Guild Wars 2

I don’t entirely agree Cyninja, you should always take moa on escort for the wargs….

Joking aside I usually take GW for sloth as we don’t lack the CC mostly and it’s useful to throw on slublings near the end to give you some respite when people don’t rotate as quick as they should and some go down.

I also sometimes use it on gorseval for the adds so they get constantly CC’d when pulled in. Your reasons are not wrong just saying I sometimes take GW for add control as we have a few people in my group who seem to always be in the wrong place getting hit by a lot of that stuff.

PierPiero.9142:

apharma.3741:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

apharma.3741:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Well what other defence does a thief have apart from its mobilty? Everyone knows if they stand still for a second vs a compitent player they will take a huge dent. It’s alright for you lot to hide behind passive anti cc raits/passive dmg midigation/invuls/blocks but when a thief is forced of a point or a fight the only thing they have is to port away, that’s a big no no.

See its funny you mention this, was roaming earlier today on my D/D ele and 2 thieves jumped me from stealth, 10k BS each, instant down. Had I had an auto cast immunity or passive damage reduction (fire, water arcana) then I’d be fine but the 1st hit took me below 50% and the 2nd hit killed me before anything could proc.

What’s the point of this story about an unrelated game mode? Well it’s that these traits are being taken in some way because you can be 100-0 by a stealth attack from 2 classes even in PvP where there’s not really a survival amulet anymore. You can have a thief +1 and down you before you even know it’s there for a lot of players, you can even see it on a lot of streams.

Thief is OP within its role, there’s nothing that can catch it and it takes a dump on quite a lot of classes that can compete in the role.

Now I’m sure someone will bring up ele being OP in PvP, it is within its role. Someone will probably mention about D/D ele not being meta in the example but it’s the best roaming build it has with cele, crusader, commander and marauder mix. The point is a lot of classes are far too strong in their roles but this is very noticeable with thief at the moment.

If you tool 10k each on an ele then, kitten them 2 must of been very glassy and built just to do that (assuming you are the avg semi tanky ele 2600 armor and above) I very rarly get that hard on my thief. It’s fine for 2 gun flame warriors to do the same thing? Or 2 mesmers ect ect. Actually I have been 1 shotted by a single mesmer.

Anyway back on topic. Yes anyone class that gets focused by at least 2 people should fall fast if they have no defences up, the fact is though thief dosnt have any of them to take take in the first place, I mean ok sure they could go and trait for acro. Weakness alone shuts down thief endurance which is their main defensive point, right? Weakness dosnt stop other people’s defences at all.

Not gonna deny locking a thief down, but tbh they could run before hot anyway, it’s just a lot easier now with dash.

The point wasn’t that you die to 2 people the problem is it can be done from stealth from a long distance away and that there’s no indication you’re going to take that 10k bs. This is in some ways and reasons why people are taking passive proc traits like an invuln or damage reduction on first hit. We’d be having the same discussion about power shatter mesmer if it was anywhere near reasonable but like many other classes thief shuts it out almost completely taking a giant dump on it.

You will see 2 gunflame warriors coming, you will see most other classes coming, you don’t see thieves and mesmers coming. Weakness works just as well on other classes, thief doesn’t suddenly lose a dodge because they have weakness nor is their regen affected too much unless you have vigor/acro as they have traits that give a flat amount of endurance back. That’s without mentioning there’s not many classes that have easy access to weakness with only necro and druid being the ones I mostly see. Poison shuts down war regen and healing, chill completely screws over ele to a far bigger extent than weakness on thief but you don’t see them bringing it up all the time.

Edit: just so someone else doesn’t read this and misquote, read what I put before, I put thief is OP within its role not that it is OP as a whole. This is me explaining thief is in some part the cause of people taking these passive traits.

Mesmer meta has not access to stealth and mesmer stealth’s access is not as good as thief ones …

I was talking about power shatter if it was good not current meta mesmer as power shatter is what competes with thief in its role but is shut down hard by thief atm. Bolded the part that’s relevant.

Offair.2563:

adozu.6398:

rune wise: legendary armor is in the 2k-3k gold ballpark. if you buy 2k gold worth of runes you bet you can swap them often enough. so huh?

How many ascended sets would i get for 2-3k gold with even better skins?

Purely crafting you are looking anything from 250-350g (so 9-10sets) but there’s ways to reduce the cost like with doing fractals and getting the pages and crafting the mark for about 15g.

There’s also the aspect of being able to stat swap so you could craft a few sets of armour and stat swap them when you settle on a new build that you test with exotics first. The difference between exotic and ascended is a couple of percent, less than 5 I know but not the exact figure, either way it won’t make a big difference in WvW. When you factor that in how much exotic/ascended armour and rune combos could you try with 2-3k gold?

Fat Disgrace.4275:

apharma.3741:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Well what other defence does a thief have apart from its mobilty? Everyone knows if they stand still for a second vs a compitent player they will take a huge dent. It’s alright for you lot to hide behind passive anti cc raits/passive dmg midigation/invuls/blocks but when a thief is forced of a point or a fight the only thing they have is to port away, that’s a big no no.

See its funny you mention this, was roaming earlier today on my D/D ele and 2 thieves jumped me from stealth, 10k BS each, instant down. Had I had an auto cast immunity or passive damage reduction (fire, water arcana) then I’d be fine but the 1st hit took me below 50% and the 2nd hit killed me before anything could proc.

What’s the point of this story about an unrelated game mode? Well it’s that these traits are being taken in some way because you can be 100-0 by a stealth attack from 2 classes even in PvP where there’s not really a survival amulet anymore. You can have a thief +1 and down you before you even know it’s there for a lot of players, you can even see it on a lot of streams.

Thief is OP within its role, there’s nothing that can catch it and it takes a dump on quite a lot of classes that can compete in the role.

Now I’m sure someone will bring up ele being OP in PvP, it is within its role. Someone will probably mention about D/D ele not being meta in the example but it’s the best roaming build it has with cele, crusader, commander and marauder mix. The point is a lot of classes are far too strong in their roles but this is very noticeable with thief at the moment.

If you tool 10k each on an ele then, kitten them 2 must of been very glassy and built just to do that (assuming you are the avg semi tanky ele 2600 armor and above) I very rarly get that hard on my thief. It’s fine for 2 gun flame warriors to do the same thing? Or 2 mesmers ect ect. Actually I have been 1 shotted by a single mesmer.

Anyway back on topic. Yes anyone class that gets focused by at least 2 people should fall fast if they have no defences up, the fact is though thief dosnt have any of them to take take in the first place, I mean ok sure they could go and trait for acro. Weakness alone shuts down thief endurance which is their main defensive point, right? Weakness dosnt stop other people’s defences at all.

Not gonna deny locking a thief down, but tbh they could run before hot anyway, it’s just a lot easier now with dash.

The point wasn’t that you die to 2 people the problem is it can be done from stealth from a long distance away and that there’s no indication you’re going to take that 10k bs. This is in some ways and reasons why people are taking passive proc traits like an invuln or damage reduction on first hit. We’d be having the same discussion about power shatter mesmer if it was anywhere near reasonable but like many other classes thief shuts it out almost completely taking a giant dump on it.

You will see 2 gunflame warriors coming, you will see most other classes coming, you don’t see thieves and mesmers coming. Weakness works just as well on other classes, thief doesn’t suddenly lose a dodge because they have weakness nor is their regen affected too much unless you have vigor/acro as they have traits that give a flat amount of endurance back. That’s without mentioning there’s not many classes that have easy access to weakness with only necro and druid being the ones I mostly see. Poison shuts down war regen and healing, chill completely screws over ele to a far bigger extent than weakness on thief but you don’t see them bringing it up all the time.

Edit: just so someone else doesn’t read this and misquote, read what I put before, I put thief is OP within its role not that it is OP as a whole. This is me explaining thief is in some part the cause of people taking these passive traits.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Well what other defence does a thief have apart from its mobilty? Everyone knows if they stand still for a second vs a compitent player they will take a huge dent. It’s alright for you lot to hide behind passive anti cc raits/passive dmg midigation/invuls/blocks but when a thief is forced of a point or a fight the only thing they have is to port away, that’s a big no no.

See its funny you mention this, was roaming earlier today on my D/D ele and 2 thieves jumped me from stealth, 10k BS each, instant down. Had I had an auto cast immunity or passive damage reduction (fire, water arcana) then I’d be fine but the 1st hit took me below 50% and the 2nd hit killed me before anything could proc.

What’s the point of this story about an unrelated game mode? Well it’s that these traits are being taken in some way because you can be 100-0 by a stealth attack from 2 classes even in PvP where there’s not really a survival amulet anymore. You can have a thief +1 and down you before you even know it’s there for a lot of players, you can even see it on a lot of streams.

Thief is OP within its role, there’s nothing that can catch it and it takes a dump on quite a lot of classes that can compete in the role.

Now I’m sure someone will bring up ele being OP in PvP, it is within its role. Someone will probably mention about D/D ele not being meta in the example but it’s the best roaming build it has with cele, crusader, commander and marauder mix. The point is a lot of classes are far too strong in their roles but this is very noticeable with thief at the moment.

Cynz.9437:

apharma.3741:

I dunno, we already have titles for CMs and other challenges for the raid wings so I honestly don’t think we need it.

I would however support a title for owning every legendary in the game, with the title being simple and to the point: Legendary.

Titles can be bought since it is one time thing. Highly doubt someone bought 150+ boss kills though.

I know someone currently buying quite a lot of the LIs, sirbauermiester or what his name was is planning to buy a significant proportion of his legendary armour. You can buy your achievements and do the easier bosses for LI’s, if you can do 3 bosses without having to buy that’s 50 weeks for a set of armour.

Assuming you can kill VG since Jan 2016 that’s 66 LI’s alone, wing 2 came out in the same month and you could do trio for another 50 at least. Wing 3 having come out June 2016 which has the easiest event to do for another 47 LI’s possible since then. That’s without mentioning the DPS golems in the 4th wing allowing for easier access to LI’s

I just don’t think we need a title for making it as we will have the armour on our main characters and the skins unlocked which is enough for me.

I dunno, we already have titles for CMs and other challenges for the raid wings so I honestly don’t think we need it.

I would however support a title for owning every legendary in the game, with the title being simple and to the point: Legendary.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Feanor.2358:

You’re doing the sensible thing by the way – you’re raiding to get it. It’s not that ANet thinks only raiders “deserve” this QoL you’re talking about, it’s that ANet thinks this gives more players the incentive to raid. Which, in your case, turns out to be correct.

What do you think will happen after I get it tho? I’ve seen what coercing ppl where they do not want ended-up doing.

You will either keep raiding, stop raiding or raid occasionally. For those that enjoyed their time they will keep doing it, maybe make more armour, enjoy getting other collectibles. Those that hated every minute of it will finally gtfo and hopefully stop complaining about being forced to do something entirely optional. Those that had ups and downs will probably poke their noses into raids when new wings come out and maybe kill a few bosses with friends every now and then.

Thing is I don’t know many people that haven’t tried to raid, I even know WvW players that have had a hard time but have slowly improved over months to a point where they are getting a few kills a week easily. They just lack that little extra to get full clears.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

apharma.3741:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Choppy.4183:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Warriors can build tanky as hell along with going mace sheild/gs. Met a warrior last night who was probably 3k armour in marurder gear mace sheild durabilty runes. I was s/d thief at the time and my aa’s critting at 1500 dmg and non crits were 740 per hit. He can regeneration that just by afking. Ofc after a few stance rotations I admitted defeat, went out of combat and went d/p and even that took a bit more time then it should.

This is the stats I was using – http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAsYl0MhSnY5TwwJw/ELwEmXa4M0Gm7gnwWoWCIAsbA-TlSBQBJUtCsoMgI7PkRlY5TPQXUa8gHAwiUCSJVVAwJA4dwBwW1KAO7szO7szaAt26szOrUACq1C-w

The trick to beating that is not letting him land a burst. So either get in and get out before he can land a headbutt followed by a burst, or just range him with your shortbow.

I know it seems stupid, but if you keep him at range you’ll cut his healing by 2/3 because he won’t have Adrenal Health going. Adding poison to the mix will drop another 1/3 from his remaining healing for as long as it’s on him and resistance isn’t up.

When he’s reflecting your shortbow back at you, just focus on keeping distance until his block is up. Also, if you notice him getting a heal whenever he breaks a stun, stop cc’ing him altogether.

You can’t pull off the above in pvp, but you can in Wvw.

I am fully aware how to beat them but the regen was with out t3 heal because as s/d thief the build and play style relys on constant Presure with aa/flanking strike and postioning. Double endura pain/sheild and mace block was enough time to stop dmg to regen with out using a burst. Ofc it was a different story when I went and changed to d/p

Lets be honest though, you are comparing the best build a warrior can run vs a much less effective build a thief can run. Even staff thief would be a better pick than S/D as vault has inbuilt evades and does way more damage than flanking strike as well as having access to the all important blinds.

that is kinda my point. some builds are just inferior to others vs the same class and i think this is half the trouble, not so much broken mechanics but some builds just work and some do not work at all vs certain class’/builds.

Yeah that’s what HoT did, it dialed up that difference in builds and styles up to 11. One of the biggest issues imo is the presence of apex builds where nothing comes close to offering what they do in that mode or doing what they do, this is shown by guardians, warriors and a lesser extent thief because thief has no place in a zerg.

Anyway I think stealth and high mobility regardless of class is broken, one or the other is fine but both together especially when it can be used frequently is broken as shown by the original celestial shadow and 10s CA. I also think low investment sustain needs to have more risk, there’s far too many traits that require 0 investment in healing that are balanced on core but incredibly strong on elites because they remove the risk or trade off.

I dunno maybe what we really need is more elite specs so they can be balanced better as atm elite specs have no competition in trait lines, only inferior styles and lack a solid purpose slot of the time. An example of such would be why ele has a support elite spec but 2/3 of the overloads are offensive with high to decent damage, same with some of the warhorn skills generally not being very support orientated.

I get what you are both saying insanemaniac and Cyninja. I personally don’t mind the weekly time gate because I can do it fairly easily on a weekly basis and go do other stuff either in game or on another game. I can space out my activities and plan my time accordingly and that’s one advantage to the weekly time gating in my opinion.

If you could grind them out at a much faster pace you would get people burning themselves out on the content as well as potentially leaving those areas devoid of players much quicker when everyone has what they want.

To me that’s what Cyninja was talking about with maturity earlier and you tend to see it with older players who don’t mind taking things a little slower and not having to have it right now.

I do however see your side in some ways insanemaniac and that it is a hard time gate and it does prevent you getting it a lot quicker. It can also be very frustrating if you get everything but the time gated stuff easily enough through as you say gold farming and then you are just waiting on what seems an arbitrary time period.

Look at it the other way and assume not everyone grinds out a few hours of gold every day they aren’t getting LI’s and other time gated stuff and you start to see it differently. You can grab that time gated stuff and slowly work on the condensed gifts, clovers and other things that average players might not like farming for and instead prefer to get through saving and normal play.

I agree entirely with Cyninja.

To me it looks like the OP wants the ability to get them easier as well by putting them on the events which aren’t particularly challenging at all.

Ohoni.6057:

That may be your opinion, but I clearly do not share it. The skins have value in their appearance alone, they have that value whether only one person has it or everyone has it. That is the difference between armors and titles. If you believe that armor skins are worth nothing more than prestige, that’s fine, so long as you don’t try to use that as justification for making it harder for me to get access to the skins I want.

No get off your lazy backside and earn them, there’s a lot of titles and prestigious items in the game you have to work hard to earn and that is why people go for them. The want to advertise they have done something difficult and got the reward to show it.

Ohoni.6057:

No, nothing can take any of that away from them. The value of their efforts is that they have improved, and are better today than they were when they started. That remains true regardless of what happens with Legendary armor. Any value they derrived from having exclusive access to Legendary armor skins, that is value they were never entitled to in the first place.

Yes it does devalue their work if everyone can get it for barely any effort which is what you are wanting, a view not shared by a lot of players judging by this thread and thankfully not shared by the devs.

If everyone was suddenly handed out noble peace prizes for doing a years worth of charity work the value of that has plummeted dramatically. The legendary armour is that ultimate prestige item and likewise should be earned the way the devs want you to earn it, by beating their hardest challenge in the game.

Ohoni.6057:

Because I never played GW1 and never had any interest to. GW2 is the game that interested me, and the only ANet game I’ve played. GW1 is completely irrelevant to me as a player, just as someone might love FFVII but have no interest in FFV.

Putting aside that I have a hard time believing you are over 20 with your warped views, what game were you referring to that you had been playing for 15 years that simply gave you anything you wanted any way you wanted without ever having to leave your comfort zone? What was the point in bringing it up if you weren’t going to mention what it was or anything about it especially as it’s not in the Guild Wars franchise or developed by ANet?

Xaylin.1860:

Yeah, I noticed this as well. But I guess we can agree that the mechanic supposedly will be similar? I mean… we already got utility groups with different names but basically the same theme or effects (e.g. Manipulations, Tricks, Physicals, Survival).

As you said, they might as well have changed the mechanic of Mantras which I personally would appretiate. I hate people being able to see my Mantra of Distraction. Or they might not have implemented the addtional icon for those skills yet.

I believe ele gets stances. The charges sounds like it stems from another leak I saw where eles gain charge for sitting in an element. The problem is that unless you are actually in the beta (and thus can’t talk about it here anyway) there’s no way to know.

I heard about very early concepts about a year ago from a source that has proven to be correct on everything even the big reveal in the latest LS episode. The concept sounded extremely complicated and likely has seen multiple revisions over time. What we see in leaks now for ele could change considerably before the XPac is launched.

Other classes are less of an issue as they were all pretty straight forward and weren’t doing anything overly complex as almost redesigning the fields and combo system for a single elite spec.

Fatalyz.7168:

apharma.3741:

Fatalyz.7168:

I think something we can both agree on…. If there was going to be a raid legendary armor set, there should have been at least one more obtainable via other content in the game (WvW being a good candidate, but there could be others).

While I do support the idea I also recognise how difficult it can be to ensure the same effort is required by the average player to obtain it, especially in WvW.

If you tie it to server wins it can take anything from a few months to years to get as well as promoting the bandwagon mentality which is already a huge issue for server linking.

Tie it to achievements like cap X amount of objectives and it promotes karma training and in no way comes close to having to learn raid mechanics.

Tie it to kills and you screw over small groups and roamers as well as promoting people to blob up and again karma train.

The nearest imo you could get is tie it to WvW rank but XP boosters now affect it and karma training is one of the most effective ways to rank up. Additionally there’s a large amount of the playerbase that would be kittened off at having to earn another arbitrary number of ranks when they’re on 3k+.

That’s without mentioning if anyone found a loophole like with the ultimate dominater farm in OS.

Like I say I like the idea and would love to see it but I can’t see a way without kittening off a ton of players or making it adversely affect the game mode by promoting either karma training, blobbing or server stacking.

I don’t know how it would work, WvW and it’s rewards are a mess. I was honestly trying to throw WvW a bone (they need something ).

In principle, my point was just that they should have another set available via other means.

Yeah I know which is the sad part, I don’t honestly think it would be feasible to do and I say this as someone who has done a lot of WvW and enjoys it. No matter which way you cut it, a lot of people will get kittened off.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Choppy.4183:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Warriors can build tanky as hell along with going mace sheild/gs. Met a warrior last night who was probably 3k armour in marurder gear mace sheild durabilty runes. I was s/d thief at the time and my aa’s critting at 1500 dmg and non crits were 740 per hit. He can regeneration that just by afking. Ofc after a few stance rotations I admitted defeat, went out of combat and went d/p and even that took a bit more time then it should.

This is the stats I was using – http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vZAQJAsYl0MhSnY5TwwJw/ELwEmXa4M0Gm7gnwWoWCIAsbA-TlSBQBJUtCsoMgI7PkRlY5TPQXUa8gHAwiUCSJVVAwJA4dwBwW1KAO7szO7szaAt26szOrUACq1C-w

The trick to beating that is not letting him land a burst. So either get in and get out before he can land a headbutt followed by a burst, or just range him with your shortbow.

I know it seems stupid, but if you keep him at range you’ll cut his healing by 2/3 because he won’t have Adrenal Health going. Adding poison to the mix will drop another 1/3 from his remaining healing for as long as it’s on him and resistance isn’t up.

When he’s reflecting your shortbow back at you, just focus on keeping distance until his block is up. Also, if you notice him getting a heal whenever he breaks a stun, stop cc’ing him altogether.

You can’t pull off the above in pvp, but you can in Wvw.

I am fully aware how to beat them but the regen was with out t3 heal because as s/d thief the build and play style relys on constant Presure with aa/flanking strike and postioning. Double endura pain/sheild and mace block was enough time to stop dmg to regen with out using a burst. Ofc it was a different story when I went and changed to d/p

Lets be honest though, you are comparing the best build a warrior can run vs a much less effective build a thief can run. Even staff thief would be a better pick than S/D as vault has inbuilt evades and does way more damage than flanking strike as well as having access to the all important blinds.

AmphibianX.7042:

let me see if I got this right:

1. Raids have a cool down, you can only do a Raid once per week.
2. For completing a raid you get a chest. a chest that contains 13 Legendary Insights.
3. you need 125 Legendary Insights to craft all 6 pieces of the legendary armor (among other things).

that’s a total of 9.5 weeks just to get all 125. is that right?
and yeah Legendary is suppose to be something hard to get, but whats the logic behind the cool-down on raids; Time Required = Challenging Content?
yet another reason why I dont want to do Raids.

Not quite right

1. You can only get the guaranteed exotic, rares, gold and legendary insights once a week per boss.

2. All raid wings are divided into a number of boss fights, wings 1, 2 and 3 all have three bosses which give the rewards mentioned in point 1 once per week. Wing 4 has four bosses that give the rewards once per week for a total of 13 legendary insights if you clear all 4 wings.

3. It’s 150 legendary insight to craft a full set of legendary armour the first time. Each subsequent set of armour costs 300 legendary insights, 150 for the precursor and 150 for the upgrade to legendary.

To get 150 legendary insights, assuming you kill every single boss it takes 12 weeks and you can slack on the last week and kill only 8.

No idea about the weekly limit, I guess it’s to stop people essentially farming bosses for LI’s as there are players who would easily be able to get 50 a week without really trying and that’s with any old group. The really try hards that are really good could get a full set in 2 weeks easily. We also don’t know how many more raids there will be, if we got another 2 wings with three and four bosses then you could earn 20 LI’s a week making the time frame much shorter to 8 weeks.

Not all bosses are the same difficulty as well, wing 4 is fairly easy with the right strategies and comp to the point where you could have 3 or 4 good players essentially carrying hard. There’s also a few other bosses that are much easier than the rest, if they gave LI’s daily you could craft a set in half a year without having to do anything difficult at all.

Fatalyz.7168:

I think something we can both agree on…. If there was going to be a raid legendary armor set, there should have been at least one more obtainable via other content in the game (WvW being a good candidate, but there could be others).

While I do support the idea I also recognise how difficult it can be to ensure the same effort is required by the average player to obtain it, especially in WvW.

If you tie it to server wins it can take anything from a few months to years to get as well as promoting the bandwagon mentality which is already a huge issue for server linking.

Tie it to achievements like cap X amount of objectives and it promotes karma training and in no way comes close to having to learn raid mechanics.

Tie it to kills and you screw over small groups and roamers as well as promoting people to blob up and again karma train.

The nearest imo you could get is tie it to WvW rank but XP boosters now affect it and karma training is one of the most effective ways to rank up. Additionally there’s a large amount of the playerbase that would be kittened off at having to earn another arbitrary number of ranks when they’re on 3k+.

That’s without mentioning if anyone found a loophole like with the ultimate dominater farm in OS.

Like I say I like the idea and would love to see it but I can’t see a way without kittening off a ton of players or making it adversely affect the game mode by promoting either karma training, blobbing or server stacking.

Saiyan.1704:

Lucentfir.7430:

Because it’s a reward incentive to do Raids. If you want Legendary armor you do raid, it’s as simple as that. It boggles my mind how the Spvp community went from we don’t need PVE rewards, to why can’t we do PVP for Hardcore PVE prestigious items. If you don’t touch raids or fractals, that’s all on you because you don’t want to bother with it. If you really wanted it, you’d do #braindeadpve.

We’ve never expressed not wanting rewards… the PvP community has Always pushed for better rewards because we would receive zilch for time spent in PvP.

What boggles my mind? How any PvE player can receive a PvP back piece so easily. It should have been more difficult but Anet wanted a steady stream of casuals… which I guess is fine… but everyone and their mothers have the back piece

I hope Legendary armor can be more exclusive to PvP players because lets face it… PvP players whose been gaming since launch with only 6k achievement points under their belt will never get the back piece unless they turn over a new leaf.

Top 250

• Legendary Gloves/Feet/Leggings

Top 25

• Legendary Chest/Shoulders*

Top 10

• Legendary Helm*

I think this would be a terrible idea, certainly in the current system where manipulating is a common occurrence in NA. It’s also not accessible to all but the top players, I know it’s meant to be legendary but hear me out first.

Currently all Legendarys are accessible to all players regardless of format for passing a certain bar or barrier. It doesn’t matter if we had 10,000 players pass that bar, all that matters is you show the dedication and skill required to get it. With your suggestion it severely limits not just who can get the armour but also how much of it they can get.

It would exclude a very large part of the PvP (or potential PvP) population that may be just as dedicated and enjoying of PvP as the top players for no other reason than 250 people are better than them. There’s no shame in knowing your place in PvP, knowing your limitations and striving to become better but at the same time we have to acknowledge that you need to set the bar at a place where dedicated but average PvP players can hit it. I felt Legendary backpiece mostly did this as it required dedicating yourself to PvP for a while as well as playing multiple classes and winning on them.

As Cynz said though, it’s just a shame you could get it by going afk for a lot of matches.

Ohoni.6057:

I don’t mind if there are difficult solo challenges in the game.

I don’t mind if these challenges are attached to PURE prestige rewards, like titles, nametag flairs, other things that have zero intrinsic value.

I just don’t believe that these challenges should deny people items that do have intrinsic value, items that they might want without regard for any sort of challenge associated with them.

I don’t want to devalue anyone’s gameplay efforts, I just don’t believe that anyone’s gameplay efforts have earned them the right to deny anyone the armor or weapon skins that they’d really enjoy having.

The armour skin is nothing but a prestige item, it is no different to a title, if you’re referring to the actual items being legendary I have already said you can swap stats on ascended at a whim but have also said making a different legendary set for WvW is something I can get behind but you would not have the same skin.

Except you do want to devalue peoples efforts, you essentially want to remove the hard work others put into it trying a new game mode, learning new techniques and classes to benefit a group of 10 people working together. You are directly asking to devalue peoples gameplay efforts as well as many other skills they will have had to develop or utilise outside the game to keep a regular raid schedule.

Ohoni.6057:

Firstly, if you think I’m “fine with that” then you don’t know me very well. For the record, my stance is that NO item, ANYWHERE in the game, should be locked too deeply behind any single type of content. There should always be options available.

But that aside, there are multiple ways to earn Dungeon armor, and the PvP method is particularly brainless, far easier than anything I’d expect for an alternative Legendary armor method. And beyond that, earning Dungeon armor via dungeons involves WAY less investment of time or level of skill than earning Legendary armor via raiding. I mean, I earned a couple full sets of CoF armors back around launch, it’s really not a comparable experience.

Back before reward tracks someone wearing Arah armour had a certain level of prestige as it was that difficult for the majority of the player base. ANet then added dungeon armours to PvP tracks and later WvW tracks, a decision I don’t agree with as once again I believe skins tied to content is just about the only thing propping up this game.

Ohoni.6057:

So what if it is? What difference would that make? I would still be a customer of this game, and as deserving of happiness as you are. What I would want take nothing away from you. The only justification for you being unhappy if I got legendary armor is if you enjoy other people’s unhappiness, and I just don’t accept that as a fair justification.

None of that is relevant to me, I just want the skin. I would take a blank “assign this skin to an item” version as the alternative if it were available, like with SAB skins.

If you are too lazy then you don’t deserve it, yes I said it and most people will agree with me. If you cannot because of your skill and you don’t have a serious disability then you need to practise and get better. Since HoT ANet has really dropped the skill floor for many classes so there’s no excuse for not being able to perform decently.

If you want the skin go earn it, stop asking for it to be served up to you for little to no effort, it’s funny because there’s a quote above where you say you don’t want to devalue the armour but this is exactly what you are asking.

Ohoni.6057:

Well, the game that was apparently a “mistake” was my favorite MMO of all time, after over fifteen years playing them. The reasons I loved it were exactly the things you seem to believe were “mistakes” in need of correction, and I stayed with the game since launch because of those “mistakes.” The further we move away from that game, the less I enjoy the experience. I just question why ANet seems to be ignoring those players that made GW2 the success that it is, in favor of players that apparently feel that the game was “a mistake.”

Correct me if I’m wrong but GW1 had many skins locked behind difficult content, why is GW1 getting a free pass but not GW2? Is it because people don’t want to play with you in GW2 and so you got on better in the optionally single player GW1 game or is it because you could just throw bodies at content till it worked? Was it because you could farm these zones with 0 risks because GW1 allowed combos that made you essentially immune to everything in that area, something no game dev should ever let happen?

Astralporing.1957:

apharma.3741:

Same way you can go around being fine that dungeon armour is tied exclusively to specific dungeons

It may be news to you, but it isn’t. That’s the whole point.

It was for a very long time until reward tracks were added, we went something like 3 years with them being exclusive and this was a time when the majority of the playerbase couldn’t do Arah.

I was never OK with dungeon armour skins being in the reward tracks btw but that cat is already out of the bag but I don’t think it is a trend we should see continuing where you can play any game mode and subset of game modes to get anything you want.

You want the shiny, go earn the shiny. That’s all there is to say on it. Do I really have to explain for you and Ohoni how dead this game would be if it had nothing prestigious behind harder/semi grindy content?

This post needs a picture of Sindrener in his legendary armour….with title….please.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

thrag.9740:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

There are things you are not privy to, like my work taking me out of home for several weeks in a year for instance and where I do not have access a computer that I can play GW2 on, or an Internet connection some times. And when I come back from long periods of absence, raids aren’t the first thing I want to think of even if I always look out for groups each day I play. Just in case something would fit my time.

I know this is not other players problem, and I’m not asking for players solutions here, but if it wasn’t locked behind such a time consuming content it wouldn’t be that bad at all. Over the years, I could casually make 10 legendary weapons and both legendary back packs without any problem. Granted, I had periods where I had more time before raid existed, but that is no longer the case.

The fact that 12 gifts of fortune is no big deal for you, but a weekly escort is too difficult is hard for me to understand. Have you at least tried to do weekly escort? If the only thing you have ever tried to do is pug wing 1 bosses, then you will have a very inaccurate view of what I am describing.

It is hard for you to grasp because raid is what you enjoy and are probably in a position that you have, or had, at least one fixed group schedule long enough to learn and get reliable progress and success. It also make pugging a lot easier as a consequence since you have the experience of all fights and the LI to go along. You make zero sacrifice when you raid. It is what you like to do.

Amassing T6 mats can be done anywhere in the game and doesn’t require any preparation before you can even try to hope getting results. All laurels I get are transformed in T6 and all the bags I collect I keep for a legendary. When I near the end of a gift I can accelerate the process by buying what remains. Also, when I say 10, it is since day 1 of Gw2. Not in one year.

I don’t know what to say but it seems you are an absolute fringe case. We all make decisions and have to live with them, if it’s apparent your choice or what you want is not attainable adjust your goals.

Have you tried joining a raid guild, I don’t mean to raid on a regular schedule I mean a guild with high level players who like running raids all the time, multiple times a week. A great example is MightyTeapot who seems to raid 4 days a week and it used to be every day but Sunday. You seem to be confident in your abilities so it shouldn’t be a problem to join impromptu raids that are put together fairly last minute with whoever is on from a large pool of good players.

Prototypemind.4026:

I just don’t understand the fundamental shift. The whole point of GW2 was to be a game that wasn’t like the rest. No mindless grind—even things like map completion at least allowed players to constantly see new areas—and play your way. The longer GW2 goes on, the more it becomes about the same tired traditions that it was supposed to be getting away from. Tying rewards to very contained content seems against what was promised at release.

It seems that the community is very much divided on it, but I’m surprised at those that have been here for quite some time backing the decision to make it so exclusive. At least PvP tracks existed to allow non-PvE players to get skins. Anyway, I don’t have a dog in the fight, I can’t get players turning on each other rather than supporting systems that let everyone put in energy and effort in multiple ways to obtain something, or at least a variant of it.

This is not what they meant by being different and having no grind.

What ANet intended and succeeded at is that the stats and end game gear isn’t behind mindless grind. All end game content can be done with exotic gear and the few exceptions (fractals, raiding) to this you can learn while gearing up ascended especially raids where ascended weapon and then trinkets would essentially be good enough. Likewise most runes and most sigils are not expensive or have cheaper alternatives, in fact sometimes you’re even going to find friends who will even give you the gear you need.

Think about it, how many people have changed their armour since starting HoT? My ele is using the same ascended armour now as 3 years ago, same ascended staff, dagger, focus and got warhorn + scepter for the change in the meta. Sure people may have changed stats in WvW but ANet also implemented a stat change system for ascended armour making the cost 5 ectos and an exotic insignia.

When the new expansion hits, my ele will still be in 4 year old armour, when living world season 4 comes around I’ll be celebrating 5 or 6 years, same armour, same weapons. That is what they mean by no gear grind and in that regard I can honestly say ANet really did it differently and succeeded in making an expansion a true joy to go into.

Ohoni.6057:

apharma.3741:

As I and many others have already pointed out you can do the easy parts of raids to get LI’s and then buy the boss kills you need to complete the collections, I believe it would cost about 1.5k gold but the option is there should you want to do it.

Bribing other players to play the game for you should never be the alternative option. There should be other methods for PLAYERS to earn the rewards through their own efforts.

Seriously, how can you guys talk about having “pride” in “earning” Legendary armor out of one side of your mouths, and then suggest players just getting Sherpaed through the content as a valid way of playing out the other side? Either Legendary armor is something that only those “deserving” of it can ever have, or it’s something anyone can get if they’re willing to pay others to do the work for them. If the latter, then how is those players playing some other type of content to actually EARN the armor not an equivalent method? Or are you just selfishly supporting a raider-beneficial economy? I would be willing to pay 1.5K gold for a set of Legendary armor, but I’m not paying it to raiders to support a broken system.

Same way you can go around being fine that dungeon armour is tied exclusively to specific dungeons but somehow have a massive beef with legendary armour being tied exclusively to raids. That you can be fine about all the other stuff in the game tied exclusively to other content which you cannot avoid, which you have no choice but to play to get the shiny.

If I had it my way you would be forced to do raids and would not be allowed to sell it, I would have also nipped all this discussion in the bud and said if you don’t want to raid then don’t get legendary armour, end of discussion. It really is that simple.

Besides we all know this is about being either incapable of raiding or being too lazy to. Best part is that it is stat for stat equal to ascended armour which you can stat swap anytime you want to change so there is really very little benefit other than the rune swapping. There’s very few runes where I would care about losing them, even if we used a laughably unrealistic change to the meta every 6 months due to balance patches.

All I know is that it will be a good excuse to craft Astralaria…if I can live with myself running a [Spoiler] build.

Swagger.1459:

OriOri.8724:

Swagger.1459:

OriOri.8724:

Swagger.1459:

Elites are better because HoT was designed to provide a stronger challenge to the game, and the devs wanted to shift from the zerker meta that was “unhealthy for the game” (dev paraphrased quote btw). Instead of constantly complaining about HoT elites, you should be fighting to have the devs improve core specs and core weapons and core traits and core slot skills… and to add quality playable roles that players have the option to build for within each profession instead.

Because this game doesn’t need more powercreep, and it could benefit a lot from reducing the power creep that HoT brought

You’re not really paying attention to the entire game are you?

I am, but so many people don’t. They see harder PvE content and just assume that this means we need to embrace and expect powercreep. That is not true. HoT maps, especially now after the nerf last April or whenever it was, are doable on core specs. Is it more difficult than on an elite spec? Sure, I’ll give you that. But they are still doable on core specs. Which means that elite specs could still be tuned down, in some cases by quite a bit, and still be absolutely fine for content throughout the game.

The devs are not going to gut elite specs just for players still stuck in the zerker meta, and who thought the launched profession designs were quality…

Aside from a few “red flag” design issues plaguing the game since launch, it’s time for players to adapt and start championing core profession improvements even stronger.

Who said anything about it remaining the zerk meta? I mean you look at what is current flavour of the month raid build and it’s core condi ranger with core engineer being more complex but more damage.

What I assume OriOri means is to look at elite specs and say “How much of this can I rip out and tone down and it will still be better than most core lines in most cases”. The answer is actually a lot. You could change primal bursts to T2 burst skills outside of PvE and it would still be picked 100% of the time. You could slap a 30s CD on headbutt, people will still use it over everything else. Instead of Arc Divider covering 3 football fields and destroying anything that isn’t a nuclear fallout bunker you could reduce it to 240 range. Instead of Skull Grinder doing all it does it could lose the daze, deal half power damage and it would still be picked for a condi build no questions asked.

That’s just warrior, you could make very deep cutting changes to other elite specs which would make the game much less painful to watch and play while keeping elite specs better than core lines.

Astralporing.1957:

apharma.3741:

Yes but there’s always a source of LI’s it is a constantly growing resource. Even if you somehow avoid all the hard weekly boss kills you will still be able to have “all the legendary armours” unlocked by raids. It might take you a bit longer and would certainly require more effort, but you would get there. The same cannot currently be said for earning pinnacle weapons outside of daily AP.

If only that were true. Unfortunately, you can’t get LIs outside of raids. Even if you could, it means nothing if you don’t have collections unlocked, and those require you killing all the bosses, including the hard ones.

So, basically completely opposite of what you tried to claim.

As I and many others have already pointed out you can do the easy parts of raids to get LI’s and then buy the boss kills you need to complete the collections, I believe it would cost about 1.5k gold but the option is there should you want to do it. There are what I would call entry level bosses, at least 3 I would consider easy enough that if you can complete a dungeon in a prompt time you can kill the 3 bosses easily a week and farm them for LI’s.

I also think what I put was lost on a few of you as it was almost a complete reversal of what the other person wrote replacing AP for LI and raiding. It wasn’t supposed to make sense because the poster is contradicting themselves multiple times. Just see above where they’re saying about Arah becoming easier and that it’s ok for Arah armour and Arah tokens to be behind Arah dungeon because it gets easier over time while also taking the time to ridicule them for it. The same logic can be applied to raids, it will get easier over time either because of more options with elite specs or because the player base knowledge pool gets so much higher…and TACO doing 90% of the work for you.

But lets for once cut all the BS and get to the core of the issue.

Most of the complainers just want legendary armour but are not good enough to get it or are too lazy to get it. The only other point that has merit is potentially having a set of legendary armour with a different skin for WvW/PvP and you better believe it’s going to be behind a massive grind fest and BS achievements.

I would prefer some level of clipping.

I only have light and probably only will have light so I will only comment on light. Have you thought about instead of have a really big sharp horn behind our heads ready to impale the back of our skulls to instead maybe shave the horn off?

It fixes the safety aspect for the armour but more importantly also solves a lot of clipping issues with the armour as the fixture point can be put closer to the back and skull before clipping. I appreciate the amount of work and effort put into the armour and how challenging it must have been though I do think this is something that will hit a good middle ground while also solving what I perceive to be 2 glaring aesthetic issues.

Edit: Included a picture of greatsword, it only really clips with the horn of the skull otherwise it rests on or obscures it completely so no clipping issue.

Ohoni.6057:

apharma.3741:

Achievement points award gems every 5k milestone, gold, various boosters and more pertinently to the arguement 2 sets of unique armour and backpiece as well as 2 sets of weapon skins. Yes I have seen people proudly display those pinnacle skins that they had to earn, you cannot earn them just by logging in daily either.

Yes, but there is always a surplus of AP, it is a constantly growing resource. Even if you somehow manage to avoid all daily log-in AP while playing the game hardcore (which seems contradictory, but whatever), you will be able to get enough AP to have “all the things” unlocked via AP. It might take you a bit longer and would certainly require more effort, but you would get there. The same cannot currently be said for earning Legendary armor outside of raiding.

Yes but there’s always a source of LI’s it is a constantly growing resource. Even if you somehow avoid all the hard weekly boss kills you will still be able to have “all the legendary armours” unlocked by raids. It might take you a bit longer and would certainly require more effort, but you would get there. The same cannot currently be said for earning pinnacle weapons outside of daily AP.

To be honest unless you have played the game since launch and GW1 you will be anything from 5-10k AP behind the top AP players. Except there is no way to bridge a lot of that as they were tied to Living World Season 1 and all those are unobtainable now.

The comparison between hardcore AP grabbing is the biggest piece of BS I’ve seen in this thread, AP requires a lot more effort to get than completing raids because AP already mandates doing said raids. Go ask Malediktus about it, guy is 2nd in the world and has to do everything especially as AP from new content is a lot less than it used to be.

Ohoni.6057:

Fatalyz.7168:

And you don’t have to have Legendary armor, any more than they have to have all of the AP.

But that’s a false equivalency. “All the AP” is just a pointless, arbitrary figure. The Legendary armor skins are markedly different from other available skins.

You want Legendary armor just as much as someone may want Achievement Points.

Is this someone made of straw? If you can find me data that there are an equal number of people who care about having the maximum possible amount of AP at all times as there are people who would like to wear Legendary armor, then I’ll concede the point, but I just don’t buy it.

If there are such numbers of people, then rather than saying that they are just out of luck, I would try to find some way for them to earn that AP they want through alternate means. Perhaps have some method by which you can farm away at gaining AP that comes out of the same pool of daily AP, so if you miss some days, you can make it up via farming.

Really though, you’re placing daily log-in on the same tier as raiding, so since you believe the two things are equivalent, why not just give out Legendary armor for daily rewards? Or like maybe a monthly thing?

Achievement points award gems every 5k milestone, gold, various boosters and more pertinently to the arguement 2 sets of unique armour and backpiece as well as 2 sets of weapon skins. Yes I have seen people proudly display those pinnacle skins that they had to earn, you cannot earn them just by logging in daily either.

These two classes really do exemplify how broken the game and HoT is, no matter whether they bring condi, power or bunker build they are mechanically broken.

I’d probably lump the guardian in with that but DH does very little for condi but it is close to being as silly as these two.

Why does heal tempest, condi chrono, wanderer druid, marauder scrapper, condi necro and Revenant get a little less criticism from me? You put them in different armour or a different build and they aren’t incredibly frustrating to fight.

If it came pre HoT era it would have been a decent rune, now it’s just a niche I think.

lucadiro.4519:

apharma.3741:

Who said it was 9k on VG? I mainly see that low number on gorseval when they get blown up by retal and start casting something as a damage field comes up to them either forcing them to move or stop.

I didn’t say it wasn’t viable just that you have to be good to play ele and that’s the point that both Feanor and I are making, you have to do a lot more and the risk is a lot higher on ele than on other classes atm. Look at the D/D power thief rotation and how much damage it can do, it is actually 3 buttons for the entire thing, no long casts, no channels just stand behind and press 3 buttons. This is why they are dropping out of favour and this is why I would never ever ask someone to bring ele unless they were known to me.

Doing 9k DPS on gorseval prove even more my point. This is not a problem related to Tempest, you are talking about someone that has 0 knowledge of the encounter.
As you said, he was dieng to reta , got Black fields and stoped to dpsing. And probably he got Also all’ gorseval’s Smash.
I’m Wondering wich DPS you expect from someone like this, for sure he would have pushed out around 10k dps even on cranger, so again is not a rotation’s complex issue, probably he was using his skills without any logical sense.
Also people still have to realize that Tempest, and any other Power class, lose tons of damage by doing the slow cc strat at gorseval, and if you have 4 Tempest in your squad you have better chance to phase him (without use updraft) by insta cc.

I’m well Aware about differents difficulties of rotation’s execution between the classes. But again, it doesn’t prevent Tempest viability. Everyone that enjoy the class and put some effort in it can make it viable.

Then you are free to complain about the fact is not fair thieves have a comparable dps with easier rotation, I don’t care about this discussion.
I would maybe want to point out that at least they are both viable while there classes like necro that have more difficult to find Groups and class like revenant that are not wanted at all.
But since this post is about ele viability I stop here.
I Just find hilarious, and this is why I’m writing, that there are people trying to say Tempest is not viable in pvp and pve, while it is still One of the best classes to go.

What was the point in everything after the gorseval part as I clearly said I wasn’t saying ele is not viable and only that you have to be good at it for it to be competitive in PvE?

As for gorseval, the retal is per hit which is why it’s easier to die to retal as an ele, you should know this and I find it weird you completely ignore this fact. You won’t have this problem on many of the other DPS classes as they don’t have excessive number of hits in their rotation. Also as I say ele has some pretty long cast skills, you can’t cast meteor or you have to interrupt it if a mechanic requires you to dodge like black or more commonly the slam attack. No other class has such a big part of their DPS tied to such a long rooted channel. So I can understand how these people get low damage and they would do much more on other classes where you essentially press 1 button for 20k+.

I think the OP has the right to know whether he’s going to have to put in a fairly decent amount of work to match what other classes do as well as the pitfalls of the class.

@Mr Godlike, very good and accurate review.

If the people complaining they don’t want to do raids put even half as much effort into actually doing the raids they’d have the armour by now…

Who said it was 9k on VG? I mainly see that low number on gorseval when they get blown up by retal and start casting something as a damage field comes up to them either forcing them to move or stop.

I didn’t say it wasn’t viable just that you have to be good to play ele and that’s the point that both Feanor and I are making, you have to do a lot more and the risk is a lot higher on ele than on other classes atm. Look at the D/D power thief rotation and how much damage it can do, it is actually 3 buttons for the entire thing, no long casts, no channels just stand behind and press 3 buttons. This is why they are dropping out of favour and this is why I would never ever ask someone to bring ele unless they were known to me.

From what I’ve heard the ele elite spec has/had very cool things planned but seemed very technically difficult. I think they want to keep to those plans but unfortunately as someone mentioned above it might have required 38 weapon skills alone and that’s not taking into account anything else.

Based on the screenshot it seems a fair bit of the original plan has been revised since I heard about it which is a good thing as it seemed like a bit of a mess to balance and keep track of. From the looks of it they’re going for something more similar to a revenant where your utilities are doubled up on with a pseudo legend swap. There are some similarities between what I heard and what is in this photo but I would be pretty certain that the ele elite spec is still being ironed out. There’s very little point in speculating as we are still 6 months from the XPac and there’s still plenty of time for it to be changed considerably.

No I’m not a beta tester nor am I friends with one in game, I got my info from a friend of a friend but he was bang on the money about the latest episode and where the plot is going. You can check my posting history and tell I was right about who Lazarus was.

Well it will make boon duration nourishment more accessable which is a good thing, consider you can do the WvW reward track and most likely ensure you won’t run out of the orchids.

I agree with Pyro, it’s not going to make a huge difference as concentration I feel is much better as it gives you a very large boost when you want it. Though I think a lot more builds can drop concentration sigil for these utility buffs now which might be an attempt at reducing the need for concentration sigil.

FJSAMA.2867:

The worst of all is hovering back items on light. I would rather have items clipping on this bulky skirt than hovering back items…

(legendary vestments vs precursor vestments)

Yeah, maybe if they removed the completely unnecessary and frankly silly head impaler from the back of the armour then it would sit better. Staves sit on the back and don’t clip with the horn on the back as they go to one side but shields and other back items probably do. It’s not a skirt issue I don’t think.

I really wish ANet would rethink the placement of some of these spoken bits on armour, you don’t want spikes where if you sneeze or put your head back you impale yourself.

Wolfric.9380:

OK warrior :-). I play ele main and power war as backup … Yes i know don´t lead with headbut ;-). I have bull rush on the toolbar and don´t use rush to engage i use it after arch divider for a very hard folow up hit. I use taunt on zerk and this is the real killer after they break stun from headbut … I also use boonrip sigil in my sword and open with it to rip stabiltiy or protection … (I use sword for the leap to engage or move faster)
And i see … stupid ele if it tries to stay close to a warrior …
I don´t say i win against a warrior as ele, but i endure quite long kiting. If he uses berserkers stance immidiately and i avoide arch divider i can even win ….

Yeah, I can see why you say about not seeing how an ele can die in 10s because you main the class and we take some things for granted like knowing when we aren’t going to win a fight and kite from the start. It’s a shame there isn’t a way to specifically target stability on boon rip on those sigils as it would help counter a lot of things and yeah that taunt is hilarious especially if you go berserk when they’re under 50% health into arc divider. gg no re.

I like hydro sigil with blood for a nice strong follow up by swapping weapon after arc divider or to arc divider but everyone has their preferences.

Wolfric.9380:

Uh how do you kill ele in 10 sec? I have to play realy careless if that happens to me. In a duel i concentrate i am rarely brought down in less then a minute … Very good necros might do it but even warriors won´t. I die to most good warriors but might drag them over the whole map …

Don’t lead with headbutt but instead force out dodges with shield 4, swap to GS and use the whirl and rush as they still hit very hard so you can hit headbutt and pretty much leave them with a 3s stun as you wail on them. Power warrior will still burn through an ele very quickly with headbutt into HB landing as much as they can before arc divider, switch to mace and start that daze spam. It all depends on if they try to stay melee or just kite around from the start. If they kite at the start then it takes longer, if they try to fight they will lose easy.

I mean I won’t say I’m playing pro players, I am definitely not but this was mid platinum so they shouldn’t be green about it and should have been on my skill level or there abouts. It’s even easier if you get them without cool downs from a 2v2 becoming a 1v1 but that’s a different story.

lucadiro.4519:

apharma.3741:

lucadiro.4519:

Anti SJW.8207:

zoopop.5630:

been away for a year, looking for a new class to main for PvP arena/advance Pve. Is this class still consider great or no go?

In PVE = Yes
In WvW = Uhm kinda…
In PvP = Nope (Every other class will eat you alive)

This is pure disinformation…. You can both like or not the metà healbot Tempest build (I personally hate it) but you can’t say is not Great for PvP while it is mandatory in every team.

Mandatory in what teams? The pro league and esports has been dead for 6 months so all you have now is solo/duo where it is 100% not mandatory as you have no idea who you will be with.

I don’t agree every class will eat you alive but ele has some pretty strong counters floating around atm. Most necros will eat an ele with very little issue with even a small amount of LF, condi warrior destroys ele due to excessive daze spam but ele can hold on quite a while vs power. Generally ele is countered heavily by CC spam which is one of the reasons I ditched invigorating torrents for harmonious conduit and pure healing with aura share and careful use of water attunement.

Man even if now we don’t have tournaments it doesn’t change the fact that is from season 2 (or 3 i don’t rember honestly) Tempest has been mandatory for every serious team.
Even now that we only have solo/duo have a Tempest in team is Just gamechanging since his support contribution in teamfight is so High.
To not mention that the viability of class like revenant or necro is totally dependent from have a ele or not in team.
And in the very First moment they Will remove solo/duo you can bet tempest Will again hold a spot in every team.

So since this topic is about someone asking if Tempest is viable or not in pvp and pve no one can say Tempest isn’t viable because is false and you all’ know that.

p.s.: If you are talking about 1v1 I hardly see how a necro, both Power or condi, with low Life Force can eat a Tempest alive and in few second.
Even a condi Warrior alone can’t really down you very Easy, or fast, even if I admit that vs a cWarrior ele has an harder time.
These 2 classes are a good counter for ele only in the middle of a teamfight, where you know, is normal that if the enemy team focus you, you die, if not you would be op.

Ele has been falling out of favour in PvE except maybe KC since people realised 1) Most average people are terrible at ele pulling 9k DPS even when fully buffed and 2) since the last “balance” patch nerfing ele damage.

I won’t say ele isn’t viable in PvE but you do have to be good with ele to get the high damage they are capable of, compare this to something like D/D power thief which presses 3 buttons, power engy pressing 2 or 3 buttons, condi thief/ranger with a fairly simple rotation.

A necro is a complete counter to ele, always has been and you will always loss to one with even a small amount of LF. I’m not complaining g that there are counters just pointing out that the counters atm are very common especially warriors which allows you to shut down an eles advantage pretty easily. This makes scrapper and druid much more competitive especially when paired with a necro as they both have better ways to deal with classes that are common in solo/duo queue. Ele is not mandatory and it’s easy to deal with or at least I always find them easy to deal with killing them in about 10s and the only reason it takes that long is because of obsidian flesh.

lucadiro.4519:

Anti SJW.8207:

zoopop.5630:

been away for a year, looking for a new class to main for PvP arena/advance Pve. Is this class still consider great or no go?

In PVE = Yes
In WvW = Uhm kinda…
In PvP = Nope (Every other class will eat you alive)

This is pure disinformation…. You can both like or not the metà healbot Tempest build (I personally hate it) but you can’t say is not Great for PvP while it is mandatory in every team.

Mandatory in what teams? The pro league and esports has been dead for 6 months so all you have now is solo/duo where it is 100% not mandatory as you have no idea who you will be with.

I don’t agree every class will eat you alive but ele has some pretty strong counters floating around atm. Most necros will eat an ele with very little issue with even a small amount of LF, condi warrior destroys ele due to excessive daze spam but ele can hold on quite a while vs power. Generally ele is countered heavily by CC spam which is one of the reasons I ditched invigorating torrents for harmonious conduit and pure healing with aura share and careful use of water attunement.

SlippyCheeze.5483:

thrag.9740:

don’t make any decision until after this week’s update.

If you wait for balance changes to finish, and class selection to be stable, you will be waiting forever.

We know there is a balance patch coming potentially tomorrow, waiting one day isn’t going to kill you.

Oldirtbeard.9834:

apharma.3741:

If you have some friends that do raiding you could ask them to take you along when they are short or if they’d be willing to do some training. There’s usually a large number of training raids advertised on reddit ( might need some searching) and here’s something that will in general help, try out BGDM.

If it’s not your thing you can remove it but it can tell you how much might you are generating as well as giving you your damage. You don’t have to let others see your damage but anyone running BGDM will be able to see if you’re not giving enough might regardless of if you have it or not.

Other general warrior tips is stick and move trait will often be the difference in damage on power, try to not use your headbutt if you know CC is needed soon and check out Nike from DnT’s YouTube. Whatever your feeling towards him and his guild are he does know his stuff about warrior and has a decent amount of info there as well as warrior PoV in various fights.

I actually tried finding that but it doesn’t seem to be listed on Curse where most addons are listed, I went to BGDM which didn’t have something which blatantly said DOWNLOAD HERE, just a break down of the program when I was just expecting something simple and user friendly like Recount or Skada Meters, granted I was buzzed a little the night before but I wasn’t hammered.

You find it under releases tab next to the about tab, http://gw2bgdm.blogspot.co.uk/p/releases-change-log.html

You want the top one under releases and extract contents to your bin64 folder in programming files → guild wars 2.

Do not download the freetype or GW2 China or Beta versions as they may not be ToS compliant.

Jeez, when will people grow up. You make your choices, you live with your decisions.

You choose to spend all your gold on seige and playing WvW, roaming and ninja capping SM? Good, I hope you enjoyed it and had a lot of fun and good memories, really I do but don’t go complaining that some other people instead of doing some of or all of that went to another game mode and worked on getting things they wanted like legendary armour.

If you didn’t choose to make the legendary armour because of whatever your reason, it was your choice, you weighed the pros and cons and came to a conclusion which you chose to live with.

If you have some friends that do raiding you could ask them to take you along when they are short or if they’d be willing to do some training. There’s usually a large number of training raids advertised on reddit ( might need some searching) and here’s something that will in general help, try out BGDM.

If it’s not your thing you can remove it but it can tell you how much might you are generating as well as giving you your damage. You don’t have to let others see your damage but anyone running BGDM will be able to see if you’re not giving enough might regardless of if you have it or not.

Other general warrior tips is stick and move trait will often be the difference in damage on power, try to not use your headbutt if you know CC is needed soon and check out Nike from DnT’s YouTube. Whatever your feeling towards him and his guild are he does know his stuff about warrior and has a decent amount of info there as well as warrior PoV in various fights.

Um just to add to this OOC discussion and resetting, you do not reset if you have a non damage condition on you like blind, weakness, chill, cripple and immobilise. The enemy so long as they are clean of conditions and sufficient distance will reset and start regaining health while you remain in combat. Doesn’t matter what class just one of those weird things, not sure it’s the same with damaging conditions though as they do damage and so I believe they keep the owner in combat.

I do think if some of you are willing to co-operate you can make a video showing the way OOC works for everyone to be a little more enlightened from rather than throwing back thinly veiled insults and waving that thing in your pants around.

Not soon enough.

/15flyingquaggans.

You might want to hit level 80 first….

Jski.6180:

Blinding ashe icd needs to be per person not per activation that alone would fix a lot about fire.

This alone is all that needs changing. Though Pyromancer’s Puissance going to 20s might would be great too.