Guild Wars 2

Abraxius.6429:

I Heard minion builds suck and im a post patch necro just rolled can any1 tell me if minions are viable in any situation ever ??

They became… adequate.
Also very much depends on the dungeon/playstyle.

warkalax.1642:

Nemesis.8593:

Lol… i run 30 – 20 – 0 – 0 – 20 as well, but with different runes, and i have Master of Terror, i have no idea how someone could leave home without it. Oh well…

master of terror dont work btw

Yes, totall because my 1 1/2 fear doesnt turn into a 2 1/4 fear in any way… nooo that is just the tooltip (what could be), in game on mob indicator (impossible) and real time doing it wrong.

What i dont get is why they picked up CB over WoC? Maybe the range?

Uruz Six.6594:

*I also saw:* Someone who merged golemagical studies with necromancy. Notice the magic effects on the Twisted and how they all drop dusts.

Actually Oolas teachings show that golemancy is just very very primitive necro/life force/soul magic amplified to workable levels with engineering. Thats kinda part that makes the whole part of the asura personal story where you steal the machine to fuse people into golems/unfuse them work.
Not to mention the sylvari facination with necromancy (as Saladmancer won MacGuffin sword insists to beat into our head if you bother to talk to him the rare times he uses some of the actual necro skills) and how easy they are to brainwash. I mean if corpses that can barely say come *well they say kitten but whatever* can make a trained scholar insane then a newborn raised in a place controlled by the NC, studied under the Inquest *and asura in general* and got some personal little gripe with some human maybe, pretty sure it would result in the 80s joker/riddler like character Scarlet is.

Nemesis.8593:

I don’t think i said no back then either… it’ just…
It is not a pleasant gaming experience when you know that… that fast moving dot towards you can one shot you once he gets here, you can survive if you are good… but then he will leave and there’s nothing you can do about it.

Any way you look at it, they have more damage and more survivability because they can do that… yet when i kill one of them, i am being called noob.
If i had a screenshot for every time i got called OP noob my 2 TB hdd would have a lot less space on it now.

No, im pretty sure that you just continued to brag about how you were doing on something awesome (the axe burst numbers vid), but what you can do about it are as follow:
Have 10 in DM for cleanse on DS, 30 in SR for stability on DS and always carry staff + Sarmor vs em, if you get the timing right: (ele start with either LTR or Flash into Earth from air) Sarmor, (ele recovery via missile crit into air for updraft blind 2x lightning) DS, (ele wants to do shield) DOOOOOOOOM, staff fear drop on you and chill.
It wont let you kill the ele but it will force a lot of CDs and only 2 long ones for you.
Then again eles did swap parts of the old arcane rotation i called op for a weird Scepter focus build that might be stronger since they got obsidian flesh, 4 sec of projectile destruction and a long daze in it if played right, but no LTR.~
Sorry that i didnt go by ability names but a) im sleepy right now b) I also dont know the actual names of the skills, scepter was too boring for me on the ele.

Nemesis.8593:

PS: anyone ever got 1 shoted by an elementalists before ?... was scratching my eye, and i saw an elementalist... and i was like pfff and by the time i put my hand back on my mouse i died.

Go trough the really old threads, i said multiple time arcane burst is bloody overpowered (just as i said cantrips+water sustain were op in beta in game and on the GW2 guru forums), i think i linked the build even once in the Ele podcast...
Either way 2 arcane builds (the basic D/X and the now fused with Air/Fire crit S/D) can dish out around 40~60k damage burst. Even back on the "zerker dps vs necro" thread i posted eles as the top burster (even if some people *cough s and f to not name a few 4 letter names* didnt agree with me). Just look a little at the exact description of arcane skills and fire air and water traits (yes thats right a total of easy 75% bonus damage). Also if you either of the 2 buggy fire skills *phoenix or burning speed* you can stack up tons of damage ticks to proc.

Use search option and type in the following words Nemesis Guide.

If you are too lazy, here is a typical Power glass build with no special requirement items: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQAQNAW3djMaV6ZaiaM8JEoH5St4MRFGGqHrD68hA-jQyAYLBZ6DAJCmKAl8KiGbboIasqFMVJRUt3oIa1SBExCA-e

Take option 3, spam minions on bar, play with whatever weapon you like/lean the profession while the minions do all the actual leveling work, works to around the point where you need to leave sparkfly.

Necro twisted flesh monster chicken, rats and floating stomach that explode in poo>Twisted mecha dogs, insects and car straps that can turn into power rangers fusion. Kinda funny.

Little side notes:
a) We used to have way more minions in beta (if traited 4 bone minions, 2 bone fiends and i think a option for multiple wurms), was too op because they soaked all aoe
b) I suggested that a long time ago for many necro skills, to use the charge mechanic (hold the button longer, it casts longer, more effects), thus you could summon more minions at the cost of not being able to use DS (grayed out like we have no LF) and pieces of LF being locked off (like Deep Wound/Overcast in GW), problem that comes with it How cooldowns work with em (its already kitten y when you use putrid and your full hp bone next to you explodes instead of the 1% hp one next to a enemy) and it would probably require to be a trait (and no necro wants more minion traits).

ForGreatJustice.3452:

Shpongle.6025:

It’s how Liadri should have been. It’s how she should be, when the gauntlet comes back.

I’m sorry, but no. First off, the gauntlet is already back, just go in since you already did the instance. Second, she’s fine as she is. My biggest problem was the lag from all the farming going on in the place. I did it again without the masses, and for me, it was easier than the first time.

No, her mechanics are fine. They’re punishing and forces you to learn and really know your classes capabilities. Let’s also be real, we ALL can’t be good at everything i.e. I personally suck at jumping puzzles.

She is fine, how the fight is set up isnt.
AoE indicators dont show up because of kittenty floor, the fact that are different arena sizes/positions adds idiotic rng to a mostly scripted fight and if your monitor is any bigger than a iphone, most of it is useless because of the kittenty camera (that got hacked/we got proof its just lazy devs not imossible/hard to code).

Back on topic yeah the fight is awesome. My personal little gripe was that she doesnt have a mild description of what she does pre phase under her target so that you gotta break combat to slot in skills to counter or kittenslap her around and avoid stuff when you could just stop it with utility/weapons you have.

Blackmoa.3186:

just saying nemsesis but ele isnt even viable nowadays, so if he owned your team you guys where just so much worse than him. also engies with autoamted response are killable as necro.

Because builds other than Cantrip ele totally dont exist *cough Arcane burst, Scepter Air burst, Earth Signet Aurashare point control, Lightning hammer cc burst build and Staff pressure totally dont exist (ok on staff i can see why you wouldnt count it since people dont like how unreliable some of its more important skills are).

While direct control would be “bad” (imagine a golem chasing down a low hp enemy then mid run swapping and charging down a enemy roamer), i do agree that necro minions need the old minion ui back (so that we can see who is low even if they aint close to us/on our screen).

Bhawb.7408:

League of Legends has one game mode, on one map; and most eSports are only played on one game mode, with at most differing maps. But LoL/Dota especially have a massive amount of pre-game strategy and planning that goes in.

The top teams don’t just pick one APC, one ADC, one Support, a bruiser top, and a tank jungle (which is essentially the exact thing we see in GW2, except support/tank is combined, and they add a DPS). It isn’t just pick the most OP support and pick them. Most OP bruiser? Pick them. They have full-team comps. There are teamfighting comps, AoE comps, single target burst/catching, split push, poke, there are tons of comps for different playstyles and for countering other teams. You don’t just say “we like teamfighting so we’re picking a teamfight comp every single game”, and then ban and pick the exact same thing. You specifically learn the enemy team’s strategies, ward placements, what champs they have been playing and the team comps they like to use. You ban out their best champions, or you ban out what they could pick to counter your comp, then you strategically pick champions in specific orders to give yourself not only the best lane matchups, but also while remaining within whatever team comp you want. There is a massive amount of thinking that goes into figuring out what you will do, what they will do, and making sure its as favorable of a matchup as possible.

That just doesn’t happen in GW2. Teams have 1 comp they run on every map, or at most they change a class or two on a map. There is very little looking into and countering other teams, and there is very little change ever made. It is, generally, who has the best FotM comp, and who plays it best. There are a great variety of tactics once you get in game, but the entire pre-game strategy is vastly lacking. As long as that continues, build variety will remain really low.

@sas, toxic gameplay is when gameplay is bad for one or both sides.

Its not really one mode (and especially not since dominion and abyss), its one objective, there are multiple strategies and playstyles that work around different stuff(more often in dota than in lol because people in lol tend to be a lot… lets say tv educated than actually using logic) not to mention that the original aeon of strife turned into a whole genre while mmos and pvp games are in pretty much every other case caused by evolution, not based on the pvp idea.

3 big problems pvp here in GW2 has:

Skills are balanced on avoidance, not reaction to them (even dota, being famous for a 3-6 second long stuns and chain bashes/stunlocks caused by procs is based on how you react, not how to avoid it completely (e.g. a melee minibash will go trough BKB/magic immunity, but if you activate the magic immunity after you got stunned, the stun is broken and you are free to run/get out of the attack range with stuff like stealth or force staff/a leap)

Burst is stronger than any sustain – same thing 2 sides of the same coin that may not be out of balance, but since they are if sustain on a character equalizes with the burst, everyone wants a nerf to it (that is actually justified because no other profession could do that in the example of the old cantrip dd ele)

Stats and builds – with 100 options of how to build something in a moba, 40~ options of weapons mods and secondary equips in fps and even simple things like pickups in arenas/deathmatches, more in depth customization is allowed, thus being locked to amulets + jewels, mostly damage boosting traits and not the option to chose to invest in one stat of a trait line more than the other (e.g. hybrid necro going 450 precision 150 cond damage or tank necro going 50% SR 10% crit) with a minimum requirement in both is a really bad thing.

Last but not least Toxic = not fun/ruining gameplay, this is more of a generalized hard counter, such things cannot be balanced (in case of BS thief and cc warrior and some other unimportant builds) without making them useless, the trick is just to make them weak against a character/build/whatever that while having no strengths, has no weaknesses the build can abuse.

Nemesis.8593:

As for the necromancer, if it is OP it will get nerfed… if it is UP it will get buffed… ArenaNet is taking their time with both of these since the feedback that they are getting is never really objective…
Including mine… maybe it requires more skill to perma stealth while doing damage, or to use the 90% of the time you dodge abilities on thief then what it requires me to counter him… so the fact that i counter with less skill something that requires way more skill makes me OP trully. I don’t know… never played thief…

Just to say, as someone whos actual pvp used to be only theif (since it was faceroll easy in the pistolwhip days then guardian and now actually necro), perma dodge is easy, but permastealth in pvp with ok damage takes way more skill than i ever bothered to put into a thief, so yeah it probably does take more skill for a sneaky backstabber than a drop 2 aoe fears hope idiots run into them, use other fears to defend, but not in any other spec since i put just as little bother (as in knowing basic combos and what actually kills you, situational rotation power and when/what points to control or how to engage em) into learning the specs.

Scythes would be quite redundant with how many weapons have looks to mimic them.
Swords(chill or mobility or something), Hammers (cc), Polearms/Greataxes (burst) do all fit the GW2 necro and could cleave, now lets just wait for the devs.

style.6173:

Necros are the current most OP class in PvP. The question is whether that’s as a result of Necro changes or because people still spec to deal more with direct damage than with conditions.

Mix of both, second being the bigger reason but still, burning – no no on necro.

Bhawb.7408:

As of now, GW2 teams are still pretty much infants when compared to the big eSports groups when it comes to how they go about competing. As it goes on, assuming it does keep growing, it will eventually mature to the point where those builds can actually be assessed for their true value in actual team comps, and not which one can best be plugged into the new FotM comp.

For that to happen we need new modes (not even competitive ones, but just to show what impact different playstyles have, e.g. capture the flag without conquest, deathmatch, single point conquest/king of the hill, moba like tower siege or even simple open pve dueling), full bug fix line and probably less % damage and more ability changing traits.

Skull>Wraith>Demon

hackks.3687:

Bhawb.7408:

Just to play Devil’s Advocate on that one, its a .5 cast time (oh kitten ANet, I can’t put 5s because it might spell a “naughty” word?), 900 range 4s bleed->bleed->poison (the poison is really the strong part). That makes it unique, and much harder to compare, to high damage melee bleeds (melee will always outdamage per hit because it will hit less), or ranged attacks that only bleed, or the mesmer one that bounces and is random.

Blood Curse doesn’t need nerfing, in any way, but it is a very strong AA.

I have to disagree. At one time it made sense to have a strong AA on Scepter because bleeding and poison were the primary damage dealing conditions available to a Necro. Hence why it applies bleeds on nearly everything. Since the additions of Dhuumfire and Torment though, this logic of balance has changed entirely. For instance, take the Engi’s Pistol AA “explosive shot” which only applies a 2sec bleed per hit. The one class that competes with Necros for the condi-pressure role in a group and it only has a single 2sec bleed on it’s AA. Of course! Why? Because the Engi has access to Burning, Poison, and Confusion as well as better sources of Bleed in other weapons/skills. Since the infamous “patch” that gave Necros access to more than just Bleeding and Poison nothing has been done to tone down the previous sources of bleed damage to make room for the Burning and Torment. While Necros did in fact need access to more damage conditions to be able to compete with Engis, they did not however need an overall boost in condition output – which is what happened. So Necros retained a boat load of long duration conditions to go along with their new Burns and Torments. Hence why their damage output is rightfully considered OP.

When I point to the Scepter AA as a problem I’m not saying it’s the problem, but that’s it’s a great example of what’s currently wrong with the Necro’s condition output. Honestly, how much would a Necro lose by reducing the duration to 2sec? There are traits to accommodate the lost duration in the Curses tree alone – remember Hemophilia and Lingering Curses? Those are choices a Necro is currently not required to make in order to make that AA perform at an optimal level.

Excuse me but There are these things called Granade kit, Tool kit and bomb kit that did let engies have higher condi application and damage then necros, what then got equalized by the patch with torment and dhuumfire. Remember there was this time where every team had a engie and necros were useful for spreading their condis with epi, well that got fixed. Also Lingering curses is still a must for condi.
True dhuumfire was a idiotic move, but that doesnt change the fact that the rest of the necros kit wasnt changed, the 3 stacks of torment doing nothing compared to other sources of it you can get, no actually it it did get changed a lot, it got nerfed twice after the patch and ruined a corruption skill during it and it got rid of a necros absorb tool, combined with the low LF generation of a condition build you got a real equivalent o a lol carry (no matter how much defensive shiz you add on, if the kit you have doesnt work with it it wont help you survive).
Its plain and simple, people knew necro was shiz, people ignored necro, people adapted playstyle to not expect kills from necro (but cc and “annoying” conditions), necro gets burst, necro kills people, people REFUSE to adapt, necro gets nerfed, people still refuse to adapt even if dps numbers show that we dont lead in condi damage anymore, not only because of cooldowns, but also how easy it is to stop, ping pong or outright just kill a necromancer.

hackks.3687:

Why condi Necros are OP:

1.) Indistinct animations on powerful skills
2.) Condi application rate is too high (read: insanely high)
3.) Terror damage is insanely high, and being a control and damage source it benefits two fold from condition duration. It is the only CC of it’s kind.
4.) High Sustainability. While I don’t feel that our new found sustainability is unwarranted, I do feel that it is too high when combined with the high damage output.

Let me counter all of this:
1) Powerful skills have the same animation, its a giant hand wave, skills with condition effects are the right to left/left to right card give move. Plain dodge when necro pulls hands from above his head (and since no kill skill has a cast time shorter than 3/4 of as second its not hard. – For short L2P issue on your side (also the only mark that was kinda blandish with mark of blood now has a staf point instead of hand animation, others as follow are dark glowy hands, snake on ground, white glow behind dark, not to mention staff does no damage by comparison to any other 2 hander).

2) Mesmers, Ele, Thief and Warrior can all apply more damage from conditions in a shorter amount of time, Necros got more total conditions, but aint stronger in condition damage, thus no cleanse on your build, Personal problem.

3) Terror damage was 25.5% higher before the nerf and noone complained for like 4+ months (maybe more) – kitten pull and lie/strawman

4) Sustainability, Necromancer? You sure you didnt miss the ele or thief forums? Well if you did think so then the points above dont matter since the amount of brain matter you used for what you said was probably just as high as the chance of a jhorror surviving a zerg fight in WvWvW.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Spectral Well:
-radius 1200
-applies protection 10 seconds.
-duration 20 sec.
cd 180 sec.

I might be reading this wrong but i shall think of you as a person that knows how well effects/pulses work.

So a well that applies a total of 200 seconds of protection for a 180 cd (op enough, efen if guardians can technically mentain permaprot too), but also in a aoe and what would prot on wells then be for, not to mention that you could well off 2 points/point and objective on some pvp maps with correct positioning with such a radius (i since on smaller maps points are around 2000 away from eachother).

Cygnus.6903:

The boss in the Giant fractal is a necro and has a hammer. So why not?

Technically he is a guardian whos Symbols just look like wells since they are oversized.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

That is the best non-response I’ve ever seen. Congrats.

What changed was that necros gained the ability to kill people effectively with the same poorly telegraphed skills. If a build doesn’t kill, it’s not as big of a deal that it’s poorly telegraphed. Now that it can wreck people, the fact that staff, doom and signet of spite are so powerful matter.

Ok giant hand waves aint enough for you on all strong offensive skills, we added a massive promo art on the main/only reliable defensive cooldown of a giant skull in his bathrobe with a scythe.
Oh still not enough how about nice glowy hands and sparkles on the ground.
Still not enough? Ok then we will make black leather stripes roll around then necro when he uses a fight changer (heal, epi, etc).
Or even better on anything that isnt a charr, 3 core guardian casts have the exact same animation

Im sorry but if these character changing animations are “poorly telegraphed”, then the mesmers have no indications of skill cases (ok true most are instant, but the differences between damage shatters is what shape the small white sparkles are in the pink explosion), eles got barely any and the fact that 80% of theif skills that actually kill are stealthed or have the identical animation as their normal attacks doesnt help your case either.

Shade was a historical trait that made us immune to all types of cc and movementspeed reductions (funny because it even let you use out of combat ms in combat if you managed to keep 100% ds somehow by not using the well bomb spectral build) in beta; i still think they should return it but only as a immunity to control loss, stuff like interrupts go trough it (so you cannot be stun, knocked down or force moved, but casting one on you will interrupt/put current skills on the 3 sec cooldown) and Chill, Cripple and Fear working normally.
Sanguine pool in LoL actually increases the movementspeed of vlad during the animation time, when it didnt you could have stunned him and he would have self saced/degened his hp to 0, so it was like yorick ulti bug but a deny, was patched in around 3 hours post release.
Transforms in general need a change (not to lock off your right side skillbar).

As for the stability/finishers thing, finishers can technically be used in DS, its just the lag/cast trick, something that should be fixed, but not really a priority for now.

Zerroth.2401:

…She cant be beat……. 100 tokens and only getting her to phase 2 twice……. I have NEVER seen anyone beat her…..excluding the youtubers…… SHE IS UNSTOPABLE

She isnt so crazy as the god kitten camera is and its not really important, since as a activity the achivement is gonna stay/return with it.
I just gave up on Light up the darkness afer running out of time multiple times despite being on the 6th or 7th crystal and her under 10% hp, really not worth the bother untill a-net decides to fix their game.

sas.6483:

Bhawb.7408:

Why do people find Necromancers OP? Because there is one spec right now that is.

We should have a slumber party. You can tell me a story about the OP necro that signet of spite-dhuumfire-epidemic-terror bombed a point with five berserker thieves circle jerking on it. Then we can go watch Phantaram’s video and cry a little about necro survivability. Maybe then we can eat some pizza or something, and watch a 1vX roaming thief video and gush about the true meaning of skill.

Can i bring the KFC and Cola? It fits well with a well of tears and the torment of getting ping ponged and 1 second + cast times.

On a unrelated to image thing:
I have had it with these Dhuumflippn skulls on those Dhuumflippn shoulders already!

Also Maleficent much?

spoj.9672:

I doubt Ill ever take it, even if it does get improved. It is probably our worst signet. I still want locust to be a stunbreak though. I would however consider taking undeath if the passive was really good and worked inside DS. I want all the passives to work in DS but they dont.

Locust active in general needs a rework now post ninja fix.

Fizwitz.8240:

Well of Chaos

120 Second cooldown
Duration: 7 seconds
Pulses: 7 (1 per second)
Damage: 1050(x7) 150 per pulse (base damage)

Every pulse deals damage and inflicts random conditions. Certain conditions will also give you short lasting boons.

Conditions that can be inflicted:

- 2 stacks of bleed (Lasts 10 seconds)
- 6 seconds of poison [Gives the user 3 seconds of regeneration]
- 4 seconds of burning
- 5 seconds of cripple [Gives the user 2 1/2 seconds of swiftness]
- 4 seconds of chill
- 8 seconds of weakness [Gives the user 1 stack of might that lasts for 4 seconds]
- 5 stacks of vulnerability (Lasts 8 seconds) [Gives the user 4 seconds of protection]
- 2 stacks of torment (Lasts 6 seconds)
- 1 stack of confusion (Lasts 5 seconds)
- 6 seconds of blind [Gives the user 3 seconds of Fury]

Each condition has the same chance of being applied as the rest. And the same condition can trigger multiple times in a row. Boons stack in duration or intensity up to 3 times their original duration. (3 seconds becomes 9 seconds max. 4 seconds becomes 12 seconds max. 6 becomes 18 seconds max. Ect..)

If an enemy affected by the well leaves the well. Any conditions that were inflicted upon him from the well doubles in intensity or duration. (1 stack becomes 2 stacks or 6 seconds becomes 12 seconds)

I don’t think that this would be overpowered considering that it is an elite and it has to compete with the other powerful elites that necromancers have. The conditions and boons don’t last for a very long time and every well is very powerful if the enemy stays in full the full duration. It would give the necromancer more sources to be able to get boons as well.

Mesmer forums for kittentyer version of chaos storm → way.

Kirschwasser.3972:

That’s actually fascinating information. Aren’t there instances where there’s water in a map at a certain level, but also open spaces at that level?

In general any of the human/krytan zones you get multiple water bodies, all on the same level no matter how far away from eachother.
The three real exceptions to the “all water at the same level” is in the sylvari starting zone (the JP with the orb), the unfinished JP and the Chaos Crystal Caverns (all of them that could technically be a zone under the actual zone/fake instance because of the mechanic how you get in).

Burn them, especially if you got Wurm and Bone fiend up, DN + Poison field +Projectiles will do more damage then their chip attacks.

BuddhaKeks.4857:

By the way, that’s not WP’s theory. It’s from the lore forum actually, but again the guy gives no credit, like always. If you want to discuss it, here is the thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/lore/Aetherblades-use-Steam-Portal-tech/first

Funny because no its actually from a Reddit post, not konig, he just posted it as fast as he could later on the forums.

Would rather have old SS or GB than another well… A full minion bar being possible is already kinda weird for me (same as full warrior signet bar).

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

And if it doesn’t, you’ve pretty much wasted a skill slot for the entire battle. If you do get to use it, yay…. but now it is on cool down for the rest of the battle. Was that worth it? You could also have brought something that protects your team, such as well of darkness, for that slot.

This part can easily be fixed if they made some universal traits across all (well most) professions, the 20% cdr +3 might for 15 should be universal, but so should a Signet passives stick to you even if you activate it, easy 1 GM trait that fits almost all professions (not engie for obvious reasons) and makes different types of builds viable, but no only ele get them for god knows what reason. I could go on with different traits, but in general, if you can drop that special banner or SoU rez, it can be the difference between a wipe and a easy fight (in some rare cases, since it is true that people need to do something very stupid or not be on a good profession for the fight for it to be required).

Spite – Was meh before, cdr made it perfect for necro, no changes needed (additional power for hybrid setups, condi burst for condi)

Plague – Kinda terrible in inplementation, not only is it a buggy stun break, but it uses the same projectile nonsense as CB for the transfer.
Passive should just make it that all condis that would be applied in the aoe apply to you instead, active be a self epidemic cast that doesnt copy but transfer your condis (or just a cleanse).

Undeath was ok, pvp balance made it kitten , but still quite useful when bad zerkers stack up but dont know the mechanics or why and when to stack, so a 3/4 people rez in most situations when i have it slotted in.
Honestly it would be cooler if it was a self rez or if it turned dead (defeated) people into minions (hint hint would be cool traits), but for balance all thats needed to make it a good use of a slot is reversing the ratio on the passive, so 3% LF pre second in combat OR just make it work all the time.

Locust was baddas because it was buggy, but they fixed it, 25% is now worth more in every situation where the active could have been useful.
My suggestion was making its active a strong single target siphon (like Dagger 2 x2 in terms of damage and health gain and instant) and maybe a stun break.

Also yeah signets need to work in DS.

Bhawb.7408:

Wait, Locust doesn’t scale well? Locust has (or used to) have one of the most OP scalings ever, because it ended up ignoring the 5 man limit.

Oh right i forgot to mention, they fixed that with the 2nd zeph sanctum patch (when terror got nerfed for 17%, you can still get insane numbers with it if you stack up healing power and got bloodthirst, but since it got changed the active went form situationaly useful to plain worthless in comparison to giving the necro more movementspeed unless you are full cleric.

Do not play the OoW sneak theme… Applez…

I still think that they should take the wow approach to siphons, make different kinds mutually exclusive/cost resources of the other and make them % hp based with a hit cap.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Andele.1306:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Andele.1306:

How is that any worse than what the asura are doing?

I don’t think the Asura are stealing peoples souls. Maybe the Inquest are, but since the Inquest are already working with the Aetherblades that only adds credibility to the statement.

Think a few seconds about what you do in each of the starting personal story missions when as a asura.
Then think about what we know about the asura: They “used to” experiment on sylvari (they still do but not on the friendly ones), they imprison the asura that are seen as “stupid” (so about as smart as most other mortal races), they are trying to cause the extermination of a entire race and (syn or dynamics) colleges that wanna meddle with the human gods (and kinda the elder dragons for the same reasons).
Also unlike what the musaat had (they actually had to kill people before stealing their “soul”), all asura golems are made using a adapted kind of necromancy, so no its the same bloody thing.

Sorry, no. Golemancy is golemancy. I have a Dynamics, so I have no idea where you’re getting this bit about the human gods. It’s technically illegal to do research about the dragons, only the inquest do it openly. Dunno where you get the bit about imprisoning the stupid because they’re stupid. They did experiment on the sylvari, but there isn’t a lot of information on that subject so it’s unclear who did it. If anyone still is it’s the Inquest because they don’t care about anything at all.

So again, Inquest.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Oola
Both back in gw1 and now in gw2, just google facets GW2
No it isnt because you meet 2 people that openly do it in rata sum (personal story example from OoW) http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magic_Sucks
Its not one subject its plain experimentation on everyone from the first 3 cycles (look up the old asura and slyvari preview posts)

So no asura are plain “for science” evil, just as charr are a warforce/bloodthirsty maniacs no matter what legion they are in, sylvair being idiotically naive, humans plain being selfish arses and norn boastful halfwits.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Andele.1306:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Andele.1306:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Dagger auto attack does 940 base damage in 2 seconds, coming to 470 damage per second.

Axe #2 dos 968 damage in 2.25 seconds, coming to 430 damage per second. Here’s the kicker, though: factor in axe training for an additional 15%, and you get 495 base damage per second, which puts it higher than the dagger, and gains twice the life force in that time. Of course, now that axe training is 10%, this puts it only equal to the dagger at 473 damage per second.

This thing called math that everyone seems to ignore, its not 430 (then axe 2 would be 860) its 480 and 530 if traited (last numbers rounded ofc because of weapon damage variation and simplicity).

2.25 seconds. Not 2 seconds. You have to divide axe damage by 2.25 seconds.

If you want to nitpick on the cast times in game that arent based on the skills actual damage dealing time but aftercast and initial animation then all of dagger damage should be delt in 0.25 of a second, no you can cancel axe 2 after 1.98 and it will still do full damage, same with dagger chain being done in 1.41 if you do it right or 1.79 if you let the 1 aftercast go and just cancel out of the 3>1 pause/aftercast.
Or even better, if you wanna count the additional time wasted in raising the arm and lowering it for axe, why not count the distance a dagger holder must walk to even deal damage?

Axe takes 2.25 seconds at least to do its full damage. :p

No it doesnt…

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Andele.1306:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Dagger auto attack does 940 base damage in 2 seconds, coming to 470 damage per second.

Axe #2 dos 968 damage in 2.25 seconds, coming to 430 damage per second. Here’s the kicker, though: factor in axe training for an additional 15%, and you get 495 base damage per second, which puts it higher than the dagger, and gains twice the life force in that time. Of course, now that axe training is 10%, this puts it only equal to the dagger at 473 damage per second.

This thing called math that everyone seems to ignore, its not 430 (then axe 2 would be 860) its 480 and 530 if traited (last numbers rounded ofc because of weapon damage variation and simplicity).

2.25 seconds. Not 2 seconds. You have to divide axe damage by 2.25 seconds.

If you want to nitpick on the cast times in game that arent based on the skills actual damage dealing time but aftercast and initial animation then all of dagger damage should be delt in 0.25 of a second, no you can cancel axe 2 after 1.98 and it will still do full damage, same with dagger chain being done in 1.41 if you do it right or 1.79 if you let the 1 aftercast go and just cancel out of the 3>1 pause/aftercast.
Or even better, if you wanna count the additional time wasted in raising the arm and lowering it for axe, why not count the distance a dagger holder must walk to even deal damage?

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Dagger auto attack does 940 base damage in 2 seconds, coming to 470 damage per second.

Axe #2 dos 968 damage in 2.25 seconds, coming to 430 damage per second. Here’s the kicker, though: factor in axe training for an additional 15%, and you get 495 base damage per second, which puts it higher than the dagger, and gains twice the life force in that time. Of course, now that axe training is 10%, this puts it only equal to the dagger at 473 damage per second.

This thing called math that everyone seems to ignore, its not 430 (then axe 2 would be 860) its 480 and 530 if traited (last numbers rounded ofc because of weapon damage variation and simplicity).

Kal Spiro.9745:

Andele.1306:

How is that any worse than what the asura are doing?

I don’t think the Asura are stealing peoples souls. Maybe the Inquest are, but since the Inquest are already working with the Aetherblades that only adds credibility to the statement.

Think a few seconds about what you do in each of the starting personal story missions when as a asura.
Then think about what we know about the asura: They “used to” experiment on sylvari (they still do but not on the friendly ones), they imprison the asura that are seen as “stupid” (so about as smart as most other mortal races), they are trying to cause the extermination of a entire race and (syn or dynamics) colleges that wanna meddle with the human gods (and kinda the elder dragons for the same reasons).
Also unlike what the musaat had (they actually had to kill people before stealing their “soul”), all asura golems are made using a adapted kind of necromancy, so no its the same bloody thing.

BoogerSammich.7189:

So i’ve never played GW1, but all of this mursaat/white mantle talk led me to the gw1 wiki. After reading about the mursaat and the mantle I am left feeling that they are a very likely candidate for involvement all of this. It seems like it’s been running through the entire living story. We have agony (introduced with fractals) which is a condition specific to the mursaat. In order to counter agony we are given “ascended” gear complete with “infusions”. I mean come on, the shining blade were the first to ascend according to the wiki and they infused their armor to counter the mursaat’s agony condition. It all just seems to important to be the kind of thing that Anet would just “recycle”. There has to be a tie in. What if, Lazarus has been hiding in the mists the whole time, the consortium are really a part of the white mantle and they are funding Dessa to get him out?
But i digress, I am just speculating wildly based on a very small amount of info and an over active imagination.

Different types of agony, just how torment aint the same, just how a ton of other stuff with same names dont do the same things now.
Also wouldnt any (since we aint 100% sure Laz was the last one on Tyria, just the last one we know of) Mursaat who wants to return to the mists just go back to the Ring of Fire or the portal thing at the Temple of the Unseen (both probably still still being there and running seeing how the temple of the ages and most statues of grenth still leeing powers from the mists and if they aint, why did they build them weaker than human crafted buildings).

Arvid.3829:

The Demonic Spirit.3157:

Andele.1306:

Dagger 1 and 3 have quite the aftercasts, so no you finish a dagger 1 chain in around 1.4 seconds while a Axe 1 attack goes off in around 1 second.
But overall melee damage > safe position of range.

How do you know that ? Is there any source that tells us the cast time of 2nd and 3rd dagger chain attacks ?
Or you just tried it ?

There is a very old thread that will give you fairly decent estimates. Most seem fairly accurate, but some are a bit off; dagger 1 chain f.i.: in one of his recent videos, Nemesis did 17 full chains in about 33 seconds which would put the chain around 1.95 sec instead of 2.2 sec.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/Autoattack-DPS-and-cast-times/first

You can (and should just like in mobas) cancel the aftercasts of 1 and 3 by pressing esc/keybind on mouse you use for it, speeds up both dagger and on DS 1, 2 (UW), 4; so if you got a mouse with 2 or more additional buttons just click 1-2-1-1-2.

PMilkos.9103:

Just keep in mind that if you go condition damage you are USELESS is *any* group. That’s not a necromancer thing either, any class that heavily invests in condition damage is useless in any sort of group content, because your teammates will constantly overwrite most of your conditions whether they want to or not.

And dagger is the absolute best weapon for a necro. If you don’t want to use a dagger then you might as well skip necromancer alltogether (unless you really want condition damage, then get a scepter and keep yourself in 1v1 fights only).

PS. If you don’t want to go melee berserker, then you’re out of luck, because ALL classes are supposed to go melee berserker in dungeons. Blame Anet for being terrible at designing their dungeon mechanics.

More mindless zerker spam... *hint hint these are the kind of people that caused all the necro nerfs because oh no something can kill a zerker build with 0 defensive slot ins, we just wanna skip everything/faceroll win in pvp*

Dagger 1 and 3 have quite the aftercasts, so no you finish a dagger 1 chain in around 1.4 seconds while a Axe 1 attack goes off in around 1 second.
But overall melee damage > safe position of range.

Dietzen.6127:

It’s incredible that we haven’t gotten any official response, even though this issue has been brought up across multiple boards

Oh come on we all know its gonna take 4+ months to notice something that affects necros in a negative way and if not/lower then its gonna be “working as intended (despite us not knowing it existed like Transforms removing minions)”

Xzaander.4123:

But would it ‘really’ have been that hard to write our personal story with more shades of gray at least? Or making the orders more political, making decisions that may not be morally favourable but practically something “good”? The Vigil could maybe have shown to be a bit too militant at times, abusing their power and harming civilians. The mystery about OoW could have been expanded on, what do they know, and it it their right to know it? Or the Priory, filled with scientists and scholars that sometimes take their tests and experiments too far, causing innocent people to suffer from the effects?

Well we got the vigil that let zhais minions slaughter 3 locations because they didnt wanna react till there was a real fight (not really bad), the priory who allowed not only for jormag corruption to spread but also shoved it into the Underworld where it could make god knows what bad stuff and risked the lives of people to test weapons mutliple times (ok more on the “bad morals, good results” side) and the good old OoW that plain state to steal political secrets, risked the charr/human relationship, abuse inquest and dredge tech and knew of the elder dragons for way longer than any of the other factions existed, without telling anybody… (yeah we are kinda kittenbags with tons of power) but they do at least they contribute to everyones progress.

For DPS:
DS build based on crit damage and Dperception > Dagger crit build
Base power dagger (so low crit) > DS based power with Dperception
Also DPS…

Dear Scarlet,
let there be chaos and misery once more upon this world so that these mortal little cowards and their so called heroes (a Human lawful zealot, a half-a-Salad necro-not-mancer with his fancy sword and that Ham of Norn Brohood) fall to their knees and beg for a quick and painless death so that another fake “god” of “truth” doesnt happen and so that true adventure, challenge (not some insects that stop fun with our eyes or ground) and really epic loot come for those who seek it!
Yours truly, Guild/Warband of the Dhuumed*

*aka my 4 characters that i gave a fancy backstory too how they met during the Pact.