Guild Wars 2

What is really being discussed here is the relevancy of Necro in the current patch.

Does it have enough burst? On-demand damage clearly dropped a tier when Fire + Air is removed and Necro can’t quadruple proc with 2 trait 2 sigil using Axe 2. Will damage modifier traits save the class?

Is boon corruption relevant? Will a player contribute more, simply by choosing another class?

What about defenses? No invulns mean non-scaling defense in the face of power creep that HoT introduced. Sure, Reaper Shroud is a lot of offensive pressure, but LF bar is still a damage sponge.

Weakening of the [burst + added boon corruption utility] selling point may bring Necro survivability issues to the fore.

Sublimatio.6981:

Downed Shroud

Assume the form of a downed player. 10s cooldown.

And because of our supreme downed skill #1 and #3 damage, we shall have glory in all the raids!

xeonage.1253:

Ahh… if your a good nec. You will know how the punchbag do their hero job in a team fight. If they cannot kill you in a short time. Your teammate will let them pay for it.

That picture is hilarious.

I’m not a good Necro.

Oh you mean running out of LoS with pro Reaper Shroud #2 kiting while a Warrior/Mesmer/DH/Thief 2-man team is waiting for you to pop out of Shroud and interrupt your heal which takes 5 million years to coalesce into health (hint: bait those headshot spammers with sheathing)?

Dazing with Wail of Doom or stunning with CTTB! while behind a wall? Around-the-corner or jump puzzle turn-around RS #5 ambush tactics (hint: they don’t work on good players)?

Or simply just staying out of focus so you have the privilege of dying last (hint: sometimes it works and you win teamfight. Amazing!)?

The only time you actually win a 1v2 kiting game is when both of them just used up all their CDs (hint: which, you know, they used to kill your teammates) and you have enough skills available to down one of them. Then you make a beeline for the downed player, cleave like crazy and hope the other player is dumb enough to try a rez (hint: but not interrupt/try to kill me like a decent player).

Around the 200 games or so I’ve been casually playing since last month (160 unranked, ~50% winrate; scrub v scrub), successful 1v2 occurred probably 2 or 3 times. Awkward 1v2 punchbag fiesta usually ends after 20-30 seconds of running around pillars, and happened maybe in 10+ or so games. I’ll admit the first half of games I had Fire + Air sigils to pressure people off me, and after the patch I had to have better positioning.

Pro Necros pls share.

With how pathing for teleports works, sometimes parts of the map are actually considered a disconnected tile and thus proper path up to the point you designate is impossible.

It’s like those rocks on the side nodes on Forest of Niflhel – they are actually disconnected from the main part of the map and thus unreachable by teleports (IIRC).

This means fixing the issue you raised might involve some remodeling.

I might be wrong though.

xeonage.1253:

“kill necro firts” Not because of nec are dangerous. Because the damage output will not be wasted by block, dodge, movement, inv…. , Because nec can’t pass any key and make any damage when they are be focus(CC spam), Because you can make a lot of pressure on the enemy, Because nec is a role of punching bag in a match. This is all because of the highest efficiency.

By your logic, why even run Necro? What’s the point if the class has all these downsides? Shouldn’t I just counter this efficient focus strategy and reroll another class?

As people have already mentioned, Necro doesn’t do a lot of condi damage as Condi, does ok damage as Power, and has poor utility defensive skills (and class mechanic) which makes the class weak to focus fire.

The only selling point is Boon Corruption, which allows Necros to break sustain bunkers and collapse teamfights when they would otherwise go on unendingly. They used to be valuable enough to overlook their weaknesses and even build a team around Necro to make this class work.

However, as the OP correctly (as I see it) mentions, the bunker playstyle is long gone, everyone has gone more and more into damage-focused Power comps (with a side of Condi), and Necro has become, basically, how to put it…

Irrelevant.

The only time you see them being run in PvP, is because players want to play the class and find it fun (we all have our “goth phase”), while in reality all you are doing is helping carry the enemy team. Because any other class you bring will contribute that much more in the current meta. (Reminds me of DRK in FF14… total Edgelord but take 300% effort to be 80% as good…)

Granted, Necro is easy to play and with minimal effort, you can be helpful to the team; but without any support or peels specifically set up to help you do your job, you won’t be going to the next level with your gameplay.

You will be going back to spawn.

In a month and a week, around.

Hopefully, the new expansion will change things up, and give us some new tools and class mechanic to play with.

Agreed with the support we play with and against. To be honest, most of us are running Necro only because we want to, and not because we’re relevant. A lot of the time before and after the patch, I feel I owe my success to my opponents being unaware/less competent/not in voip. Without dedicated support, any coordinated team can drop you quickly and tilt the teamfight in their favour.

Or maybe I just need to kite more.

It’s an extremely good map for any class (usually thief) to take marked targets and +1 over walls.

Otherwise, open map with decent obstacles to kite around.

Nikkinella.8254:

Eh, i think your numbers are a bit off. I think its more like 10% luck, 20%skill, 15% concentrated power of will. 5% pleasure, and 50% build.

And 100% reason to keep playing Wars the 2 Guild.

If this is not a troll thread… Warriors survive by correctly pressuring the enemy.

Just land more of your F1’s and you’ll be fine. More cleanses, enemy goes defensive and pops CDs, less time to Condi you. Win-win.

Stances are there so you can pop them, ignore damage and keep pressuring.

Crinn.7864:

Yeah, with necro you basically have to go full glass all the time.

I’ve been kitten ing around with this. Obviously it’s paladin so the dps is meh, but it’s got the debuff and boon corrupt spam of ye ‘ole procmancer with the sustain of blighter’s boon.

I’ll have to try it sometime.

I went the opposite direction from your concept with this:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNBHhF6kZTo2GscTwbTgeTsgLYxVxuYYE6qFAaBUdh2wzC-TpRWABEfCAg+BAU6RAAg9HS+QAARZAA

I dream of landing a Quickness Gravedigger, but in reality those are few and far between.

When you mentioned corrupt + sustain I thought it would be Curses/SR/Reaper, but I guess I just need to learn how to grow some balls and take off Soul Reaping. Curses screws with everyone, so it’s good for your survival, in a way.

Vitali.5039:

It’s a strange build, i’ve never tried to run a power necro build without ferocity

I used to do Paladin before the patch too, but now… without Fire & Air (+Chill of Death & Chilling Nova) procs you just don’t have the pressure to kill things.

Landing a full Axe 2 for a truly meaty 4k does wonders for my self-esteem.

Win rate doesn’t mean much off-season (and everyone is playing unranked). I feel that it’s the same old ~50% I’ve always had (I like to think it’s a bit more than that…).

Of course you’ll recognise games when you have inexperienced players on your team, but I know I make too many mistakes to be criticizing other people when I could have rotated better/not gone into that losing fight/watched objective/done better in that duel etc.

Sure there’s the blowout matches, but we don’t need to discuss those.

I don’t feel that the patch has really affected my playstyle and indeed I feel less punished for my mistakes, if anything. Because I won’t get procced to death with Air + Fire anymore. Even as my amulet choice went from Paladin to Berserker, I’m living considerably longer (in the same matchups) than if I were playing before the patch.

I have more time to ponder my ridiculous mistakes as I die (but not instantly) to focus fire in a teamfight after going way too ham. I can also see how I’m countered by certain skills since I’m not pressured into panic as much.

At times when I should have read the fight and disengaged early, I might actually do so and survive due to the patch, because people are less inclined to chase without the damage from sigil procs. Players have to commit to attacking now.

My precious gold-tier cents.

Staff actually got a built-in CD decrease implemented already, and making it unblockable and +3% LF is extremely useful in situations outside of PvE. What more would you suggest?

Lingering Curse has been there for 5 years… it’s a very strong trait for PvE as you’ll get noticeably more bleed stacks on the target. While the presence of Reaper Shroud and its insane combo stacks has diluted this GM trait somewhat, in a large-group situation where self combo Chilling Bolts is unreliable, Lingering Curse is still the way to go.

In PvP situations it’s much better to take Weakening Shroud anyway, and it clears blinds for your key skills/corrupts a boon/applies weakness and bleeding; a lot more useful since as you say, condi’s will get cleansed or converted.

Crinn.7864:

Why would you rotate into a fight your team is winning? That’s the definition of overcommitting a fight.
I would only rotate into a winning fight if I’m expecting the enemy team to reinforce the fight.

You’re right. So, stalemates and reinforcements.

There’s already a wonderful guide by Jazz in this section.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Vid-PvP-Guide-Commentary-Roles-Rotas/

You can judge if a fight is lost or salvageable (by support + surviving teammate) by checking minimap, healthbars and recent kills.

Another take by QQmore:

He talks about considering rotations in terms of where NOT to rotate.
———————————————————————
I’m only playing Power Necro recently, so advice on that is to go into winning teamfights or fights you know can have the upper hand with you there. Your poor mobility but anti-sustain role means that you are doing your job if the enemy teamfight ends quickly (their supports don’t contribute), and momentum is maintained for your team.

Although you can +1 a 1v1 and usually do well, in many cases it is better for you to teamfight and keep someone on the other team in respawn. Let a better +1 build save the 1v1, like a good D/P Thief.

It was removed along with Unholy Feast, but the tooltip was not updated.

This trait is sad when you have Annulment and Revocation sigils available. I’d rather take Close to Death.

I think what the OP is saying (if I’m reading between the lines where there are lines to read) is:

sPvP is a team game type that takes rotations and team work, not just players killing players off nodes.

OR

Why call it PvP when it is just a 5v5 conquest-based team PvP? That’s too much of an encompassing term for such a niche game mode!

OR

Why don’t you players who just go off and kill other players (a.k.a. way back when “look at my score it’s higher than yours so shaddup I win” children dominate) scamper off to WvW while we get to do our team game in peace?

Sometimes you get situations in PvP matches where Plaguelands solos 2-3 people for you while everyone is doing their MLG ress game.

People don’t see the subtle splatter and red ring sometimes, and get maybe 2 to 3 ticks from plague-well which fabulously covers all the damaging conditions and screws them over.

Even srs gamers will get a giggle out of it. Well, maybe not if you’re on the receiving end of Plaguelands…

For open world, which I assume will be world bosses, map meta events and maybe some dungeons, I recommend to have a main Condi set and a backup Power set for when you feel like it. Dire and Rabid gear are quite inexpensive compared to Berserker gear, so if you are really strapped for gold, run Condi.

For gear you want a mix of Dire and Rabid gear and jewellery and Krait runes – such a setup won’t cost you a lot. Aim for 30%+ critical chance and 1600 toughness. Adding to that you have some vitality from Dire and won’t die if you make a mistake and step into something horrible.

Just run this until you get comfortable; Necro isn’t big on rotations.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNAW7Ync0A12gV2Ae3A0biliBLKAMASAUPhpQRIuHOETiA-ThyFgAJPAAWVCkV3pT3ggSwdlfn7PAcQAOOCAFXAAA-e

Some tips:
If you are low on health and Life Force is almost full, enter it to buy time for your heal.
Shroud not full? Pop Spectral Armor, go into shroud and you’ll be ok-ish safe.
If you are on Staff and find nothing to do after casting your marks, swap into Shroud and use its abilities until the Scepter set is off CD.
Reaper Shroud in melee: 5 -> 4 produces Chilling Bolts that each proc Deathly Chill, giving you very rapid bleed stacks.
Reaper Shroud 2 -> leave shroud before it slows down to hit: this allows you to travel more quickly.
Use Dagger 4 and Staff 4 to transfer off the conditions you give yourself after using Corruption skills. They also remove the blind you get from Consume Conditions (traited with Master of Corruption).
If you are moving around a lot and avoiding circles of doom, and can’t find breathing room to cast your skills, remember your Scepter spam is still decent damage. Spam it to bleed and proc chill for more bleeds.
While uses are few and far between in PvE, Necro has “Boon Corruption” as a big selling point, and you can notice this on many weapons and some utilities.

Traits:
Curses 3-1-3
Soul Reaping 2-2-1 (you can take Dhuumfire, but the stunbreak of Foot in the Grave can save you if a world boss knocks you into a dangerous puddle of goop and you are stunned)
Reaper 2-2-2

Weapons:
Sceptre Dagger (Geomancy and Ice sigils) (sometimes I go Warhorn)
Staff (Hydromancy and Intelligence sigils)

Utilities:
Spectral Armor (use and go into Shroud if you have to)
Epidemic (to bring down groups faster)
Blood is Power (when doing bosses and you want some oomph)
Signet of Locusts (drop BiP when you are travelling)
Bone Minion (for blast finishing)

Elite:
Plaguelands (drop on stationary bosses or group)
“Chilled to the Bone!” (If you don’t feel safe with Plaguelands just use this)

Power Build:
I run it like so and basically camp in Reaper Shroud (not literally, just high uptime), but it’s an extension of what I run in PvP and it’s not streamlined or anything.
No, it’s not original (metabattle build).
It’s not that I don’t like Dagger, but you can get chunked easily trying to stab things near you. Though it is a pretty good sustained damage option with steady LF gain, so you do you.
I like Axe because I can just Axe 2 and go into Shroud. GS 3 is great for a quick burst of LF as well. Note that due to Chilling Victory, multi-hit skills produce an additional chunk of LF; Chill can be applied easily with “Suffer!” or GS 5 (the pull). You can also use Sigil of Ice.
When low on health, enter shroud and use Shroud 5 -> 2 to get an easy burst of healing (due to Chilling Victory + Blighter’s Boon). Swing your grasscutter around as well and notice the incoming health from all the might you get (Spite life blast minor trait +1, enemy under 50% +2, chilled +1). There’s an ICD on might gain and healing, but multi-hit attacks bypass this and are thus favoured skills to use.

Going Ham (you can proc things to death with Chilling Nova + Chill of Death + Fire + Air): http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNBhOD7kjGo2GsyGwxGgeTsgLYUdh2wzC6qFAaBxXxuYYE-TBCFwAt2fApyvSaEEcRAQp+jddBXVCC4JAAA-e

Shouts with more survivability (you’re still squishy): http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNBhOD7kZTo2GscTwbTgeTsgLYUdh2wzKuK2FDjQXtAQLA-TRCFwA21FgS9HkK/KufwgLCwVlgAeCAl0I0aBBA-e

I think it’s pretty much the same anywhere, won’t be just like this for gw2cn.

An MMO is 90% PvE, most stick to whatever works.

Would be nice to see CN compete in tournaments though.

Crinn.7864:

Necros don’t have a block so that they can better fulfill the class fantasy of being a punching bag.

Since I was small I always wanted to be a punchbag. Must be why I’m playing one now.

Shroud scales inversely with how many people are in a teamfight. Necros survive better in small scale but contribute the most to big fights, but there were no adjustments to Shroud decay or defensive CDs because Anet deemed Necro still relevant in the meta.

Necros have always been the snowballer that needs babysitting. Boon Corruption is a unique role and thus even with how bad they get ganked they still see use in tournaments. Unless the role of Necro changes (directly or relative to new expac elites), we won’t see immunity skills (blocks) on this class.

i.e. It’s fine in teams, so RIP personal survivability.

It’s a worse matchup. Because if you want to keep up you need to play Shiro/Mallyx, your weapon sets are all Melee and you have less evade, and end up very vulnerable to spikes.

If you play Glint/Mallyx you’ll just get kited. Though this is the usual setup.

Thieves won’t stay in your AoEs and most likely will disengage before they get loaded with conditions.

If you run Shiro you don’t contribute to teamfights and if you do side node Thief will +1 and kill you.

If you run Glint you’ll try to be Necro in teamfight and Thieves will +1 you.

In the end Condi Rev isn’t suited to 1v1 Thief at all and will need babysitting. You’re also squishy.

If you are a Power Rev just use Shiro to keep up with Thief, use your reveal on their Black Powder/Blinding Powder, counter the AAs with your Sword’s Unrelenting Assault. Time your Infuse Light with their Shadow Shot AA attempts or when you see Basilisk Venom being cast (this takes some prediction of their attack timing).

If they Shadowstep out, force them to use Return or stealth using Phase Traversal. Phase Traversal also counters Bandit’s Defense.

Put your Elemental Blast on Black Powder, or put it on top of you when they AA you to force them off. Then chase with Shiro.

You have to be very quick and react to what the Thief is doing, all your defense comes from pressuring your opponents. There’s no press button I win on Rev. You should run a bursty amulet.

Power Rev has a lot of tools to deal with Thief. They may not be as good as before, but they did chase Thief out of meta in Season 1 for a reason.

@Silv: best teamfighter sounds grand, but Necro really has a fugitive playstyle than I’m still trying to get used to.

Read this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Revenant-too-much-Torment-How-to-counter/6592599

Condi Rev: kite and maintain range if you can. If they are Mallyx/Shiro they go down to any focus fire and don’t do much in teamfights, if they are Mallyx/Glint, watch invert heal and interrupt shield, but otherwise just kite and dodge the really obvious animations. They are all super squishy. Don’t try to fight on point 1v1. Ideally Condi Necro can +1 and screw the Condi Rev over.

The new Anullment and Revocation sigils can cause a lot of trouble if you take away their Resistance, since they have no Condi clear.

As with Rev as a class they also have no stability and outside of defensive CD you can control them fairly well.

Power Rev has a really bad matchup with Condi Rev because lack of condi clear. Don’t hit your head on a brick wall and let teammates with better matchup rotate in to fight it, and you just +1 quickly.

Condi Thief can be countered by Druid or any ranged pressure (nerf to burst sigils though), but I’ve not met them too often to really say too much. They can do venomshare for teamfights but lack the +1 power of PI D/P DrD. We managed to outrotate them in a game because we had a good Ele.

Rangers have Signet of Stone for direct damage, and pet transfer for condition management. You can also use Survival skills as there is a trait to remove 2 conditions on skill use.

For Rangers, your positioning matters more than dodging things, since you can only keep up evasion for as long as your cooldowns last you, and in the end if you focus on dodging, you’re not doing any pressure to whoever’s attacking you and they will keep doing what they do unless you can get them to become defensive.

There’s no one best solution for everything, and you have to learn the strengths and weaknesses of each setup to fight them well. The first step to all this is to find a build that works (usually a meta build), watch how people do it, and emulate them.

At the very least, know what killed you, how they killed you and what you can do better next time. Early on (8 years ago when I started PvP in games) I was changing builds frequently, but I realised my build was fine, I just sucked hilariously badly. Now I still scrub around but reviewing mistakes has allowed me to not be a liability.

HoT definitely tuned up the pace by increasing condi application, condi removal and boon application. Boon removal in the case of Necro.

If you don’t build around those, then you will be outclassed.

You have 2 options as I see it: go full balls glass Zerker ammy, or Staff Menders and kite everything to the nine hells.

I edited my first response above to make it more helpful, but I’m just your average player so it’s best taken with a grain of salt.

Don’t think it’s much to do with powercreeping. There’s no major introduction of new content. Maybe you’re counting Plaguelands? I think it’s just a bad matchup for your… setup. Power GS is suffering because of the removal of burst sigils.

I know LB/GS Berserker Amulet/Pack Runes Druid is a cult fetish roaming setup (an extreme example of Power Ranger), but it has clear weaknesses and that is any sort of sustained fight – you +1 and quickly down your target and gtfo.

Condi Engi is fairly outclassed by meta builds and you negate a lot of its pressure if you stick to range or use Survival/pet transfer/Druid traits and skills. If they stealth up for Magnet combo, stunbreak/stability/stealth and negate that. Don’t use the term “go tiny”… Elixir S has just a 3 second invuln and most of the time they dodge roll after and is fairly predictable. You can use the skill, or there’s a trait for activation at 25%.

Condi Necro can be knocked out of Shroud from 1200 range away using Longbow. Watch for Corrupt Boon attempts, and knock them away for pewpew if they have no stability up. Don’t let them come close with Reaper Shroud.

GS while on point is a fairly bad choice in these cases since you are basically giving them free engage. You can use it though, if you are sure you can put out enough damage to force them to go defensive on point.

You can stand in that circle if you’re getting peels or support (pocket Ele).

If you’re solo queuing as Condi Necro, I salute you. Anyone half-decent will be finding every opportunity to train you down. The most I can do for the team in that scenario is to kite 2 people for as long as I can off point until someone comes to help me (“why won’t anyone… help me?”) because I know I’m not that good to take 1v1’s. Hopefully the team is capitalising on all of 20 seconds I’m buying for them. When your team is actually doing the right stuff and you can snowball hard off it, it’s the best feeling.

If not, then you probably just got owned by a Thief, a Warrior or Power Block Mes (because I’m scrub) and is staring at respawn count.

Power Boonstrip is so-so now and to maintain the burst I’ve been trying to use Close to Death and Berserkers Amulet. Although I can now proc people to death just as before, I doubt this has the survivability we need.

Now I’m trying to use Shouts.

Fight against Avatar of Mordremoth:

At 75% HP and the call to take to the skies
I fly straight up and exit the map due to being outside play area
This has gone past buggy into hilarity…

We were fighting on the cannon and I was knocked through the rails into the sea.

A voluntary disconnect fixed the issue (I was able to respawn), but I don’t think swimming was an intended feature.

I know this is necro-ing a thread (in the necro forum no less).

Shouts Reaper + Soldier Runes is faring relatively ok in this new patch. Though still a bit early to tell, I feel this is the safer option after the shaving of Power Boonstrip.

Axe is doing work, and managing Chilling Victory/Blighter’s Boon along with Shouts gives us some nice sustain in smaller fights.

GS (Nightfall) is a good counter weapon to Condi Revs.
Warriors are manageable now, in the same vein.
Condi Mesmer can be stalemated.

Thanks OP, with this build idea I just might survive the new patch.

P.S.
@KrHome.1920: Thank you for the general tips.
@skoobydoo.9246 as well: Curses is amazing at increasing 1v1 survivability. Not sure why I haven’t tried it before. In condi-heavy games, the passive transfer buys me enough time to hold up fights.

So after some use, it is as people have mentioned above.

Although the condi pressure is very welcome, people won’t be dumb enough to stay inside of Plaguelands during the vicious final ticks. Sure, you can use it to cleave the downed, but walking up to cast it, is costing you dearly in terms of positioning.

Bosses that have any movement interval less than 10 seconds, or is unpredictable, won’t receive as much of the condi as we would like.

While we can kite/pull crowds into the circles or use it as deterrent in PvP points or WvW chokes, it just feels like a slow-casting, AoE Signet of Spite active to me.

Plague had its function as an oh-kitten button, and it has barely any overlap with the new Plaguelands. Taking it out completely has raised my suspicion of whether Anet is planning to put it back in as a new product in the next expansion.

I will miss being a fluffy ball of plague with the ability to ress/stomp and hold out until heal CD is done.

Wallowing in reminiscence probably won’t help though.

Taking Master of Corruption in Curses will turn it into a short-CD condi-spam festival, so that’s something to look forward to.

So they are trying to reduce stalemating fights but also slow down the pace of the game.

Warrior is directly reflecting this concept in their changes.

The biggest worry is still a generous tilt in the appeal of condi builds, but I think it’s best at this point to wait out the changes and see how we adapt.

Titles and the Dragon Finisher don’t mean anything in terms of skill, it just means you play a lot of games.

I started playing a few months after release, and on-and-off I have a total of 1500+ ranked games. I also have a win-rate of 55-60% which is your average scrub. But most of those games I play Bunker Guardian, Bunker Warrior, P/P Nade Engi, and then D/D Ele (yes, I am ancient).

Since I generally only play to stay alive and work around the downed state (stomps, resses and interrupts), and in the Engi’s case take care to only rotate into +1’s for quick takedowns, I don’t duel much if at all; my rotations are okay, but 1v1 in an offensive role/to apply pressure I am absolutely terrible. I.e. I play builds that carry themselves.

I have limited experience with WvW, but the way you build for it is different since you’re not fighting around a node and you aim for mobility/personal survivability and won’t be speccing for bunker/roamer/support/teamfighter etc which sacrifice sustain for a specific function.

That said, a good player should be able to do well in PvP and WvW regardless, since good players adapt, understand mechanics, and if they have a Dragon Finisher, should at the very least know how to handle their class and use keybinds. I would say these players should be able to perform above a certain level.

P.S. Before the rank gain changes to make R80 not an endless grind, I was about R45. Still feel like a Tiger. I definitely belong there.

Dragonhunter (DH) is the Guardian elite specialisation for Heart of Thorns.
You might wanna look up the build in metabattle.
It’s a blend of traps and old meditations.
Your burst consists of pulling and pushing people through Test of Faith.

Chilled to the Bone is -the- necro defining ability in PvP.

Aside from using it to bait dodges, some of the best time to land it is downed cleave. Corrupt Boon, force those CDs with a CttB and cleave like no tomorrow.

I’m nowhere near some of the good necros, but when you do it right, a CttB that lands in combination with Reaper Shroud has so much pressure there’s usually no way to save that corpse.

For all the times you get trained down, getting the ability to be rough with downed bodies (ogod) only seems fair.

Of course you have the blocks and invulns and stuff going on, but it’s not just you trying to cleave like crazy (when blessed with good team), and if someone blows their CDs it’s a great time to capitalise on that.

Corrupt Boon for style points.
Plague Signet because transfers are fun.
Mr Wurm of course. Wurm stomps!
Well of Corruption for dirty cleave.

I’ll tell you how I levelled my Necro. YMMV.
Here’s the rough weapon/utility/gear setup from 1-80.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQNBHhZakjGapxGbwyG4wxRtQRfj5oahzZAMDyhYsDYA-TRCEABxs/ATK/SU9HCeAAQcIAaTfjBHBAAORAbpEEA-e
Traits do what they advertise, but feel free to ask if you have questions (so condescending).

Gear:
[Power] gear, meaning Mighty, Strong, Berzerker stats are best.
If you are completely new, check out the heart vendors that open up after you complete a heart; some have greens and blues with +Power good for your level. Don’t care too much about Precision, as without proper gearing (e.g. on-level greens) you won’t get consistent crits. Focus on stacking Power, and mobs will die fast enough. Necro doesn’t lack damage.

*Food: *
Cheap food can help, it gives you additional experience on kills. Anything really.

Weapons:
Necro is the sandbag class with no invulnerabilities and 2 health bars, but it doesn’t mean you need to be hit all the time. To develop a proper mindset, here are some good weapons to use.
Shroud: Skills 4 and 5 allow you to clear large clusters of mobs. Apply 5 then 4, and use your 1 to finish off those still standing. Use 3 to interrupt pesky skills. Shroud allows you to protect your Health, but keep in mind if you get knocked out of Shroud, you don’t get access to its skills again unless you gain some Life Force back first.
{!!! Don’t panic and hit Shroud twice on low health, you enter and exit instantly and will die for it !!!}
[Axe/Warhorn]: Axe 2 generates a large amount of Life Force, perfect for when you want to get into Shroud. Axe 3 when you need to run away/get some space to channel Axe 2. Warhorn 4 won’t see too much use but if you like to interrupt nasty skills, it’s handy. Warhorn 5 can be cast, and the buff persists in Shroud, giving you LF constantly in contact with enemies.
[Dagger mainhand]: high damage and can hit 2 enemies at once, but be careful of taking damage in melee. Good Life Force gain on auto-attack.
[Dagger offhand]: Weakness helps you mitigate damage, so Skill 5 can be cast before being hit. The main reason you want this sometimes is if the enemy throws conditions (Burning, Poison, Bleeding, Confusion, Cripple, Chill, Weakness etc.) at you and you want an extra condition removal to deal with them.
[Staff]: great weapon with a complimentary trait in the Soul Reaping talent tree (first trait to go for) that gives you Life Force on trigger. The Marks can be combined in an easy combo: Skill 5 to fear, then Skill 3 to Chill/Poison and Skill 4 inside of 3 to inflict Area Weakness to foes. Skill 2 can be applied liberally. Apply the weakness, then go into Shroud to use your 4 and 5 near enemies in relative safety.
Others: experiment with Focus and see if you like it.

Weapon Sigils:
Minor/Major sigils of Bloodlust so that you can stack Power with every kill, makes your life easier.

Armor Runes:
Use cheap ones if you can afford them; buy +Power minor and major runes sets.

Utilities:
Heal: [Consume Conditions]: good for most situations. Try the other heals if you want, but the condition removal is very handy.
[Signet of Spite]: gives you a lot of bonus Power in its passive effect, so just leave it there.
[Signet of the Locust]: 25% run-speed is pure QoL here, and if you want to go faster, use Spectral Walk to stack with Warhorn for permanent swiftness, but you do have to apply swiftness constantly, if that is chosen.
Free slot: [Well of Suffering]: great damage in a Power build. Group up enemies and get them to stand in it for the 6 seconds of pulsing; great for big mob pulls.
Options: [Summon Bone Minion] is good for AoE too, [Summon Flesh Wurm] is a teleport skill which can come in handy in some situations, [Spectral Armor] can be maintained while you go into Shroud for pseudo-invulnerable 6 seconds, and [Well of Power] if somehow you’re inundated with conditions. [Corrupt Boon] won’t be needed if you have Axe or Dagger, unless your enemy is boon spamming (like the Dredge) and you like boon corruption (who doesn’t?). Play around with the free slot and see what you like.

Elite:
I usually go for Lich Form, and its Skill 1 is basically just a souped up Death Shroud Life Blast. Skill 4 spawns some minions to distract enemies if you’re fighting some Veterans or Champions.

Approach to combat:
Since Necro doesn’t have Vigor for dodging in melee and is a bit squishy, I run with Axe/Warhorn + Staff. I try to stay at range most of the time.
Find a group of enemies:
1. Cast Axe 2 at 900 range. Cast Axe 3 if wthin 600 range. Cast Warhorn 5.
2. Switch to Staff, 5 -> 3 -> 4 on the group to weaken and deal some damage.
3. Put down a Well of Suffering where they are going.
4. Go into Death Shroud, hit 5 -> 4 when within 600 range. Most enemies die here.
5. Finish off strays with DS 1, or come out of Shroud, switch to Axe and hit 2.

MyPuppy.8970:

Well, there are worse things in life than losing or winning a game. At least, being able to play is quite a luxury in itself. I can understand the frustration, but that can’t excuse all the hate and the insults. People just need to chill out a bit. Just remember there are people dying for real, for no (or bad) reason, out there. When i think how a simple game makes people react, i can see no hope for humanity.

Naw, it’s just that sometimes we try too hard to have fun. While everyone can get what they want in PvE, half will always win/lose in PvP.

You go into a PvP game accepting that you might lose and the way to salvage that loss is to learn from your mistakes. But you also have the desire to win, over your peers.

We can of course examine gaming from a distant perspective and declare that we are feeling entitled while in luxury. But PvPers can be a greedy bunch. And when we can’t satisfy that greed, we turn to (oh the rage) escape mechanisms. And those can be entertaining in itself.

Oh you mean Spirit Watch? cough

As soon as you join the match, by looking at the people on both sides you’ll probably have a good idea how it will go anyway. It’s pretty common to get the same few people in consecutive matches. You’ll be awake when it seems like a close match though.

Duo queue is rather weird, I agree. MMR is the same old wonky thing.

Team queue used to exist but I can guess that because of population issues there aren’t enough full teams going by to make it work.

And solo can get some wildly inconsistent teammates to appear and back in the day some of us brave souls solo into team queue just to get a good fight.

Well GW2 PvP is like that. It’s a lot more fast-paced. WoW gives you less stress because it gives you more time to make decisions in a fight. There are ups and downs and there’s no guaranteed way to win, but the thrill of fighting with/against other players makes me come back to it again and again. Frustration can happen but it affects your play and opens you up to mistakes in decision making.

If you have a 2-3 loss streak and you feel bad then it’s time to take a break. Expectations can ruin rewarding moments. I try to do my best floating in Gold (still bad) and I always find new things to learn, especially from scathing comments (some are helpfully scathing).

I’m not a super hardcore veteran, but after ~1400 rated/queued games in 2 active years, you don’t really feel that much about most things anymore. You know generally where to go, what to do, minimal communication (inc home 2, mid 3 etc) and you have a 55-60% win rate (anything below 70% is not consistent, i.e. I’m your average bad player). You feel that you can probably make another 5% if you just rotate sooner, 1v1 better, manage that Stomp & Cleave game in the team fight better, disengage appropriately, eliminate bad tunnel vision habits… things you tell yourself but since becoming more casual they don’t improve.

If you have the dedication to stick around after 8-10 losses, that would be key in improving your play. Just don’t bang yourself against a brick wall and burn out. Gotta find out the correct way to improve. There’s always something you can do – blaming teammates has never helped me. Watch the many guides and streams and try their tactics yourself.

If you feel bad at all it’s just experience you need. It includes the wisdom to take a break after a lose streak.

Take care.

@Huskyboy.1053
Many thanks! I’d write something reflective, but I think I’ll get more out of your tips by doing more queues and watching what’s happening as I fight these builds.

The top stats don’t matter too much, but the Revives and Defends can tell you how well your team is handling teamfights.

Ranked queue is 1-2 and Unranked is 1-5 people. Since you mention leagues, I’m assuming when you say premade you mean the 2-man teams in Ranked?

There used to be One Queue → Solo & Team Queues → Unranked and Ranked Queues. The new system seems like a throwback to the earliest queue system.

Losing and being frustrated affects your performance and decision making, so it’s best you establish some rules to take a break from it all to avoid burnout in the long term. I used to queue 20 games a day or more if I meet decent teammates, but if I lose 3 games in a row, that’s the sign for me to take a break and think about where I went wrong.

It’s pretty natural actually to get big losing streaks, since not everyone is a PvP god but sometimes you get queued with premade teams on voice chat (+said PvP god). Back in the day with just the one queue, it’s pretty much something you can do nothing about and since you can feel the helplessness a few minutes in, just stay calm and do your best to learn from your opponents.

One of the things that most significantly impact the flow of a game is point defending/assaulting, and if you want to win above all else, you either pick a tanky, bunkerish build that can stand on point, like a D/F Tempest, or an aggressive assaulter like a Warrior or Meditrap DH that can push points. A build like a Power Reaper that needs team support won’t do well – consistently – if you play solo.

My experience from 2-3 years back was that if I specced for bunker/support, there usually isn’t another one on my team – and you are of great use in a big teamfight rezzing and stomping. Sure, you rely on your teammates for damage, but the presence of support in a team with 3-4 glass builds is more significant (or so I think).

If you are a really good roamer and have confidence to take side node 1v1s/decaps and pressure in teamfights without dying, you can make game-changing plays (like a D/P DD Thief); but otherwise stay off overly glassy builds, since it’s very easy in an uncoordinated team to always have someone respawning and funneling into the enemy for points.

Won 8 out of 11 matches yesterday, then 1 out of 7 today.

I’ve played around 1000+ rated matches over the course of the game (shameful win-rate of around 55-60%; I consider myself low-mid tier), and I’m not really sure about the consistency of the league system since I don’t feel it handles any different from the old leader-boards.

Normally, I expect the distribution of win-losses as indicated by my average – I’ll win/lose half the games each. It does get a lot better when I find a decent team (I swear my friends carry me hard).

There will be times when you get sync-queued players, or put against players who should be far above your rating/LB rank. Mostly it’s because of holidays and you get the good players queuing all day.

The opposite can also happen, where you get paired with (in the old days) people wearing starter Guild PvP clothes, MM Necros, Deep Strike Warriors, Spirit Weapon Guard, Soldier Bearbow Ranger. This mostly occurs when it’s late at night/in the morning and there’s not enough population to split the players into tiers.

Now the causes of these win-lose streaks can vary, but the most affected are us peasants with very ordinary ability, and the appearance of a good player can throw the matches wildly.

What is constant in these happenings is that the matching/rating pairing will be sustained for the entire session you’re playing. You’ll get these ridiculous lose streaks that test your resolve and confidence.

What I recommend is taking a break from PvP until decay or a change in the game population (off-peak).

Hello, thanks Dustin for writing this up – currently studying the Necromancer in Season 6 and it’s a lot different from the bunker builds and classes I’m used to run. In all honesty, I’m pretty much used to bum-rushing and fighting on-point (War, Engi, Guard, Ele), so what I’m used to is absolutely counter-intuitive to my Necro’s well being (read: just another scrub).

Granted there are some impressive moments when – anyone/monkey can do this honestly – you find the moment to dive into a team-fight, target someone for boon-stripping and wipe everything inside of ten seconds (like you said, killing some guy, killing his rezzer, killing whoever is unfortunate enough to be caught in the spins and AoE)…

I’m just struggling to kite and run from half the team trying to gank me when they see me a mile away. I have to work on my non-existent kiting skills.

This guide is giving me a lot of helpful tips.

P.S. If anyone from the Necromancer community can chime in regarding matchups like Dragonhunters, D/P Thieves and Power/Condi Warriors, that would be awesome.

A long time ago, it was the age of the infamous Ham/Bow in PvP (Anastarsis and others). I think it started there, the moment when people seriously thought about using the Hammer properly. Before that people were running around with CC Warrior for fun…

Around the same time Ham/GS is popular in WvW roaming (someone called Arajal/Shinryuku and others). Built nearly full Zerker, its survivability depended on how hard you controlled (i.e. knocked around) your opponent in a fight.

I am assuming you run a Core build with Discipline/Defense/Strength, setup for Healing Signet, Cleansing Ire, Stances and maybe a Physical skill. Elite is usually Signet of Rage for serious fights (Rampage can also be serious, yes). Hammer controls the fight and does decent damage, while GS allows you to cleave a ress like no tomorrow, give you high mobility and an emergency evade.

A full combo after your target has no stunbreaks/protection/aegis and you are not blinded/weakened: F1 > 5 > 2 > 4 > 3
If you have good ping you can put in 1~2 swings after the knockdowns.

Bait all the stunbreaks and dodges with your F1 or Bull’s Charge (into 100 Blades if GS), or your other weapon set. F1 can be used fairly often and you can land a 2 (Weaken) to let off some pressure on you. Your aim is to land the whole set of Hammer skills after a 3-bar Earthshaker and buy time for your Healing Signet and Adrenal Health. You don’t have huge burst, but the full combo string and the Warrior’s naturally high damage on all weapons can still be fairly nasty.

I’m not active now, but tanky DPS like a GS/Hammer roamer was having trouble with tanky Celestial setups, last I know. To create sufficient pressure, it would be good to at the very least have an Ascended Hammer to use and gear for Zerker.