Guild Wars 2

Dungeons are already balanced to be solo’ed except for puzzles that are explicitly player gated.

And since you can sell the paths the rewards scale similarly.

In before the inevitable “when will anet address price DEFLATION which is making the rich get richer???!?!?!??!?!?!” threads.

Ragnarox.9601:

I aprove only zerker warriors, 2 in a team is a good thing. but 4 zerkers is too much and dps lose.

Feel free to check out the link in my signature. You can see the dungeon speed run records where everyone in the group is full dps. You can also watch the replays of the last dungeon tournament where everyone in the group is full dps.

The fact that you think everyone in dps gear dies alot and is a waste says more about you and your playskill than some universal truth.

kyubi.3620:

hybrid.5027:

kyubi.3620:

Black cat XIII.3576:

The tower was a massive group dungeon you move through. The ideal survival dungeon would be a party dungeon (5 people in a party entering) where something like an Asura gate gone haywire would be sending in enemies from far and wide. Dungeons are about surviving to the end, but the survival dungeon is about how many waves you can survive without end.

Picture this. You enter an Asuran lab and they are testing a single gate that can go anywhere without having a gate at the other location. They start up the gate but the control panel has been sabotaged by inquest and it explodes. “Oh well we can build another.” Then the gate fires up and the Asura close the doors with you inside saying “We have to quarantine the area until we know that the environment is safe.” Then a wave of icebrood pour through the gate. The Asura says “Lock it down! We can’t let the dragon’s minions out!” Now your stuck and the carnage begins. After you dispatch of the first wave the gate fires up again and destroyers come through. “The gate is choosing coordinates at random. Be careful we have no idea what could come out of there!” Then after a few more waves you get to wave five when the arm of a dragon reaches through the portal! “Attack the arm of the dragon! If you can hurt it bad enough it will pull it’s arm back and we can temporarily overload the gate. We may not be able to stop it, but we can give you a break.” Let your imagination continue from there.

The Survival Dungeon would be endless and the final reward would be based on how many waves you survived before your party were finally overcome and died.

Remove any possible corner for impossible wall stacking and you got a serious deal especialy if the ennemy has ranged unit amonst its rank. What about a circular arena so mob can actualy hit you from anywhere

You might as well say “remove any strategy or tactics that smart players could use to succeed in the instance.” I can tolerate a lot of dumb ideas, but I won’t tolerate asinine, uncreative ideas.

You call standing still stupidly and gathering all mob togueter tactics? I call that exploiting. Sure thats effective but you guys have it way to easy.. lets see how you fare when mobs are scattered all over the place.

I call using terrain to your advantage to be a valid tactic, yes. I know exactly how’d I’d fare if they were scattered, I would crush the content with ease thanks for you concern though. The difference is if there was some tactical application it might hold my interest for a few minutes, whereas a blank empty room wouldn’t hold it at all.

Illuminerdi.9153:

groups that don’t speedrun account for a fraction of a fraction of the overall groups that play dungeons in GW2, meaning that without investing a lot of time and energy into finding like minded people, most people’s first and last experience with dungeons will probably be speedrunning, where nobody will be ok with someone watching the cutscenes.

alright, so this is where you’re wrong. Go to the LFG. Start an Arah p3 group and put “anyone welcome, not a speed run” in the advertisement. Your group will fill in 3 minutes or less and you’ll get EXACTLY the type of run you want. You cannot dispute this and it basically runs contrary to the entire premise the OP is based upon. So I would accept your immediately apology for being wrong and spreading misinformation, but I hardly believe you have the intellectual honesty to admit it.

The funny thing is that most other speedrunners embrace the ideas of glitching and exploiting. They consider discovery and effective use of them a mark of pride and proudly tout their extensive knowledge of glitches and exploits to be better speedrunners…

Nintendo can’t ban you for exploiting the Ocarina of Time in a speed run. Anet can ban you in GW2. Thats reason #1 why you don’t understand the difference. Reason #2 is that any scrub can exploit their way through the content in the game, no one looks at that as skillful or something to be proud of. We praise people who show actual playskill, which is why our community looks down on exploits.

kyubi.3620:

Black cat XIII.3576:

The tower was a massive group dungeon you move through. The ideal survival dungeon would be a party dungeon (5 people in a party entering) where something like an Asura gate gone haywire would be sending in enemies from far and wide. Dungeons are about surviving to the end, but the survival dungeon is about how many waves you can survive without end.

Picture this. You enter an Asuran lab and they are testing a single gate that can go anywhere without having a gate at the other location. They start up the gate but the control panel has been sabotaged by inquest and it explodes. “Oh well we can build another.” Then the gate fires up and the Asura close the doors with you inside saying “We have to quarantine the area until we know that the environment is safe.” Then a wave of icebrood pour through the gate. The Asura says “Lock it down! We can’t let the dragon’s minions out!” Now your stuck and the carnage begins. After you dispatch of the first wave the gate fires up again and destroyers come through. “The gate is choosing coordinates at random. Be careful we have no idea what could come out of there!” Then after a few more waves you get to wave five when the arm of a dragon reaches through the portal! “Attack the arm of the dragon! If you can hurt it bad enough it will pull it’s arm back and we can temporarily overload the gate. We may not be able to stop it, but we can give you a break.” Let your imagination continue from there.

The Survival Dungeon would be endless and the final reward would be based on how many waves you survived before your party were finally overcome and died.

Remove any possible corner for impossible wall stacking and you got a serious deal especialy if the ennemy has ranged unit amonst its rank. What about a circular arena so mob can actualy hit you from anywhere

You might as well say “remove any strategy or tactics that smart players could use to succeed in the instance.” I can tolerate a lot of dumb ideas, but I won’t tolerate asinine, uncreative ideas.

1. “You dont have the option to watch cut scene in a speed run your first time.”

Guess what: if its your first time in a dungeon and youre trying to do a speed run, you are doing something wrong. Speedrun groups advertise themselves as such on the LFG, newbie groups do the same. If you voluntarily join a newbie group and start yelling at people to follow speed run strategies, you’re a jerk. If you voluntarily join a speed run group and watch the cutscenes you’re a jerk. Use the LFG tool properly and quit trying to fix what isn’t broken.

The solution you’ve come up with, a radical redesign of the game in order to facilitate better grouping is incredibly inefficient and frankly indicative of someone who has never engineered anything or been manager of any kind of complicated project. If the problem is a grouping issue, you solve that by putting development time into the grouping tool. What you don’t do is try to redesign the thing people are grouping for in order to socially engineer some kind of result that probably won’t happen due to the law of unintended consequences.

2. “dignity and respect.”

People do indeed deserve to be treated with dignity from the start up to the point where they reveal themselves to be undignified. I would say based on the lack of flaming responses and the minimal amount of sarcasm (frankly less reverse trolling than you probably deserved) you got dignity. However, respect is something that is earned and cultivated, not given freely.

My new plan of action.

1. Go to PvP forum.
2. Explain how I want to radically alter the game so it conforms to exactly what I want it to be regardless of the wishes of anyone else.
3. Expect to be treated with dignity and respect.
4. Express exasperation when my ideas are met with scorn.

I think this plan will work out for me.

This thread is either a troll or a cry for help. I think the solution in either case is the same.

What does wearing tanky gear have to do with speccing for support? Does Sentinel’s gear make your Wall of Reflect last longer?

Speaking conceptually, the faster you divorce yourself from the gear = playstyle mindset the better you’ll be. I mean it’s only been two years and I still have to put this fire out on a weekly basis so maybe I’m hoping for people to learn something they never will.

They could pretty much copy paste the tower, add some good rewards and implement some mechanism to prevent people from skipping to the end with stealth, and mechanisms to prevent people from farming the trash mobs for loot bags over and over. I’d play it.

kyubi.3620:

try the citadel of flame suicide room in the old style fashion (aka instead of regular mob all mob are silver circle and everyone jump in and run around trying to stay alive as much as possible) Now do tell me how zerker fits in a place

Ummm, killing all the elite mobs that spawned was how we did it in those days. Only scrubs actually did the suicide-kite-waypoint rush method.

Kabolt.7283:

hybrid.5027:

Doesn’t like dungeons, pvp or wvw. Maybe MMO isn’t the genre you’re looking for.

No I like those things they are just getting kinda old because it’s the sme ones over and over again

If you just hit level 80 you haven’t done enough of any of those things to even say you’re experienced, with the possible exception of PvP.

Doesn’t like dungeons, pvp or wvw. Maybe MMO isn’t the genre you’re looking for.

You act like Obal doesn’t have a PVT set still in his inventory for just such an occasion.

Cygnus.6903:

Most people don’t realise that Arcing Slice to a <50% foe does ~the same damage as Rush (if that would ever hit anything).

Rush benefits from Slashing Power, Berserkers Power, Forceful Greatsword. Arcing Slice doesn’t benefit from any of those. I’d rather have another Rush.

The change to adrenaline hurts berserkers power and heightened focus even more. Before, you lost adren on hit, so you always got the bonus with your burst skill. Now you lose adrenaline before the hit, so in pve your eviscerate and arcing slice have 15% less damage or 15% less chance to crit.

When I see pugs advertising an “exp” group I pretty much assume it’s noobs looking for a carry.

Lord Kuru.3685:

hybrid.5027:

During the heitred reign of terror we all learned to use friendly fillers to somewhat mitigate the risk of being kicked. Get on with re-learning it already.

Past tense? He was online a couple days ago.

He wasn’t kicking anyone afaik.

During the heitred reign of terror we all learned to use friendly fillers to somewhat mitigate the risk of being kicked. Get on with re-learning it already.

I particularly like the Arah p3/p4 light orbs puzzle. It’s a simple move the light orb from point a to point b, how you actually do it is up to you. Portal? Maybe. Shadow trap? Just running it? One person soloing with a special build? It’s completely open ended. It’s a bit simple, it would be nice if there were more things to make the actual movement harder or more complicated but the basic puzzle is great.

So good puzzles…

1. CoEp1 hacking event
2. Arah3/4 Orbs
3. CoFp2 Bombs
4. ACp2 arming the traps event
5. CMp1/p2 scavenger hunts

There ya go.

Ayrilana.1396:

spoj.9672:

You are still misunderstanding us. Just because we use speed to measure variability of a puzzle doesnt mean we are talking about tailoring for speedrunners. Its bad design because there is literally no choice. If you give players multiple choices on how to complete a puzzle, naturally some strategies will be faster and some will be slower and some will be safer while others will be riskier. This is what i was trying to say.

The majority of the posts claiming bad design has centered around speed/pacing/whatever.

Hybrid’s responses against my examples were:

hybrid.5027:

Nope, that is a good puzzle. Here is why: disorganized groups with no communication finish it with 35 seconds left on the timer. Organized groups with good communication can finish it with 70 seconds left on the timer. The better you are the faster the puzzle can be completed. Unlike the electric floor puzzle, which takes the same amount of time no matter how many times you’ve experienced it.

The lasers would be an awesome puzzle if there was some punishment for failure. As it is the puzzle is just a time gate and bad design.

No artificial time gate.

All of those have to do with speed and time. None of it has to do with choices.

You’ve given the following reasons regarding time and speed as well

spoj.9672:

That means they should not be locked behind timegates and ideally they should have a combat element.

spoj.9672:

Unskippable cutscenes, unecessary timegates, excessively long dialogues, buggy hologram generator hitboxes, player count checks, puzzles that dont involve combat and just add tedious timegating upon replay. Its an explorable dungeon path. It should of been designed to be replayable and at the same time engaging while replaying. It shouldnt give any reason to cause irritation to players. Some people dont mind the puzzles and timegating but many do. Its current design suggests it was built to be played once as a story instance.

The parts that are not bolded I have stated at least once already that I actually agree with. The only exception being the statement that there needs to be a combat element.

There there’s another post of yours about speed and pacing

spoj.9672:

The difference between those examples and the ones in aetherpath is that dolphin and bombs do not slow you down. Yes they add extra time due to you having to move places to get them done. But you have the freedom to do them fast or slow. The aetherpath puzzles seem to force extra timegating on you which just makes things worse when you already experience countless timegates from cutscenes and dialogues. I feel non combat puzzles should be in jumping puzzles not dungeons. People dont do dungeons for puzzles. The only non combat puzzles i dont mind are ones like TAFU’s bee corridor. It doesnt slow you down if you know what you are doing. So its not going to cause irritation but it still makes you pay attention.

What you’re missing is its about time*gates* not just time. If a puzzle takes a long time, relatively speaking, thats not necessarily bad. If the puzzle allows for tactical innovation and improvement thats great even if it takes 5 minutes (and the rewards are appropriate) but the problem is when it takes 5 minutes no matter what and there is no room for improvement. That is the ACp3 problem.

The Ooze puzzle is slightly better, but not by much. As I said, there is one “good” tactic and all other tactics are inferior and a better tactic will never be created than the good one. The best possible run of that puzzle has been done and there is no tactical innovation. It’s solved and it’s sad. It’s horrible.

The electric floor puzzle is just as bad as the ACp3 burrow event. In fact, the only saving grace is that its shorter than the burrow event. But nonetheless, there is only one way to do it: the right way. Doing it any other way is not doing it at all. It’s a solved puzzle.

Solved puzzles have limited replayability. No one enjoys solved puzzles. The best thing you can say about a solved puzzle is that its short. CoFp1 braziers puzzle is solved and simplistic, but at least its fast and not tedious. If only the electric floor puzzle was fast and not tedious.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

The problem isn’t just the cap, the damage is subpar no matter how you slice it.

A zerker warrior/ele/thief/guard can put out ~11k dps at level 80 if properly specced and following a good rotation.

At max stacks of everything (nor even theoretically possible currently) a condi necro (highest condi profession) can only put out ~8000 dps.

Highest condi profession is warrior or Engineer. But the point I’d like to make is that the 8k DPS is only counting the condition damage. You’re not counting the direct damage. In the same scenario you show for the berserker (25 Might, banners etc) the direct damage of a Rabid engineer/warrior is not negligible. they are basically the same DPS as the berserker.

The difference, like I said earlier is ramp up time. A condition damage Engineer caps out at about 18 bleeds, but it takes around 13 seconds to get that high. A berserker thief is outputting 15k DPS from the first second of the fight and suffers no ramp up time.

Ummmm no one uses Longbow for the auto attack dude. You start the fight with Barrage, then Rapid Fire and then swap to sword for the duration of the fight and at the last 5-10% you swap back and finish the boss with Rapid Fire. You should understand what the debate is about before you offer a lengthy opinion.

Essence Snow.3194:

I’m not saying what we have is completely wrong….just not enough of the picture to make definitive assertions about.

The sample size is in the hundreds of precursors at this point. How many standard deviations are you comfortable with?

Ayrilana.1396:

Tedious is subjective. I’m sure just as many people would say combat oriented puzzles are tedious as there would be for the non combat ones.

Yeah those people don’t even like dungeons though, so who cares about their opinion when dungeons are the topic?

Ok. So it’s all about how quickly you can do a puzzle rather than the actual challenge. Gotcha.

No, it’s all about technique and improvement and refinement producing faster and more efficient methods. The bomb puzzle presents almost limitless ability for good players to refine their run and improve. The garbage aetherpath puzzles present no such opportunity since they are time gates. The only opportunity you have is “not failing it.” Once you can escort the oozes every time on the first time you have mastered the puzzle and there is no further method for improvement. The puzzle is cheap and stupid and has been solved. The CoF2 bomb puzzle has not, as far as I am concerned, been solved. The fastest CoF2 bomb run possible has not been done yet. If you dont see the difference you’re choosing not to.

So your criteria is that skilled, organized groups must be able to complete the puzzle faster than unskilled, disorganized groups? Well just about every puzzle I listed fits that description along with those in the Aetherblade path.

Nope, as I hinted above, the Aetherpath puzzles are binary. did you succeed on the first try without problems? congrats you did it as fast as its possible to do. There is no further room for refinement or improvement. they are pass/fail puzzles. dumb. simple. tedious.

By the way, there is a wide variability with the electric floor puzzle between skilled, coordinated groups and those that are the opposite. Do a pug run and tell me you finish that puzzle in the same amount of time as your speed run group.

it’s a pass fail puzzle. It can only ever be done so fast. It can never be improved faster than “doing it correctly the first time.” that means it has minimal replayability and presents no interesting qualities.

The dolphin path and orb path in the aquatic fractal don’t have any punishment for failure. If you fail, you just WP (well, respawn) and try again. No different than the laser hallway. So how is one good design and the other not when both don’t meet your criteria for not having a punishment for failure mechanic?

In the Dolphin puzzle good players can do it significantly faster than slower ones. The more times you do it the faster that it can be done. The punishment mechanism is irrelevant for this particular puzzle since the puzzle itself is more about efficiency than a pass/fail mechanic.

hybrid.5027:

If I remember correctly 2/3 of the obstacles in the reactor fractal don’t require combat.

Most groups prefer any third tier fractal to that one.

Your point? Most groups prefer swamp to aquatic and you stated that aquatic puzzles are good design.

We are presented with our choice of which fractal to start with. People choose the least tedious one. My point was that you cite the Reactor fractal as an example of good design when it’s the least popular third fractal. Its failure (irrelevant to this conversation) was that it is laid out so that we should be able to split up the group and do multiple objectives simultaneously, but the objectives are designed so that they are explicitly not solo-able other than the heat room.

None of the puzzles I listed had a time-gate other than the time it takes to do them which is dither the same amount of less.

You must not understand the definition of a time gate. The Ooze puzzle can never be done faster than the time it takes the ooze to walk across. The electric floor puzzle is even worse in that regard because it has built in scripting that limits how fast the puzzle can be completed. Again compared to the bomb room in cof2, the electric floor puzzle will take the same amount of time a year from now that it takes now. The cof2 bomb puzzle will be significantly faster for the best teams a year from now because they will practice it more and be faster.

Road.1473:

If Anet adds anything called a “Raid” I will quit.

Simple as that.

Are you playing the game today and enjoying it? Yes. There are currently no raids in the game.

If they added raids could you continue to do everything you currently do and are enjoying? Yes.

So that raises the question, what is wrong with you?

Condition cap isn’t the problem at all in dungeons. The problem is ramp up time. If a boss fight is 20 seconds and your build doesn’t hit it’s condition limit until 13 seconds in, that is a big problem. If you could instantly start the fight with your conditions already applied to the boss there would be no reason not to bring a condition damage character, but thats not going to happen.

So yeah, the problem of ramp up time isn’t going to go away and removing the condition cap won’t change anything.

Ayrilana.1396:

So any obstacle within a dungeon that doesn’t have combat elements to it is poor design?

It all depends on whether its tedious and/or annoying.

Bringing bombs to the NPC in CoF P2 is bad design because there’s no combat needed to complete it?

Nope, that is a good puzzle. Here is why: disorganized groups with no communication finish it with 35 seconds left on the timer. Organized groups with good communication can finish it with 70 seconds left on the timer. The better you are the faster the puzzle can be completed. Unlike the electric floor puzzle, which takes the same amount of time no matter how many times you’ve experienced it.

The lasers in CoE are bad design because there’s no combat?

The lasers would be an awesome puzzle if there was some punishment for failure. As it is the puzzle is just a time gate and bad design.

If I remember correctly 2/3 of the obstacles in the reactor fractal don’t require combat.

Most groups prefer any third tier fractal to that one.

Dolphin or orb part of the aquatic fractal doesn’t require combat.

No artificial time gate.

Doing the beginning of the swamp fractal doesn’t require combat. I’m sure there are many more.

No artificial time gate.

Asmodeus.5782:

I’m just saying that stacking should not be advocated in any part of this game. It’s acceptable before WvW zerg clashes, to share boons and compress the crowd. In PvE, however, it turns combat into a button mashing fiesta combined with chaotic lightshow. Nobody is able to see anything and then they win, somehow. Wow. Such tactics. Stacking has nothing to do with skill, only with the general knowledge of the game’s shortcomings.

The only short coming of knowledge is your own in reference to what is actually happening in dungeon speed runs. If the Guardian doesn’t grant stability at the right time, the group wipes. If the ele doesn’t Ice Bow 5 at the right time the group wipes. If the team doesn’t dodge the 1hk mechanic the group wipes. If the thief doesn’t black powder the trash mobs the group wipes. If your view of what’s actually happening is “lolz every1 stackz press 1 and win” then you should be embarrassed to have revealed how little you understand the game and how much everyone else in your group is carrying you.

guardian.6489:

Mesket.5728:

guardian.6489:

Also remember at launch when everyone complained that dungeons were too hard and Anet needed to nerf them now (It was funny I heard this scenario repeated itself in the china release)? O how times have changed.

You mean that everything is so easy now that 5 guys in full dps build can just stack on a boss and kill him only using from 1 to 0 and dodge? get out of here…

And people uised to complain that, that same boss was way too hard. Not even joking. Zerker meta wasn’t discovered though.

EDIT you know what:
blows dust off old threads/articles
See for yourself:
http://www.mmomeltingpot.com/2012/11/guild-wars-2-difficulty-challenging-or-frustrating/
http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/guild-wars-2-no-nerf-for-you/
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Ascalonian-Catacombs-is-too-hard-now-I-think

In all fairness guilds like DnT were using Zerk meta even back in November 2012, the pug community were still PVT zombies at that time.

But I agree with your point, and I’ve said all along that the dungeons in this game are actually pretty hard objectively speaking. Drop 5 guys who installed the game and hit 80 after two weeks of play into Arah and you will find they have 0% chance of finishing any of the four paths. Heck, drop those same guys into AC at level 35 with green gear and you’re talking taking the better part of an afternoon to finish a path or two. The problem with the dungeons is that they are ancient (by video game standards) and the tactics, builds and strategies developed by dedicated dungeon guilds have trickled down to the point where even bad pugs can do them relatively efficiently. After two years of practice I should hope that even below average players can manage to complete even a hard dungeon.

Ohoni.6057:

The highest buy order is still far too high.

This might sound like Libertarian claptrap, but any price a fair, free market agrees upon is the correct price.

EgonVenkman.1907:

The sad, unfortunate truth is that there are too many people who dedicate a large portion of their life to do that exact thing; beat them day 1. It is a fact of modern mmo development that you locusts will chew through the entire content that took a year to develop in a matter of hours or days, then cry that it was too easy or you want more.

There is overtuned, undertuned and correctly tuned. You make it sound like the third thing is impossible to accomplish and has never happened. I don’t need a time machine back to vanilla wow to know you’re wrong about that.

No one cares when some random dude quits because he got hurt in the feels. Harsh, but its the truth.

Ohoni.6057:

Bull. The market acts to keep prices at the highest amount that some people might pay, it does nothing to get the prices to the level that most people would want to pay. It functions to the bare minimum level that one could call “functional,” and it works great as a seller’s market, but it is not satisfactory to the vast majority of players. It functions terribly as a buyer’s market.

There is a gulf between the highest buy order and lowest sell order. What do you suppose that tells you?

Any raid easy enough for pugs to be able to accomplish with no voice communication of coordination will be too easy for competent guilds and won’t be worth the title ‘raid.’ Ideally we want content that won’t be beaten the first day it’s released.

If I want to do mega zerg pve content, I do it with guilds built for that. If I want to do tight knit wvw 5 man roaming, I do it with guilds built for that. If I want to do organized dungeon speed runs I do it with guilds built for that.

I’m sure you can follow where I am going, but if you want to do 10/20/XX man raids (whatever they will end up being) it would stand to reason you should hook up with a guild that does that sort of content.

ArenaNet PVP Community
7:36 PM (13 hours ago)

to me
Thanks! I sent this along to our QA leads and they’re actively looking into it.

Anet QA is looking into fixing ACp2, SEp2 and Arahp4. This is good news for everyone. =)

Ohoni.6057:

most likely, the bulk of any one specific precursor on the market, is coming from the forge. However, it is possible that the bulk precursors total introduced to the market is mostly due to drops in the world.

It’s perhaps possible that the bulk of any precursor for which the base rare weapons sell for more than 45 silver each would come from MFing, but yes, I believe the majority of Pres in total come from random loot, and I would not be surprised if the majority even of Dawns and Dusks came from open world loot. Keep in mind that the GS market is split two ways relative to other weapon types, and yet rare GSs don’t sell for all that much more than other weapons.

Actually Rare GS, daggers, 1hs and staves all sell for a price almost exactly relative to their precursors.

The “90g precursors” have rares that sell for the price of the ectoplasm.

FrostSpectre.4198:

Too bad that skills go to waste for PvE, since 99% of mobs are “Zerker feed” (Dominated by berserker DPS builds so badly, that Support and Control builds are incapable of doing any kind of results and some combat mechanics are not required, like dodging).

Lupicus, on other hand is in the 1% of PvE content where some degree of skill is required.

Weird, because the berserker dps builds you talk about ARE control and support builds. And funny you mention Lupicus which is a fight that requires no control or support.

Valento.9852:

maddoctor.2738:

For those who are talking about Damage/Damage/Damage, follow a guild raid in WvW and you will see that’s not the case at all. Control and Support are equally important, if not more important than Damage, in a PVP setting. Lots of different stats are being used (Berserker is not the dominant stat combo) lots of skills (and weapon sets) are useful and powerful and not just a tiny few that complete the “best” PVE builds.

Mechanics are here, stat combos are here, the trinity (Damage/Control/Support) is here in any form of PVP. I believe before the Raid CDI they should do a Mob CDI, how to redesign every single mob to use more PVP-like abilities that will make PVE better and not just Damage/Damage/Damage.

I’m with you. We have many skills and there should be some kind of importance using one or another, it just feels we only have to burn the most damaging skills and be done with it. PvE became just: DAMAGE.

To quote myself from a few pages back, “1. The combat system in this game is amazing. It is the sign of an extremely uncreative person if he believes that challenging boss fights for 10+ players is impossible to design with the current system. A trinity system is not required whatsoever to have bosses with complex mechanics. If you think it is not possible to design such encounters, kindly excuse yourself from the conversation.”

You should check out this dungeon called Arah.

phys.7689:

not only that, but the materials do not ofetn drive the precursor prices, the precursor prices drive the cost of materials. This mean as demand or precursor supply changes, so to do precursor gambling items change in price. This means the price of precursors isnt really determined by the average cost of putting in the forge, the price of precursors determines the cost of items that can go into the forge.

But that doesn’t change the conclusions whatsoever. The casual player who wishes for cheaper precursors may not be aware that the unintended consequences of that damage him significantly.

Precursors are nothing more than an average ratio of the t5/6 mats and mithril/orichalcum needed to produce them in the mystic forge, plus the profit margin for assuming the risk of bad RNG and time.

You cannot change any part of the ratio without causing a chain reaction in the prices of everything else all the way down to t1 mats.

Way back in Christmas 2012 when the snowflake debacle happened, people found a slightly better way to convert Mithril to ecto than the standard version. What happened was ecto came down a little in price and Mithril increased in price until we had stability. So why ban all the people they banned if most people didn’t profit much and price equilibrium was achieved through normal market forces? Because the price of mithril rising had significant consequences besides the ecto market. If the price of Mithril quadrupled (as it did in my example) that directly impacts the price of precursors. So the “economic damage” that caused people to get banned was likely wholly unrelated to the original recipe at issue. The point of this history lesson is that you change one piece of the precursor puzzle and it will have wide ranging side effects which are not necessarily in the best interests of the players or the economy. Just because it will be better for players struggling to afford precursors does not mean much, since they may find themselves damaged in ways that make the price savings o the cheaper precursors totally irrelevant.

Which bosses in other dungeons do you stack on and press 1 with nothing else?

Couple of points…

1. The combat system in this game is amazing. It is the sign of an extremely uncreative person if he believes that challenging boss fights for 10+ players is impossible to design with the current system. A trinity system is not required whatsoever to have bosses with complex mechanics. If you think it is not possible to design such encounters, kindly excuse yourself from the conversation.

2. You don’t need gear treadmills. In SWTOR you achieve a special wearable title if you complete the raid within a particular time frame after it launches. The raids are tuned to be challenging content that take 1 hour for a good, experienced group to accomplish if they don’t wipe. Guilds that manage to complete the raid in an hour during a specific window of time also get a special title. Prestigious, skillbased special titles are enough of a reward. If they want to implement unique skins (but not stats!) that can only gotten through the raid, that would be fine too. PvP already has unique skins that only the top 0.1% will ever get, and people seem to have gotten over that.

3. People need to stop complaining about content they don’t like. Saying “I don’t want raiding in gw2” is a tremendously myopic view. Just because content doesn’t appeal to you in no way means it shouldn’t be in the game. I don’t care about organized WvW, and I am not a top tier tPvP player, but if new modes and features and content was announced for them I wouldnt begrudge it to them. Any new, quality content is good for the game. Saying you don’t want the devs to work on particular content is just extremely selfish and it would be easier to say, “If they implemented raiding I wouldn’t participate” and then kindly excuse yourself from the rest of the conversation since it clearly doesn’t concern a topic that is relevant for you. This isn’t a zero sum game: just because dev attention is going to a particular mode that doesn’t interest you in no way diminishes the experience of whatever game mode you enjoy.

-Nike

Elrey.5472:

You need Aetherpath, which is imo the best dungeon ever in gw2, the only one that’s fun and challenging to go with a group of friends

What is specifically challenging about it? None of the bosses are hard and the puzzles are more annoying than they are difficult.

kyubi.3620:

At this point why bother running a pet specialist ranger?

There is a really simple answer to that question, but only you will be able to answer it for yourself.

phys.7689:

Ayrilana.1396:

phys.7689:

Ayrilana.1396:

It’s not difficult to earn enough gold to beat inflation. Do not confuse inflation with changes that directly impact supply and/or demand.

• The increase in price of scraps and logs last December was not caused by inflation.
• The increase in price of certain legendary weapons last December was not caused by inflation.
• The increase in prices of levendary weapons last April was not caused by inflation.
• The increase in prices for mini’s last month was not caused by inflation.
• The decrease in price of precursors in November 2012 was not caused by deflation.

Whoops I used the inflation word. I meant the trends for value of desired precurors steadily rises at a rate you have to beat in order to get the item.

Fact is the game has been out for maybe 780ish days and highly desired precursors have gone up about 1100 gold.
Roughly 3 months ago dusks were 100 gold cheaper, so this trend is continuing.

Being that this is the case, one cannot argue that 1 gold gets you any closer to a precursor. Getting close to precursor is more about relative earning than absolute value.

I just wanted to make that distinction as people often are quick to blame inflation when it’s often not the culprit. The prices in precursors fluctuate quite a lot. I’ve tracked the prices for a few and the costs for them have actually gone down in the past week.

weekly prices arent too relevant, they may have gone down in last week, and are still 100 gold higher than they were 90 days ago, when people we complaining that they were going up too fast. the overall trend is still upward. and 90 days before that they were lower, and the 90 days before that.

i mean we can theorize we have finally hit the precursor breaking point and prices will now normalize, but somehow i have a feeling some new change will spark them up again, history repeats itself

The big moves in precursor prices are the result of game updates. Game updates are essentially unpredictable unless you have insider knowledge. The historical prices make it rather clear that the price is more or less stable barring demand shocks caused by particular game updates. The fact remains that the prices have been flat for a significant amount of time and no one who desires a Dusk can complain that inflation is holding them back, and that since August it is entirely true that each gold piece has been 1/1500th progress towards Dusk.