Guild Wars 2

Finally and interesting thread. I’m just thankful that the rewards for the games I play don’t conform to the ideas of the OP. When everyone is rich, no one is rich, so the question for me becomes; why even bother with rewards at all in that scenario? They all become very trivial if even the least capable players can earn them. At that point, the game is ONLY about the fun (if it’s fun at all), not any rewards and they can be completely removed. I get why MMO’s have them because that’s part of their sustaining factor. Otherwise, you get bored with the repeated content. THat’s not hard to understand; it takes a special level of obtuse to not follow that logic.

I’m curious if there are demographics associated with players that feel one way or another and how that’s linked to the kind of player specific games target. I’m sure there are correlations and to be frank, some of the the most fun games I’ve played don’t result in ‘stuff’ rewards; the fun play is rewarding itself. Can an MMO work like that? Has anyone played one like this? I know I haven’t. Why do I continue playing MMO’s then if most of the fun is linked to earning a reward? because the value of playing WITH other people is what makes it fun, moreso than the content itself.

I personally feel that if the rewards structure of an MMO (and GW2 is not a whole lot different than any other) does not suit you, you’re better off with a different kind of game because I’ve yet to see an MMO that trivializes rewards at the level being discussed in this thread.

Harper.4173:

Obtena.7952:

Maybe you don’t want a sub par FPS experience in an MMO but it’s not about what you want. I’ve never played an MMO that was about ‘what I want’. Anet wanted a collection of activities for unlock; if the requirement for those activities were based on ‘what everyone wants’, there would be no collection that would fulfill it.

But you can build something based on what the majority of your player demographic wants.
Why would you assume your player base that’s currently playing an MMO with MMO mechanics would want to stop playing that and enjoy your sub-par FPS or Race simulator experience?
Why not make the adventures use the mechanics that are linked to the game type your players are actually playing?

I don’t know and I won’t venture a guess. What I do know is that Anet has made a broad set of activities that appeal to a wide range of players in an attempt to make some parts of unlocking this interesting to most of the players. What I don’t understand is how some activities out of the many are such a barrier that people would refuse the whole unlocking process outright.

Black Box.9312:

Obtena.7952:

Harper.4173:

Obtena – people wanted a non-RNG method of getting a precursor that they could work at themselves.

Somehow you think a non-RNG translates to cheaper. It doesn’t and I don’t think Anet’s goal was to cater to people that wanted it cheaper either. Not their failure if someone assumes something that doesn’t come true.

Eventually, crafting method will become financially weighted to established methods. There are people where the main factor to choose crafting a precursor isn’t cost. You weren’t ever going to get a system where performance matters. That’s even more exclusive than the crafting is …

The trading post has always been an effective means to obtain a precursor without the need to rely on RNG. Sure, Anet might not have explicitly mentioned that they were going to make it a cheaper alternative, but the logical assumption was that that would be the case because otherwise it would be a pointless addition. The RNG drops on the trading post would maybe decrease in price a bit, but would still retain value for their convenience, while anyone could instead choose to put more labor and time into crafting it while being able to save their gold as well.

Instead, we have a system that takes more time, more work, and more money than just outright buying it. It’s a completely inferior process that, at best, doesn’t change anything, and at worst, introduces a host of new problems while completely failing to address the problems that inspired the concept to begin with.

That’s just a narrow perspective. The system appeals to people that don’t care about how much time work and money it takes to craft a precursor. I personally think this solves one of the key problems with the original concept which was a lack of a static, measurable goal to earning your legendary.

Harper.4173:

Obtena.7952:

Harper.4173:

Obtena – people wanted a non-RNG method of getting a precursor that they could work at themselves.

Somehow you think a non-RNG translates to cheaper. It doesn’t and I don’t think Anet’s goal was to cater to people that wanted it cheaper either. Not their failure if someone assumes something that doesn’t come true.

Eventually, crafting method will become financially weighted to established methods. There are people where the main factor to choose crafting a precursor isn’t cost. You weren’t ever going to get a system where performance matters. That’s even more exclusive than the crafting is …

I don’t want cheaper – I want alternate.
I don’t want to have to buy the item with gold – off the TP or through a collection.
I want a skill-based challenge (Like Liardri or other hard content) that will reward me with items required for my precursor.

I want my precursor to be made by me spending time getting better at the game and attempting harder content in order to overcome challenges not just farm gold.

Performance being exclusive? sure that’s true – but these are Legendary weapons – they’re not supposed to be commonplace and if the common player wants them they still have the alternative of buying them.

Yup, I get all that, but what Anet’s vision can’t accommodate every players wants, so it’s not very relevant to ever bring that into a discussion.

Harper.4173:

Obtena – people wanted a non-RNG method of getting a precursor that they could work at themselves.

Somehow you think a non-RNG translates to cheaper. It doesn’t and I don’t think Anet’s goal was to cater to people that wanted it cheaper either. Not their failure if someone assumes something that doesn’t come true.

Eventually, crafting method will become financially weighted to established methods. There are people where the main factor to choose crafting a precursor isn’t cost. You weren’t ever going to get a system where performance matters. That’s even more exclusive than the crafting is …

Maybe you don’t want a sub par FPS experience in an MMO but it’s not about what you want. I’ve never played an MMO that was about ‘what I want’. Anet wanted a collection of activities for unlock; if the requirement for those activities were based on ‘what everyone wants’, there would be no collection that would fulfill it.

Ashern.5328:

Most importantly, this thread is directed heavily at ArenaNet for the grave misthinking on their part.

And most honestly, this is why your mature thread is not. Anet didn’t misthink anything here. If you’re angry you got fooled into making a kittenumption that crafting was going to be a cheaper route, for some reason OTHER than Anet telling you, that’s not Anet’s fault. That’s where the ‘maturity’ of the thread comes in. Accept your error, move on. Anet never gave any indication they were implementing crafting so people could get legendaries cheaper than established methods.

The complaining is a little over the top. Crafting is not your only option to get a precursor. It’s time some mature thinking prevails here. Choose the option that best suits your playstyle; if none of the options appeals to you, well, you just won’t get one.

Supernaut.2684:

Vayne.8563:

And this post is another example of how little the player base understands the creation of a major software title, and how fixing bugs takes time. It’s like some of you have never played an MMO before.

The complaints on forums of virtually every MMO after a major update pretty much look like this forum. Maybe there’s a reason for that.

Saying Anet doesn’t care because a bug hasn’t been fixed yet (when other issues have been dealt with) is just not on.

So people shouldn’t complain, then? I run my own business, and I LOVE it when people complain. It motivates me to do a better job and to provide a better service. But when one looks at the myriad of issues/bugs that have been present in this game for months (or even years now), with not even a simple acknowledgement on ANet’s part, it’s very easy to believe they just don’t care. The OP’s concern is a very real one.

They should complain about stuff that makes sense. The post you’ve quoted that he’s referring to did not. Anet doesn’t care because bugs? That’s utterly ridiculous.

Tomiyou.3790:

Arcaedus.7290:

Coalescence of Ruin (Revenant Hammer #2) needs nerfing first, then we’ll talk about trueshot.

But on topic: yes, I think trueshot would be balanced at 5s cd. 4s seems a bit too low, and 6s would hurt the dps too much.

Yea, Rev is “interesting” as of now. I actually find myself handling trueshot quite easily, but most ppl just run onto the point like idiots, then get combed from 100%-0% by Dragonhunter traps and bow, whoever still stands usually gets finished by the 2nd trueshot.

Whatever the specific details, nothing should ever be nerfed because of bads.

That’s ridiculous. It’s a choice whether or not the options are in balance; there are tons of choices that aren’t balanced; you make the choices that best suit you. For example, if balance is the main factor you use in how you make a decision on your choice, you choose based on what you consider the MOST balanced. Anet has simply expanded the choices available to take into account more of the things that players value. Some players might decide their main factor has nothing to do with balance, so may not arrive at the same choice you did. Your perspective is very narrow.

I think my only complaint (or I just don’t know) is that the new Legendaries are only available through crafted precursors. THIS I don’t like. Whenever my choices as a player are limited, that’s a problem. Crafted precursors and however Anet decided to implement them are not.

It’s not a genuine fairness issue; I’m going to challenge the idea that Anet implemented any of the available methods to get a precursor with fairness as a factor. It’s a CHOICE issue. You’re trying to make this complicated because complicated suits your arguments. Really, it’s simple. The point of crafting precursors is about choice for players. You pick the choice that is best suited to your playstyle. Now that we have crafted precursors, I think that the core playstyles are captured.

Ohoni.6057:

I have to challenge that because Anet never came out and said “We are making craftable precursors so legendaries are more obtainable”. It’s simply an option for people that don’t want to play TP/MF.

Except that it requires roughly as much “playing the TP” as just buying the thing, only with more outside work on top of that.

So what? No really … if you’re the kind of player that simply wants to craft it, you don’t care what other methods allow you to do to get a legendary; mutually exclusive.

Frankly, I can’t find my way around … they should just give rewards for roaming around that map.

It’s a plenty fair point because the price of a precursor on the TP tends to be variable; therefore, saving gold to buy your precursor is NOT a pre-defined goal.

You CAN say that about precursor crafting: I know EXACTLY how much I need of whatever mats and activities are needed to craft a precursor. So you go ahead and ask again what the point is, I will just repeat my original thoughts; crafting gives you a a definite requirement that no other method does.

These arguments stem from a lack of understanding the monetary value vs. the real value of a thing. I’m no economist but this has specific terms and it’s clear that people are equating these two values when they make their “I’m angry about crafted precursors” threads.

Swagger.1459:

Well certain players use them as opposed to save them…

@linken- gotcha, thanks. There are bigger issues with it so winter daily won’t resolve it for the long run.

There is no drought … you can set your clock to when you get laurels, literally. If you were to explain exactly WHY you think generally, we need more laurels, we are listening. If you just want to be cryptic and think that makes you clever, well, just carry on.

Demandred.7930:

Junkpile.7439:

You don’t need power in condi spec.

Builds with sinister and viper are basically hybrids, not pure condi. A large proportion of your damage will be power-type damage (see the sinister vs viper thread linked above).

Really? Tell that to my Scepter Auto attack.

So here is a tip from someone that farms to make gold:

Yes, the nodes change BUT … the areas you find them are pretty consistent. If someone would take the time to take some statistics of where nodes appear over many many new map instances, you will find that there are areas favoured by specific nodes. If you have farmed enough, like me, you will know where those areas are just from experience.

I read some recent QQ about having to ‘run around aimlessly to farm wood’ … not if you’re knowledgeable. It’s not aimless at all. A good farmer know the OPTIMAL path in a map to get the mats he wants.

Thanks Nexterror. Good job.

mcwurth.2081:

Obtena.7952:

Meta events are divided into many smaller events. I know the exact events you’re referring to because I did all of them in that chain this morning; you get an event reward for EVERY ONE of them, PLUS your periodic participation reward for the meta AND whatever loot drops from the mobs in the events, including champ bags, etc… If you THINK you didn’t get a reward, you simply missed it because rewards are raining on you all the time in VB.

I KNOW I didn’t get a reward for that event. and several others. I do not know why I do not get a reward, I do know I do damage, and help out in events, I just sometimes do not get the reward. How can I miss it it when it ALWAYS pops up on the side of my screen? ALWAYS!

Funny that you ragequit because one bugged event didn’t give you a reward … ONE. I don’t know how you can miss it. Busy? I miss those notifications because I just click them to get them gone.

That still doesn’t change the fact that you’re biggest issue is one that is already solved; meta events ARE broken down into smaller, more accessible events.

tim.1280:

I think most people are missing the point here. The point of precursor crafting was to make them more obtainable to people in the game.

I have to challenge that because Anet never came out and said “We are making craftable precursors so legendaries are more obtainable”. It’s simply an option for people that don’t want to play TP/MF.

I find it very hard to not camp LB. Unless something is directly in my face and I can’t shake it or don’t think I can survive it, I won’t use a melee. That’s a rare occasion. That being said, you really have to know your enemy to know if melee or ranged will work for you in any particular situation.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

tim.1280:

Obtena.7952:

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

I get your analogy and I know about how the craftable item is cheaper to craft yourself than buy as well. I don’t see the relevance.

This system is Anet’s response to players wanting to give players a more meaningful experience getting a legendary. It does that better than the old ways. Price just wasn’t a factor and I think for the more astute people, they knew it; not because Anet wants to screw people and get them to buy gems, but because it CAN’T.

Let’s be honest … did you think it was going to be different than what it is? Look at what you have to do for current Legendary or Ascended Gear. Think about it.

Ah, but in the end, it isn’t more meaningful, because you have to buy it after all. So all that work that would otherwise make it meaningful is void of purpose.

It’s not less meaningful because you have to buy something. What is this something you HAVE to buy?

I really don’t see people not buying some of the materials unless they want to wait 2+ years to get them all…

Neither do I, but I don’t think it makes the whole process less meaningful to the person crafting it.

Because why go through all the extra work when in the end you’re just gonna buy anyways…

Like I already mentioned, to some people, that doesn’t matter. Please read.

tim.1280:

Obtena.7952:

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

I get your analogy and I know about how the craftable item is cheaper to craft yourself than buy as well. I don’t see the relevance.

This system is Anet’s response to players wanting to give players a more meaningful experience getting a legendary. It does that better than the old ways. Price just wasn’t a factor and I think for the more astute people, they knew it; not because Anet wants to screw people and get them to buy gems, but because it CAN’T.

Let’s be honest … did you think it was going to be different than what it is? Look at what you have to do for current Legendary or Ascended Gear. Think about it.

Ah, but in the end, it isn’t more meaningful, because you have to buy it after all. So all that work that would otherwise make it meaningful is void of purpose.

It’s not less meaningful because you have to buy something. What is this something you HAVE to buy?

I really don’t see people not buying some of the materials unless they want to wait 2+ years to get them all…

Neither do I, but I don’t think it makes the whole process less meaningful to the person crafting it.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

I get your analogy and I know about how the craftable item is cheaper to craft yourself than buy as well. I don’t see the relevance.

This system is Anet’s response to players wanting to give players a more meaningful experience getting a legendary. It does that better than the old ways. Price just wasn’t a factor and I think for the more astute people, they knew it; not because Anet wants to screw people and get them to buy gems, but because it CAN’T.

Let’s be honest … did you think it was going to be different than what it is? Look at what you have to do for current Legendary or Ascended Gear. Think about it.

Ah, but in the end, it isn’t more meaningful, because you have to buy it after all. So all that work that would otherwise make it meaningful is void of purpose.

It’s not less meaningful because you have to buy something, no more so than having to get a recipe or vendor only materials like spools, etc… . What is this something you HAVE to buy?w

I get your analogy and I know about how the craftable item is cheaper to craft yourself than buy as well. I don’t see the relevance.

This system is Anet’s response to players wanting to give players a more meaningful experience getting a legendary. It does that better than the old ways. Price just wasn’t a factor and I think for the more astute people, they knew it; not because Anet wants to screw people and get them to buy gems, but because it CAN’T.

Let’s be honest … did you think it was going to be different than what it is? Look at what you have to do for current Legendary or Ascended Gear. Think about it.

You will never be reimbursed for your ‘effort’ playing a game … I can’t even believe I read that. It’s not a job, your RL necessities are not a results of time ingame. Are you even aware that through the EULA, you don’t even OWN your account? This stuff isn’t even yours.

There is lots of logic behind it because if you think about it, most people don’t need ascended and the cost barrier is a way to get people to rethink and break out of their “new gear, must get” MMO thinking so embedded in gamers from decades of other MMO’s. Plus, I got no problem profiting off of people wanting to get ascended gear, needed or not. It’s actually a great way to get lower level players/newer players some gold as well.

No, it’s part of what is necessary to get those legendary. You might think it’s unfair or unreasonable, but it’s definitely work that needs to happen. Perhaps you think it’s just ‘busywork’ because it’s not part of the tangible set of materials that actually go into crafting, but so is leveling a character to get the mats, leveling your crafting skills, watching the TP, etc… ; point is that there are LOTS of activities you need to do (that you aren’t considering or at least you haven’t mentioned) that go beyond the ‘collect loot, make legendary" that aren’t factored into it’s ‘cost’, so it’s rather silly to complain only about the ones you don’t like.

These extra activities certainly don’t invalidating anything (methinks you don’t know the meaning of the word); those non-materials activities definitely count because you won’t get one without them, including the ones you haven’t mentioned.

… or you could just you know … make a legendary the old way because you have choices. Maybe you’re going to be like that other guy … take the stubborn route and be hyper-focused specific, then complain because you choose to be stubborn, that it’s too hard or unreasonable, or whatever.

I mean, if you think about it, those activities make sense because you can’t deny that simply buying mats and crafting a ‘legendary’ item , or even just buying it directly, is not all that legendary at all. In fact, it’s one of the things that many players complained about. So you see, you might think it’s all just a waste of time, Anet is just responding to players complaints and creating a system where players actually DO something related to their legendary that is meaningful to them; at least more so than buying it outright.

BrotherBelial.3094:

Obtena.7952:

BrotherBelial.3094:

Obtena.7952:

Iason Evan.3806:

Obtena.7952:

Regardless of what raids could have been or should or whatever academic discussion … if you ignore they are there because you don’t like them, it won’t affect the things you like about the game.

True. All of this stuff works together though. Why the dungeon nerf? Because they wanted everyone doing the same content.

No, that’s why players think Anet nerfed dungeons. These things don’t work together; they are independent of each other. It’s simply convenient for you to say they do for your theory to work.

Ok then. If the dungeon nerf had not happened, would people be doing the new maps to make gold or doing the raids?

They would; people do new content because it’s fun and new to them, just as one example; there are lots of reasons to do the new content and none are related to making gold because running the new content isn’t the best way to make gold. I know this bursts your bubble but … dungeons aren’t the best way to make gold in the first place. Also, many people don’t play just to make gold anyhow. Shocker I know.

Sure SW is probably the best place to make gold, but before that dungeons where, .

They weren’t but even if they were, it’s irrelevant to the argument that no one would play HoT if they didn’t nerf dungeon rewards. That’s just nonsense. In fact, that’s the irony of all this; people QQing that dungeon rewards got nerfed and now they have NO idea on how to make gold … they never DID.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

OK the execution is stupid … that’s still the purpose. Besides, all the things you elude to has nothing to do with what the point of crafting precursors is … you just want em cheap. That’s definitely not what anything Legendary in this game is going to be about. There is no nerf needed: if you want a cheaper, faster or more lazy way, you have options.

The thread for QQ about precursor expensive is down the hall, first door on the left.

No, I just want to earn it, properly; through challenging content worthy of a legendary. I just want my time and effort to be validated, and for methods of obtainment to be worth doing.

You can with crafting, you’ve simply convinced yourself you can’t because reasons. ANet doesn’t cater to opinions.

No, I’ve convinced myself of nothing, I recognize that legendaries can now be earned through farming and crafting, but I also recognize that the other effort we put into the journey isn’t factored into the equation at all, and as such is invalidated.

I’m looking at all the facts, but you’re ignoring one… who’s convinced himself???

You’re just going to have to be more specific; what effort is invalidated in your journey to a legendary? I don’t get it. You earn mats, build your subcomponents, unlock masteries and finally make your legendary. What is it that you have to do exactly that doesn’t go towards earning you a legendary but is part of this journey?

I don’t speak for mostly everyone else. It’s obvious what kind of guilds GH’s are for. Same thing for Guild missions … Ignore it all you want but there IS content in this game that’s inline with traditional MMO’s. Crying that a duo guild can’t afford a GH is silly.

mcwurth.2081:

Obtena.7952:

mcwurth.2081:

Obtena.7952:

Dejavu.2349:

Obtena.7952:

My problem with your complain about GH’s is that it’s based on the number of people in your guild. See, that’s not actually your problem because we all know the barrier to doing GH isn’t people in the guild, it’s gold.

It’s Mats… That some people will buy with Gold, Sure. I prefer to pay them for Black Lion Market things… not for gold to get a basic quality of life back. Maybe when I’m bored enough, I’ll go through the mat list and assign current gold values to everything, so we can see just how much it would take…

But no, inherently, it’s not Gold.

That’s a convenient argument for you. Mats is equivalent to gold in this game as we know. Besides, if you’’re going the mat route, the expectation is that it already takes you longer, so complaining about it makes no sense. You can’t complain about how hard it is if you’re just going to be stubborn and take the hard way to do things. I mean, you can, but you don’t look very good doing it; since day one collecting your own mats for whatever has always been the hardest and slowest way to go about crafting; I see no reason that GH is any different.

either way: materials or gold requires game time. converting materials/drops into gold takes time and needs to be gathered etc etc. it really isnt about the leght it takes (for me anyway) it is the implementation of how all was done. YES we get to keep certain things and are given BUT if we want to continue with it as before we have to REDO everything. sort off not fair but meh, keep calm and grind on i guess

Exactly, so it’s not about how many people are in Guild, it’s about gold or mats you have.

it is also about people sort off, cant move on with 2 players in it. also for claiming the hall a guild needs a minimum of 5 players ( I hear the best is like 7 or while before hot ALL was reachable with even people having their private storage guild. which i can understand some people get flipped off about. as do I. my “private” guild consists off me and my best friend, we used to have more people but they left because we play irregular times. now she left GW2 because of HoT difficulty (she is fairly new to the game but already did all core things and cant go on HoT) So now I am alone…. I do not want to invite random people into it, scared for abuse of systems and such ( i know i know settings). so for my private thingy I am stuck now. I wasnt before. now i am. I wasnt before, with HoT Iam.

True, but that’s a vast minority of guilds. Some might say it’s reasonable that Anet doesn’t cater to EVERY single scenario, especially those that may not be inline with their ideas of how the game works. It doesn’t even make sense to me a 3 man org would want to make a GH and I doubt it does to mostly everyone else in this game.

mcwurth.2081:

Obtena.7952:

Dejavu.2349:

Obtena.7952:

My problem with your complain about GH’s is that it’s based on the number of people in your guild. See, that’s not actually your problem because we all know the barrier to doing GH isn’t people in the guild, it’s gold.

It’s Mats… That some people will buy with Gold, Sure. I prefer to pay them for Black Lion Market things… not for gold to get a basic quality of life back. Maybe when I’m bored enough, I’ll go through the mat list and assign current gold values to everything, so we can see just how much it would take…

But no, inherently, it’s not Gold.

That’s a convenient argument for you. Mats is equivalent to gold in this game as we know. Besides, if you’’re going the mat route, the expectation is that it already takes you longer, so complaining about it makes no sense. You can’t complain about how hard it is if you’re just going to be stubborn and take the hard way to do things. I mean, you can, but you don’t look very good doing it; since day one collecting your own mats for whatever has always been the hardest and slowest way to go about crafting; I see no reason that GH is any different.

either way: materials or gold requires game time. converting materials/drops into gold takes time and needs to be gathered etc etc. it really isnt about the leght it takes (for me anyway) it is the implementation of how all was done. YES we get to keep certain things and are given BUT if we want to continue with it as before we have to REDO everything. sort off not fair but meh, keep calm and grind on i guess

Exactly, so it’s not about how many people are in Guild, it’s about gold or mats you have.

Dejavu.2349:

Obtena.7952:

My problem with your complain about GH’s is that it’s based on the number of people in your guild. See, that’s not actually your problem because we all know the barrier to doing GH isn’t people in the guild, it’s gold.

It’s Mats… That some people will buy with Gold, Sure. I prefer to pay them for Black Lion Market things… not for gold to get a basic quality of life back. Maybe when I’m bored enough, I’ll go through the mat list and assign current gold values to everything, so we can see just how much it would take…

But no, inherently, it’s not Gold.

That’s a convenient argument for you. Mats is equivalent to gold in this game as we know. Besides, if you’’re going the mat route, the expectation is that it already takes you longer, so complaining about it makes no sense. You can’t complain about how hard it is if you’re just going to be stubborn and take the hard way to do things. I mean, you can, but you don’t look very good doing it; since day one collecting your own mats for whatever has always been the hardest and slowest way to go about crafting; I see no reason that GH is any different.

My problem with your complain about GH’s is that it’s based on the number of people in your guild. See, that’s not actually your problem because we all know the barrier to doing GH isn’t people in the guild, it’s gold.

BrotherBelial.3094:

Obtena.7952:

Iason Evan.3806:

Obtena.7952:

Regardless of what raids could have been or should or whatever academic discussion … if you ignore they are there because you don’t like them, it won’t affect the things you like about the game.

True. All of this stuff works together though. Why the dungeon nerf? Because they wanted everyone doing the same content.

No, that’s why players think Anet nerfed dungeons. These things don’t work together; they are independent of each other. It’s simply convenient for you to say they do for your theory to work.

Ok then. If the dungeon nerf had not happened, would people be doing the new maps to make gold or doing the raids?

They would; people do new content because it’s fun and new to them, just as one example; there are lots of reasons to do the new content and none are related to making gold because running the new content isn’t the best way to make gold. I know this bursts your bubble but … dungeons aren’t the best way to make gold in the first place. Also, many people don’t play just to make gold anyhow. Shocker I know.

I wasn’t talking about raids either. Anet said the whole of HoT was a step up in challenge. Focus of the game hasn’t changed, it’s still Barbie and Ken Dress up MMO and still allows for non-pros to play 99% of the game and feel good about how awesome they killed that mob while watching Netflix and pressing 1. Game is still casual friendly; they haven’t removed any of the content that all the casual people love to do.

I get it .. even though Anet warned you about the difficult content, you were hoping for something different and bought HoT anyways. It’s got some surprises you don’t like that offend your ‘want to solo an MMO’ playstyle and now you’re unhappy and trying to think of ways to show how the wool was pulled over your eyes.

BrotherBelial.3094:

Obtena.7952:

Regardless of what raids could have been or should or whatever academic discussion … if you ignore they are there because you don’t like them, it won’t affect the things you like about the game.

Iason Evan.3806:

I find it interesting that they nerfed dungeon rewards to get people all playing the same content but didn’t introduce a system for raids that helped to teach the majority of players who aren’t skilled enough to do raids how to raid like the Fractals do by easing you into the content.

Sure they did, it’s called Dungeons.

But they killed the rewards from Dungeons. So new players will probably never do them past story mode, as people will probably get groups for them to unlock the PvP tracks.

But riddle me this, Raid’s are completely different to Dungeons. one is 5 the other 10 player content. also the fights in Raids are nothing like fights in Dungeons. You really can’t compare them.

I’m not comparing them, I’m simply saying that dungeons prepares you for what to expect in raids.

Iason Evan.3806:

Obtena.7952:

Regardless of what raids could have been or should or whatever academic discussion … if you ignore they are there because you don’t like them, it won’t affect the things you like about the game.

True. All of this stuff works together though. Why the dungeon nerf? Because they wanted everyone doing the same content.

No, that’s why players think Anet nerfed dungeons. These things don’t work together; they are independent of each other. It’s simply convenient for you to say they do for your theory to work.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

OK the execution is stupid … that’s still the purpose. Besides, all the things you elude to has nothing to do with what the point of crafting precursors is … you just want em cheap. That’s definitely not what anything Legendary in this game is going to be about. There is no nerf needed: if you want a cheaper, faster or more lazy way, you have options.

The thread for QQ about precursor expensive is down the hall, first door on the left.

No, I just want to earn it, properly; through challenging content worthy of a legendary. I just want my time and effort to be validated, and for methods of obtainment to be worth doing.

You can with crafting, you’ve simply convinced yourself you can’t because reasons. ANet doesn’t cater to opinions.

Smoosh.2718:

To clarify I’ve been playing for over a year and a bit, have 4 legendary weapons and put in over 3k hours into this game. This topic isnt just about the legendary weapons but more about the actual manifesto for the direction of the game. Why has the no grind policy been thrown out the window?

There is nothing that says the game direction can’t change. I’m not schooling you on ‘no-grind’; there are multiple threads correcting people that believe it.

Dejavu.2349:

Once again, This thread isn’t about raids. Nobody here gives a rat’s kitten about raids.

This thread is about Anet completely disregarding an entire player class.

But no class of player is being disregarded.

1. Anet made it very clear HoT was a step up in challenge. Not sure what that means to most people but for me it means ‘if your a scrub, don’t buy this’.
2. The player class you claim is disregarded has been catered to for the last 3 years.
3. Even if someone isn’t a pro gamer, there is still much that can be accomplished in HoT.

Iozeph.5617:

Curo.2483:

The raid was designed for organized groups of highly experienced and geared players to have a challenge. Anyone who complains about the raid being inaccessible is missing the point.

Oh. That so? Then let that sort of content be developed in future(assuming there is one)with the funds coming only from that percent of the player base. Then see how good it is.

That’s a rather disingenuous statement … for 3 years the people that wanted harder content have been funding content for scrubs … I don’t suppose you think they should get their money back now do you?

The fact is that people that can’t do raids aren’t being left out. There is tons of easy content for them to do. .. or they have the option to step up their game.

OK the execution is stupid … that’s still the purpose. Besides, all the things you elude to has nothing to do with what the point of crafting precursors is … you just want em cheap. That’s definitely not what anything Legendary in this game is going to be about. There is no nerf needed: if you want a cheaper, faster or more lazy way, you have options.

The thread for QQ about precursor expensive is down the hall, first door on the left.

The elite trait spec will only appear in the bottom traitline bar.

OtakuModeEngage.8679:

Obtena.7952:

The point is simple; allows you to track your progress to a pre-defined goal. That’s all it was ever intended to be.

Regardless of the intent, it pointless, stupid even to complete the legendary journey when you can just buy a precursor for less money, time, and work.

Good thing not everyone feels that way. Some people don’t care about those things and just want a reliable method to see how far along they are in the process of making a precursor. That’s the point of crafted precursors.

The point is simple; allows you to track your progress to a pre-defined goal. That’s all it was ever intended to be.

Meta events are divided into many smaller events. I know the exact events you’re referring to because I did all of them in that chain this morning; you get an event reward for EVERY ONE of them, PLUS your periodic participation reward for the meta AND whatever loot drops from the mobs in the events, including champ bags, etc… If you THINK you didn’t get a reward, you simply missed it because rewards are raining on you all the time in VB.

Smoosh.2718:

Ok, picture yourself as someone who has just hit level 80 been playing for 3 or 4 months and wants to get the new legendary weapon. How on earth are they to get the gold or materials without resorting to heavy heavy grind?

It’s funny that you make it sound like being a 3-4 month old player is something special to be catered to … if you have played more than 3-4 months, you’ve BEEN there and somehow, managed to get through it.

How to get gold, etc… the same way everyone who have been playing since beta does … being ingame only 3-4 months is NOT a barrier to doing anything in this game.

Regardless of what raids could have been or should or whatever academic discussion … if you ignore they are there because you don’t like them, it won’t affect the things you like about the game.

Iason Evan.3806:

I find it interesting that they nerfed dungeon rewards to get people all playing the same content but didn’t introduce a system for raids that helped to teach the majority of players who aren’t skilled enough to do raids how to raid like the Fractals do by easing you into the content.

Sure they did, it’s called Dungeons.