Guild Wars 2

Allison The Strange.4519:

Evan Lesh.3295:

That player must be pretty dedicated to get to rank 20 and Ruby division in 2 days.

There is an upcoming change that will help with the problem described.

1. Rank 20 is easy, I did it on an alt account already and it didn’t even take the full two days. Also he started 2 days prior so it was his third day of pvp.

2. He was emrald.

3. He was solo queued.

4. Fix your game.

You just got a dev response 10 minutes after you posted that addressed your concern and promised a fix. Did you really need to be a jerk with #4?

I mean holy crap…

Jaxom.7310:

Dahkeus.8243:

So, if queueing from outside HotM is so problematic, what about just making HotM a more interesting place to spend your time while queued?

Maybe add a jumping puzzle…more NPCs to fight…some other sort of puzzle/games…

I mean, you could probably meet with the people who designed the adventures and come up with some sort of interesting stuff for people to mess around with until the queue pops.

all that takes a bit of time, planning, dev, $$$

rather, think small, simple, and easy – a area for people to fight each other

wi already there to battle… so. problem solved

Pretty sure that would take time and money too since there’s the technical limitations of coding players to be considered as enemy targets when they’re otherwise considered friendly.

Maybe the same tech from guild halls that makes arenas work could be used here, but I have a feeling that solution is harder than it sounds.

However, I’d honestly be happy if they just tacked the Obsidian Sanctum jumping puzzle on to HotM and called it a day. =P

Tuthan.3250:

Hello all,

I am planning to make a new set of ascended, but i can’t decide what to make yet because of the upcoming balance patch. Between condi war, condi engi, thief and tempest, which of these will be great after the balance patch?

I understand that it might be a bit early to ask since the patch will be out on the 26th. However, it’s bugging me at this moment to get an anwser for it. Can someone please help? Thanks!

Engi is probably your safest bet and ele is your second safest since both of those professions aren’t changing much in terms of raid builds.

Condi warrior will probably get hit hard with nerfs… PS warrior would probably be solid though.

Thief could become worth bringing just for pure dps if the buffs are enough, but there’s nothing else to this class that’s really advantageous to raids, so I wouldn’t get your hopes up on this one.

So, if queueing from outside HotM is so problematic, what about just making HotM a more interesting place to spend your time while queued?

Maybe add a jumping puzzle…more NPCs to fight…some other sort of puzzle/games…

I mean, you could probably meet with the people who designed the adventures and come up with some sort of interesting stuff for people to mess around with until the queue pops.

Remember when Soldier’s was the default amulet for any new character when they stepped into the mists?

Oh how things have changed. =P

baylock.1703:

other than the mysterious staff damage increase seems fine xD i was once hit 12k by vault skill on staff staff secry xD

That vault won’t hit any harder after the patch. The damage increase is only on the AA.

circuitnerd.5863:

Try to lure them away from their traps. If you can’t, make sure their aegis is off first, then scorpion wire them to you. Only other options are ranged which is not great on thief or just run away.

Yea, you should actually never run scorpion wire. =P

This had some fun use in SkyHam, back in the day before the floor changes, but it’s really way too unreliable. Even if it didn’t bug out on you half the time, it’s a slow projectile that can miss, is easily dodged, and is vulnerable to any other anti-projectile hate.

A pure duel between you and a DH is the only situation I can think of using it and even then it’s still sketchy as hell.

Thieves aren’t in a good spot for 1 v 1s, especially with the new elite specs. However, here’s some basic tips for engaging with the new elites overall. Ideally, you’ll only encounter them when you +1 a current fight.

Dragonhunter – Their traps will blow you up fast. Dodge through them and use your stunbreaks/shadow steps liberally to escape them. Avoid stepping in them as much as possible in the first place though. They still have a lot of blocks, but the biggest to look out for is the one with a big bubble shield in front of them. This is the new version of their aegis virtue. Just wait a few sec for it to go away. Also, if you see them on a point by themselves, they probably have traps already set under their feet.

Tempest – Pretty much standard ele, but they will now raid down a lot more AoE with overcharged attunements. Avoid AoEs or use trickery-traited steal to interrupt a channel (trickery is needed so you can go through stability).

Druid – Basically a heal-heavy ranger. Pets generally hit harder now, so be careful of them. The smokescale, in particular, will knock down and do an evade multi-attack skill, similar to Unrelenting Assault on revenant. Dodge if this is used on you. Beyond this, watch for them to go into celestial form. When this happens, either stun to shut them down or wait and burst them when they come out of it.

Reaper – Lots of AoE pressure, especially when they’re in their new shroud form. Avoid them in shroud, but shut them down with interrupts outside of this to prevent them from shrouding. A strong CC chain can obliterate them, but if you miss for a second and let them shroud, you may as well run and reset the fight until they run out. If you catch them below 50% and are using D/P, you can steal -> AA once -> headshot -> Impact Strike/Upper Cut/Finishing Blow chain them to finish them off. Just make sure they’ve used their stun breaks already (usually 1-2).

Scrapper – They’re very tanky and can block with hammer. Don’t blow too many cooldowns trying to burst them down since they’ll likely Elixir S or stealth with gyro when they get to low hp. If they use stealth gyro, swap to shortbow and shoot the gyro since it will bounce and hit them too. Also, be aware that they can put revealed on you for 6 seconds, so always have an escape like shadow step ready if they focus you.

Chrono – Bunker chronos are full of evades and blocks. Don’t attack during the big purple bubble block, but use stuns to shut them down if you have a teammate to focus damage on them. This build will be killed off on the next patch though. Beyond bunker chronos, just watch out for gravity well (big CC chain well) and if they use Continuum Split (you’ll see a floaty chain object on the ground when this happens), don’t chase them. Instead attack the object or just run until this runs out. This basically allows them to use all their cooldowns for a few seconds and then return to the place where they cast it unless that object is killed. Their health and cooldowns are reset to the way they were when they cast it when this ends.

Revenants – Save dodges for Unrelenting Assault. This is the sword skill where they port all over the place attacking while evading at the same time. Outside of this, revs are generally one of the easier targets. Just be careful of condi-based revs since they can stack a lot of torment. Don’t overcommit to downing them since most will have the trait that makes them block for 3s and regen health when they get to low hp.

So much ego in this thread…

Funny since it’s rarely ever worthwhile to engage in a 1 v 1 in high level PvP as a thief anyways. There’s almost always something you’re better off doing instead, such as bursting and finishing off an even fight somewhere else so that you can win a contested point or decapping an open point. Fair fights are for schmucks. The best part of playing a thief is not having to play fair.

SlayerSixx.5763:

Dahkeus.8243:

SlayerSixx.5763:

Question. Nobody has mentioned how all of these unlockable effects screw over guard the most :P. Or has guard simply faded into the background cuz traps op?

You mean like this guy?

laquito.5269:

Every time thief buffs are announced people go ham and whine their kittening kitten off in here. Thief never really had issues with mesmers to begin with and now OP wants to make us believe that it’s BV which will push Thief over the edge?

In reality whether you play with BV or not is completly irrelevant, cause you should be able to win against Mes anyway. BV is far more useful against Revenant, Guard and Scrapper than it is against Mesmers. It’s also only 2 attacks, not even a timeframe of unblockable attacks so this is clearly just another whine topic.

Either way, I think people are still blowing this out of proportion because they’re forgetting 2 things:

1) Impact Strike will still be the better elite.
2) BV still has a 1s cast time, so the thief will either have to be really lucky to catch you while you’re casting shelter or they’ll just have to stand around waiting for you to cast it before they attack anything.

Sure, there’s aegis, but that never mattered much for thieves anyways. BV has had 2 charges for a while now and even a thief without BV never had to worry about it since backstab doesn’t reveal if aegis blocks and bountiful theft makes your steals burn right through it.

Traps have nothing to do with this.

Honestly, revs probably are the most vulnerable since a thief can see them use Crystalline Hibernation, cast BV, and actually land it before it’s over.

What about basically ruining focus? BV and untraited SoW have about 4s between the two in terms of CD. The guard would usually blow SoW during a CC. Assuming the thief initiates with BV out of stealth after stealing aegis, that guarantees at least backstab landing before SoW is either broken or expires.

Also, I understand that the DH virtue shield is super cheesy, but what about severely reducing its effectiveness? Thief and guard have the same health pool and deal similar damage. Every hit counts in this fight. Thief can reposition repeatedly to kite the guard’s 0 mobility melee, but what can the guard do? Chrono has no place complaining since they’ve got, basically, all of the escapes in the game (in w.e proportions). If the thief bypasses their shield, they still have as much invuln as guard, teleports AND stealths coupled with a sizeable amount of CC to counter pressure with. Guard gets all ined and a thief that simply waits out shelter can pretty much place a backstab+HS very quickly.

Also, don’t misunderstand. DPS guard will still be one of thief’s toughest matchups, especially if they’re running DH with traps still punishing people who try to go melee VS the DH. I just want to know why all the unblockables…? Why not just reduce overall blocks (not that guard had too much of to begin with) instead of introducing something like this? Next, they’ll introduce skills that go through evades/invulns/blinds because they simply don’t want to go through the process of properly balancing every class’ resources x.×.....

Not sure what you’re getting at. Yes, BV can still be a strong counter to some guard skills, but as you said, DPS guard will still probably be a counter to thief as it historically has been.

If I were you, I’d be more concerned about warriors getting beefed up. If they become viable, Sig of Might + Rifle will tear guardians up. I mean, it does now, but you probably won’t see this much considering how many warriors are out there right now. 6 seconds of attacks, which can include CCs is a lot more brutal than 2 attacks with a stun you can break, especially considering that they can activate theirs instantly whereas the thief has a 1s cast time (along with almost double the cooldown).

Junkpile.7439:

I would like to see some team use 5 scepter/dagger eles.

Yea, I can pretty much outline how that game would go:

The eles would 100-0 a target instantly…then, they’d get wiped while the single downed target gets revived.

Thief in 1 v 1? You don’t really want to 1 v 1 in PvP. Thieves excel at making fights unfair. Even if the next patch buffs the class so that it can win most 1 v 1, you’re still often better off swooping in to +1 fights and decap points.

Vague Memory.2817:

I predict PU Mes will come back with an avengeance after these changes. Been a while since I used it.

Yea, PU was never much more than a troll build in sPvP. It may come back to WvW to some degree, but PU hasn’t really gotten any better since the big stealth duration nerf.

SlayerSixx.5763:

Question. Nobody has mentioned how all of these unlockable effects screw over guard the most :P. Or has guard simply faded into the background cuz traps op?

You mean like this guy?

laquito.5269:

Every time thief buffs are announced people go ham and whine their kittening kitten off in here. Thief never really had issues with mesmers to begin with and now OP wants to make us believe that it’s BV which will push Thief over the edge?

In reality whether you play with BV or not is completly irrelevant, cause you should be able to win against Mes anyway. BV is far more useful against Revenant, Guard and Scrapper than it is against Mesmers. It’s also only 2 attacks, not even a timeframe of unblockable attacks so this is clearly just another whine topic.

Either way, I think people are still blowing this out of proportion because they’re forgetting 2 things:

1) Impact Strike will still be the better elite.
2) BV still has a 1s cast time, so the thief will either have to be really lucky to catch you while you’re casting shelter or they’ll just have to stand around waiting for you to cast it before they attack anything.

Sure, there’s aegis, but that never mattered much for thieves anyways. BV has had 2 charges for a while now and even a thief without BV never had to worry about it since backstab doesn’t reveal if aegis blocks and bountiful theft makes your steals burn right through it.

Traps have nothing to do with this.

Honestly, revs probably are the most vulnerable since a thief can see them use Crystalline Hibernation, cast BV, and actually land it before it’s over.

shion.2084:

I never have much luck with PUG’s and multi ranger teams either…. add them to the list

I actually found that I had good success with double druid teams. Just have one druid on home and one on far. They bunk well and have good decap abilities to keep the point in your favor.

After the balance patch however…we’ll see. It’s possible that this could become even stronger with things like the Mender’s Amulet.

raven.9870:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQNAU5enMdA1dgdhAmkCElilrATJH06qBIBgEQq7d0maftA-TZBCABUcBAu4JAAwBBA/9HcvMAA

hi all, what do you think about this build? after the patch will be weaker since they will eliminate runes of durability from pvp. but it’s work well with other runes aswell

There’s nothing really tanky about this build…

• Rifle without Crack Shot is weak, especially after the change to boost its adrenal gain.
• You’ll want Cleansing Ire if the balance changes announced stick.

There’s several other trait choices I don’t entirely agree with, but it’s not worth nit picking considering how many unknowns there are.

Onisuo.8607:

insanemaniac.2456:

Onisuo.8607:

Pvp participation is at an all time low,

back up your statement with hard numbers or dont say it

Just my observation as a frequent Spvper since December 2012.Don’t have to take my word for it, everything you read on the internet should be taken with a grain of salt.

Been PvPing just as long and I’ve observed the opposite. The FtP change for the base game brought in a lot of people and after HoT the population has stayed pretty high. Leagues seem to have also made a big impact, despite all their faults. The only dropoff I’ve seen is some players who are happy with the rank they’re at deciding not to PvP anymore until the next season.

Xiahou Mao.9701:

Dahkeus.8243:

Not only will the power of this skill become more pronounced once people start actually seriously playing this profession in PvP again, but it will also be the only fast cast spike in the game after the quickness spike nerf.

Don’t forget, too, that Impact Strike itself will likewise be bolstered by Quickness. Thief doesn’t really have a lot of ways to generate Quickness on its own, I don’t know that many people are going to be running Haste on their bar, but a good coordinated team with an ally who can drop Quickness on demand can bring about some fast and brutal Impact Strike stomps. And maybe some of the top players will be able to make Haste work, too. It’s still a stunbreak at the end of the day, and with improved auto-attacks Quickness will no longer be as much a DPS waste as it is now on a Thief, compared to say a Revenant…

Yea, in theory quickness would be great with impact, but I don’t see it happening often aside maybe from very organized groups and even then, we may see less of this with bunker mesmers moving out of the meta.

Haste has gotten a lot of love, but it’s tough to replace the current utilities that thieves run. This is one of the many reasons why venoms builds never made it to meta. =P

It’s too bad Trickster competes with Bountiful Theft. The stab stripping steal is just too good to give up…

Shadow Step is pretty clutch for any fight involving a DH as well. However, S/D seems like it would be pretty tough to pull off. At least with D/P, you have a lot of shut down capabilities.

Either way, I’d honestly advocate avoiding this 1v1 regardless and only start focusing a DH once they’re engaged with someone else.

reikken.4961:

yes, experience was most definitely the biggest issue

I imagine this would be the hardest part of making a successful thief raid: Finding 10 players who are both experienced with raids as well as experienced with playing thief.

brannigan.9831:

nearlight.3064:

Well, reapers will be able to just press 1 a bunch of times to convert resistance to chill and proceed to sit on mallyx’s face, so yeah.

The last time I checked there were more then 5 classes what if you don’t have a reaper? Thats the problem with hard counters there bad. We need a game where you can run mostly whatever you want class wise and have a chance at countering just about anything. Otherwise the game is a gigantic failure. This game has always been a joke diversity wise when it comes to builds. You can’t have it where any class is needed over any other or we might as well just cut the number of classes available to pvp with to five.

It’s not really a situation of just having 1 hard counter though:

1) Reapers – ofc
2) Thieves – as mentioned
3) Warriors – With them getting buffed, this is another heavy burst class with a lot of CC
4) Scepter eles? – It’s possible the changes will bring this back.
5) Longbow Rangers? – Another build that may return, which would be a hard counter.

And beyond that, let’s also take a step back. One of the biggest boosts to condi rev is the heavy boon strip. This is amazing right now because boon strip is clutch to working in a bunker meta. However, there’s big nerf coming to bunkers overall, there may not be as much of a reason to bring a mallyx rev in the first place. =P

dDuff.3860:

As long as you have “mug” trait and BV already being cast, does it mean that “steal” will become unblockable ability going through, say, crystal hibernation from rev, or engi hammer #4 block, or guard’s shelter?

I don’t see why it wouldn’t. If you have Bountiful Theft, the boon steal applies before the Mug hits, so you you can still damage a target with aegis.

And while this sounds great in theory, I doubt you’ll see this happen a lot. BV still has a 1s cast time, so you’ll have to predict when the enemy is about to do this or just get really lucky. Crystal Hibernation is the one exception, but you’ll only catch the tail end if you cast BV as soon as you see this happen.

Hmm, I’d be very surprised if this wasn’t possible in an all thief group, but I doubt you’ll see this happen with this type of group. Aiming to have dedicated rez duty just sounds like a pretty bad chance of success from the start, even if you didn’t actually get the “ninja nurses” you wanted.

I gotta admit, a lot of the problems sound like experience was the main issue for the group. The damage in the fight isn’t that bad, particularly if your group can handle seekers well. I’m not sure what strat you used to handle these, but I could imagine these were tough to entirely avoid as thieves don’t have reliable ranged knockbacks like you can get from warriors, engis, mesmers, eles, etc.

Even just the occaisional clipping of seekers can add up to make it feel like you’re taking a lot of AoE damage, which is often the difference between new and experienced groups.

kdaddy.5431:

Total joke but best yet was more guns then roses ran the double warrior and thief. Great balance within the game in the match i think we can all say.

Yea, that game made my day. Too bad they got 500-0, lol.

Btw, does anyone know if someone from More Guns has spoken up as to why they ran that comp? Were they just messing around, figuring they would lose anyways or were they seriously trying this as a counter strat?

Lots of talk about BV here.

And yea, it’ll make BV good. I think this will make base thief at least viable and it will serve as a good skill for people learning to play thief…

…but, I don’t see BV beating out Impact Strike as meta. IS is already game changing in the hands of any thief that knows how to time this right. It may not seem that way now since there are so few experienced thieves maining this class and most of the thieves out there don’t really seem to know how to utilize IS to its full potential.

Not only will the power of this skill become more pronounced once people start actually seriously playing this profession in PvP again, but it will also be the only fast cast spike in the game after the quickness spike nerf. Anyone who played a bunker mesmer with quickness spikes can probably speak to how much of a difference this can make in a team fight.

Thieves are still squishy and it still make not be a good idea for a thief to do the spiking in a lot of team fights, but with the BP aftercast removal, you could certainly start casting BP, steal to enemy, and then IS to land a spike on a foe with the cover of a blind field.

So, with the rifle changes, warriors may no longer be a class that needs to be in melee range…

Ya, the biggest changes I saw with regards to defense are probably from the changes to rifle. I’m predicting that rifle will be a staple of any warrior build going forward. The immob + evade on Brutal shot is huge. The adrenal on Cracked Shot also fixes another weak spot for this weapon so that you don’t have to rely on melee for adrenal gain as much.

In other words, simply being able to stay at ranged more will be a big improvement for staying alive.

Will this be enough? Who knows. Maybe warriors will still be fodder. I still think that thieves will have the upper hand in most fights. Projectile hate could also be too strong for any advantages of rifle to really make an impact. It’ll be interesting to see what happens though.

Shirlias.8104:

As thief DD S/SB i can’t handle a good Scrapper.
To me is a good counter for thieves. More than DragonHunter.

And cause no nerf will come with the new patch, i really doubt that “regen on dodge” or “more dmg on autoattack” will save me from a scrapper. Due to mention, Sigil of Energy nerf ( which is ok, but still not a good spot for 1v1 as thief ).

Well, that’s an easy fix. Switch to D/P. Blinds are your friend and D/D is especially weak with the introduction of all the block skills that HoT introduced.

@ Jourdelune: I think you’re putting Revs pretty high up for a class that’s going to be really vulnerable to burst in a burst heavy meta after the Facet of Light nerf.

Nocta.5274:

The Impact strike vs BV choice will come down to what you play against. Just change it depending on the number of potential block you face.

In a meta with lots of necros and druids, I’m not sure BV is better than IS, even as unblockable.

From a pure 1 v 1 perspective, maybe, but in a meta where there’s no quickness stomps, I don’t think there will be any question at high level play. I think BV will be the best choice for lower tiers and for newer players since it will allow you to get the upper hand in fights and is a lot easier to use. However, once you get skilled at using IS, you’ll be able to land insta-spikes more often which are completely game changing.

A druid/necro meta will push this even farther. Necros in particular are very vulnerable to CC and nailing that burst + CC with IS at the right time will completely down them before they can even shroud.

I think zerk longbow will definitely be able to chew through a lot of players, but considering how many projectile defense/reflects are now in the game in the post-HoT world, I don’t expect this to ever make a top tier build.

P.s. as a side note, however, it would be awesome to see a ranger spike team comp a la GW1 come back. I could see it now “1, 2, 3 SPIKE!” and then 3 rangers cast a might stacked Rapid Fire against one target, lol. Too bad there’s too much invuln for that to work in GW2. However, a venom share thief with the new basi venom could allow them to surpass blocks…hmm…

Eh, I don’t have that high of expectation for engi. They are one of the classes currently riding the wave of using a glassy amulet with Durability runes, which are going away. I don’t think this will break the class or anything, but I think this will keep them from hitting the absolute top tier.

Cynz.9437:

As long as devs think thieves are extremely strong (taken from dev stream few months ago… cringe) it won’t happen….

Thing is, a team with multiple thieves is bad regardless of how overpowered or underpowered they are.

Eh…Pistol Whip is a tough thing to balance. It’s always on the edge of useless and being an overpowered, cheesy, spam win button.

As for BV, I’m glad to see this change. Hopefully this will make some viable base thief builds…

…but swooping in out of nowhere and nailing an enemy trying to stomp a downed ally with Impact Strike to then rally the downed teammate is such a fulfilling feeling. Even if BV was buffed to the point of being better, I don’t think I could give this skill up, lol.

So, I know that there’s logic in the matchmaking system that tries not to stack too many of the same profession in the same team, but could we get something that emphasizes this for certain professions? I mean, 2 thieves is much worse than 2 revenants and this is something that stays true across all metas. The same could really be said for mesmers (except for the current bunker builds that are going away 1/26) since they’re also glassy roamers.

Anyone else on board with this?

Eh, best part of today was More Guns than Roses playing double war, thief and DH in a group…

…and then getting wrecked 500-0.

Sorel.4870:

Dahkeus.8243:

And post patch, I still expect Impact to be the elite of choice for meta, so I don’t think the basi change will make it meta or anything.

Even more so that dagger damage is being buffed, so the added value of Fist Flurry is even worse.

Good point. =P

I’ve seen it tried and while it can work to some success in solo Qs, it won’t become meta in pro leagues.

I could see engis come out of this pretty well. They were solid before scrapper and if this does end up being so good for thieves, their access to anti-stealth may work out well.

I could see Fist Flurry making it onto decent builds with basi venom maybe, but as it is, it’s a skill that you take for funzies. You can get away with it to some extent, but it’s not the best choice you can make.

And post patch, I still expect Impact to be the elite of choice for meta, so I don’t think the basi change will make it meta or anything.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Necromancer gets more corruption, thief should get more boon steal (ofc not to crazy, will be op otherwise, not on auto attack for sure). On Steal would be fine (1 boon steal by default).

Nah, I think it’s fair that mesmers continue to have the better boon strip.

With the amulet changes, I’m not sold on druids doing too well…

Thieves will be in a good spot, but I don’t expect you’ll still ever want to have more than 1 on a team. However, I do expect every team in leagues will go back to having one.

Urejt.5648:

are writing a book? i promise it will not be bestseller

You sir (or ma’am), made my day.

Ha, that gave me a smile.

i-ii supp pr qhs prn saltiness. hehe.

Eh…patch has me pretty worried. I honestly think that if thief didn’t get a single direct buff, we’d be in great shape. Considering that:

• Thieves were solid before the bunker meta hit
• The quickness stomp change now means that Thieves have the only fast stomp in the game.
• Mesmers, the other high mobility glass roamer, is getting hit hard with nerfs.

What worries me the most is that post-patch there will be a bunch of FotM reroll thieves queueing up, so solo-Qing as thief will be a pain since it’ll be tough to end up on a team that has non-thief teammates for a chance at winning team fights.

Syde.5961:

You should take a break when you hit a losing streak. Even a 3 game losing streaks warrants a break. They really pay off. You get in a better mind set and your mmr lowers so you’ll get better games.

Example A:

^ Good advice. There’s been plenty of times I’ve kicked myself for not taking a break when I hit a losing streak.

Unfortunately, I waited to really put in any games in the league, so now I’m trying to get in enough play to reach a good rank before the season ends…which doesn’t particularly help this, lol.

@ OP: Thanks for testing this!

I gotta admit, I’m a bit unsure about what I think on this yet.

From a PvE perspective:
This will be a great help to make Thief worth taking in raids, but if this makes AA dps better than backstabs, then it’ll be pretty sad to see Thief just AA to get max dps.

From a PvP perspective:
With the bunker/DH nerfs and everything, I’m not sure this was entirely needed. As long as this doesn’t swing us into the wildly OP direction though, I’m happy.

Ya know…Fleet Shadow may be a good trait for people learning Thief for the first time. Thief is a really fast-paced squishy prof and as a result can have a bit of a rough learning curve, so I don’t think it’s all that bad.

But I doubt Acro will make it to meta.

Tons of buffs here to thieves. Here’s the stuff that sticks out the most to me:

• Removal of tanky runes/amulets is inherently good for a burst class like thieves.
• DH trap burst nerfed
• AA DPS buffs
• Basilisk buff could make core thief a viable choice
• Thieves will now have the fastest stomp with Impact Strike after Quickness change

I think D/P is the biggest winner out of this, but just barely. This is both because of the BP aftercast removal and also because of the AA dps boost.

I’m curious to see how S/D compares to Staff after the changes. Considering the AA changes, I could see sword make a comback…

Yea, the next meta is definitely poised to be good for thieves. Hell, even if they did nothing beyond the sigil/amulet changes, we would be boosted to a top meta spot. =P

So, I think you bring up a good point about D/P, but I think that it’s been a while since it was a cheap, stealth-heavy weaponset and I think that was more of an issue in WvW. The SA traits in the past made this a set that could easily just abuse stealth so much that you didn’t have much reason to use it for anything else.

However, I think it’s evolved to be a more well-rounded weaponset. You can still play it to stealth for burst, escape, etc. However, you can also use it as a non-stealth dps weapon by relying on blinds for defense or you can use it as a shut down weapon in a 2 v 1 to keep an enemy locked down.

And totally agreed that P/P was mangled so hard. I mean, it was never a great weapon, but it was decent in the right area and it was at least viable enough to justify how fun it is to run around like a gunslinger, lol.