Guild Wars 2

Just to point something out….

Today I went into EB and noticed FA / CD pushing into each other’s territory, while ignoring TC…. I also noticed FA in CD borders taking camps and west keep. Seems great for FA right? Wrong.

Look at the score now. Look at FA and CD’s border lands. By attacking each other CD and FA have, once again, opened the game wide for TC to not only run away with the score, but to decimate our borders and basically control the entire fight.

All this argument over wheather or not there is an alliance is pointless, because an alliance shouldn’t even be needed. You guys are blowing it with your fail stratagy.

Sunspots.9861:

Has it occured to you that while defending our own lands as best we can, TC could simply choose not to attack CD and only destroy FA on their own homeland? I’m pretty sure if we couldn’t get first we’d just guarantee ourselves second until Fort Aspenwood got tired of being third and gave up on helping CD get first. An alliance is really on phase 1 of a changing war and we plan on playing smart, not emotionally.

Moreover, while FA can affect who gets first, it is TC who would get to decide who is last. Think about that.

Sure, but TC was capable of deciding 2nd and 3rd before this alliance. In fact, while 2nd and 3rd were busy fighting each other TC was free to go wherever they wanted. By having two servers preasure TC in their own borders it forces them to dedicate more of their forces to defense. It gives both CD and FA a much better shot at defending their own borders, takes alot of the power away from TC and maintains a closer match all around.

A close score is much better for all three servers than a blow out, but especially better for 2nd and 3rd. Some may think it’s good for 3rd place to attack 2nd, but it’s not. All they’re doing in that situation is making sure they get double teamed.

Sunspots.9861:

What’s the point of an alliance where you still get last place lol

If you watch the score you’ll see that during the times when FA and CD work together that all three scores are much closer, with FA many times getting the most points per tick. It’s helping you guys have a better chance at 1st and 2nd.

You shouldn’t need to know about an aliance to realize it’s a good idea to focus on TC.

All you have to do is look at the score to realize that 2nd and 3rd place working together against the 1st place server is the only way to give yourselves a shot at winning.

I don’t know how many of you played Star Wars galaxies, but I always found their version of the stealth class (Spy) to be balanced and fun. The reason was, it wasn’t ever intended to beat other classes 1v1. It was mean to be a spy.

The class had perma stealth, and was hard to catch, but there were also counter measures any class could use to search for them. They eventually added some burst skills and that made them better for killing, but I can’t say if they became over powered or not, as I stopped playing shortly after.

I always found the lack of killing power my spy had was balanced by my ability to actually spy on the enemy, relay info to my allies, and add combat support when needed.

Because of my experiences with the stealth class in SWG, I’ve come to realize that stealth really isn’t what makes a class OP… it’s the ability pop in and out of it, while doing way too much damage.

Great job tonight Crystal Desert!

We finally got into the TC borders and started pushing the fight to them! Great to see FA in there holding the right side of the map for quite a while too. TC has been fighting hard all night and the battle has been awesome.

A special shot out to the KH guild for holding that tower and doing a great job all night long. Excellent work!

Great job to all three servers!

Haha yeah. It’s funny because last time we went against TC we were gaining a rep for camping the Jump Puzzle. Great to see we can play nice sometimes too.

I also agree that our comunication has been really good, at least in EB. Needs work in the homelands though.

MrKnieves.4162:

which is funny considering that most people were claiming last week that we were ready to fight TC again, we’re not.

I think we’re doing great. We all knew we’d be outnumbered against TC. I think it’s just a bit frustrating that FA has focused on us instead of TC, which leaves us short on the EB map, and unless something changes will hand the victory to Tarnished Coast.

Hard to support EB, or make a move on TC borders when we’re double teamed at home. In the meantime TC doesn’t need to keep near as many in their home lands, because neither server is willing to push there. This of course, leaves them free to push wherever they want.

All in all though, we’re doing well.

Nice idea…. didn’t read the whole thread so maybe this was mentioned, but if they gain points for taking something on the map, they should also lose points of failing to defend it.

Jump puzzle is bad because it’s not WvW / PvP content.

But they should be trying to encourage players who wouldn’t normally join WvW to want to try it, and those of us who already enjoy it should have a reason to stay there.

Character progression is an important part of the game.

Kerithlan.1659:

I love how this entire topic has devolved into pot shots against Tarnished Coast. And here I was about to complement our opponents for keeping us busy in our EB third all morning/afternoon. Typical.

CD player here….. If you want my opinion, all I see is TC playing smart and using top tier tactics that might eventually get them there as well.

In the meantime, FA and CD continue to waste man power fighting each other.

Shadow Gathering.5649:

I would add that the WvW incentives are already quite good (we shouldn’t expect it to be as lucrative as farming).

Huh? Why wouldn’t the Devs want to encourage people to WvW over farming? Seems backwards to me.

RuneEX.8612:

Incentives are tricky. Gold, badges, and/or karma would disrupt any form of balance.

Gold balance is already broken, as PvE can gain gold much, much faster then WvW.

XP leveling is probably fine. It’s not “insanly fast” as one person put it. It’s slower than PvE, but has it’s ups and downs.

An incentive to participate is greatly needed.

If you don’t care about the score you miss out on the fun and strategic gameplay that it offers. Also, the better your score the better chance of moving up in tiers, which leads to even greater challenges.

Believe me, as a CD player, dropping to the lower tiers is not fun.

Fighting for fun is great, but fighting for a cause adds another dimension to the game.

DivineBeing.2086:

FA and CD is trying to form an alliance against TC? Wow, that is definitely not intended gameplay

Actually it is what the game intended. The 2nd and 3rd place serevers SHOULD focus on the 1st place. The goal of the designers wasn’t to have a clear winner but to make each week a balanced fight.

It doesn’t work as well as they’d hoped though, since quite often the 1st place server is seen as unbeatable, and so 2nd and 3rd just pick on each other. That’s why alliances are being offered.

I for one won’t be spending any time in FA’s borders, as it doesn’t effect the lead TC already has…. and I don’t really understand why FA is spending so much time in CDs.

Quentin Fields.1295:

Stupid logic.We are not running around in stealth.We are an open target for a glass cannon thief like every other player.

No you’re not open like every other player, even if you get hit with their opening, all you need is a sliver of HP to stealth away, so you’re not going to have anywhere near as much trouble with a Glass Cannon as other classes. Also, even though you’re not “running around in stealth” you are in stealth for a lot of the time during combat…. this is when most other classes get hit with these burst attacks.

So no, it’s not “stupid logic”. It’s truth

brandon.6735:

Would love to see some facts on this 20k in less than 1 second. As a tanky condition thief, i have yet to see a Glass cannon thief downed me in 1 second with 19k health.

You have stealth. Other thieves aren’t going to be as much of a problem for you, since they aren’t going to have as much time to set up for their attacks against you.

Derv The Monkinator.4915:

“I’m happy to see Yaks go. It’s nice having another server that isn’t afraid to take on TC.”
Yeah, ok, they’re not afraid to take on TC. *looks at TC Boarderlands picture" Wamp Wump.

That’s because for some reason FA spent way too much man power attacking Crystal Desert today, which forced us to spend all our time defending our own borders. Of course this leave TC’s borders completly clear.

Bad strategy by both CD and FA so far this week

rhyein.6172:

The first hour after reset, TC was pushed back to Cragtop on TCBL. So it’s not like both servers haven’t been pushing. But if you just mindlessly go after the first place server, you’re setting yourself up to lose.

Well that’s obvious. No one should be “mindlessly” doing anything. But there’s no point in pushing deep into 2nd / 3rd place territory, while the first place server holds SMC and most of their own border lands.

The first hour was great, it shows that we can make a dent in TC. Later in the evening I saw both CD and FA lose that focus.

Maniac.5163:

Score update.
CD making a pretty poor strategic decision to hit FA today…

CD player here, and I agree. Makes no sense for us to be fighting each other.

Then again FA kept pressing into our EB territory last night. This forced us to press all the way into the Ogre’s and defend from there, which opend the other side of the map for TC’s huge zerg to easily gain points.

I know it’s easier to go where there’s less defenders, and just quick grab points. But unless we focus on TC neither server will have a chance to win.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Lol, because we no life the game? And you no life forums?

I don’t think anyone is “no life” anything. People spend time doing what they enjoy. Some play the game alot, some don’t. I’d play the game more, but It gets old after a while. I’m actually playing the game right now. It’s easy to do other things, and just check the forums eveyonce in a while.

I actually have a nice life, and I’m sure you do as well.

jobengals.2760:

Chuckle

I wonder how lonely you are in the real world

Not at all. Projecting?

I like how the server that supposedly doesn’t care about the forums can’t make a comment without my name in it.

ViperWire.4261:

I was going to type something important

Chuckle

Good luck everyone!

Hope we at CD can put up a good fight.

ViperWire.4261:

Raincrow.1840:

Is it reset yet?

No

Edit: Added a screenshot to cheer you up

I don’t get it.

Is it reset yet?

uhohhotdog.3598:

It would make sense to do it, which is why most people don’t.

Haha this is true.

GuardianOMS.8067:

Raincrow has been arguing for God knows how long with God knows how many people about how score = skill.

I have actually not “argued” or even said that once.

LoL… you people and your reading….

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Actually waiting for him to do it again for screenshot. Unlike you, I really am not srs about forumz..

I’m sure you’ll rush in here to post your screen shot too.
Oh the hypocrisy…..

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Some LW guy is glitching his way under the Champion Lord in Mendon’s…

Forum warriors, Go get him!!

Zephyrus.9680:

Lmao. Basically through a roundabout way you’re TRYING to argue mindless zerg tactics even lead to better score.

Nope. And I’m really tired of the way every time I say something you guys make a straw man out of it.

/Maguma Logic Failure

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

Here’s the thing. Why would Maggies be mad at WvW or CD?

No clue why anyone would be mad at any of this, it’s just conversation and gaming.

Really coool vid!

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

I am just pointing out you are spending an exorbitant amount of time on the subject.

I’ve only spent as many posts on it as have been used to accuse me of it. It’s not psychology, I seriously am confused by the assumption that putting effort into a conversation means the person is mad. It’s just a very odd thing to assume about a person.

Also report button on forums is telling of who is mad since I got a mod mail lol.

I didn’t report you, but if you got a mod mail I would consider you stop whatever it is you were doing.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

CD is funny in this regard. You are a zerg server. Many of your members don’t know what to do outside a zerg. And you guys let it drag on and on. It is like an endless cycle of lulz.

Likely because most of the day there is literally nothing to do outside of the zerg, since you guys don’t hold more than one or two spots on the map.

You mad bro?

It’s an exploit. But finding exploits that exist in the game is pretty clever too.

It’s up to ANet to fix things like this, because there will always be players who take advantage.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

You guys will have to recruit moar people to keep that smile going…

Sure, but as long as we’re still trying to win I’ll be happy.

xxxzavulonxxx.8413:

You spend an unnatural amount of time on this mad subject.

Because it’s fasinating the way you guys keep bringing it up.

Is it that you guys are really so mad that the score doesn’t reflect your imaginary skillz that you can no longer read a forum post without projecting your own anger into it? Or do you simply assume anyone who doesn’t agree with you is angry about it? Seriously, what’s the issue there?

I enjoy my time here on the forums. Maybe some of you should try enjoying it too, instead of going around trying to make other people mad at you.

Second time one of you has posted something and then tried to remove it after the fact. Is that the new forum version of the ALT-F4?

Cain.9724:

It’s chopped up because a 30 minute video of what happened would have been even less exciting.

Well that’s obvious. You spent 30 minutes doing spin attacks in front of a small channel where enemy players had to run in attempt to get past 2 balista and at least 1 if not more arrow carts. Wow exciting stuff….

Cain.9724:

What’s amazing is that you think you have anything whatsoever to do with the success or failure of your server.

WHAT???? LoL When did I EVER say that? You guys have had trouble grasping the point before but that’s the funniest thing yet.

Cain.9724:

we have a lot of these on Ebay as well, and I’m sure people on your server are just as embarrassed by you as we are of them.

But I’m sure your vids make you the king of Ebay huh? LoL.

Cain.9724:

Look how much effort you keep putting into replying to this thread, you’re obviously mad.

Putting effort into a conversation makes me mad? That’s funny. You guys must be the ones who are mad, since you’re reading that emotion into what I write. This being mad thing is in your heads not mine.

Also funny I’m being accused of being mad, while you guys resort to insults and chopped up videos that attempt to make CD look bad.

Cain.9724:

If you weren’t mad, it’s even worse. Now it just sounds like you spent 18 hours making walls of text in this thread that not a single person cares about. Waste of time.

I enjoy posting on forums. kitten

edit: that “kitten” probably isn’t what you think it is. Man they sensor everything.

Phzt.9864:

Raincrow have you ever smiled while playing WvW?

edit: so I realized after posting this that smiling is meaningless.

I’ve been smiling at the score board for 2 weeks.

Already answered… But I’ll point out that your video really just makes my point for me. You seem impressed by things that I consider pretty meaningless. The idea that a chopped up vid of you pushing people off a cliff would make me mad, is odd. I don’t care about individual fights. Did you hold the tower or not?

If you’re weren’t defnding it, it’s even worse. Now it just sounds like you spent 30 minutes in a tower and never made an attempt at capturing it. Waste of time.

Cain.9724:

Someone’s mad cause otherwise they’d see it wasn’t a tower defense..

The beginning is tower defense. You’re firing a balista down into the attackers. It cuts and by the second part you’ve already lost the tower.

Pointing out the truth doens’t mean I’m “mad” lol. You guys are funny.

Oooo someone pulled his own comment. Why is that?

Phzt.9864:

Nice video. Good example of CD tactics showing their superiority.

Failed tower defense = Failed tower defense.

Zephyrus.9680:

It’s just that the conclusion doesn’t follow.

Sure it does. If you’re not playing to win, you’re not going to be as focused on doing the things that gain points for the server. Yes it’s simple, but it’s also true.

Zephyrus.9680:

It could only be valid with a “win win win = better” mentality

False. As I’ve already said many times, winning does NOT = better. You just said you understood my point, but obviously you don’t. You do not need to actually win to be better. You need to try and win, to get batter at the things that lead to winning. If you don’t care about the score, you’re not going to be playing in the same way as someone who does.

Again, yes it’s very simple. The problem is, that you continue to misrepresent that point over and over again.

Zephyrus.9680:

It’s a perfectly logical and actually very simple reason for not caring (or even not wanting) to win.

Ok? I don’t need to be convinced that your way of playing is valid, you’re free to play however you want. I’m not saying one way is better than the other, I’m saying that having a different goal leads to different tactics. Maguma’s goal isn’t the same as CD’s. Sure we want to have fun, but we also play to win. The fact that we play to win leads us to do things you may find odd, or out of place, even “mindless”. Throwing bodies at a defended keep for example, something you guys seem unable to comprehend…. you see it as letting you farm badges…. but our goal isn’t to keep you from getting badges, or die less times than you, it’s to take the point. For you to come in and act as if our two servers play exactly the same NOW, is a complete contradiction of everything you guys have been saying the other 13 days we’ve been playing.

Great, you enjoy close fights… I enjoy playing to win. I agree that a more even match can be more fun, but winning is still the goal. I see that in the way CD plays, and I see the difference in the way you guys play. It’s a different style of play, with different tactics.

Again, throwing bodies at a tower is a good example. It’s something you guys have stated you “refuse to do”… Well, guess what…. we do it all the time. Why? Because we have a different outlook. It’s just one of the many ways I’ve noticed over the past two weeks that our two servers generally play differently. Different goals mean different tactics.

Zephyrus.9680:

The only contradiction, I assume, is in your own case accepting premise 1, since you don’t think a relatively evenly matched fight is actually the most fun

Your assumption is wrong. An even match usually is more fun, but that has nothing to do with anything I’ve said at all. An even match is fun, but if I’m not playing to win, it’s still not going to be as fun for me.

Bunzy.8674:

I do not enjoy being on the winning server, I play WvW to kill people that is all. I don’t care about objectives or score as long as there is people to kill I am happy.

/respect for honesty

Question: Wouldn’t you agree that your style of play, and philosophy, makes you better at 1v1 or killing in small groups… where as other players, who did care about winning and were likely playing classes with builds made for large scale group support and seiging, would be better at tasks such as taking and defending objectives or managing larger forces around the map?

Rhyis.7058:

Oh, well I’m glad that’s established.

It’s been established over the last 2 weeks of reading your players criticize the way CD plays, and our overall philosophy. Funny how different we play when it suits the idea that we suck, but when it’s mentioned that not caring about the score could be an indication of potential weakness in playing strategies that would raise the score, it’s completely unfathomable that we might have a different style of playing.

Whatever suits your argument at the time I guess.

Rhyis.7058:

We play the game the exact same way.

No , we don’t.

washac.2897:

Once in the dungeon in story mode solo you do get a group of NPCs but they are complete rubbish.

I was playing through the story mode with an alt last night, and in one of the missions with Trahearne, he got bugged and just stood there looking at me while I fought. I gave up doing the last story quest a while ago on my main, so I’d forgotten how worthless the NPCs can be in this game.

Makes me wonder if the reason they don’t have henchmen like GW1 is that they literally don’t have anyone on the Dev team who knows how to make them anymore.

Whether or not your server is good at (skilled at) larger WvW scale operations such as taking and holding points is a matter of opinion, and not really something I wanted to argue about. So I’ll just agree to disagree there…. just wanted to touch on this part I quoted….

saiyr.3071:

Lastly, apologies for misunderstanding what I quoted, but it seems to be you were absolutely equating “success” with “winning”, which is purely a measure of point value. I’m sure you can understand where the interpretation came from.

Thanks for this. I’m glad you’ve come to understand my point better.

It was never my intention to imply that Maguma doesn’t have skilled players… In fact it’s the opposite. No server, including Crystal Desert or Maguma, has any business attempting to judge the skills of another server, especially when the servers in question don’t focus on playing the game in the same way.

Anyway, I’ve enjoyed this match up for the last 2 weeks. But I’m more excited for next week. I doubt we’ll overcome TC’s numbers, but I hope we can at least do better than the last time we faced them.

Good Luck against the Yacks. You’ll need it.

saiyr.3071:

Err, I don’t think any of us changed our mind that we don’t care about winning, and I don’t think any of us thing that is what’s hurting us. I’ve started skimming recently because there are seriously some tl;dr posts going on, so maybe I missed it?

You missed it.

What you quoted wasn’t about what you think it’s about. Nice try though.

When I was talking about WvW success I wasn’t talking about points, or even winning. I was talking about being good at the things that gain points for the server. You don’t have to win to be good at taking keeps or holding them…. but you do have to be good at those things if you ever want to win.

As you admit yourselves, you guys don’t play to win, so from what I’ve seen you’re not developing the skills needed to win as a server. It has nothing to do with the idea that one server is more or less skilled than another, just that some servers, in general, are more focused on being skilled at different aspects of the game than others.

I’m sure there are exceptions on every server, but we’re talking about server wide, on average, players tend to share similar playstyles.

I never said ANYTHING about points = Skill. I’m talking about your own assertion that you don’t care about points, and how that mentality effects the way you play.

Zephyrus.9680:

Contradiction doesn’t have anything to do with it

You guys argued for 2 weeks that you don’t care about winning, and when I suggest that mentality is what’s hurting you, you did a total 180. Contradiction has EVERYTHING to do with it.

Zephyrus.9680:

And really, you can drop the silly pretenses about score = skill.

Never once said that.

Short version of my point…. players who don’t care about the score aren’t going to measure skill in the same way that a player going for points will. Why this is such a hard concept for some of you I don’t know.