Guild Wars 2

Quotes from a little known film called “30 Days of Dungeons”…

Players: Please, dungeons!

Devs: Dungeons? [They look down at the ground then back at players. They shake their heads.] No dungeons.

Since there is some fancy new tech stuff, are there plans to improve ranger sword attacks?

Mightybird.6034:

You can play whatever build you want. Go look at any streamer that is well ranked/part of a top team. They always play lol/troll builds on their off time for fun. Like d-d zerk ele or w/e. Guess what? They still do great. Has little to do with builds at unranked. And EVERYTHING to do with simply getting better lol.

Sure, you can play whatever you want, but you will get mixed results depending on a number of factors.

Also, thanks for clarifying that the spvp meta revolves around limited build options and team set ups.

Xterra.6172:

People in computer games throw the word “punished” around a lot and I don’t think they even know what the word “punish” means. OP, nobody is sitting around watching you make your bad builds and play your bad builds badly then saying “Yes, I’m going to make this guy’s life miserable now”. Either your build is awful or you’re not a strong player. Or both. Plenty of players perform well in pvp playing non-meta builds all the time whether it be s/f fresh air ele, condi ranger, power necro, hambow warrior, or pistol whip thief. This is a case of lack of game knowledge for you I’m afraid.

Question for you… Gw2 has some great combat mechanics (movement while attacking, camera, targeting, animations and overall gameplay “smoothness”), but why is participation in spvp so abysmally low?

kirito.4138:

If you are satisfied with the experience just stop looking at LB. As long as it was fun right?

I’m thinking that you are missing the point…

Rehero.7821:

Swagger.1459:

really makes you wonder what percentage of players think they are actually supporting the game financially by converting the virtual currency gold with the virtual currency gems that someone else bought.

You can color me ignorant I guess. I struggle to grasp that my money is going anywhere other than their company when I purchase gems. As such if I choose to convert that into gold I am unsure how that immediately removes the my money from the equation. So while no the individuals transferring gold to gems doesn’t directly benefit anet, the allure of buying gems at times of extreme fluctuation (when the wings where available for example) is enough to get people to drop gems down. I also feel like it is evident that putting the HoT expansion on the gem store would cause an extreme increase in gold to gem prices thus prompting more gem purchases.

I edited my post to be more reader friendly and I’m sure that clears up the mess… “converting the virtual currency gold into the virtual currency gems that someone else bought.”

ellesee.8297:

Why is this a thing? We all know immob stacking is the single worst change Anet made to this game! Worse than Skyhammer! Worse than courtyard! Worse than Dhuumfire! And yet, they take an immob stacking elite and put it on an extremely short cooldown! Anet plz!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

I’m sure as the #1 NA Engineer you can handle 5 seconds of immobilize once per minute.

Dear Wanze,

I would be more interested in having you figure out how to make individual pieces of ascended armor and weapons cost 30 gold each.

Thanks!

really makes you wonder what percentage of players think they are actually supporting the game financially by converting the virtual currency gold into the virtual currency gems that someone else bought.

lighter.2708:

some times it just feel like a major patch of another game…..?

I agree with this. If you look at anet’s development record you will see that small amounts of content are implemented, but they try to “stretch it out” with reward track, achievement and progress bar grinds. Even with china not sucking a ton of extra resources now, I don’t see this development philosophy changing anytime soon and certainly not for this xpac.

DiogoSilva.7089:

Apparently, specializations are going to be a much bigger thing than what players may think. There’ll be a whole week devoted to each one of them.

No they won’t be “bigger” or as grand as you want to believe. Also, doing a weekly review of each one is nothing more than the pr trickle they have always done.

grifflyman.8102:

warbignime.4610:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

he was banned from WoW for account sharing

That was another guy not him. He quit WOW because he think wow’s pvp is unbalanced and boring.

He will love WvW. Lol

For a couple weeks or until he gets bored of blobbing to victory with auto attacks.

Overall, pvp here is unbalanced and boring as well, and that won’t change anytime soon (if ever).

Ragion.2831:

warbignime.4610:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

he was banned from WoW for account sharing

That was another guy not him. He quit WOW because he think wow’s pvp is unbalanced and boring.

Well he wont be going back once he experiences gw2s pvp

They always go back. Besides, everyone needs a break from a game once in a while. Also, he makes much more moola streaming wow so it’s just a matter of time before he goes back.

Despite the fact that gw2 has “smoother” combat gameplay, it has far less depth to classes and combat compared.

Algreg.3629:

1. a popular WOW streamer is nothing more than a single person with personal opinions and tastes. Playing and streaming does not turn you into a market analyst or even a knowledgeable player.
2. GW2 is extremely succesful, as far as I can see, second to WoW only in the genre. Ever thought that may be the case partly because of the lack of “trinity”? Is that a more improbable guess than the hypothetical “what if”-scenario you present?
3. Your “90 percent” is just a number anyone can draw out of the hat. My personal – and likewise only anecdotal – impression is completely the other way round.

Can you explain how gw2 is “extremely successful”?

What do you mean gw2 is “second to wow only in the genre”?

warbignime.4610:

So I was watching Towelliee(a popular WOW streamer), and he said this:
“GW2 has the best PVP and combat out of all MMOs, If GW2 had Holy Trinity, with that pvp and dungeons ,it would be the No.1 MMO in the world” this is his quote, When I first heard of it, I thought it’s totally nuts and holy trinity is bad so gw2 don’t need it, but later when I think about. I actually think he is legit. GW2 might not be unique and a better game with holy trinity, but I really do think it would be more successful. Because as I know 90% of the people were turned down by no holy trinity, which is the only reason people play other mmo(WOW, SWTOR,etc.) instead of GW2, imagine if gw2 went with holy trinity, people often say XXX mmo is WOW killer, I think GW2 would actually kill WOW.
PS: all my opinion.

GW2 would be more successful with a healthy dose of “real” roles (Tank, Heals, Buffer, Debuffer, Disruption…) because every profession and build is just a different version of dps with a sprinkle of pseudo role abilities.

Players, like Towellie did, use the words “holy trinity”, but I’m pretty sure that’s just default for wanting more actual and meaningful roles.

It’s disappointing to see such potential wasted.

TheDaiBish.9735:

Swagger.1459:

Iirc, they are not investing resources in dungeons so that means no dungeon raids either.

Source?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Very-disappointing-news-for-you-guys

Dondagora.9645:

Question here. A new ability showcased by the Revenant is the ability to forcibly teleport enemies away from an area. Will this be a hard CC which the new Stability interacts with and thus prevents? I’d assume yes, but I wanted to make sure.

I think it will be a hard cc

Iirc, they are not investing resources in dungeons so that means no dungeon raids either. Besides, there is enough raid/zerg open world content already and I’m sure they will make more.

Ralanost.8913:

Swagger.1459:

I’d be all for getting rid of sylvari and making room for dwarves.

Other than the petrified one in the Priory, they are all dead. Even the Mursaat had more reason to be alive than dwarves do, and we supposedly hunted the “last” of them down in GW1.

Such a poor imagination. Anything is possible in the world of fantasy and magic!

Caeledh.5437:

Swagger.1459:

Choosing what profession(s) to play should be about personal preference (preferred role(s) and aesthetics), not based on “easy or hard to manage”. These imposed “difficulty levels” are an unnecessary gate to playing certain professions and are particularly detrimental for end game.

I can appreciate that. Personally one reason I never played GW2 as my main game was I could never settle on a profession. I liked the theme of some. Hated their mechanics. Like the mechanics of others. Hated their theme. Until revenant.

If I’d had my way all professions would be like thief and revenant. Kitten you and everyone else who doesn’t like that style of play.

That’s why you’re still wrong and why ArenaNet is rolling in great big dirty piles of money. Smart game design involves catering to as many different tastes as you can.

What I find wrong or “off” is that Gw2 has some great game elements, but they were not in the top 10 f2p games last year and gw2 china did not do so spectacular. Certainly makes you wonder what the problems are and why this game doesn’t appeal to a broader audience. The only answers I can come up with are the poor profession designs, major combat issues that have been ignored and lack of regular and meaningful balance updates.

I’d be all for getting rid of sylvari and making room for dwarves.

I hope they do not allow for players to buy hot (or any future xpac) with gems or by converting gold to gems.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Nothing wrong with having a profession that requires micromanaging for those who enjoy that sort of thing. Lots of choice is good. Easy professions to hard to manage professions. Something for everyone.

I believe there is something wrong with having different ways of “micromanaging” professions. It can alienate people from playing certain professions purely based on the levels of keyboard and resource management proficiency required to be competent and/or competitive in any area of the game. All professions should be on equal “control” footing and equally manageable. Choosing what profession(s) to play should be about personal preference (preferred role(s) and aesthetics), not based on “easy or hard to manage”. These imposed “difficulty levels” are an unnecessary gate to playing certain professions and are particularly detrimental for end game.

Let me spin that “lots of choice is good” statement. Look at the spvp meta and tell me that there are lots of choices there. Tell me there are a plethora of viable “high end” team compositions, weapons, utilities, traits… On the flip side, in owpve and wvw players can run around in a zerg while auto attacking and aoeing their way to victory with a bit more forgiving build options, but that has a limited enjoyment lifespan for some. Also, the zerg and stack game hides many of the core profession and combat issues that I mentioned in my original post.

Overall, the main problems are that the higher you go in any area of the game, there are less and less optimal build choices and flexibility. These problems are made worse by the profession “difficult level” designs. Colin mentioned wanting all the skills to be meaningful to use, so by extension that means all professions will need work and “things” need to be better balanced. When the devs have to account for all these different profession mechanics and such, it makes balancing and progression much more difficult. Also, the devs want to build better and more meaningful game content, and that starts with fixing/working on the flawed profession and combat foundations.

Think about this… NPE was designed so the game would be more user friendly because things were “too confusing for new players”. At the moment, all professions are not equally user friendly and can be “too confusing for new players”.

Reserved again for future use

Reserved for future use

When I look at these different resource management and skill set playstyles, it kind of boggles my mind how the devs wanted players focused on playing the game and not on the UI. Combat can chaotic enough at times (particularly in wvw and spvp), and profession designs that require more UI fiddling, resource awareness and swap-swap-swap mechanics seem counterproductive to the above developer’s goal. The emphasis should be on role preference (which is kinda hard here considering everything is a version of dps) and different powers doing different things, not on professions requiring more keyboard management and memorization than others to be played proficiently.

Gw2 has a great base combat system with targeting, casting on the move and overall “smoothness” to gameplay, but I bet that the spvp community (and regularly played 80s in other areas of the game too) is small largely because of the different ways professions are designed. To exacerbate the fundamental profession problems mentioned above, there are such a minor amount of viable “high end” builds per profession that gameplay becomes very stale and people get annoyed with being pigeon holed. There are so few competitive weapon sets, skills and traits that it’s not even funny, but nothing is really done about it. I mean my gosh, Rangers have been begging to have their sword abilities function better and alternatives to pets, but the devs are making it seem like an impossible coding feat. Additionally, when I look at the pvp meta with things like Taunt (which will force opposing players to run around auto attacking even more) and that the devs are anticipating and encouraging more “perma stealth builds” in spvp (yay, because we didn’t have enough of that silliness in wvw), I feel like the development team does not care at all about having quality and balanced combat. Players have voiced major concerns with things like perma stealth, condition “carpet bombing”, immobilize stacking, continuous knock backs, some over the top burst attacks, being locked out of combat by cc abilities…, but all of them are mostly ignored while the devs shuffle some traits and numbers that run behind the scenes.

I have played many games and had been an avid pvper for a very long time across different platforms, and my overall impression now is that the devs will just keep tossing in quirky game modes (strongholds), gimmicky objectives (new wvw map), and these unique profession "stuffs” (specializations) to string players along and not “reimagine” major issues plaguing the game. It also seems as if they do not have an interest in improving professions and having balanced combat (which are the most important aspects of a combat oriented game). I understand that no game is perfect (not even the one I mentioned), but I think the devs are doing a disservice to the players (and their own pockets books by extension) by making the “difficult to master“ part of professions and combat about keyboard and resource management as opposed to abilitiy/power use, timing, counter play, positioning, los…. Also, if unbalanced profession and combat mechanic “things” do not improve, then there will not be any hope of having a better wvw experience outside of blobbing or increased spvp/esports participation.

Revenant snip (bolded) from Massively Overpowered…

“the setup meant that the class had access to two heals, two Elite skills, and a variety of maneuvers that could be tailored to the situation.”

My personal opinions…

The Revenant (and some of the other professions such as Elementalist and Thief to name a couple) has too many different design and performance mechanics. I understand the intent was/is to make professions interesting, but I personally feel these different profession mechanics are off putting to many players. Instead of providing common UI management and control, simplifying attack and skill use with cooldowns only, ditching resource bars and streamlining play performance so it is easier for any player to pick up any profession in any area of the game, I believe the attempts at making “unique” profession mechanics only serve to alienate a lot of players. Players are instead forced to learn (or fail to learn and abandon) completely different mechanics to play competently and to also be competitive against other players. While some people may easily adapt and/or really like these different profession mechanics, I have a feeling that the above is having a negative effect on long term retention and play variety for many. Also, I believe these different designs translate to professions never really being balanced at the meta stage (especially in pvp environments where it counts the most).

To help you understand the above paragraph better… While playing City of Heroes (which had its own set of problems, but at least had carp ton of different “profession” options and build flexibility) I could pick up any archetype and powerset and it felt familiar. Yes, I had to learn how to play different roles (melee, ranged, tank, control, buff, debuff, interruption, heals, stealth play and combinations of these…) and what each power did, but every one of them had the same base controls and resource mechanics. Yes, some had secondary resource and performance mechanics (Brute Fury and Dominator Domination come to mind), but those were minor to the overall playstyle. In gw2, however, different professions have completely different gameplay mechanics, effective playstyles and resources (or lack thereof). Examples…

>Ranger- Straight forward playstyle. Abilities on timers. Two weapon swaps. One set of utilities on timers.

>Thief- Initiative resource management playstyle. Initiative allows for more “specialized” attacks to be used more frequently. Two weapon swaps. One set of utilities on timers.

>Elementalist- Atunement swap-swap-swap playstyle. One weapon set, but effectively 4 weapon sets (20 abilities) to draw from. One set of utilities on timers.

>Revenant- Resource bar management playstyle. One weapon set with super low cooldowns. Utility swapping effectively giving multiple heals and elites.

Tyrannical.9348:

Swagger.1459:

Tyrannical.9348:

Just a small suggestion, make Living Story Season 2 free with Heart of Thorns. Most of the story leading up to HoT is all living story content, which is locked to people who didn’t play during the release of each episode or purchase it with Gems.

It would seem a little silly to have the expansion’s plot rely on backstory you can’t access, you wouldn’t know what reasons your character has to chase down this new dragon, or what happened prior to the event of the pact fleet crashing into the canopy. There’s so much of this expansion that relies on players knowing current events… it’s kinda flawed when you think about it.

Would people prefer if S2 was additionally accessible to players who purchase HoT?

my vote on this would be no.

“There’s so much of this expansion that relies on players knowing current events…” like what? couldn’t the players just read the ls history for free and catch up?

Reading up game content isn’t as fun as playing it.

that’s a completely different argument than the one you provided.

there are options for players to relive and learn about ls2 already. i’d prefer that arena not give away more free stuff (particularly old ls content), because more free stuff means less development money. this game has a lot of things to do, catch up on and offer to their customers and these things will not be achieved by giving out even more freebies.

Tyrannical.9348:

Just a small suggestion, make Living Story Season 2 free with Heart of Thorns. Most of the story leading up to HoT is all living story content, which is locked to people who didn’t play during the release of each episode or purchase it with Gems.

It would seem a little silly to have the expansion’s plot rely on backstory you can’t access, you wouldn’t know what reasons your character has to chase down this new dragon, or what happened prior to the event of the pact fleet crashing into the canopy. There’s so much of this expansion that relies on players knowing current events… it’s kinda flawed when you think about it.

Would people prefer if S2 was additionally accessible to players who purchase HoT?

my vote on this would be no.

“There’s so much of this expansion that relies on players knowing current events…” like what? couldn’t the players just read the ls history for free and catch up?

Gaile Gray.6029:

I just sort of wish they have an “E Z Mode” for people like me.

Possible new gem store convenience item?

think of the new revenant energy/resource bar first…

now, think of a similar mechanic that affects damage output based on the duration and frequency of any form of stealth used personally or placed on your character. example, player is running around killing stuff and their damage output energy/recource bar is at 100% normal… player then enters stealth or has stealth placed on them and the energy/resource bar starts draining which reduces their overall damage percentage output when they exit stealth… player continues to fight/run/do whatever outside of stealth and the energy/resource bar fills back up to 100% damage output.

*obviously there would be a necessity to balance other “things”, but this is just a basic concept so don’t jump all over me.

thoughts?

Tyrannical.9348:

wrong wrong wrooooong…

I drew similarities between two incidents where a new feature was brought to a game where people didn’t know the backstory nor did they understand the extent of this content’s impact on others.

I am NOT comparing Revenants to Incarnates, I am comparing GW2 to CoH, in the context of new features vs the RP community. Please read things more carefully before you get up on your high horse making accusations about what train of thought you seem to think I have here, because I did say TWICE that I’m not relating Revenants to Demigods.

I’m comparing similar situations in the RP gaming community, that’s all, don’t think too much on it because it’s that simple. I’m sorry if your argument is invalid now, it looks like you worked hard for it, such a shame it was wasted by you missing the point…

PS: for future reference; being condescending on a help thread, one of the easiest ways to paint a target on yourself.

Tyrannical.9348:

I’m not sure whether this is the correct forum or not, but as a cautious roleplayer I’m interested to see what the RP community things about the Revenant in terms of it’s feasibility as a character’s profession, what problems might arise, and how to ensure that it’s fun for everyone.

Naturally, when a delicate kind of force is put forth into the player’s hands, people don’t know how to gauge the levels of power they actually command, and Revenant seems especially fragile territory.

It reminds me of ‘Incarnates’ from City of Heroes (ad to a lesser extent Time Manipulation and Gravity Control). What are the limits to what a player can do or achieve with this kind of power? and how will it affect the RP community at large?

Bolded the important parts of your op.

Players knew the backstory to incarnates… “Incarnate is a special origin originally not available to players, although heroes and villains who gain the attention of the Well of the Furies may gain Incarnate powers. Incarnates are humans who have been exposed to the Well of the Furies in some way, empowering them with the powers of the gods themselves. As such, they are substantially more powerful than most other superbeings.”

You did not and were not asking about the “back story”, you basically wanted to know how the revenant “fits in” as a profession and then kept mentioning power level related things in your last two paragraphs. Your post is worded in such a way that it is easy for readers to assume you are talking about revenants wielding superior power levels compared to other professions and not in terms of how to deal with “context of new features”. We currently don’t know how exactly a character becomes a Revenant, but you equated their ability to draw from powers of the mists with characters who have been given godlike powers and are “substantially more powerful than most other superbeings”.

I’m not being condescending, I’m actually trying to be helpful.

I think it would be best to edit your original post to match your intended questions.

Tyrannical.9348:

Swagger.1459:

Tyrannical.9348:

I’m not sure whether this is the correct forum or not, but as a cautious roleplayer I’m interested to see what the RP community things about the Revenant in terms of it’s feasibility as a character’s profession, what problems might arise, and how to ensure that it’s fun for everyone.

Naturally, when a delicate kind of force is put forth into the player’s hands, people don’t know how to gauge the levels of power they actually command, and Revenant seems especially fragile territory.

It reminds me of ‘Incarnates’ from City of Heroes (ad to a lesser extent Time Manipulation and Gravity Control). What are the limits to what a player can do or achieve with this kind of power? and how will it affect the RP community at large?

Other professions draw their power from various sources and elements to do “cool stuff”, so I’m wondering why you equate being powered by the mists as demigod/incarnate/“above the rest” status?

I didn’t say they are above the rest, I never even stated they are incarnates of the gods or whatever, all I said was this is a new unknown force that’s delicate to handle. We hardly know much about the mists, let alone how this profession can use the powers of the mists to influence reality.

We’ve witnessed they can call forth the powers of ancient legends, disrupt the fabric of reality, and I suspect more questions and fewer answers to appear in the future when they show off the class some more, that’s why I’d like to see where people stand, so the RP community can address the situation and come to an agreed decision on how much this profession can influence the balance of power.

You drew a parallel between Revenants with mist powers and incarnate demigod status.

The problem is that you are applying real world logic and understanding to your role playing in a fantasy setting. You are mentally comparing things like snow storms vs. gravity and coming to the conclusion that “well, snow storms are less powerful than the gravitational forces of out planet” and “omg Revenants must be so powerful because on earth we cannot even see or talk to our dead ancestors”. If you keep applying earthly logic to fit into tyria logic then you will never effectively roleplay.

Edit- Also, sources of power in tyria do not matter for our characters because they can only use and manipulate these things on a micro and limited scale. The Revenant is not going to be like Aragorn controlling thousands of the ghosts to decimate entire armies of bad guys. Think of Revenants like Aragorn with a couple of ghostly drinking buddies who get in bar brawls and kick the kitten of all the overweight and out of shape locals who guzzle beer and smoke cigarets.

Tyrannical.9348:

I’m not sure whether this is the correct forum or not, but as a cautious roleplayer I’m interested to see what the RP community things about the Revenant in terms of it’s feasibility as a character’s profession, what problems might arise, and how to ensure that it’s fun for everyone.

Naturally, when a delicate kind of force is put forth into the player’s hands, people don’t know how to gauge the levels of power they actually command, and Revenant seems especially fragile territory.

It reminds me of ‘Incarnates’ from City of Heroes (ad to a lesser extent Time Manipulation and Gravity Control). What are the limits to what a player can do or achieve with this kind of power? and how will it affect the RP community at large?

Other professions draw their power from various sources and elements to do “cool stuff”, so I’m wondering why you equate being powered by the mists as demigod/incarnate/“above the rest” status?

Hey Joe,

Read this archived post https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/archive/balance/PvX-Balance-Iteration-Wrongdoing/3680985 and ask if the development team is going to finally change their balance philosophy and start addressing some major lingering issues starting with the HoT xpac.

*I know the above linked topic is old, but it is still relevant and applicable to the current state of the game and development team.

Since you have been gone for a while, I’ll let you know that profession balancing updates have been made at turtle speed and mostly meaningless changes have taken place (read any profession patch notes to see what I’m talking about). The development team has allowed red flag issues and player concerns like “perma stealth” builds, condition “carpet bombing”, immobilize stacking, continuous knockback effects, lack of viable build diversity for every profession in pvp environments, the unholy dps-dps-dps trinity meta… to remain, while mostly making changes to skill texts and trait, rune and sigil numbers that run behind the scenes. Yes, the Revenant profession and specializations coming will add new dynamics to gameplay, but we have not heard any word on core problems being fixed. While some players may be happy with the current development and xpac direction, let’s not forget that this is a combat oriented game and it is vital for the development team to take profession balance and mechanics seriously.

Gw2 could be one of the top combat mmos out there, but so far the developers have squandered potential by sticking to the living story, gem store and “out of left field” updates status quo which has alienated a huge playerbase. While much of the game design hides many profession and combat flaws through zerg play in pve and wvw, there are players out there simply not content with “blobbing” their way to victory with auto attacks and “gimmicky” mechanics. Also, the spvp “e-sports” combat scene is abysmal because of all that has been mentioned above, and you can watch any twitch stream to see how awful, unbalanced and uninspiring small scale combat is. Overall, playing and watching gw2 really makes you scratch your head wondering how a talented team of developers, with the tech to back them up, would allow professions and combat to remain so stagnant and stale.

SpiritSpeakerOfHoelbrak.3980:

Longbow Rangers are broken. Please balance the class. Thanks. 1500 range + with massive burst,evades and stealth + immobi =not fun. Less cheese please. Decided to make one myself and roam in WvW. 8 hours later I’d had so many servings of cheese I had to stop.

Time for a change.

Can you run a twitch stream and post a video of your ranger “eating up the cheese”?

There are a lot of new and “reimagined” things coming with the xpac, so I’m just wondering if some other stuff is going to be given the NPE treatment?

Some examples of “stuff” below…

Stealth and counter stealth mechanics…
*Watch the video below and imagine you are a new player and encountering gw2 pvp for the first time…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=2QVy_C-Z0-k

So, after a few combat experiences against the current stealth mechanics, the player(s) come to the forums seeking advice to deal with the stealth scenario and are told to “Make sure you equip a melee weapon and swing it around randomly to hit the stealthy opponent!”, “Equip a superior sigil of fire!”, “Learn to predict where the stealthy opponent is and when they are going to attack!”, “Most build options don’t work so you must create your character specifically to deal with the stealth to have any chance!”, “Just break stealth with an aoe and melt face!”… While all of these may sound good in theory, they are not realistic, well-thought-out or balanced solutions to the poor stealth and counter stealth mechanics that have been designed and implemented. It is unfortunate that players are left with extremely limited build options in a pvp environment to deal with stealth mechanics and are pigeon holed by lack of developer attention and “development”. Also, the current stealth design severely limits growth for the thief profession.

Conditions…
New player(s) walk into pvp fights and are continuously carpet bombed with conditions and stacking immobilize. fun stuff right? not at all, and I don’t need to say anymore about conditions in pvp.

On the flip side, player(s) with condition builds hit the mass pve boss and champion trail and are basically rendered useless with the condition caps. This experience feeds even more into the auto attack meta that is prevalent in much of the game. It’s not really fun or engaging to sit there in large battles letting the #1 button on the keyboard, a couple dodges and an emergency heal win the day (this happens in wvw too btw).

Ascended gear…
New player(s) level up to 80 and look how they can equip their awesome character. “Cool beans, through regular gameplay I can buy some ascended trinkets!”. “Now let’s look at some high end gear…” (Player(s) go to Dulfy site and sees the obnoxiously long shopping list…) "Whoa, forced to level up crafting to 500 and then all that time gated stuff…) “Hey, maybe there is an alternative, let’s look at the bltc!”… “Hmmm, maybe I can cash in all the badges from wvw?”… Looks back at the bltc… “Wow, precusors and bis legendary weapons for sale…”.

By design, you have created 1 reliable path to gear up with ascended and the rest is a poorly implemented mess. This should be fixed. You had a perfectly good system with ascended trinkets so I don’t see why you could not have the same laurel time gated- crafting mat required-gold sink and badge of honor ascended gearing system in place. Multiple paths to gear progression needs to happen to cater to all types of players and as Chris Whiteside said, “earned through lots of different parts/activities of the game”. Also, if you are going to continue to allow players to sell precursors and legendaries, then all ascended gear should get the same treatment. It doesn’t matter whether ascended is needed or not, it’s the principal of the matter with regard to acquisition.

My overall thoughts…
It is disappointing to see major topics and flaws ignored for years while random things are implemented and/or changed. There has been enough community feedback and time to address many red flag and poor design issues, but they are completely ignored. I don’t understand why a talented team of developers and coders, that have a great game engine to back them up, would squander a potentially great game by not improving or fixing core game elements.

If you want to increase player retention, bring back some old players, add new customers and boost revenue in the process, I suggest that players and their concerns be taken more seriously. I’m hoping that the “new new new” efforts to communicate produce more transparency with community concerns and that we see more meaningful and substantial new player experiences in the near future.

Edit- I understand there are many different opinions about these topics, but we can all agree that it is in everyone’s best interest to have a growing player base and that the game needs to be more accessible and less alienating.

dietzero.3514:

It should start low and scale higher, the more you buy. Linking something as critical as space to gems is severely punishing to new players and people with multiple characters/accounts, and the problem is only going to get worse. A static gold cost is a far better option.

Currently having to buy ~1000 gold worth of gems to max bank tabs and ONE character’s bag slots is ridiculous.

I think they should charge more for bag and bank slots.

if you (the devs) want players to have “more reasons to try different builds” and were “very cognizant of keeping the focus heavily on player-vs.-player combat”, why are you not doing anything about the current limited amount of viable pvp builds per profession?

are there finally some meaningful balance and build updates coming that we don’t know about?

working on the poorly designed stealth and counter stealth mechanics?

what are you doing about condition bombing and immobilize stacking?

any changes to some over the top burst abilities?

are you making more weapons sets and attacks, skills, elites, traits… viable in pvp settings?

Shalamahara.9283:

So i played for 6 months at launch.But left the game,and just came back this past week.
All ive been doing is pvp..so heres my question.
Why is it..that as a ranger..theifs seem so op to me?? i mean..when i see a theif even turning my way,i almost dont even try to fight anymore,i just let them kill me.
Cause theres no point,how can i target,let alone kill someone who can pretty much go invis anytime they want…

There have been a plethora of concerns and complaints about stealth that have continuously been ignored by the development team. By their (the devs) lack of responses or actions, we can only assume they think the system is fine and/or they do not have a strong interest in balancing classes and poor mechanics.

Now onto how to deal with thieves and stealth as others have mentioned…

You must build and run your character specifically to deal with the stealth scenario to have any chance. You must force yourself to have a melee weapon to swing around randomly, aoes from torch, damage trap skill somewhere and sic em elite. Additionally, you must develop and employ your “prediction” skills to anticipate your stealthy opponents whereabouts and attacks.

Good luck and have fun being pigeon holed into running a couple of viable builds in a pvp environment.

more door bashing and lord killing… much disappoint.

Xhyros.1340:

Guild Wars 2 is probably not Nexon’s issue for these shenanigans *cough*Wildstar*cough*. Y’all can probably stop worrying *cough*unlessyouplayWildstar*cough*.

yes, wildstar is bombing, but that’s not the whole story. gw2 china is not doing as well as expected and I’m assuming this xpac is coming now for a much needed cash boost because the living story is not doing the job to keep the ship afloat.

there are many more factors and elements to talk about, but I don’t feel like analyzing the quarterly financials right now.

Astralporing.1957:

Swagger.1459:

What I take from the article…

Ncsoft is underperforming in the gaming market and Nexon wants to increase revenue.

Not…quite. Both NCsoft and Nexon are in this for profit, and are interested in maximizing it. It’s just that NCsoft thinks not only about profit now, but also about profit tomorrow, and about survival of NCsoft. Nexon on the other hand is more interested in fast cash grabs, and longterm survival of NCsoft is completely irrelevant to them (after all, NCsoft and Nexon, in the end, are firms competing for the same market).

So, you can read the “underperforming” part and wanting to increase revenue as “We think we could milk NCsoft for way more before it dies”.

The fact that they went public with it is a very good thing – it means NCsoft is resisting. And, if it continues, it might end in weakening ties between those two companies.

You are correct and worded things much nicer than I had the energy to do last night.
Although, I personally do not think NC will improve even if ties are severed with NEX. Guess we will have to see what happens over the next few to many years…

What I take from the article…

Ncsoft is underperforming in the gaming market and Nexon wants to increase revenue.

If Ncsoft and Nexon want to “find effective ways to increase corporate and shareholder value”, it is by making better games and having their current portfolio of games improved for the end users. By improve, I don’t mean more cash shop stuff to bypass grinding (see gw2 legendaries), rng boxes and hiring more economists.

As an example to explain the above statement, let’s look at what gw2 can do individually to increase retention for current customers, bring back some old customers and make some new ones to increase revenue…

-Clearly show what is on the development “table” and have a public test server. Doing both of these shows transparency and confidence by the development team and builds better communication and faith among customers. Faith opens wallets and silence closes them.

-Regular and meaningful balance, profession and combat system mechanics improvements. There was a huge thread in the old balance section that made many valid points to the way the talented team of developers, with a great engine to back them up, ignores player concerns (1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1 combat with 75% of your other skills on long cool downs), red flag issues (stealth, counter stealth, conditions, burst capabilities vs hp, almost meaningless trait number shuffling and reshuffling…) and squanders what could be one of the best class/profession combat systems in an mmo to date. Unfortunately for us customers, though, very little is done to improve the most important aspects of a game like this. In a combat centric game things need to move forward and I don’t have any faith the xpac will do anything meaningful for the profession and combat meta. Also, players like options and flexibilty to build their characters (see gw1 and city of heroes)to make them feel unique and interesting to play, not the current limitations that have been designed and imposed to make things less of a headache for the development team.

-Properly reward players for their time and effort (less gloppy gloop and junk rewards) and sort out the current wacky gear progression that allows customers to buy the bis slot gear (legendaries) and forces players to craft to reliably earn the second bis gear (ascended).

-Stop forcing customers to do things you want them to do (forced pvp for map completion anybody?). Multiple paths to achieve certain things is always better than one rigid path.

-Make games for the players first, not shareholders and corporate suits, and you will see more of our money. Also, a video game should be managed by players for players period.

-This game would probable earn more money for corporate, shareholders, employees and future development if there were an optional sub with benefits available.

Venatorn.7619:

It’s a LEGENDARY weapon … work for it and stop whining like a kitten

Do you consider it a “legendary” journey to obtain a “work for it” LEGENDARY by credit card?

Beast Sos.1457:

My assumption is all based on not being able to do specific content without the corresponding Mastery.

Masteries are the new gear progression. Without them you cant kill certain mobs or you cant explore certain areas. This is pretty much forcing you to go grind areas you dont want to play in or content you dont want to do so you can play what you want. That is something that goes against Anets philosophy.

Now I can be 100% incorrect and you wont have to get Masteries to do certain content, all they will do is make the content easier. Certain Masteries should be gated like the hand glider and learning new languages, since you have to learn some way. But you telling me I cant do this boss fight or fight this certain mob because I dont have the corresponding Mastery, is just another gear grind with a fancy name on it.

I love gw2 and ill be buying the expansion no matter what but I’m concerned that the Mastery system isnt anything special and just adds grind to the game, which isnt necessary.

it does seem that anet wants to add (once again) very little “substance” to the game and stretch out that “substance” as far as they can so people log in. also, they will probably handle specializations in a similar way so they can make it seem special and exciting.

Hylgeriak.8250:

Swagger.1459:

still waiting on the “focus on zero grind” part for ascended weapons and armor to be implemented…

you chose to make it a grind for yourself if you decide to actively go for the required mats instead of bunkering them while regularly playing the stuff you want and wait until you can efford it. There’s no content in GW2 that’s not entirelly doable without ascended gear

your reply has nothing to do with what I’m talking about. it wasn’t supposed to be a grind in the first place hence the “focus on zero grind” part. also, it is not about waiting or not waiting. it’s not about doable or not doable. it’s not about needing or not needing. it’s about the required methods to obtain ascended weapons and armor contradict the statements I quoted.

interview snip from 2012…

“Elsewhere in the AMA thread, Studio Design Director Chris Whiteside revealed the backlash was “definitely expected” by ArenaNet, and releasing Ascended gear “would have been better at launch.” He subsequently bombshelled his bombshell by declaring, “We have no intention of adding a new rarity gear such as Ascended.”

Ultimately, ArenaNet will begin moving forward with itiered loot. “We have never said there would be no vertical progression,” Whiteside concluded. “We do intend to focus on horizontal, but we will have vertical progression moving forward with the focus on zero grind and a very low power curve.”"

still waiting on the “focus on zero grind” part for ascended weapons and armor to be implemented…

Jana.6831:

Swagger.1459:

Jana.6831:

Swagger.1459:

Jana.6831:

Swagger.1459:

Jana.6831:

Azhure.1857:

TheBlackLeech.9360:

At very least the game should still show damage splashes on opponents which have been struck.

(this, of course would not apply to projectiles or ranged attacks)

I agree here. It makes no sense that stealth is more than simple invisibility. If I strike an invisible opponent with a melee weapon then I should know that I hit them, instantly.

My L2P advise: equip a superior sigil of fire.
Edit: And there are in fact 17562481756234 indicators of where a thief is: best indicator is that thief is a melee class. So where can the thief be?

can you explain exactly how having a sigil of fire equipped is beneficial?

ok so the indicator is this???… assume that the thief is in melee range and hope that your melee weapon is equipped so you can spam #1 and pray to hit said invisible player?

Sigil of fire triggers a fireblast when you hit the opponent (with a critical hit).
Any yeah, fighting melee classes with melee weapons is a good choice – you can always go ranged but that won’t do much good against thieves.

ok so you hit the thief while they were visible and your sigil proc but they reapply stealth, now what?

ok having a ranged weapon is useless so you are sol if you don’t have a melee weapon. gotcha. playing ranged is an insta loss scenario.

stand there swinging a melee weapon around is the best anti-stealth method. so “swing and pray” is your l2p advice. seems to be a great and well thought out combat mechanic…

You can also spam aoe you will hit the thief 100%.
Edit: And they have no blocks or anything.

can you tell me all the spammable aoes per profession and build?

No, I can’t and I won’t (I see what you’re trying here) – just find them for your prefered class and equip the weapons necessary for it if you’re afraid of thieves or don’t like to spam 1.

you never answered my previous question…

“ok so you hit the thief while they were visible and your sigil proc but they reapply stealth, now what?”

so let’s assume that everyone is currently equipped with weapons and skills that generate an aoe effect. so what happens when players spam all of their aoe abilities (that are on timers mind you) and get lucky enough to hit the thief and they reapply stealth?

Lucky Shot.7650:

Let’s just remove stealth, evades, blinds from thieves and stealth, clones from mesmers to let scrubs kill them easily and be happy.

that’s not what most level headed players are really saying. stealth could be handled differently so they can balance other aspects to make for a better “all around” combat experience.