I really think if you give it another week or so, people will be completing it much more regularly. But time may prove me wrong.
Why? It’s been more than a month already, I didn’t spend 49$ to have such “fun”. It wasn’t our fault to keep the bugs for so long.
What will people get if they keep the difficulty? Satisfaction?
ELITISTS: People only want faceroll content.
FACT: Most of the pugs failed after spent hours to organize and learn it. Even after the fix, the successful rate is less than 25%. And most of the time 3/4 of the people didn’t do anything wrong, it was one lane’s fault thanks to the design.
Nobody is saying it should be faceroll, we are saying that open world meta shouldn’t be that hard, which you have spent months to try, spent hours to prepare and still fail most of the times.
I’m not against hard content. Some HoT content didn’t please me, but overall they are acceptable, but this meta, it is way too much and a nerf is totally needed.
I compare it to tequatl because I don’t really do Triple Trouble, just doesn’t interest me a whole lot. I have no idea what its status is currently to be honest, but seeing how smoothly without a whole lot of difficulty TD went it seems like an apt comparison considering how much people complained about tequatl when it first came out compared to how easy it is now.
Well you should try TT then say about how will TD Meta go. Also from what I experience, Teq’s mech has been changed quite a bit as well.
I don’t get why people are saying others just want faceroll zerg. I’ve spent my entire morning on 2 different runs to prepare and both had failed, I was too tired and take a nap and I got kicked out from the map due to afk, this time they made it…But it meant nothing, next hour’s group might suck like the previous ones. This is why I’m against open world meta being difficult.
I don’t think it’s enjoyable at all, if people spend so much time in open world meta, they should be able to do it easily.
And yet the same things were once said about tequatl. TTS was formed precisely because of that event, and they also made that look easy too. And then lo and behold, as people learned the mechanics and started using it on their own without having to be coached, it really was easy.
Why are people comparing it with Teq rather than TT? Obviously it is more similar to TT, which you have to split to different directions and each lane got different mech, you need to kill different mobs in a certain period.
Do we see many people doing TT before the xpc?
All of the map meta’s in HoT are not hard its just that some players do not know the mechanics of the fights. The event depends on the amount of people, time of day and if players listen the people organizing it. Other players want to afk and let people carry them throughout the fight. Midday(3-6pm server time) tends to be the worst time to do any map event not enough people and they do not listen.
The fight is simple main priority is to get Chak grent to emerge some players/lanes still have issues doing this, even after you make it pass phase 1. Kill chak so they do not destroy the cannon. Try not to cc it, otherwise those slowly expanding blue instant death AE will be everywhere and you will have no where to stand. Finally try to take +30% of grent hp each phase.
In that order Get grent to emerge, kill chak and avoid cc. Not as complicated as people think. Its just like Tarir only the map is more difficult to navigate. Some players do not know that the lanes are link by nuhoch wallow to each WP. When they die they wait for a rez.
In comparision:
Tarir: remove layers, dps octovine, cc adds move triggerbloom
TD: get grent to emerge, kill chak, no cc and time dodgesTHIS IS VERY COMPLICATED
Actually, this is exactly why it’s a worse design than TT. It doesn’t have much mechanics to know, but these mech are very hard to do it for pugs. So even with the experience of knowing what to do, it’s still hard.
I don’t get why some people are still acting like they’ve never tried the meta, at the same time blaming people to “get better”.
My lane got the chak gerent down to near 65% in the first burn, we did everything fine and what happened? One of the lane has failed=GG. What could we have done and how is it our fault? How am I going to know are the other lane’s people good enough or not in the next run? Why should I keep waste time for other people’s mistake?
THIS, THIS is why open meta shouldn’t be too hard, it’s participated by random people mostly and you can’t help decide are they good enough or not.
There is no need to nerf this event, the entire rest of the open world game besides TT is doable by zerging 1 without thought. AB is on farm ,DS is on farm, Teq is on farm. If you personally don’t have the time or dedication to do this event , well then don’t. There are guilds that have formed dedicated to doing this and you know what, now that the bugs are fixed we are succeeding with pugs about half the time. You have 5 guild slots so use 1 and join a guild like MASO, MAGI or 1 of the others that have no rep , no requirements and are basically a LFG tool. The real reason this event fails is 1: people refuse to join squads and follow the tags direction and some have taken to hiding in corners of the lanes to avoid being called out on it. 2: Alot of people refuse to run the gear needed, this event does not need heals or tanks it needs conditions applied at max strength and DPS,DPS,DPS oh did I mention you need max damage stats.3:most of the mobs when the Gerent spawns can safely be ignored through movement and damage negation, they are a distraction, a decoy and an obstacle to damaging the only target that is important, the GERENT. When I see lanes fail hard it is usually when half the lane is running around playing games with the chak and not DPSing the boss.4: Food and Utility buffs are needed and your MF , vitality and toughness buffs ain’t gonna cut it here. Step up , buy the right stuff and see how much easier it is. You are going to commit an hour and a half to two hours to this but 60 silver worth of buffs is too much?
This is not a question of the event is too hard for open world , it is a question of are players willing to do what needs to be done to down this thing. The ones who are sticking with it, who fail over and over again and then group together with others to figure out how to do this event even with a bunch of selfish sabotaging leechers present are the ones who will put this on farm because we will problem solve until it is idiot proof. The proof of this is in the last 2 weeks the success rates have jumped and that was before the patch Tuesday and since Tues it has become even better.
Good luck , have fun, stop complaining and problem solve like the evolved simians you are or go load some wood in your ovens and light it up to cook dinner and complain about the smoke in the kitchen with grunts.
Let me ask, how are you going to know or make sure the players are “good enough” other than join a guild run?
So they should nerf TT too, just because it takes some planning then? You’re funny.
Of course while it’s a bit late, it would be good if more ppl will do it. Teq and some other bosses like Claw of Jormag takes some planning as well but people are doing it.
I don’t oppose hard content, but I don’t think open world meta should keep 80% of the people away or let them experience failure most of the time. It’s not like we don’t plan, we plan for hours and it still fails, and usually it was not my lane’s fault, we did totally fine.
Mechanic is fine.
The LONG timer and the lack of events after Meta completion is not fine.
The numerous bugs in SCAR and Nohouch is unacceptable, making a relatively easy fight becomes harder than necessary.
To people who don’t know, SCAR’s cannon will always break Gerent’s breakbar instantly and making it tougher, WITHOUT making you do bonus damage to him, unlike other paths. There’s no mechanic that enhance the dps against SCAR’s Gerent.
SCAR path also has one of the worst terrain of all 4 lanes, very narrow paths which make you harder to avoid Gerent’s aoes, especially when he charges to an unfavorable location.Nohouch has bug that prevent sport spawn, which could lead to fail. Otherwise the boss is very easy.
No, no, the mech is not fine. The harsh punishment for failure is a big problem. People really get mad when the other lane has failed.
I don’t see why nerfing the event would be better for the game, but okay.
Because it is a meta event for open world, making it easier=more ppl will do it. If you want hard challenge there are raids.
Sure, right now plenty of people are still trying it. But they fail most of the times. It’s not like thing will surely go to the better way. Remember most of the people are not going to keep trying, they will stop when they found it’s too hard and there are better things to do in and outside the game, or leave after they beat it once and got what they want.
Not to say unlike Teq or TT, there weren’t really much mechanics to learn in the TD Meta, most of the stuff are already clear after 1 month. It’s mostly a DPS race+some really hard mech. You can still fail easily even if you know it well, and how are you gonna make sure the group are experienced?
So you want it to be even easier to attract people? That’s what you are saying.
Yes, right now more people are doing TT because of the xpc, new spec+new runes. Before that in 2014 I’ve tried for months and nobody was bothering to do it other than big guilds. This is what could happen to TD soon, when new contents keep coming out.
I’m pretty sure TT is done at least once daily. Yesterday when I did TT there were 2 maps doing it at the same time. That’s only at that time of the day, there were probably other attempts at other times.
If TD becomes like TT it would be very easy to get a kill for anyone who bothers to learn when a map is being organized.
However, maybe attaching King of the Jungle to the meta of TD was not a good idea. Maybe it should have been a separate event chain. Chak Crown could have been the meta boss fight, with changes to make it more like a boss.
After the xpc, yeah there are more TT groups but still minor compare to other meta. Before that it has been a ghost town for a long while, I tried for months to get a group which can do it and it was TTS.
Teq was “difficult” when it was first released too. People learned what to do, and it has become easy. Gerent will be the same way, if you can’t understand that I don’t know what to tell you. TT is more difficult then KotJ, not sure why you even brought that up.
And it is not what happened with TD, people are giving up on it already. It’s more like the case of TT and even TT doesn’t have such harsh mech on failure.
It sounds like you’re annoyed because the event is more than a faceroll. Maybe try in a few weeks when more people learn the mechanics I guess if you get annoyed so easily. It took me about 30 tries before I got on a good map. I don’t know what else to tell you? It is easier now that they have fixed the nodules.
What do you mean faceroll? A meta event with higher than 20% successful rate is faceroll?
Even you said it took you 30 tries, which most of the pugs won’t be able to endure. The worse thing about open meta is, unless you go with a certain big guild, you will never know how next map is even after 100 tries. You can’t know or decide they are experienced or not. That’s why people are abandoning it, that’s why open world meta shouldn’t be too hard.
Actually, many many many people are still doing the “faceroll” meta, and the hard content like TT became ghost town a lot of the times. You don’t ask too much for open world meta, it’s meant to let people work together, not to drive them away.
I wouldn’t say it’s just fine.
It’s certainly better than before. But could still use some adjustments.
The worst thing of this meta is that you can’t fail any phase,
In Teq it allows you to make mistakes. You can let the bone wall spawn, you can let some of the turrets gone, you can miss a boat/hill team, or you can even fail a battery phase. As long as you don’t make too many mistakes and be able to kill it in 15 mins, it’s fine. Even TT only require you to kill the heads in certain time with many mechanics. But in this meta, no, if any of the 4 lanes fail once=game over.
I’ve killed it 7 times since the patch, it is much easier now. Happy?
I still fail every time, even had trouble with finding a map, I asked 20+ ppl and none of them have a 50%+ success rate(at most 20%). Happy?
Your anecdotal evidence isn’t any better.
The thing is most of the pugs still fail at it for sure, even the OP admitted it. And unlike dungeon/raid, in pug meta you can’t decide what kind of people you are working with. Are they experienced? Do they have good DPS gear/builds? We don’t know anything. Some people might not want to do the meta. Which is why it’s silly to make a meta so hard and why people will only abandon it like TT.
I killed it twice yesterday, with randoms; the nodule “fix” has made this much easier. I don’t see what there is to fuss about now. It’s a fun event, leave it be.
I still fail at 1st phase, don’t use two of your tries to say it’s much easier.
You wouldn’t hear 1 complaint on the forums if ANET had not locked the headpiece for the new armor behind this event.
I agree. I think this is where most of the rage is coming from. Not to mention, its a bit silly seeing are the rest are on Core world bosses.
On the other hand, if it didn’t have the headpiece, there would be even fewer ppl doing it.
PUGs are quickly learning this event. Today I had 3 close calls, we brought them down to 3-5%. Give it a month and it’ll become trivial like Tequatl.
You’re delusional. Tequatl can be beaten with over half his timer left. The most experienced organized TD maps always come to a close call. We already gave it a month. No amount of time is going to fix this meta.
Yes, Teq can be done even if you fail one battery phase, as for TD, 1 fail in 1 lane=GG.
Just tried it, Nuoch lane failed like normal, didn’t even get to the 2nd phase after 1 hour’s preparation.
Pugs are already doing this event. Given time they will learn it. Stop asking for yet more braindead content when there is plenty of that for you.
A lot of the pugs are already giving up on this meta, it’s much harder to find a map compare to other meta. I don’t see people try to learn TT, it became ghost town after many months, TD will be the same with new content keep come out.
Doable meta without 90%+ fail chance does not equal braindead content. If you want challenge, go to raid.
See? Elitists never care about how others feel.
Yet Anet added another hard meta. So obviously it’s not a failure.
And why? Because I’m in a large guild and we can’t fit everyone in a raid and we want to play together. Oh and we’d rather not do braindead content.
And most of the people are already giving up on that, good job.
And most of the people don’t have such a big guild, open world meta are not made for elitists. Try to leave your guild and taste it with pugs for a while.
If that was the case Anet would never have created TT and they would not have created this event. But they specifically said they were adding TT and teq like bosses to HoT. That means more organization and coordination. This event isn’t even that hard. With time people will learn.
And TT is a obvious failure because very few people are doing it, it’s even hard to find a map after so many months of its release. People don’t want to spend so much time to learn and organize in open world meta. Teq is totally doable without facing so many failures.
There are tons of hard content in the instance, you want challenge, go there. Why bother with Open World Meta?
There is plenty of faceroll content for you in this game. One or two hard meta events is not the end of the world.
Meta events are made to let most of the people work together, the elite content should be kept in raid instances.
Not everything in the open world needs to be completely faceroll. Keep chak gerent the way it is please.
No open world meta need to be hard enough to drive most of the people away. You want hard content, go to raid.
I have completed this fight in a pug and if you had actually read what I wrote you would have seen I said a map organized to that degree isn’t remotely necessary. The Nuhoch lane was just fixed a couple of days ago. You had to be lucky to complete the event prior to that point. Now that the event is working properly, give it a chance. Maybe your bad attitude is making the event fail.
And how many fails did you experience, what’s the success percentage?
Why? We gave it for months and many many many people hate it and gave up, why do we need such a meta?
most of the people who have given up were prolly the chaff that needed to be cut in order to succeed.
Which is against the point of Open World Meta, it’s made to let people work together, not drive most of them away.
26 TD meta attempts
25 fails
1 victoryITS BALANCEDDDDDD AND ITS FINE . . … >.>
Before or after the recent update?
After the update, the problem is still there, I couldn’t even find a map. Some taxi showed up 30 mins ago that’s all.
Percentages prior to the Nuhoch lane fix are pointless to analyze. It sucks that it took so long, but that’s the situation we have. I have no doubt you are right that many people gave up already or are frustrated, which is unfortunate.
I did the event twice yesterday. The first is the one I mentioned above, where one lane didn’t have enough dps. That map was well organized by players, not one big guild. The other was a completely disorganized map still trying to get people to the confluence and find commanders as the Gerents were emerging. I knew that map wasn’t going to beat the event, but they actually did better than I expected and made it past the first burn.
I’ve seen that lane done before the patch, and we still fail.
It has been days since it was fixed, tell us how many successes did you see with pugs? We don’t need a meta event of open world to be that hard cause not many people will like to spend time to do it, especially compare to the other meta we got.
I have completed this fight in a pug and if you had actually read what I wrote you would have seen I said a map organized to that degree isn’t remotely necessary. The Nuhoch lane was just fixed a couple of days ago. You had to be lucky to complete the event prior to that point. Now that the event is working properly, give it a chance. Maybe your bad attitude is making the event fail.
And how many fails did you experience, what’s the success percentage?
Why? We gave it for months and many many many people hate it and gave up, why do we need such a meta?
@Slowpokeking: Mordremoth’s plot suffered because they tried to make him unique, did not fulfill his potential for all the lead-ins they created, and rushed the main plot. They literally created a hundred bridges and used two – and not even fully at that, they began going down one bridge then they jumped over and went down another.
Too much useless research+pointless egg and exalted.
It isn’t a lie, and you don’t need a map organized by a mega-guild to do this fight. The only thing required to organize this fight is to have people who want to complete it, get them to the confluence ahead of time, and have 4 people that can run the lanes (even that may not be necessary eventually).
I think people would have this fight down completely by this point if it hadn’t been for the spore bug in Nuhoch lane, which is now fixed. People are still learning some of the best strategies, but that will all get nailed down soon. There are certain things that may not be immediately obvious (like getting back to spores early for Nuhoch lane.
My favorite tip, that I just learned yesterday: fight the Gerent under its belly. Orange circles will not hit you there. I’ve beaten the fight and never seen that done. As with the OP, the lane I was in killed the Gerent on the second burn phase (but not the same map as one lane didn’t have sufficient dps on the map I was on).
Which brings me to the real issue that is going to make completing this fight routinely a royal pain: dps. This isn’t Tequatl, where you can take until the three minute mark to get to the first defense phase and still win. SCAR lane needs strong dps, but the others also do to a certain degree.
My suggestion for this fight: rework Ogre lane so that breaking the Chak eggs places some kind of debuff on players. This debuff would have a damage effect on the player but also increase their damage significantly. The damage taken by players should be mitigated by toughness. Players in glass cannon gear should melt in this lane, making soldier/cleric/knight gear necessary, much like reflects are needed mid in Silverwastes. This would give a place for players wearing tankier gear to thrive during this fight.
If you do it with pugs, it fails 9/10 or 95/100 or even 99/100. Get over it, people don’t want to try so hard to fail over and over again, then meta abandoned.
Don’t go with TTS, try with pugs every run and tell us how you feel.
The thing is, these meta events weren’t supposed to be super guild only. It’s meant to let most of the ppl on the map get together to do something, and some people might not want to do it in that map. So it shouldn’t be too hard for pugs otherwise they would just abandon it like TT.
TD Meta is even worse than TT. TT simply require you to know a lot of mechanics, which experience it would get easier. TD Meta doesn’t have that much mech, it just require high DPS and a very hard lane, which require a lot of luck,.
no because it’s been proven that dragons are linked in pairs (Zhaitan Mordy, Primordus, Jormag, Bubs, Kralk), if Kralk is one of the next two then bubs has to be next, and he’s probably last…
I want to face Jormag next, among the remaining four, it was the most active dragon and a lot of the areas or even personal stories were about fighting its minions.
Why didn’t Anet make a storymode for these raids?
I think the Mordremoth story suffered a lot from the rushing plot because it was a totally brand new dragon. I don’t want DSD to show up as the next one. Jormag or Kralkatorrik would be the best choice next. I also hope we can see the dragon’s interaction against each other rather than just focus on one each time.
Jormag-Kralkatorrik-DSD+Primordus I think
Naw man. Maps still full up ridiculously fast for it. I stand by the point that this is easier than TT, and will be run more due to the increased rewards, and the fact that so many collections are tied to it.
Only 1 map per meta and sometimes people found it’s not organized enough and leave. If you make a org TT taxi it’s going to full fast as well, remember TD is still new.
Even with one head I see constant fails. Collections actually make it better, because who cares if they leave after? They will still have been there versus the alternative- not at all.
Same with Gerent, most of the pugs can’t last 1 phase.
After they leave you are gonna have less people to do it. What are open world meta made for? To let (as many as possible) pug players group together, meta like TT and Chak Gerent made the opposite effort. People are even arguing for the conflict of meta and HP.
Don’t know what PUG’s you have seen, because I’ve never seen a phase one fail. It’s usually the second phase of the lane mechanic that Nuhoch fails, and if they succeed then it’s most likely all down to DPS as they are not likely to fail the third one.
I was talking about that 2nd phase oh.
70% of the pugs fails here, and 20-25% will not pass the next phase.
Still a better rate than TT =D And that’ll increase as people get better at Nuhoch :P
The last 4-9% failed at DPS race, only 1% of the pugs can make it. That’s not much different than TT and people are already starting to give up on it.
Even with one head I see constant fails. Collections actually make it better, because who cares if they leave after? They will still have been there versus the alternative- not at all.
Same with Gerent, most of the pugs can’t last 1 phase.
After they leave you are gonna have less people to do it. What are open world meta made for? To let (as many as possible) pug players group together, meta like TT and Chak Gerent made the opposite effort. People are even arguing for the conflict of meta and HP.
Don’t know what PUG’s you have seen, because I’ve never seen a phase one fail. It’s usually the second phase of the lane mechanic that Nuhoch fails, and if they succeed then it’s most likely all down to DPS as they are not likely to fail the third one.
I was talking about that 2nd phase oh.
70% of the pugs fails here, and 20-25% will not pass the next phase.
Even with one head I see constant fails. Collections actually make it better, because who cares if they leave after? They will still have been there versus the alternative- not at all.
Same with Gerent, most of the pugs can’t last 1 phase.
After they leave you are gonna have less people to do it. What are open world meta made for? To let (as many as possible) pug players group together, meta like TT and Chak Gerent made the opposite effort. People are even arguing for the conflict of meta and HP.
The just increased the event rewards in the latest patch, even for failing. And because of all the collections this event is tied to, it will most likely always be relevant and people will always need/want to run it. This is not the case for TT.
Same thing with TT, you can go for 1 head and it’s pugable, do you see many people doing it today?
Collections make it worse, many people do it for this, once they get lucky and killed it, they aren’t gonna come back. Like me.
TT and the Chake Gerent meta are quite different.
TT is mostly about numerous mechanics and coordination. It requires good communication and command. With more and more experience it will get much easier, but people are still giving up.
TD meta isn’t that complex, it just have some super hard mech and tight DPS check. It’s not really relied on communication much. So it won’t reduce that much difficulty with experience unless we have new skills or gears.
There are still plenty of people doing it. If you look at TT basically no one even bothers trying to PUG it. Literally, when people understand the Nuhoch mechanic and leaving 30 seconds before the next phase starts, all it comes down to is DPS. So it’s really not that bad.
Because it was still NEW, but compare to SW, VB, AB and DS, it already got much fewer people. After a couple more months and the release of new content, it would become worse and worse.
It’s a meta event for open world, you don’t know who are you going to get and you can’t make sure they know it or not. The Nuhoch line isn’t hard to understand, but it’s very hard to success, plus the DPS check so even when people know the mech, the difficulty is still quite high. That was worse than TT.
I think open world meta shouldn’t be too hard like this one or TT. Meta requires a lot of ppl and it’s very hard to organize. Also some ppl might not want to do the meta but the HP. It was meant to encourage pug players to work together, not to let the majority feel kittened and left after 1 hour preparation and 8 mins fail. Teq is probably the hardest level it should be.
Sure it’s killable but more people feel kittened after so many fails, I mean I could grind much more money and gears doing other meta with such time. Right now many people have already give up on it. After a while I think the situation will become worse.
The design is also a problem, there aren’t much mech to be known, but the DPS check is very tight and the mushroom line is VERY VERY hard, one line failing a phase- game over. Which means it was too punishing for open world meta and require a lot of luck to kill even after you get know the mech.
Since when did GW2 become a Hardcore MMO?
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Slowpokeking.8720
I don’t oppose hard content, but I oppose hard content in open world, especially the TD meta.
Eh. Sure they will tweak it if no one has completed it.. Or they could up the reward.. But hardcore HoT? You can’t be serious. This game is so casual – you don’t even need a group – just go help other people!
I don’t think most of the content is hardcore, but some people are using this as their excuse to defend current content.
Since when did GW2 become a Hardcore MMO?
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Slowpokeking.8720
This game is so not hardcore.. Listen I get that SOME people might feel the game is too hard. But here is the rub..
1) People get bored easily by content that they can always complete.
2) To extend this content – you have to make the grind longer..So GW2 has to find a balance between content creation (expensive)/challenge/repetition..
I think they have done really great here. So I would say – be careful what you wish for. Here is the problem with your scenario OP.
Easy content = more grind. More grind = less players. Less players = money lost.
Sure you can have content that is too difficult..
Then you have hard content = massive frustration. Frustration = less players. Less players = money lost..
I certainly don’t think Arenanet has done that. I see LOTS of players who don’t really like old GW2 who are back playing this game. I’d say that is mission accomplished.
The content might be too difficult for some people – but extremely few. I’d say less the 1 in 1000 video game players would have any difficulty in this game. This is still a very easy game for the most part. (I am not counting raiding or competitive PvP – those are more difficult.).
I don’t oppose hard content, but I oppose hard content in open world, especially the TD meta.