Guild Wars 2

Xula de Neiva.9508:

You see a portal? Lay your traps and wells. From that point on, you know to change your strategy if it’s really an issue. Yes Mesmer can be annoying, but if you’re having that much trouble, you should train with a good Mesmer user. Learn from that. You want to know where they are? Watch the one that moves the most. Too many clones? You can easily get rid of them before most mesmers can shatter them on you. Don’t spam your skills in a panic if that’s an issue. Learn from the fights. Everyone in this game complains about most classes every season. Duel with each other, this helps.

The funny thing is if you watch Helseths stream he often does duels with other pro players to get better. Even then he’s heavily reliant on Moa to get the kill if he can at all, if he fat fingers a button in continuum split then he’s not much of a threat for the next 72s until it’s back up. Takes a while and a fair bit of set up for condi mesmer to kill anything on equal skill now and the necessity of moa just shows mesmer isn’t that strong.

I mean, let’s be honest here, how many times have you seen a genuinely useful mesmer on ranked? I think on my team once and on the enemy team maybe once I can remember. Rest of the time they keep jumping into team fights with gravity well against a DH and 2 eternal champion warriors.

OK so looking at the wiki you can buy quartz which means you should be able to charge it to make celestial and also buy the recipes.

However I also found from the wiki that free accounts can’t access the forum’s so I’m a bit puzzled by the question now. If you’re free you shouldn’t be able to post here. If you just don’t have HoT but the base game purchased then craft cele and stick water, monk or traveler runes on it. I’d personally recommend traveler or monk over water though as most of water runes bonuses you can’t use with the signet or are kinda meh.

jebro.6370:

apharma.3741:

sophiewhite.3149:

Auroraborealis.7310:

sophiewhite.3149:

so basically your saying because people were born on a different part of this giant rock they are automatically much different and kinder and better.

Well compare two different species of bird, that evolved in different parts of the world. They are both majestic and unique in their own way, but due to certain environmental factors sub species could display completely different behavioral patters. Yes they are both birds, and no bird is more special than another bird when you consider a universal perspective; all live is amazing. However, its undeniable that sociological and behavioral patters of humans can vary from culture to culture.

I’m no psychologist but it doesn’t take a genius to figure out there’s a difference in the average player in EU and NA regions. But don’t take my word for it, go check it out for yourself. You’re still gonna lose in EU, and you’re still gonna have blowouts, but they are less common, and even when they do happen you don’t have people expressing their negative emotions quite as frequently and as vulgarly as in NA.

so EU and NA are also different species? i agree it can be different but im getting tired of non stop EU is superior to NA comments constantly. if you even mention your NA in a thread or stream you instantly get comments like “well na isnt real pvp anyway” as if the comment has no validity. your sample size is too small to say its for sure better 100%. id say you got lucky. EU has toxic people so does NA its no different.

Jebro is in the top 50 in NA.

Just let that sink in for a minute.

Jebro….top 50….NA….Jebro.

1, Im not top 50 NA (Although its a fantastic meme)
2, Who are you.
3, Im improving as of late, it seems moving to NA gave me the focus I needed (thats a wink which infers sarcasm)

The baldest Jebro.

My mistake then, just thought I heard you say it on your stream late at night and you being NA I can’t exactly check.

Soothsayer.9206:

apharma.3741:

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

IMHO, I think the concept of Mesmer is intriguing, especially the mechanics (execution of concepts can always be improved). Personally speaking, and you have to go way back in RPG history (original D&D), it reminds me of what the Illusionist was supposed to be (or at least my recollection of it). That may be one of the reasons I enjoy Mesmer so much (clones/phantasms/shatters, etc.) it really is the ‘illusionist’ factor. I wouldn’t change the mechanics though, that’s what makes it so much fun and as far as I know, unique in RPG games. As far as GW2 sPvP, difficult to get used to fighting against, but not op.

It may be unique but the way it works now doesn’t make it good mechanically in PvP, PvE or WvW. A mesmer is balanced sustained damage wise around phantasms in a power build however they have very low health pools and so are easily killed by AoE in PvP and WvW.

Then they’re also summoned on an enemy which also has 2 problems. First that it gives the enemy quite a measure of control over your damage, more so than most classes and secondly they disappear when the target dies but have considerable cool downs on them which makes mesmers terrible damage dealers in PvE.

It all adds up to mechanics that don’t work, they should have stayed with clones summoning only but allow flip over effects for swapping places or short range teleports like phase retreat and iLeap. Get rid of phantasms and adjust sustained damage and skills appropriately.

Nikkinella.8254:

If they reverted stability and reverted the condi changes for wvw only, it would become like this again. But that would be the intelligent and easy thing to do to fix wvw, so Anet won’t do it. Instead we’ll get a golem rush or some new type of siege or something like that.

The condition changes (as in to stacking and changed coefficients) were fine what they needed to do was keep an eye out for skills that were performing hilariously bad and skills that were over performing. A slight adjustment to burns to make them all last a little longer but do a little less up front would have made conditions fine. Except confusion, that should have been left as only on skill use.

Stability was grossly overpowered and needed to be changed, thing is they changed every single CC skill in the game to 10 people max. Then they did the sensible change to stab which they should have done in the first place. So what are we left with? Have 20 people with a good amount of stab and they render all CC useless as they charge ahead triggering the 10 target cap of skills but not losing stab due to the 0.75s immunity window.

Changing CC back to no target cap would allow smaller organised groups to combat a map blob of pugs as the group would be effectively cut in half by those with stab and the numptys at the back with no stab. This allows them to pounce on the weaker half of the group, clean them up and get any rallies needed before having to deal with the brainless 111 guards in the front.

BlackBeard.2873:

Still, I think the problem lies in the chrono specialization, as I wouldn’t want to nerf core classes. One potential change could be to make portal an elite: it wouldn’t really hurt core shatter mes, who could now take more survival or burst utils, but would really make a tough call between moas and the high map control mesmer has. Alternatively, you nerf shield, specialization traits (esp. chronophantasm), or sig. of inspiration (which allows shatters to be all the more spammable).

Ofc we should be adjusting the elite specs over core, I’m in full agreement however there’s also another problem. Mesmer shield has one of the highest cool down blocks untraited in the game now. It requires at least 2 trait lines and decent alacrity uptime to be able to reach the cool down reduction that other classes get. I would say it requires 3 traits but I think it’s a false arguement when 2 of them are minors you have no choice about.

Nerfing chronophantasma isn’t a particularly nice thought but to be blunt the whole phantasm mechanic needs to be changed. They don’t work mechanically in this game and have hilariously bad scaling in fights. If the mechanic was overhauled so mesmer didn’t share the damage with phantasms then I’d be behind a chronophantasma change.

Signet of illusions I’m guessing you meant. The active I’m not sure what it would be changed to but so long as it’s not junk I could get behind. I’m not a fan of the shatter spam mechanic and it certainly removes some aspect of skill, however looking at other classes that are strong there would have to be some hefty nerfs to other classes as well.

Tbh I think ANet needs to do a proper look at the state of a lot of classes and either change mechanics/traits or make a few baseline changes. Mesmer, just using it as an example as this thread is about them, needs phantasm mechanic removing and meaningful skills put in its place with damage coefficients/traits to correspond to them. I always found it hilarious when people said mesmers do too much DPS in the bunker meta as they have some of the lowest coefficients in the game per weapon role.

Buran.3796:

OriOri.8724:

Ocosh.5843:

I’ll say here as everywhere: Rev was obviously designed around having one weapon set. The addition of the swap was based on uninformed feedback. You could undo a lot of the nerfs and create some real choice and balance if rev only had one weapon set.

I said the same thing close to the release of HoT and people hated that I pointed it out. But its true. Rev was designed around no weapon swapping, so its weapons are able to do too much. They weren’t brought back in line when Anet decided to allow weapon swapping on Rev.

Based on that logic you must think that Rev was designed to not to be able to figth underwater, because Herald (Glint) has no underwater skills and neither Shiro or Mallyx have them (underwater Shiro and Mallyx skills are the same as on ground, so we must asume that the developers didn’t mean the Rev to be able to swim… they added them in the last second when they figured out that some slots were empty… ).

Rev was rushed, but no problem: only took 4 years to ANet to fix the Guardian sword.

Fun fact: Mallyx underwater was different to on land as it used an older beta version under water where some of the utilities would self inflicted conditions. Wasn’t changed for months after HoT came out either…

Not gonna lie this is kinda funny.

skarpak.8594:

i am familiar with gw1, since i played it nearly for 8 years and also got gwamm.
tbh. it was great, but it also was an easy grind and nothing more.
there where some challening missions but most part of gwamm was pure grind…if you deny that out of nostalgia, i have to call you stupid.

getting all the titles was hardly challening, only time consuming and a lot of platin (never forget that 10k sweets, alk and party stuff, all the weapons for collection and elite armors).
then there was much stuff which also got rushed for you if you paid them, it was a thing back then in gw1, nothing new. nothing new in every game.

so, if someone is really going for it and buys the raid every week for 4 months to get all the legendary insights, thats some pretty dedication in farming gold to pay all 9 bosses every week.

well, i am missing 7 LI so i put my dedication very much in it, also raiding several times a week…and i am here and tell you, if somebody buys the raid that many times with so much gold, he deserves that armor.

i don’t feel like my achievement is being reduced by that. do you or what? or do you speak without actually raiding much?

Regardless whether it’s a grind it still requires an awful lot of effort to get in terms of time.

I’ve completed every raid wing, help out a few groups and lead my own raids which has done full clears in an evening even having to rebuild the raid group when nearly half of them have left GW2 because of balance issues.

So yeah, I’ve put in plenty of effort to get the armour, achievements and it does dilute the achievements of others if you can buy it with gold. If someone could pay $20 to get 1000 AP worth of achievements unlocked would you still feel you achieved something by doing them the normal/hard way?

I know I wouldn’t put the same value to an “achievement” that can easily be bought for making very little effort.

Annabel.5127:

Rarnark.5623:

If you want a competitive solo arena:

1) Remove duo q option. Solo only for less segregation and more accurate ladder placement

2) In game voice. This game is kitten without a proper communication. Also players in the high end will just join channel in ts together the second they get teamed which gives greater advantage to said team (which is usually already stacked). Having in game voice will level the playing field significantly and allow for a higher level of coordinated play.

Yeah i honestly think if a solo q only system were to be implemented voice chat would be a must, its too hard to carry solo when you have to type to your team where to go. There could be a rating barrier that would create longer queue times but on NA where during primetime you get +4 and -20 for a loss i think i’d rather just wait the extra 5-10 minutes for a q without lower rated players in it.

This would only possibly work in NA as most people there speak some form of language resembling English.

apharma.3741:

Ele: “Hey guys, stick near me and I’ll heal you up!”

Warrior: “**** off you ********* ********, i **** yor mom!”

Ele: “Charming, lets just win ok?”

Ranger: (breathing)

Guardian: (screaming and shouting in the background) “SHUT UP MOM IM PLAYING MY ******* GAME!”

Ele: “So…..anyone got a plan?”

Ranger: (breathing intensifies)

Guardian: “Sorry I just had to SHUT UP MOM!! Sorry sorry, yeah I’ll go mid with you and the war.”

Warrior: “**** off you piece of ****”

Ele: “Sure ok.”

Ranger: (loud breathing)

Ele: “Are you ok druid?”

Ranger: "Es-tu une fille?

Ele: “errrrr”

Ranger: “Je ne parle que français”

Announcer: The match is about to begin!

skarpak.8594:

it is still like that, if you want to get into raids, you have to adjust.
if you want to do lowmans, you have to adjust even more.

nothing is lost, the only thing that is added through selling, is that people who can’t, whatever the reason may be, can trade their stuff for people who invested more time to be better then avg.

and “nothing is prestige”…we sell currently for 200g (30k gold for 150 LI in the end) and even if you buy it for 80g, its still 12k gold. ontop of that u need to give out some more gold, since you also want to buy achievements and the legendary armor mats aren’t that cheap either.

so what, if someone spends that much gold its pretty much prestigeous and certainly a feat. the avg. player has how much gold? 300g? guess not even that.

if you see it from the prestige point of view, nearly nothing in this game is. there aren’t much limited items or items that you cannot aquire anymore.

and the only thing that makes something prestigeous is, its either kittening expensive or limited (and it doesn’t matter if its rng limited so you need luck or if its a giveaway for only a small amount of people).

Which is part of the problem, nothing means anything in this game as most of the time you can buy your way to it. Completing the challenges should be worth something where it says “hey I did this really hard thing that took effort and time to do” I mean that is the very definition of achievement.

Except not here apparently where you can just buy your way to whatever you want. Also you can farm 100-200g a day pretty easily without taking up a ton of time probably more especially those that were exploiting multiloot.

You look at people with GWAMM and you know they put serious time into GW1. You see someone in GW1 with Legendary Survivor of Ascalon you knew they did something pretty difficult (look it up if you don’t know) to get that. Here you just pay someone better than you some gold and done, which only serves to reduce the achievements of those who actually did it.

It depends what you consider good roaming.

If you like to run a low risk high reward build with a few other people around attacking groups smaller than yours or single players. Then stealth and run away while jumping like you have hot coals beneath your feet then yeah Gankdara, Piken and Gunnar’s Hold would be top of my list for similar minded individuals.

If you actually want to run around with a small group taking on bigger groups or solo, perhaps being a pita and camping in a tower killing small groups that try to flip it till they have to call in the blob then go else where. SFR isn’t so bad but you could also go to a linked server.

It has 2 advantages, firstly most of the linked servers have people who very rarely had groups bigger than 20 and would consider that a map blob before linking so are more roaming inclined. Secondly you can get relinked every other month for more variety.

Ofc if you want to just duel outside SM then it doesn’t really matter what server you’re on, they all have people doing that.

Fyi, I’m on WSR and there’s a decent number of roamers from our server and we still have some roaming guilds around.

Vargamonth.2047:

apharma.3741:

I agree with the last point sort of but I don’t have any problems with having a weapon set being more defense and support based but not doing lots of damage. If I wanted damage I’d pick a weapon set where damage is its main purpose.

Having a more defensive/supportive weapon set is not a problem. The “problem” is having to pick it because there’s no better alternative to fill that slot and it arises, as you said, because the class was initially designed without weapon swap.
A pure power revenant will never pick a mace because it deals negligible direct damage and has nearly zero utility and will think twice the hammer option because it’s a death trap for anything but AoEing from distance while unnoticed, so it’s either the staff (a defensive/supportive weapon) or a second offhand to couple with the sword (which has the obvious drawback of providing just 2 out of 5 skills off CD).

The low amout of weapon choices coupled with their degree of specialization is a very big problem balance wise because only the specs which can make some decent use of the second, conceptually unrelated, weapon set can prevail.
If someone tries to make a supportive build (assuming a not terrible ventari legend), what can he pick as his second weapon set? Hammer? Sword (just because it can go along with the shield for minimal support)?
The problem will also become only bigger over time. Whatever the new expansion brings to us will dictate what becomes viable (it’s probably going to happen anyways based on the insane and completely unnecesary power creep HoT brought) because, unless we get another gray-ish legend (a CC based one, for example) featuring another offhand, there will be one “role” with much better legend/weapon sinergy than the others (and there’s a limit to how many gray, general purpose legends and weapons can be designed).

Yeah I know that problem, other classes have it sometimes as well but it is very obvious on rev. Staff however isn’t a terrible weapon though and the auto coefficients aren’t lower than other support/defensive options on other classes. If it had no defense and was only a healing to others weapon then it would be an extremely bad weapon but I just can’t call it that given the 3-5 skills and how useful they can be to power builds to add much needed survivability.

I just think the orbs should be replaced with a 130 range AoE heal and adjust it’s scaling with healing power to 0.25 then replace staff 2 with debilitating slam that applies weakness.

I also think rev needs a 2 handed condition damage weapon (said this in the beta) possibly another power main hand as rev has some pretty decent off hands already for a power build. I just don’t think staff is half as bad as everyone makes out, it’s certainly a better option than what some classes have on their core weapons.

Vargamonth.2047:

I can agree on SoTM being stupidly powerful and on the need of nerfing it before other aspects of the weapon could be improved, but sticking to the conceptual design and purpose of any weapon or legend is a very dangerous path.

Staff was used because it provided decent defensive utility and allowed for a really strong disrupting and damaging move with SoTM. It’s still useful after the nerf, but if we keep pushing it towards its support concept, we could easily reach a point where it becomes a worse option than slotting a second off-hand and camping sword the whole time, effectively making the spec unable to fully capitalize on the weapon swap.

Conceptually, the revenant was presented as a class that could jump between “roles”, and we all know that’s something which will never be possible. First, because the energy mechanic makes continuous legend swapping pretty much mandatory, and then, because different “roles” would almost surely require different amulets/runes (which is not possible) and trait allocations.
The only way to make the idea somewhat true would be to choose a hybrid amulet and split the traits between both roles, which leaves a character that’s necessarily suboptimal all the time. If a character built like that works, then the class will produce a monster whenever it is specialized and/or some kind of sinergy between conceptually different tools is found.

IMHO not only the balance approach shouldn’t try to conceptually specialize different legends, weapons and traitlines, but actually reinforce their sinergies even if that requires nerfing the tools on their main conceptual purpose.

This all stems from the way revenant was designed from the start, without weapon swap. When they then added weapon swap they forgot to rebalance the weapons and sort out some of the other glaring issues.

I agree that staff could do with some changes to allow it to heal properly as the orbs thing is silly as well as punishing sweep. However the staff is not entirely a bad weapon, nice low cool down block and blind, good CC, blast with condition cleanse and heal on an equally low cool down. Ventari and Jalis need some changes too, the tablet doesn’t really work properly as a mechanic and Jalis could do with losing the taunt for a better skill to be honest.

When resistance is made to not be a complete counter to conditions then mallyx will need changing as well. I agree with the last point sort of but I don’t have any problems with having a weapon set being more defense and support based but not doing lots of damage. If I wanted damage I’d pick a weapon set where damage is its main purpose.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

apharma.3741:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

apharma.3741:

XxsdgxX.8109:

Classic member of a PvP community.

lol classic Rev player. Sorry but a defensive/support weapon being able to take off 50% of a persons health if not more while CCing them and being an evade frame is flat out broken.

This game used to be about risk and reward, when you attacked you would be vulnerable to being attacked. When you defended yourself you couldn’t usually attack.

HoT threw all these out of the window and it’s high time we returned to skills and builds having proper risk and reward.

Lol that same weapon has horrible damage otherwise, a terrible “heal” on auto attack, a block that has been nerfed twice for +50% CD compared to the original, and the easiest to interrupt “heal” in the game.

Revenant still has no condi clear and extremely deniable heals. Both Infuse Light and Enchanted Daggers heal less than 2k on activation. Seems pretty high risk to me. But yeah go on crying more

It has horrible damage because it was always designed to be a support weapon.

Did no-one here ever watch the developer chats on twitch during the development of HoT and the revenant as a class?

Staff was designed to be used with ventari with a theme of peaceful combat, the auto attack gives those orbs as their way (I’ll admit I always thought it wasn’t great design) of providing healing. The block that also blinds fits with the theme, AoE heal and condi cleanse and then the powerful CC to push enemies from allies. Even the bizarre number 2 skill was designed with defense in mind by applying weakness and being a flip over to “a powerful attack” to ward people off from attacking (yeah I thought that was a BS reason too).

Granted that powerful attack is laughable at 1.5 modifier when the attack is 1.0 but this was the intention with staff, it was never intended to be used as a DPS weapon.

You’re using the most offensive heal Shiro which relies on lifestealing but does extra damage and it heals for nearly 6.5k when it all hits, not exactly low. The Glint heal has the capacity to be a full heal if timed right and here’s the thing, you get 2 heals, yes you get 2 heals instead of one both on the same cool down as what most classes get.

Revenant is starting to become a properly balanced class, the stun break on pain absorption should have been from the start. Now if they made Jalis worth using and sorted out the ventari skills it might actually turn into a really nice class, once it’s out of 2nd beta.

Just bad design on healing orbs? THEY’RE TOTALLY NEGLIGIBLE. The heal on staff 4 is horrible and extremely telegraphed, only really used for condi clear since oh yeah the class has virtually none! Staff 2 is still useless. Staff 3 is 50% worse at being available for defense. Where exactly are these incredible support/defensive skills on staff??? Even the auto hits like a wet noodle when full zerk.

Both heals are still TOTALLY DENIABLE when you’re playing against someone with half a kittening brain. Shiro heal even got nerfed with daggers being used when hits are evaded/blocked. I can trait full glass with marauder amulet and tickle people to death lol. The only thing keeping revenant relevent is AoE CCs for rez denial and quickness sword auto. What a useful class that dies to the very mention of condition damage and thieves.

Again, support weapon, why are you complaining it doesn’t do high damage when it was never designed to do high damage. You’re literally complaining you can’t hammer with a screw driver at this point.

If those heals are so bad there’s nothing stopping you switching to a legend that has a more consistent heal.

All I hear is crying about how all the silly overpowered stuff about rev finally got sorted out and how you can’t instagib people anymore with phase traverse into surge of the mists.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

apharma.3741:

XxsdgxX.8109:

Classic member of a PvP community.

lol classic Rev player. Sorry but a defensive/support weapon being able to take off 50% of a persons health if not more while CCing them and being an evade frame is flat out broken.

This game used to be about risk and reward, when you attacked you would be vulnerable to being attacked. When you defended yourself you couldn’t usually attack.

HoT threw all these out of the window and it’s high time we returned to skills and builds having proper risk and reward.

Lol that same weapon has horrible damage otherwise, a terrible “heal” on auto attack, a block that has been nerfed twice for +50% CD compared to the original, and the easiest to interrupt “heal” in the game.

Revenant still has no condi clear and extremely deniable heals. Both Infuse Light and Enchanted Daggers heal less than 2k on activation. Seems pretty high risk to me. But yeah go on crying more

It has horrible damage because it was always designed to be a support weapon.

Did no-one here ever watch the developer chats on twitch during the development of HoT and the revenant as a class?

Staff was designed to be used with ventari with a theme of peaceful combat, the auto attack gives those orbs as their way (I’ll admit I always thought it wasn’t great design) of providing healing. The block that also blinds fits with the theme, AoE heal and condi cleanse and then the powerful CC to push enemies from allies. Even the bizarre number 2 skill was designed with defense in mind by applying weakness and being a flip over to “a powerful attack” to ward people off from attacking (yeah I thought that was a BS reason too).

Granted that powerful attack is laughable at 1.5 modifier when the attack is 1.0 but this was the intention with staff, it was never intended to be used as a DPS weapon.

You’re using the most offensive heal Shiro which relies on lifestealing but does extra damage and it heals for nearly 6.5k when it all hits, not exactly low. The Glint heal has the capacity to be a full heal if timed right and here’s the thing, you get 2 heals, yes you get 2 heals instead of one both on the same cool down as what most classes get.

Revenant is starting to become a properly balanced class, the stun break on pain absorption should have been from the start. Now if they made Jalis worth using and sorted out the ventari skills it might actually turn into a really nice class, once it’s out of 2nd beta.

There was no plans to have more tournaments and haven’t been for a very long time because populations would normally get smaller after a tournament had finished. As far as the upgraded version of the armour goes, not a clue, there’s been no news on it.

If I had to make an educated guess (and this is a guess) it would be added when they figure out what they’re doing to allow people to get the mistforged hero weapons. It would make sense to link it to a gift of heroes for upgrading.

XxsdgxX.8109:

Classic member of a PvP community.

lol classic Rev player. Sorry but a defensive/support weapon being able to take off 50% of a persons health if not more while CCing them and being an evade frame is flat out broken.

This game used to be about risk and reward, when you attacked you would be vulnerable to being attacked. When you defended yourself you couldn’t usually attack.

HoT threw all these out of the window and it’s high time we returned to skills and builds having proper risk and reward.

skarpak.8594:

apharma.3741:

This was meant to be hard end game content and now it’s a joke just like dungeons were.

it is completly normal that once you learned the mechanics and you got gud at it, its not challenging anymore.

sure, you can go the way and make the fight so hard that only the 1% who can learn, have faster reactions then anyone else and know how to control their defensive uses and how to manage them through a fight.

is that really how you want the fight to be. sesshi level solo’s just for a 10 man group? do you really think you can do that?

so before you go arround and saying stuff like: its a joke and its easy, rather think before you speak.

i mean, sure, you could also go the mathematical way and just take dps possible over the time of a fight and adjust the bosshealth accordingly.
which is not the way to go, because just giving something more stats so it takes longer doesn’t make it harder.
the only thing that happens is that slacker who cannot hold their perfect rotation up for the whole time can’t raid anymore.

can you? even if kitten starts happening?

and btw. dungeons where never a joke. it was actually pretty great what the speedrun community made out of them.
because these dungeons where never about the bossfights.

and before you say something like: now you can kill everything totally fast because of the damage which came with hot: just because everyone now got more dmg through builds, nothing changed much. back in the days you also killed them this fast…just the normal pug couldn’t do it.

Way to snip my post down to one part and then twist it to your own agenda. The point was that it was supposed to be moderately difficult content that required an investment in time to learn and to be actually decent at your role.

This is lost when people sell raids and achievements as achieving it starts to mean less and less.

@Nikkinella: Your problem isn’t that raids are difficult or you can’t do them it’s that legendary armour is tied to raids. ANet should have made it independent of raids as now there is 0 prestige to anything in raids as it can all be bought.

Jayne.9251:

apharma.3741:

Jayne.9251:

See #3.

You all a making it like thieves are the boogeyman. You can kill them.

Or it could be all thieves in EU play drunk.

Fought Baruch Bay recently? They have a thief who seems to enjoy tagging keeps for hours. Problem is that you only need to tag any guard to contest a keep.

So while you guard a gate they go to the wall, choking gas an archer and BAM contested. I mean just think how many guards there are at gates and on walls to contest with, you will need several players just to guard it all.

Also cold doesn’t affect thieves anymore as most run unhindered combatant which removes cold on dodge.

They actually taught me how to fight thieves, whole server is full of thieves, lol, kept me on my toes. Was frustrating for a long time, but useful.

This sounds like a challenge to make you truly fear thieves again…

Also BB thieves are terrible, 100-0 most of the time except this one condi guy who pretty much runs away 90% of the time.

Superb display of everything that’s unbalanced in WvW, tanky builds going full condition damage for stupid amounts of damage with boonshare mesmer to take it to the next level of cheese.

jackynikola.1205:

nah doesnt work. Taking marauder makes my hp 21k. So before I eaven start any burst am geting one shoted by Thiefs or Warriors. Eaven if i pull full burst target is barely on 50%hp so… MMMMMMMMM quiting mesmer for good. Ty guys for help

er ok, if that’s all it takes for you to stop playing a class I have 2 alternatives to the advise I gave earlier, I think it’s much more suited to your attention span.

High damage high sustain.

Easy for a new player.

Crinn.7864:

Necro condi bombs involve a combination of corrupts and transfers. The condi bombs look scary but then you realize that most of the condis are utility condis like vuln, cripple, and weakness and the damage you are taking from the necro condi bomb is not as high as it first looks.

Don’t get me wrong I know a lot are debuff conditions or utility or whatever people want to call them however the point I was making is these other conditions are pumped out like rabbits. These cover the dangerous ones that really will kill you but it can be very difficult to clear and cannot be targeted specifically for a cleanse a lot of the time.

Cynz.9437:

@apharma.3741:
- point is, other classes have better damage capability than thief IF they chose to go dps. Whether they can survive with it, is different story. Also, we still have example of warrior pumping out way more dmg while also being extremely bunkery.

Yes this ties back to what I have said before about how berserker spec removed the risk from what would be a balanced class. Berserker spec brought about 2 things:

1. Low cool down T3 burst skills
2. Easier ways to build adrenaline

Core warrior has trouble building adrenaline without traiting for it and missing a burst is a big hit to it’s condition cleansing and healing. Berserker doesn’t suffer this problem at all as if it misses swap weapon and have another shot.

Cynz.9437:

- maraduer scrapper has still more suvival than thief. What is your point?

The point I made incredibly clear if you’d bothered to read is that it also has a lot less mobility than a thief. When you consider both points the thief is on top as being able to run away from a bad fight or to a good fight in your favour is worth as much as if not more than your defences in it. The thief also has the tools to survive a decent time in a fight, not as long as scrapper but again, you need to take mobility into account.

Cynz.9437:

- but you do have issues with thief doing damage atm, do you? Otherwise you wouldn’t be in this thread demanding IP nerf, or am i guessing wrong?

I have issues with IP not thief doing damage. IP is a bad trait that is too rewarding to a spec (DP) that arguably doesn’t need help while also requiring nothing but power stat to do the large amount of damage it does.

I have issues with thief’s insane mobility and how it cannot have a point holding build at all because of this and the general balance of thief.

Cynz.9437:

- once again bringing up wvw is pointless. I am not going to respond to any wvw arguments anymore as it is completely irrelevant to pvp and game will never be balanced around that mode.

Fine by me but it was pointing as proof that thief (and many other combinations of skills, stats and specs on many classes) is incredibly broken when you remove conquest.

Osu.6307:

I know you can never completely do away with pin-sniping. The driver is always in front, and usually a guard, so it is pretty easy to figure it out by deductive reasoning. I’m just trying to make it less obvious.

Anet created this problem by changing stability. Least they can do is try to mitigate the damage.

It depends on the driver, at the end of the day 90% of drivers it’s extremely easy to figure out who they are by the movement of the group. The driver is usually the first one to move in any change of direction and so without stealth is easy to find.

Ultimately the best way to defend against pin sniping is to be proactive and have a smaller group able to disrupt them before the driver gets into range. Well the other option is to change the pin every few fights but I figure that’s almost as annoying as the problem.

Cynz.9437:

@apharma.3741: Fat wasn’t wrong, eles and mes do pump out more dmg if they build for it, it is their choice not to.
You do claim that thief hardcounters ele so much thus implying thief needs a nerf, where in fact issue lies with ele and not thief because dps ele is just generally not doing so well atm.

“They have way better defenses and engage/disengage than any glass ele/ranger/mesmer/engineer could dream of." is still in the same sentence. The sentence does state that thief has better defense than glass ele/ranger/mes/engi which is just wrong.

I play paladin scrapper because i play to hold point and not murder people. It is my choice. I may not spike people to death but i can hold point for extended period of time vs multiple enemies. So here is that. Surely, glass engi couldn’t do that but glass engi also play differently and frankly engi is not really meant to be a roamer atm, same as thief is not meant to be a point holder. It was Anet’s decision. I will never be good team support like ele or druid, same way as ele not going to be good dps spike roamer (unless Anet suddenly changes their opinion).

Except you can’t pump out damage if you’re dead most of the time or actually cannot put out the damage because your “high damage” are highly telegraphed abilities or have 3/4s cast times and susceptible to IP which this discussion is about. Glass ele has clear strengths and weaknesses, risks and rewards the problem isn’t all ele though it has it’s problems, it’s the lack of risk in many damage builds now, could probably say most meta builds tbh.

You play paladins scrapper so of course your scrapper is going to be more tanky, you have 560 more toughness on top of 3 defensive lines. Making the kind of comparison you did earlier is very misleading.

Cynz.9437:

What you basically claim, by the looks of it, is that it is wrong that thief is at least good at one role and shouldn’t have any at all.

Nope, never said that and if you’d bothered to read any post I’ve made in the forums at all you’d know I actually want build variety for all classes including thief. I have no issues with a few classes being better at a role than others so long as the difference is not so disgustingly large as it is now. This is classic of what you do though, always assume and run away with what people say.

Cynz.9437:

“Do I also have to point out how ridiculous what you said is when there is a world of difference between the state of the game now and the state of the game in S1/2?”
I am well aware that meta has changed, point remains, when thieves didn’t exist (and s1 wasn’t only example for it), people still prefered to run bunker/bruiser builds. Why? Because of conquest.

Glass ele would also die to literary every single meta build so i don’t see your point here.

Also, wvw is completely irrelevant to pvp. Completely different mode, completely different objectives. If Anet did balance game around wvw, you wouldn’t be able to play your beloved mes in pvp at all.

The reason I bring up WvW is that it is a game mode without point cap mechanics, essentially where the conquest style is mostly removed. If you go play that you will see that the issue isn’t conquest, it is actually thief and how it’s mechanics need a complete overhaul especially stealth.

FYI I don’t play mesmer in PvP, I’m not mechanically good with condition builds as I play power mes in WvW, couple that with not having the required map awareness to fulfil the role and would be a liability on that build.

Edit: Added “The problem isn’t all ele though it has some problems”

Pancake.3092:

All the suggested changes mean that theres no point for a team to commit to a keep unless they know they outnumber the defenders…

Requiring wall damage to contest a waypoint means the game automatically scouts for the defending side, so you know 100% whether your keep is being attacked or not just by looking at the waypoint status.

Right now a small attacking side might be able to get a keep if the defending side are slow with scouting / responding. If waypoints contested when the structure was damaged, the defending blob would respond immediately.

Also you might be substituting one annoying thing for another. If solo people can’t contest by hitting guards, they’ll just build trebs …

The point is that it will cost something to contest a keep more so than 1 guy running around hitting a guard every 5 mins. You also have the option to destroy the Seige and flip the camp they had to use to build the Seige.

What might happen is you have 2 people running around building a cata and hitting the wall once but again it takes time and resources to do and you won’t be able to keep a way point contested all the time.

Think of it like this: Ever had a T3 stonemist castle? You know how useless a waypoint usually is there unless you’re completely dominating a match up? It’s contested 95% of the time as either someone is trebbing or has catas up trying to paper it. The same is currently true of keep waypoints if someone chooses to be a troll except they don’t need to do anything but tap a guard.

OriOri.8724:

@Ballads – Because keeps on EB don’t have WPs either, oh wait, they do.

apharma.3741:

Simplest solution is to require gates or walls to take 500 damage in a single hit to become contested, simple.

This is reasonable. Requiring siege to contest keeps would prevent griefers from tapping guards and running away in stealth for hours, as well as prevent PvD players from taking a WP out of commission while keeping the swords up so you know they are there.

There is a down side, you can have a zerg roll up build 5 catas and the wall will be down on T1 before it’s tagged. Even keeps will have a substantial amount of health knocked off a wall first. Conversely you will know that it’s a serious attack to towers and keeps if you see crossed swords.

Another idea would be to also put up white swords when there’s X number of enemies within a certain range of a keep or tower.

Some good keybinds help for doing continuum split bursts Ori, being able to place your fingers on buttons to press mirrorblade, CS and blink in that order within the same fraction of a second while pressing mind wrack as soon as the clone spawns helps a lot.

Still working on it myself.

LouWolfskin.3492:

Khisanth.2948:

So you are implying that power build can’t kill just as fast?

People simply feel powerless against conditions because before they could be ignored, to a point at least.

I personally don’t think that conditions themselves are overtuned but maybe a few skills applying them (Reapershroud 4 for example).

I agree with this and I also agree with the person who said about conditions 2 years ago were bad because they could be overwritten so easily like burn and poison with less damaging ones from power builds.

However I do think conditions in general have come to a point where they’re instead of being tactically applied get applied without any thought. This isn’t a stab at the current condition builds, though necros seem to apply 6 conditions extremely fast, this is about how cover conditions from power builds cover the damaging conditions of condition based builds.

As an example if there’s a DH in a fight and you trigger a trap you will get 6s of cripple and usually 1.5s slow. Add in the spear and you have burn, that’s 3 conditions. If you were already fighting a condi mesmer and had some confusion and torment on you you will cleanse the DHs conditions as they were applied last and you could have 2-3 other conditions on you depending on sigils.

I simply think we have too many conditions being applied in general not specifically condition damage builds or damage components that make it a lot harder to cleanse what you need to cleanse.

Cynz.9437:

So is it thief preventing ele from going glass or just any class? Which is it, can you actually decide lol?

This is the original arguement:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Pretty sure if said mesmer and ele were glass built like the thief is then they would be pumping out higher numbers but they are built for team fights.

To which Zenith responded with “No they wouldn’t, because they’d be hardcountered by glass thief/warrior immediately and would spend most of the fight dying to the thief class which has more instantaneous, less telegraphed damage, and far more mobility/disengage.”

Just because glass ele is hard countered by thief it doesn’t mean thief has a monopoly on that counter. Glass eles are extremely countered by thieves however they are also countered by warrior, rev and quite a few other classes in the meta as outside of their burst they just don’t have the sustain and damage of other classes in the meta. However the point still stands, they’re countered to extreme lengths by thief, war and rev, all of which were mentioned in the guys post specifically.

Nice of you to try and twist my argument into saying ele is only countered by thief however I didn’t say it was only countered by thief.

Cynz.9437:

The comment i quoted refered to engis….. other posters can bring them up but i can’t now? What gives?

You mean this?

“No other glass builds exist because thief/warrior/rev (nerfed to irrelevance now) farms pretty much any glass build. They have way better defenses and engage/disengage than any glass ele/ranger/mesmer/engineer could dream of.”

You put: “thieves don’t have better defense than wars or engis, whole reason why they are so mobile is because they cant stick to any fights due to their squishines. I play scrapper and necro and those are way tankier than my thief could ever be.”

Thief has way better engage/disengage than any other class, no questions asked, it has been an unquestionable fact for 3 years nearly. You made no mention or seemed to account for this at all in your remark which seem weird as any glass specs role isn’t generally to be in a team fight but to spike people down and move on. Mobility here counts for a great deal more than defences to which thief has ample for it’s role and in this regard the poster was right with those 3 classes.

Let me ask, are you playing glass scrapper or the meta paladins/menders?

Cynz.9437:

Once again, if thief is such an issue, why did nobody switch from bruiser/bunker builds in s1-2 when nobody played thief? I keep hearing same overused argument every year and yet i don’t see people going FA ele or glass engis or <insert any glass build here >, even in tourneys when there is no thief on either teams and people switch a lot. So what gives? Is thief really the issue or is it actually conquest?

As mentioned, glass ele is hard countered by thief but also warrior and rev. Do I also have to point out how ridiculous what you said is when there is a world of difference between the state of the game now and the state of the game in S1/2?

Now before someone mentions “what does glass ele have to do with IP?” Well IP will completely shut down a glass ele build using Sceptre, even then a lot of damaging skills on other weapons are highly interruptable which means while an ele might be able to cover their heal they can’t pressure or attack so it’s a lost fight.

Oh and believe me, if you actually roamed in WvW instead of following a tag and trash talking players while spamming shortbow skills to tag enemies you’d realise how completely broken thief truly is. Conquest is the only thing stopping thief from showing how terrible it’s mechanics are, just ask Deceiver X or look at some of his posts.

Simplest solution is to require gates or walls to take 500 damage in a single hit to become contested, simple.

Cynz.9437:

Zenith.7301:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Pretty sure if said mesmer and ele were glass built like the thief is then they would be pumping out higher numbers but they are built for team fights.

No they wouldn’t, because they’d be hardcountered by glass thief/warrior immediately and would spend most of the fight dying to the thief class which has more instantaneous, less telegraphed damage, and far more mobility/disengage.

No other glass builds exist because thief/warrior/rev (nerfed to irrelevance now) farms pretty much any glass build. They have way better defenses and engage/disengage than any glass ele/ranger/mesmer/engineer could dream of.

There’s a reason ele can only exist as support and mesmer is a crappy version of thief as a roamer. There’s a reason druid only rolls support and engineer/necro are only condi.

This argument is extremely overused and really really wrong. Whole reason why other classes don’t run glass is because they have builds that offer them more in conquest.

There have been cases in the past when thief was extremely underplayed or not played at all (e.g. season 1), tournaments are great example, even now i have been in matches where there wasn’t a single thief on any team, yet people chose to run bunkier builds. Why? I mean there is no thief to murder them so why not run glassy builds? Because of nature of conquest. At the end of the day it is all about holding point and bruisers/bunkers exceel at it.

Also, what you said is wrong. Thieves don’t have better defense than wars or engis, whole reason why they are so mobile is because they cant stick to any fights due to their squishines. I play scrapper and necro and those are way tankier than my thief could ever be. The fun part, current meta war puts out way more dmg than thief (they can kill my necro way faster than thief) and is way tankier than thief as well.
Only reason why thief is still viable IS because it is so mobile. If thief didn’t have mobility it would be completely unviable. If you actually think that thief has better defense than all said classes, why don’t you go play one w/o running away, please record it so we all can see how tanky thieves are.

Lol glass ele is completely countered by thief, saying otherwise only makes people give no merit to anything else you say. If running zerk an ele will literally die to a steal backstab, if running marauder they will live longer but given most ele weapons have substantial casts (all but dagger main hand) they’re easily farmed.

Ele cannot go glass because they will die very quickly and easily when focused by just about any class and easily outperformed by most classes within the high damage role. Need I remind you the original comment was about glass ele and glass mesmer not warrior and engy so stop bringing them up.

The comparison was made between glass ele/mes defences and thief, war and rev having better defences so I dunno why you keep bringing up engy, seems you just have an axe to grind at this point.

To be honest I thing selling raids sort of cheapens the whole experience, they were supposed to be end game content you had to work hard to complete. Now it’s just a joke with some absolutely appalling players just buying their way to the achievements and legendary armour.

This was meant to be hard end game content and now it’s a joke just like dungeons were.

Offair.2563:

Why do people talk so much about a teef tagging keeps. It’s kitten easy to do it with any class.

My guess anet changed it from tapping gates to aggro a guard as hardened gates prevented pvd for 100%. Now that has been nerfed with 50% i think the way to contest stuff should be reverted to actually tap the gate again.

Probably because doing it with thief is easy mode and almost guaranteed escape so long as you’re not comatose. You also have the excessive mobility to get back in 2 mins if you somehow died.

BlackBeard.2873:

To make it useful in pvp: reduce the cast time to 1/4s and the CD to like 30 (but reduce the duration), then I might consider taking glyph of storms for the near-invulnerability on-point from earth storm.

I think it should have a 1/2s to 3/4s cast tbh, far too many skills are instant or near instant in the game. I also think they should all have the same duration as currently the different elements are all over the place in terms of duration.

Jayne.9251:

See #3.

You all a making it like thieves are the boogeyman. You can kill them.

Or it could be all thieves in EU play drunk.

Fought Baruch Bay recently? They have a thief who seems to enjoy tagging keeps for hours. Problem is that you only need to tag any guard to contest a keep.

So while you guard a gate they go to the wall, choking gas an archer and BAM contested. I mean just think how many guards there are at gates and on walls to contest with, you will need several players just to guard it all.

Also cold doesn’t affect thieves anymore as most run unhindered combatant which removes cold on dodge.

Replace staff with great sword.

Mirrorblade > mindwrack at close range can do 10k on zerk targets and if you’re marauder/zerk mix. The iZerker also does more damage too, does about 3-6k damage depending on how many hits it gets in.

sophiewhite.3149:

apharma.3741:

sophiewhite.3149:

Auroraborealis.7310:

sophiewhite.3149:

so basically your saying because people were born on a different part of this giant rock they are automatically much different and kinder and better.

Well compare two different species of bird, that evolved in different parts of the world. They are both majestic and unique in their own way, but due to certain environmental factors sub species could display completely different behavioral patters. Yes they are both birds, and no bird is more special than another bird when you consider a universal perspective; all live is amazing. However, its undeniable that sociological and behavioral patters of humans can vary from culture to culture.

I’m no psychologist but it doesn’t take a genius to figure out there’s a difference in the average player in EU and NA regions. But don’t take my word for it, go check it out for yourself. You’re still gonna lose in EU, and you’re still gonna have blowouts, but they are less common, and even when they do happen you don’t have people expressing their negative emotions quite as frequently and as vulgarly as in NA.

so EU and NA are also different species? i agree it can be different but im getting tired of non stop EU is superior to NA comments constantly. if you even mention your NA in a thread or stream you instantly get comments like “well na isnt real pvp anyway” as if the comment has no validity. your sample size is too small to say its for sure better 100%. id say you got lucky. EU has toxic people so does NA its no different.

Jebro is in the top 50 in NA.

Just let that sink in for a minute.

Jebro….top 50….NA….Jebro.

im not talking about whos better. EU has better high tier players we all know this. but your not any different from us. your not more or less toxic. our opinions have the same validity. we both play the same game.

Well you can always make a free account and come play with us in EU or if you have an alt move it over. I also think you’re carrying the species metaphor way too far, he was just expressing how they can be different do to different locations and environmental factors.

Honestly I don’t often see people screaming “noob [class], uninstall” or anything like that often, you do get it but it’s maybe once an evening at most. How often does it happen NA?

sephiroth.4217:

apharma.3741:

sephiroth.4217:

Archon.6480:

apharma.3741:

Might want to take it to reddit, there’s already a nice salty thread on there and your post won’t magically disappear like this will in a few hours.

Annabel is one of the best in NA and should be first or second place. If we keep this thread clean and come up with some good ideas how to prevent this, they will keep it open, and might even implement our ideas.

I think he referring to posting names on forums but it’s a top player so it’s allowed, he can even call us plebs too if he wants.

Yep that’s what I was referring to.

Also Annabel can call a generic group plebs but cannot single a person or persons out for planning. Yes, Gaile actually clarified that in Helseths post.

Yea, funny how this “successful” season has pushed so many away from the game and that’s what they chose to clarify. Not exactly sure why I keep checking forums for something either.

Good to know I can call people plebs if I don’t single them out.

Gaile Gray.6029:

A few of you were concerned about the use of the term “pleb.” It’s not the greatest term, but I seem to remember when newbie/noob/n00b was considered the height of insult and it’s now commonplace and pretty acceptable across the board.

The ground rule is this:

• A generic reference = ok. Example: “The average pleb will…”
• A direct referral to another player as a pleb = not ok. “You’re a pleb.” “You play like a pleb.” “Your socks carry the unmistakable odor of plebism.”
• Other types of insults aren’t good, either.

If you’re going to report, look at what’s being said. If you’re going to try an attack or a counter attack, may I politely introduce you to your choice of PvP modes rather than doing it on the forums?

No, not everyone has a solid state drives and even a DC for 30s can mean it takes over 1 min to reconnect. A game isn’t always a loss because someone has been gone for a minute, I’ve won matches where it’s taken half the game to convince some immature person that the game isn’t lost because of one wipe in mid.

Since when is the abbreviation of solid state drive a banned word? Seriously ANet you need to stop these kittens breeding.

I think you really need to re-evaluate what is important in life if you’re even thinking of doing this.

Instead you could go on a holiday, meet a nice guy/girl and be a lot more happy for a few weeks.

sophiewhite.3149:

Auroraborealis.7310:

sophiewhite.3149:

so basically your saying because people were born on a different part of this giant rock they are automatically much different and kinder and better.

Well compare two different species of bird, that evolved in different parts of the world. They are both majestic and unique in their own way, but due to certain environmental factors sub species could display completely different behavioral patters. Yes they are both birds, and no bird is more special than another bird when you consider a universal perspective; all live is amazing. However, its undeniable that sociological and behavioral patters of humans can vary from culture to culture.

I’m no psychologist but it doesn’t take a genius to figure out there’s a difference in the average player in EU and NA regions. But don’t take my word for it, go check it out for yourself. You’re still gonna lose in EU, and you’re still gonna have blowouts, but they are less common, and even when they do happen you don’t have people expressing their negative emotions quite as frequently and as vulgarly as in NA.

so EU and NA are also different species? i agree it can be different but im getting tired of non stop EU is superior to NA comments constantly. if you even mention your NA in a thread or stream you instantly get comments like “well na isnt real pvp anyway” as if the comment has no validity. your sample size is too small to say its for sure better 100%. id say you got lucky. EU has toxic people so does NA its no different.

Jebro is in the top 50 in NA.

Just let that sink in for a minute.

Jebro….top 50….NA….Jebro.

Sins.4782:

Ben Phongluangtham.1065:

Should be in tomorrow.

Evan, or the fix?

Gonna take a stab at both…

Oh wow that looks really bad, I’m not stabbing anyone tomorrow!

Jayne.9251:

OriOri.8724:

Jayne.9251:

OriOri.8724:

Jayne.9251:

OriOri.8724:

One change I would like to see is to not have WPs be contested until either a wall/gate is down.

Careful for what you wish for. Those swords can mean the difference between defending lords room and getting there JUST as it flips. One gate down and no immediate defenders … Might as well just hand it to them.

Have it affect WPs and attackers might as well not attack. People can insta port in.

I only want to change how the WPs are contested, not how the orange swords spawn. Those should stay the same, but it just doesn’t make sense for one person to knock a WP out of commission by doing almost nothing. And, having the WP still be uncontested until the outer wall is down gives that server more of a chance of getting there to defend. It might be too long, so maybe when walls/gates are at 50% might be better but still.

Also, if at all possible (though I highly doubt it), someone who hits a gate, then runs away mmediately as soon as you come up to fight them, rinse and repeat should never, ever be able to contest anything.

There’s strategy involved in the pizza delivery model.

Contest the centre keep on alpine and force your opponent to have to run all the way from spawn to get to a keep under attack. Any delay can mean victory if timed well.

I’m well aware of that strategy. I think its a bullkitten strategy that Anet should get rid of already. If you want to contest a WP then you should be putting serious pressure on that keep, not killing a guard or two that are roaming outside every couple minutes. That’s lazy and only requires a single person to hamper an entire servers’ ability to respond. That’s too much power put into a single person’s hands, too much. It’s just something that shouldn’t be happening. Go actually attack the keep and make a concentrated effort if you want to take down their WP.

It’s not a bull-kitten strategy.

There are many viable counters to it; the prime one being jumping out of your keep and killing the guy who’s doing it. Over and over. Hiding behind the walls and pew pewing with siege won’t stop them – it just irritates them and makes them more determined.

I can think of five different ways to dissuade it.

The problem is when said person is a thief who literally just comes back over and over and over again to tap a guard on the wall then stealth runs away for 5 mins. Then they go to another part of the wall and do it, you can literally have a keep contested for hours while needing a disproportionate amount of people to kill him or just stop him contesting it.

Remember a thief can get back again in plenty of time even if they die every time.

Also did someone say pizza, mines a pepperoni please!

sephiroth.4217:

Archon.6480:

apharma.3741:

Might want to take it to reddit, there’s already a nice salty thread on there and your post won’t magically disappear like this will in a few hours.

Annabel is one of the best in NA and should be first or second place. If we keep this thread clean and come up with some good ideas how to prevent this, they will keep it open, and might even implement our ideas.

I think he referring to posting names on forums but it’s a top player so it’s allowed, he can even call us plebs too if he wants.

Yep that’s what I was referring to.

Also Annabel can call a generic group plebs but cannot single a person or persons out for planning. Yes, Gaile actually clarified that in Helseths post.

God help you if you ever play in EU.

Map pings and drawing is one of the best ways to communicate.

I used the meta build and did ok after the first few times as I knew what to expect. Having said that I also do it very easily on a keyfarm character without elite spec and imo it is easier with fire, air and arcana for high vigor uptime.

Fire is all top
Air is bottom, top, top
Arcana is middle, bottom, top as I don’t generate that many boons for bountiful power to be worth it.
Heal use glyph of elemental harmony, it’s one of the largest heals ele has
Utilities glyph of storms, lightning flash, signet of fire and glyph of elementals.

The trick is if you’re playing staff to stay ranged and kite the boss, use burning retreat to get away if/when he teleports or lightning flash and continue afraid to switch to water for a cleans on number 5 and then to earth to blast it with either eruption (need to be fast) or dodge roll with evasive arcana.

If you’re still having trouble you can use bowl of orrian truffle and meat stew for more endurance regen and switch signet of fire or glyph of storms to arcane shield.

Might want to take it to reddit, there’s already a nice salty thread on there and your post won’t magically disappear like this will in a few hours.

Ross Biddle.2367:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Ross Biddle.2367:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Ryuk.6840:

Cynz.9437:

More so, you are implying IP is broken because thief invests into damage instead of picking more survival? Should i remind you on things like DH traps, that deal more than IP damage to EVERYONE, not a single target like IP. Same goes for necro marks etc. Sry but in grand picture 3k single target damage dealt by glass canon is hardly broken.

When combined with 500 with Headshot and other 2k from the sigl of air/fire + beeing ranged that punish evey1 even for moving , then there something wrong

That why they nerfed the sigil of air and fire in the past , and the spamm Headshot spec where one most of the superior specs after the S/d have been ’’destroyed’’
(by Caed in the money-prized tournament with his Dagger/unerfed Black Powder spamm)

If your way of your thinking is like your theif (pewpewpew 2222222) , theres lies the problem of understanding with him

Edit: Dont say that the Elite specs caused harm to the game , and in the other hand try to defend them …
Thats simply moronic…

One question how does this punish people from moving??? The Meta Build people are complaining about doesn’t use Torment so no punishing people for moving. And complaining about Sigils that everyone has access to and that can go off on any attack, smh I feel like you are just trying to fish for a reason to cry for Something is OP, but keep trying to make excuses that have no bearing on the situation.

And guess what almost all classes currently have an over abundance of counters to the Interrupts and the Headshot projectile, almost all Meta Build puke out Stability, Aegis/Blocks/Projectile Hate, all on relatively low CD. Maybe they should Shave those down a lot if they are gonna nerf PI.

Exactly. See, this guy gets it. While you have to wait around some circumstances to use Headshot, what’s really OP is the unblockable (bas venom), insta cast, non-LoS, teleport, boon stripping Steal. Of course Steal and Headshot are hardly the only options a thief has.

XD

Complaining now about a 40 sec single target 1 charge Cc that does no damage by itself, that the charge gets wasted if someone uses a Dodge, or if Thief gets blinded(which there is an abundance of) or if it gets obstructed, which FYI happens a lot to Steal even on perfectly flat ground, so no damage and no cc happen? Bahahaha, you guys are trying hard to fish now.

You want to see the epitome of Unblockable CC? Look at Warrior 6 seconds all attacks are unblockable, and they can keep the Cc up while all their Cc skills except one does more damage than PI w/Headshot.

Nice try though will wait for more excuses.

Rofl

How about a 20s steal that rips stability and applies a daze after. Insta cast, no animation, no need for LoS, teleports, etc etc.

See, what you obviously don’t understand is how different classes with different mechanics mean different thing when it comes to balance. So 6 seconds of unblockable attacks might seem crazy if, say, you’re a thief. But on a warrior at the cost of a utility spot, it’s not unreasonable at all. In fact the devs are so confident of it being on a warrior they actually give war the potential to double access (traited) on a 20s CD each. Because while it’s strong for a warrior to be able to pressure a target who wants to sit behind a block all of a sudden, it’s certainly not over powered considering- warrior. Nice strawman though, maybe try again.

To be clear: I’ve not targeted PI specifically at all. But I’m happy to continually point out how Thief ini system and their overall mechanics are, and have always been broken. If anything we should be thankful for the changes to the game that have left them in the somewhat troublesome (more a slight annoyance for them really than any actual problem) position they’re in. They’ve certainly always been able to take extreme advantage in this game, and still do.

Ini system is still there. Mechanics still haven’t changed.

Rev is the same.

It’s a good thing the Devs realised pretty early on with rev that skills do need cool down with only a resource cost. Still got some pretty bs stuff like UA and surge of the mists needs reducing in WvW too. I liked the addition of stun break to pain absorption, it’s starting to get into a decent state.

(Looks at ventari and Jalis stance)

Oh well er…3 out of 5 isn’t bad I guess.