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Easy. A four-kit build that still had room for elixir S would be way better than dropping three turrets on 180sec cooldown. I’ll give up my toolbelt skill from elixir gun.
Took the words right out of my mouth!!!! Med kit, grenade kit, elixir gun, tool kit, and STILL be able to use elixir s?? YESSS PLEASE sign me and sacrifice that 5th tool belt skill to the gods
I have been using surround to play for over a month now and it’s been great. But today when I go to log in I can’t unless I play in 1920×1080. As soon as I put it to 5900×1080 it basically start flashing and I can’t do anything but hard reset the pc. This is really a pain a love playing this game in surround can anyone help me
I’d take the raw damage over conditions any day so it’s a nerf anyway I look at it
A truly amazing idea. And if I could, I would drop supply crate in a heartbeat. The amount of builds that would become viable to me would be insane, I can only imagine
Elementalist? They get 1 save from a finisher. Thief & mesmer get unlimited. It’s actually faster to just hit them with auto attack than try a finisher.
Warriors I agree with though, since almost every time you are downed in PvP you are going to die anyway, it’s really like giving them a bunch of extra HP.
But a elementalist can stop a Whole group guaranteed on the first stomp while still repositioning themselves. You cannot stomp an ele on the first try. A thief or Mesmer can still be stomped by one person guaranteed if your fast enough everytime (blink stomp, lightning flash stomp, any teleport skill usable while stomping).
We took a big step backwards in my opinion with the laTest patch
One of the reasons I roll them in the first place
They just need to balance them
Why the hell did they change Super Elixir S? Seems pathetic on the pulse heal even with all healing+ gear. I loved my build for dungeon runs in CoF and TA as well as supporting in WvW occasionally, but now it feels worthless. I’ll give it a try or two in a dungeon, but probably will be hopping back onto my mesmer >.>
The way it is now is the wait always was technically, they broke it in the last months patch. Ironic how long it takes them to break broken things if ever, but that super explicit sure got fixed in a hurry
Ranger auto attack also hits twice as fast as engineer rifle 1
You guys are noobs. 30% damage reduction from the grenade auto-attack. Do you guys seriously spam the auto-attack that much to even make that much of a difference? I rotate through grenades, bombs, rifle, and heal skills throughout the fights. I do use the grenade autoattack, but not THAT often and I still do pretty well. I don’t see why everyone is crying so much about this.
You called everyone in this thread a noob, but yet state yourself don’t even understand what’s so bad about it. So we’re the noobs….but you basically have no clue what were talking about. Because if you don’t understand why a %30 dmg reduction to grenade 1 is such a huge blow then that technically makes you the noob, amirite?
I’m wondering if they nerfed us like this because the weapon stats on kits will bring them back up? If they do will they nerf them again? Will they make it so grenades gains no benefit or some kind of lower benefit from weapons? Really wonder if I even care enough to play engineers anymore to find out
OP your opinion has been noted.
Same build as before.
Place your curser in the center of your screen, hold down the right mouse button, now press 1 so the nade target comes up (if you have enables autocast, disable it) now move around and “aim” with the mouse. Get adjusted to ‘looking up’ to aim further away, and ‘looking down’ to aim closer.
Double tap your nade skills to “fire” and play as a third person shooter. Your nade kit just became %100 more powerful. You may soon understand why they nerfed it.
This is how I play. Except I use auto hotkey to hold down the RMB for me and can engage and disengage with 1 click instead of holding (think combat mod) I also use razer naga and razer nostromo so I can move with an analog and hit keys with unrestricted movement. I could hit a moving target pretty consistently and they were always my main source of damage
I played around with them some when I got home now and I didn’t seem to notice any difference in speed. The damage is absolute crap now though
Engineer was my first class, and I had a blast making it to 80, but I now find that I don’t know what build to make. I cant find one that does a good amount of DMG, even a glass cannon rifle power build is underwhelming, and I would rather not develop arthritis early in life by spamming grenade skills, which have been nerfed by 30% anyway.
ArenaNet: I really like the IDEA of your Engineer class, and would enjoy it SO much more if I felt like an effective member of a party or even Dynamic Event. Please stop nerfing me.
Thank you,
KeynorWhy should we have to change every time there’s a patch. See i went thru this in WoW when they put that marine biologist in charge of class balancing and guess what Every week I had to relearn my class EVERY WEEK. in this game however if you have to change your build you have to change your entire expensive as hell gear and rune sets and even weapons. So guess what, more money more money or endless farming hours just to make a new set that might not work.
So here we are again, with yet ANOTHER broken spec that no one can use so people will be scrambling to get the gold they need to make a new armor set and weapons with the appropriate sigils so they can actually do something with this class again.
It’s NOT versatility when you keep breaking every single viable build we have left!
And now we have people denying engineers into dungeon groups because they can’t support, they can’t dps. What’s left CC? Yeah show me Jon show me the engineer that is viable in a dungeon run that can only do CC. Seriously.
This is what’s forcing me away, there isn’t any other viable damage source to turn to
I really did love this ability in its broken form, I do believe that how it should have been. Heck I’d even be happy if they left it broken and made it so it would only heal you. They break so many things each patch but they make sUre the engineer doesn’t have anything good for long. I think this is it for my engineer days, and the saddest part is not because I don’t want to play them anymore. The reason is because the isn’t anything else I have left to turn to in order to be viable in pvp…..nothing comes close to what we lost in the last 2 pvp updates
Well at least we know all the kit swapping will make us excellent elementalists
Waiting for the answer to this one as well..
Many of the posts in this thread make me realize how many people have no clue about the real mechanics behind grenades. I’ve never even done wvw and grenades was still my bread and butter
Also if you think that flash and poison grenade will recoup any more then a fraction of the damage lost from the 1 nerf then it just supports what I said before (and short fuse is STILL broken to my knowledge).
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arent two other grenades now doing damage in addition to applying conditions? + sigil buff makes it worth it. also grenade spam was lame and this may encourage people to try different things.
You can’t be serious dude
I might actually play my engineer now. Before I felt if I wasn’t doing grenades, I wasn’t doing what I optimally could be doing (in PvE), and grenade spamming just isn’t fun.
Personally I like this change, grenades were completely overpowered, and now I can go p/p condition build and never look back.
Cool story bro.
Every other prof can outperform your “versatility” if you werent aware.Performing “optimally” as an engineer requires FAR more busywork than any other prof and should be compensated accordingly. Grenades takes more skill than then entire warrior prof combined, yet a 30% damage nerf to its red circle spam kinda makes it not very intimidating to other players, and have fun taking 40 grenades to kill a mob in cursed shore.
Not to turn this into a flamefest, which many people seem to wish to do, but if you think grenade spamming was/and/or is difficult — wow.
Have you played a glass cannon warrior? I’m guessing you haven’t, because it isn’t just BullRush+Frenzy+HundredBlades. Do that in PvE and have fun dying.
There is no comparison in the difference of how easy it is to ranged attack, compared to how much more intense and difficult it is to melee in this game.
Pistol/pistol engineer is actually a lot more interesting for me than grenade spam ever was. And being a heavy condition build and being able to stack 20-25 stacks of bleeds all ticking for 120 damage each second, in addition to poison and burning seems at the least competitive with other professions and certainly not very hard of a playstyle.
So basically your saying you can hit any kind of target with grenades? Someone who is running in circles, a straight line, zig zagging, no matter the movement you will land every grenade? If you can’t do any of the above consistently throughout every game and land EVERY SINGLE GRENADE, then you my friend are a troll!
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Did they even fix short fuse which they broke in the last nerf?
I always thought that the tradeoff for having higher damage with grenades was that they were AOE and on a delay. In WvW in particular this meant that you missed your target a significant number of times unless you were shooting at a piece of siege equipment.
This is what I always believed, and that delay makes it SO much different from other aoes
Ele’s can almost have regeration and protection up almost all the time now with this patch
Ele’s could always maintain high/100% protection uptime. The nov. 15 patch bugged out one of our leap finishers which took away a large chunk of d/d ele’s protection. Now that it’s fixed it’s back to the way it’s been since release. There is currently a bug that was introduced with today’s patch that is granting a ridiculously high amount of protection, but I assume it will be hotfixed in a day.
You assume much, my good sir!
We waited for a hot-fix to the block bug on guardians for months (or was it “just” weeks?), to mention one.
Granted, Anet might be human enough to learn from their mistakes, but I would not hold my breath. I learned that from my own past mistakes..
Well they made sure they fixed the engineer elixir gun bug introduced on the nov 15th patch. But then again, they seem to have it out for engineers as well
I fear this patch may be the nail in the coffin
Farewell engineer…thanks for all the kit swapping training….I shall wield it valiantly on my new elementalist
I think I may be done with engi….this time around. Mainly because grenades was basically the only thing that made me feel viable enough in pvp. I am actually really good with them in pvp and I don’t miss much the way I play. But at least with all the kit swapping I can say I would probably make a fine elementalist, so I will most likely go that route.
The funniest thing about grenade kit is they nerfed it again but failed to fix the short fuse trait to give correct cd reductions they broke after last grenade nerf. Insane
Looking at the “Class Balance Philosophy” post I have to wonder if anet is playing the same game the rest of us.
One of the first thing I noticed
Been waiting to jump into the pve wanted to get on tarnished coast but I won’t be able off work for another 3 hours
Yeah well if you are using 3 kits the kits will give you counters depending on the kit, such as ae blind, ae frontal kb, a block etc which all are counters to shatters.
Well that certainly goes without saying obviously
It’s really really hard to dodge shatterspikes, but it’s not too easy to land them as the mesmer as well, but here are a few tricks I’ve picked up in countless 1v1’s with Top-Mesmers (I often 1v1-train with Top-30 EU-QP-Players):
1) First of all, don’t let them get near you if possible. It’s way easier to dodge the immobilize, if you actually see the Ilusion that does the leap, it’s harder if the mesmer stands near you and just presses “3” two times very quickly.
2) Everytime they get near you – dodge. Yes, this is only possible on chars that can potentially stay out of Melee-Range with the mesmer, but it’s IMHO the only safe way to avoid being immobilized, because everytime a mesmer is in Melee-range, he can potentially Immobilize you within the blink of an Eye.
- There are certain mediating Aspects to the Rule of Thumb above: Count the Illusions; if he doesn’t have 2 (1 he’ll get from Illusionary Leap), it’s not as likely that he’ll shatter you, or he’ll have to dodge somehwere in between to get a third one or he’ll spike without the full potential; In each of the cases, the spike won’t be as scary, because it’s not as fast or doesn’t deal as much dmg. These tips are only important if you don’t have enough dodges – if you have a high-endurance-build, it’s still best to always dodge if the mesmer is in Melee-range.
- Count the time between spikes and constantly know if Mind Wrack is up: Yes, being spiked with other shatters might still deal a bit of DPS and rip off boons, but MW is the Damage-Dealer: No need to use up dodges or Cooldowns on the other F-Skills of the Mesmer. If the Mesmer spiked you, you can easily go into Melee-range for like 10 Seconds and punish him, then just stay back out of Range when MW is back up.
- Watch where the Illusions are and try to control the Illusions with Movement: Most Mesmers use the Pistol-Duelist, which is ranged and the one on the Staff as well – the other Illusions are most of the time Melee: Try and spread out the Melee-Illusions as far as possible from the Ranged ones; this way, the spike won’t hit all at the same time and even if the Mesmer hits his immobilize, you might even be able to dodge some of the Shatters, because the Ranged Illusions had to walk 2+ seconds to you.3) Kill the Illusions: This is mostly an emergency-plan if you run out of defensive CD’s, dodges or have to go Melee with the Mesmer and staying alive is more important than actually dealing DMG to the Mesmer.
*Edit: if you simply wanted to know how to dodge individual Illusions: They stand still for maybe half a second and kinda charge up their shatter, that’s when you have to dodge them. So they need to be in that state of charging up the shatter, so they’ll actually explode. You kinda have to stand still for a moment and let them get near you or they’ll just keep running. ^^’
I hope I was able to help a bit. ^^
That’s quite the task for an engineer using 3 kits
2. I think it would make sense for channeled and incoming ranged attacks to disjoint after stealth. From my experience with the Elementalist’s arc lighting skill however ANet seems to have trouble with channeling skills and targets that are no longer targetable (dead or invis) so it might be a technical issue that prevents them from implementing this. For now treat it as a counter to slealth, lol…
3. IMO, the thief profession simply needs to be redone. Conceptually and mechanically its cheesy profession that adds little to PvP interactions. That’s not to say that they’re hard to beat, but they’re simply not very interesting or fun to fight against.
The real problem is initiative and how it promotes spamming of key skills. Whether intended by the user or the fault of the stupid skill queue system, it’s become a spam mehcanic. In multiplayer games these spam mechanics. especially those that work absurdly well, tend to leave those on the receiving end frustrated and dissatisfied with the experience and prevent the ones using them from becoming more experienced with more complex tactics. Why ANet let this pass is beyond me.
Additionally Heartseeking is tied with deathblossom, a skill that also moves you uncontrollably, as one of the most functionally broken thief skills. If not the entire profession, those two skills need to be redone.
Not to mention the evades tied to these techniques
It is not possible for me to game without my Razer naga , razer nostromo, and mobo chair arm mount. I don’t even have to sit at the desk I’m leaned back in the chair so comfortable
30-40 is bait much. I say anywhere in between 10-20 is good enough
Agreed I’d take the water field instead
Am I the only one who noticed downstate 2# does not always work? I’m talking strictly pvp, I try to time my 2# skills when I’m down according to the person stomping me, by that I mean timing it to go off last second before I get stomped. But when I do this I’ve seen the skill be used, and not interrupt the person stomping me. (And no the times I’m talking about do not involve some kind of “invuln” or stability skill I watch closely to the buffs). It seems to only happen when they are high mid air, which makes me use my skill earlier then I would like to due to thinking it’ll fail if I don’t. It does not happen everytime but enough to make me irritated.
I’m pretty fine for the whole pulling towards me deal, it’s funny doing it to someone currently using his burst set up. The simple fact it stops 1 person from stomping is “alright” with me. But when you compare this to the other class downstates its very under powered in usefulness for group situations or losing aggro against a monster in pve.
Would love to see perhaps a triple shot pull instead of a single, that would be great. (although I am certainly not thinking about pve lmao) so that’ll never happen :P
I notice this in spvp as well, sometimes I use and it goes right through and they had no boons going at times. Sometimes as soon as I go down the skill is already used. Although I think the worst thing is the cast time (for spvp at least) without a doubt. Many times I go down and the person is already standing right on top of me and begin the stomp immediately. If this is the case I find more then not that they can get the stomp off before I even throw the grapple. This is mainly due to the animation where he puts his arm up for a second and THEN throws it, you can actually watch it wind up but it’s just so slow.
Quoted from another thread
The main issue is simply that some classes have a #2 skill that may interrupt a single stomp (if no stability is used), some classes have a #2 that may interrupt an entire group from stomping and then there are classes that have a #2 that will interrupt an entire group from stomping no matter what they do.
You can’t balance on the #3, because the classes that can’t reliably interrupt multiple stomps with #2 will rarely get to use it.
I don’t consider the downed state to be that important for overall balance, but in itself it is completely unbalanced from one class to the next because of this.
grenades ARE NOT for spvp. if you’re using them there…i think there’s something wrong with you. that or your fingers have the speed of jimmy page.
Just because something doesn’t work for you doesn’t mean others can’t be good at at
Yea I find myself avoiding the one place where I used to hold dominion over
So your “evidence” is a video that you claim was on these boards 5 days ago that you can’t seem to find? Ok…..
Just to humor you, I switched back to my old grenade build and went to Orr. On crit, it did about 800 per grenade then, and sure enough each grenade on crit does about 800 a pop now.
Went to wvw. Against the same npcs, again, did 800 a pop then, does 800 a pop now. Went to heart of the mists. Does about 720 per grenade on crit against heavy golems now, which coincides with their spvp nerf.
Wanna know what happened? A few classes, like thieves, got some of their offensive traits/skills nerfed and some of their defensive skills/traits buffed. Now many of your player targets have more defense and less offense with similar builds to the ones they had pre-patch, and you do less damage.
Look “bub,” I’d even post screenshots of my nade damage against the same control targets before and after (yes, I do have screenshots of my nade damage pre-patch), but there’s no time stamps on in game screenshots so there’s really no point.
If I do the same damage against npcs, but reduced damage against some players, what does that mean? That’s right! They buffed those players’ defense a bit. Common sense ftw.
Video you linked…which you stated is you playing…your character in spvp.
Your damage is pathetic vs any other class in game, esp grenade damage.
I never once mentioned anything about NPC’s…but the 800 crits you are getting, well I am getting close to the same except I used to get around 1400 crits…and yet you say the damage was not nerfed and that defenses went up. If defenses went up and engineers were not compensated with more defense themselves, or more control or more damage elsewhere, then the engineer took a nerf…outside of the fact that the damage was nerfed.
I am doing less to NPC’s, AND players. Did NPC’s get a defense buff as well?
/faceplam
In the defense of engineers in general that character in the video could have been played SO MUCH better and the damage would have shown.
Guessing your classes made it to the bottom of the list. I play engineer and engineer only and look at my list. This is a post about people’s OPINIONS so who cares
You know, this game is like few months old, and I am pretty sure, that 99% of people haven’t played all classes yet, so their opinions doesn’t have any value. Even if somebody played them all, they base their opinion about like few hours of gaming, a single FoTM build, which is nothing.
Yes, this topic doesn’t have any sense, but if you enjoy it, keep posting anyway.
Well you see there this little thing called public forums. People can make posts and ask others about their opinions. This OP asked us our opinions on the hardest to easiest class and we replied accordingly. Your stating the obvious, clearly our opinions don’t matter on easiest to strongest because that’s all it is, an opinion. So posts like yours just seem absolutely redundant and hold no value in a thread like this. Would you reply to your friend like that if they asked you your opinion of class difficulty rankings? Seriously dude lighten up a little
My main class is the hardest, yours is the easiest, and the rest are medium.
It can also go this way: my main class is the hardest, and the class which keeps destroying me is the easiest.
And thus with said text, this thread can end.
All this thread is going to do is piss people off and get into arguments defending their classes. I digress.
Guessing your classes made it to the bottom of the list. I play engineer and engineer only and look at my list. This is a post about people’s OPINIONS so who cares
Logged on to do some spvp last night and this kept on happening. Except it would lag like that and never catch up, and after a few minutes it would just crash
To me the topic lends itself to “hardest to easiest class to play to achieve good results”. So while ranger might be one of the easiest to play, the results do not amount to anything great at all.
1.Ranger
2.Necro
3.Ele
4.Engi
5.Warrior
6.Guardian
7.Mesmer
8.Thief
And depending on how many and which kits were talking on an engi I might switch engineer and elementalist
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Thanks guys and your right Infectious heartseeker is more of a spammable leap. It’s definitely not the players fault for using the quickest route to a win. If you give an easy mode system to defeat other players in pvp of course it will be exploited. It’s up to designers to make sure these things don’t exist, to create an even playing field where skill not broken class mechanics dictates a winner.
I like to categorize heartseeker more as “homing”. When the thief health gets low and panics he can press this 2 or 3 or 4 times to launch him straight to the target for a guaranteed strike if the target uses no counter (hard to counter 3 or 4 times in a row), evade all incoming damage, and do big numbers normally. With all the different mechanics these abilities do in 1 strike (spammable combo finisher, evade, gap closer, conditions, etc) why does it have to evade as well? Make it a possible penalty for jumping right on top of someone or in the fray of battle.
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Im just wondering if thief is so OP why in touraments i see more guardians/mesmers elementalists and necros lately then thiefs ?
You might be thinking of another post there buddy
http://www.gw2league.com/rankings-spvp.aspx class distribution in Paid touraments. Take a look at it mate, and as i said necros are on the rise.
But this thread is about the next patch being in January…..and so far most of the posts have been relevant to the topic at hand (hint which one does not belong).
Im just wondering if thief is so OP why in touraments i see more guardians/mesmers elementalists and necros lately then thiefs ?
You might be thinking of another post there buddy
Thief can stealth pretty often too, but he also has weakness called innitiative. Its a double edged blade, we cannot use 2 weapeon sets effectivly, unlike other classes. We use our innitiative and are left defencless, as we cannot cast any skill at all, even if we swap weapons. Stealth is implemented cuz of that, if diffrent weapeons had diffrent innitiative pools you could talk about less stealth.
None of which is hard at all