Guild Wars 2

segman.3560:

You’re not the first one and won’t be the last one, trust me. They care about this thread as much as me or others that share my opinion here. You posted on public forum, prepare your behind for public judgement. If you don’t care about other ppl opinions, don’t use the forums and submit a qq ticket to the support team so they can add them to other qq posts.

Toodles

Oh, but you see, they do care.

I care about your opinion as much as you care about mine. Neither of our opinions have any impact on each other at all.

However, I’m sure ANet cares, considering they are releasing an expansion and are desperately trying to get users to come back and spend money.

But if ANet truly feels that anyone who has an issue with the game should not come back, then I’m sure they will lock this up or delete it. It would be a pretty strange stance to take on their part, with the struggling userbase as it is, but who knows. Maybe it’s time they start taking feedback.

segman.3560:

seriously, if you left the game, don’t bother coming back

ANet should accept that as their motto!

For your information, this thread wasn’t posted to make you happy. I don’t care whether you like my opinion or not. This thread was posted as feedback, and letting ANet know why I won’t be coming back, despite them sending me emails asking me to come back.

Thanks for the bumps, though.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

With no grind, they mean no mandatory grind.

Exactly! No games have grind, you can just choose to not play them. Not mandatory at all.

Yargesh.4965:

Then the game does not meet your desires, good to know. What is your point again?

See: thread title

Think about what you’re trying to use as an argument, and how it defeats itself.

Builds not mattering for 95% of the game isn’t a good selling point. The doesn’t make the fact that they are only available for 5% of the game better. It just makes it that much worse.

If anything, you’re hurting the little bit of motivation I had to come back.

Yargesh.4965:

Apathy.6430:

Yargesh.4965:

bought a new account on sale.
Two weeks to get to 80, no crafting, Eotm for 3 levels just to get 70-80.
2g for buying traits I did not want to go out and get.
Can’t really see the issue of not playing because of maybe.

Surely you can see how “if you come back now, in two weeks you’ll have access to build defining features” is not the most enticing thing?

I can’t even count the number of games that I can go play right now, and make meaningful decisions immediately after. This game is far from engaging enough, and the decisions are far from meaningful enough, to hide them behind “it only takes two weeks!”.

They either need to put a carrot on the stick or get a shorter stick.

If they where playing before then they can jump in wherever they left off. There are more options at 80 but the game is the same. Traits don’t matter until 80 anyway.

Traits don’t really matter at 80 either. Adding a longer stick just serves to show how small the carrot really is.

Yargesh.4965:

bought a new account on sale.
Two weeks to get to 80, no crafting, Eotm for 3 levels just to get 70-80.
2g for buying traits I did not want to go out and get.
Can’t really see the issue of not playing because of maybe.

Surely you can see how “if you come back now, in two weeks you’ll have access to build defining features” is not the most enticing thing?

I can’t even count the number of games that I can go play right now, and make meaningful decisions immediately after. This game is far from engaging enough, and the decisions are far from meaningful enough, to hide them behind “it only takes two weeks!”.

They either need to put a carrot on the stick or get a shorter stick.

I’ve read about them changing how you unlock them in general, which I don’t mind.

It’s the mindnumbing boring between level 1 and 30 that irks me…and there’s been no mention of that. That, and needing to reach 80 until you can actually play with grandmaster traits is also quite a turnoff.

Then I remembered the disaster that happened with traits, with them not starting until 30 and not unlocking them all until 80.

I understand handholding to a certain point, but if you’re going to hold off major game mechanics for the first hundred hours of gameplay for each character, then no thanks.

It’s not that you “have” to level alts, it’s that you “get” to.

According to ANet, leveling alts is fun because dynamic events are constantly evolving and changing the world.

RuneCrimson.7380:

I went in to check out the event for the first time in months….Got told I have to read cliff notes on Diffy.com so I dipped….Its not even worth playing much anymore. Gotta read rules to even play now….and to map complete gotta go into WvW where I will never get what I need cause I will get downed every 5 minutes. Not being able to map complete without being forced into a PvP situation ruined it for me a while ago…thought I would pick up just doing events and such and I get told I have to read the rules just to play the event. blah. The game just keeps getting better..good thing its not a pay per month game.

Don’t play it then, there’s a LOT of other games that are more enjoyable than this.

I mean, this is a pretty stereotypical run of the mill MMO, so maybe you and your wife should look into a different genre. I hear Diablo 3 is pretty straightforward and easy to understand.

- Fun impacts loot collection. The rarest items in the game are not more powerful than other items, so you don’t need them to be the best. The rarest items have unique looks to help your character feel that sense of accomplishment, but it’s not required to play the game. We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.

- Fun impacts decisions. Every time you finish a dungeon you get tokens you can trade in for reward items that you want, rather than having a small chance of getting it as a drop, because it’s more fun to always get rewarded for finishing with something you want to have!

- Fun impacts development. Explorable dungeons have multiple paths you can take and random events in them. Because of this you don’t feel like you need to play the same dungeon over and over again if you want to chase the prestigious rewards at the end, but can instead mix up that experience to keep it fresh and fun.

- Fun impacts customization. The event and personal story systems allow you to get a sense of customization from your characters. Playing through the game, each character can experience completely different content, and the world can always stay fresh and new in the pursuit of new story lines, and an ever-changing dynamic event world. It means going back to a place you’ve already been with a character can be fun, and it means making a new character on an entirely different personal story chain can be fun as well.

- It doesn’t take much effort to get the best stats available
- You don’t have to run dungeons over and over and over to get their rewards
- Dynamic events are ever-changing and totally not the same ones repeated on timers
- Doing different events somehow equates to customization

Beldin.5498:

Apathy.6430:

Beldin.5498:

Most of all the advertising of GW2 before release was about the open world and events. They never said much about that it would be another dungeon grinder where you have to be in brown holes under the earth for 99% of the time.

They should have called it something other than Guild Wars, honestly.

The only real resemblance it has to it’s predecessor is reusing names and brand awareness.

Don’t really care about that. However i wouldn’t have played it at all if it would have been like GW1, and i needed to convince a lot of friends that it is different because a lot of people simply didn’t liked Gw1 at all.

That’s so cool.

And all of those kind of people will be gone as soon as the next big MMO comes out, and actual fans of the IP will be left with this husk of a game.

RuneCrimson.7380:

Then the drops are not specific like people are telling me. Either way I see Different then what I am being told so I just stick to my little group and if I get something that I think belongs to them I hand it over to them.

You’re putting a lot of effort into trolling.

Beldin.5498:

Most of all the advertising of GW2 before release was about the open world and events. They never said much about that it would be another dungeon grinder where you have to be in brown holes under the earth for 99% of the time.

They should have called it something other than Guild Wars, honestly.

The only real resemblance it has to it’s predecessor is reusing names and brand awareness.

RuneCrimson.7380:

I do not believe it cause I have seen different I watched someone take My loot more then once and I have seen XP split between Myself my wife and two friends when we where playing a while back. But like I said not getting into that fight. When i kill a monster and get 200xp and kill it with two other people and get 67 xp I know its being split. Its obvious. But no one pays it no attention cause its not important to most. But its important to me when I play a MMO I want my loot and XP cause its hard work I do not some leech player who stands around waiting for someone to kill something or jump in and take the credit for the kill.

lol, are you for real?

So…I’m confused.

Asking how to make the most of your gear that you won’t change with your build that you won’t change?

VOLKON.1290:

Just because you can’t imagine something doesn’t mean someone else hasn’t or that it doesn’t exist.

Of course, I’m not saying open world stuff shouldn’t exist.

I’m just hella bummed that they spent the last year focusing solely on that, and haven’t touched the dungeons that are in a sorry state.

Honestly, there’s just a lot of things I’m hella bummed about regards this game, and I’m not sure I’ll ever really be happy with it.

The more I think about it, the more I realize that I just generally don’t like other people. I like the cooperative nature and teamwork in dungeons (in games in general, not the atrocity present in this game), but I don’t really like other people…they kind of sap the fun out of everything. It’s always rush rush rush to get the tokens, skip this group skip that group stack here so we can kill boss faster hurry hurry hurry zerk only.

GW1 was just amazing…could play with people that I actually wanted to play with, or could opt to just have heroes+hench. Always had that “teamwork and cooperation” feeling even if it’s clearing some random zone in Cantha. In Guild Wars 2…regular open world is bland and boring, no real thought just click an enemy and wait until it dies then do it again…dungeons are rush rush rush zerker only hurry hurry tokens tokens.

But hey, at least I’m enjoying yoloPvP.

uhohhotdog.3598:

GLF 3 MORE ZERK ONLY ALREADY HAVE 2 ZERK WARS
GLF 3 MORE ZERK ONLY ALREADY HAVE 2 ZERK WARS
GLF 3 MORE ZERK ONLY ALREADY HAVE 2 ZERK WARS
GLF 3 MORE ZERK ONLY ALREADY HAVE 2 ZERK WARS
GLF 3 MORE ZERK ONLY ALREADY HAVE 2 ZERK WARS

Yep, seems about right. Much improved.

Now I’m just making up excuses.

I’m really just not that interested in open world stuff. It’s always been awful in every game and has been awful in every experience with it in GW2. I can’t possibly imagine how standing around hundreds of faceless people doing the exact same thing that I’m doing could be fun.

VOLKON.1290:

Apathy.6430:

I’m also on a dead server, and not sure I want to spend 30 bucks just to try out something I’m not entirely interested in.

Guesting is free.

Which US server isn’t awful?

Gate of Madness apparently has “very high” population, but there’s never anybody doing anything.

I’m also on a dead server, and not sure I want to spend 30 bucks just to try out something I’m not entirely interested in.

VOLKON.1290:

Apathy.6430:

VOLKON.1290:

Apathy.6430:

VOLKON.1290:

That’s the point, these fights are anything but a mindless zergfest. Mindless zergs fail miserably.

Anything with hundreds of random people is a mindless zerg, with or without a trinity.

The fact that anything that requires any ounce of thought is completed falls back to the infinite monkey theorum.

Spoken with the experience of someone that hasn’t succeeded in these fights I guess? These are anything but mindless zergs. The Wurm kills, for example, are highly organized events. The Marionette less so due to familiarity, but again, you can’t zerg it. Even Tequatl is far from a zerg due to so many coordinated things that need to be done together in order to succeed.

Yeah, I’m basing it on Tequatl from release. Has it changed in the meantime? I have so little interest in PvE, especially the open world hogwash, that I haven’t even bothered checking out the “new” meaningless fights.

Oh man, it’s been fully revamped and is a completely different fight. You’ll want to be on TS for this one now, I highly recommend checking it out at least once.

Meh, too many reasons to not care.

I was excited for a second, then I realized the amount of work it takes to get ascended gear, and I lost all interest again.

Yay vertical progression.

Most helpful thing I saw a ranger do was swap to his zerker warrior for an exp mode dungeon.

VOLKON.1290:

Apathy.6430:

VOLKON.1290:

That’s the point, these fights are anything but a mindless zergfest. Mindless zergs fail miserably.

Anything with hundreds of random people is a mindless zerg, with or without a trinity.

The fact that anything that requires any ounce of thought is completed falls back to the infinite monkey theorum.

Spoken with the experience of someone that hasn’t succeeded in these fights I guess? These are anything but mindless zergs. The Wurm kills, for example, are highly organized events. The Marionette less so due to familiarity, but again, you can’t zerg it. Even Tequatl is far from a zerg due to so many coordinated things that need to be done together in order to succeed.

Yeah, I’m basing it on Tequatl from release. Has it changed in the meantime? I have so little interest in PvE, especially the open world hogwash, that I haven’t even bothered checking out the “new” meaningless fights.

VOLKON.1290:

That’s the point, these fights are anything but a mindless zergfest. Mindless zergs fail miserably.

Anything with hundreds of random people is a mindless zerg, with or without a trinity.

The fact that anything that requires any ounce of thought is completed falls back to the infinite monkey theorum.

Phadde.7362:

Playing support in this game is much more enjoyable than healing, even though it’s mostly redundant when playing with fairly skillful players, it really makes a big difference when playing in most PUGs and such. But support could definitely have a bigger role in PvE.

You’ve just convinced yourself that is the case, as the lesser DPS professions are kind of forced to do to make themselves feel worthwhile. I did it too for awhile, it’s an easy trap to fall into. Then you try one of the zerkers and you wonder how the hell you managed while rocking a “support” class.

You’d be better off shaving a minute off the fight by going DPS rather than “support”. The most supporting thing you can do in the game is revive people when they go down, but you don’t need to build for that, just dodge and press F.

VOLKON.1290:

But speaking of PvE… no one has yet shared with us how fights like Tequatl or the Marionette could possibly be designed with a trinity system in place. I still say that one of the major flaws of the trinity, you can’t design fights like these, or the Jungle Wurm for that matter, with the archaic trinity.

Massive open world events are always a mindless zergfest in every game. I’m guessing that isn’t what the conversation is mostly about.

That said, a lot of heals are AoE based, so pretty easy to know how it would work…exactly like they do in WvW.

KarlaGrey.5903:

Apathy.6430:

I heard the sPvP was much improved, and that seems to be true…I’m having a blast. It’s depressing when there’s more build and role variety in PvP than PvE.

Interesting o0

Making 5v5 readily available instead of the awful 8v8 hotjoins helped immensely. So much more enjoyable than when I quit playing a yearish ago.

KarlaGrey.5903:

Also, I didn’t realize players still opted for henchies in the hero era. o0

I quit playing before they enabled full hero teams. I’d done pretty much everything there was to do on most professions and just kind of wandered off. I beat Proph and Factions with full hench teams…they weren’t THAT bad…way better than 95% of pug groups.

Honestly, I’d be much happier right now with an extra 3-4 GW1 expansions rather than GW2. The only reason I’ve come back to GW2 is because I heard the sPvP was much improved, and that seems to be true…I’m having a blast. It’s depressing when there’s more build and role variety in PvP than PvE.

sorudo.9054:

tanks where good till MM’s became better, from there on having no MM was seen as a death sentence. (don’t ask me why, i did great without both of them)

Maybe to the awfuls that made up pugs.

I rarely used MM (and only the bottom of the barrel players even considered a “tank”), and completed almost all of HM with heroes+hench.

Oh god…I miss GW1. Shame I put tens of thousands of hours into it and did pretty much everything there was to do multiple times.

Harper.4173:

Also I’m glad that your " lfg experience " isn’t that bad – but it isn’t just marketing – I’ve personally gone through the " lfg monk / lfg tank " situation and don’t enjoy it one bit.

How about – to each his own?

Only really bad players in GW1 used “tanks”.

Honestly, GW1 was pretty much the perfect set up I’ve seen in an MMO. Damage builds had their place, support/disabling builds had their place, and healing was way more interactive than “spam big heals on tank” prevalent in most other MMOs. Plus, without there being a tank, everyone had to pay attention to what was going on.

And the part that made it even better? If you couldn’t find a healer, or damage, or whatever you needed…you could throw on a hero or hench and they would do an acceptable job (usually better than pugs).

Hell, you could even lone wolf pretty much the entire game. I did FoW hard mode with a group of 7…me plus six heroes.

PvE is just awful in this game in general. It pretty much just needs completely revamped, as the only thing that matters in any aspect of it is doing more DPS.

killcannon.2576:

Apathy.6430:

Treborlavok.3504:

hellsmachine.4085:

Treborlavok and Lalangamena if you read my last couple of posts you would see that we came to an understanding, try not to be so mad. It doesn’t help the matter and will most likely get the thread closed.

Nah it’s all good. I’m not mad at all I’m just disappointed because this game could’ve been so much more. I was an avid eq/eq2 player for many years. So I love the trinity. But it was nice to have something come along with the hopes of a soft or no trinity. I just wish they would’ve done about it another way.. Maybe it was rushed maybe it es an oversight who knows. But the main thing is that the game is already too far along to change and not kitten off one majority if players or the other.

The game is still fun. But it will be replaced with bigger and better things. It’s the nature of the beast.

ESO seems to have a pretty good “soft trinity” from what I hear.

Never trust marketing or beta tests. Wait for the game.

Looks like it will be fun for at least a month or two regardless.

Oh, yeah, of course.

After the sham that was GW2 marketing, I’ll never trust marketing again. GW2 also has a really indepth soft trinity…LOL

So many smoke and mirrors…not sure whether to feel pity for ANet for their incompetence to deliver what they promised, or contempt for their blatant lies.

Treborlavok.3504:

hellsmachine.4085:

Treborlavok and Lalangamena if you read my last couple of posts you would see that we came to an understanding, try not to be so mad. It doesn’t help the matter and will most likely get the thread closed.

Nah it’s all good. I’m not mad at all I’m just disappointed because this game could’ve been so much more. I was an avid eq/eq2 player for many years. So I love the trinity. But it was nice to have something come along with the hopes of a soft or no trinity. I just wish they would’ve done about it another way.. Maybe it was rushed maybe it es an oversight who knows. But the main thing is that the game is already too far along to change and not kitten off one majority if players or the other.

The game is still fun. But it will be replaced with bigger and better things. It’s the nature of the beast.

ESO seems to have a pretty good “soft trinity” from what I hear.

Zoid.2568:

chemiclord.3978:

Simply put, if you have a handful of skills, and you want to balance them, you have two choices:

1) Buff up EVERY OTHER skill… oh, and re-balance everything else in the game so that it remains at the level of “difficulty” you want.

OR

2) Nerf the handful of skills you have deemed out of balance.

100% of game developers will (and should) use option #2. Deal with it.

All they have to do is reduce time/damage of Dhuumfire and don’t move it over to Death Shroud. Still not OP with the damage it has now, but nerfing it like that(moving it to Death Shroud) and making it useless to a lot of builds is not the right way to do it.

Pretty sure his response was addressing the “OMG STOP NERFING ANYTHING EVER” argument, and not the validity of the dhuum nerf specifics.

chemiclord.3978:

Simply put, if you have a handful of skills, and you want to balance them, you have two choices:

1) Buff up EVERY OTHER skill… oh, and re-balance everything else in the game so that it remains at the level of “difficulty” you want.

OR

2) Nerf the handful of skills you have deemed out of balance.

100% of game developers will (and should) use option #2. Deal with it.

For an example of a game that does number 1, check out Warframe.

The devs of that game are lazy and weak, so they just spend all of their time releasing stronger and stronger weapons despite the fact that all of the content in the game was trivialized months ago.

munkiman.3068:

The game really redefines support roles. I thought i’d miss playing a healing class, but i don’t. I can easily play an ele or guardian and get my support itch scratched quite nicely, even Engi or ranger have pretty good support roles. But then again i enjoy cooperative team play in this games mechanics.

You’re just convincing yourself you’re not being deadweight.

Going pure zerker warrior would help the team WAY more than 200-300 healing every few seconds in the land of one shot kills.

Zoid.2568:

The best teamwork you will get in GW2 is: “Hug wall and AoE. Only Warriors, Guardian and Elementalist”

The epitome of teamwork, surely ANet’s dream system as they’ve made zero attempts to change it.

Yargesh.4965:

Go to options, control options and remove all the shift commands.

It’s not there =/

Save your dodges for when you get ready to exit.

Exit before it hits zero, as other players are usually just waiting to blow their stun loads all over your face as soon as it drops naturally.

I’m just happy my DS bunker isn’t on their radar yet.

Bump?

This is so annoying. Is there seriously no way to remap this?

hellsmachine.4085:

killcannon.2576:

hellsmachine.4085:

Raine.1394:

killcannon.2576:

hellsmachine.4085:

killcannon.2576:

Reverence.6915:

3 game modes and 2 are PvP based. Combat in GW2 is largely balanced around PvP. Of course there shouldn’t be trinity.

Anyway, PvE in any MMO is mindless, boring and scripted. You’re either wailing away at a meat tank or you’re being killed in 2 hits or both (when you’re soloing content, not including grinding, which can be done with a bot). Why are we even discussing PvE here?

Because pvp has never really relied on a trinity in any game and doesn’t have a place in the topic? You get lost on the way to the pvp forum?

You don’t PvP much do you killcannon? Other MMOs it’s basically team with healers wins… If your team has no healers, but the other does you may aswell just afk…

incorrect, the team who kills the others healers first wins.

That is the central aspect of strategy, generally, though not the only one. If it’s arena, it might just be killing the squishiest one or ignoring the squishiest one for that matter. Combat is rather rich under the trinity, unlike the stack and wail combat of GW2.

If you really think trinity is so “rich” and GW2 PvP is stack and wail. Why are you even playing this game? There’s countless MMOs with trinity… Why don’t you just play them instead of trying to turn GW2 into one of them?

I just don’t see how anyone can say the lack of defined rolls makes this game better than any other. It just makes it one dimensional. There needs to be a reason for build diversity adopted and implemented in game.

I want toughness, vitality, and healing power to synergize better with a characters skills.

If I decide to make a high vitality build, I want it to give me a bonus on dodges, or an extra dodge meter or a bonus defense versus condition damage.

I want toughness to synergize with defensive skills more. I want it to extend block times with shields, increase counter damage for skills that have such, I want it to extend durations on defensive skills or increase their potency.

I want healing power to give more than just bonus healing. If it’s high enough, I want chances for extra effects, I want heals to matter to my teammates more than “x player drop water field, and 20 players burst finish in it”, I want chances of reviving downed allies with high heals.

I want more than just crit dmg and power to synergize with my skills so that if I do choose to go that route, it’s not just a wasted effort. A toughness, vitality build should synergize with skills as well as a zerker build.

But it doesn’t. There is no incentive to do anything other than stack as much dps as my skill will allow. And that’s one dimensional game play.

That’s probably a better idea than asking for Trinity…

Yeah, I’m not sure anyone here wants an exact trinity.

I’m sure people would be pretty happy with a system from a game that people may have heard of, called Guild Wars.

hellsmachine.4085:

Apathy.6430:

hellsmachine.4085:

No, the WoW crowd was simply returning to WoW. It happens in every single MMORPG since WoW.

Clearly not, as it’s subscription base is lower than it has been in years.

I blame the Pandas…

Pandaren’s were part of the Warcraft lore well before WoW was even released.

hellsmachine.4085:

No, the WoW crowd was simply returning to WoW. It happens in every single MMORPG since WoW.

Clearly not, as it’s subscription base is lower than it has been in years.

hellsmachine.4085:

Apathy.6430:

Hell, GW1 didn’t even have the trinity in the traditional sense.

There’s a lot of distance between the traditional trinity and “the only things that matter are DPS and dodging”.

EVE also doesn’t have the trinity, why don’t you go play that? Alternatively, you just stop using that awful myopic argument.

Because I don’t like space and I don’t like runescape… I also don’t like a lot of things about WoW, though I did like that game at one stage.

Ah, so you’ve finally realized this isn’t being discussed within a vacuum. We’re making progress.

Hell, GW1 didn’t even have the trinity in the traditional sense.

There’s a lot of distance between the traditional trinity and “the only things that matter are DPS and dodging”.

EVE also doesn’t have the trinity, why don’t you go play that? Alternatively, you just stop using that awful myopic argument.