you are too possessive we need to talk.

Hi, my name is SoR…and I’m a BG-holic.

Just to correct some misinformation about BG’s EU:

We never, even at the height of DEYS, had numbers as large as IRON has on the field. We will offer good fights as always, but we are not nearly as population heavy as people make us out to be. Our domination of this week’s matchup is simply due to the other two servers fielding much less numbers than usual or expected, and our core WvW force showing up regardless of who’s available for a fight.

Ayusaki.6739:

Neuromancer.2148:

Hahaha. That’s not a common practice. Probably the people realized there was an abundance of golems and decided to have a party.

^ This… or maybe there was just an overwhelming abundance of supply to burn.

Lets sit here quietly for a moment and think of what the more likely explanation is….

vanzan.1250:

MagiKarp.8201:

Sorry if this feels this way, but what BG is doing isn’t about crushing you, its about maintaining momentum and morale, MERC is showing up every night as usual even though we know we do not have to, this is to not get sloppy and keep our A game waiting for the return of the Sanctum of Rallverywhere.

The problem is if you maintain too much momentum and morale it has the opposite effect on the other servers, each day we have less and less wanting to play and today we cant get anyone into wvw.

I will still be there with a few people so your 50 can maintain momentum on me

There are far less people on our voice server than usual, to be fair. You’re probably fighting pugs mostly.

Hahaha. That’s not a common practice. Probably the people realized there was an abundance of golems and decided to have a party.

Why did TW transfer to JQ and not DB who actually need the help?

Rednik.3809:

Voicer.8239:

I really dislike IRON comment that SoR was the only1 that didnt offer help for transfers. You just made us and others look bad for no reason and lost some respect from enemys, if you care about it and I rly think you dont, mb bc the concept is a lil bit to much for you to understand. We are all the same bro, you’re better than no1. Sorry if you cant see that.

This answer was not intended to offend anyone, it was made as a clarification that no one bought our transfer to SoR. We chose the weakest server (in terms of points) in the top three, and only because it was the weakest, and not because someone offered or did not offer money.

Well sadly you guys were deceived. I’m not complaining, and I won’t accuse SoR of intentionally doing this, but when you were scouting, their SEA was on break, putting out ppt as low as 60. Thats a clear impossibility without guilds actually not playing for a long period of time. By the time you transferred the break was over, and now SoR sometimes ticks at 300 even during SEA. Any map I zone into has a full map zerg or at least 50 people in it. I salute SoR for finally receiving perfect coverage, probably the most perfect since HoD, but unfortunately your playmates are a bit more tired than you are and require the same benefits fresh transfers bring, not just in terms of numbers but also to revive interest in the game. Bashing a server for requiring new transfers like that is the height of hypocrisy and probably a big reason why other servers strongly dislike your community.

On other things…

Since no one cares to remember, we always have to mention that Laylyn, a BG member from the guild HNT, created a massive recruiting thread for ALL servers to balance out all the tiers. We don’t swallow people out of greed – we simply wish to remain competitive for our opponents’ sake. Would you really want to beat on a dead server? But we never take on more than we need. At the height of HB’s WvW days, we would not even hear of any requests for any EU guilds to come over because we clearly had that timezone in our pocket, and would just say, oh but server x needs EU, tell them to go there.

At the end of the day, Blackgate craves equitable competition. Scores that are so close you couldnt even ram a quaggan squad in between them. If to achieve that we have to help people onto our servers…yes, they received our help for transfer gems ONLY, none of this thousands of gold per guild BS that SoR likes to mention so much…it’s because we are a community that’s watching each others’ backs and wants to fight a good fight. That we have lost many to attrition is nothing to be ashamed about. That is the nature of gaming: people will get bored, find a job, go back to school and move on. I personally can’t play as much as I used to, because my business is taking off. Many respected commanders have also similar situations. Thats life. You’ll have to shut down the computer one day.

There are untruths that have been repeated so much that they have accepted as the truth. A server whose leadership blatantly accuses other servers of bribery, for a motivational speech I should add, is immediately branded as hostile and toxic. That is not fair play and sporting competition. No one else preaches on the basis of character assassination and it shows in the record number of trolls the server carries. These are not individuals looking to muddle the mixture…its the result of the beliefs of the leadership taking root in the populace’s minds.

Sanctum of Rall is in a position to continue a legacy okittendness and excellence embodied in the name the server bears. My job in real life is marketing and branding, and I say this as a professional: I really do appreciate the heritage you’ve inherited. But every spiteful comment that comes out of your leadership drags that name through the mid and ensures that you will remain in cult status, instead of becoming something more…a true community that is seen as such by GAMERS and not just your members. You could be on the brink of creating an enduring legacy but unless you know how to build it right, minus the toxins, you’ll remain to be a group that believed by no one but itself to be great.

hex.3218:

Hello everybody!

Look, it’s been real fun, but if I have to fight you all again next week, I’m going to pee on my laptop and set it on fire. So, let’s all put our quarters in the wish machine and hope that one of us, at least, gets to play 2 new opponents, that we everyone at least gets a chance to face one new server.

To be fair, it should be SoR who fights 2 new servers. Then, there might actually be a chance that those new servers would band together to take down SoR or at least make it a good fight.

Lets face it. Scores haven’t been close for a while. Even when BG gets new guilds, it doesn’t seem to help them get closer. The only thing that will bring interest back to the ‘lesser T1 servers’ is new blood. It’s no fun pulling out all the stops and playing to your best ability only to have someone just throw more bodies at you to win. When you beat that havoc squad and then 20 reserves show up, so you beat them back then 50 more reserves show up. To take a camp. That your guarding with 5 people.

So, hopefully JQ and BG will get a brief respite from the Hoard of Rall and get to fight even numbers for a little while. I mean, seeing as how neither server will even consider helping the other against SoR ever.

But if the oh so predictable matchup happens again (we all know it will), then I think we’re going to see a lot of attrition due to boredom from all 3 servers… At least on JQ/BG we have the challenge of beating the superior numbers and craptastic double teams… what does SoR get for a challenge? A door? Those 5 guys standing in the way of your 50 man zerg at spawn tower?

I’ve been on the top server before ticking 600 against zero resistance and it’s no fun. How long before SoR gets bored? because even with a new match up for them… there won’t be much better competition than BG/JQ. It’s the curse of being the top server. SoS saw it, JQ saw it. Now, SoR folks are starting to see it. There’s nothing special about being first when you have twice as many players even in prime time…

Let’s see if they can survive the death spiral!

In before the media cover-up.

Our server is only very high.
We had to endure weeks of being undermanned but we always showed up.
Its JQ BG who have the zergs.

Repeat ad zergium.

^ Forum warriors don’t have much by way of perspective.

Kreen I also came up with that name and posted it in our wvw shoutbox. Im just glad other people are catching on.

I miss the days when SoS was ranked first. They always seemed so gracious in victory.

I don’t know if it’s funny or sad to see how badly Blackgate has traumatized the SoR trolls. They just can’t let go

Do you also have 1000 know-it-alls telling you how to do your job? Give the devs a break.

There are only two server locations, NA and EU. I’ll leave it to you to fill in the blanks.

Burl.9567:

Are NA servers complaining about coverage during NA prime time now? What a sad state your servers must be in if you can’t get your NA population to play. You want to complain about SEA and EU, fine. I get that. But to complain that your NA can’t compete is just pathetic. The EU guilds thinking of transferring to JQQ and BG should really start looking at the T2 servers instead.

NA servers don’t necessarily mean good NA coverage. I don’t know why people keep insisting on this.

Reslinal.2359:

Aurust.8961:

aelflune.8590:

Zen.8497:

aelflune.8590:

Yeah, we can’t really complain, although it makes the whole SoR shtick about looking for good fights look lame as well.

SoR is looking for good fights but that can only happen if your opponents meet you halfway. Bring it on and we will have only good fights.

There’s nothing we can do if no one besides you guys play at those times, mate.

BG has 24/7 coverage…..

Not enough coverage to compete with your coverage when you can dominate EU and run mass zergs at 5 a.m est like today. You are also the only server that has queues on all 4 maps in NA during weekdays (indicated by your own people).

Your sense that server population indicating stacked is also completely flawed. If server population indicating stacked, then TC must be the most stacked server ever as they have the longest Full status.

Save your breath mate. They’ll only hear what they want to hear. That’s what makes them a great community!

CDS, what’s your problem? I’m alone, I bow, but four of you charge at me and kill me.

Liquid.9672:

magikfox.9658:

Liquid.9672:

Choo invented the zerg. True story!

When did you buy your game, last week?

Someone apparently skipped humor class.

Don’t blame him. He’s from Sanctum.

You answered your own question? Wow you should be on the Home TV Shopping network!