Guild Wars 2

Its so frustrating when comparing my eles stats with my warrior. I have to invest heavily into toughness and vitality to get enough defense stats on my ele to not explode in milliseconds on spike damage. On my warrior I can reach perma 4k power + 50+% crit chance and still got the same damage reduction and even more hitpoints than my ele.

Sure ele has access to regen and protection, but damage-wise ele is just pathetic compared to warriors or thieves. GW2 is the first MMORPG ever with no high-damage caster available.

Dont get me wrong, I really like ele mechanics. But the lack of damage is kinda annoying. And I really hate the AOE mechanics. Although I play WvW 99% of the time I never got for staff. I like skills which are directly connected to your opponent. IMO its ok to have 1 or 2 AOE skills which are ground target, but the rest should be direct damage skills.

I really loved how AOE spells were implemented in DAOC. First there were PBAOE spells with fast casttime and really high damage but it was very risky because you have to be close to your target. The range was far lower than e.g. Churning Earth but getting hit by it really hurts.
Then you had direct range AOE spells with medium casttime and medium damage. Direct means you had to target one enemy. When the spell hits the enemy the AOE effect procs off this enemy being the center of the AOE effect.
And you had ground AOE spells with medium casttime and low damage which worked like AOE spells in GW2 now.

So at the end casters had 3 different kind of AOE spells to choose from. PBAOE was great for defending against melee classes or defending choke points like gates. Direct range AOE was great in open field battles. Ground AOE was great for defending or attacking keeps.

Playing staff ele in WvW is more like spaming those ground AOE spells + crossing your fingers hoping your enemy is dumb enough not to leave the red circle before the spell actually does damage.

Hi,

I’m playing WvW only with my D/D ele. I first started with the cookie-cutter bunker build (0/10/0/30/30) with full PVT armor + knights daggers + cleric trinkets and 6 water runes (2 x superior, 2 x major, 2 x minor) for max boon duration. I never play dungeons, so I dont have access to monk runes.

I’m now using a more offensive build. I switch cleric for knight trinkets + ruby juwels. And I’m using 2 x ruby orbs instead of the minor water runes.

Since Zephyrs Boon has been nerfed with the latest patch I’m disappointed with my swiftness uptime. I often find myself running out of swiftness in combat.

I’m pondering of switching runes to 6 x Centaur. This would give a nice 165 power boost + 10s swiftness on heal. With Ether Renewal being on a 15s cooldown this would result in 100% swiftness uptime just by using Ether Renewal every 15s (10s + 50% boon/swiftness duration).

What do you think? Is it worth dropping 25% boon duration for perma swiftness uptime + a huge power boost? This would bump my power to 1932 + 250 (bloodlust) + might.

How do you keep your swiftness uptime high since the latest patch? What Runes do you use in WvW for you D/D ele?

teg

oZii.2864:

In WvW I don’t see more thieves than I do any other class.

Yep. You dont see them. Thats exactly the point. lol

Thief can spam 5-6 x heartseeker with full initiative. Thats 2250 – 2700 range. Or he can use 2x infiltrator arrow for 1800 range in zero time. Add an additional 1200 range with shadow step. Add additional range just by running away at 30-40% speed in stealth.

GS Warrior use Rush every 16s for 1200 range + WW every 8s for 450 range + Bulls Charge every 40s for 900 range + Savage Leap every 10s for 600 range. With mobile strikes he’s immune to immobilize. And he got perma swiftness.

Ele has 1200 range RTL every 20s which can be destroyed by immobilize + 600 range blink every 36s. Thats all. Plus swiftness uptime is subpar since latest nerfs.

Even my grandma realizes that both thief and warrior are far superior to ele when it comes to mobility.

Can we all please stop the whining about RTL now? There is nothing special about this skill anymore. Compare it to other professions mobility skills and you will eventually see that the grass is always greener on the other side.

If you really think Ele is still the most mobile profession, you really dont have a clue about the other professions in this game.

Kardiamond.6952:

Since you are guaranted to evade the firsts finishers. You have minimum :

2.5 sec : First finish attempt.
3 sec : Vapor form.
0.5-1 sec : before they follow up and finish again
3 sec : They finish you.

How is that bad?

Common. Its not like other professions dont have tools to delay stomping. Warrior and Guardian has knockdowns, Necro fear etc. Theres hardly any benefit in case of delay time.
Vapor Form is strong, but overrated. Its not that great as you might think. In most cases it doesnt make a difference. Often I actually dont use it, because its just a waste of time to delay a garantied stomp.

Dont blame other professions just because your profession lacks a decent downed skill to delay stomping.

Kardiamond.6952:

You have a guaranted, GUARANTED escape to survive 5-10 sec more then most class that have a single target interrupt as number 2.

5-10s? Never. Vapor Form lasts roughly 2s and 600 range. If you get stomped and use Vapor Form, in 99% the enemy immediately follows you and stomps again. Vapor Form doesnt make a difference, unless you can (a) escape through a tower gate or (b) the pressure of your team prevent the enemy from stomping you again. Both is extremely situational and rare. Consider you can be immobilized + blink stomped during Vapor Form.

Vapor Form is OP when used in front of a tower. And its useless most of the times in ANY other situation. Most often you die anyway.

The amount of whining about eles is ridiculous. There is exactly one viable build around this whole profession and it got nerfed hard with the latest patch.

Guess what? At the end Vapor Form doesnt make any difference. There are so many real issues in WvW which have to be fixed before touching stuff like that. Culling, perma stealth, stealth stomping, AoE cap… to name a few.

The main problem with thieves and stealth to most players is not whether they are OP or not. Its the fact that fighting a heavy stealthing thief is NOT FUN. I rarely loose to any thief because I’m lucky I chose the right profession. But although I win many fights against thieves, I really get bored fighting them over and over again. Thats due to the fact that its extremely frustrating to fight targets you cannot see most of the time.

I’m playing PVP based MMORPGs since 2001. But I never had this feeling ever before that fighting a certain profession is frustrating and not fun at all.

To me this is a major issue of WvW because from my observation the total number of thieves in WvW raises from day to day. It might be the one reason to quit this game for me.

Again: this is not a l2 kitten ue to me, this is not about thieves being op, Im not angry because I loose all day long against thieves. Its just because fighting thieves is not fun due to massive stealth uptime + no real counter to it.

I would trade GW2 stealth for DAOC stealth (perma stealth but only out of combat) immediately if I could.

katniss.6735:

Why don’t they nerf the teleport range on theives now? Because there’s no way to catch these guys at all now. It’s like a 1000 yard radius in any direction they’ll just randomly be at. Plus, stealth. Plus they get a huge burst. The more targets a thief has to ping-pong off of, the more OP the porting becomes. I just leave when I see some guy doing this.

The major problem with catching thieves to me is camera arc and culling. Chances are good the thief is not in my camera arc when he leaves stealth and gets visible to me after culling. So if he stealth + shadowstep away the game is over, unless he is accidentally within my camera arc when he gets visible after culling, so I can RTL in his direction. Even then thieves can just spam heartseeker a gazillion times or blink away with infiltrator arrow while I have to wait 20s for RTL.

All those whines about RTL + Ele being the most mobile profession is just pathetic – spreaded lies from the gazillion wvw thieves out there. lol

I move the mouse to the top of the screen, doubleclick, then RTL away.

My setup for Ele only (requires 5 button mouse, e.g. Logitech MX518)

WASD – movement
QERFG – weapon skills 1-5
1-5 – Heal, Utility 1-3, Elite
Mouse 5 + ERFG – attunement swap
Mouse 4 – Dodge
V – Use
^ – Swap Weapon

As D/D ele I have to use my weapon skills permanently. QERFG is easily accessible to me while moving around with WASD. To me this is much better than using 1-5 for weapon skills because you dont have to move your finger away from W. W is by far the most crucial button for moving around. Mouse 5 + ERFG for attunement swap fits extremely well in my playstyle.

Example usages:

Mouse 5 + G → G = Attune to earth + Eartquake
Mouse 5 + F → G = Attune to air + RTL
Mouse 5 + E → F = Attune to fire + Burning Speed
Mouse 5 + R → R = Attune to water + Cone of Cold

As you can see swapping attunements + using skills is extremely comfortable with this setup because of reusing the same keys. You can swap + use skills with zero delay at the same time while moving around with WASD. Utilities are on high cooldowns and situational, so its ok to use 1-5.

Dual.8953:

That’s because we get a whole bunch of laymen making suggestions that would ruin thieves. Things that would be equivalent to, make it so Eles can’t use Boons, or make it so Mesmers can’t use clones or phantasms. Other classes ardently defend themselves too from similar claims against them. Thieves and Mesmers probably take the most heat because they’re based around deception and trickery.

Ele boon stacking has been nerfed significantly with the latest patch in addition to RTL nerf. Fury, Swiftness and Vigor uptime has been extremely cut back. Thats results in less mobility, less survivability and less damage. Coincident nothing has been changed about thief and stealth in WvW.

Master of Timespace.2548:

llolollolol. You just don’t know how to play D/D ele if you don’t spam. Seriously, go watch that video from that Aurora Glade ele Riez.
There:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-s0EbWDWcQo&feature=player_embedded

My brother plays an ele too and he spams like hell as well because “it’s effective” and because “I can”. (Poor keyboard!)

Spaming skills to me means facerolling the keyboard. That doesnt make a good d/d ele. Sure you use skills all the time, but look at this video. He has a pretty good timing at using his powerful skills at the right time. This is crucial to playing d/d ele. Each attunement has a few low cooldown skills which are indeed spamable. But the rest is on huge cooldowns. You definitely dont want to waste those skills in the wrong situations.

BTW: Non of the opponents shown in this video ever dodged a single churning earth. Its pretty obvious they doesnt really have a clue about eles.

Being visible for 3 secs minus culling is far from “high risk”, bro.

Stealth mechanics let anyone look dumb because fighting what you cant see is like gambling. You have to predict where the thieve could be. You dont get any reliable feedback, when you actually hit a stealthed thief.

There are times when you are lucky. But you wont find those moments in thief vids. Those vids only show moments when you are unlucky and those moments lets you look like a complete jerk.

Haha, he spams aoe on my SR but I’m miles away due to shadow step.
Haha, he wastes his CC in that direction but I dodged in the opposite direction.
Haha, he doesnt dodge my backstab because of culling / lag.
Haha, I’m the greatest thief on earth.
Oops, I died… let me cut this off.

Spaming heals in water? Jumping while spaming skills? Ehm, lol. Thats not possible. Ele doesnt have spamable skills besides anytimers which are completely garbage. All skills are on huge cooldowns.

Sure, you can just waste all your powerful skills like earthquake, backdraft, churning earth and cleansing wave, then RTL away. But you’ll kill exactly nothing.

Draygo.9473:

Leaps charges and teleports is what makes these classes the fastest.

Ehm, no.

Ele: RTL (1200 range in 2 seconds every 20 seconds) + Lightning Flash (600 range in 0 seconds every 45/36s). Thats 1800 range repeatable every 36s.

Compare this to thieves: Heartseeker spamable up to 5-6x in a row (5*450 range = 2200 range) + Shadow Step (1200 range in 0 seconds) + Infiltrators Arrow (900 range in o seconds).

Even at 50% initiative thieves can easily blink for 2000+ range in no time. Thats wider than any other profession. And its repeatable more often, because initiative regenerates faster than the other professions cooldown.

Chances are good that the other professions mobility skills are already on cooldown when the thief begins to flee. Thief is on a massive advantage due to initiative regeneration. As long as you have some initiative you can use all you skills. You just have to time your skills for the next few seconds whereas other profession have to time all of their rediculous long cooldowns.

In reality stealth + shadow step is mostly enough to get away far enough so that nobody will follow you. Stealth is a massive mobility boost, because your opponent doesnt know the direction you are fleeing.

Chances are good that you are not within the camera arc of you opponent when you leave stealth. Thats a massive advantage.

Fighting thieves is like gambling. Thats the reason nobody likes to fight thieves in WvW.

Dual.8953:

Guardians, Thieves and Elemenalists do have the lowest HP pool, but despite thier HP pool, Guardians and Elementalists are widely considered the tankiest classes in the game, because of their access to sustained defensive boons and buffs. Thieves only have access to a weak version of Regen.

Ele is per default squishy as hell. Look at all those GC staff eles. they die in seconds. Because of that many eles go for bunker builds. That means traiting for 30 water + 30 arcana (no damage traits) and equipping full PVT armor with clerics trinkets (no damage stats besides power). As runes most choose water + monk (again no damage stats).

Got it? Ele sacrifies all damage to become tanky. Its not the profession itself which is tanky. Compare this to thieves. Most thieves go full GC with a bit of valkyrie because stealth mechanics is so strong compared to the other professions mechanics.

Ele cant go full GC just because they have access to protection and regen. Thats entirely unique to thieves. Stealth is both a superior offensive and defensive game mechanic which totally negates the necessity to trade damage stats for more defense.

Chrysaliss.8720:

Thief is the most squishy class in the game. Lowest HP and lowest toughness in the game. Not speaking about the fact that thief does NOT have an ability to grand himself stability.

Ehm, no. Thief has the same base HP pool than ele and guardian, so its not the lowest. And thief has access to medium armor which results in ~7% more damage reduction compared to light armor classes.

Stability is granted by dagger storm, an extremely OP AOE damage skill granted to a single target damage profession (lol). Not only does it deal extremely high AOE damage in a huge area, ignoring the 5 target cap, it also cripples + reflects projectiles + grants stability.

Thieves are NOT squishy per default. Thieves are squishy because you decide to go (mostly) full glass canon. All the other professions explode on damage spikes when running full GC builds in WvW. Thieves just deal massive damage in a few seconds then vanish in stealth.

Sure, you can hit a thief in stealth. But due to missing hit feedback, thats just pathetic. Looking at the chain animations is not an option because (i) not every profession has access to anytimer chains and (ii) you have to wait for the second hit to actually see if you first hit has landed – at this time the thief may be miles away.

Stealth is ridiculous in this game. Thieves will tell you its a L2P issue. But thats completely BS. Thieves will tell you its all about culling. Thats also BS. Stealth is a completely broken mechanic in WvW. Anyone knows, however thieves deny it and Anet is too busy balancing around sPVP + PVE, totally ignoring WvW.

Im so bored of fighting thieves 1vs1 but it gets even more worse. It strikes me that at least 90% of all solo roamers are thieves nowadays.

Gallrvaghn.4921:

teg.1340:

International.7980:

D/D Lightning 1 never lands anyway…it needs better range before dmg.

It seems to me that Air #1 has been greatly improved with the latest patch. It hits much more reliable than before in wvw.

Yep, I agree. Hitting inanimate targets are now doable with Air 1. Rejoice!

Air 1 also works much better for moving targets.

International.7980:

D/D Lightning 1 never lands anyway…it needs better range before dmg.

It seems to me that Air #1 has been greatly improved with the latest patch. It hits much more reliable than before in wvw.

Sure its less effective then before. But its not that bad, that it cannot be compensated by the way you are acting. You dont need that extra seconds in every fight. So not every fight is affected by this change.

I think 20s cooldown is ok. Its en par now with similar skills like warriors Rush. Its pretty well balanced now.

Ether renewal is great for getting rid of a heavy cloaked immobilize, because it removes multiple conditions instead of just one.

Raptured.9307:

It forced me to another class and it’s the best choice I’ve ever made. Just lawn mowing every mob I see now. Guess what I’m rolling?

That was easy:

pve = warrior; wvw = thief

SlimGenre.6417:

lol, it could be worse, you could be a class that can’t maintain swiftness… I get so bored trying to get somewhere on anyone but my ele…

with buffs on aura’s getting you up to like 5m of swiftness, what else ya gonna do besides sit there and spam RTL, Burning Speed and Lightning Flash to increase our already rediculously easy to maintain mobility.

5m of swiftness? What are you talking about? I really have a hard time stacking enough swiftness since the latest patch. Reduced Swiftness and Fury uptime hits me very hard.

Iavra.8510:

shorten Fire Field + Blast finisher duration (20 sec in my opinion is much too long and allows a full bunker build to also deal respectable amounts of damage. I’ve seen D/D eles been able to get to 25 might stacks on their own)

fire field lasts 6 sec and has 2 sources of damage: burst damage is applied on skill activation. burning is applied when you cross the borders of the radius.

I dont see any problem with the current duration. 6 secs is not that long. If you want to leave the ring earlier, you have to eat that burning.

And blast finishers are the same for any profession in the entire game. Why should might stacking work differently for eles? Sounds not fair.

Besides: 25 might stacks self buffed is bogus for ele. Its not possible. Earth blast finishers are on 30/45s cooldown. Earth dodge roll blast finisher is possible at most every 15s. Sigil of Battle is on 9s cooldown. Fire Attunement gives 1 might at most every 9s. Did I forgot anything?

Henrik.7560:

and OP high armor

ROFL? My ele is at 2500 armor whereas my warrior is at 2600. Ele is full toughness equip on every exotic piece. My warrior is full knights armor + berserker trinkets.

At the end my warrior has way more crit chance, massive crit damage, more power, way more hitpoints and still more armor than my ele.

Vanthian.9267:

Zenith.7301:

These staff escape skills have slow activation times allowing for plenty of reaction time to the opponent or are slow projectiles…..

Meanwhile…. a Warrior kneels down for 3 seconds to channel a single attack!
Meanwhile…. a Warrior does a cute spin on the spot then charges in the wrong direction because you went left then right.

LOL? Killshot is 1,75 seconds casttime, not 3 seconds. Still quite some time, but it hits squishys for 10k+ damage. Combine Frenzy + Killshot + Volley to get squishys explode within 2 seconds. Done that alot in WvW on my warrior.

You cannot compare warrior and ele skills. Its totally different mechanics. Both have pros and cons.

If you want to compare something you should go for Killshot vs. Churning Earth.

Drawing Guy.3701:

teg needs to work on his sarcasm meter a little bit – especially if you couple it with my post that happened just before your own.

Hehe. Sometimes its hard for me because english is not my main language. But I try to do my best, bro!

The damage number you see over your enemies head while using whirlwind attack is cumulative. You dont hit your enemy 1x for 8k but probably 4x for 2k. Look at the combat log to see the correct damage numbers for each individual hit.

brunohstein.9038:

teg.1340:

Spamming heartseeker is useless in 1vs1. But its far from useless in larger WvW battles to finish enemies. Just pick a target at 50% health and spam heartseeker until he dies. Its easy and efficient.

Its the only spamable gap closer in the entire game. 6 x heartseeker = 2700 range. thats almost double the range of eles RTL. Its the reason you cannot kite away from thiefs.

Again: Heartseeker is ok for 1vs1 but its entirely broken for larger WvW battles.

So, if it is not useless only in one specific situation, let’s nerf it so it is useless in all of them?

No. Just bring Heartseekers gap closer on par to all the other gap closers in the game. It could be easily fixed by putting a 8s cooldown only to the leap effect of heartseeker. This would prevent abusing heartseeker just to close gaps. Make this a WvW only change. Problem fixed.

Thieves in these forums are claiming for month that only noobs spam heartseeker like that. If this is true, the proposed change could hardly be called a nerf.

Spamming heartseeker is useless in 1vs1. But its far from useless in larger WvW battles to finish enemies. Just pick a target at 50% health and spam heartseeker until he dies. Its easy and efficient.

Its the only spamable gap closer in the entire game. 6 x heartseeker = 2700 range. thats almost double the range of eles RTL. Its the reason you cannot kite away from thiefs.

Again: Heartseeker is ok for 1vs1 but its entirely broken for larger WvW battles.

Red Falcon.8257:

Eles are getting nerfed soon, Anet said.

Back in September 2012 they said, that they want to nerf bunker builds. Nothing has been changed til now.

Now they said Ele is on their watchlist (nothing mentioned about actual nerfs yet).

Thief feedback thread is 2.7k replies strong, but nothing has been changed for WvW.

…

tl;dr I wont expect too much.

Brutalistik.6473:

Warriors Endure pain: can ignore only physical damage for 3 seconds and the cool down is 90 seconds. It can be activated another time when the hp is lower at certain % if traited.

No it cant. After using Endure Pain (active skill) the passive version is on cooldown and doesnt trigger. you have to wait for the passive version, then use the active version, which is kinda meh.

Drawing Guy.3701:

Teg – #2 is very useful if there is only one person stomping you and they don’t have stability. And if you managed to use it, they’d be stupid to ignore you – if my warrior stands up and they don’t do all they can to drop me or actively engage me to avoid my attacks, they WILL die. It just happens to be that there’s always 2, so there is jack crap I can do to avoid a stomp. I’ve managed to get Vengeance ONCE in all the times I’ve allowed my warrior to go to WvW.

You’re right that #2 has its uses in 1vs1. But 1vs1 is very rare in WvW. Most of the times Im facing someone 1vs1 its either a thief or a d/d ele. In both cases our #2 is useless: thief stomps you from stealth and ele stomps you with armor of earth or mist form.

Downed #2 should be instantly usable + effect should be PBAOE (no target needed). Than it would be useful in WvW.

BTW: Eles Vapor Form has been changed so its instantly ready when downed.

I would prefer access to protection + regeneration (like any other profession has) over more burst damage.

Hey,

I tried hard to get a WvW build using banners. But I gave up, its impossible. Banners for WvW are perse useless:

1. Banners range is way to small to be useful in WvW. Most of the time I dont fight at choke points. I have to move around the whole time. I cannot stand in that tiny banners radius.
2. Banners cooldown is way to high. Because of point (1) I had to recast banners every now and than. But with a (reduced) cooldown of 96 seconds, thats impossible.
3. Picking up Banners in WvW is inconvenient. Most often I dont have time to pick something up before moving. Furthermore there are so many objectives like loot bags, siege, broken walls and doors, which prevents you from picking exactly your banner. And finally every now and then another player accidently picks your banner up + throws it away. Awesome!
4. The banners bonuses are mediocre for the given cooldown. 180 stats in a tiny radius for 45s on a 120s cooldown? Come on. Even buff food got better stats with a 100% uptime.

It really bothers me that warriors dont have access to regeneration other than 30 tactics + banners. And I’m deeply disappointed that a whole professions mechanic is completely useless.

These are my suggestions to make banners viable.

1. Reduce banners cooldown to at least 60s.
2. Increase the banners range. Add a visual circle so you can see when you’re in the radius of a banner.
3. Remove the existing stat bonuses (its way to boring). Instead add the following effects:
- Banner of Defense: Grant Protection to all nearby allies for 5s (refreshes every 10s)
- Banner of Tactics: Heals nearby allies for 1000 (?) (every 10s)
- Banner of Strength: Cripples nearby enemies for 5s (refreshes every 10s)
- Banner of Discipline: Blinds nearby enemies (refreshes every 10s)
4. Banners bonuses are also granted when the banner has been picked up.
5. Add F2 shortcut for picking up / placing the currently active banner. You must be in 600 range to pick up.
6. Only one banner per warrior can be active simultaneously.

What do you think?

A few reasons why warriors are far from OP in pvp/wvw:

- no protection
- no regeneration (lol @ banners)
- no aegis
- no blind
- no chill
- crappy condition removing
- crappy damage prevention
- builds are full of trade-offs because so many abilities are mutual exclusive
- no serious condition damage builds

If you take away warrior range capabilities and DPS you can just remove the entire profession.

There is no logic behind downed skills balancing in this game. Some abilities are extremely OP while others are extremely useless. Warrior is the latter, so better dont get downed.

I play WvW-only and when my warrior gets downed, the game is over. Vengeance is a joke. Its on a 20s cooldown. I cant remember the last time when I was able to use it in WvW. And when I use it, all the enemy has to do is ignore me for a few seconds until I die. Even Downed #2 is rarely usable because most of the time I get stomped instantly.

Iavra.8510:

nothing to prevent damage

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Endure_Pain
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Defy_Pain_%28warrior_trait%29
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_Stance

Both Endure Pain and Shield Stance dont prevent condition damage. Defy Pain has an internal cooldown of 90 seconds, so it doesnt trigger after using Endure Pain which makes this trait pretty much useless to me.

Fuzzion.2504:

teg.1340:

I’ve tested yesterday:

Warriors Rush needs 2.3 seconds to finish whereas Eles RTL needs just 2.0 seconds. And yep, its true that RTLs traveling distance is much larger + has a shorter cooldown.

So at the end RTL in each way is far superior to Rush.

You do realise using War Rush to justify a change in Ele RtL is not very useful.

Ask any ele, “would they swap light for heavy armour and in return give up RtL for Rush”?

Their answer would be yes.

Where did I said anything about nerfing RTL? I just posted some facts about those two skills. I’ve both chars (war, ele) on 80 in full exo, playing WvW since headstart.

But to answer your question: No! Never ever would I give up RTL for heavy armor on my ele.

Warriors heavy armor is a joke. Warriors lack all those powerful boons and conditions like protection, regen (lol @ banners), aegis, blind, and chill.

Heavy Armor is like +290 toughness compared to Light Armor. Protection on the other side is like +950 defense compared to no protection. Forget about armor classes in this game!

Silver.8023:

Warrior – Good duration cripple, Immobilise on the burst and has a nice spammable leap finisher skill.

You forgot something:

Warrior – No protection, no regen (lol @ banners), no aegis, no blind, no retaliation, nothing to prevent damage

All they got is DPS + CC + mobility.

Sorry bro, you cannot have it all. Get used to it. The grass is always greener on the other side.

I’ve tested yesterday:

Warriors Rush needs 2.3 seconds to finish whereas Eles RTL needs just 2.0 seconds. And yep, its true that RTLs traveling distance is much larger + has a shorter cooldown.

So at the end RTL in each way is far superior to Rush.

Amargein.1569:

Here’s an example of how using offhand axe and Arcing Slice could give lots of fury for minimal investment AND maintain high adrenaline for passive benefits of 12% damage and 9% crit:

0. Hundred Blades, Rush are on cooldown
1. Use Arcing Slice (30 adrenaline) for 15+ seconds of fury and a > 1 .0 scaling weapon attack.
2. Weapon swap to offhand axe for 5 adrenaline
activate Dual Strike for 4-12+ seconds of additional fury and a 1.67 scaling attack and 2-6 hits of adrenaline before any other traits
3. Activate Whirling Axe for a ~0.9/sec scaling AoE attack, 15 base adrenaline per target, and many, many weapon/crit procs
4. Weapon swap to greatsword for 5 adrenaline and use Hundred Blades

This whole series (1-4) should be able to be performed during the cooldown of Hundred Blades and generates 19+ seconds of fury, does more damage per swing than a greatsword auto-attack chain, hits more times for more procs, and re-fills your adrenaline before your next Hundred Blades/whatever you want to do for the next 20 seconds (minimum) before you need to do this again for fury. It only relies on 15 points in Discipline, your weapon skills, and nothing else.

Arcing Slice, Dual Strike and Whirling Axe does way lower damage than e.g. Whirlwind Attack, Bladetrail or the axe 1 chain. So while you are wasting 6-8s for this combo you could just use FGJ for 3 additional stacks of might + permafury + perma 12%/9% bonus and concentrate on the highest damage skills available. Add in the fact that you can get additional benefits from FGJ shout, e.g. healing or adrenaline or condition removal. Furthermore FGJ is a 600 range group buff and this is a MMORPG.

BTW: weapon procs have an internal cooldown of 5s, so you won’t see that much procs while using whirling axe. Sure you hit 5 targets instead of 3, but the damage is much lower than other skills.

Atherakhia.4086:

Be very careful what you wish for with Rush and Bull’s Charge. They’ve clearly found a way to resolve the issue of these types of skills missing if you look at grasp for Ele’s Dagger Earth 3 skill Magnetic Grasp. They turned it into a 2 point attack, one to hit the target and imobalize them, the second to leap to the target.

Now this would resolve the issue of missing attacks when using these skills, but these skills serve a much more valuable dual purpose for the Warrior as they’re also used to disengage from the enemy (I’d argue they’re probably used more often for this purpose). If they ‘fix’ these skills like they did with magnetic grasp, it would remove the functionality for using them as disengages unless they somehow keep the logic to move if there isn’t a target selected.

I dont think this is comparable. Old version of eles magnetic grasp really had nothing in common with warriors rush or bulls charge.

You can better compare Rush/Bulls Charge with eles Ride the Lightning. RTL works way better than Rush/BC, because RTL has some kind of auto-aim (changes direction when the target changes direction). Its also much faster movement.

dukefx.9730:

Summary: those who do not use FGJ need other sources for non-stop fury uptime.; either weapon skills or foreign sources. So, the next time you say Arcing Slice or Dual Strike fury is useless think of this!

Axe 4 deals mediocre damage and 4s fury is not that much. Axe 5 is also mediocre damage. So to me using offhand axe is not an option.

Arcing slice is fine for maintaining perma fury without FGJ, but again the damage is mediocre and you loose 12% damage + 9% crit chance.

tl;dr: Damage wise its better to just use SoR + FGJ. Not only do you get perma fury but also 8+ stacks of might permanently. Thats why 99% of all damage builds run FGJ + SoR.

dukefx.9730:

Where do people get the idea of permafury? Not everyone is running some mindless 30 in tactics build and has FGJ up all the time.

30 in tactics?
All you need is SoR + FGJ + 10 points in discipline to gain perma fury as a warrior.

I agree with you that adrenaline mechanics is way to boring compared to other professions. But I think your suggestion would be too OP.

I really like the general concept of having adrenaline gainers and spenders + passive bonuses if you dont use the spenders. But IMO there are way to few spenders and bonuses to make the warrior mechanics fun to play.

So here is my suggestion:

1. Add more passive adrenaline bonuses (one for each trait line):

- Strength: Berserkers Power (up to 12% damage bonus)
- Arms: Heightened Focus (up to 9% crit chance bonus, move from discipline to arms)
- Defense: Adrenal Health (health regen)
- Tactics: ??? (up to -25% condition duration)
- Discipline: Warriors Sprint (up to 25% run speed bonus)

2. Add 2 new adrenaline abilities to each weapon (3 adrenaline skills per weapon). First adrenaline skill becomes available at 1/3 adrenaline at the cost of 1/3, second at 2/3 for the cost of 2/3, third as is.

IMO that would make playing warriors much more fun.

Afterwards Anet should rework banners, to make them more useful in WvW.