Guild Wars 2

Or havoc with 2 Mesmers muahahahha use thief mobility with S/D and SB to start rooting people

Runiir, you are missing the point, Anet did this too themselves, they saw Noone especially thieves were not using traps, so they added Trapper Runes, still thieves did not use traps, so they removed the direct damage application of them, well aware of the Synergies they had implemented previously.

People complain about stealth instead of fixing the issue they give thieves reveal on hits, and give other classes to reveal thieves, people don’t use the reveal utilities, skills and items given to them because there are better ootions to use, they still complain.

Hell even now if you take out the Trapper Runes all together Thieves can use this build without any issues. Yes this is an abusive build yes it’s a stupid build, but it’s effective and has been around for quite a while.

Now they can fix this and have had 3 years to do so, either redesign stealth completely and not just band aids like revealed, Redesign the Thief Completely and spread out the Survivability into more traitlines, make more builds viable, but even then people have complained when thieves didnt use stealth outside of SR which resulted in unnecessary Nerfs.

Anet, did it to themselves to be honest, this is the crap Thieves have to deal with, hopefully this build brings attention and gets a redesign for the Thief class, I’m not just talking Buffs but actually fixing the class.

The thing is though, the thief doesn’t even need the runes to do the Ghost Thief build it just adds alot of synergy, you could use more condi damage to take it a different route, would just need to be more mindful of stealth

From a player that mains Thief and Mesmer, what Sticker has said is pretty much it, you will mostly find blinds mainly from 2 specs for Thief D/P and S/P, granted any Thief can have blinds do to traits and utilities.
Thieves are very vulnerable to any damage, they are like wet paper bags if caught outside of the initial burst.

Only counters are to anticipate the blinds and pop you condi cleanses when needed. The best is to bait then pressure with CC to limit use of blinds in the first place.

With Mesmers it’s a little trickier but same concept bait the initial Burst and dodge the initial Burst, since all Mesmer blinds are tied to CD through shatters and they have daze/ stun on shatter the blind is a little less spammy, they are bit harder to deal with than Thief due to better survivability and being one of the best 1v1 classes currently.

If you are against both l well I say find another piece of real estate away from them.

And the reason these 2 have so much blind and stealth is all thematics and fluff. Which all fits also its from the initial concept from the classes being masters of misdirection and stealth.

Lots of Issues.

And no fix anywhere in sight.

The second number of points I made were changes directly to thief not for other classes, sorry If that wasn’t clear enough.

The main way Ghost Thieves stay stealthed is using Black Powder which is one of the Pistol Skills and spamming Heart Seeker in it to stack stealth duration from the combo field, it leaves a red Aoe circle to enemies and has smoke in the middle of it, if you stand in it or put a minion in it, then he would hit you or the minion, causing him to reveal himself.

You can get Stealth Disruptor traps which need supply to be cause reveal in a large area. This was Anet wat of giving everyone reveal.

The two key ways for fighting Ghost Thief is reveal/stealth disruptor
Standing in the red black powder circle to make them reveal themselves and cc them.

These are the only ways to fight them effectively, now a way to get rid of this abusive play is for Anet to stop being lazy and redesign/balance out the Thief instead of nerf in everything into the ground and the results become these abusive troll builds.

Ways to eliminate these builds by changing thieves.

1. Have traps cause direct damage, enough to make traps be relevant and viable compared to other utilities.

2. Rebalance/Buff other trait lines to be more viable.

3. Spread out Survivability traits among other traitlines, which ties into number 2.

4. Redesign stealth completely.

*Or last but not least what every other class wants. Nerf everything Thief does and delete the class.

Funny thing is Condi Mesmers are one of the weaker mesmer specs currently. But yeah currently thieves are in a pitiful state that it doesn’t matter, but I either run my thief with 2 other mesmers or we run in a pack of 3 mesmers, one for each spec PU power, PU condi and so on…. the fear is real…..

Showbiz.9725:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Showbiz.9725:

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Showbiz.9725:

I cannot get Exotic Berserker or Valkyrie accessories. I don’t think they exist…cannot find any.

I have these on me but I made them myself from Jewelcrafting, so that’s one way to get them.

If you have Laurels lying around, you can also purchase the Ascended versions from the Laurel vendor.

I have 400 Jewelcrafting…what are they called?

The Berserker is a Ruby Orichalcum and the Valk is Beryl Orichalcum.

Oh, actually these are on the TP for about 5g right now. Not that bad. I must have been searching the wrong thing.

Side note, I just got a Grizzlemouth’s Weapons Chest (Ascended chest) randomly from ranking up in WvW. How rare is that? And how much gold/time would it have cost me to craft, lol. So random. Rabid doesn’t seem too good for Thief though

You can change the stats to whatever you need, just buy the appropriate exotic sigil on tp and mystic for it with other mats, you can find the recipe on the wiki.

Must be noted Thieves don’t need "OP"Trapper Runes to be “OP” it just kills bads faster.. for no condi removal or reveal options

The funny thing people in this thread don’t realise, that Thieves had direct damage on their traps, Anet removed it because Noone used the traps, now people use them.

I’m saying that when Anet changed the way Thief traps work and deal damage that they were fully aware what would happen, Perma Stealth has been neglected and they have not fixed it in 3 years.

Offair.2563:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Trapper

Read the 6th bonus.

Offair, What MUDS is saying is that Thieves do not rely on or need the Trapper Runes 3 sec stealth ability to stay perma stealthed, it is just an added synergy to the class, Anet removed direct damage from Thief traps because Noone would use them since they would proc reveal.

I main both Mes and Theif and condi is very weak unless against inexperienced players, even as a thief I don’t find too many issues with them, normally I figured either out after I die once and will be ready, but I run Signet of agility and S/D so most time I can keep condi off of me with my Generosity sigil

See the reason DD feels underwhelming is because it is a watered down rebranded version of what Thief had before getting Nerfed, because it was too “OP”.

^ this condi Mesmer is one of the weakest Mesmer Specs.

Most thief builds can’t 1v1 in the least unless they are more skilled then their opponent, or use Gimmicky Stealth builds which people QQ about because Stealth.
hell instead of changing the thief traps change the Trapper Runes themselves, would amount to the same thing, apply an ICD. Remember the Trapper Runes were in the game before the Devs removed direct damage from thief traps.

I could care less how they change this, I don’t use traps or stealth often so it doesn’t effect me in the least.

I’m not defending it, I have stated that if you want people to avoid abusing it have Anet make thieves have more incentive to play other builds, but every time that’s happened they got nerf ed and players defaulted to stealth since so much of the classes survivability is tied to it, as I said I run S/D but that’s from playing since launch I was able to adapt and even then I’m hardpressed since most classes have passive survivability built into their class that doesn’t suck compared to what Thieves have at their disposal. The only thing I was defending was when Thieves find some way to be viable and not a free kill everyone yells nerf, heck if Anet redesigned stealth overall and took a better approach I would be happy but everyone would still call it OP.

Until Anet offers a better option or tradeoff I don’t see it going anywhere anytime soon which is the sad realization. All I see people yell is nerf with no constructive way to make it happen besides just taking it away without actually balancing anything.

To say there is no counter play to this is a lie, hell 2 classes have reveal, there is a trap for reveal, you can actively sit in and make sure the BP stealth spam doesn’t go off, you can knock back out of SR, are things people like to ignore, you would think that with 4 classes that use stealth, 2 of them that use it so much more than others people would have a reveal or another way to negate stealth, but they don’t because there is a "better" option, if these classes and stealth are such a huge issue would you not run the reveal or counter play to it? No you would rather cry nerf. Yes Trapper runes and Ghost Thieves can be seen as abusive, so offer up a better alternative. But each class have abusive synergies that they employ.

Offair.2563:

@Meepey Stealth Trap is not an answer to this problem. Unless you sit somewhere on it waiting for perhaps a trapper teef to show up. I run lots of condi clears in this build. The problem is the perma stealth throwing conditions all over, think we both know its easier to apply then to cleanse.

Again im not bashing the thief but the abuse of the rune, thats the problem , not the class it self.

There are other counters to this play one of the biggest outside of Stealth disruptor, is standing in the small red aoe with smoke the Thief uses to keep stacking stealth. This will apply revealed, and if that’s too hard to do then idk what say I have never had issues against this style of player.

Chaba.5410:

Jana.6831:

Chaba.5410:

It’s already been qq’d about multiple times. No it doesn’t have to do with “being built around stealth” either. Your statement begs the question just what do you think engineer is “built around”?

Read a bit about thief traits – most of it is tied to stealth – take that away and thief has got no access to condi cleanse, regeneration, damage migation and so on.
Engi might have access to stealth but the class can well live without it, just like rangers and mesmers.

Not entirely true. If you make your build completely reliant on Shadow Arts, that’s your weakness. And you didn’t address my statement regarding thief having the best access to stealth.

So you are saying to completely ignore a whole trait line that is so let dependent on stealth.

Thieves have mechanics based solely on stealth, while Rangers and Engineers have access but not have it as a class mechanic that relies upon it, those two classes do not have any traits or skills that solely rely on entering stealth. While thieves need stealth for stronger weapon attacks, increased speed, regen, conditions cleanse, and so on.

It is a class mechanic for thieves, while it is not a class mechanic for other classes, now if they had whole trait lines dedicated to stealth then yeah they should have more access to it but they do not.

I get its not class vs class, and yes this is an annoying rune when paired with Thieves, but it’s not OP in any sense, to get rid of it being used so much they would have to provide other options or change the runes themselves, as stated earlier, the Devs removed the direct damage on traps well after trapper runes were released.

And as Jana said all the other classes with traps besides Thieves are built around stealth, Rangers and Engineers have access to stealth but they gain no benefit besides not being seen, unlike thieves where they have a whole trait line dependent upon stealth and gaining different attacks for being stealthed, so yes a rune which enables stealth on a class built around stealth will have fantastic synergy.

Really let’s see the only roles thieves have in Pvp are +1 (essentially a ranger pet), and Decap empty points. Hmm just because a class is in Meta doesn’t mean it’s OP. Since thieves die to any = skilled player on a different class.
Roaming in Wvw any class can roam in Wvw, you see thieves tack on as a +1 since they can immobile with their great mobility, but they need the party to kill the opponent.

If thieves QQ’d louder we wouldn’t be in the state that made this spec possible, people complained about stealth so Anet made thieves have a non stealth defense with Acrobatics, guess what people QQ’d that got gutted, and that spec relied on active play not passive damage mitigation to be good, unlike most other classes.

Point behind this, people in this game QQ when they get downed for not learning how to counter/ play a class that they claim to be overpowered, if trapper was so OP why do thieves not use it in Pvp or Pve? Because it’s not OP, it’s an annoyance. I main a S/D thief (since launch) I find stealth reliant thieves annoying but I learned how to kill them, it’s not hard, I told a guildy to stand in his small red circle, guess what he had a dead thief 3 secs later.

Now if you want to see an end to silly builds like “Ghost Thieves” don’t QQ when Thieves get a viable defense, I see more Classes go to the Thief forums and cry Nerf like no other, yet never see Thief players do nearly as much on other forums, so be pro active and instead yell nerf ask Anet to spread Thief Survivability to other traits and mechanics that don’t rely on stealth.

Arctarius.2649:

Mesmers are beyond Overpowered right now and getting even more so with the arrival of chronomancer. Not sure what’s to be done about them.. But thief is underpowered so fighting a Mesmer as a thief is just as easy as soloing Triple trouble…. All joking aside .. Anet please fix Mesmer. They need a nerd like all hell.

Mesmer is not overpowered, annoying, yes but not overpowered, most classes are able to kill Mesmers without any problems, Mesmers can nuke down Thieves, pretty hard but that’s mainly due to the Thieves unpowered design currently. Hell when Thieves were viable before June 23rd Mesmer couldn’t kill Thieves unless the Thief was afk.

Thieves are at a disadvantage vs most other Classes, you can work around that for help with conditions cleanse use the Sigil of Generosity, I can’t recall if it is in Spvp though.

It’s like with Thief, the play type is different than what they like and makes it harder for them to spam faceroll. So they claim OP and want nerfs.

IGN: Aliena Silverblade
Thief Type: Mostly Pve and starting Spvp and Wvw
Server: Sanctum of Rall
Experience with Thief: Played since Launch, have taken big breaks in between, just now getting back in, have ran S/D religiously since launch. But trying to branch out into Pvp and Wvw more, so looking to better learn Thief from that aspect.

Because that would entail Teefs getting something beneficial, and everyone will complain more about Teef Op’ness

BraxKedren.8941:

Smollett.6270:

Hi Karl!
Do you know, that we are the only class who doesn’t have 1200 range weapon?

Scepter?

But with the Bow DH gets they have a weapon with1200 range. Which means Thief is the only class without a 1200 range weapon.

Ah I see. Thanks for the input.

If you don’t mind me asking, why is Shatter bad for Pve?

Does it still revolve around Zerker stats?

So I have not played my Mes in close to a year now, and coming back from a big break in the game.

My question is twofold, are Shatter builds still Viable and if so in what Gametypes?

Hi,
So I was wondering haven’t played my thief in ages, I am about to start crafting Ascended for my thief, would Assassin’s in Head, Chest and Legs and zerker in every other slots be a solid choice, and is it the current min max for thief dps like it is for a few other classes. for a power based build?

So I Am running a dps guardian, and the gear I am running is Saphir head, chest, and legs the rest Zojja’s/zeker. With strength runes, what would be a good Build using GS and Sw/F and Sc/F.

Oh no worries this input is good, I have played most classes but main a Mesmer and Thief, those two classes are the only ones I see people give grief over in hot join yet when compared to the wars engi and guard mechanics, it is blatantly obvious that the guard and war in that match probably are not that good and that’s why they complain.

Stealth on one skill on one weapon ooohh so op it last 4 secs iirc

But compared to even a crappy thief, war, or engineering the mesmer has no defense and hardly any mobility besides blink while rose classes alone have multiple snares. The only way the mesmer can steam roll is if they catch someone already engaged or is a complete scrub and doesn’t evade when the clones all start running in towards them. And most other classes have higher burst and actual burst aoe.

SilntNight warrior how are mesmers OP the main 2 builds used now are PU and Shatter, the shatter relies on Power to have any effectiveness and relies on a quick gimmick of BF and shattering which effective mostly to squishy classes and PU which is effective if the opponent doesn’t run cleanses. Before April 15th Mesmer were on part with majority of classes now they are one of the weakest out there.

Yeah I run a basic shatter build but mix it up with a phantasm build when I’m feeling froggy. Before I left the game I could see Mesmer being OP but after all these updates it has been pushed into the ground unless you were a decent mesmer before hand

So I was peacefully enjoying a nice match in Forest of Niflhel, and all I read in chat was how OP the mesmer was, yet as being a Mesmer main it astounded me these claims were coming from a Guard and a War, is it just they are kitten players that do not have any concept of how to play their class and counter the weakest class in Spvp, or is the Mesmer really that good outside of Tpvp?

Took a 3 month hiatus and I was wondering what the current meta is for Mesmer, have been hearing mixed on PU or a shatter build. Does anyone have any input on the meta and any decent builds for both that I could base my mes off of?

Is it bad that I am a mesmer and abuse this on other mesmers???

Rag.3258:

While we are at it, lets yell at guild mission exclusive ascended trinkets as well.

There are no guild commendation only ascended trinkets it takes 12 commendations for just the accessory slot trinket which you can also buy with laurels plus 50 echos so please get your facts straight, thanks

MisterEction.9382:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Again entitlement is the fact of having a right to something, people complaining about Arena net taking a item set they said was exclusive to a certain race and making it available to every race is not an example entitlement, an example of entitlement are ppeople saying that since they just play the game and saying they have the right to that exclusive item set on a character that is not the race it is exclusive to.

Actually, those that bought the item are entitled to it. Entitlement, despite its use by a certain segment of the political spectrum as such, is not a negative word. What you’re looking for is the phrase a “misplaced sense of entitlement” and that doesn’t apply to people who purchased something and are entitled to have it or entitled to be compensated for it in a way they feel is appropriate, not one dictated to them.

I was referring to the person’s initial statement, where he was saying misplaced sense of entitlement when referring to the people who were complaining about the release of cultural T3 being available to everyone, and then he tried changing how he was using the term. I’m not referring to the people who have already purchased the gear

Again entitlement is the fact of having a right to something, people complaining about Arena net taking a item set they said was exclusive to a certain race and making it available to every race is not an example entitlement, an example of entitlement are ppeople saying that since they just play the game and saying they have the right to that exclusive item set on a character that is not the race it is exclusive to.

Tashiro Kurosawa.7481:

Personally, I didn’t mind the flamekissed skin. My sister is actually really disappointed that it got taken out, she was planning on getting it at the end of the week. :\ Sure, so what if it was a reskinned and updated cultural armour? Nobody was twisting any arms to force people to buy it – if you liked it, you could get it. If you didn’t? Don’t buy it.

Seriously, I think some people have an overdeveloped sense of entitlement. The light (and the heavy, actually) were visually stunning, I really liked them. I wasn’t going to get them, since they didn’t suit my ‘theme’, but my sister was all over the light armour, and looking forward to picking it up as somewhat of a Christmas gift for herself. Ah well.

For one how is this over developed sense of entitlement? Entitlement is the fact of having a right to something, people being upset about the Flamekissed armor is not them being entitled to it, they were upset over the fact of it being a T3 cultural item with particle effects that any race and player can achieve with minimal effort and cost.

The players complaining about the removal of the item have a sense of entitlement, since they believe they should have access to it even if tthey do not meet the requirements for it I.e. being Human race, to obtain something Exclusive to being Human.

So before you start spouting of words you do not know the definition to and have no real argument to the fact, I would sit back and actually see why people are mad and consider what made them that way.

I feel like the majority of the Mesmer population, are human females. What is everyone else’s opinion?

I would love to stats on each class on race and gender.

barghest.3298:

Have to agree, they designed it for us mesmers

Still can’t decide on what staff to put this skin: berserker or rampager or even rabid for wvw.

Well Kasmeer is a Mesmer so yeah it was designed solely for Mesmer s