Guild Wars 2

Lol, is he STILL going on about the same thing? I think Cod and I tried logic a few days ago and we both gave up because it was nothing but broken record responses. Better to just ignore him than feed the trolls.

Kiltor.9362:

I for one do not agree with a karma train on a Thursday. Glad SoS decided to come fight tonight! Karma trains creates 0 fights since bls are qued for hours with underlvl toons tryin to get there 6 lvls in 3 hours. I dont mind it as much on Fridays as there usually is a BL that will have small man fights on them but having it on a Thursday is just Poor Form.

We didn’t have much of a choice but to Karma train at one point in SoS BL last night, Choo and CNB decided to have a GvG and apparently the whole SoR map blob went to watch instead of doing anything

Lemrish.5970:

Cuddlepie.8109:

The guild Legends Never [DIE] started a thread about the current matchup (that appears to have been removed) titled:

SoR Legends Never [DIE] Vs ALL OF BG

In it – claimed to be the first post of any of their members – they said that:
1. They’d embarrass BG’s “lacklustre” WvW guilds.
2. They could spawn camp BG every night if they wanted to – but didn’t because that would be “childish”, and
3. That BG could not defeat them – or any server – in open field fights.

The Youtube video here shows what happened when [DIE] met the BG militia I was commanding last night in EB.

http://youtu.be/8WCq986sCpU

This is gold. In my opinion [DIE] could use some more training. That BG militia group looked much more coordinated then them.

Great Vid

I wonder if this was before or after we wiped them off SoS BL last night… wiped them out of bay after they broke a wall/door, then wiped them out of hills later when they tried to sneak it during the awesome garrison fight and we had to come back.

akamon.2769:

Lucentfir.7430:

Kyle.3856:

From the ele forums:

Tyler Chapman.1832:

Treborlavok.3504:

just like the guardians 5 trait for vigor on crit… its ok for them to have a 10 second single condition cure at adept…?

The Guardian and Mesmer vigor traits are something that were on the table and will be on the table for change in the future. We don’t like those traits being that easily accessible. While they haven’t yet been changed as long as our thoughts don’t change internally they are part of the vigor rework we want to do.

………. Uh oh….

Really…..so on top of having to be a melee fighter class, with the lowest HP, no real mobility and having every other class being able to outrun us you’re going to mess with this trait. Pretending to buff the DPS…yeah….sure…..please clarify Devs what you actually intend to do with the trait….because right now I’m feeling it’s going to impact guardian greatly. i don’t know if I’m overacting or not but that’s really nothing light to take in, that’s pretty heavy.

so they want us to stay in one spot and can’t chase or run from others. but they don’t want us to be too strong. they want us to be more supportive and defensive. so they will take away our more notable defensive utilities and traits.

and who the frack is this Treborlavok (the one complaining about Guardians vigor and purity traits)? normally i don’t complain “much” about the Guardian class. or i’ve been largely positive with the class. but i HATE it when others complain about classes they don’t play. so now they’re going to mess with some of our core aspects cause some crybaby whines. wtf.

[edit: i’m probably overreacting too like Lucentfir says.. but still. frustating when they keep goign back and forth about where they want us to be. or actions don’t line up with talk. hopefully i’ll come back later when i’m a bit more calm to properly contribute.]

Not very often I see a post like this from you. :P I do agree though, Not only would this be a nerf to our survivability in terms of damage negation, but it would also hurt one of our biggest heals in terms of selfless daring. I can understand thief taking a hit, as they have two traits that give vigor, on top of a trait that auto returns some on dodge. Eles have the scepter trait that increases out of vigor regen, and also have the means to kite people around. And rangers have access to alot of evades from GS Auto, sword 2/3 dagger 4, and also a utility that is a dodge, and gives vigor. Changing both mesmer and Guardian would severely hurt both classes, due to other mechanics that rely on dodges, and are really both cores of their builds. (selfless daring for healing support, and the clone on dodge for pretty much any clone build a mesmer might use.)

Speaking of condition removal, I really think we need some sort of buff of it in the radiance line (like was suggested in my post concerning core issues) Right now, in zeal, we have 0 condition removal, in radiance we have minor condition removal, through signet removal, and the improving of SoR’s passive through the 30 point trait (which is actually extremely weak) Part of the issue with why people don’t go deep into zeal/radiance is because we need so much condition removal due to our low health. I would suggest either boosting either signet renewal to 2 per use, or combining it with signet CD to bring in some other trait, possibly even a full fledged torment on crit trait, making a signet crit condition build something possible, and making signet of wrath useable outside of on use CC.

Pirate.5736:

Torment and Chill seem like good options to assist Guardians ability to stay in combat without increasing mobility. Seems like every other class has a “condition on crit” trait, why not add a Torment on crit trait to the radiance line? This would offer another damaging condition to make use of a stat that is pretty underwhelming on a Guardian.

Overall, conditions like Burn could also do with an initial damage component if stacking. Say damage equal to one tick based on the users condition damage trait and duration increase on the existing.

+1!!!!

Ive been saying the torment part for months, pretty much since torment was introduced as a condition.

Either a 2s chill with 10s CD on crit, or torment on crit so we can have a viable condition build base would be nice. Though, I would like to see those extended to all 1h weapons, as mace is VERY lacking in terms of cc/movement, and a chill/torment on scepter would really help with the whole “don’t bother out of 400 range”

I am going to repost this here from the guardian forums since there seems to not be any response in there. I am including quotes that have context to my thoughts on guardian design atm.

JonPeters.5630:

Guardian:
Tanky and supportive guardians are in a strong position in many gametypes. We do feel that damage guardians are not as powerful as they could be. While we don’t want guardians to be as strong offensively as some of the other classes (given their powerful defensive abilities) we opened up more offensive guardian builds.

Supreme Justice and Kindled Zeal
I’m not sure this will be enough, but I do not want these traits to be overpowered as I feel they are fairly passive. That being said, I think they are good simple traits and with 12 traits per line it is absolutely fine to have some passive simple to understand traits. Another thing about this build is that you do not have all of the information you need about this power guardian right now, but I can’t reveal more without spoilers. /tease

Power guardian vs Condition guardian
I think Dec 10th will see the emergence of the power guardian, but I think that the condition based guardian still has a ways to go. Ultimately this is because it is hard to cover the burning and frankly you need a good reliable second or even third condition that guardians simply do not have right now. I think for those professions lacking that 3rd damage condition we are looking at supplementing them via runes and sigils rather than skills/traits right now but that won’t be something we attempt until the build that follows the Dec 10th build.
I think that is everything for guardian and hopefully you enjoyed a few half spoiler/half teases.

All that aside, we still are one of the least mobile professions, we still have literally no soft CC to keep anyone near us, we still are extremely weak against conditions, unless we spec hard into condition removal, which limits our builds very badly. None of these current "buff"s are going to fix any of that. Kindled zeal will still be useless A) because we have one condition, and because to put the points that far into zeal, makes us lose way too much in the line of defenses, which we need BADLY, primarily because of our low health pool and poor mobility. The fact that you intend to use sigils/runes as a band aid for this when NO other class HAS to is rather disappointing. Why must we give up both our sigil and runes just to make a condition build? Honestly, if we even had multiple conditions, I still doubt kindled zeal would be worth it, as nothing else in the zeal line does anything for conditions. it is completely power based, and you could easily put into more defensive lines and pick up more condition damage in gear and be better of.

However, I really think the core issues need to be fixed before any of that is even thought of. We NEED some type of soft CC, that we can at least semi-frequently apply to keep people near us. We are one of the slowest classes with very lack luster ranged capabilities, yet compared to a warrior, who is very mobile, and also has ranged capabilities, they DESTROY in a comparison to the amount of CC they have in addition to that. I still suggest a glacial heart revamp to effect every weapon with a shorter duration and CD, or even apply chill on symbol pulse or application would be a start. (though 1h sword would still be SOL in terms of staying on someone with a symbol trait)

We need some type of revamp on our condition removal skills/traits. We have ALOT of condition removal at our hands, that is obvious, the issue is being able to keep up with the massive amount of reapplication, and also the requirement of our utility skills for mobility and support. I believe that we need to move some condition removal into our damage trees, just to make them able to be used without completely tanking our chances at living.

I know you say that we shouldn’t be allowed to do as much damage because of our basic defenses, but at the end of the day, those basic defenses are not even doing it anymore without specing heavily into buffs for them. Yes we are a heavy class, but toughness is starting to become overrated when a thief can backstab for 7k+ on 3.2k armor. Our passive healing through resolve is now pathetic as without any buffs, it wont even cover a single bleed stack, compared to a warrior who gets 300/s right off the bat due to signet, but also gets the highest health pool in the game. Yes we get the most access to aegis, but in pvp game modes, that aegis can easily be wasted on some minor tick from an AoE attack. Due to how stagnant guardians have become in regards to balance, we can no longer look into specing for damage outside of trying for a gimmicky burst build, and are stuck in the same 3 trait lines that we have been for the last several months.

KeeZee.7312:

Bash.7291:

KeeZee.7312:

Bash.7291:

KeeZee.7312:

BG won 6 out of the last 7 matches where it was BG/SoR/server x. 85.7% win percentage against SoR.

Why did BG feel they wouldn’t win?

Oh ya, that’s what they want everyone to believe.

I dont know, maybe because our SEA coverage got gutted by guilds leaving, which left us vulnerable in that timezone. Or maybe the fact that before the start of the league, we hadn’t won a match since we lost that coverage?(including an SoR/BG/TC match, and also a JQ/BG/TC match) You can look at those win numbers all you want, but WAY to much changed between those matches to even use them as viable data.

SoR has beat BG once this year (in a heads up match) in week 39 which was 3 weeks before leagues started.

Do you really want everyone to believe that that one win shows BG as lacking coverage?

Please provide all the losses BG suffered against SoR due to BG not having coverage.
I expect that will come when BG posts how their easy schedule is unfair to everyone.

Lets see… 3 weeks before leagues started… hmm, that seems to be about the same time we lost a bunch of people to transfers. Wow isn’t that a fluke! It is funny how you can’t seem to accept that over a multiple month period something like WvW status can change very quickly, yet that is exactly what happened from Sun -> Mon last match up. Hell, the same thing happened when got Iron, or are we selectively forgetting that? By your logic, ZD coming over shouldn’t have effected anything, since nothing can change unless its been over the course of years or something.

KeeZee.7312:

Cod on Cod.3694:

KeeZee.7312:

BG won 6 out of the last 7 matches where it was BG/SoR/server x. 85.7% win percentage against SoR.

Why did BG feel they wouldn’t win?

Oh ya, that’s what they want everyone to believe.

I give up on your kid, simply dont know why you are dodging this simple question….

Anyway, happy trolling you broken record you.

Give up on facts……the BG way.

Yep, he gave up on trying to show you facts, I guess you just said it yourself ^.^

Still waiting to see the facts showing BG with a losing match history vs SoR.

So far all I see is “We feel we needed more coverage.” Your match history (fact) shows what you felt couldn’t be further from the truth.

Meh, I’m following Cod on this one, the fact that you can accept how things can change on a whim is rather sad. But keep trolling, im sure someone else will pick up, then get bored with you too. just remember, trolling is only fun when you can actually keep someone hooked, so next time try and switch the arguement a little, broken record isn’t much fun.

Also, I never said we needed more coverage, I just think it’s funny when people try to exclude data the doesn’t fit into their arguement, despite how important it may be.

Tyaen.5148:

Bash.7291:

HolyMolla.6582:

So any guilds that thinking transfer out of SOR,
please consider TC, SOS and MAG or FA.
They have good community.

I would normally suggest TC so we could at least have another T1 server to go against, but then again I would rather the T1 threads not keep the SoR trolls…

And you would call that what? Not trolling?

“Hello pot? This is kettle.”

I never said all trolls did I? :P

KeeZee.7312:

Bash.7291:

KeeZee.7312:

Bash.7291:

KeeZee.7312:

BG won 6 out of the last 7 matches where it was BG/SoR/server x. 85.7% win percentage against SoR.

Why did BG feel they wouldn’t win?

Oh ya, that’s what they want everyone to believe.

I dont know, maybe because our SEA coverage got gutted by guilds leaving, which left us vulnerable in that timezone. Or maybe the fact that before the start of the league, we hadn’t won a match since we lost that coverage?(including an SoR/BG/TC match, and also a JQ/BG/TC match) You can look at those win numbers all you want, but WAY to much changed between those matches to even use them as viable data.

SoR has beat BG once this year (in a heads up match) in week 39 which was 3 weeks before leagues started.

Do you really want everyone to believe that that one win shows BG as lacking coverage?

Please provide all the losses BG suffered against SoR due to BG not having coverage.
I expect that will come when BG posts how their easy schedule is unfair to everyone.

Lets see… 3 weeks before leagues started… hmm, that seems to be about the same time we lost a bunch of people to transfers. Wow isn’t that a fluke! It is funny how you can’t seem to accept that over a multiple month period something like WvW status can change very quickly, yet that is exactly what happened from Sun -> Mon last match up. Hell, the same thing happened when got Iron, or are we selectively forgetting that? By your logic, ZD coming over shouldn’t have effected anything, since nothing can change unless its been over the course of years or something.

In the first league match-up on Monday and Tuesday when JQ and SoR were focussing BG, BG managed to make up the ppt and take the lead on both days after NA went to bed.

Another fact, I know.

But hey, BG obviously needed ZD even though the facts prove otherwise.

The amount of time that BG got focused was EXTREMELY minimal. Everyone knows the 2v1 worked out in BG’s favor in that fight, hell, even SoR and JQ people know that. Or do I need to re post all the QQ about how 2 servers were generally helping each other paper the others keep. 80% the time it was about BG either getting help, or helping the other server, not against BG. But please, keep ignoring facts, and repeating the same false arguement over and over.

HolyMolla.6582:

So any guilds that thinking transfer out of SOR,
please consider TC, SOS and MAG or FA.
They have good community.

I would normally suggest TC so we could at least have another T1 server to go against, but then again I would rather the T1 threads not keep the SoR trolls…

KeeZee.7312:

Bash.7291:

KeeZee.7312:

BG won 6 out of the last 7 matches where it was BG/SoR/server x. 85.7% win percentage against SoR.

Why did BG feel they wouldn’t win?

Oh ya, that’s what they want everyone to believe.

I dont know, maybe because our SEA coverage got gutted by guilds leaving, which left us vulnerable in that timezone. Or maybe the fact that before the start of the league, we hadn’t won a match since we lost that coverage?(including an SoR/BG/TC match, and also a JQ/BG/TC match) You can look at those win numbers all you want, but WAY to much changed between those matches to even use them as viable data.

SoR has beat BG once this year (in a heads up match) in week 39 which was 3 weeks before leagues started.

Do you really want everyone to believe that that one win shows BG as lacking coverage?

Please provide all the losses BG suffered against SoR due to BG not having coverage.
I expect that will come when BG posts how their easy schedule is unfair to everyone.

Lets see… 3 weeks before leagues started… hmm, that seems to be about the same time we lost a bunch of people to transfers. Wow isn’t that a fluke! It is funny how you can’t seem to accept that over a multiple month period something like WvW status can change very quickly, yet that is exactly what happened from Sun -> Mon last match up. Hell, the same thing happened when got Iron, or are we selectively forgetting that? By your logic, ZD coming over shouldn’t have effected anything, since nothing can change unless its been over the course of years or something.

KeeZee.7312:

Cod on Cod.3694:

KeeZee.7312:

BG won 6 out of the last 7 matches where it was BG/SoR/server x. 85.7% win percentage against SoR.

Why did BG feel they wouldn’t win?

Oh ya, that’s what they want everyone to believe.

I give up on your kid, simply dont know why you are dodging this simple question….

Anyway, happy trolling you broken record you.

Give up on facts……the BG way.

Yep, he gave up on trying to show you facts, I guess you just said it yourself ^.^

deathTouch.9706:

So basically, SoR was unable to buy recruit enough warm bodies and are now losing to Buygate’s sheer coverage, so SoR now claims to now have been in WvW only for Gudfites but nevertheless is on the verge of collapse because of disillusioned PPT/PVT bandwagoners?

I like where this is going.

Cant you people at least wait a week till our matchup!? :P

KeeZee.7312:

BG won 6 out of the last 7 matches where it was BG/SoR/server x. 85.7% win percentage against SoR.

Why did BG feel they wouldn’t win?

Oh ya, that’s what they want everyone to believe.

I dont know, maybe because our SEA coverage got gutted by guilds leaving, which left us vulnerable in that timezone. Or maybe the fact that before the start of the league, we hadn’t won a match since we lost that coverage?(including an SoR/BG/TC match, and also a JQ/BG/TC match) You can look at those win numbers all you want, but WAY to much changed between those matches to even use them as viable data.

Zepher.7803:

Antares.2586:

I would like to thanks Dev for that :

Zeal VII – Zealous Blade. This trait now scales with Healing power (2%.)

I’ve asked with several people that VII would scale with Healing, even a bit, to open up new build, less relying on AH.
I see Devs are watching and listening to the community feedback

So Kudos and thank you, and keep up the good work !

is anyone doing the math on this?

Zealous Blade Healing is way off now and with 2% it’s still a joke, you need 1300 healing power to make it heal for 26 hitpoints when an attack hits.

I’ve put on my Healing power gear/Weapons, my ascended trinkets and im upto 1800
give or take, so then I will be able to heal for 36 hitpoints!

if 20 people stand still and let me hit them for 10 seconds I would heal for 1k
(oh wait I can only hit 5 people at a time)

now since my toon is level 80 I have 16,000 hitpoints with a whooping heal of 150 hitpoints; again if everyone stands still and in range.

I’ve tried to understand these changes but I can only think of someone that’s in a area that doesn’t scale stats and plays with the numbers at level 2 or something, it just doesn’t add up.

Just to fix something, I think the intent is to make it scale in addition to what it already does, at 1k healing power that would put the heal at 45 per hit pre wvw bonuses. Granted, that doesn’t seem like alot, but also you have to figure in that ANY attack while using GS will heal you for that amount, that includes utilities, and also anything like symbols that were cast and are still active after switching to GS. The issue however is that your limited to it only healing for that weapon, so as soon as you switch you lose all of that extra healing.

My question to the SoR posters in the thread, what does your constant complaint of blackgate being “stacked” have to do with the fact that your score is as low as a T2 server would be? Despite a guild hitting a coverage gap, SoR/JQ/BG VASTLY outnumber any T2 server, let alone SoS/Mag (No offense to the two servers, just stating a fact) The fact that you guys are giving up shows more about your server than the supposed “stacking” of ours. Im really looking forward to the JQ match in two weeks, because even through any QQ, I know they will at least show up.

Also, can we stop tying to fool everyone? The reason BG won the first week was a simple play out of 2v1ing JQ, and JQ thinking it was best to put BG on top since they thought we would lose in our 1v1 matches. It wasn’t a matter of anyone having better coverage, simply because all 3 servers went all out against each other that week. It was a perfect example of match politics.

So instead of giving us the option for conditions, as EVERY class has even before runes/sigils, guardians will be forced to use them to even think of a condition build? Let alone that its not like these sigils and runes will be class specific, so we will see an even bigger flow into the already massive condition meta.

All that aside, we still are one of the least mobile professions, we still have literally no soft CC to keep anyone near us, we still are extremely weak against conditions, unless we spec hard into condition removal, which limits our builds very badly. None of these current "buff"s are going to fix any of that. Kindled zeal will still be useless A) because we have one condition, and B) because to put the points that far into zeal, makes us lose way too much in the line of defenses, which we need BADLY, primarily because of our low health pool and poor mobility. Honestly, if we even had multiple conditions, I still doubt kindled zeal would be worth it, as nothing else in the zeal line does anything for conditions. it is completely power based, and you could easily put into more defensive lines and pick up more condition damage in gear and be better of.

However, I really think the core issues need to be fixed before any of that is even thought of. We NEED some type of soft CC, that we can at least semi-frequently apply to keep people near us. We are one of the slowest classes with very lack luster ranged capabilities, yet compared to a warrior, who is very mobile, and also has ranged capabilities, they DESTROY in a comparison to the amount of CC they have in addition to that. I still suggest a glacial heart revamp to effect every weapon with a shorter duration and CD, or even apply chill on symbol pulse or application would be a start. (though 1h sword would still be SOL in terms of staying on someone with a symbol trait)

We need some type of revamp on our condition removal skills/traits. We have ALOT of condition removal at our hands, that is obvious, the issue is being able to keep up with the massive amount of reapplication, and also the requirement of our utility skills for mobility and support. I believe that we need to move some condition removal into our damage trees, just to make them able to be used without completely tanking our chances at living.

I have no issues being the slow moving bunkerish class. However, we simply do not have the tools to even play that correctly. When the only way to even fight half of the classes is to equip a ranged weapon and use it as a longer range melee weapon, something is wrong. Also the fact that we keep getting pushed further and further into the hole of bunker due to everyone getting large buffs, and also a meta which we can’t really participate in is getting really discouraging.

I know you say that we shouldn’t be allowed to do as much damage because of our basic defenses, but at the end of the day, those basic defenses are not even doing it anymore without specing heavily into buffs for them. Yes we are a heavy class, but toughness is starting to become overrated when a thief can backstab for 7k+ on 3.2k armor. Our passive healing through resolve is now pathetic as without any buffs, it wont even cover a single bleed stack, compared to a warrior who gets 300/s right off the bat due to signet, but also gets the highest health pool in the game. Yes we get the most access to aegis, but in pvp game modes, that aegis can easily be wasted on some minor tick from an AoE attack. Due to how stagnant guardians have become in regards to balance, we can no longer look into specing for damage outside of trying for a gimmicky burst build, and are stuck in the same 3 trait lines that we have been for the last several months.

The link to my base suggestions/questions

For the TLDR: WTF for kindled zeal, why do guardians have 1 condition, and can we get some improvements in this area in radiance (Aka our condition line that has no business being a condition line currently). Why 60 trait points for a horribly broken utility (spirit weapons) and is there ever going to be an actually decent form of glacial heart that people might use. Oh, and also if zeal is ever going to get the overhaul it deserves?

Other topics, if I get any type of answer, will include the reliance on valor for 90% of builds. The possible buffing of virtues for damage builds, since it is almost purely offensive outside of semi useless burn talents, and a slight damage boost based on buffs.

First off I would like to say thank you for actually opening up a discussion thread about the upcoming changes, it is nice to see this type of preview and open talks about the upcoming changes. Being a semi-frequent visitor of the guardian forums, and an active participant of multiple trait threads in said forum, I have a couple question and thoughts regarding the state, and listed possibilities of changes. (Keep in mind that this is all from the mindset of an almost exclusively WvW player)

First, why does kindled zeal exist currently? Guardians have 1 condition they can apply which is burning, even with signets/runes/random racials we still cannot make a build that would even be equal in terms with a normal power build.

Also, why do guardian’s have only one condition? Every other class in the game has access to some type of condition build except guardians. Even our Condition trait line (radiance) only has 2 traits that relate to condition damage at all. (Shimmering defense, and A fire Inside) Both of which are almost useless as we already have an easy time applying burn, and also spirit weapons are near useless outside of very special cases. Two previous suggestions I have made in the guardian forums for possibly fixing this would include changing Shattered Aegis to inflict bleed stacks instead of burning (or damage as the current intended change) and also move it out of zeal to radiance. And add an on crit trait to cause torment in the radiance line. This would fix two major issues for guardians that spec damage, the issues with easily being kited by pretty much any class by causing them damage by doing it, and giving us some conditions to actually make a viable spec.

Another current issue is the complete layout of the zeal trait line, currently the traits in that line do not really mesh at all, considering all the adept traits are symbol based, yet there are traits for weapon’s that don’t have symbols. Both of the grandmaster traits are extremely weak, and not worth putting the extra 10 points into worth getting. Are there any plans to do a complete overhaul on zeal in the future to give us more options outside of fiery wrath and zealous blade?

Another point would be spirit weapons, and why it currently requires 60 points worth of traits to bring them up to full potential. I cannot think of a single utility skill outside of them for any class that requires that many points, in 3 different trees, to make them almost usable. (The ONLY exception would be engineer with kits, but half of the traits can apply to other kits, and also they take the place of actual skills you can control) And I say almost because even after the 60 points, they serve almost no use outside of the shield, which doesn’t even benefit from half of the traits. Is there any plan to merge some of the traits and possibly move them to one trait line, and also buff them in any way to make them usable?

My last question will be regarding Glacial heart, and why this trait is what it currently is. In it’s current state, it is extra CC, on top of pretty much our only CC weapon. The CD is way too long, as with the current meta, there is so much condition removal in builds that it will be gone way to fast to have any real effect. My personal suggestions for this trait are to either A) Lower the CD to 10s, make the chill 2s, make this effect all weapons, considering how horrible it is to try to keep enemies near you as it is as a guardian. or Remove swift retribuition as adept minor from zeal, move the other two traits down (symbolic exposure to adept, power to master) and make Glacial heart a new grandmaster zeal trait that causes either a 1s chill on symbol pulse, or a 2-3s chill on symbol generation. The first suggestion would give weapons like mace and sword a chance to actually stay on people, while the second suggestion would help with the “area denial” that was originally spoke about in the definition of guardian gameplay.

There are other thoughts and questions I have, but this would be the starting point for me personally.

Peetee.9406:

Yes, please.

Can we karma train for the remainder of the match up so the PvErs can get their achievements done. Smaller queues benefits us all.

Fixed queues would be better, not being able WvW on certain nights because my entire guild gets in in 15 mins and i am stuck out for over an hour and a half is not cool.

dragon.8071:

Bash.7291:

Seriously though, this is pathetic. BG got one guild who once again, WAS COMPLETELY UNEXPECTED, and SoR throws a kitten-fit.

i agree that it was pathetic. especially the completely unexpected part. according to a zd post, bg approached and asked them. how unexpected is going after a guild to superstack?

ZD was apparently approached before the leagues, and had originally declined. We did not buy them, nor did we expect them to come over after that. But please keep trying to troll by taking the info given out of context.

We might have to build an ark due to the flood of tears in this thread….

Seriously though, this is pathetic. BG got one guild who once again, WAS COMPLETELY UNEXPECTED, and SoR throws a kitten-fit. I can’t count the number of times that SoR has said “we are in it for the fights, not for the points” then why does it matter who is winning or losing to you guys, get out there and freaking fight. It is even worse that you blame this one guild, despite the fact that the turnaround in points happened even before they came over.

Also, why do people feel the need to post the server status? WvW maps are limited no matter what in the first place. On top of that we also have one of the largest PvE communities along with TC, who is listed at very full just like SoR, despite not having anywhere close to the WvW numbers that SoR has. Unlike SoR though, TC actually still shows up to fight even though they don’t expect to win in points.

Shifty.4985:

ok, ive lost all respect now for oPP you litteraly have to group up in packs of 5 to then kill 1 person, then to top it off you /laugh.. -_-
Pathetic people in a pathetic guild

To be fair shifty, If I knew it was you, I would most likely do it too, as with certain other people i see trolling the forums or personally know :P

Ok I Did It.2854:

Big congrats to this weeks winners ZD guild and TC server, I wonder which one of you got paid more gold for the move/ throwing the match LOL,

Alas its good to see a guild on BehindaGate that like to battle open field.

BG the pay to win server LOL.

Hopefully JQ’s easy matchup will allow them to win the Season 1, then all that buying out guilds etc that BG did will be in vain gg, gg.

ZD wasn’t bought, and pretty much nobody knew they were even coming over. TC is not a server to throw a match, it is called lack of coverage, just like EVERY other server has compared to JQ/SOR/BG. And I find it funny that you call out BG for buying guilds, when JQ literally bought a guild off BG, pre-league and also got several others, but please keep trying to troll without any correct facts. I am assuming you must be from TW or IRON?

Obby Shards.9365:

FEAR & REV enough blobbing contact me in game for GvG 15v15 or 20v20 lets rock n roll baby

First time I have really been able to check the thread this matchup but… um what? You do realize that we only have about 15 people in WvW during our WvW nights, 20 being our record at once… I know the definition of a “Blob” isn’t very clear, but you might need to get your eyes checked. But thanks for acknowledging us as “blob like” threat anyways!

Beyonce.3207:

We fought with mostly PVE militia eager to get their achievement points.

Once you open the floodgates of PVE into the realm of PVP, you break the true PVP champions of each server from doing what they do best.

I know Anet is trying to please everyone. Sure, I got my Veteran of the Mist title and my key in the first week endlessly focusing not on my server objectives but my own. And I’ve been playing WvW since day one of GW2 launch.

Something is really screwed with this ‘Season’ concept. I pity those true PVP folks like ATM and GE and MERC who give their life for this game with brilliant fighting coordinate for server glory, only to be cut at their knees by the flood of PVE newbies clogging up their vital resource lines.

Not sure if you are aware… but BG has one of, if not the biggest PvE population in NA. If you don’t believe me, look at the Teq kills a while back. So please, don’t even try to play that card like your server was the only one suffering.

seanpenn.7364:

Gordok.2146:

2-1 happens all the time, two servers trying to spawn camp while flipping the lone paper tower and ignoring each other for 20 hours though is something else. Especially when they are getting wiped over and over because they are not the superior force but still come back holding hands, heck bg even waited for sor’s longer run back to our spawn to push each time. This also happened across all borderlands and eb at the same time. So congrats on the propaganda and to the SOR, BG alliance. Atleast we know who takes it in that alliance for future reference.

So troll this post how ever you want so that you can convince yourself otherwise but you made a joke out of your selves that will allways be remembered by all watching this season how ever it turns out. JQ did’nt choose the schedule but your two servers chose how you wanted to react to it. GG JQ and way to keep fighting regardless as allways.

Well said sir! We found out after game 1 that BG wears the pants in this Sor-BG relationship, while Sor likes to take it.

Hey, at least we are getting some, now shoo off to your lonely corner! :P

Avster.1935:

Tyaen.5148:

Avster.1935:

… you are not truly seeing our position. …

I disagree. I think that’s exactly what we are seeing.

IIRC the last BG/SoR/JQ matchup before Season 1 began, JQ came first with a 15k PPT lead from SoR who was second. But of course you guys weren’t even trying that hard right?

lol, yeah, because all the servers were totally queuing maps then like we are now right?

I honestly hope we somehow end up coming out tied coming into our last matchup, because its going to be really interesting to see. I can already hear the QQ of 2v1s because anytime a server gets in first all the focus is going to go on them lol

Brutus.5732:

Bash.7291:

Skoti.3195:

Bash.7291:

And JQ did the same thing to us to help SOR cap bay last night during NA in SoR BL… but please, keep complaining about something that every server has done to kill a WP…

2v1 in JQ BL started in early EU timezone, when bay was T2 without WP, so cut this crap please.

Been defending bay for 9h straight then i logged. Thanks for all the bags.

PS. To the JQ blob that was playing druing EU in JQ BL: It’s not polite to knock the door and as soon as the householder open the gate and welcome you warmly you run like a kitten chickens. Next time at least stay for a dinner.

Lets see… complaint about 2v1, thanks for all the bags comments, yeah gonna put this up as a typical forum warrior post. But good job completely missing the point that all servers have done what Brutus was complaining about, which was the only point of my post.

I’m not complaining about the 2v1. It may be a kitten way to fight but there are plenty of kittens out there.

My complaint is if you 2v1 don’t then pretend you are not a kitten and start spouting off about the great fights and how great and honorable everyone is. Its the same reaction I have to people ganking solos that get caught by a zerg and then /sit or /laugh. Congratulations, really….

Then don’t complain when your server does the same exact thing? We complained about it last night on TS, but we also said we knew it was because you both wanted it paper, which makes sense and we moved on and eventually re-capped it later.

Honestly, there is no such thing as honor when it comes to WvW because the best way to take things is to stab somebody in the back or kick them when they are down. The only time I will ever mention great fights or “honor” is when we get some good open field fights of the same size. Keep fights are never going to fall into that domain

Tyaen.5148:

Jedbacca.6297:

After about 20-30 minutes of setup and laughing and making fun of “the fat kid” who gets picked last, we rolled out.

You mean Rangers.

….ITS SO TRUE /cry

Skoti.3195:

Bash.7291:

And JQ did the same thing to us to help SOR cap bay last night during NA in SoR BL… but please, keep complaining about something that every server has done to kill a WP…

2v1 in JQ BL started in early EU timezone, when bay was T2 without WP, so cut this crap please.

Been defending bay for 9h straight then i logged. Thanks for all the bags.

PS. To the JQ blob that was playing druing EU in JQ BL: It’s not polite to knock the door and as soon as the householder open the gate and welcome you warmly you run like a kitten chickens. Next time at least stay for a dinner.

Lets see… complaint about 2v1, thanks for all the bags comments, yeah gonna put this up as a typical forum warrior post. But good job completely missing the point that all servers have done what Brutus was complaining about, which was the only point of my post.

Brutus.5732:

RobF.5864:

OOooh JQ in Bay Lords Room and BG standing on the portal for them….despite having a blob each. Awww bless em. Cosy.

They did the same thing last night. Fighting like kittens.

And JQ did the same thing to us to help SOR cap bay last night during NA in SoR BL… but please, keep complaining about something that every server has done to kill a WP…

Fuzzion.2504:

LostBalloon.6423:

:’( dont tell me we will be getting a divorce that will benefit JQ!

JQ has equal respect for both BG and SoR

On another topic, hows the lag ? and are there still ridiculous que times?

Worse than ever, and yes.

That pic is from 2 weeks ago at least (last time sor was red and JQ was green.)

I guess that’s what happens when you send your entire map blob to deal with 1 treb on NW tower. Best part is, you guys didn’t even kill the treb, and lost your trebs in NW tower because of it lol.

Brutaly.6257:

xFireize.6318:

I found the Zeal trait line is kinda lame.

I suspect that is why he think a powerful trait should be moved there. Its also why i think AH should be a virtue since it would weaken valor compared to other traitlines.

Yeah, pretty much, Zeal needs a boost, and our damage specs really need some CC to stay on people in WvW environments.

Oh yay! this thread again! I was originally going to go back and copy/paste some old suggestions, by why not start anew.

—Spirit weapons: Merge all traits into one line, having to dump 60 points to just get them fully up is stupid for something that isn’t even a strict class mechanic like how clones are for mesmers.
—Symbol traits: merge them and put them into 1 line, or just remove some. (symbolic exposure/zealots speed can both die in a fire)
—Completely rework zeal, move weapon traits to other lines (scepter to radiance, focus to… somewhere, maybe valor since it works with might on block?
—Somewhat rework on radiance, it has a focus on 1hand weapons and signets, but also has alot of dead traits, and also nothing that actually ties into the fact that it gives condition damage.
—Add CC to zeal, move glacial heart, make it effect all weapons, lower the CD and duration to make it apply more often but for lower times.
—rework traits/weapons for condition damage. Shattered aegis could cause bleed stacks, also possible traits for conditions on crit (most looking at 1h weapons in the radiance line with possible torment)

I would have to say of my most drastic suggestions would be to change the stat bonuses for lines. move condition damage to valor, crit damage to zeal, and condition duration to radiance.

This would allow for some better synergy among the trees, as alot of our conditions that don’t do damage reside in radiance (blinds,vuln) also it would work well with the 25 point trait radiant power. Defensive traits with conditions could easily be moved to valor, such kittentered aegis, shimmering defense, both of which would need changes to work (shattered aegis causing bleeds, shimmering defense rework to something like when you are crit or lose 10% of your health to an attack. if 10% I would say add a blind to it too, obviously with a CD) Zeal could easily use some damage boost to make it more attractive, and adding crit damage would be a great way to do it.

These are only some of the ideas I have, I really should post the rest of my trait changes I had started but never finished, would need a work through though with some of the small changes.

It made my sPvP build do a bit more damage… but otherwise no, its just not worth taking. Too many other traits in the Valor line outshine it such as Strength in numbers, Purity, Retributive armor. If you run burst guard it might be ok, but at the moment, that is not guardian’s strength in any playstyle, mostly because of what A-Net has done to to class in general.

Ill just repeat the same thing I have said… I don’t know, like 20 times?

Lower the CD to 10-15 seconds, make the effect for 2 seconds, make it effect all weapons, move it to zeal.

Caroline.4987:

Fun times in TCBL tonight! Wiped a few, and we wiped a few. Haven’t seen you guys try to deblob in a long while. =3 It was interesting.

Thank you OnS, PLX, REV, Work, ZN, Agg, Leet, NS, RATS, S…was it SF/SG? I forgot…for all the fights. If I missed a guild that was running organized in either the JQblob or the BGblob…uh…sorry!

Now…we just gotta work on you guys coming at us one at a time. We need to empty our bags and all…=S

Honestly we(Rev) were looking for groups our size to fight but it was kinda hard. Between the Rats ankle biting swarm, AGG and you guys, it was hard not to join up with another guild every now and then. Not saying anyone was blobbing to any degree, Just that the other guilds were fielding more than us

Honestly, It has been a tough week. Last time we fought it was great due to fighting several guilds our size, this week however its been rough to find the other guilds our size.

LOL. pop shelter and just start using every movement ability we have. Also, would make MI pretty freaking awesome for combos, jump to someone, heal them, and knock everyone away.

TheGuy.3568:

Relentliss.2170:

AgentChaos.4932:

^yes that effect is lost. and yes guardians got nerfed hard and people still saying ‘its perfectly fine’

Agreed

Its not fine.

Ohh no it’s not fine. We should continue to complain. I am not saying this in a bad or sarcastic way. The only way the devs are going to know what is wrong is if we are vocal about it and constructive. We need QoL buffs especially in WvW. A great deal of the reasoning behind why we do not have thing (no mobility because you bunker so well) are laughable now. Things need to change too many buff and fixes are heavy nerfs in disguise.

Have to agree, Guardians are pretty much the only class without a ranged option, the second lowest mobility class (next to necro) and the lowest CC class. Because of our low life, we have to spec insanely high into condition removal or pretty much just fall over dead, just because we have a few basic healing measures which REQUIRE us to go healing power to even use. while other classes have more health, better condition removal, and even better passive regen then we have, without going into healing power. Meanwhile other classes are actually getting buffs to these areas while we continue to receive nothing. Warriors get better shout healing, mesmers get AoE stability, Eles get our line of warding, thieves get an immobilize on pistol main hand.. because we all know they needed more ways to kite someone….

Guardians are honestly in a bad place now, not because we got nerfed, but because the only things we were good at, ended up going to everyone else too, while we have gotten nothing in return from patch, after patch, after patch. I think the only thing we have is the most tooltip fixes, which just went down the hole too with the latest patch!

Honestly, this patch gave us pretty much nothing, while taking away one of our biggest fights against the condition meta in the PoV “fix”

Instant cast meditations are ok, but still meh considering that smite condition was already only 1/4 second, and MI is too wonky to use anyways. The fury on them isn’t even close to being a good enough to waste a trait slot on, as 3s is pretty horrible

Glacial heart gets a buff, and still nobody will use it with a 30s cd. Also, WHY is it still tied to a weapon that already has our CCs? we have so many other weapons (mace/sword/every freaking offhand) that have no type of CC at all that could really get some decent play out of a snare.

Healing breeze is still a joke, plain and simple. same with hallowed ground as the CD is stupid long even with CD reduction. Also, anything that limits you to an area for that long is never a good idea outside of possibly bloodlust node fights.

I actually like the changes to purging flames as now you don’t have to dance over the line for the condition removal, and the added 20% lower condition duration is nice when stacking with other sources. But I can agree with people regarding the whole standing still thing as well.

There are others, but honestly the only thing we got that people might use is purging flame’s rework. Other than that, its another case of having to bunker harder as everyone gets buffs and we get “fixes” that push us further and further into the hole.

It honestly isn’t worth it, 4s on a 30s cooldown that only works on one weapon doesn’t compare to other traits in the line. If they say, lowered the duration to 2s, ICD to like 10, and made it work with every weapon, we would have a serious trait consideration, as it stands, though….

Ryan.8367:

AgentChaos.4932:

you forgot pov needs to remove 2 condis again

It was always meant to only remove 1… It was a fix… Alot of classes got fixes , mesmer’s duelist got fixed , sigil of para was fixed as well… Please do not tell me you didn’t see this coming? It has been in the guardian suggestions for fixes for like 4 months.

That doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt guardians who are already having issues with the condition meta. Now we have to give up even more offensive stats to deal with conditions, which once again is just pushing us further and further to the “go pure bunker or die” that they seem to want us to go to.

Also keep in mind you can put a target on people without being in a group now. really helps staying on them in the sea of clones. it will need to be re applied when they stealth though.

Vash, that gif needs a seizure warning attached.

Anyways, looking forward to the fights, had alot less zerging up last time sor was not in the matchup, and ended up having some good fights with the various smaller JQ NA guilds. Hopefully this time will be the same, as it was some of the best fights I have had in a long while.

Even after the whole transfer issue last week, I actually miss playing against JQ… At least we could find some decent small guild fights. This week has been nothing but running from blobs -.-

Treeline.3865:

Autoattacks does not work if nearing the range limit. Why? Is there any way to make this work? For example, you can hit the Golem Mk II boss from the edge of the platform, not risking the lethal energy fields. It is juuuust within range for the shortbow. But effectively I also have to spam the “1” button for the 8-10 minutes the boss is up. Is there any way of getting rid of this?

There actually is a reason for this. You are actually beyond the listed range limit for your bow. if you notice, bow shots arc, and actually travel slightly further than the 900 range, hence you still hit because the rest of the arc finishes just at the target, however since it is out of 900 range the game doesnt seem to pick up on completing the attack from the auto attack side of it. You can test it with SB #2, since that is a straight line, it fades out at exactly 900, so it will not actually hit the enemy, while any attacks you have that the arrow arcs in, will. I found out this little fact when trying to figure out how my ranger friend could hit further away from me with my scepter despite having the same range weapons.

Burl.9567:

The really funny thing is that so many on SoR knew this was coming a while back, yet MERC’s own members and their server mates seemed to be the last to know.

Why? Was Merc looking for buyers from SoR too?