Guild Wars 2

Slic.2406:

^ Yes, this is a great middle ground between the ‘content locusts’ (that want to feel like their time/grind spent should automatically make them superior) and the players that just want max statted gear forever (and not have to worry about re-grinding everything, like in EVERY. OTHER. MMO.).

Have ascended/legendary have the same stats as exotics, the same upgrade slots, PLUS the additional infuse slot for the new content. And have these infuse slots never, EVER, EVER have general stat bonuses like power, precision, crit damage, etc. Only agony resistance/duration reduction/etc. And boom, all of a sudden the progression locusts can have their progression, and it will not affect the rest of the game, such as WvW.

Not exactly what I stated, but yea pretty much.

pricer.5091:

What are people going to do if there is no gear progression, given the current content it will take about 3 runs of a dungeon to be utterly bored of it. Endgame at the moment is grinding Plinx and feeding the mystic forge…as I already have all the skins I like. So seriously, what am I missing that everyone seems so angry about? Unless there’s a reason to repeat the same content there’s no point repeating it, unless it is genuinely fun or challenging, which current dungeons aren’t. They would have to add new content every week to keep people interested if there were no gear progression.

I can even faceroll though Orr now…so don’t tell me to go exploring.

I’m looking forward to the new stuff so I can do something interesting for the first time inmany weeks.

Being bored with the dungeons means ANET failed to make them fun. Giving you more powerful gear for doing the dungeons doesn’t mean they suddenly become fun. It just gives you a reason to deal with the fact that they aren’t fun.

You should ask for new engaging content, not rehashed content with better gear that makes you toon more powerful. Why? Because GW2 was advertised as not having that kind of game play. If thats the type of game play you like and is the reason why you play MMOs, then you shouldn’t of bought GW2 in the first place.

Gabi.5264:

Xpiher.5209:

Gabi.5264:

You’re not concerned about the direction the game is heading, you just want some attention like the rest of you whiners.

Stop making these kind of posts and play for Christ’s sake, I’m pretty sure you and everyone else will enjoy new content.

Not if I have to grind more gear to experience new content. We have a game like that already, its called WOW

Looks to me like you have problems with just playing the game mate, noone is forcing you to play

No, I bought GW2 with the impression that all future content wouldn’t require me chasing after gear to participate in it. If I wanted that type of game play I would have bought one of the other 1000s of MMOs on the market. ANET advertised GW2 as not having that type of game play.

Jezath.7395:

The gap between exotic and legendary aquisition is by no means imaginary. I for one dident miss all the posts about legendarys and the RNG system.

Xipher we already have gated content in this game from release. You cannot aquire legendarys until you have explored 100% of the map including wvwvw areas even if your a pve player. You cannot do explore mode on a dungeon until you have done the story mode. Alot of players wont let you in there explore group unless you have done explore mode at least once before or in the case of arah also have decent gear like exotics.. Ok the last one isent really gated content but you catch my drift for sure.

1) Spell my name right
2) Gated content caused by the players is different.
3) Gated content isn’t necessarily a bad thing, if its tied to story progression or something else that easy to get around. Gated content becomes a problem when YOU HAVE TO HAVE A SET OF GEAR to even have a chance of completing the new content and when that set of gear COMES FROM PREVIOUS CONTENT couple with RNG (random drops). If its random, you will inevitably have grind.

Sco.9615:

I’ll answer your question the same way you guys spread your own information. I’ll take a single sentence and quote it not only out of context but without any supporting arguments. If you do not accept what I have to say at face value, then how, applying the same method, can I accept what you and everyone else says at face value?

Our Studio Design Director Chris Whiteside just posted this:
- “Our goal is not to create a gear treadmill.”

Bam, according to your own logic all your worries should now be gone.
Isn’t it a wonderful world : D

The issue with their answer is that ITS VAGUE.

Gabi.5264:

You’re not concerned about the direction the game is heading, you just want some attention like the rest of you whiners.

Stop making these kind of posts and play for Christ’s sake, I’m pretty sure you and everyone else will enjoy new content.

Not if I have to grind more gear to experience new content. We have a game like that already, its called WOW

Ok so here’s the way to please both the “I need more power” crowd and those who don’t like gear treadmills in 3 simple steps.

1) Remove the extra stats from Ascended gear or come out and say there won’t be any higher stats placed on gear in the future

2) Clearly state that, while Agony resist will make it easier to complete FOTM, it won’t have any bearing on future content

3) Make all future content have a progression system using the Ascended/Agony system, but make past upgrades worthless in the new content. What I mean by this is, Agony resistance obtained in FOTM is only good for that dungeon. New dungeons will require a different type of Agony resist that you get from said dungeon. This gives progression and power without gating content.

Pleases everyone and make lots of money. Do it now!

Chrissle.8690:

Cactus Brawler.7415:

They had the perfect end game, get your exotics of the right stats and then farm for looks, either through pvp, karma or dungeon runs. then if you ever changed your mind about your stats and roll, or just wanted a change in looks, do it again.

All they needed to do was keep releasing new skins with each content pass to give people something to run for, but no instead they are apparently buffing legendary’s to make them better than exotics, and adding a new set of better than exotic gear.

Perfect end game becomes yet another gear treadmill, well done.

There´s one flaw in your philosphy about only farming for looks though. Imagine a new dungeon coming out. Only new looks on the dungeon sets, not better stats. 50% of the player base likes the looks, 50% hate them. What incentive do the 50% that hate the looks of the new armor have to do the content? What ANet is trying to do is cater to all kinds of gamers, not just one kind. I´m not saying either way is better than the other but most of the posts I see in this thread is like this “waaah waaah mommy they are not doing what I want. How can they be so mean to me. I´m gonna quit this game and tell all my friends that they shouldnt play it anymore. Am I doing good mommy? waah waaah”. Kinda like that. Not all of you are like that but majority that I have read in this thread. =)

They can do this by using the new Agony system without adding more tiers or requiring past Agony buffs to do new future content. The problem is, ANET hasn’t stated if thats the case or not. They left room open to continue content gating and adding gear treadmills. It doesn’t matter how much time is between new gear and old gear, the fact that I need old gear to do new content that will be outdated in a new patch is why people are saying they are going to quit.

I want an answer to this. Just state there will be new tiers of gear added, or not. State if each new content will utilize its own “progression system” or not. Sectioning off progression to new content is the best of both worlds IMO. It means I don’t have to do the new content to get the best gear if I don’t like it, and if I like it will get easier for me the more I do it.

RLD.7439:

SWTOR launched without a dungeon finder and you see where that kind of failed thinking got them.

You don’t launch an MMO in 2012 without a LFG system. Especially when you know it’s going to be expected.

/boggle

I like not having a dungeon finder, it forces people to do some community building.

Pants.8315:

cherrie.8907:

xelynruk.6983:

The last paragraph is relevant to the “problem” in that this game is new and the direction in which is headed isn’t set in stone. No one really wants to chase after stats every three months. Anet has stated that a treadmill is not their intention. We won’t know the difference until they actually do.

While it’s fine to protest the periodic addition of gear tiers to the game, it’s not acceptable to refuse an update that may or may not set a precedent for future updates. We simply do not have enough information to judge Anet one way or another at this point, and proof by intimidation is not proof at all.

They were advertising a cherry flavoured bar with no peanut content.
But after we ordered our cherry bars, what we end up getting are peanut bars. Some people really can’t take peanuts, you know. And in some countries / areas what they’ve done is not only of doubtful moral quality, it’s illegal.

Yes they said the treadmill is not their intention, at the same time saying they will, with time, introduce more powerful items, just not every three months. Maybe every four or six. So yeah, they’ve already set a precedence for future gear updates.
They might want to name it whatever they want but it doesn’t change a single thing.

No they haven’t.

not ever three months…

How long has Guild Wars 2 been out…3 months!

Now look back at the sentence. They are saying, yes the game has been out 3 months and we are adding a new tier of gear to bridge a gap we left in original release, that doesn’t mean in another 3 months or more we aren’t going to be adding new tiers of gear.

They are effectively acknowledging that the game’s been out three months, but they aren’t setting a precedent by adding this set now. It’s a one time only deal.

It doesn’t say that. It leaves them room to change their mind either way. Ascended gear or requiring Ascended with the upgrades for new content is gear treadmill.

jibs.8463:

I still don’t understand why we need higher stats on the ascended gear. Isn’t it enough to have an ascended slot where you can put the new stuff to prevent Agony in?

I mean, a few more points of stats is not enough to appease those who want significant upgrades, and it really offends others who bought into the whole “no gear grind” that Anet was advertising.

This is a lose-lose situation for sure.

EXACTLY!!!

It might cause more gated content in the future. ANET needs give us a real answer or suffer the same fate as Funcom!

Sco.9615:

Okay, not this post but this one instead:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside/first#post721451

I’m seriously tired of seeing a hundred diff posts about “OMG the world is ending!!” because people cannot use parts of their brains.

The above linked post should be linked in a properly named sticky in this sub forum. Thank you.

Also, for those of you too lazy to go and read it, here’s the main point:

- “We will not be adding a new tier of gear every 3 months that we expect everyone to chase after and then get the next set and so on.”

Now go pet a fluffy kitten…
(and by that I mean calm down.)

That post didn’t answer anything! They need to say they are or aren’t anymore tiers of gear planned after Ascended, or if more gear is planned for new dungeons with different stats.

Ensio.8172:

Haralin.1473:

If you get an answer? What have you then? just an other promise they will breake

They haven’t broken their promise, not yet at least.

While I can understand why they would hesitate to make any clear cut statements given how the forums have reacted to the patch teasers they posted, they really need to explain the system so people will stop jumping to conclusions.

My thought exactly.

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

Dedalus.3065:

SiNoS.2147:

IceCold.5172:

I personally is looking forward to a new dungeon. And the new gear. Cant see what the fuzz is all about if people dont want to grind DONT do it. Stop kittening and whining like little kids lol.

The problem here is that someone with a full set of ascended will have quite higher stats. For example 1000+ hp, 5%+ crit chance, 30%+ crit damage. Those are examples but over all each piece will give you 8% more stats. When some items are over 100 stats already that 8% is massive in power boost. This is what people dont realize. In order to stay useful you will have to grind.

Well, the fact of the matter is that you can’t know that. I’m not saying that it’s impossible that we will have to grind, but I’m saying that it’s possible that we don’t have to grind. I mean everyone here says that GW2 is about enjoying the journey, playing for fun and all that. What if the recipes for the ascended gear will only require things you get from having fun playing the game? I mean exotic gear right now is pretty much grindy, and people expect a new gear tier to be more of the same. What if this new gear tier is the developers way of remedying for their mistakes with the grind involved in the acquisition of exotic gear?

There are multiple ways of approach to this new patch; either you assume the worst, assume the best, or you wait and see what the developers have in mind.

This new tier is being put in so gear grinders have something to grind. According to how they have covered it this new gear is going to take time. More so than exotic’s, and less than legendary’s in order to try to hold off the content locust. So by that we can assume its infact not easy to get this gear, and will infact be time consuming in order to grind it out.

They stated that the tier is between exotic’s and legendaries, correct. But you must remember that there’s a big difference in the acquisition of legendaries and exotics. For legendaries, you need to grind every part of the game. For exotics, you need to grind one part of the game. Their goal could very well be to eliminate the grind that exotics require by spreading it out across all aspects of the game (like legendaries).

Which forces me to grind content i do not want to do. Any way you look at it is a massive time sink into content you may not like. I have dabbled in about everything out there. I personally do have area’s i will not touch ever again. If it forces me into these area’s i will leave. Thing is im not alown here. A large core of players will do the same thing.

But the main selling point of GW2 end game was that the entire game was the end game. Isn’t it logical then that the rewards for experiencing the end game covers all of it? And I know that you will say that the reward for experiencing the end game is fun, but the previous reward was actually exotic gear, but the acquisition of exotic gear is flawed since it didn’t cover the entire end game. And I have to ask another thing, is doing a dungeon once considered grinding?

Actually the main selling points was no gear grind. Top end gear available from every area of the game. You could do any part of the game but were not forced into any part of it. It was always known that highest stat gear would be easy to get as thats not the reward. The reward was the hard to get skins. Frankly hard to get skins are still exactly that. Thats why not everyone is in t3 culture gear and wielding legendary’s.

This, but we need a real answer to the question: is ascended gear the final tier?

rikuharada.3152:

Gabi.5264:

How about you stop starting new threads to complain and play the game instead?

No point in playing it when you know that everything you do (except for legendary goal) will be pointless and obsolete. I was actually working of my goal of getting tier 3 cultural armor and doing CoF for tokens……….but guess wut, now all my motivation are gone because I know that the reward I’m getting will not be the “end gear” in term of power.

Unless Ascended is the final tier (stat wise) and the dungeon armor is adjusted accordingly. But the answer they gave us doesn’t really answer anything. So we can only assume that they’ll add future tiers, which could be wrong!

Please answer the question anet

I just read Chris Whiteside response to all the complaints. It didn’t answer the main question. It doesn’t matter how many months is in between. What matters how you will
We are also working on other reward and progression systems for the game that tie into current and new content and features
.
incorporate that quote into the game. If you continue to add tiers of gear between ascended and legendaries you introduce gear grind treadmill. If Ascended is now the top level gear, and you don’t add anymore sets, people will believe you are keeping to your principals and will continue to support you. So we need an answer: Is Ascended Gear the end of introducing new tiers of gear into the game? Without answering this question, one way or the other, you aren’t pleasing anyone: those that love gear grind treadmill or those who want you to stick to your philosophy. If you answer it now, regardless of how the answer is, you will be saving yourself from a headache latter by avoiding a Funcom fiasco.
============
PS: I’m sure most would agree that adding in further progression into the game isn’t a bad thing. Many would welcome more skills to unlock, and new story content that ensures access to future content. You wouldn’t be losing anyone if you did character progression a different way.
I also believe that if you used the ascended/agony system by just adding in new “runes” that allows you an easier time in future dungeons, people complaining about vertical progression and gear grind treadmill will be appeased as well, while those who like gear treadmills will be appeased by feeling more powerful in new dungeons that offer better rewards. The reason why I believe this is acceptable is because you aren’t gating content this way. You simply add progression to the dungeons, people won’t have to do FOTM to get have a chance in a new dungeon, they will have to do that dungeon more to have an easier time at it.

Chamone.6890:

I agree. We were told Exotic was the top tier, spent all our time and money getting Exotics, now we have to do it all again.

I will let them off once, but if anything comes along after Ascended I will immediately stop playing forever.

If they plan to add something after Ascended, tell me now so I can stop playing now and save myself the time.

Not only this, but if people play on the assumption that they were right, and it turns out they were wrong, you’ll have a bigger issue than losing a few 100 players. You’ll lose 1000s and have a bad reputation FOREVER!

Don’t pull a Funcom ANET, just don’t

mordred.4609:

this may prove to be a very fatal error on their part. ALOT of people came to this game from WoW to get away from the grind (myself included)

so let’s see,stay here and grind from scratch OR go back to WoW and grind on toons i have been invested in for YEARS.

people are invested in their WoW toons, they still have friends/guilds there. if you make them choose between grinding here or back with Blizzard, i’d bet this game will go down in flames.

How many games have tried to be WoW and died for it? This one will be no different.

THIS!!!

Haralin.1473:

If you get an answer? What have you then? just an other promise they will breake

They haven’t broken the promise yet. They break it if they use gear as a means of character progression and content delivery MORE.

But the issue isn’t whether or not I will believe them. Its that having a clear answer, not the crap they posted, will save them headache later because people are assuming it going one way or the other. If they stay on that assumption, and their assumption is wrong then ANET will be in bigger trouble. It will be just like what Funcom did.

Don’t pull a Funcom ANET just dont.

ANET needs to clarify their stance further. If you agree, sign the petition by clicking on the link in my sig

ANET needs to clarify if ascended gear is the final gear tier (stat wise) and if Agony resistance attained from FOTM will be required to successfully do any future content. If you agree click on the link in my sig

Ensio.8172:

This is assuming I understood what Anet is saying correctly, and I guess we won’t know for sure until we see the new system and mechanics in action.

Which is why we need a direct answer to the question: Is ascended gear the final tier of gear stat wise and will future content rely on rewards from previous content to even hope of completing.

wookie slayer.4259:

I like power creep as it makes my dude more powerful and progesses my dude i dont see whats wrong with new content giving more power I like vertical progression. This skins only stuff has lead to dungeons and end game being no exhistant and pointless.

Why did you buy GW2 then? ANET said there wasn’t going to be Power creep. Its people like you that whined about not having it why people in the majority of the community are flooding the forums with “WTH is this crap!?”

wookie slayer.4259:

I miss gear treadmills I alwasy liked chasing more powerful items by doing new content its what I do in mmo’s, and I have a blast doing it.

Right now im sitting in lions arch with my favorite skins and exotics at about 150 hrs played and never log on anymore.

The issue is that GW2 wasn’t designed for you! Why did you buy the game when you knew and were told, directly by AV, that they wouldn’t be using that type of game play. kitten /p>

Healix.5819:

If you look at it from the long run, there will always be a gear treadmill. One day, the level cap will increase (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLHfq2lJY5A&t=58m35s) and everything will start all over again.
.

You can add levels without adding more gear. You can add character progression without adding levels or gear. Look at GW1

Its harder for them to corner the market since all servers share the same TP. But you shouldn’t hate them because of this. It called playing the MARKET and it should be a viable play style.

Rojaha.4082:

The real answer is likely: If this ascended/infusion/agony thing turns out to be a mess and hurts the game financially or causes a noticeable drop in players (losing more due to this, than those lost for lack of it), then they won’t add any more content like it. However, if this is successful, or doesn’t negatively impact the game in a negative way, we’ll likely see all new content follow this route, in which each dungeon has a unique scaling debuff, and you have to obtain more and more resistance gear specific to that dungeon to progress in it – and possibly other different/new implementations of progression/rewards.

So… vote with your time and/or money. If you hate the new content, stop buying things, or take it a step further and stop playing. If you like it, then buy gems and play the new content. They don’t only care about gems, but people actively populating their game as well (noticeable drops in population make a community/game seem weak, and thus those who DO spend money are less likely to invest).

They need to give a decisive answer because they were wishy washy, and didn’t appease either crowd with the one they gave. All I really want to know: Is ascended the final tier, and will the Agony resist be required for future content or will each future content have it own resist mechanic utilized by the “Agony system.” Answering that question clearly will save them headache, because if some stay under one assumption or the other, and then they are wrong, people will be even more pissed than they are now. Don’t pull a Funcom ANET just don’t do it.

Latinkuro.9420:

What I can see happening is them introducing new dungeons with other types of conditions, for which you will need new infusions on your ascended armor making ascended gear viable w/o adding a power creep / gear grind ladder at all.

This would be fine. But if you need previous gear to do the new dungeons (whether armor or Agony resist) then its gear treadmill. Its also gear treadmilll if they add new gear, self containing or not. The only way this avoids being treadmill is if Ascended gear is the last set of gear and new content uses self containing “runes” to make that content easier while not requiring previous “runes”

Edit:

Rojaha.4082:

So you’re saying I should be happy that I have to buy on the TP or grind in-dungeons for a new type of resistance gear every time I want to do a new dungeon?

No, its all about entry level. If Ascended is the last level of gear and you don’t need previous versions of Agony resist to do new content, then its not gated content, nor is gear treadmill. As long as the Agony aspect of the game is used in a way that makes new dungeons easier, and each new content has it own, then its not gear really treadmill in the sense that people hate, which is each new content replaces old content that YOU HAVE TO DO to do the new content. With self contained resistances, old content is replaced may be replaced by new content, but you don’t have to do the old content to even have a chance at the old (assuming Ascended gear can be crafted or it drops in the new content)

Kathmandu.2417:

Haette.2701:

Seriously, I just want a straight answer. If they say there’s more coming in the future, I can quit while I’m ahead.

If they say this is it, no more stat bumps ever, I can deal with one tier. It honestly seems like something that got cut right before release anyway. And then if they do add more down the road, I know their true colors and can get out as soon as news breaks.

Would you trust someone who lied to you once? About the same topic, actually?

This is the main problem here.

I don’t trust their “its not our intention line.” I would trust them with a concrete answer. Until they give it, I have no desire to play their game or continuing buying $20-$40 worth of gems a month (I’m a gambler).

camoflaugz.5031:

Yep keep it coming. Real MMO players play MMO’s for character progression and for the social aspect, that doesn’t mean your hardcore that means your playing the genre for what it is. Dont hold back because some of these people want a single player game MMO’s dont handicap players, it keeps going and going. As long as you implement progression in a fun way of doing things there should never be a problem.

The issue is this game was sold as NOT HAVING GEAR GRIND TREADMILL. ANET was oringially founded by WoW developers WHO HATED THE IDEA OF GEAR GRIND PROGRESSION!

Snow.5269:

I have to agree that the “official response” didn’t do anything for me. I want a concrete answer. Why are we changing one of the founding principles of the game in the first content update to appease a crowd that will never be satisfied. It shows a lack of confidence in a vision the developers have been creating for 5+ years as well as breaking the trust of the fanbase.

You will never satisfy the gear treadmill/power creep crowd. Ever. As soon as they acquire the new loot, they will once again claim there is no endgame which the developers will respond to by adding more loot with better stats & it will never end.

EXACTLY!! Interesting note: The thread was deleted by one mod, and restored by another with a different title. LOL (please don’t delete because I’m pointing out what happened)

Jabberwock.9014:

PvE and PvP don’t intersect you say? Then what the hell is WvW? I could care less what my gear is in actual PvE because I just use all MF gear anyways. In WvW though I should be able to have the same playstyle while roaming that I have in sPvP.

ANET never said that WvW and PvE don’t intersect. The entire reason why WvW exist is for PvE people to casually PvP while rewarding them with PvE bonuses. If you want a customized set of armor, get it crafted. Yes, I realize you can’t get it FULLY customized, but its alot more customizeable than if you got the gear as a world drop.

Sylv.5324:

The dungeon gear was mostly for its looks, not its stats, anyway, so I don’t see why they’d become obsolete.

You customized your armor stats by crafting exotic level armor. You did dungeons for the looks, because most people already have specialized sets of armor. Now they have to get new specialized sets of armor.

It becomes gear grind treadmill if new armor sets are added to do new dungeons, or if the slotted item is required to do new dungeon with any chance at all which will also drop stronger version of it.

The only way this avoids being a gear grind treadmill is if new content doesn’t rely on the same buffs from the FoTM (get it, flavor of the month :bang: ) system and new content doesn’t require new gear content related gear to have a chance of doing, in other words if Ascended armor is the last type of armor they add to the game. The new content can require a new type of Agony upgrade to put in the Ascended gear to do it easier though, as long as it doens’t require the current planned buffs to be even doable.

I just read Chris Whiteside response to all the complaints. It didn’t answer the main question. It doesn’t matter how many months is in between. What matters how you will

We are also working on other reward and progression systems for the game that tie into current and new content and features

.

incorporate that quote into the game. If you continue to add tiers of gear between ascended and legendaries you introduce gear grind treadmill. If Ascended is now the top level gear, and you don’t add anymore sets, people will believe you are keeping to your principals and will continue to support you. So we need an answer: Is Ascended Gear the end of introducing new tiers of gear into the game? Without answering this question, one way or the other, you aren’t pleasing anyone: those that love gear grind treadmill or those who want you to stick to your philosophy. If you answer it now, regardless of how the answer is, you will be saving yourself from a headache latter by avoiding a Funcom fiasco.

============================================================

PS: I’m sure most would agree that adding in further progression into the game isn’t a bad thing. Many would welcome more skills to unlock, and new story content that ensures access to future content. You wouldn’t be losing anyone if you did character progression a different way.

I also believe that if you used the ascended/agony system by just adding in new “runes” that allows you an easier time in future dungeons, people complaining about vertical progression and gear grind treadmill will be appeased as well, while those who like gear treadmills will be appeased by feeling more powerful in new dungeons that offer better rewards. The reason why I believe this is acceptable is because you aren’t gating content this way. You simply add progression to the dungeons, people won’t have to do FOTM to get have a chance in a new dungeon, they will have to do that dungeon more to have an easier time at it.

Jestunhi.7429:

coleman.2095:

I’m okay with this added tier if this is the only time they do it. I’m not okay if they keep adding tiers and increasing legendaries each time to the top tier.

What this is going to boil down to for me is that I’m excusing this ridiculousness for now. But as soon as they add another tier, I’m gone. Not that it matters to them, they have my money…

Why would they just do it once? What would it achieve?

Getting the gear grinders to start playing again for a short period while they get the new tier and then quit again?

That would solve nothing. They need to do it all the time or not at all. They need to decide if they want to aim the game at gear grinders or non grinders. Because it’s impossible to please both.

They could add it once and add in other things to grind that give power in different dungeons. They said they are going to add in other types of Agony. Its possible that Ascended gear is the final tier, but new types of Agony will be released coupled with new legendarys.

But I like WvW and want to be competitive in it. To do that I now need to get a new type of gear (assuming you can put sigils or other bonuses in them) and if I like PvE dungeon content I’ll need to have to grind that new gear to do future content to just grind new gear again.

I’m simply tired of that crappy system.

Hrafn.7638:

cherrie.8907:

blablabal more blababal

The thing that people like you dont understand is that reality isnt some kind of fixed version of your dreamworld, it changes. (also called “Adaptation”)The manifesto was a guidline and not some kind of 10 Commandments. They saw that their approach didnt went so well, e.g. people left/complained a lot about having nothing to do and so they changed their approach.

How was it not doing well? Millions sold, already turned a profit, and many people spent as much, if not more, than they would by playing a sub game. Hell, the cosmetic types probably spent a couple $100 already.

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

JJGlyph.9746:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

Its no different than Raid gear progression in every single MMO game in existence.

how do you know if you haven’t tried it?

This is the same argument ppl used for months about events being zergs & too much special FX flash. You don’t need to try it to know. They have provided the details. Wow, some people…

they have not provided all of the details, especially about the armor, what effect the varieties of infusions do, etc.

so we can’t just jump to conclusions here

As someone mentioned, if the armor is only good in that dungeon and “worthless” every where else, then its not taking away from the over all philosophy of the game. Of course, this isn’t likely the case because ANET decided to give the armor better stats on top of a special ability.

well, we won’t know for sure until they release them but according to what we know, the better stats are there to compensate for the fact that the gear has no upgrade slots for runes or sigils

If this is the case then the system isn’t that bad because the gear is simply a different flavor of exotic and useless in PvP. But it still doesn’t boad well simply because they are trying content to gear progression and visa versa.

They said they are slowing adding more ascended gear in future patches and will continue to add mechanics like this in the future.

Djavlas.8249:

Vasham.2408:

Djavlas.8249:

so for it to not be gear gating:

I could hop in the instance, at a relatively high lvl of difficulty, with all my current exotics and be at zero disadvantage?

Basically yes. Eventually you’ll reach a point after so many clears were the scaling difficulty will overwhelm you. That’s going to happen with or without ascended gear. But when it comes to the content within the dungeons: the sub-dungeons, the bosses, the loot, you’ll be able to see and get all of that.

Thanks! that’s what i was looking for. (not like that other reply lol)

now if they just get rid of the base stat increase ill be all peachy

This. Its the base stat increases that people are complaining about. Dungeons having their own armor and mechanic isn’t detracting from horizontal progression. What detracts from it is when new armor instantly makes old armor inferior everywhere.

If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

It doesn’t matter how often they drop. They are now the best items in the game for that specif type by simple virtue of having better stats. They could drop from every mob you fight and it wouldn’t matter (we know they don’t since they are rare than exotics which means gear grind treadmill more), the fact is Horizontal progression no longer exist.

fellyn.5083:

Nar.8327:

fellyn.5083:

Nar.8327:

fellyn.5083:

I don’t see how anyone can hate them when we don’t even know exactly how it’s going to work.

Drama queens.

P.S. No where did Anet ever say exotics would be the final tier of armor. People just assumed that. The only clarification they need to address if they will be making more tiers of higher powered armor in the future.

https://d2vn94glaxzkz3.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Ascended-EN.png

This image shows us everything we need to know to be concerned.

So? All that shows is a ring that is slightly better than an exotic. Perhaps you should go back and reread what I said.

Here are the facts: that ring is statistically superior to ANY ring in the game at the current time with that specific stat combination. It doesn’t matter by how much, what matters is that any ring you might have obtained in the last three months will not be as powerful as the rings from this new update.

What it means is that, anyone who walked away from the game before this update, for any reason, will return after the update to find that their gear is no longer the best. What concerns us as players is not this individual item, but the precedent it sets, where each update’s items are slightly more powerful. In the industry, this is called “power creep.” If you don’t keep playing, you’ll be left behind.

Many of us have played many MMOs, and we feel that we were lead here under the pretense that we would be given a game where we would not have to put up with this again. And for three months, we thought we were right – until tonight – hence why so many people are up in arms.

And? You don’t know how it’s actually going to work. You’re basing all this on a small article that leaves a lot to the imagination and speculation and people are completely over reacting at this point.

Wait until further explanation or for the actual update to see how it works before getting all worked up.

And? He stated why he doesn’t like it. It doesn’t leave any speculation on his over all point, which is that exotics for rings are no longer the best items. ANET shouldn’t have given these items better stats, just that nifty mechanic. They could of also given PvEers items that are good against a new mob type, that are just as good as exotics in every other way, but needed to kill the new mob type.

ANET went back on horizontal progression. Thats all people need to know.

impoc.1795:

JJGlyph.9746:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

Its no different than Raid gear progression in every single MMO game in existence.

how do you know if you haven’t tried it?

This is the same argument ppl used for months about events being zergs & too much special FX flash. You don’t need to try it to know. They have provided the details. Wow, some people…

they have not provided all of the details, especially about the armor, what effect the varieties of infusions do, etc.

so we can’t just jump to conclusions here

As someone mentioned, if the armor is only good in that dungeon and “worthless” every where else, then its not taking away from the over all philosophy of the game. Of course, this isn’t likely the case because ANET decided to give the armor better stats on top of a special ability.

GW1 didn’t thrive on people going around capping skills. It thrived on the PvP meta game that ANET constantly changed through “balancing” to keep it fresh. The PvE in GW1 was decent enough to keep enough people playing and buy character slots, bank slots, etc to keep the game getting revenue until the E-sport players came back with the introduction of new classes and skills.

GW2, while not taking the same model, was easily thriving off of what it had. People buying the game and quitting after a few months was in the game best interest and part of ANET’s business model. The cash shop was/is perfect for revenue generation during holiday/special events and random pick-me-ups (bank slots etc). Gear grind progression wasn’t needed to keep the game generating revenue. Its the reason why people are tiring of MMOs and play them like single player games (beat them and quit). GW2 was different in that ANET KNOWS THIS IS THE CASE and designed the game in a way that allows people to do that, but come back to experience new content at will. With the agony system, this isn’t possible if it become a staple for future end game content unless each new “dungeon” get its own armor system which actually would be kinda cool

Note: The below is only applicable if the gear is good outside of the fractal instance. If, as someone mentioned, you can’t also put in sigils then the gear is ok because its limited to that particular dungeon. It linear progression for a specif dungeon, not the entire game.

If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hope you are happy.

impoc.1795:

Xpiher.5209:

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

you have already tried the new GW2 content?

Its no different than Raid gear progression in every single MMO game in existence.

That said, the sting will be taken out if, as someone had mentioned, the gear is only useful in that dungeon due to not having sig slots.

Payback.4526:

Well, I hope u will not be angry when u realize that the new gear will only be best in slot for the new dungeon and not for WvW or other PVE Content because u dont get Sigils/Runes.

No, that will make things slightly better and I hadn’t thought of that. Assuming thats the case

I have tired it. Every other MMO has crapy gear grind progression. Now so does GW2. I don’t like it.
If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.

Bornthisway.4609:

This is all true, as I said in my thread. Some players want to achieve and move forward. If you don’t, no one is forcing you.

That would be the case if the gear didn’t also come with BETTER STATS and ANET plans on allowing players TO HAVE A FULL SET and build content around HAVING BETTER STATS. It completely changes how end game is done. Now it will be GLF players with 5 pieces of Agony gear. PvP becomes more IMBA as well.

ANET could have easily added more content, like Agony, that didn’t require gear grind but character progression. Character progression isn’t random chance drops, is permanent, and doesn’t distract from their philosophy. Doing the fractal dungeon could have made your character gain ascended levels that allow you to devele deeper into the dungeon and uncover mysteries never seen before while dropping Legendary crafting material like candy or gave you rare boss skins like the deep did in GW1.

If I wanted to buy a gear grind tread mill game I wouldn’t of bought GW2. Now, if ANET plans on keeping this POS system that is reason why MMOs are stale (GW2 was actually a breath of fresh air) I won’t bother playing the game, picking it back up when new expansion come out, or spending another dime in the gem store (and I’ve already spent $200+). You will lose us ANET, and we would have been the people to keep your profitable for years just like GW1. Now you have catered to the fickle MMO crowd who will eat up your content and quit when the next shiny kitten is released. Hop you are happy.