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Ranger WvW Zerg Superstar?

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

rangers are nothing more than tag bots in zergs.

Currently Druids in zergs will not be that great and ca form will get torn apart by AoE damage because we have to be on the frontline with groups that are stacked.

Unfortunately, the side with the most numbers and aoe attacks will still win and ranger/Druid will not be a zerg game changer in its current state. I have faith in Irenio, though, because I’m sure he will make this profession as awesome as he described at twitchcon!

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Swagger.1459

You all keep going on and on and on about dps meters…

There are threat meters… Healing meters… Damage parsers… There is a lot more information being processed that could be useful to individual players and groups.

Information gained could also serve to help player feedback to developers because we could have numbers and stats on our side instead of just complaining. Players can help discover bugs, show if something is indeed underpowered or overpowered… There is a ton of beneficial information to be had if numbers were more accessible and transparent.

Some of you are just stuck on some isolated scenario where that 1 out of a 1000 run has someone behaving badly and doesn’t play to your liking… It’s going to happen regardless so you move on to another group or start your own right?

The API development thread is full of info gathering and qol stuff but nobody is complaining that someone can monitor the trading post and log in to start flipping stuff for tons of profit. There are a bunch of Apps that provide advantages, time saving tools, monitoring tools… And more are coming so start thinking out of the box…

Heck, the economy is getting flipped upside down because of legendary gear and some of you are so worried about some random person or serious raiding group using personal stat meters and info graphs… Ascended gear costs are probably going to go through the roof, all while the devs are designing content around ascended gear and strongly “recommending” that we pour out thousands more gold because we will be far better off at tackling endgame that we have been dying for… Sorry but if players are being told that endgame content is designed around gear that will cost an arm and a leg to craft, and that builds and roles like healing and “tanking” are important now, then the very least we could get is something to keep track and monitor the performance of our very expensive and time consuming investments, builds that we put thousands of hours into tweaking and to monitor all the back end numbers and stats.

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Thank you Irenio!!!

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

So excited for the 23rd!

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Swagger.1459

Good discussion, keep it up guys and gals

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Swagger.1459

No, there isn’t. You’re just so stubbornly blinded by your desire to validate your DPS you are willing to sacrifice the community to get it. This game is not designed that way. Go back to WoW and load up your 30 add ons when you start having meter withdrawals. GW2 will still be here when you get back.

No it’s not just about dps. I would suggest that you look at all my posts in this thread first before assuming things.

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Swagger.1459

There is a tremendous benefit to both players and developers by having numbers more transparent

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Swagger.1459

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/external?l=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FGuildwars2%2Fcomments%2F3mz8ta%2Fcrystal_reid_raids_will_be_balanced_around%2Fcvk6djq

Any of that will be 3rd party at best, and not something directly from arena net. And yes ascended the gear is recommended but not required.
Raids are balanced around ascended, thus it’s “recommended”…

“Earlier wings doable w/ some exotics by top players”…

It’s not mandatory to do raids for legendary gear, but if you want to do this optional stuff then you better have your ascended gear… Unless of course you will be sticking to doing earlier wings with some exotic gear while being carried by a group of top players…

Gear checks are already here and will be used by top player, groups and guilds. Meters and graphs to gather and display numbers and stats are coming next…

Yup, third party API development that anet will eventually support.

Anet relies on third party to help improve qol features and to bring the community together more by getting involved.

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Swagger.1459

It’s related to the topic, but thanks for your concern.

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Swagger.1459

Meters, stats, numbers, gear, roles, requirements… These are all intertwined and related topics, but thank you for your input. I would suggest reading things before commenting so we can avoid any unnecessary misunderstandings.

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Swagger.1459

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/external?l=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.reddit.com%2Fr%2FGuildwars2%2Fcomments%2F3mz8ta%2Fcrystal_reid_raids_will_be_balanced_around%2Fcvk6djq

Raids are balanced around ascended, thus it’s “recommended”…

“Earlier wings doable w/ some exotics by top players”…

It’s not mandatory to do raids for legendary gear, but if you want to do this optional stuff then you better have your ascended gear… Unless of course you will be sticking to doing earlier wings with some exotic gear while being carried by a group of top players…

Gear checks are already here and will be used by top player, groups and guilds. Meters and graphs to gather and display numbers and stats are coming next…

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Swagger.1459

“The benefits are greater than the random picky elite person followed by the complaint thread on the forum taking up space.”

Anet clearly doesn’t want people to be kicked out of groups for wearing an unoptimal gear set. That’s the reason we can’t inspect others. The whole game was designed from the ground up with the same mentality: cooperation over competition. Meters wouldn’t encourage cooperation in open world/dungeons/fractals, where the more casual and less skilled players will be spending most of their time. It won’t help you find groups or make friends, or won’t make others appreciate you because you survive well. In WoW that might be the case, where you can see a clear disparity on meters, but that’s due to ilvl, but that won’t happen in GW2 where there’s no treadmill.

You do realize raids and high level fractals will require ascended gear?

You do realize that there is a site called gw2 efficiency that the devs have approved that allows for inspecting someone’s gear? Serious raiders and fractalers will ask for you to ping them your info before they accept you into the group right? And trust me they will use it for serious stuff.

What exactly does this have to do with meters ?
You can complete a raid or as many have been doing for so long, Fractals without a meter so no it’s not needed. Why your going on about gear is baffling … you know there is an entire separate thread discussing gear right ?

if you read what I replied to then you will understand.

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Swagger.1459

“The benefits are greater than the random picky elite person followed by the complaint thread on the forum taking up space.”

Anet clearly doesn’t want people to be kicked out of groups for wearing an unoptimal gear set. That’s the reason we can’t inspect others. The whole game was designed from the ground up with the same mentality: cooperation over competition. Meters wouldn’t encourage cooperation in open world/dungeons/fractals, where the more casual and less skilled players will be spending most of their time. It won’t help you find groups or make friends, or won’t make others appreciate you because you survive well. In WoW that might be the case, where you can see a clear disparity on meters, but that’s due to ilvl, but that won’t happen in GW2 where there’s no treadmill.

You do realize raids and high level fractals will require ascended gear?

You do realize that there is a site called gw2 efficiency that the devs have approved that allows for inspecting someone’s gear? Serious raiders and fractalers will ask for you to ping them your info before they accept you into the group right? And trust me they will use it for serious stuff.

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Swagger.1459

And if that serious raid team you want to join asks you to ping your gear from gw2 efficiency site approved by the devs, what do you guys and gals do?

Leave the raid and join another, but then again I plan on raiding with guildies/friends and this won’t be an issue.

I think the people asking others to “ping” their gear will be the minority, this isn’t WoW.

Problem solved then

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Swagger.1459

And if that serious raid team you want to join asks you to ping your gear from gw2 efficiency site approved by the devs, what do you guys and gals do?

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Swagger.1459

The benefits are greater than the random picky elite person followed by the complaint thread on the forum taking up space.

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Swagger.1459

No meters until classes are reasonably balanced

Meters exist in wow for instance however you’d still bring every class along for the raid besides a Shaman.(My poor poor alli shammy) Every classes brings something to the table this isn’t true for GW2 and at the very best you’d need the top healing and top support class with everyone else being the top DPS class. That’s three out of 9 classes if even at that while the other classes would get booted due to meter and other such nonsense.

I main a mez for the record

You do realize that players having access to more numbers will help provide accurate feedback to developers so they can balance better right???

Currently most feedback provided to developed is more about feeling and less about numbers. Think of this scenario… Someone plays both Druid heals then Ventari 10 times in a raid. They have their meters and graphs compiling info. At the end of each raid the player sees that the Ventari far out healed the Druid. With the statistics we can figure why that happened more easily, how to bring the Druid up to be the best heals as designed and prove accurate feedback for developers to review.

That’s just one scenario, but if you think deeper, you will see the benefits game wide. The tools are not only to maximize zomgdps, it can also help catch bugged stuff, op stuff, up stuff and will greatly improve communication with the devs.

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Swagger.1459

@hellchamp

Yeah, I don’t care about legendaries either, but being able to have gear that can change stats makes it far superior in function compared to ascended.

I’m not a serious raider myself, but I personally think meters and graphs are good for the long term health of the game. It’s a good tool for the players to have and the transparency helps the players to provide better feedback to developers as well. The benefits really do out weigh the random raid kitten drama that someone will complain about on the forums.

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Swagger.1459

The only thing meters are good for are excluding players that others feel don’t meet there standards. You don’t heal enough, You don’t do enough dps , your rotation isn’t right. Meters to me = eletists
Gear checks I am ok with since all my 80s have multiple sets of ascended gear but I still roll with people in fractals or dungeons that use exotic it makes it rough but its a game so I don’t get upset. I don’t mind carrying a person or 2 or even helping them get gear maybe im a different kind of gamer….So I will take all the people that don’t cut it for the eletist with there meters and checks and raid with them there most likely better people any ways less attitude and chest thumping.

Yet some will see it as a good personal tool for their individual character and also for mobilizing the best group to face challenging content.

Endgame raids and fractals will require (even more expensive now) ascended gear, roles to be filled, timers to be overcome and will only have 1x week window to do official raid runs for the best armor in the game. Also, we don’t know what challenges will be faced in fractals to obtain legendary back pieces, but I’m sure it will be just as tough as raids. Yes, some will take it seriously regardless and you can’t blame them. If you ever feel alienated by anyone you can start your own semi-serious or casual run.

Gear, stats and roles matter now. Before it was zerker and forget, but those days are going away. Thing are getting “real” and gear is getting real expensive so yeah, expect players to be more serious aka “elite”.

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Economy Questions Repost

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Swagger.1459

Howdy John! Any plans to reduce the amount of bolts of silk required for crafting spools of silk weaving thread?

Nope

Ok, thanks for the speedy reply!

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Swagger.1459

Howdy John! Any plans to reduce the amount of bolts of silk required for crafting spools of silk weaving thread?

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How to save dungeons

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Swagger.1459

Sorry but say goodbye to dungeons. RIP

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Dungeon nerf and TP flipping

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Swagger.1459

I totally agree with account bound on purchase

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Swagger.1459

That’s the spirit!

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Swagger.1459

The more the devs move away from the zerker meta and make content designed for roles with an emphasis on gear, the desire to have access to numbers will increase. Optional gear check is already allowed by the devs through the GW2 Efficiency site, so it’s just a natural progression from here.

It will start with Druid healing coefficients, then move on to healing game wide, then toughness numbers and holding aggro, dps related numbers to beat timers… The devs are already balancing skills and numbers for raids so the players will want access to number tools and graphs as well.

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Swagger.1459

I would like to advise everyone to post your toughness numbers with your comments so I can make sure my gear is sufficient enough to tank properly and hold the aggro. Also, let’s all make sure to dodge roll away from the negativity so we don’t trigger the unavoidable mod damage that our healers won’t be able to handle. Remember if we wipe, I won’t be able to start another official thread run until next week.

Thanks

To continue the analogy..

You should’ve looked up the raid strat (previous threads :P) and learned from those first.

I’d say “contributed to and expanded them,” but they all get closed, because some people feel they have to be mean and crude about it. :\
But yeh, Urban’s pretty spot on. The haters and jerks will be haters and jerks with or without DPS meters.

Given how complex and interwoven damage components are in GW2, I’m certain that there won’t be a clean execution method for it. (Or at least not in the foreseeable future.) Expect that to be a core reason for ANet not doing it.
It would involve tracking Might/Fury stacks and sources, attributing damage to those people who provided the stacks, tracking Vulnerability and giving that damage to the players who stacked it.. It’d be a mess. If not, you get that one selfish twit who goes all solo-damage, then complains that everyone else wasn’t doing might/vuln.

And, honestly, damage meters have been classically easy to break, except in monolithic boss fights. Once minions and other trash get involved, you can bet the Epidemic necro is going to be topping meters.

I highlight all this not to kew “no meters,” but to detail that the kinds of numbers sought are supposed to be a tool. A metaphorical screwdriver. What most players will end up doing is using a hammer instead.

Sure, there are tons of factors but it can be useful to get accurate base numbers on training dummies to make comparisons and experiment with builds.

Personal stats are always nice to have for various reasons.

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Druid, longbow/staff

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Swagger.1459

Unfortunately CA form and glyphs are all about stacking in melee range so a melee weapon in the build seems like a good choice to have most of the time. So back line Druid with staff. Move in and heal in CA. Hold ground with melee then pop out when clear. Also, we can cover a lot of ground with gs/staff so that’s a plus too.

Lb/staff will be fun for back line zergs and stuff, but to be a decent healer we will have to be in the frontline too.

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Swagger.1459

I would like to advise everyone to post your toughness numbers with your comments so I can make sure my gear is sufficient enough to tank properly and hold the aggro. Also, let’s all make sure to dodge roll away from the negativity so we don’t trigger the unavoidable mod damage that our healers won’t be able to handle. Remember if we wipe, I won’t be able to start another official thread run until next week.

Thanks

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Swagger.1459

Well, I neither want Recount nor something like Gearscore to be part of my raiding experience anymore. It was horrible in WoW, besides being mandatory for monitoring the DPS in raids. DPS-nitpickers are last thing I want to see in Guild Wars 2.

So you just admitting that you sucked in raids and was a bad player who couldn’t get most from his class, and didnt wanted to improve. Why do you think other raiders must carry you through? Many ppl nowdays just too demanding, thinking everything should be brought to them just because they want it. Lol. Just lol. Dont write this crap, seriously.

Woah dude, calm down, will you? I never said I sucked at raids. Where did you get all that nonsense you just said from my text?

Guess you drew his aggro kaligos, you must have the highest toughness score here.

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Swagger.1459

There is nothing wrong with having access to numbers and statistics. It’s another way to improve different builds and roles.

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Swagger.1459

I’m all for PERSONAL meters. It could have a graph at the end of the raid/dungeon with how much you healed yourself and others, condition damage, total freeze etc. I want this.

That would be awesome

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Swagger.1459

Mark my words, we will get more transparency and gain access to important numbers now that raids are coming.

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Swagger.1459

However, DPS meters and the like caused a very toxic environment in wow, I don’t see how you can think the results will be any different here. Besides results generally speak for themselves.

As an aside, I would bet 100 gold that Anet will never put meters in anyway, so this is most likely just a post about wishful thinking rather than an honest expectation of results.

Yeah but the gw2 community is the friendliest of all mmos so I have confidence things will be ok.

Given that the devs have approved and endorsed this one site (forgot the name) that includes gear check functions, I’ll take that 100 gold bet. I believe that the devs will allow player created apps for such things and they will be made available within a year after HoT launches.

I will add you as a friend in game and keep my word so mark your calendar.

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I just want a combat log printed to file. There are many useful things you can do with combat logs that don’t even have anything to do with meters.

We can have that too!

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Swagger.1459

Just a reminder that DPS is not everything …

It’s like the people currectly asking for 2 eles in meta groups…

Yes! That’s exactly why different types of meters are going to be great!

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Swagger.1459

Yeah, that’s what I’m saying about the UI. Players should be able to customize the UI to their liking so it’s a more enjoyable UI experience and interaction overall. That way players can focus more on the action instead of the UI.

It will definitely be possible, but now that roles, gear, stats, beating timers… matters, players will need to have access to their performance numbers.

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I’ve got the fire department on standby

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Swagger.1459

With all things raid considered (boss timers, gear requirements, role requirements, importance of group make up, need for healing, the transition away from zerker meta, best loot rewards on weekly restricted official runs), I want to say that it is about time to have personal aggro, dps, healing… meters…

Stats and numbers will matter come HoT, so that means players will need more transparency.

Edit- thanks knighthonor, you reminded me of something…

Also, it’s 2015 and three years into the product life, so I think we are at the point where we should be able to move around and customize our UI, and that includes individual ability placement on the combat bar.

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Druid's Avatar/ Staff/ Glyph Rework

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Swagger.1459

And you couldn’t put this in the main feedback thread because?

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How would you gear Druid?

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Swagger.1459

Celestial everything and traveler runes. Food and stuff to supplement whatever the situation needs. Great sword/staff and axe-torch/staff.

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Time to change the Sword.

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Swagger.1459

Also, “high skill, high reward” weapons and abilities should be about timing and such, not about having to do wonky UI and camera tricks to make a weapon more viable.

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Time to change the Sword.

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

I guarantee the metrics of sword use and sword builds are low compared to other main weapons. The ranger sword attacks can still be remade unique while functioning better for end users. The ranger sword has been poorly designed and has been complained about since launch, so it’s time something is done about it. Considering hot introduces tons of new weapon skills, new traits, utilities… the least that could be done is a revisit to a mere 3 weapon skills.

Also, not trying to be rude, but the mere fact that players need to do all the gimmicky detargeting, camera tricks, turning off auto attack… while hoping for a “bit of luck” to make the sword work says a lot about the inherently poor design. You are trying to spin doctor a bad weapon by showing all the player created work arounds. How about we give the Revenant hammer the ranger sword treatment and let’s see how well it’s received by the players.

You guarantee? Well then, a complete stranger on the internet guarantees something, it should be true, right? =D

Anyway, I was just trying to make a point.. ^^
Even though the weapon has its shortcomings, and not being able to dodge while in auto attack chain can be annoying at times, i do not see it as bad weapon design, just different in the way that an auto attack is high risk high reward, usually you get a choice in such skills, like barrage or meteor shower. Having it on auto attack makes it less of a choice, seeing as you have to use the auto attack as your main damage source. But there are ways to play around it.

To me it does make sense, that when you start an attack, you should be forced to finish it, thereby requiring you to think if you actually want to start attacking or rather dodge. Sure in an action packed game like Guild Wars, at times that will get you killed because you made the wrong decision, however, that is the part about high risk high reward that makes the ranger sword fun to use.

The tricks that i mentioned about targetting and detargetting were merely to show OP that there is a lot of stuff that you can pull off with the sword, that would not be possible if they changed the mechanic of the sword.

The auto attack might be something people have been complaining about since launch, mainly because it is not as simple as to press 1 and just go afk, you have to pay attention and actually think of when you want to use which part of the chain. But is that really a bad thing? Is not the fun in playing a game having some kind of a skill cap at least if you want to have one? no one forces you to use sword, especially if you are refusing to use the tools that the game gives you to make the sword auto attack one of the best in the game.

I am not saying we should not be allowed to dodge during leaps, i would welcome that change, everyone would. However, i am saying that the mechanic behind the sword leaps should not be changed, and the OP did say that he would like the mechanic changed to something that allows you to move freely, thus removing the leaps, and in my opinion that is something that should not be touched.

Also, small addition, if you say ‘’not trying to be rude’’ it actually comes over as rude, more at least then if you just state your point without saying that sentence. ^^

i think Sword 2 could use a larger window before the Monarch’s Leap portion times out so many times i try to use this in a very tight spot where i need that extra 0.5 second to be a little more agressive or to down and escape.

Yes, that could be cool ^^ or just make it a flip switch kind of a thing, that you jump back, and untill you jump forward the jump backwards wont become available. It will never be implemented, but we should be allowed dreams right? ^^

Because having dreams has never killed rangers in Guild Wars before… right? … RIGHT?!

Yes, I guarantee if a developer showed up here they would say sword and sword traitline use is on the low end.

I not sure if you know, but you are really helping to explain everything wrong with the sword and why it should be changed or fixed.

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Healing power

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

You gotta think bigger picture. “The berserker meta not be the only consideration requires that other stat combinations be rewarding”…

Irenio didn’t say that Druids in zerker gear can’t be the only consideration…

Listen to his opening statements at twitchcon…

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Healing power

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

They are looking into it

source?

I think they only said that they are looking into how much healing affects the druid. Nothing was said about doing the same for other professions.

Exactly.

You think that they are not going to review healing numbers across the game now that we have two new healers coming?

The devs want to make gear stats more meaningful, break further away from the zerker meta and to promote support/healing roles so it would be foolish to think that all things healing won’t be on their radar. And sometimes you have to read between the lines of things…

Irenio’s quote…

“Celestial Avatar healing is the best available by a decent margin right now. One issue that came up is that the healing coefficients are so insignificant that running with healing stats yields very little reward.

The best healing in the game being available without using any healing power; this is not good for the game.

The berserker meta not be the only consideration requires that other stat combinations be rewarding."

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Time to change the Sword.

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

The sword auto attack is actually one of the coolest mechanics in the game. You can use it as a gap closer or to disengage if you detarget correctly and with a bit of luck it can track targets in stealth all the while having reasonable damage on every hit, considering you are playing as a ranger.

It is a typical high risk-high reward attack, that if you manage to master it you can do such amazing things with. It would really be fairly boring to have a sword auto attack like some other classes have, that only adds damage, and no additional gameplay mechanic. Especially because rangers rely mostly on their auto attacks for damage anyway (aside from greatsword and longbow 2 ofcourse).

Sure if you auto attack without thinking, or have smart cast on, you are not able to dodge, same if you are in the middle of a leap, but that is a tradeoff that makes the mechanic fun, and not as mindless as say playing longbow. ^^

I certainly hope that the last thing that Anet changes in this game is the way how the ranger auto attack works..

And about the sword 2 ability, do not spam it on cooldown, but try to think how it could benifit you if you use it in a certain way. For example if someone is chasing you, dodge roll backwards through your oponent and press nr 2, you will now roll away from him, detarget while jumping back, turn with the about face button, and press nr2 again, now you have aproximately 1200 units away from your opponent in about 1,5 seconds, theres no need for the extra damage, well, maybe in pve, but in pvp its fine ^^

I guarantee the metrics of sword use and sword builds are low compared to other main weapons. The ranger sword attacks can still be remade unique while functioning better for end users. The ranger sword has been poorly designed and has been complained about since launch, so it’s time something is done about it. Considering hot introduces tons of new weapon skills, new traits, utilities… the least that could be done is a revisit to a mere 3 weapon skills.

Also, not trying to be rude, but the mere fact that players need to do all the gimmicky detargeting, camera tricks, turning off auto attack… while hoping for a “bit of luck” to make the sword work says a lot about the inherently poor design. You are trying to spin doctor a bad weapon by showing all the player created work arounds. How about we give the Revenant hammer the ranger sword treatment and let’s see how well it’s received by the players.

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Healing power

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

They are looking into it

source?

Irenio post history?

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

They are looking into it

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Healing power

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

Does some one else think that investing in healing power takes a lot of investment and gives very little back?
Heal as one
7268 healing with 900 healing power
6690 healing with 0 healing power
———————————————————————
578 healing difference by investing entire armor + amulet + 2 rings

Regeneration
2,324 regeneration in 10 sec with 900 healing power
1,338 regeneratiion in 10 sec with 0 healing power
—————————————————————————————————
986 healing difference in 10 sec by investing entire armor + amulet + 2 rings

Look at Irenio’s post history

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Thank you Irenio!!!

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

It could happened, you never know…

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Sword Auto Attack

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

skills should not be about learning how to work around poor design. If this design is so good, then let’s give it to all swords and see how the player base reacts.

Additionally, enjoy your rooting and wonky movement while a sword wielding Revenant tears you apart…

Ranger sword could be infinitely better and there is not a valid reason why only 3 skills can’t be fixed or replaced… 3

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Legendary gear is not "Legendary"

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

sure players want new legendary skins and the devs will make them.

Unfortunately your idea of… craft one legendary weapon or armor set and unlock unique looks for each profession is not realistic. If they did that, crafting that one universal legendary would end up costing 100k gold to make… Plus, you are putting restrictions on top of restrictions by limiting things to individual professions.

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