Guild Wars 2

There is no problem with zerker.

Look at the other areas of the game: spvp and wvw. While there are players wearing zerker there its not as abundant. Why? Because the philosophy of bring max dps to kill faster does not work there. The reason for this is because players aren’t fighting against npcs but other players who are actually smart and have a skill set equal to their own.

You can not stack a player in a corner to max dps them, you can not use wall of reflect and expect a player to keep using projectiles to kill themselves. In pve you can do this, because the AI is ridiculously dumb. If they moved out of aoes, moved out of corners, if they stopped dpsing or went to melee after getting hit with a few reflect projectiles and used actual skill sets players have then we would see a much different meta in pve.

The fault is in AI not zerker.

Deathmond.7328:

Even with new trait and 2000 condition damage I don`t feel retalation like “condition”. And if you go something like 6\6\x\x\x with guardian you don`t have any predicition to survive.

So far I’ve been able to get radiant retaliation to hit for over 300 dmg in pvp. I’m not sure the accurate numbers but I believe thats around 30-70 dmg more. Its actually a good trait but the pvp damage reduction makes it look far worse than what it should be.

I disagree with not having skills to survive if you go 6/6. I’ve been playing around with signets just to see if they can offer a remedy to the problem you mention and to a degree it does. With inscribed renewal and signet mastery you get some above average condition removal, the defense increase from signet of judgement and CC from wrath and bane signet. I want to make this known, I’m not saying signets are the answer but I’m saying try to think outside the box.

I don’t feel there will ever be a end game build that is universally good against every build. Each build will always have strengths and weaknesses, as they should.

Tarsius.3170:

typical – are you sure it’s not just Hold the Line that’s broken, since that has other issues?

Yea, I’m sure. I know hold the line audio is broken.

When I read the patch notes, I was like omg! After 2 years they finally fixed it. So I loaded up the game on my pc and my gfs. When I used the shouts the only one I heard on her pc was save yourselves. The others I didn’t hear.

Oddly, during a dungeon run I heard another guardian shout retreat! But when he used his other shouts I didn’t hear them. So far the only shouts I’ve consistently heard are from asura and charr.

I believe they are still broken. We might see them fixed in 2016 at this rate.

Tarsius.3170:

Fixed a bug that prevented players from hearing other guardians’ shouts.

I missed this one the first time I read the patch notes because it wasn’t in the profession section.

This is probably the most significant update the guardian has ever received since beta.

Its still broken, most of the time you don’t hear guardian shouts. Particularly for human characters.

I can pretty much confirm shouts are still bugged on humans but work with all the other races. I guess we’ll have to wait a entire year or two for Anet to get around to fixing it. :<

I can hear Charr say stand your ground, but I can’t hear humans.

I just tested, the only shout others players can hear is “Save Yourselves!” The other shouts are still not heard. :<

Also, Zealot’s Flame doesn’t not have the unblockable skill fact.

BurrTheKing.8571:

Aza.2105:

Althalos.6734:

Warning – math ahead:
0 healing power Warrior with no traits and with Healing Signet = 362 health/second
Healing Signet: 362

0 healing power quad meditation, 30 Valor Guardian with Meditation Mastery and Monk’s Focus = 363.22 health/second
(base healing + Monk’s Focus) / ((skill cooldown * Meditation Mastery) + skill cast time)
Smite Condition: (0 + 1960) / ((20 * 0.8) + 0) = 122.50
Judge’s Intervention: (0 + 1960) / ((45 * 0.8) + 0) = 54.44
Contemplation of Purity: (0 + 1960) / ((60 * 0.8) + 0) = 40.83
Litany of Wrath: (1640 + 1960) / ((30 * 0.8) + 0.75) = 145.45 (not counting 20% damage to healing conversion)

Conclusion: A quad meditation guardian has the same sustain as a Healing Signet warrior if he uses his meditations whenever possible and the warrior denies him to gain extra 6 second 20% of damage healing from Litany of Wrath.

And to answer the OP:
Nothing changed and I can’t say they are more popular than before. PvE and sPvP premade teams will always take 1 guardian for utility, WvW groups will always use a mix of guardians and warriors as the main force with a few support mesmers and elementalists behind. It will stay this way as long as guardians will be stuck so deep inside group support/utility role or another profession ascends to their level.

You aren’t including adrenal health, every warrior in pvp takes this with cleansing ire….

Also, zerker guardian has no sustain they have burst healing. Not sure why you included litany of wrath. Because its completely theoretical, in the sense that you must land all of your attacks to make use of it. Its a better group fight heal than it is for single fights because of this. So I wouldn’t bother including it in your mathematical analysis if I were you.

Adrenal Health has been overestimated for ages now. It only tics once over 3 seconds and the vast majority of Warrior builds revolve around using your adrenaline constantly to not be eaten alive by conditions. It’s an OK trait, but nearly as amazing as some seem to thing it is.

Its just like Virtue of Resolve, but better.

Moleless.1462:

Not worth it at all, unless you run full rabid condi build like the guy above suggested, but you’d have to be a bit of a moron to do that anyway.

If you want a chill, put hydromancy on your hammer. Much lower CD, AND it does damage (quit a lot if you’re zerker)

For what? Why would you need rabid to use it?

Althalos.6734:

Warning – math ahead:
0 healing power Warrior with no traits and with Healing Signet = 362 health/second
Healing Signet: 362

0 healing power quad meditation, 30 Valor Guardian with Meditation Mastery and Monk’s Focus = 363.22 health/second
(base healing + Monk’s Focus) / ((skill cooldown * Meditation Mastery) + skill cast time)
Smite Condition: (0 + 1960) / ((20 * 0.8) + 0) = 122.50
Judge’s Intervention: (0 + 1960) / ((45 * 0.8) + 0) = 54.44
Contemplation of Purity: (0 + 1960) / ((60 * 0.8) + 0) = 40.83
Litany of Wrath: (1640 + 1960) / ((30 * 0.8) + 0.75) = 145.45 (not counting 20% damage to healing conversion)

Conclusion: A quad meditation guardian has the same sustain as a Healing Signet warrior if he uses his meditations whenever possible and the warrior denies him to gain extra 6 second 20% of damage healing from Litany of Wrath.

And to answer the OP:
Nothing changed and I can’t say they are more popular than before. PvE and sPvP premade teams will always take 1 guardian for utility, WvW groups will always use a mix of guardians and warriors as the main force with a few support mesmers and elementalists behind. It will stay this way as long as guardians will be stuck so deep inside group support/utility role or another profession ascends to their level.

You aren’t including adrenal health, every warrior in pvp takes this with cleansing ire….

Also, zerker guardian has no sustain they have burst healing. Not sure why you included litany of wrath. Because its completely theoretical, in the sense that you must land all of your attacks to make use of it. Its a better group fight heal than it is for single fights because of this. So I wouldn’t bother including it in your mathematical analysis if I were you.

Cameron.6450:

Aza.2105:

no obvious animations or cast times

Come on now, the projectiles are pretty slow and the necro turns into a glowing green giant, I’m not really sure HOW it could be made any more obvious.

Being a glowing green giant isn’t a animation, its a transformation.

Moleless.1462:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

Ferrari. Speicifically built car. High performance. Extremely fast off of mark. Extremely fast over short distances. High maintenance. Small fuel reserves.

1964 hemi big blacl anything. Solid performance. Slowish off the mark. Respectable speed over shot distances. Lower maintenance. Large fuel reserves. Extremely fast over long distances.

Which one is faster?

Purely depends over which distances you choose to measure them. Guardian has high damage off the mark, very little else behind it. Warrior has ok damage off the mark, but builds up to massive damage and has a lot more staying power behind it. Better armor, better health, better coefficients, better movement. If you want High melee DPS..stick with warrior. Guardian starts well but finishes badly and heavily relies upon your target making multiple mistakes.

Actually that’s very much wrong. A zerker gaurdian WILL have a shtload of damage off the mark, but they also have a shtload of sustain. If it’s a long fight, the guardian will win. Warrior has to rely on a passive 300 heal per second, whereas a gaurdian has 3 2k heals on a relatively short cool down. If the warrior can’t manage to lock down a gaurd and burst him in a couple of hits, the gaurdian will outsustain him easy.

Your example of a zerker guard is a bit vague, what traits are you imagining? AH? Meditations? 3.2k heals? With cleric gear? Since you said heals and not heals I’m assuming maybe you are referring to meditations?

Lich form attacks are very strong. I encountered one a bit after the feature patch. And was decimated before I knew what hit me. The damage is EXTREMELY high, perhaps too high with respect to having no obvious animations or cast times. In the shot below, I had around 2.2k toughness.

While there are ways to deal with lich form (blinds, aegis), I feel the damage is much too high.

Zach.3264:

I wish it would work, but that trait really isn’t worth taking in my opinion. The Chill duration is so low compared to the cooldown.

Even with good Condition duration and Grenth runes, it’s still really low.
In my opinion, there are better options.

Nah, with condition duration, condition duration food, rune of ice and rune of chilling. Glacial Heart lasts close to 9 seconds. With sigil of ice, rune of ice and hydromancy guardian can make a nice troll chilling build.

jportell.2197:

Aza.2105:

In comparison to what other utility skill? Afaik, no other utility functions like Merciful Intervention. But this isn’t the point of my posts to you. You said valor is bad because of no support, I told you there is communal defense. So that argument is now invalid. You said that guardians can be selfish, in reality they can’t unless they really try hard to do everything not to assist allies.

I don’t have a subjective view of support, I’m talking about objectively. By the definition of what it means. Objectively speaking the entire class design is built upon support, no one can deny this.

And if you want group support you would go anywhere but valor. PvE Is a DPS race. Valor gives the worst DPS options in guardian trait lines. It also gives the worst support from all of guardians trait lines.

Do you do teq or wurm?

In comparison to what other utility skill? Afaik, no other utility functions like Merciful Intervention. But this isn’t the point of my posts to you. You said valor is bad because of no support, I told you there is communal defense. So that argument is now invalid. You said that guardians can be selfish, in reality they can’t unless they really try hard to do everything not to assist allies.

I don’t have a subjective view of support, I’m talking about objectively. By the definition of what it means. Objectively speaking the entire class design is built upon support, no one can deny this.

jportell.2197:

Aza.2105:

jportell.2197:

Aza.2105:

jportell.2197:

Moleless.1462:

jportell.2197:

a t s e.9614:

Well since its a PvE thread , if guardian was so hard to play then pugs should ask for warrs only , not heavies. Usually its what I see when I check the LFG system :" heavies only " because they are easier to play.

Like really dude, since when guardian is a hard mode class?

Not saying it’s “hardmode”. However your example of a meditation guardian should get you kicked from any dungeon group. Not just the speed clears. People want guardians for the group boons and reflects etc if you run a triple meditation guardian you come across two issues.

1. Your DPS sucks compared to a non meditation guardian (you lose Dmg% increase traits that you would get otherwise.)
2. Your group support sucks as your three utility slots are taken up by the most selfish utility skills that a guardian has (Think of triple cantrip eles or worse 5 signet warriors).

The only thing you are going to be giving your group is the random blind (assuming you are six deep into precision) and a few stacks of vulnerability here and there. All of which another class can do infinitely better.

PvP DPS builds should never be used in PvE and vice versa.

Uhhh, which Dmg% increase traits are you missing out on by playing meditation?

You are either missing unscathed contender (20%), Fiery Wrath (10%), Radiant Power (10%), Elusive Power (10% when endurance not full),or Power of the virtuous (1%/boon).

Now usually no matter what build you run, you won’t be able to get all of these however by not going into valor at all you are opening up your options greatly for dmg% increase traits. If you run triple meditations you are going 6 deep into a line that is the most selfish line in the game for guardians. If you are running a triple meditation guardian you bring absolutely nothing to the group. Valor has absolutely no flat damage increase traits however EVERY other line that the guardian has does have a flat increase trait somewhere as well as something else to offer the group like decreased recharge on shouts. Decrease recharge on consecrations which give reflects or fire fields etc. Better group condi clear for certain dungeons.

Communal Defense is probably one of the best group utilities guardian has and its in the valor line.

In regards to your idea that meditation guardians are selfish, its hard to be selfish as a guardian when most of their weapon skills provide group support in some way. So saying that a selfish guardian exists is probably the biggest lie I’ve ever heard. In fact, its really hard to create a selfish guardian build. You would literally have to use scepter, no off hand weapon, meditations or signets and never use your virtues.

Do you ever see anyone play like that? I sure haven’t. While other classes have to trait heavily into support to help allies guardians support is innate. So even though players aren’t running your “ideal” guardian build, they are still supporting allies in some way shape and form.

Actually guardian weapons provide support with only staff (if you take this in a dungeon any speed clear group will kick you.), and the hammer auto attack chain. Focus provides minimal support and sword provides none. Greatsword is good for cc and not much else as far as a group is concerned. Communal defenses also has a 20s CD so it’s not exactly THAT great since guardians have so many blocks that the proccing communal defenses would be completely random I would rather use retreat, hold the line etc. Also communal defenses would not be taken in a mediation build because you are sacrificing the meditations healing you which is half of a meditation build alone. Then lets not forget you are still missing the tons of %dmg increase traits that guardians get from EVERY other line besides valor. And no a meditation guardian is not really supporting anyone at all besides himself…. Its equivalent of taking a necro in your group. Except necros can still bring wells.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Can-a-selfish-guardian-really-exist/first#post3896158

And not a single thing in that list was a meditation……… and here is what people are talking about.

The OP was referencing the meta in PvE as far as guardian compared to warriors. Then some genius came along and talked about how a triple meditation guardian is the “meta” in PvE. Which is the furthest thing from the truth.

Merciful Intervention is on the list, which is a pretty good skill imo.

jportell.2197:

Aza.2105:

jportell.2197:

Moleless.1462:

jportell.2197:

a t s e.9614:

Well since its a PvE thread , if guardian was so hard to play then pugs should ask for warrs only , not heavies. Usually its what I see when I check the LFG system :" heavies only " because they are easier to play.

Like really dude, since when guardian is a hard mode class?

Not saying it’s “hardmode”. However your example of a meditation guardian should get you kicked from any dungeon group. Not just the speed clears. People want guardians for the group boons and reflects etc if you run a triple meditation guardian you come across two issues.

1. Your DPS sucks compared to a non meditation guardian (you lose Dmg% increase traits that you would get otherwise.)
2. Your group support sucks as your three utility slots are taken up by the most selfish utility skills that a guardian has (Think of triple cantrip eles or worse 5 signet warriors).

The only thing you are going to be giving your group is the random blind (assuming you are six deep into precision) and a few stacks of vulnerability here and there. All of which another class can do infinitely better.

PvP DPS builds should never be used in PvE and vice versa.

Uhhh, which Dmg% increase traits are you missing out on by playing meditation?

You are either missing unscathed contender (20%), Fiery Wrath (10%), Radiant Power (10%), Elusive Power (10% when endurance not full),or Power of the virtuous (1%/boon).

Now usually no matter what build you run, you won’t be able to get all of these however by not going into valor at all you are opening up your options greatly for dmg% increase traits. If you run triple meditations you are going 6 deep into a line that is the most selfish line in the game for guardians. If you are running a triple meditation guardian you bring absolutely nothing to the group. Valor has absolutely no flat damage increase traits however EVERY other line that the guardian has does have a flat increase trait somewhere as well as something else to offer the group like decreased recharge on shouts. Decrease recharge on consecrations which give reflects or fire fields etc. Better group condi clear for certain dungeons.

Communal Defense is probably one of the best group utilities guardian has and its in the valor line.

In regards to your idea that meditation guardians are selfish, its hard to be selfish as a guardian when most of their weapon skills provide group support in some way. So saying that a selfish guardian exists is probably the biggest lie I’ve ever heard. In fact, its really hard to create a selfish guardian build. You would literally have to use scepter, no off hand weapon, meditations or signets and never use your virtues.

Do you ever see anyone play like that? I sure haven’t. While other classes have to trait heavily into support to help allies guardians support is innate. So even though players aren’t running your “ideal” guardian build, they are still supporting allies in some way shape and form.

Actually guardian weapons provide support with only staff (if you take this in a dungeon any speed clear group will kick you.), and the hammer auto attack chain. Focus provides minimal support and sword provides none. Greatsword is good for cc and not much else as far as a group is concerned. Communal defenses also has a 20s CD so it’s not exactly THAT great since guardians have so many blocks that the proccing communal defenses would be completely random I would rather use retreat, hold the line etc. Also communal defenses would not be taken in a mediation build because you are sacrificing the meditations healing you which is half of a meditation build alone. Then lets not forget you are still missing the tons of %dmg increase traits that guardians get from EVERY other line besides valor. And no a meditation guardian is not really supporting anyone at all besides himself…. Its equivalent of taking a necro in your group. Except necros can still bring wells.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Can-a-selfish-guardian-really-exist/first#post3896158

jportell.2197:

Moleless.1462:

jportell.2197:

a t s e.9614:

Well since its a PvE thread , if guardian was so hard to play then pugs should ask for warrs only , not heavies. Usually its what I see when I check the LFG system :" heavies only " because they are easier to play.

Like really dude, since when guardian is a hard mode class?

Not saying it’s “hardmode”. However your example of a meditation guardian should get you kicked from any dungeon group. Not just the speed clears. People want guardians for the group boons and reflects etc if you run a triple meditation guardian you come across two issues.

1. Your DPS sucks compared to a non meditation guardian (you lose Dmg% increase traits that you would get otherwise.)
2. Your group support sucks as your three utility slots are taken up by the most selfish utility skills that a guardian has (Think of triple cantrip eles or worse 5 signet warriors).

The only thing you are going to be giving your group is the random blind (assuming you are six deep into precision) and a few stacks of vulnerability here and there. All of which another class can do infinitely better.

PvP DPS builds should never be used in PvE and vice versa.

Uhhh, which Dmg% increase traits are you missing out on by playing meditation?

You are either missing unscathed contender (20%), Fiery Wrath (10%), Radiant Power (10%), Elusive Power (10% when endurance not full),or Power of the virtuous (1%/boon).

Now usually no matter what build you run, you won’t be able to get all of these however by not going into valor at all you are opening up your options greatly for dmg% increase traits. If you run triple meditations you are going 6 deep into a line that is the most selfish line in the game for guardians. If you are running a triple meditation guardian you bring absolutely nothing to the group. Valor has absolutely no flat damage increase traits however EVERY other line that the guardian has does have a flat increase trait somewhere as well as something else to offer the group like decreased recharge on shouts. Decrease recharge on consecrations which give reflects or fire fields etc. Better group condi clear for certain dungeons.

Communal Defense is probably one of the best group utilities guardian has and its in the valor line.

In regards to your idea that meditation guardians are selfish, its hard to be selfish as a guardian when most of their weapon skills provide group support in some way. So saying that a selfish guardian exists is probably the biggest lie I’ve ever heard. In fact, its really hard to create a selfish guardian build. You would literally have to use scepter, no off hand weapon, meditations or signets and never use your virtues.

Do you ever see anyone play like that? I sure haven’t. While other classes have to trait heavily into support to help allies guardians support is innate. So even though players aren’t running your “ideal” guardian build, they are still supporting allies in some way shape and form.

Rentapest.6503:

This ability should be removed from PvP. I’m so tired of trying to attack my enemy and losing HALF my hp to retalliation! That is not an exaggeration at all, I start nuking ppl and just see my health evaporate to this ability. Then ofc they start to attack me and I’m just insta-dead because I’m forced to blow my heal just because I touched the enemy.

This ability imbalances pvp. I play a ranger, how am I supposed to buff myself with this ability 24/7 like everyone else has it? Oh that’s right, I’m not an OP guard or OP engineer.

Stop spamming aoe on a group with retaliation. The solution is quite simple.

I’ve gotten gold over a dozen times. The loot is good. Also you can trade tokens for equipment boxes for even more loot.

zaw.6741:

Megastorm.6219:

I would agree with this for the most part. Anyone can say “switch that trait, change this rune or sigil and it’s better”, but I think for the most part it’s trickiculty factor 5 lately for getting the right balance on guards. I have also had the most success with hybrid builds lately, and they have been holding their own and fun to play.

I’ve been running these setups if anyone is interested.
PVE: Might focused with swappable utility
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQNAR8dlsApUoVDxZI8DRBARl1CaXAgZMEe3GCjAA-TBSGABA8AAGS5XCXEAQ2fgMdDGcEAAU9HpUCSKgqEGB-e

PVP: Bunker Burner hybrid
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fVAQNAR5elsApaodDxZI8DNx/QYZwAm37XPW2B-TJxHwADuIAa2fAwTAoYZAA

Probably not perfect but they’re fun and effective.

you dont go valor for pve, its worthless crap in this game mode totally inferior to anything else

Valor is good for teq and wurm. Communal defense is great.

NevirSayDie.6235:

That’s pretty broad. How do you suggest going about equally nerfing all defensive capacity for every profession?

Or if you simply think all damage should be increased, are you willing to accept the 1-shot gameplay that will come with that? Lich form autoattack can already 1-shot some builds, 100-0 in a single auto (+procs). Should it do more damage?

I don’t think the OP understands what he/she is saying.

I’m sure Anet reads threads like these where the bickering is minimum. I’m going to throw my opinion out there:

Pros:

• Well designed boss fights
• Anti zerg design
• Requires coordination

Cons:

• Reward for effort is a bit lacking
• Open world and coordination doesn’t mix well. Can’t expect randoms to organize themselves to complete this type of event
• Too much emphasis on dps rush, there needs to be a smart balance that requires not only dps but control and support

Maybe someone should further test, I’m interested to know if it was fixed as well.

Vlad Morbius.1759:

Oh this was a terrific idea, first you feed zerg content to your player base for 18 months then you decide, we need to change it up people are earning 2 gold an hour oh my! So your plan, you lower the rewards, then change the content to an organized raid style without ever once considering you’ve made that nearly impossible by introducing a mega server where organization is nearly impossible…genius!

This is a valid concern, big guilds have been vocal about this as well. Its very hard to do a organized raid when the nature of the game is disorganization. Anet has yet to respond, I’m not sure if they are expecting a bunch of randoms to magically organize to defeat a boss. It will never happen, thats what raid instances are for.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

^ such lies.

berserker stance
8 seconds immune to conditions
60 seconds recharge
- still dies very quickly to direct damage

endure pain
4 seconds take no damage
60 seconds recharge
- slowed down by crippled, chilled
- stopped by immobilize
- stopped by control effects

60 seconds is long cool down
4 / 8 seconds is short duration

what kitten are you smoking?

Most invulnerability skills don’t last any where as long and their cds are just about the same.

While its true that zerker stance and endure/defy pain have “weaknesses”. What you didn’t list is unlike gw1, in gw2 you can use as many stances as you have equipped at once. Your point would be much more valid if you could only have one stance enabled at once.

Julie Yann.5379:

Aza.2105:

Julie Yann.5379:

Aza.2105:

Hambow is in a good spot, with the exception of combustive shot. The radius is far too large, it covers a entire point except graveyard in Legacy of Foefire. This makes the only counterplay available is to simply leave the point, which is unacceptable.

how is it any different than a MM Necro that has the entire node cover with minions or a spamgineer bombarding the entire node with nades and turrets or a meteor shower from an ele?

1. Necro minions can be destroyed
2. Engi turrets can be destroyed, blind combats nade spam, retaliation penalizes engi for spamming nades.
3. Meteor shower’s impact area is random, you may or may not be hit. They are also easy to dodge when needed.

Combustive shot can’t really be compared to any of the above.

• And burning can be cleansed

What condition removal can keep up with the reapplication of combustive shot? It has a short cd, adrenaline is relatively easy to come by. I don’t feel it being cleansed is even relevant to mention up.

• the shot can be interrupted

Any interruption would probably be by accident, most (note not all) interruption skills have long cast times and animations which makes being able to skillfully interrupt a skill with a relatively fast cast and animation very unlikely.

• or evaded completely and requires 3 bars of adrenaline to get full size and damage

It can be dodged theoretically but for how long? The skill last for 4 seconds with a 10 second default cd. That means there is a 6 second period between when it can be applied again. Regardless it being able to be dodged is irrelevant to the point I mentioned up.

• Like I said, the only thing that makes this skill so strong is people dumb enough to stand in it to fight

I’d usually agree to this, its certainly true that many players will just try to face tank aoe. The problem is the skill takes up a entire capture point. Making it the only way not to stand in it is to not be on the point if the warrior is defending or trying to capture it.

Julie Yann.5379:

Aza.2105:

Hambow is in a good spot, with the exception of combustive shot. The radius is far too large, it covers a entire point except graveyard in Legacy of Foefire. This makes the only counterplay available is to simply leave the point, which is unacceptable.

how is it any different than a MM Necro that has the entire node cover with minions or a spamgineer bombarding the entire node with nades and turrets or a meteor shower from an ele?

1. Necro minions can be destroyed
2. Engi turrets can be destroyed, blind combats nade spam, retaliation penalizes engi for spamming nades.
3. Meteor shower’s impact area is random, you may or may not be hit. They are also easy to dodge when needed.

Combustive shot can’t really be compared to any of the above.

Hambow is in a good spot, with the exception of combustive shot. The radius is far too large, it covers a entire point except graveyard in Legacy of Foefire. This makes the only counterplay available is to simply leave the point, which is unacceptable.

Are you playing hotjoin by chance?

Evade is overpowered and always has been. The problem is evade is the dodge mechanic renamed and pinned to weapon and utility skills. Its like being able to dodge and do damage or use healing skills at once. When dodge is used all other skills can not be used since dodge takes priority.

From a broader perspective, what evade does is give specific classes access to a alternative dodge mechanic that doesn’t play by the same rules as dodge. Dodge and evade can be chained in succession giving the user large periods were they remain untouchable, which is probably what most complainers have a problem with.

The thief class is exempt from a lot of the conventional rules of combat in gw2:

1. Chill does not affect their skills
2. The class does not use static cooldowns for weapon skills
3. Stealth has no counter outside of sic em

So when you look at how evade is exempt from the same rules used by dodge and you give it to a class that is exempt from many basic gameplay rules then you can see how it becomes over the top.

I feel evade should be changed to work different than dodge or at the very least make skills that can’t be evaded. There are already unblockable skills in the game, dodge has weakness to counter balance it. Evade has nothing.

Dee Jay.2460:

I agree that Runes of Strength are probably a little strong overall.

But I’d rather see crappy Runes buffed than popular ones nerfed. Because objectively Strength Runes only really add DPS. And I’m sure other things matter too.

They should start by rebuffing Runes of Lyssa. Other Runes could also be buffed.

In general I think it would be better if ANet moves away from static damage increases and instead promoted more “utility” effects, rather than just raw damage.

Ever notice how Anet always adds damage modifiers but no damage reduction modifiers?

I really don’t see the problem with strength runes.

I’m not saying it shouldn’t be nerfed or that it shouldn’t be left as it is. But consider this, while it is a 20% increase its has requirements to be met. No character is stunned 100% of the time, but only a very tiny portion. So while it appears the 20% increase is a lot, I don’t feel it is vs 10% dmg increase that is consistently available to the user.

Interesting, every time I talk about skyhammer I say that it belongs in a quake game.

Malediktus.9250:

SafiMoyo.5130:

Stability stomp and nobody can save that ranger.

did you even read? I was talking about downstate vs downstate, rangers are basically godmode in downstate vs downstate, heck even downstate vs 2x downstate is no problem for a ranger

Someone told me that downstate is when rangers are at their best, they can not lose vs another downed class.

Evan Lesh.3295:

It has not changed.

I’ve noticed it as well. After awhile it slowed down until I no longer got points for track progression.

a t s e.9614:

The question is how you managed to get downed by a ranger?

Lets not blame the player. He has a valid point. The skill is obviously bugged. I’m surprised its been bugged for so long.

Terrahero.9358:

Aza.2105:

Terrahero.9358:

Darek.1836:

it’s not really guardians that are OP, they’re just necessary for the boons and some healing as well as bunkering ability

“Guardians arent overpowered, they are just necessary”

In your own words; lol.

I’m not saying nerf guardians is the only solution, but right now its obvious they fill an important role in a team and no other profession can apparently come anywhere close to doing it. Which is why we see so kitten many guardians.
Either Guardians need to be worst at it, or other professions need to be better.

Also, the more then 1 average is based on the streamed ToL. Those were the top teams to come through the 128 team onslaught that came before that would use double guardian.
So if the best teams are doing it then there is apparently some merit to it.

This is true to extent, the other end of the spectrum is that guardian does not feel other roles well. People tend to freak out if you bring anything other than a bunker guardian to pvp.

A lot of professions have trouble filling multiple roles, hell a bunch of professions have trouble filling even a single role.

This might also hurt Guardians in another way, if you are good at A then everyone expects A from you.

If you have any experience with a game like WoW then you know what i mean. Classes had several builds available to them, but if one of them was a healing build then you were a healing class. Show up as anything but a healer and be ready for verbal abuse.

I dont think GW2 is that terrible or has such a toxic community as WoW did back in “those” days. But certain expectations are set. Which in turn might very well hold other potential builds back.

Regardless, if something is so important that you always need someone to do it, having only one profession able to pull it off will stiffle diversity. And again, i think simply looking at the statistics says enough. This is a game wide issue.

I agree with what you are saying here and yes I played wow and can definitely see the comparisons you are making. It is very similar. You aren’t the first to be vocal about the lack of diversity, but from one end of the spectrum I believe the players themselves are at fault. Since most stick to tried and tested builds others have run or slight modifications of them.

To see something like a dps or condition guardian in a pvp group is probably on the experimental side of things. Everyone expects the worst and no one is too certain how well they will fill the role outside of bunker. I personally feel that guardians non bunker specs are decent, but the bunker role is far beyond any non bunker guardian builds. Guardian is suppose to be the ally support class, so its no accident they are the best for this particular role.

The question is what can other classes do to support as good as guardian without replicating one? Probably not much, boons and conditions are homogeneous so getting other classes to support as well as guardian would be no easy task. This of course is my opinion.

foofad.5162:

Mm, not buying it. At 43 seconds he went from 7 stacks to 8 stacks a split second before you stripped, shifting Might to the far right (most recent). The same thing happened at the very next strip, ten seconds later at 53 seconds into the video, where he went from 5 stacks to 6 just a split second before you stripped him again. Those are the only two I’ve scrutinized so far but I suspect it’s the same story for all of them.

I can confirm that you are correct. From what I’ve tested it, it always strips the boon further on the right. It didn’t seem to prioritize anything.

Terrahero.9358:

Darek.1836:

it’s not really guardians that are OP, they’re just necessary for the boons and some healing as well as bunkering ability

“Guardians arent overpowered, they are just necessary”

In your own words; lol.

I’m not saying nerf guardians is the only solution, but right now its obvious they fill an important role in a team and no other profession can apparently come anywhere close to doing it. Which is why we see so kitten many guardians.
Either Guardians need to be worst at it, or other professions need to be better.

Also, the more then 1 average is based on the streamed ToL. Those were the top teams to come through the 128 team onslaught that came before that would use double guardian.
So if the best teams are doing it then there is apparently some merit to it.

This is true to extent, the other end of the spectrum is that guardian does not feel other roles well. People tend to freak out if you bring anything other than a bunker guardian to pvp.

They should fix random dodges when they get rid of instant casts and makes animations more clear.

Lucentfir.7430:

Aza.2105:

Valor- Courageous Return needs to be changed.

Explanation:

It lacks synergy with the rest of the minor traits in the line. Here are examples of synergy in the other trait lines:

Zeal- Zealot’s Speed (cast a symbol when you drop below 50% hp), Symbolic Exposure (symbols now cast vulnerability), Symbolic Power (symbols now do 10% more damage).

Each trait adds on to the previous one giving it depth. But with courageous return, its disruptive to the synergy between Valorous Defense and Might of the Protector. Possible changes that could be more fitting would be:

*Courageous Return:

A. Deal 7% more damage while under the effect of might
B. Gain swiftness for 10 secs each time aegis is removed
C. Enemies are crippled for 8 secs each time aegis is removed
D. Gain 5secs of stability when aegis is removed
E. When aegis is removed you become immune to cripple, chill and immobilized for 10 seconds*

As much as those skills sound nice, they look a bit to powerful to be a minor trait in Valor’s master line. A is straight up copy pasta of Strength rune 6th set, B looks alright except for the duration would probably be 3-5s, C doesn’t really fit the name of the trait, D seems to powerful and just way too strong for a minor Valor trait, E= Zerker stance against movement impairment….wayyy too strong.

I know it’s a wish list and all but if they were planning to actually replace Courageous Return with one of the three traits, they would be Shaved down by quite a bit. But then a again it’s a wishlist :P and one can only wish/dream.

The only thing(s) I wish for is a Kindled Zeal remake since it’s obsolete compared to Amplified Wrath. Another one would be to change Retaliatory Subconscious into a new trait that procs Stand your Ground When CC’d. If it happens move it up to to master trait and move Supreme Justice down to adept tier. General change to have some condition removal on all weapons like not complete removal but things like removing 1 stack of bleed or knocking off a fixed duration poison or burn upon landing said skills. Last thing would be some soft CC, not a lot, just a little bit initially to help builds that don’t run hammer or Traveler/Speed to keep up.

Not really a wishlist, but more like examples of a trait that provides synergy between its predecessor trait and successor trait. The other trait lines follow this pattern, valor however does not.

Valor- Courageous Return needs to be changed.

Explanation:

It lacks synergy with the rest of the minor traits in the line. Here are examples of synergy in the other trait lines:

Zeal- Zealot’s Speed (cast a symbol when you drop below 50% hp), Symbolic Exposure (symbols now cast vulnerability), Symbolic Power (symbols now do 10% more damage).

Each trait adds on to the previous one giving it depth. But with courageous return, its disruptive to the synergy between Valorous Defense and Might of the Protector. Possible changes that could be more fitting would be:

Courageous Return:

A. Deal 7% more damage while under the effect of might
B. Gain swiftness for 10 secs each time aegis is removed
C. Enemies are crippled for 8 secs each time aegis is removed
D. Gain 5secs of stability when aegis is removed
E. When aegis is removed you become immune to cripple, chill and immobilized for 10 seconds

I feel healing power is fine where its at. In fact, I’d say most of your reasoning why it needs to be overhauled aren’t true at all.

A example of this is when you said “In PvE healing power is almost always unviable because you can survive with your class heal and nobody would ever take a healer in a dungeon when they could take another damage dealer”.

There are a few problems to this statement. The first being that pve isn’t the best place to measure defensive performance. For a number of reasons: Mob AI is unintelligent, so most can be defeated by stacking in a corner. Because of this players can focus on dpsing without having to rely on supportive builds. Why should they went enemies die so fast and are so stupid.

PvP gives a better perspective of the zerker vs healing argument. A zerker can’t bunk nearly as well as a build with a defensive amulet like cleric or solider. Likewise a zerker can’t just survive on their #6 heal alone. The idea that healing power needs a boost isn’t what you are asking for, what you are asking for is to change AI were it takes more than stacking, pulling into corner/los and dps to beat them.

If that changes then more supportive builds will be used. But I’m not sure if that will ever happen.

The biggest offenders of spirit weapons that makes them feel a bit underwhelming:

1. Spirit weapon AI
2. Spirit weapons dying if you use their skills while not trait for Eternal Spirit
3. Spirit weapons health

I don’t think I need to elaborate much since most people will understand what I’m saying. In particular though, spirit weapon AI is horrible especially on the shield and bow. Since they are both defensive weapons. Nothing is worse than seeing them run after a enemy target. Shield will often run after someone then proc its protective bubble with no ally around, bow will follow enemies but do nothing. Its horrid.

Glacial Heart: This trait now applies 5 seconds of chill on a critical hit with a 100% activation rate (up from 4 seconds on a 50% rate). This effect’s recharge has been reduced from 45 seconds to 30 seconds.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-June-25th-2013

When the patch came out that made traits less transparent, it was ninja nerfed back to 50% chance to activate.

Ghotistyx.6942:

Practically since beta svarty has been complaining about guardian health. If you look through his post history, he’ll have many random quips about raising the pool, or about how having a low hp pool prevents guardians from being able to use a burning build or something unrelated like that.

It’s been well documented moar hache pees is in his wishlist.

I’d still like to hear other people’s ideas.

That’s a long time to be complaining, I’m amazed.

Kasei.8726:

Aza.2105:

I feel its fine. Try to look at it this way, shield of absorption is comparable to wall of reflect which is a utility skill. In addition it also heals. Shield is basically two utility slots moved to weapon slots.

I hate to be that guy, but no, it’s not at all.

I’m going to be captain obvious here and remind you that Shield of Absorption absorbs and Wall of Reflection reflects. WoR can be placed at a spot and you can continue fighting, SoA locks you in place while absorbing. Being locked in place usually spells defeat.

I won’t speak for others, but I use SoA 90% of the time for its knockback effect since it’s projectile absorption and healing are both lackluster.

I said comparable, not the same.