Guild Wars 2

Giving Rangers stealth. What kind of kittenery is this?

So now that rangers have 3 seconds stealth on a short 12 seconds cooldown, how about you simply give every class access to stealth? Kitten this kitten.

Because clearly that’s what the game needed, MORE STEALTH CLASSES.

Wait, what, we have permastealth mesmers and rangers?

Peter Buch.8071:

Anet does give a kitten about elementalists.

Took you long enough to notice that.

Zelyhn.8069:

Well they have started introducing alternatives to arcana, like fresh air. I am quite confident that we may see something rather similar for the other elements in the future. Or maybe I am just too faithful!!

While fresh air certainly is an awesome trait (though only for scepter which is sad) it’s no substitute for 20 arcane. Sure builds with 20 points in arcane are viable though most take 30 for EA. But anything below 20 points simply gives you too long of an attunement cooldown even with fresh air.

So, never.

/15chars

I think there needs to be a distinction between meelee AOE and ranged AOE. Ranged AOE is clearly utterly out of hands. Meelee AOE on the other hand I feel is OK because it has lots of counters (just don’t stack up on the melee, move around, kite him, etc.).

ITT: A thief whining about a victim that got away.

I actually PVP because I like playing against other players (gasp!) I don’t need any carrot on a stick to get me to play it. I would pay quite some money though if I could simply buy the better skins from the locker instead of having to grind 24/7 for 3 years to get anywhere close to the required rank.

Exactly how would a 1200 range RTL be unbalanced in pvp? The whole problem was it’s range was 1550 which allowed you to RTL away, heal up without being damaged and go back to the fight. With 1200 range every single class can still damage you or move up to you with their own gap closers.

The ridiculous cooldown is not needed any more with the range decrease.

RTL was one of the defining skills eles had. It was one of the most FUN skills in the whole game. Nowadays it’s no fun anymore because you can’t use it for roaming because of the nasty 40 seconds cooldown.

Yet engineers suddenly have our old RTL, only better. Rocket boots go 900 range (about 1100 with swiftness and about 1300 with superspeed) have a 20 seconds cooldown (16 seconds with trait), cure immobilized, chill and cripple, and are a freaking blast finisher on top of all that. Oh and you can actually fly above obstacles with Rocket boots because it doesn’t take you to the ground instantly if you use it from higher ground. Just like RTl once did before all the nerfs. And of course you can use all your instant skills while rocket booting insteaf of having everything taken away like RTL does nowadays.

Sure bunker ele needed nerfs, but I still think nerfing the RTL cooldown was the wrong choice. Warriors, Rangers et al always argue that RTL is so much better because it ignores cripple and chill. Yet it also ignores swiftness. But rocket boots cure everything that could slow you down AND they benefit from swiftness.

IMHO as eles are now RTL with a simple 20 seconds cooldown would be balanced. And most importantly FUN.

The best solution to the problem would be to simply make RTL exactly like rocket boots. Cures cripples, goes 900 range by default, goes further with swiftness, and doesn’t take you immediately to the ground if used from higher up. And no longer makes you immune while traveling but also allows use of instant skill while RTLing.

But most importantly: REDUCE THE COOLDOWN. I’ve lost pretty much all interest in my ele outside of pvp because I simply can’t roam any longer or get around at a reasonable pace (and no targeting rabbits is not a solution).

My ele, ninja style:

Always total HP. Earth Embrace and Final Shielding are both a bit buggy so that they trigger well below their threshold (mostly because we have such a low healthpool that by the time the game registers you’re below 50% you’re WAY below the mark).

Cempa.5619:

Kodiak.3281:

Cempa.5619:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fEAQFAWhEmkbxR3gjDIhCGw4hG4BdY5xMsD2AA-j0xAINAaBQOsIasl2ioxqZw0oER1ekioVLEwi1A-w

Thoughts?

My thought is you should nut up and go full on Conditimentalist

Works with staff as well. Lead with Signet of Water Chill to get them to blow Condition removal. Follow up with Signet of Earth Immobilize -> Eruption -> Shockwave -> Fire -> Lava Font -> Flame Burst.

lol some guy on the WvW forum told me about your build and I made a new post here about it before seeing your post

PS that link is broken on youtube and here.

Doesn’t matter because the build is broken too

Kodiak.3281:

Aether McLoud.1975:

No offence, but that’s some of the worst gameplay I’ve ever seen, both from you and your opponents, even in hotjoin.

You realize that this creates an impossible scenario where it’s impossible to prove anything right? Any video made as proof can be dismissed out of hand by implying anyone and everyone in the videos are “terrible” and therefore they’re invalid. I could take on arguably the best player in the world and win and all you have to do is say they played poorly and therefore what I present is invalid.

Not it doesn’t, not at all. There are lots of videos out there of good players playing good (the first rule of tautology club is the first rule of tautology club!). No matter what you think, there is actually a way to objectively measure performance in pvp. Things like how often you get hit, how well you manage your cooldowns, how well you dodge heavy-hitting attacks, etc. Neither you nor your enemies did any of these things.

Also your argument has no merit because as I said the community as a whole is actually really good when judging play skill from videos (i.e. compare Teldo or Phantaram or Zoose videos to yours).

Kodiak.3281:

This is the problem you and others around here have. You’re too concerned with the theoretical. “Such and such will happen.” “If you played against so and so this would have happened.” “Without this you would be screwed in that scenario.” While all these theories are wonderful they don’t reflect actual game play experiences but rather only things that can happen in game play.

It’s funny how again, when you’re out of arguments and are up against a metaphorical wall, you try to attack your opponents again instead of their arguments. Also you fall back to strawman argumentation (You’d probably make a really good politician).

AAAAAAAnd on top of that, you actually try to argue that we all here are just theoretical pvpers and you are the once with so much gameplay experience that you are able to issue judgements on gameplay, when you yourself told us 2 post ago that you almost never pvp. And you spent 2 posts theoretically explaining your build.

Now THAT is irony.

Kodiak.3281:

Talking about how a fight will go and how you will counter/react to things is entirely different from actual fighting. People panic. People don’t react as fast as they think they could. People don’t encounter what they thought they would. At the end of the day all that matters is whether or not something is effective. I’ve proven it can be and is effective.

That sounds very… theoretical… to me. PVPers don’t panic. Why? Because they PVP all day. Sure they might be out of their domain in FOTM dungeon (I’ve never been there and I don’t care about it at all and I’d probably die within the first minute there) but they sure don’t panic in PVP. Just like race drivers don’t panic when driving 300 kph.
The only people that might panic in pvp are people like you (and probably your hotjoin opponents), pve’ers.

And no, you haven’t proven anything, not in the least that your build is anything close to viable. Go to a tournament against actual pvpers and see yourself on the ground 10 seconds after you engage and then try to come here again with your silly proof.

Kodiak.3281:

Also I don’t recall ever stating that this build is the build to end all builds and that there’s no other possible viable alternatives. I leave that nonsense to you guys.

You stated it’s viable which it isn’t. You stated it’s good, which it isn’t. You stated you won against pvpers, which you didn’t. Every competent pvper will tell you that eles don’t have any viable condition build.

Kodiak.3281:

Okay sorry for the broken links in the other areas.

First off I primarily play PvE and WvW. I like playing builds that fly in the face of what others consider “mandatory” and pulling them off. In this build there is 0 Arcane which many people would say is impossible.

SPvP:
http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fEAQJArYhEmebux2wjDAkCmEeQADJMeohHkA-ToAgyCuIKS9l7LTRyvsfNMYCC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eNyM-OdKVc

No offence, but that’s some of the worst gameplay I’ve ever seen, both from you and your opponents, even in hotjoin.

You almost never dodge (even if you did, you have no vigor) or put stone barrier up. Your enemies seem to be braindead because even if they outnumber you they don’t actively attack you. At around 8 minutes you fight against a necro and a thief, and they just seem to watch and stand there as you cast churning earth (without arcane shield or flash, and with a lowly 1400 toughness) and then get hit by it. The warrior at the start of the video even ACTIVELY RUNS INTO YOUR CHURNING EARTH RANGE.

Against non-braindead opponents you won’t last longer than a few seconds because you don’t have protection, or regeneration, or stability for ether renewal, or any source of defense or heals besides water 3 and 5 and you only have 1400 toughness.

Your build has 30 (lost) points in fire, yet you spend most of your time in earth. You try to make a condition build that’s earth based (for bleeding) yet you don’t use the fire trait that gives you burning on crit (no matter how bad the trait is it’s still our only chance to give us 2 damage conditions in 1 attunement). You have 20% reduced cooldown on fire skills yet you’re almost never in fire and when you are you don’t stay long enough for the cooldown reduction to matter, and if you switch out it doesn’t matter either because your attunement cooldown is atrociously long.

You use Pyromancer’s Puissance for might stacking, yet you never have more than 7-8 stacks of might, and most of the time you have either 0 because you haven’t been in fire for so long or around 3-4. The average amoung a normal build with sigil of battle has is 5-6 which makes a gorram weapon enchant MUCH better than your chosen grandmaster trait in your build.

I’m sorry to break it to you but your build isn’t anywhere near viable. Just like every other ele condition build, alas.

Edit: SCNR the attachment :P

vinceftw.5086:

Geff.1930:

vinceftw.5086:

Geff.1930:

These include rangers, necros, eles and to a lesser extent engis.

Do you even engi?

Most engineer build use a pistol and grenades. That gives them access to bleeds, poison, chill, immob, cripple, confusion, burning, chill and blind.

Compared to an elementalist, engineer is way better at spreading lots of different conditions.

I admit, out of all the classes engi is my least played. Most of my experience comes only from fighting against them. I said to a lesser extent engis because it is equally likely that you will see a bunker/CC based engi as you will see a condition based one, from my experience. I was not attempting to diminish their condition granting prowess.

Same can be said for elementalist though right now, the meta for them is a bursty build, some go bunker but I haven’t encountered a condition one yet.

That’s because eles simply can’t build for a condition build.

Kodiak.3281:

Aether McLoud.1975:

The message is always more important than the messenger.

Ideally that’s true, but reality is another matter entirely.

No it’s not. Not at all. If you want a serious discussion, the ONLY way to defend your position is to attack the opponent’s argument, not the opponent himself.

Kodiak.3281:

Zelyhn.8069:

Except when it’s Kodiak, in which case both are not imporant :p

Ironically this is exactly what I’m talking about. Thank you Zelyhn for taking a break from figuring out if 0.034 Fury duration is greater DPS than 2 Power. Our community as a whole suffered for this needless distraction from your great work.

If you don’t stop insulting people instead of replying to their argument nobody will ever take you seriously. Look up that wikipedia article for “Ad Hominem” again. And then again. And again. Trust me, it’ll help.

P.S. That’s not how Irony works either.

Durzlla.6295:

It could work, you’ll need to take traits for defense ( or utilities) because staff lacks in that department.

Isn’t that the main problem of all our weapon sets? (Healing isn’t defense)

Conncept.7638:

Benji.9203:

I made a thread about making signet actives be auras that correspond with the given element.

Air signet > shocking aura
Etc

I still think it would be a cool idea IMO

The problems is that with air/earth/ice sigils equipped with D/D you would essentially have immunity from ranged damage. And the problem would only be worsened by constant buffs… and then there’s the ice elemental trick.

What ice elemental trick?

Fringilla Vigo.8594:

I’m quite amazed that so few utilize masquerade set which I find one of the most beautiful in the game. I know that human T3 is nicer but since I have one (well, slightly mixed) on my necro I went for something different. Here is how she looks at the moment.

Not everyone wants to look like Stripperella

You should try fresh air scepter. It’s not only insanely fun to play, it also does a LOT of burst damage with low cooldown.

I agree though that staff is an atrocious weapon for anything but pure support (which IMHO is boring as hell).

Kodiak.3281:

Aether McLoud.1975:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

Commonly abbreviated as L2discuss.

Haven’t you realized that sometimes who is saying something is more important than what they are saying?

The message is always more important than the messenger.

Kodiak.3281:

Aether McLoud.1975:

No matter what gale just has a ridiculous cooldown. 50 seconds for a ranged single target knockback with a casttime? LOL. Updraft is instant, AOE, and even gives you swiftness on a 40 seconds cooldown, with the only drawback being melee ranged.

Wait, Aether McLoud thinks something is bad and or terrible? I am so shocked and surprised!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

Commonly abbreviated as L2discuss.

Dalo.3941:

PS: New Elite: Gain all auras for 8 seconds. All aura related traits effect the Elite.

An elite skill that isn’t a pet and doesn’t remove all our weapon skills? How exquisite!

No matter what gale just has a ridiculous cooldown. 50 seconds for a ranged single target knockback with a casttime? LOL. Updraft is instant, AOE, and even gives you swiftness on a 40 seconds cooldown, with the only drawback being melee ranged.

AndrewSX.3794:

I like GoeP, but it has few issues.

First, is not suited at all as defensive/stunbreaker skill. It’s something you want to precast and keep using on CD troughout a fight.

Second, the skill itself could use some tuning – i like the idea of it and how is right now, but feels a bit cluncky atm.

Overall, i’d prefer to see stunbreak taken away from this to another glyph, and this skill being improved a bit (i prefer the current buff rather than the “Infinite duration but one shot” figured above. but current buff doesn’t work well with stunbreak – so either move it or change the buff to keep it, even if i’d dislike to lose it).

The problem is that although having the stunbreak on GoEP doesn’t make any sense, when you REALLY WANT to add a stunbreak to a glyph, it still makes the most sense.

Heals should never stunbreak so that glyph is out. The Rez Glyph has way too long of a cooldown and is generally unusable. Both elemental glyphs don’t make any sense to have a stunbreak. And Glyph of Storms is a targeted aoe which makes it unusable as a split-decision stunbreak gylph.

I really dig the idea of GoEP giving an aura depending on your attunement.

Avead.5760:

Something irrelevant but..is it only me that thinks fresh air can work wonders with d/d too?
Its the only weaponset which has an autoattack that can like .. kill a person alone and its on air.

Yes. D/D Fresh Air doesn’t really work because what makes it work for scepter is that it’s instant damage that can happen at the same time as other burst (phoenix, churning earth, etc). D/D air autoattack, while “good” (it’s our best autoattack, that doesn’t make it good compared to other classes autoattacks), is rather slow and you can’t burst someone down with it. And you can’t kill someone with sustained damage (unless you have lots of conditions).

Vazkro.1762:

LordByron.8369:

@stealth
because there was written
“scripted AI+mobs outrageous stats”
You didn t read mobs outrageous stats it seems.
And you just proved you don t know anything about PvE.
You can t kill lvl 52 jade maw.
It just oneshot you for 1570% (if i remember correctly) your HP as you approach the area, and once you are ressed it reapply agony to oneshot you again.
it was just to say that lacks of AI doesn t mean easy.
PvE is more challenging than WWW for sure if you know how is current WWW.
For pvp its a different thing
PvP players only are uberbad at PvE and vice versa. those game modes doesn t share anything in common.
And that is the reason why PvP builds and professoins are unviable in PvE and vice versa.

I don’t like to point people on their mistakes but you keep spamming WWW instead of WvW ( World versus World ).
If it was only one time then w/e but you spam the heck out of your WWW so I just had to ask what do you mean with WWW since the only WWW I know stands for World Wide Web .

If you actually mean anything correct with it then my mistake but when people were talking about World versus World and I see you spam WWW instead then it kinda makes me wonder.

World vs World vs World

Josh Mitchell.1596:

@ ZDBioHazard: AA water cleanses a condition? I thought it was water dagger 5’s spell that was cast when hitting the ground in water attunement?

Dagger Water 5 heals and cleanses a condition so the water spell from taking falling damage should too theoretically.

10/10 would use.

Benji.9203:

Everyone else pretty much said it.

Valkyrie isn’t bunker. With a zerker jewel you have the same crit damage as a full on zerker ele just less percision. It’s more like a hybrid ammy.

It has lots of toughness and healing power on it. It’s a bunker amulet.

rsq.3581:

Aether McLoud.1975:

0/10/10/20/30 is still bunker.

Not if you run it with a Valkyrie’s or Berserker’s Amulet.

LOL of course valk is bunker. Also D/D Berserker is nowhere near viable.

DXIEdge.2789:

kitten it you two I logged in to say your 2 points >.>

I have 5 viable builds for tPVP right now. One is D/D and I can tell you it’s not 0/10/0/30/30 anymore.

Do all my builds include 30 arcana and at least 10 in water? You bet your kitten . But to say our only build is D/D bunker is so wrong. So so wrong.

0/10/10/20/30 is still bunker.

What is this I don’t even

I’m still not convinced that 5% damage is worth losing powerful auras or condition removal on regeneration.

Thrashbarg.9820:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Maskaganda.2043:

Aether McLoud.1975:

I never understood why we aren’t allowed to have anything faster than swiftness (nothing stacks!) but engineers can have 200% runspeed for a short time with their superspeed boost.

thats just poor wording on the skill tooltip. it is only very slightly faster than swiftness. (140% instead of 133%)

Still faster than swiftness :P
AND they now have a much better RTL…

Which requires it’s own utility slot, the equivalent of giving up an entire attunement worth of skills for one (or 2 utility slots for the max range once every 35-45 sec with slick shoes). I’ve been using it on my engineer recently, but it definitely comes with it’s drawbacks. Apples and oranges again.

Not really because engineers get 2 utilities out of every utility slot (or 6 if it’s a kit).

Maskaganda.2043:

Aether McLoud.1975:

I never understood why we aren’t allowed to have anything faster than swiftness (nothing stacks!) but engineers can have 200% runspeed for a short time with their superspeed boost.

thats just poor wording on the skill tooltip. it is only very slightly faster than swiftness. (140% instead of 133%)

Still faster than swiftness :P
AND they now have a much better RTL…

Bugs like this speak volumes for Arenanet’s Q&A and software design…

Some MODERATOR should really sticky this thread.

I just tried this an I can interrupt all my autoattacks with any other skill.

I never understood why we aren’t allowed to have anything faster than swiftness (nothing stacks!) but engineers can have 200% runspeed for a short time with their superspeed boost.

Cleansing fire giving retaliation would be awesome. We seriously lack a source of retaliation.

What, 1.15 seconds stun gets rounded up to 2 seconds? I can hardly believe that. Especially seeing as there already are 1.5 second stuns ingame.

Yes. A 900 range charge on a 10 seconds cooldown is way better than perma-swiftness.

Blast in Lightning Field should give Fury IMHO.

Swimsasa Stoon.8936:

let glyph of elemental power give us auras corresponding with the element we’re in.
Then I’d be happy.

That’s one of the best ideas I’ve ever heard. It would make a lot of sense and give every weaponset access to every aura. Brilliant.

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

That being said although on paper it looks like theres a lot of counters, most builds don’t have those, so it can’t be strong enough where if you -don’t- have that stun/immob the ele is going to win, […]

I see this pretty much as a double standard.

If a dagger thief opens on you and you don’t have a stunbreak ready you’re dead.
If a greatsword warrior charges you and you don’t have a stunbreak ready you’re dead.
If a necro fear-condition-bombs you and you don’t have a stunbreak/cleanse ready you’re dead.
If you don’t bring insane burst you won’t win against a competent bunker ranger.
If you don’t bring stuns, slows and aoes you won’t win against any thief because he will stealth away.
The list goes on.

So why is it always OK to have to bring specific skills and needing to use specific tactics against all other classes, but when it comes to eles that’s not OK and ele needs nerfs until they can be defeated by braindead opponents hammering their face on the keyboard?

I don’t use a stun break against a warrior or thief, i just use raw tankyness to wait out their burst and then melt them with condis (how most condi builds work), or i do this thing called Dodging/Blocking.

I’m sorry but that’s not an option. No matter your toughness or vitality, if you don’t stunbreak basilisk venom ASAP you’re dead against a burst thief, so the rest of your point doesn’t have any substance.

There aren’t multiple ways to get out of this situation. There is no option. You either have the stunbreak and use it, and have A CHANCE to win (though of course the thief still has the upper hand through his opener) or you are dead. Simple as that. It’s a binary choice.

Maybe if you’re an ele, my ranger, mesmer, and engi do not need to stunbreak it they have ways to mitigate the damage while stunned (or prevent most of it). Idk if i can on my ele or not because all my eles builds have a stunbreaker (or two) because of how squishy they are.

Dunno about mesmer and ranger but as an engy you’d have to spent specific trait points to get the damage reduction while stunned to live through that amount of burst even with 1900 toughness.

So again, the point still stands: Why is it OK for classes to have to use specific skills/tactics/traits against the likes of thieves, warriors, etc. to be able to have a fighting chance, but when it’s eles instead of people learning to adapt eles have to be nerfed every single time?

That’s the very definition of a double standard.

I’m not saying that, i’m saying there shouldn’t be ONE WAY, you are essentially saying if you go against a D/D ele and you don’t have an immob or stun, whelp sucks to be you, i’m saying it shouldn’t be that narrow. As for my engi, he’s a turret engi, that thief jumps on me and he gets stunned or KD or thrown away from me and his entire burst combo is ruined, or i use this fancy little thing called a shield and stun his kitten the second he comes up to stun me, or better yet, just block the shot entirely. There are OPTIONS on those ones, just because you only use the most direct route doesn’t mean there aren’t other ways to prevent it.

a) For eles there IS ONLY ONE WAY to get out of that thief instagib.
b) There already ARE MULTIPLE WAYS against a 1200 range RTL because as I said all classes have 1200 range skills, most of them even 1500 if skilled, all classes have immobilizes, stuns and movement skills. Every single one of these is a counter against RTL. If you have a 1200 range weapon all you have to do is move 1 inch and autoattack away and there’s nothing the ele can do against it.

I already said it’d be fine if it were 1200 range because you could just chase after them, i don’t know why you’re still going on about this, i’ve posted that as a response a while ago, and an ele actually has the same “I’ll just CC you while i’m CCed” approach the engi can have if they either have Tempest Defense or Static Field (use it defensively) or Static Shield, or if you time it right comet (i only knew about this one because my friend whose a thief told me a few eles have done it to him).

Glad we’re on the same page then. 1200 range 20 seconds RTL. Now we’ll just need to get arenanet to recognize that the ele forum even exists

Apparently eles now have access to stab.

STAB STAB STAB

Oh no it’s a BACKDRAFT!

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Durzlla.6295:

That being said although on paper it looks like theres a lot of counters, most builds don’t have those, so it can’t be strong enough where if you -don’t- have that stun/immob the ele is going to win, […]

I see this pretty much as a double standard.

If a dagger thief opens on you and you don’t have a stunbreak ready you’re dead.
If a greatsword warrior charges you and you don’t have a stunbreak ready you’re dead.
If a necro fear-condition-bombs you and you don’t have a stunbreak/cleanse ready you’re dead.
If you don’t bring insane burst you won’t win against a competent bunker ranger.
If you don’t bring stuns, slows and aoes you won’t win against any thief because he will stealth away.
The list goes on.

So why is it always OK to have to bring specific skills and needing to use specific tactics against all other classes, but when it comes to eles that’s not OK and ele needs nerfs until they can be defeated by braindead opponents hammering their face on the keyboard?

I don’t use a stun break against a warrior or thief, i just use raw tankyness to wait out their burst and then melt them with condis (how most condi builds work), or i do this thing called Dodging/Blocking.

I’m sorry but that’s not an option. No matter your toughness or vitality, if you don’t stunbreak basilisk venom ASAP you’re dead against a burst thief, so the rest of your point doesn’t have any substance.

There aren’t multiple ways to get out of this situation. There is no option. You either have the stunbreak and use it, and have A CHANCE to win (though of course the thief still has the upper hand through his opener) or you are dead. Simple as that. It’s a binary choice.

Maybe if you’re an ele, my ranger, mesmer, and engi do not need to stunbreak it they have ways to mitigate the damage while stunned (or prevent most of it). Idk if i can on my ele or not because all my eles builds have a stunbreaker (or two) because of how squishy they are.

Dunno about mesmer and ranger but as an engy you’d have to spent specific trait points to get the damage reduction while stunned to live through that amount of burst even with 1900 toughness.

So again, the point still stands: Why is it OK for classes to have to use specific skills/tactics/traits against the likes of thieves, warriors, etc. to be able to have a fighting chance, but when it’s eles instead of people learning to adapt eles have to be nerfed every single time?

That’s the very definition of a double standard.

I’m not saying that, i’m saying there shouldn’t be ONE WAY, you are essentially saying if you go against a D/D ele and you don’t have an immob or stun, whelp sucks to be you, i’m saying it shouldn’t be that narrow. As for my engi, he’s a turret engi, that thief jumps on me and he gets stunned or KD or thrown away from me and his entire burst combo is ruined, or i use this fancy little thing called a shield and stun his kitten the second he comes up to stun me, or better yet, just block the shot entirely. There are OPTIONS on those ones, just because you only use the most direct route doesn’t mean there aren’t other ways to prevent it.

a) For eles there IS ONLY ONE WAY to get out of that thief instagib.
b) There already ARE MULTIPLE WAYS against a 1200 range RTL because as I said all classes have 1200 range skills, most of them even 1500 if skilled, all classes have immobilizes, stuns and movement skills. Every single one of these is a counter against RTL. If you have a 1200 range weapon all you have to do is move 1 inch and autoattack away and there’s nothing the ele can do against it.