Guild Wars 2

Mystic.5934:

but the zones could still only be affected later in the year, even if megaserver came around sooner than that

Looks like it is later in the year now then.

Wanze.8410:

Malediktus.9250:

Wanze.8410:

No because lvl 80 zones wont be affected by the megaserver rollout until later this year.

later this year came quick. all zones are megaserver now

My statement still stands correct, though. There is little i can do about the way you interpret it.

Your statement did give a false impression that it would take a much longer time for level 80 zones to be affected by the megaserver rollout than they did.

However, I don’t blame you since you could not have known how soon ANet would rollout their megaserver throughout the game, at that time.

Rauderi.8706:

Mystic.5934:

yes it does. there will be lower demand for dyes, so they decreased the supply of dyes. unid dye price is pretty much guaranteed to go up to ~1g, but no one knows when that will happen, so it may be a very very long term investment.

Got over 300 in my bank. Waiting for when they finally get back up in price~

Unidentified dyes are going to be a long long term investment because so many people are hoarding it waiting for their price to go up. So many blogs and forums were asking people to do that.

Now we can only wait as the impatient hoarders slowly dump their unidentified dyes in the market, depressing the price.

Wanze.8410:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Brother Grimm.5176:

Ok I Did It.2854:

Wanze.8410:

No because lvl 80 zones wont be affected by the megaserver rollout until later this year.

So how’d that prediction work out for you, I see T6 blood has hit 48s each now.

Looking at TP Sell/Buy prices and Supply vs Demand, Ancient Wood looks fine, but Ori Supply seems to be steady while the Demand has gone up (but the price is relatively stable).

BTW, you mentioned Powerful Blood (not a node associated material as mentioned previously). It’s price in FACT spiked down a good bit after the patch went live and has since rebounded to pre-patch levels and while it HAS moved slightly higher since the patch there was a spike in demand (for some reason) and NO drop in Supply (your claim of a pending problem).

So far, I see no evidence that the Megaserver system has in any way “hurt” the overall economy in terms of farming nodes. Obviously, it’s not as easy as looking at GW2nodes any longer, but I loaded several characters into Frostgorge last night and they all hit the same nodes (once I located them by using MAP chat for 15 seconds).

I know I am farming less because I just don’t have the time to run around the map to look for the nodes. Previously it was so convenient to just use the website to go to where they are. Now, that website is mostly useless.

I assume I am not the only T6 farmer affected by this. But if you have lots of time to explore the whole map, sure, you are probably not affected.

I would argue that the mayority of common t6 mats is being generated by salvaging, not gathering, so this change might have a bigger impact on you personally than the general player base. Right now it also seems that there are more people in Orr and Southsun that werent there before. They might not farm nodes but will pick up whatever they come across, so theyfarm more ori and ancient wood than before.

So like I said, if you are someone with limited playing time and login just to farm the T6 nodes, then you would be affected.

If you are someone who have lots of time to join trains to kill mobs, then gather T6 nodes on the side, then sure, it wouldn’t affect you much. It is not that there are more people in Orr now than before, but because of the megaserver, you now SEE more people in Orr than before or any of the maps for that matter.

I think there too many hoarders for unidentified dyes, partly due to blogs like this one:

http://www.guildwars2tradingpost.com/2014/04/fools-selling-unidentified-dyes.html#.U1k3cPldV8F

So the more impatient hoarders would be dumping them, bringing their prices down over time. It should recover after a long period of time but we’ll see.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Ok I Did It.2854:

Wanze.8410:

No because lvl 80 zones wont be affected by the megaserver rollout until later this year.

So how’d that prediction work out for you, I see T6 blood has hit 48s each now.

Looking at TP Sell/Buy prices and Supply vs Demand, Ancient Wood looks fine, but Ori Supply seems to be steady while the Demand has gone up (but the price is relatively stable).

BTW, you mentioned Powerful Blood (not a node associated material as mentioned previously). It’s price in FACT spiked down a good bit after the patch went live and has since rebounded to pre-patch levels and while it HAS moved slightly higher since the patch there was a spike in demand (for some reason) and NO drop in Supply (your claim of a pending problem).

So far, I see no evidence that the Megaserver system has in any way “hurt” the overall economy in terms of farming nodes. Obviously, it’s not as easy as looking at GW2nodes any longer, but I loaded several characters into Frostgorge last night and they all hit the same nodes (once I located them by using MAP chat for 15 seconds).

I know I am farming less because I just don’t have the time to run around the map to look for the nodes. Previously it was so convenient to just use the website to go to where they are. Now, that website is mostly useless.

I assume I am not the only T6 farmer affected by this. But if you have lots of time to explore the whole map, sure, you are probably not affected.

Yes crafting is a lot more worth it now because of:

1. The wardrobe. Look at duffy and see for yourselves how many skins can be obtained from crafting and from new characters: http://dulfy.net/2014/04/17/gw2-fashion-collector-title-guide/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=gw2-fashion-collector-title-guide

Even those who have maxed crafting are building new characters using crafting for leveling and unlocking new skins at the same time.

2. Lower tier crafting materials are worth something now due to ascended crafting, etc. This is a little bit contradictory but think about it, lower tier crafting materials are not just gathering the nodes in low level areas, but many lower tier materials have to be salvaged. If you bring your level 80 to low level areas, chances are you would be getting higher level loot. The higher level loot salvage into higher tier crafting materials instead.

3. Karma. Completing the hearts and events again is a good fun way to earn lots of karma.

4. Recently there was a sale on character slots for a long time, so people are making new characters. This further drives up demand for low level gear.

Morsus.5106:

Sssssssshhhhhh The reason crafting is profitable is not everyone is doing it, so don’t spread the word!

There are people out there who still thinks that crafting is not profitable based on their past experiences a long long time ago. Let them continue to think this way, so we can profit. There is actually very good gold to be made just by crafting at low levels, quite unlike when the game was just released. The new wardrobe helps to drive this too.

But don’t spread this too much so we can keep the supply of crafted goods low. Keep telling everyone that crafting sucks and that they are better off selling their crafting materials to the TP than level up crafting.

Like this guy: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Is-it-worth-crafting-anything/first#post3945489

Behellagh.1468:

I believe we are all megaserver all the time now. There wasn’t any major technical glitches during the roll out and they expanded the megaserver balancing quickly.

And because of that, the old websites showing the locations of T6 gathering nodes have become somewhat useless, thus affecting their supply into the market.

Wanze.8410:

No because lvl 80 zones wont be affected by the megaserver rollout until later this year.

Are you sure about that now?

Note that it now costs 5 laurels for 1 unidentified dye and they don’t drop from loot anymore.

Dye prices will probably go up after a month or two.

It is still far too early for dye prices to come back up. This is only what? The first weekend after the patch?

Also note that it now takes 5 laurels for 1 unidentified dye and dyes don’t drops from loot anymore. I guess it will go up after a month or two for this new reality to sink in after this initial influx of unidentified dye caused by the patch.

Mr. T impression: I pity the fools, who sell their unidentified dyes right now!

At least that is the impression here:

http://www.guildwars2tradingpost.com/2014/04/fools-selling-unidentified-dyes.html#.U1HPN_ldV8E

What do you all think? Is it foolish to sell unidentified dyes right now?

Mystic.5934:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Thanks for the heads up.

I have a feeling that something like this would happen after the big patch, so I downloaded all the items and recipes on Monday.

I’ll probably sound like a noob, but is there a simple way to download all the items and recipe details? /item_details.json and /recipe_details.json seem to only be capable of one item/recipe at a time, which would take a long time to get them all. I know about items.json, but that’s only the item_ids

Yes, like the others said, you have to download them one at a time, for now so it takes awhile for my script to download all of them and compile them into a local database or JSON file for me.

Thanks for the heads up.

I have a feeling that something like this would happen after the big patch, so I downloaded all the items and recipes on Monday.

0%. I will never craft a legendary until I can craft or loot a precursor.

I am not going to use the mystic toilet RNG or pay over-inflated prices. There are better uses for my gold.

I don’t think they have updated their server. If they have, they would have replied to assure us by now.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Not to be mean, but you should not post FUD…. Heartbleed could not effect the BLTP in any way. The bug you are talking about has nothing to do with this issue, so quit spreading this unfounded rumor (PLEASE).

Why not? If they can read the data in transit through ssl.

william dj.6953:

Gene Archer.8560 " We tell you that money making is out of whack, because people who put in equivalent work and effort into the game make less than those who put equivalent work and effort into the TP in certain instances."

True, I love exploring the open world but people in Fractals earn more gold than I do within the same amount of time.

They have no proof as I said there are a lot of contradictions in what they said. They want us to believe:

1. Playing the TP is relatively risk-free, doesn’t take much time, and yet yields lots and lots of free gold.
2. There are lots and lots of poor and desperate people in the game who can’t afford to buy basic items

My question is, why don’t the poor people in the game just play the TP whenever they run low on gold then? Nobody could answer that.

My conclusion: There are not that many poor people in the game. Most of the people who complain here are complaining about the price of luxury items like having multiple legendaries, instead of basic items.

Also that the TP is not as great a source of free gold, which is supposedly risk-free with almost no time investment, as they try to lead others to believe.

LordByron.8369:

DarkSpirit.7046:

The other contradiction I noticed in this thread, is that you guys say rich people are hurting the market and making life miserable for so many poor people by raising prices everywhere. Now, if it is so easy to be rich by playing the TP, then why are there so many poor people?
.

This is the best question possible…

The answer is the most interesting

Because other people play Guild Wars 2 and not “John’s Smith market tycoon”.
(remember the “play the way you want” that should mean a minor activity shouldn t nor profit 10-100X other nor influence other players playstile)

That still doesn’t make sense.

If it is so easy to make gold from the TP, as people here claim, then why can’t they simply play the TP whenever they run low of gold? Thus staying above the poverty line. If there are so many poor and desperate people, as people here claim, and the TP is so easy to earn gold from, then there is a contradiction.

The knowledge on how to play the TP has always been free. All they need to do is to google for them. Furthermore, people here say that playing the TP doesn’t require much time investment and it is almost risk-free. If it is such a convenient fountain of gold, why not people simply use the TP whenever they run low of gold? It is a contradiction in argument if there are so many poor and desperate players, yet have such a convenient fountain of gold in the SAME game!

It can any combinations of these reasons:

1. People are too lazy to google for information to make themselves rich? This is vehemently denied by people here.
2. The TP is not as easy to play or doesn’t earn you as much gold as believed?
3. There are really not that many poor people in the game as believed.

Bunda.2691:

Come on, let’s be honest now. There is next to no risk flipping many items, for example many blue weapons and trinkets. Now, it’s not zero risk, and it may be a bit cumbersome, and you may have to wait a while, and the profit isn’t always that great, but there is essentially no risk. This might change if more people enter the market, but as yet many of these items can more or less be flipped risk free.

When I first tried flipping I made some mistakes and lost some gold. I read forums such as this one and I thought it must be really easy to earn gold. All I needed is just pick any item, jump in and flip it and I’ll have 1000g in no time!

Wrong! But that has always been the impression that people here give that is so easy to be filthy rich, just go play the TP and you are guaranteed profit! That is a lot of BS and gross exaggerations here and those persists even to this thread. Either that or most of you guys don’t even know what you are talking about.

Sure, you can reduce the risk by analyzing the market for a week before you jump in. But that would imply spending some time to invest now would it? So how can what this guy says be true and yet be effective?

Nike.2631:

Farming monsters creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Map completions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Guild Missions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Daily/Monthly metas creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Event completions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Dungeon completions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
WvW ranking up creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Trading Post concentrates coin as a function constrained by how much coin you already have.

The other contradiction I noticed in this thread, is that you guys say rich people are hurting the market and making life miserable for so many poor people by raising prices everywhere. Now, if it is so easy to be rich by playing the TP, then why are there so many poor people?

All the techniques are learnt have been posted by free websites and forums like this one and many others that I am too lazy to list out:

http://www.guildwars2tradingpost.com/

The specific items to invest in may be secretive but they change based on market conditions anyway. But techniques themselves don’t usually change.

Therefore, this blame-the-rich-players thread is full of contradictions.

Aidan Savage.2078:

Wanze.8410:

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

There is no such thing as a 100% guaranteed profit from flipping.

There are…. certain items that do in fact guarantee profit. But like anyone else who has an uninvaded market on the trade post, I’m not going to spoil my own profit. I’ll simply confirm that they do exist. Smart TP players should be able to easily find the items I’m talking about too.

How do you prevent others from undercutting you when they see the same good deal? Once the spread becomes narrow enough, the item is not worth flipping anymore.

If you know when to stop flipping, you can generally earn a profit overall, but you need to monitor and you certainly can’t say that there is absolutely no risk to flipping like what LordByron is saying.

Because I dont stay in those markets until they run dry or start bleeding money
from me. I poke at them so they bleed enough money to suit whatever need I had at that time, and then I move on to other things and let the market recover. It’s remained stable for as long as I’ve been using it.

So they dont guarantee profit 100% of the time, as you claimed earlier.

100% of the time I’m in the market, they do guarantee profit. Granted, it’s a lose-lose situation for me. I cant reveal what I use for profit to show it exists, because doing so loses it’s viability for such profit for me, and consequently invalidates the fact it provides risk-free profit.

So the rest of you can keep denying such things exist while I continue making money out of them.

You took a calculated risk, but any calculated risk is still a risk. Being “risk-free” is a totally different definition. If it is really risk-free then it is guaranteed profit, if that is the case, you should be able to tell us and still get your guaranteed profit. Since you can’t, then it can never be risk free as, as you claimed, this is an open market. You are trying to avoid competition by not telling us, which means that competition is a risk and has always been a risk to you as market competition has always exist.

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

There is no such thing as a 100% guaranteed profit from flipping.

There are…. certain items that do in fact guarantee profit. But like anyone else who has an uninvaded market on the trade post, I’m not going to spoil my own profit. I’ll simply confirm that they do exist. Smart TP players should be able to easily find the items I’m talking about too.

How do you prevent others from undercutting you when they see the same good deal? Once the spread becomes narrow enough, the item is not worth flipping anymore.

If you know when to stop flipping, you can generally earn a profit overall, but you need to monitor and you certainly can’t say that there is absolutely no risk to flipping like what LordByron is saying.

Because I dont stay in those markets until they run dry or start bleeding money
from me. I poke at them so they bleed enough money to suit whatever need I had at that time, and then I move on to other things and let the market recover. It’s remained stable for as long as I’ve been using it.

Which points to what I said about knowing when to get out which requires some amount of active playing and monitoring. Certainly not equivalent to a risk-free investing.

Knowing when to get out because profit is no longer there is distinctly different to getting out because you dont need that amount of profit anymore. It’s risk-free because I do not stay and abuse the market long enough that the risk becomes tangible enough to impact it’s viability.

If there is really no risk then you why do you need to monitor? It is because there is a risk of getting caught staying there for too long right? You would never know for sure how long is too long. Also if you have really bad luck that one day, isn’t it still possible that many people can undercut you?

So how can you say that the risk is absolutely zero as in really “risk-free”?

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

There is no such thing as a 100% guaranteed profit from flipping.

There are…. certain items that do in fact guarantee profit. But like anyone else who has an uninvaded market on the trade post, I’m not going to spoil my own profit. I’ll simply confirm that they do exist. Smart TP players should be able to easily find the items I’m talking about too.

How do you prevent others from undercutting you when they see the same good deal? Once the spread becomes narrow enough, the item is not worth flipping anymore.

If you know when to stop flipping, you can generally earn a profit overall, but you need to monitor and you certainly can’t say that there is absolutely no risk to flipping like what LordByron is saying.

Because I dont stay in those markets until they run dry or start bleeding money
from me. I poke at them so they bleed enough money to suit whatever need I had at that time, and then I move on to other things and let the market recover. It’s remained stable for as long as I’ve been using it.

Which points to what I said about knowing when to get out which requires some amount of active playing and monitoring. Certainly not equivalent to a risk-free investing.

Bunda.2691:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

There is no such thing as a 100% guaranteed profit from flipping.

There are…. certain items that do in fact guarantee profit. But like anyone else who has an uninvaded market on the trade post, I’m not going to spoil my own profit. I’ll simply confirm that they do exist. Smart TP players should be able to easily find the items I’m talking about too.

That is bogus. How do you prevent others from undercutting you when they see the same good deal? Once the spread becomes narrow enough, the item is not worth flipping anymore.

You don’t, and he doesn’t really mean it’s guaranteed profit, just highly probable. .

He said “TP lacks risk…..”. How else would you interpret that? Does that mean I am probably going to make a profit even if I invest carelessly?

Like I have said, TP requires time to analyze and plan but some people here seem to think otherwise and you can just jump right into TP investing and make lots of gold from the air. Like him:

Nike.2631:

Farming monsters creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Map completions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Guild Missions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Daily/Monthly metas creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Event completions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Dungeon completions creates coin as a function constrained by time.
WvW ranking up creates coin as a function constrained by time.
Trading Post concentrates coin as a function constrained by how much coin you already have.

Aidan Savage.2078:

DarkSpirit.7046:

There is no such thing as a 100% guaranteed profit from flipping.

There are…. certain items that do in fact guarantee profit. But like anyone else who has an uninvaded market on the trade post, I’m not going to spoil my own profit. I’ll simply confirm that they do exist. Smart TP players should be able to easily find the items I’m talking about too.

How do you prevent others from undercutting you when they see the same good deal? Once the spread becomes narrow enough, the item is not worth flipping anymore.

If you know when to stop flipping, you can generally earn a profit overall, but you need to monitor and you certainly can’t say that there is absolutely no risk to flipping like what LordByron is saying.

LordByron.8369:

When you try to flip something you never lose 100% (10% maybe? while potentially you can gain 50-300%)

That is bogus. People who flip often can tell you that their sell lists is full of items that failed to sell, if they are honest. Why? Because competition comes in and people undercut when they see a good deal, until the item is not profitable to flip anymore.

When would that happen and when to stop flipping? Almost impossible to tell and when you placed the items in the sell list, you already lose the 5% listing fee. I have made many mistakes and lost gold playing the TP too, so you win some and you lose some. You can only hope to win more than you lose. But most of the time, you only hear about the wins when people brag in the forums, they keep quiet about their losses. There is no such thing as a 100% guaranteed profit from flipping.

LordByron.8369:

@DS
I won t answer to your lazy quote…read this forum you ll be disproven by TP players themselves as many time you want…

lol…then you have been taken in by their lies and brags. Every form of worthy investment carries an amount of risk, unless you are breaking rules (i.e. hacks, dupes, insider trading, etc.)

LordByron.8369:

Its really hard to discuss with people denying facts….

http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24714

Common tactic to derail topics…

I don’t get your point. I did not invest in superior rune of strength and don’t see its relevance.

If you are saying that flipping has zero risk then you obviously know nothing about flipping and price undercutting.

LordByron.8369:

As we all said its all about RISK/REWARDS…
TP lacks risk…..

Nothing could be further from the truth.

Ohoni.6057:

Maybe, but plenty of other players have spent hundreds, if not thousands of hours in the game doing other activities, and not made remotely as much. I’m not saying that every hour spent should result in exactly the same amount of reward, just as it would be impossible to perfectly balance every class against the others, but they should at least be reasonably close.

So what? Many other players have spent hundreds if not thousands of hours searching and experimenting with new strategies, developing tools, debugging them, testing them, fixing them, planning and analyzing TP data also. Why should those hours count any less?

@Ohoni: wall of text with over speculation without substantiating proofs

I like your round-about stretchy arguments and I especially like the part where people who are rich are evil and people who are poor are saints. Nice try….I guess only you would have known the hearts of every rich and poor GW2 players in the world. You failed to realize that not everyone who is poor is hard working and not everyone who is rich is lazy.

As long as there is one hard-working rich GW2 player and one lazy poor GW2 player, it would not be right to punish the hard-working rich player so as to reward the lazy poor player. You would have to convince us that no such situation exists or you would be suggesting an injustice.

Bunda.2691:

Well, let’s not go that far. Work is a bit relative, after all.

Speak for yourself, I worked hard for all my gold!

Essence Snow.3194:

The coin sunk might not be able to pave roads or build schools, but the increased sink could allow for increased rewards for the masses which would eventually find their ways back to the tp players. Thus the masses have increase satisfaction for playing the game…..ie….productivity and the tp players get to recoup increased taxes via a market which now has more inputs…ie activity.

1. You still have not proven how taking more gold away from richer players would eventually find their way back to the tp players.

2. I don’t see the purpose of taking gold from players who have worked hard to accumulate their gold into other players who don’t bother accumulating gold in the first place. Should lazy players, who don’t bother, be somehow rewarded for being lazy?

3. Why would there be increased satisfaction overall? What is the message you are sending? Don’t be too rich or you would be punished? Or are you just being sadistic when other people who have worked harder than you have, to accumulate all that gold, are brought down?

John Smith.4610:

This is not an acceptable comment and we will not spend time disparaging each others culture on this forum.

I do think it’s fair to say though that in many countries there is some unrest with the level of political power being wielded by smaller groups (note I’m making 0 value judgement on the concept itself, but it’s fair to say the idea exists) and this idea can sometimes be extended to an argument of wealth disparity. That unrest may be being projected into this environment, but I still see no evidence of that being an issue in GW2.

Precisely, if the richer players in GW2 have done nothing wrong, I don’t see why they should be punished. They worked hard for their gold and deserve to keep them.

Essence Snow.3194:

Again I have no idea why “punished” keeps being brought up. It is simply an alignment of methodology for the greater good of the economy and the sociological impact of such. It’s not meant to “punish” anyone nor would it.

It still is a punishment to the rich, no matter how you embellish it. Therefore, it will not be a fair suggestion.

Schizo.1375:

Let’s try to avoid emotional hyperbole.

Still haven’t proven why rich people deserve to be punished?

I can understand hating stingy people and people who cheats. But I can’t understand the hate for rich people since I personally know many poor people who cheat and exploit the sympathy of others around them. Rich or poor, there are good and bad people among them.

This must be the american culture. If you are richer and more successful than I am, you must have cheated.

Gathering nodes will be changed. You would need to explore the map to hunt down nodes instead of using websites/API. This would greatly impact supply of T6 material gathering.

What do you think? Will this happen?

MithranArkanere.8957:

DarkSpirit.7046:

[…]

You forget something very important.

Guild Wars 2 is a game.

It’s meant to be fun.

And doing those things is extremely boring.

I’ll be the first person to say that fun is more subjective than you think. Some people here have said that crafting is boring but I find crafting to be fun and I am making lots of exciting profits from it. Crafting is also challenging for me to come up with workable solutions. Most scripts like those in gw2spidy or gw2craft assume that there are infinite number of items at a given cost. It even says so on its website:

http://www.gw2crafts.net/

“This script does assume there are “infinite” of an item at a given cost, so if they all get bought up, or there is very few available during the update window prices may be wrong until the next update"

But I am proud to have written a better algorithm that doesn’t have to assume “infinite”. So I have essentially taken something that is suppose to be bland and boring and turn it into a personal challenge that is rewarding.

Sure, I am extending what crafting means outside the game box, but as long as I am having fun and not breaking any rules, who cares? I am not going to let you or anyone else tell me what is suppose to be fun and what is not. I believe I am more than capable of defining that for myself. I love solving puzzles and improving on how things can be done. That is my idea of having fun.

Essence Snow.3194:

KarateKid.5648:

Essence Snow.3194:

DarkSpirit.7046:

LordByron.8369:

Why not Diminishing returns on TP?
The more you buy/sell the more taxes you pay….every part of the game has it

That is already implemented.

It’s a flat tax not a progressive tax.

Oh, here we go. You said the more you sell, the more you pay. That is precisely what is implemented now.

Wrong person….lol……Mt Pelion was smart enough to figure it out.

Obviously we all know what he was talking about, but he didn’t express it well enough.

Essence Snow.3194:

DarkSpirit.7046:

LordByron.8369:

Why not Diminishing returns on TP?
The more you buy/sell the more taxes you pay….every part of the game has it

That is already implemented.

It’s a flat tax not a progressive tax.

If you want the tax to be progressive then you might as well limit the number of times anyone can use the TP since it is not worth using it when it hits near 100% tax. Are you saying that each account can only use the TP, say 5 times, and not be able to use it forever after that? If yes then you might as well close down the TP since it would be a ghost town and stop all other forms of player trading while you are at it. Everyone would only be able to equip what they loot.

I am up for that.

LordByron.8369:

Why not Diminishing returns on TP?
The more you buy/sell the more taxes you pay….every part of the game has it

That is already implemented.

MithranArkanere.8957:

You may think that’s being “smart”, but not everyone is smart. Some simply copy what others did. A trained monkey can do differential calculus with a computer. They don’t even have to know what they are doing.

But that is not important.

The thing is, if there’s one single way to make the highest income possible, people who doesn’t do that may be tempted into doing that, to the point that the other things you can do get less and less people.

Do you know why they changed Dungeon rewards? Because there was too many people doing CoF1 repeatedly. PEople trying to do other dungeons had a hard time finding people to do them.
Do you know why they changed world boss rewards? Because people went to the same world bosses over and over and ignored the rest. People ended up alone in some world boss fights.

Right now there’s not many people just messing with the TP, but after they reduce income in the next update, you’ll have people looking for the next “get rich quick” scheme, and google will tell them the bragging stories of these TP meddlers. It wouldn’t be a problem if there was many, because the more people tries to do it, the less it’ll work for all of them, but in the process, they’ll raise prices and mess things up for those that will not do that.

“Use or sell, but never both” is what works best in a game economy. It’s one of the reasons why gear is bound. Prices going bonkers because of reselling is also one of the reasons that got Diablo III’s AH closed. Peope used items they bought to sell higher, then with that gain buy even more expensive items and selling them higher, and repeat the process until they have insane 12 figure prices. Then a new player comes along, and they see those prices, and they see how much they earn playing, and notice the gap that makes them feel that getting items like those is a hopeless and futile endeavor.

If a trained monkey can do it then everyone should be able to be rich. I don’t see what the complaint is.

Furthermore if there is one thing that people can do to get rich and everyone does it, then that thing would balance out after awhile and not be as lucrative anymore. This happens automatically in the TP more than dungeon farming which ArenaNet has to actively nerf if that becomes the case for one particular dungeon.

I have no problems with people playing the TP and I personally find that fun, even though some people don’t enjoy it and tries to dissuade others from playing it. Some people find crafting fun while others don’t. Why should these people define what is officially “fun” and expect everyone to follow? Fun is subjective, just leave it as that.

As for prices being too high, there must be people rich enough for these prices to be realistic. If they are too expensive for you then either don’t buy them or farm more gold.

Gene Archer.8560:

DarkSpirit.7046:

So are you saying that if I have ever flipped on the TP, I can never ever be playing the game, and therefore do not deserve anything?

No, and if you have any reading comprehension whatsoever, you should realize that’s not what I mean. I don’t know how to possibly dumb this down any further for your old brain, but I will try.

When you’re playing the game, you deserve rewards.
When you’re flipping, you don’t.

So if you do events for an hour, and then flip for an hour, you deserve rewards for the hour spent actually playing the game, which would be the events, but not for the hour spent flipping, because that was an hour not spent playing the game.

I don’t know how to make this any more clear to you. I really kittening don’t.

In that case, it doesn’t matter if you are flipping or not, since flipping does not get rewarded so nothing’s changed. The only thing that would change your reward is playing the game.

Since I have played all aspects of the game, including crafting, I deserve to get ascended items while you are picky on what you like to play so you don’t deserve to get them. If you don’t like flipping, you don’t have to, since it is one of the poorest form of investment anyway.

If you don’t like people flipping then it is easy to get rid of them, just don’t sell instantly but create sell orders instead. Similarly, with buys. This would narrow the spread between the min sale and max offer prices to make flipping unprofitable.

The players who sell or buy instantly are the ones who sacrificed long term profit for instant gain. This then gives the flippers the opportunity to take a share of that longer term profit.

Gene Archer.8560:

DarkSpirit.7046:

If I have never played the game then where do my ascended items come from? They can never be bought.

Is my argument that hard to understand? Let me dumb it down for your old brain. I understand that it probably moves slower, given your age.

If you are doing events, you are playing the game.
If you are flipping, you are not playing the game.
During those times you are playing the game, by doing events, you should be far more rewarded than when you are flipping.

So, either flipping needs to, in some way, be brought down to the levels that every other activity has been nerfed to, or those activities need to be brought up in reward structure to be on par with or exceed flipping.

DarkSpirit.7046:

Obviously, you who don’t craft would not have one because you have not experienced all aspects of the game.

And not experiencing every single aspect of the game should preclude me from rewards that I can actually use because…?

DarkSpirit.7046:

So that is your own fault for choosing not to craft.

Why should my reward for doing content only be crafting, as opposed to flippers who get rewarded gold and the ability to afford everything in the game, including some ascended items?

Why should not playing the game be rewarded more than actually playing the game. Answer me that.

DarkSpirit.7046:

Whereas I am playing whatever aspect is necessary to get what I want.

Except for when you flip. Because you aren’t playing the game when you’re flipping.

DarkSpirit.7046:

That is the difference between do-ers and people who rather sit-on-their-butts-and-complain.

Yes yes. Go on Rush. Tell me more about how the muslims are destroying the country.

DarkSpirit.7046:

You just don’t deserve them.

And flippers deserve nothing when they flip.

So are you saying that if I have ever flipped on the TP, I can never ever be playing the game, and therefore do not deserve anything? Do you know how ridiculous that sounds?

In your brain there are only the evil flippers and the good people who play the game but you never thought that flippers can also play the game even more so than most people. Time to be more open-minded, most things are not black and white in this world.

Gene Archer.8560:

DarkSpirit.7046:

And you do get rewarded, by playing the game, you get account-bound materials to make the most powerful armor and weapons in the game. These cannot even be bought regardless of how much gold you have. Therefore, the ones with the gold would always be weaker than the ones who play the game, unless the ones with the gold also play the game, of course.

Great, and for those that have no use for account bound materials? For those who don’t craft? What reward is there, then? Are you really trying to suggest that ascended materials is some kind of proper compensation when everything else in the game is literally bought with gold?

Don’t make me kittening laugh.

DarkSpirit.7046:

Flippers serve the convenience of people who prefer to sell the items immediately for instant gold rather than place them as sell orders.

No, no. That would still exist even without flippers. Don’t even try to make flippers seem necessary. They aren’t.

DarkSpirit.7046:

Asking for handouts is just lame and shows that you are a lazy kitten who don’t respect the efforts that people have put in to get ahead.

Says the guy that doesn’t respect the efforts of people who actually play the game rather than a market simulator.

And again, I will remind you, this is a kittening game. Take your real world work ethic, take your old-world views, take your Rush Limbaugh uber conservatism, and kindly shove them where the sun don’t shine.

If I have never played the game then where do my ascended items come from? They can never be bought.

Obviously, you who don’t craft would not have one because you have not experienced all aspects of the game. So that is your own fault for choosing not to craft. Whereas I am playing whatever aspect is necessary to get what I want. That is the difference between do-ers and people who rather sit-on-their-butts-and-complain-waiting-for-handouts. You just don’t deserve them.

Gene Archer.8560:

DarkSpirit.7046:

Then you are ignoring the efforts that those of us have put in to learn the market and those who have put in the effort to farm and acquired more gold than the rest.

And you ignore the efforts of those running the events, slaying the bosses, doing the quests, and playing the actual game by keeping rewards so unrewarding, while TP flippers who are playing a glorified market simulator get to make far more gold. If the efforts of farmers and flippers matter, than the efforts of people who actually play the kitten game matter as well, and they should be rewarded just as much, if not more so, since they’re actually playing the game.

So long as you ignore the efforts of everyone but flippers, I will gladly ignore the efforts of flippers. Especially if the game becomes more fun and welcoming by ignoring those efforts.

DarkSpirit.7046:

Those who have worked harder in the game deserve to stay ahead!

Flippers deserve nothing when they don’t even play the game.

And you do get rewarded, by playing the game, you get account-bound materials to make the most powerful armor, weapons, and trinkets in the game. These cannot even be bought regardless of how much gold you have. Therefore, the ones with the gold would always be weaker than the ones who play the game, unless the ones with the gold also play the game, of course.

Flippers serve the convenience of people who prefer to sell the items immediately for instant gold rather than place them as sell orders.

Asking for handouts is just lame and shows that you are a lazy kitten who don’t respect the efforts that people have put in to get ahead.

Gene Archer.8560:

And this is a game. So what if people ask for or are given handouts? This isn’t the real world. There is no need to treat it as such.

Then you are ignoring the efforts that those of us have put in to learn the market and those who have put in the effort to farm and acquired more gold than the rest. Those who have worked harder in the game deserve to stay ahead!

Gene Archer.8560:

It’s called wanting to relax after being at work and slaving away at a desk/stove/fryer/wood cutting machine/insert profession here. It’s called downtime. It’s what games and movies are for.

You want more work? Go pick up extra jobs. Don’t turn our games into jobs for your bullcrap laden, romanticized, workaholic ideals.

DarkSpirit.7046:

I prefer to live in a world (virtual or otherwise) that rewards smarts and hard work, not a socialistic world where everybody is treated equally no matter how much they work.

The world you prefer to live in is rife with poverty and suffering. Good to know you obviously support poverty and suffering. (See? I can use guilt by association, too)

There is not much relaxation for me, I am taking on two jobs so that my family and I can get a better life and so that I can improve myself by learning new skills even though I am almost fifty years old.

Except for a few exceptions, there are mainly 2 types of people that I know. Those who work hard for their dreams and those who are too lazy to work for what they want. The latter usually ask for handouts from others and from the government because they can’t rely on themselves and always need the first group of people to carry them through life. In this case, the government in the game being ArenaNet.

MithranArkanere.8957:

DarkSpirit.7046:

[…]

Rare items with high prices are not the most important issue. It’s all they do in average.

There’s people keeping programs doing calculations for them to see how they can make the most profit without actually playing the game.
They are not even doing that work themselves.

For example, sometimes people craft stuff, and then they get a surplus of items like dowels.
Resellers will do things like buying as much as they can of entire stocks, and put a bit back cheap to lure people into selling low, then rebuy again everything and sell it back again high.
More than one person may do that, but since they do mostly the same, the result is the same for others.

It’s a lot of small things joining together to suck money from lots of people into their accounts.

Someone with a calculator in town should never make more profit than someone out there, saving the world, yet the ones making the highest numbers are the ones doing the least.

Unless they are lying when they brag, they earn more than the fastest dungeon speed clearers and fractal runners.

That should change. The ones making the big bucks must be the ones killing the big, fat ugly bosses that can kill you practically by looking at you.

As for equalizing wealth, the only way is earning caps, limiting what people can get in the first place. Like in the Chinese version. Play more than X hours a day, and you no longer get currencies, and you’ll better do something else, like taking a break or RP or PvP or WvW, just socialize, or get achievements or something that isn’t playing for moneys.

Of course, not many people would like that. They want continuous rewards with continuous play, and that will always divide players between those that play more and those that play less.

That is called using your brains and your skills to the max to earn gold. There is nothing wrong with that, in fact, such behavior should be encouraged because not enough people have been using their brains or have the motivation to learn new and useful skills for themselves nowadays. They rather fry their minds with brainless forms of entertainment, wasting their time away. The mind is like a muscle, use it or lose it.

Is there any reason why I have learnt to use a calculator and others can never learn to use one? Of course not. Then why complain that others can use a calculator but you can’t because you haven’t worked at it.

Furthermore, except for the legendaries, the most powerful items in the game cannot be bought with gold and has to be earned through spending time playing in the game.

I prefer to live in a world (virtual or otherwise) that rewards smarts and hard work, not a socialistic world where everybody is treated equally no matter how much they work.

Gene Archer.8560:

Oh, I see now. I misread. See, I took what you were saying at an actually logical slant. That is: Anet would just make every skin and armor available in a set up like the wardrobe or pvp locker and just give every item to every player so they could choose their own look.

But what you actually meant was an incredibly dumb system in which Anet would have a game where only one type of armor and weapon existed. All wrapped up, yet again, in that guilt by association argument.

Keep using that guilt by association, man. I’m sure it’ll stop being a fallacy if you use it enough times.

First of all, if ArenaNet is not receiving extra payments from us as you have proposed getting rid of gems, then you can’t expect them to keep as many staff employed to work on the game as they have now. This would include fewer artists and developers.
And there would be fewer incentives for them to come up with new and innovative armor.

Furthermore, since everyone would be getting the SAME set of armor for free, then everyone would be wearing the best-looking armor that they have available, that which is also available to everyone else. This turns it into a uniform.