Guild Wars 2

http://img.pandawhale.com/post-15416-Necromancer-mouse-summoning-th-uX3l.gif

Skrittmancer

Necroskritt

I just thought of this stuff by my frustrations in this game.

Imagine the breath.

Poop vomit.

If they wanted all classes to play any role then everyone would be on the level of the Elementalist.

Speaking of which, I just had to fight a team that was using nothing but meta builds (Guardian Bunker, D/P Thief, D/D Elementalist, Trap Ranger, HGH Engineer) and it was utterly complete hell.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_truce

According to everyone here, courtesy is for the weak. In my little experience of WvW it seems like everyone is a ravenous dog looking for kills and loot. Atleast most people in PvP have the kitten decency to say “Gg” afterwards and are respectful. Camping jumping puzzles… honestly.

Sigh alot of people giving opinions/criticizing for things they know not. Well guys, for those of you that helped me, I thank you kindly.

For those of you that are Elitist, Annoying, or overall anti-helpful, good day.

25 stacks of bleed, 20 seconds of poison, 30+ seconds of burn > 25 stacks of confusion.

Mesmers bring very little to the table in group fights. Especially in PvP. I’m definitely not an expert in WvW, but I know how Mesmer works as it is infact my third best class.

What you’re implying, is a zerg comprised entirely of facerolling confusion spammers. Unorthodox, impractical. A full zerg comprised of any other class would generally out-condition a Mesmer.

It was the meta D/P stealth setup. I was constantly being blinded and stealthed, made it a war of attrition a Necromancer should’ve been able to win but couldn’t. Also I’m finally glad someone here understood exactly where I was coming from. I might just hit you up on that offer (Not now, atm, as I’m about to go to bed.)

If I have 25 stacks (Or incredibly long duration, rather) of any damaging condition in the game on you, you’re essentially dead. Mesmer confusion is no different, and is actually significantly harder to stack in such quantities.

I don’t need to be a WvW expert to know you’re full of it. Stop insulting me over my game mechanic knowledge.

Also, Dynnen: I easily avoided the initial Thief burst, it was clear as daylight (Which is why I say the Thief I was fighting wasn’t nearly as skilled as some PvP Thieves I fight), however, after that everything went downhill. I couldn’t do any damage to him due to his stealth mitigation, and he was wearing me down.

There is not a single condition in the game that single ticks for 30,000 damage. If there is, it is blindingly overpowered and needs a nerf.

And this is the person criticizing me for ignorance in game mechanics?

A Mesmer in a point heavily bomarded by group AoE/Conditions cannot get enough clones up to help pick his nose, let alone get a solid shatter up. Once again

“When someone is frustrated enough to “QQ” while still being sensible enough to ask for advice/help, it is generally admitted one should understand his/her point of view, rather than do what you have done this entire time and go “nou”/“l2p”.”

I have a feeling that I have helped more people ingame learning Necro for PvP than either of you have helped anyone in your entire lives on forums for anything.

I asked for help defeating Thieves in WvW, and I am forced to defend myself against constant recycled verbal attacks. Amazing. Yes, I dislike Thieves in WvW. Yes I was frustrated in the beginning. Yes I believe I had more skill than the Thief who beat me. I’d even go as far to say because I generally play nothing but tPvP (and use all classes) I have above average skill. Gee, imagine that.

Any other points you’d like to make?

I am unfamiliar using Necro in WvW. I am unfamiliar with WvW in general. So I ask for a strategy/build or anything to help even the odds stacked against me. What exactly am I doing to offend your Magistrates?

It was a heavy amount of frustration by losing to an essential faceroller that lacked a significant amount of skill that I’ve come to know and respect in the tPvP community, but still having no chance at winning that battle. I was, however, very eager to know if there was a way to beat these things in WvW and I was just bad at it.

Also, LordKrall because I’ve seen your posts, and many of the posts of the other players in this thread that I have referred to as “Elitists” who are very quick to jump onto the “l2p” bandwagon rather than be actually helpful as many people here have been. Honestly, I believe you are more of a hinder to these forums than a help.

When someone is frustrated enough to “QQ” while still being sensible enough to ask for advice/help, it is generally admitted one should understand his/her point of view, rather than do what you have done this entire time and go “nou”/“l2p”.

Chopps, being aware of your surroundings only goes so far.

More ignorant Eliticism.

Yes but the above thoughts really ruined it, first comparing them to a pitcher plant filled with acid and digestive fluids… don’t really want to “insert” anything in there…

and the second stating poop vomit. So…

PinCushion.7390:

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

If it were balanced around group play, Thief is horrible, Mesmer is below average, Warrior downright sucks, and Elementalists are OP.

If it were balanced around 1v1, everyone except Mesmer, Thief, and Elementalist are completely unviable.

I’m not sure what this is balanced around, since no one is really balanced. If they wanted to give everyone unique jobs/capabilities, they probably should have done that.

Welcome to WvW. Only Warriors are pretty useful right now because people figured out Leg Specialist works with arrowcarts.

My strategy is to have 2 different builds and gear sets. 1 for traveling and 1 for siege/zerging. My traveling set is soldier’s gear, and my traits are largely about getting more life force, siphoning health, dropping wells faster, and generally taking a very very long time to kill. It’s essentially “burst proof,” and is specifically designed to throw burst classes off their game. It’s not for winning 1v1, though I have vs baddies. It’s for dragging a 1v1 out for so long that they either leave (after which I move on to wherever it was I was going) or one of us gets rolled by a group of roamers. Basically it’s a troll build.

When I get where I’m going I swap to my rabid gear, flip a few traits over, and I’ve got a pretty serviceable condispam zerging build.

Trying to build a Necro to consistently win 1vs1 against the “good” roamer classes is an exercise in frustration, since the good ones will just bail out of the fight when they start getting beat. I’ll settle for surviving.

Ah that is actually one great thing I forgot to take into aspect. I’m so used to tPvP, I forgot you can easily switch out builds on the fly in WvW/PvE. Which might make one of my PvP builds highly viable, as I made it to be completely versatile from Burst, to Condition, to Tank, to Bunker all with a few trait/ammy swaps. Thanks, you gave me a great idea.

And another elitist * joins to be a wonderful contributor to the conversation. Anatolian, I’ve covered all of your “points” before. Do please read context before trying to compare kittens.

As to Besetment, and Naphack: Thank you for your tips, but I doubt I’ll go back to WvW any time soon, Necro is too unviable there sadly.

Edit: Lifwaster, that is correct, I did forget to use food buffs.

Lordkrall, do you even have any fathom of the context of this situation? Or do you just read through 1/4th of my posts and then proceed to go “l2p” blindly like a facerolling Warlock from WoW?

Allow me to reiterate: I recognize when something is failing, either my build, my strategy, or my skill in a fight. In that fight, it was none of the above, even if I had my full build that I used in tPvP, I would’ve still lost. Even if I had one of my other builds, I would’ve still lost. If I had my Mesmer, my Thief, or my Ele there… I would’ve easily won.

Again, I saw immediately that he was stealthing far too much for me to have beaten him, even before I dropped the first well. I came here specifically to ask if anyone had a strategy to beat said Thief strategy using Necro. Apparently not.

If you want to practice with me sometime, I can help you with Necro strategy ingame. WvW is completely different in many aspects, but PvP helps give a player very strong basics and intimate knowledge of how to deal with other players (and bad situations). (Won’t help you a single bit against faceroll classes/builds though)

Well, I didn’t have everything to make it work fully, but I was using a experimental Well Bomber build that allowed me to get 20+ kills in a single tPvP match (Not against bad players, either). Again, gearing for WvW is very expensive, and I didn’t have everything I needed by a longshot. However it wouldn’t have mattered, I know when someone is going to beat me no matter what I do. That Thief was unbeatable for my build, just so much stealth…

Lala, the problem with boon removal is that alot of classes, namely Ele, Guardian, Ranger, and Engineer can all reapply them as fast as they lost them. Ranger even has strong passive Regen, which can get even stronger with certain runes.

Of course that is why Elementalists dominate 5v5s along with Guardians.

In WvW I’m not an expert, but from my recent experience in it I’d have to say “Hell no.”

In tPvP, it’s a VERY difficult fight, often one you will lose. I had a build posted here a while back that would make short work of Rangers/Guardians/Thieves/Mesmers/Engineers that would pull that, but that was for PvP. In WvW, I’m afraid I don’t see any way to beat that kind of thing, or Thieves, for that matter.

If it were balanced around group play, Thief is horrible, Mesmer is below average, Warrior downright sucks, and Elementalists are OP.

If it were balanced around 1v1, everyone except Mesmer, Thief, and Elementalist are completely unviable.

I’m not sure what this is balanced around, since no one is really balanced. If they wanted to give everyone unique jobs/capabilities, they probably should have done that.

• Firstly, I didn’t actively seek out a 1v1, bro.

• Secondly, When traited properly, Thief does NOT take full damage while invisible, as they have some of the best condition cleanse/damage mitigation while stealthed. Regardless of the fact that I would have to flail around blindly hoping to hit them with a single mark/slash.

• Thirdly, Bullcrap I’m not supposed to beat a class in 1v1 if I wanted to: This is supposed to be “Balanced” remember?

• Lastly, probably the only point you may be right about, is that I was running an attempt at a PvP build. It was ineffective, despite killing numerous players of other classes even outnumbered.

I like how this entire thread turned more into a “l2p” poo flinging contest where Elitist Thief players come out of the woodwork going “nou” than a actual “Help me understand this nonsense” thread I intended.

There are ways of making up for skill with builds/classes, Master of Timespace. Ever see an D/D Elementalist in tPvP? Facerollers the lot of them.

I’ve fought extremely good Thieves in PvP, and I even use Thief myself. The Thief that killed me made many mistakes, but his build was very forgiving, as he would just stealth away before I could punish him.

As for what Advent said, if your Reaper’s mark is on cooldown, you’re sunk. Wells don’t work on Stealthed Thieves as nice as one might think they would, atleast in my experience, a good Thief easily knows how to work around it. I don’t know if it’s the same in WvW, but I can’t count how many times I’ve seen 1-2 people get ressed because of Shadow Refuge, when trying to cap a point, that becomes VERY annoying. It’s twice as good as Signet of Undeath simply because it’s on a shorter cooldown, and also helps any teammates that happen to walk through it.

There should be a direct counter to stealth, imo, but there isn’t.

Theory crafting is a complicated and expensive thing in WvW, I think it would be easiest to find someone with a viable 1v1 build then just tweak it.

(I theory craft ALOT in PvP, over 34+ builds for Necro alone.)

As I stated from my little talk with the developer, Necromancer would be good with an overhaul to conditions. We need more variety, possibly some special conditions that utilize effects like Dwayna’s Lament does.

Mighty Ice Arrow.9268:

Mate I can’t care less about your problems

Then why did you post here?

As for the guy above talking about me trolling… I merely posted the ‘poo’ question as a joke about Sylvari biology. To which I got very legitimate and interesting answers. Sylvari is the most interesting race in the game, I apologize if I like the lore.

I don’t want to get into the “Nerf Thief” aspect of WvW, since I’m not that familiar with it. However in PvP, I believe Thieves should not be able to condition remove or regen while stealthed. I also believe they should not be able to stealth downed players to res.

I handled a 3v1 earlier in WvW (1 upleveled Guardian, 1 Warrior, 1 Mesmer) in which I killed all of them (Except the Mesmer, he ran away at 5% health)… but I can’t handle a single thief…

It’s embarrassing to someone whom is proud to wear a Champion Phantom title in tPvP.

Ah well, I suppose WvW isn’t for me.

…

How… am I suppose to beat that?

and here I thought thieves/eles in tPvP were difficult fights… this just feels overwhelming
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Anyhow, you’re right about the Deathshroud, and don’t worry, I am not a dumb player, I’m always moving. Didn’t help me at all though.

Problem with that though, is that even the most idiotic player will know how to avoid a well, and keeping a thief in your well (even in tPvP) is incredibly hard. Unfortunately, my well seems to be the only tool I have for fighting a Thief at the moment.

I play a Thief in tPvP very well. Which is specifically why I had no idea how it was in stealth for so long.

Now my problem is that Necromancer takes a long time to build up a burst, revealed is not nearly long enough to capitalize on that.

By the way, since you’re such an enormous help and not at all an elitist **** Kstudios, let me reiterate: I am not calling for a nerf on Thieves, since I know too little about how they play in WvW to make that call. I am asking if there is a viable strategy to beating them as Necro in WvW, since it felt like I was at a disadvantage from the start.

Thanks Coinin, I suppose I’ll just rethink my build and strategy a bit for WvW.

As for LordKrall, don’t try to pretend I’m bad. I’ve fought and beaten Thieves that make the Thief I lost to look like a child mashing 2. The main problem is the high amounts of stealth, I’m not used to it. It felt like he was just running off to reset for 20 seconds. I couldn’t win it, every time I started to kill him, he’d run off and stealth then come back before I could leave the area with full health.

I’ve never encountered a Thief that could stealth seemingly forever before.

Yes I understand sPvP and the like are completely different, but I outmatched him in skill, he was making beginner’s mistakes with his Thief… he just.. was CONSTANTLY in stealth. I received backstab like 5 times.

Does anyone have any sort of strategy for fighting these things?

tl;dr – Thieves go to hell, someone tell me how to win as Necro.

I’m a tPvP player. I just spent FIVE minutes in WvW, and I now hate EVERY thief on the planet that even so much as THINKS of heartseeker or stealth. What the hell is this? Stealth every half second? Healing in stealth every half second? This is absolute nonsense.

Is there even a way for me as a Necro to beat these bad players without needing 4 people backing me up? Is it even possible? I would really like to know.

I wasn’t up leveled, and I had full exotic gear. My build is incredibly strong against thieves and generally all players in tPvP. But this… this was just stupid.

Then a Thief had the NERVE to say he was UP.

And now Sylvari are unattractive to me.

OMG Nerf Rangers! Birds are so OP!

Elementalist. Always Elementalist.

I’m not about to become the press, hopefully that way if I ever get a chance to talk to another developer ingame they won’t be like “Omg no” and give me absolute rehearsed answers.

They are surprisingly approachable, and one of the more notable things was that I stated “I feel like Necro doesn’t have enough variety in conditions” and the Dev agreed, so I don’t know if that will mean anything but hopefully it will. Bottom line, they understand the problems of Necro and Warriors.

That was a small tidbit of our convo, but I just feel more reassured and decided to try to pass along that feeling to you guys. Whether it will pay off or not, I don’t know.

I talked to a developer ingame today. Long story short, I feel better about where Necromancer will be.

I main Necro. Engineers are not countered by Necro.

lupercaleb.6041:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Boon#Skills_that_remove_boons

False. Engineers can add more boons than can be removed/converted. The fact that you posted that discredits you.

I would like to see Greatsword as a Vampiric weapon, with a teleport for distance closer.

I should make a TV series titled “Thieves say the darndest things”

• “oh i had sticky ikeys on” – Thief after stopping mid-heartseeker spam

• “ill kill their ele” – Thief on my team, shortly before dying a painful death

• “I hate spamming, that’s why I don’t use Heartseeker” – Thief after using Deathblossom over 9,000 times.

“i may be an idiot. but ur the moron” – random player in tPvP after I feared him off a cliff and he called me a hacker, so I called him an idiot.

“You fought us 5v4, why didn’t one of you just stay back for the match?” -random thief when he got outnumbered by us

“You lack honor” -random thief as I feared him to death with Necro Terror.

jportell.2197:

Is necro bottom of the barrel? No…. I think minion mancers are pretty darn powerful… not because of damage but because getting to them through their meat shields is a night mare and a half plus their minions have good cc and somewhat decent damage… Especially when traited…. One match had 2 full minion mancers bunker a side point… no group in our team could touch them… Doesn’t mean it needs nerfed… Just means they aren’t as low on the totem pole as people say.

The inability to beat Minionmancers generally stem from inability to strategize at beating them. If you’re going to try and go directly for the Necromancer himself, you’ll die.

Instead Flesh Golem → Blood Fiend → Shadowfiend/Fleshwurm/Bonefiend → Player

boom, easy.

We’re not as effective as you’d like to think.