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I can understand the long-term reasoning, but that admittedly doesn’t make it any less annoying at the current moment. If you wanted to establish an “infrastructure” of repeatable content, it should’ve been mixed in with more permanent stuff along the way.
This is the first year. They spent it building their deck of recurring content which means it was all new.
Next year we should expect more permanent content since they won’t be devoting time to building new recurring content because they already have it.
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To be fair, the objective is not to survive for 2 minutes in the ring, it is to defeat the foe within 2 minutes. If this means you need to respec for more DPS, then you are going to need to respec for more DPS (or use a DPS-focused alt).
Bunkering is a great tactic for survival, but this competition is not about survival so any lack of success with that tactic should be expected.
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Hey folks,
- tonnes of reasonable sounding stuff-
This is all well and good, Colin, but what is the advantage to the player of this content appearing and disappearing?
(I’m talking specifically about the Gauntlet, not stuff like Halloween which is real-world seasonal too)
I can see how it’s advantageous to ArenaNet to have the ability to switch it on and off so it seems like we’re getting more new content in any given month. But what is the benefit to the playerbase?
I don’t mean to be combative so apologies if it comes off that way – I’m genuinely curious what you think we’re gaining from this approach as players.
We are avoiding burnout. By limiting the time we can participate, that time becomes special instead of monotonous.
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Temporary is probably the wrong word.
I think you are looking for “Recurring”.
Anyone who has played previous MMOs understands how recurring holiday content works. You get to play it for a month, then it goes away for a year.
Just be glad you won’t need 7 years of Nine Rings for your Lucky Title…
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Okay, this sounds good and I do hope we will see Queens Gauntlet return to certain times. But I’m still worried about the achievements for the Gauntlet and how difficult they are. With only 4 weeks (and smack in the middle of holiday summer) will we have enough time and chances to reach these achievements? I read about testers not being able to finish after several weeks trying, so I’m worried my experience with the Gauntlet will just be a frustated one because of this time pressure.
Most likely, the event and the achieves (since they have their own category and are unrelated to the Jubilee) will repeat again, so I wouldn’t worry too much about not finishing all of the achieves this year.
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Out of all of this I really hoped the Gauntlet would be permanent.
It is, in the same sense that Christmas is permanent.
Events like this are bound to become recurring holiday items so don’t sweat it if you can’t win it all this year.
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I was wondering the same thing. The support tokens were to see who would get the contract, not who would win the seat (since the council picks the replacement, not the people).
Granted, it is heavily implied that the person who got the contract would be a shoe in, but having pirates allow an election to dictate what they do just seems incredibly “un-pirate-y” of them.
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Well, time to sell my holdings in Lion’s Arch. Ellen Kiel’s grotesque incompetence was manageable in her limited position as head of the Lionguard, but now that she has been given enough authority to be dangerous it is time for me to expatriate to a safer location. On the upside, I do look forward to being well compensated for my efforts in saving Lion’s Arch from whatever disaster will surely befall it in the impending future as a result of her untimely ascension.
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Because those words are deemed inappropriate and rather than saying “censored” or “****” they replace them with “kitten”.
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Make sure that your firewall is not blocking the awesonium process. The BLTC uses its own program that is separate from the GW2 process.
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As long as there are fun/beneficial things to do while you are waiting, having a queue shouldn’t be that bad.
Plus, entering the queue requires the expenditure of a ticket which must be farmed from somewhere. Depending on the drop rate, you may want to spend that queue time farming tickets in the group area below the domes…
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See, this implies a point of view I don’t understand (but have been more than willing to try).
Like everyone else here, you’re just snarky.
I’m going back to the general discussion where people are more civilized.
Not snarky. Just point of fact.
If your stuff isn’t selling, its because you listed it too high.
If your bids aren’t being filled, its because you bid too low.
It has nothing to do with your level of patience, but rather your lack of knowledge of the market you are trying to enter.
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All good narratives have good antagonists.
Force of Nature can be a good antagonist, but only if it is dire, urgent, and personal loss occurs.
The problem with the story so far, is that there is no sense of urgency or personal loss.
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To be honest, I always felt that this was a decision between getting to watch Chernobyl (a relatively recent event that has left enough evidence to be researched in the now) versus getting to watch the Crucifixion of Christ (an event of the distant past, whose existance is widely debated and even outright contested and would require time travel to actually learn about).
Personally, I feel that Abaddon makes sense as a Fractal while the Reactor makes more sense as a Dungeon/Dynamic Event/World Boss type deal.
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I think that the impatient benefit (because of the smaller spread) and the patient suffer (because of the smaller spread).
That’s incorrect. The reality is that both receive a more or less equal price, which is a more fair outcome.
It’s rather hypocritical to complain about flippers “leeching”, and then support the interests of only one of either patient or impatient players.
Nope what I said is 100% correct. The impatient get a better outcome and the patient get a worse outcome. Every time.
My statement had nothing to do with fairness. Also I wasn’t kittening about flippers. I was just stating that some benefit and some suffer because of flippers.
Edit: As opposed to everyone being better off, which is what was asserted.
If by “patient” you mean “those who incorrectly priced their buy/sell bids outside the acceptable price range”, then I agree with you. They do have a less than ideal outcome as a result of margin shrinking since their bids are now outside the margins and will thus be left unfilled.
The “patient” buyer can easily rebid at no cost. The “patient” seller will have to cut their losses and move on.
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My guildies and I only do the Dredge one if it winds up being #3. Any earlier means we are restarting the Fractal.
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Now what ? if champions and boss from dungeons don’t drop money…
What we do with the gold find now?
PD: Sorry if my English is not very good.
Run event chains.
I make decent money (obviously not great) doing the Harathi Hinterlands centaur chain. I do it for the fun of it, but having GF makes it more profitable at the same time.
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I’ve bought 2 lots of 800 gems so far (bank space, level 80 transmute crystals, bear hat), and preordered the regular version of the game, but that’s it. I try to keep my purchases to things I feel will really affect my ‘quality of life’ in the game and seem worth the price (or are bear-related.)
I was very tempted by the permanent harvesting tools and some of the instruments but decided against them in the end. I reckon it’s decent value for money given I’ve been playing for nearly a year now.
I only bought the axe because, like you, I was conflicted on the tools when they first came out.
It is hands down the best item my character owns.
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3 Character slots (some were on sale).
3 Bank tabs (I think one was on sale).
1 Unlimited Axe
I also bought a second copy that I gifted to a friend for his birthday, not sure it that counts though.
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Regardless, we should not have to mass store gold on the Trading Post, simply because they are removing our only way of storing gold in our Bank vaults.
It should not be excessively hard.
UNLESS —- they are removing the Gold slot from the Vault and adding it to a Wallet, then forcing all our characters gold to automatically fall into the old “Bank Vault” gold slot. Thereby re-using the existing “Bank Vault” gold slot mechanic.
Instead of taking the appropriate time to create a new mechanic.
TL;DR —- Anet sounds like its doing it the lazy way and costing us our Bank Vault gold slot in the process, because they are not taking the time to do it right.
The issue is that storing gold in the bank is now redundant.
FWIW, you can form your own little guild and use the Guild Bank…
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I think that they should add a kit that you can use to salvage an item and add its skin to the account skin bank (where the zenith stuff is).
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Ya’ll can do better than degrading the discussion into “Communists”. That’s more of a last ditch effort and we should be above that.
To be fair, his points have already been made and countered several times in this thread. I just didn’t feel like rehashing them. Plus the fact that he came out and said that everyone who disagrees with him is an economic parasite significantly reduced my interest in addressing his arguments with any level of respect.
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(edited by mtpelion.4562)
thank you to prove again how flippers are just economic parasites.
In case gold inflates just wonder what farmers will do…
Farm materialsWhile flippers won t do anything :| but leech gold.
If I understand your argument correctly you believe that anyone who has more money than you is a parasite and that someone should force those people with more money than you to have the same amount of money as you.
I could have sworn that I’d heard this argument before…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Terror
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I know how you feel bro. I thought it was a sure bet. Boy was I wrong.
I think the biggest risk with these skins is the rate at which new ones are introduced… with new content twice a month, it’s easy to forget about “old” stuff in favor of the new shinies. Do I want to spend 200g on a 3-month old skin most people have forgotten about or 50g on the new skin that just came into the game last week?
In time, there may be players who never had the opportunity to get the skin when available – bad luck with RNG, not enough money, bought the game after the content was replaced – but with the rate at which new content enters the game, it’s not likely to be a fast way to make money, especially in 2014 and beyond, when the selection of skins is much larger than it is now.
If there was a way to bank skins (kind of like the mini pets) I think you’d see an increase in demand for them because players would have an easy way to track which ones they are missing.
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so in your opinion, you can balance having a class that is guaranteed to out perform others by making it undesirable to play.
So you think people would be fine in SPVP if there was one class that 95% of the people didnt want to play, but they were guaranteed to lose everytime they fought them?
you are missing the problem, this means that if the game ever had a tournament in that state, everyone in the tournament would be that 1 class. Only the 5% who are that class can compete for the top level rewards.
This is the exact problem, the TP flipping masters will be the only ones who can compete for the most valuable things that can be bought with money. everyone else can get their left overs
but i think your general idea is that you think that is an ok game mechanic. I dont think thats what they should aim for.
First, the TP players have the LAST shot at top items because all top items are dropped or created. That means that the player who got that Super Sword of Super Swordiness decided to sell it because he didn’t want it. He had first dibs and decided to convert his dibs into gold.
Second, your analogy is way off. Players with money are not a different class from players without money. They are better at their class than the other players are. A better analogy is that players who spend a lot of time getting good at being a ranger should be able to beat a player who just started playing today and doesn’t even know how to use his auto attack.
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Because I actually want to play a game(called killing monster). What’s the point of me running dungeon when I can do nothing and turn 700 gold into 1200 gold. Which apparently just happened to me in this 2 week.
Tell me what’s the point of me spend 1000 hours killing monster in diablo3, when the reward is so crappy I make much more money in 10 hours flipping the auction house.
I actually want to go out and kill monster. But the reward is so bad, I might as well just sit in the auction house all day.
I don’t want to play auction house tycoon. But when it is much more rewarding to play the auction house, it make the other content pointless.
Nothing is stopping you from killing monsters. If that is what you enjoy, then simply do it. Why do you care if it is the most profitable way to make gold, you enjoy doing it, right?
Just Kill Monsters + Ignore Trading Post = Happy You
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I’m coming from the perspective that I would like the numbers that represent interest and availability be based on more recent activity that simply ancient bids and listings at prices far removed from the current price range of the item. It doesn’t mean you can’t have out of normal pricing on an item, just that I have an assurance this isn’t from the start of the market when nobody knew what anything was worth.
And this is simply because we don’t have a sense of actual trading volume of an item. We have to base that on snapshots of what’s “on the shelf”. And if I’m going to have to rely on these “snapshots”, I would like to know how many of these items are fresh versus dusty ones with out of step prices on them.
Ok, how about they add an “average age of listing” stat to the screen that shows the average listing age for all items listed at that price?
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I do however, think there have been several good comments about the effect to wealth disparity on the game, which, while not the main topic, should at least be considered.
There is a huge Achievement Point disparity in the game. Some people have over 10,000 points while I have less than 5,000. Therefore, to be fair to everyone, anyone with more than 7,500 points needs to have 2,500 points removed, while anyone with less than 5,000 points needs to have 2,500 points added.
Oh, and everyone gets a Legendary weapon, because if one person gets something, everyone else should get it too.
Wealth concentration can lead to market stagnation, but that is not really a concern in a game because those with the wealth cannot control production or own property/resources.
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This is a great thread.
A few minor thoughts:
The TP is part of the world of Tyria and spending your time interacting with it is just as legitimate a play session as dungeons or jumping puzzles or any of our other fantastic content.I think it’s the part where people playing for thousands of hours making less money than people who sit infront of auction house is the problem.
We call that auction house tychoon in diablo 3. People who farmed for thousand of hours killing monster make less money than people who flip an item in a few second.
And the game changed from killing monster, jumping puzzle into a game of auction house tychoon, not everyone of us want to play.
How does the income rate of a TP flipper make playing the game less fun for you? If your idea of fun is making more money than other people, then I hate to break it to you but you aren’t going to win that race by driving a Vespa. Good news though, ArenaNet has provided you with a free Drag Racer.
This is a great thread.
The TP is part of the world of Tyria and spending your time interacting with it is just as legitimate a play session as dungeons or jumping puzzles or any of our other fantastic content.Isn’t it a bit hypocritical then to essentially allow unlimited profiteering with the TP (even if only a few players attain it) but at the same time slap DR and time-gating on farming and the other play session activities for everyone else?
No. Those are Wealth Creation activities and thus contribute to inflation. The TP is a Wealth Transfer activity that has a Wealth Deletion mechanic built in (the listing fees) and thus it helps to curb inflation.
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Stat treadmills are designed to keep you paying a monthly subscription (“Ah, I finally got my full suit so I am tied with everyone else and can participate at an even level of … what?! A new tier is out now and my gear is already obsolete? Back to farming I guess”.)
Guild Wars does not have a subscription and thus does not need to keep you tethered 24/7. They put in cosmetic items in order to generate something for you to work towards at your leisure.
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Useless? No.
Less useful? Yes.
Those infusions will work best when doing event farming instead of dungeon farming.
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Check to ensure that your firewall is not blocking the Black Lion Trading Company. It runs on its own separate executable. It’s called “awesonium” something or other.
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I think it is important to note that actions in game can do one of three things to the economy:
1. Create Currency
2. Move Currency
3. Destroy Currency
If you look at the things that have been limited, you will recognize that they are all related to creating currency. They all have a fundamentally different impact on the game than the TP does.
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Just so you know, I’m not a flipper in GW2. I did significant flipping in WoW because I had no real life friends still playing the game and thus wasn’t inclined to do anything else.
I’m just pointing out the reasons why an expiration date would negatively impact the game economy.
I’d also like to point out that most buy orders are flippers. Casuals may place them from time to time, but they are usually not the forward-thinking types who decide they want to craft next week and therefore should place a bunch of orders.
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The big problem juno is that automatic expiration is going to inconvenience casual players more than flippers. To a flipper, having to relist is just the price of doing business. To the casual, it is something that is going to wind up getting vendored to save time. Since the VAST majority of inventory comes from casuals, inconveniencing them will result in a significant decline in inventory on the market.
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Never be afraid of thinking! EVER!
Anyways…no, this conversation has been going for some time now. LONG before any of the current nerfs were announced.
This conversation will always be going on due to the fundamental difference of opinion between those who value equality of opportunity and those who value equality of result.
It is getting more attention right now due to the nerf threads.
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I don’t recall (I’m not a frequent PvPer), but at level 1 aren’t you still missing traits/utilities/elites in sPvP?
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^ That’s true enough, Ursan, but we should also remember that for many players, they play games to get AWAY from that kind of inequality. Video game worlds are supposed to be a place where you can be someone you aren’t, where the playing field is (more or less) equal and everybody can have fun. If you’re someone who’s stuck in a dead-end job where people who earn much more than you can basically treat you like crap all day, do you really want to come home and log into a world where wealthy players are also doing their best to concentrate wealth in their own hands so they can also look down on you and show off all the nice things you’ll never have?
And on the flipside, if you’re a poor player in real life who wants to become rich in-game so you can gloat over poorer people, shame on you for missing the point. :P
There’s always inequality in every single game, you can’t get away from it.
In GW2 inequality is purely cosmetic. Owning mountains of gold simply means that you’ll look better than someone else. That is fully intentional design.
Few people will ever reach the top sPvP or WvW level. Few people will unlock certain skins. Few people will have certain minis. Few people will earn all achievements.
Should we start handicapping decent sPvP players because you want to get away from situations where someone is better than you? A certain movie where that’s exactly what people do comes to mind.
Since GW2 defines itself on cosmetic variation as end game, perhaps it would have been better design to award players with said variation based on actual game play rather than just amassing monetary wealth. And by actual game play I mean killing monsters and doing events since that is really what the game is all about.
Everything on the market came from players playing the game. You are rewarded for playing the game. You can simply get there more quickly if you take the effort to play the TP mini game.
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The problem with your premise is similar to how when you raise capital gains taxes you actually make less tax revenue because it causes people (especially low margin people) to leave the market entirely. Each transaction makes you more money, but there are significantly less transaction now because you made it inconvenient or unprofitable to engage in the transactions.
The end result is that there will be less people utilizing the TP which will cause inflation to spike and ultimately the opposite of your goal will occur.
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Point taken (and you are likely correct). The other interesting side result of all this is what it is doing to MF items on the TP….very weird speculation logic going on there.
If they wind up taking my suggestion, then salvaging a MF item will produce a consumable that gives your account a permanent boost to MF (obviously not a 1:1 ratio).
If that is the case, buying up some MF items now would pay off. Of course, if they go a different route then buying up the MF items will be a waste of time.
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I’ll agree with the OP as well that I wasn’t a fan of the trials. I just decided to skip that part of this content all together. I achieved both mini’s by doing other Achievements so it wasn’t a loss. From what I understand, the drops and reward aren’t that great anyways. It sucks because I like doing most of the living story content when it drops. I actually usually just skip out on the mini-games but this time it was basically opposite.
But… But… But… Don’t you WANT to have 50 Broken Lockpicks as a reward for a timed event?
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@juno: I’ve played one other MMO (WoW), that had a trading system and while it did have built in expiration, there are a few significant differences:
1. Crafting was mostly pointless outside of the first 2 weeks of a new tier.
2. Markets were server specific.
3. The limits were already in place (i.e. status quo), whereas you are proposing adding a new limit which will shock the economy here.
I do think that the impact would be extremely negative in the long term. Casual players are not going to be constantly relisting their items, they are simply going to vendor them if they don’t sell immediately. Even flippers are going to have a line where relisting is going to result in a net loss due to the fees (which will not get refunded as they are the main gold sink in this game).
Long term, you can expect available goods to dwindle because it is just more convenient to vendor, increased inflation as the number of transactions declines, and significantly higher prices on the TP creating a barrier for new players (and most existing players).
I understand that those old listings are annoying, but a time limit is an unnecessary inconvenience that will have a significant negative impact.
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You have to take two important factors into consideration:
Will this limit profits?
Will this limit convenience?
If the answer to either question above is “Yes”, then you can expect a significant negative impact on the game economy.
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I was apparently not clear, I don’t mean the boss is healing, I mean that the party must do an average amount of healing to themselves every second or die from damage from the boss encounter.
Right now you can do most (all?) bosses without taking a single hit of damage and that is what allows full DPS to be the most ideal setup.
If you have an environmental effect that causes damage (either spikes or over time) you can use that damage to balance the encounter around party Heal Per Second rate.
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If you’re going to get into semantics and completely disregard a field due to what you’ve seen in your own, (probably) poor-quality post-secondary institution, then why shouldn’t we disregard your views as well? Why bother replying at all as what you’ve said in this latest post has nothing to do with this thread?
A sociological view on this economy isn’t some sort of speculative, subjective professor-vomit. If so, a lot of the users that have posted on this thread must be very attentive during their sociology classes.
The point: it’s not a fringe “Occupy X” mentality to have a shared disapproval of concentrated capital in the market.
Sir, I critically wounded your position to near death without needing to point out that sociology is not a worthwhile academic pursuit so I removed my original comment. You added it back into the debate (my guess is so that you could turn a blind eye to your whimpering argument’s mortal wound).
Since you wish to continue down this road, I shall put your entire field of study into the same corner as your poorly-formed position:
The concept of infinite wealth does not derive from quantity of resources. Gold ore in the ground has no value. It is not until a person recovers it from the earth that value is added to the ore. All economic value is derived from work that adds value. As long as there are people, there is therefore infinite wealth because there is always some work that can be done that will add value. The expenditure of time/effort/skill is what creates wealth in the real world and that is infinite.
And you are correct, it is unfortunately not a fringe opinion that you share, it is a widely disbursed swath of nonsense that is dangled in front of the jealous masses by instigators, eager to profit in the aftermath of class warfare.
Good. Day.
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“mostly far left extremism” <- LOL, and yes I saw you edit that out.
Resources in the market are not the same as resources obtainable elsewhere. The market is a source of obtaining resources for individuals. Control of the market, through amassing goods (such as buying out enough of a good), thus significantly limits a the ability of an individual to obtain said resources. Pretty sure that’s not how a healthy economy works.
I felt it was too inflammatory and disruptive. Sociology is essentially the art of parroting your instructor’s opinions back to him so that your GPA stays high enough to participate in the athletic program.
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In what way are the “poor” players competing with the “wealthy” players?
There are infinite numbers of everything available to every player. No one can prevent you from obtaining anything in this game.
If you have studied sociology at all, that is one of the fundamental flaws in the capitalist system. Many academics agree that the “infinite resources” or “unlimited opportunity” ideology is flawed. This is 2013, not the 20th century.
There’s no one that can say “no, you can’t have this”, but they can sure put up barriers to hinder your pursuit of that object.
If we ignore the philosophical debate that must be answered before your point can even be considered and just go straight to the meat of your argument, this is a video game in which infinite resouces and unlimited opportunity are programmed to exist, so any arguments against capitalism in real world economies are irrelevant.
No matter how much money I amass, there is not a single thing I can do to prevent you from obtaining something in game because every item in the game can be generated, either on demand or at random, at any given moment. If I wanted to prevent players from obtaining a specific legendary I can’t. If I bought 100% of the precursors and materials new ones would be instantly available for me to have to continue buying, 24/7. Even if I did manage to completely lock down all supply on the market by constantly buying EVERYTHING, a poor player who wants the legendary can still get it the same way the first players got it… farming the materials themselves.
There is no competition for resources in this game because all resources are equally available at all times to all players.
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I have only bought one infinite use item and it was with real money gems. Honestly, from a QoL standpoint it is the best thing you can buy with gems.
I want the other items to make a return so I can get one of each for the same character (my ranger farmer) and never have to worry about stocking and swapping tools again.
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So far it’s really only the Gekkos who come out to play.
Gordon Gekko is about insider trading, this is not about insider trading. Now insider trading is an issue when website get news before everyone else does. Which happens in this game, and that is truly unfair
It’s only insider trading if the website acts on said knowledge.
I know you know that, but I just wanted to clarify.
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