Guild Wars 2

Skan.5301:

Devata.6589:

chemiclord.3978:

Devata.6589:

Shelledfade.6435:

Can we let them fix the broken aspects of this game first before they release an expansion?

Just saying… it might be better if they fix what’s there first before dumping more stuff on top of it.

They will but very slow as you can see. Fixes does not make them money as it won’t sell them any gems. But when then can work on an expansion they can and must (to prevent negative feedback on the expansion) also handle much of those bugs.

And making fixes would take resources away from the expansion you are convinced MUST happen to save this game. Meanwhile, MMO players are NOT patient. They will NOT wait for an expansion if they are bored.

Not really. Remember the question would change from "how to get people to buy gems’ to “how to get people to buy the expansion”. I think fixing bugs fix in both but I also think it fits better in the second question.

Answer to “how to get people to buy the expansion”: Another Manifesto filled with sweet, sweet lies that people will eat up and then be severely disappointed with.

Possible and it would work for the first expansion. But if the expansion would be really bad it would not work again for a second expansion so it would be a very bad idea. If there goal is to keep on going with this game for many years that is. So I would hope they would do better. Anet build up a good name with GW1 so something there must be good.

chemiclord.3978:

Devata.6589:

Shelledfade.6435:

Can we let them fix the broken aspects of this game first before they release an expansion?

Just saying… it might be better if they fix what’s there first before dumping more stuff on top of it.

They will but very slow as you can see. Fixes does not make them money as it won’t sell them any gems. But when then can work on an expansion they can and must (to prevent negative feedback on the expansion) also handle much of those bugs.

And making fixes would take resources away from the expansion you are convinced MUST happen to save this game. Meanwhile, MMO players are NOT patient. They will NOT wait for an expansion if they are bored.

Not really. Remember the question would change from "how to get people to buy gems’ to “how to get people to buy the expansion”. I think fixing bugs fix in both but I also think it fits better in the second question.

+ what Skan said. The fixes are slow at this moment so it’s not like it now go’s faster. Sadly enough problems are not just bugs it are also missing features have for example a look at the list on this page https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2 . Half of it might be nice to haves but the other half is just thinks you might expect and need.

Then you have thinks like that one person is ‘owner’ of a dungeon. Officially thats not a bug but it does not work so should change.

Mobs that spawn to fast.. no real bug but needs attentions.

Mobs that run away when you get to far and then regenerate and become invulnerable. Bad design because you might get out of the circle on accident.

Al that sort of thinks are bad but not official bigs so if bugs are so slow how about those thinks.

Personally I think a expansion would also be a good moment to have a second look at that. They did lose people because of bugs and those thinks. If it is done better in an expansion they can advertise it so it makes sense but people who left won’t see the LS patches so you won’t get them back so easily.

Shelledfade.6435:

Can we let them fix the broken aspects of this game first before they release an expansion?

Just saying… it might be better if they fix what’s there first before dumping more stuff on top of it.

They will but very slow as you can see. Fixes does not make them money as it won’t sell them any gems. But when then can work on an expansion they can and must (to prevent negative feedback on the expansion) also handle much of those bugs.

ThiBash.5634:

Assyrian.4827:

ThiBash.5634:

You really think that ArenaNet, being afraid that their expansion might not sell well, decided to instead add free content to the game instead (which still costs them the same to build in terms of manpower)?

Just think about that for a second. Does your premise still make sense now?

Yes I do.
GW2 has core problems and patch after patch it is getting worst (condition damage/vertical progression) it was a better game at release.
what they are giving now is not free someone is paying for it. but how many wings and bag items they are going to buy without new players that will decrease.
instead of going for more audience they decided to keep what they have now.
what we are getting from LS has nothing to do with GW2 lore. who is going to invade the next city the green pirates from Mars.

But why do you believe it? Yes, there are gemstore items. Yes, people buy them. But there’s no reason to assume there wouldn’t be gem store sales if there were an expansion. Even World of Kittencraft, which has a monthly subscription, sells ingame vanity items for real life money.

Living Story = Expansion, only released in multiple small chunks instead of one big chunk. And it’s free.

No living story is not free. It cost money to make that and so the company needs to make sure they get that money and so they need to convince people to buy gems and so in influence the game in a bad way.

Redenaz.8631:

~

The problem is, it is so importand you can better farm gold to buy what you need then try to get hat you need.

““DLC should be free” is a strange attitude to me. Free DLC is a great bonus, but I don’t think we should forget the days when there was no DLC; a game shipped as-is, and if something wasn’t ready by the time the game went into manufacturing, it would have to wait for the sequel, if the game got one.”
No if a product was not like it should be they fixed it for free and they would usually also throw in some other extras like extra maps and so on. Thats the ‘free DLC’ I am referring to. Because DLC now is basically the same with the difference that they now ask money for it. The free patch bounds people to a game and company and in that way they where more likely to buy new games of expansions. However DLC is something we talk about in other games not in MMORPG’s so not the point here.

No the 50 dollar is fine for a game.. and then they add new stuff making the game better and then the game might be worth more and the company should and must be rewarded for that. If they put in gems they get rewarded for it with the money people spend on buying gems. But then they have to lock it behind a gem-store and so the game as total does not improve. Or they generate the main income by expansions and lock it behind that expansion then you would of course also have the barber without the expansion but it would have less hairs to pick from. But a game with barber is indeed better then one without. Now because of the gem-focus it’s not there.. they could put it in and still lock the hair behind gems but still that would make it less fun. When playing the game you should not run upon that sort of stuff that makes it less fun. For me it does. Not for everybody but thats why I never play F2P game.

“That’s like ordering a pizza and demanding extra cheese be free, just because it would be a friendly gesture on the part of the company.”
It’s not really a good example because a pizza would not have the negative side effects but just to make them up in the pizza… no it’s like buying a pizza or a pizza the luxe (thats the one + expansion). And the gem option is the pizza where you have to pay extra for all the possible additions (that together make the Pizza the luxe ) but because you order everything sperate the pizza gets cold before they have put everything on it. (that last makes no since but like I said, a pizza is not a very good example)

“An expansion is, ultimately, a $40 DLC pack. Instead of having the option to get any of it for free (as with Living World,) players either have it or they don’t, dividing the player base into those with access and those without” dividing the player-base up. Something Anet also always talks about and I think it is a little nonsense and overflows do that as well you know. Locking it somehow is the same with the gem-store. Not everything is for free but indeed you only have access to the new content with the expansion. I don’t see how that is a problem everybody gets what he paid for but you don’t have the bad side-effects so the total game because better because of it. Thats the difference between F2P and B2P yeah. Like I said I prefer B2P and since I did pay for GW2 I think I am allowed to ask for that.

Besides in practice how many people would not by the expansion? Maybe not all on the same time but people who play it will eventually buy it The fact that they not all to it together is a plus.. partly because it spreads out the player-base. When you get people all to the same place on the same time the other places are empty. Of course you will not get all people there so many people still see the empty places but because you focus on that the empty places will be more empty and so more of a problem. I would think you want to spread out the playerbase over the whole map. Thats also something Anet said with there down-scale thing.

BTW I see a difference between DLC (what is a very small addition that a few years ago was free) and a expansion (big addition that never has been for free).

The payment model shows how a company generates income. At this moment Anet does that by making money on a cash-shop. That is F2P. It does not suddenly not become F2P because you did buy the initial game.. I see people saying this multiple times. But if they talk about WoW it’s P2P but uhhm you buy the game there as well. So by that logic WoW would not be P2P, thats of course not how it works. What is the main way GW2 generate income. Cash-shop so F2P model. The name F2P is just because games that don’t require purchase always use the cash-shop. So GW2 is not trying something new they are using the same bad system many other companies also have. They just also charged money for the first sale.

Oow and then there is this area in Queensdale where you get LITERALLY kicked out when you try to enter. You need some ticked they sold in the gem-store and the presents for gem-buyers… We love you more. It’s the same bad behavior we indeed see in all the F2P games but that does not make it good. Anet had a name for a good B2P model but GW2 has become a bad F2P model with all those negative side-effects. You might not see gold-driven system, locking stuff behind gems in stead of expansions and a non-fun mini structure a problem but I for sure do.

Some people indeed do not see the connecting but companies also don’t want people to see it. It might not work so good anymore because then they might feel as being cheated into buying something.

Redenaz.8631:

~
the rest you added.

First of all I was not talking about GW1. I would also not name presents ingame and yes I do name the ones in the living story ingame but that was nearly all temporary and so not fun again.. you can not go collect mini you need to farm living story’s and farm gold to buy them. Thats now fun. How many mini’s are there now really in the game that can drop? I don’t know but I think of the many many mini’s we have maybe 5 are really available ingame. I am one of those persons who enjoys farming mini’s in other games but here… well I buy a few that I like but collecting them is boring so no thanks. That are the facts.

So yeah.. I wasn’t talking about GW1. The only think I really liked about guild wars one was the payment model. Needles to say I did not play it. I did buy it just for the HoM after I pre-ordered GW2. I did know GW1 and that was because of it’s famous B2P payment model.

“So the world feels like it is constantly changing“ No thats the excuse not the reason. You know what changed the world. The lost shore event and while that event was temporary the content that came with it was mainly permanent and that should be how it works. Some events that happens (no achievements, no rewards) and then that ends with a big chuck of new content. Temporary content that gets removed does not change the world at all because it is removed.

“It’s going to burn some players out if they try to do everything, but for those who don’t need to do everything (I skipped Super Adventure Box and basically all of Wintersday, for example,) it’s a way to keep providing new content for people with different interests. “ They ‘need’ to do it now because else they miss out on it totally.. Thats why they don’t like temporary content. SAB and Wintersday.. you know thats not temporary right? Thats returning every few months / year.

“If they just wanted to toss in limited time gem store products, they could, easily, without half the non-gem-related content included in the living story releases. “

They could but this go’s nice with it. And indeed many F2P games do.. Thats why I do NOT like F2P games and thats why I did go for GW2 because it was knows for there B2P model and by asking money for the game they make it seem as if GW2 would use the same system. But it now indeed looks like the many bad F2P systems out there. Thats the problem, you see. You are confirming here what I say.

It is like in many F2P games. I prefer B2P games I hate F2P games for these sort of things!

“I’m tired of hearing the “money poisons everything” argument. “ luckily you will never hear that from me. I even say I understand Anet needs to make money. But there are differed ways of making money and they effect the game in differed ways. Thats a fact and that does not mean money poisons everything. The F2P payment model GW2 has now adapted does poisons the game indeed.

Redenaz.8631:

Devata.6589:

Why is the game so gold-driven? Thats not fun but then people are more likely to buy gems to convert to gold.

It’s worth noting that gold is the single most widely-rewarded currency. Pretty much anything you do (other than sPvP) rewards coin, unlike most other forms of currency (badges of honor, fractal relics, guild commendations, dungeon tokens,) that can only be earned through more narrow kinds of content. Laurels and karma are pretty flexible, too, but still not as flexible as coin. (And laurels are time-gated, to boot, which a lot of players don’t seem to like for content.)

A lot of things charge coin, which you can get for real money through gems, but there’s a huge amount of content that rewards coin, too, so it only makes sense that a lot of items should cost gold. It’s the basic, content-neutral currency. Is the fact that gold can be bought with gems considered? Likely. But it’s not the only factor.

That’s like asking why the game is so XP-driven, and then pointing fingers at the sale of XP boosters. Yeah, I guess that can be a factor, but it’s a core system of the game, and just because real money can be involved doesn’t mean it’s the only practical way to play the game.

Devata.6589:

Why isn’t there a barber in the game where you can change your hair for 15 silver? Because then they will sell less make-over kids.

That’s like asking why all DLC packs in games aren’t free. Just because a company could include something in the base game doesn’t mean they have a responsibility to, or that the game is necessarily a bad product without the DLC. I know that galls people who can’t stand DLC (“Extra fighting game costumes should be free!”) but that’s the business.

It is mainly currency driven indeed but gold is still the most important currency of them all. You can better farm for gold and they buy what you need then farm for the item. Mostly in MMO’s it’s the other way around. Farming for gold to get what you want is extremely boring and thats part of the reason you can find so many farming grinding complains in this game.

About the DLC. DLC indeed should be free (it shows a company cares) and it was untill just a few years ago. But thats more something for other games. I do understand a company needs to make money and that can be done with expansion. That barber and the hair will be paid for.. with the expansions!!! I did say that already so why are we even having this discussion?

There are multiple ways of making money and that way effects how the game works. Put it all expansions and you get it that way. Make money like gems and they lock it all behind gems. It’s that easy.

See who accepted / declined credits for another guilds mission. We always have some member pressing accept when we tell them not to because we want to so a run for ourself because some member missed it. This extremely bad guild management told however do not show it.

Also it would be nice if we could not just have guild-houses but really could build our own guild houses / castles in the open world and defend them. Inside can then be a room that really is an instance litke the standard guild-house. There could be done on a new map where people fight for terrain and people can build there on houses there. Thats then similar to WvW but now there is a real reason to defend and something to work for with the guild. If the building part is dynamic it will keep people busy because you can always make it better or bigger.

Edit message of the day is finally possible. We need much more then that change for the MotD but heey it’s something after more then a year.

Meanwhile the list here just keeps growing. The longer the list gets the more it shows negligence from Anets side.

Paulytnz.7619:

Devata.6589:

If you don’t like that Anet has items available for a limited time you should not buy gems.
Anet is now using gems for their main income (Not expansions like in gW1) this means that they use marketing techniques to try and get people to buy gems. Making stuff temporary might seem as not working (because you can’t buy it anymore) but in fact is a marketing technique based on creating a sense or urgency. They will just put a similar items in at a later time. It makes the game worse but it works to generate more income.

So if you don’t like those sort of thinks (and there are many in GW2.. for example the fact that gold out rules everything else is also related to that) you need to understand where they come from. Thats the fact that they focus on the cash-shop. Then you also know what you can do about it. Not buying gems in this case.

If course they need to make money but they can do that with expansions like they did in GW1.

I think they can do it with both expansions as well as the gem store as well as not having to rely on limited timed items.

Let’s be honest here, how many people buy things because they are limited to a certain time limit? I guess that would depend on the actual content, but even then I see no reason that people wouldn’t buy things without that “urgency” hanging over their head.

Good examples of course are the unlimited gathering tools. Any new player given the chance to see these items available and how much of a boon it would be to have one would simply buy it for its use. I don’t believe people ONLY buy things because they believe they will be special because they have things other players never will be able to get again. I think that line of thinking is old fashioned and belongs to other games…..or in the least apply to only certain things like minis…..

Indeed I think there are some items where it makes no sense at all. But overall it does work. It is a marketing trick that has proven itself over many years so by thinking it would not really work that well you go against years and years of proof for companies that it does work.

The sense of urgency it not based on the idea that they want it because other people will not be able to get it anymore. That might help as well (wen trying to create a ‘unique’ char but then it does not fit items like mini’s) but for sure it’s not the only reason and it’s not the reason behind temporay items.. It’s really the urgency. I never gave that reason so I am not sure why you are telling me thats not a why people buy something.. I never said that it was.

I don’t want Anet to focus on all, they should focus on expansion. They might till have the gem-store to get income but that should be more extra while expansions have the focus because only then we get rid of the bad side-effects.

Julie Yann.5379:

The LS is the expansion. Instead of releasing everything in one installment they do it little by little, gradually changing the face of Tyria with more content (and eventually new zones, races, stories). That’s what they keep saying and repeating to everyone but I guess most of these posters can’t seem to wrap their head around that concept.

Oow they can. They just don’t like it. Every two weeks you get a rush for content that then is done very fast. Much of it being temporary is even worse. Some thinks don’t seem to get improved in the living story. Big overhauls like letting people really sit on chars and having bakers sell bread in stead of salvaging kits or making turning GW2 in one big open world in stead of instanced maps.

But worse of it is that it also means Anet focuses on the gem-store to generate income and that results in a lot of bad behavior. With that I mean.. game mechanics and stuff that is there to get people to buy gems but is not so good for the game itself.
Why is the game so gold-driven? Thats not fun but then people are more likely to buy gems to convert to gold. Why isn’t there a barber in the game where you can change your hair for 15 silver? Because then they will sell less make-over kids.

Why are so many mini’s in the gem-store and not in the world so it it fun to collect them? Because then they can’t sell them in the gem-store.

Why do they work so much with temporary content. So they have an excuse to put items in the gem-store and take them back out.. this to create a feel of urgency.

If the question is “how do we get people to buy gems” you get this sort of stuff in the game.

You must understand Anet is a commercial company that needs to make money. The way they do it effects the game. The living story fits to there gem-store focus for income so if you don’t like many of those negative side-effects that is also a reason to prefer expansion so Anet can and should focus on that to generate income.. Of course then they should also stop with the gem-store focus and change all the bad effects of it that are now in the game.

If you don’t like that Anet has items available for a limited time you should not buy gems.
Anet is now using gems for their main income (Not expansions like in gW1) this means that they use marketing techniques to try and get people to buy gems. Making stuff temporary might seem as not working (because you can’t buy it anymore) but in fact is a marketing technique based on creating a sense or urgency. They will just put a similar items in at a later time. It makes the game worse but it works to generate more income.

So if you don’t like those sort of thinks (and there are many in GW2.. for example the fact that gold out rules everything else is also related to that) you need to understand where they come from. Thats the fact that they focus on the cash-shop. Then you also know what you can do about it. Not buying gems in this case.

If course they need to make money but they can do that with expansions like they did in GW1.

Thx for all the answers. I will have a look at the Swindler or Rogue coat.

Then there is only the search for the blue pill left

(And the glasses but I think they just are not in the game (Yet)).

Edit: hmm need it in light armor.

Caramel Ham.4891:

Devata.6589:

The whole mini system in GW2 is boring because they put most of them in the gem-store so where is the fun in collecting them?

Then many other where linked behind temporary content what is also boring.

It’s to bad Anet wants to use the cash-shop to make money instead of using expansions. Thats why they do these thinks and it’s not good / fun for the game itself.

My biggest problem about mini pets is that:

1) They do not have their own spot in your inventory space, thus taking a spot in your bag.

2) They disappear way to quickly.

Thats more functional problems about them and I agree. At the same time there is a positive ‘function’ about that I do not like. In the bank every mini has it’s own slot. That makes them less special. Now I know all mini’s that are in the game. Takes away the fun of going in the world and finding them.. then again like I said in my previous post. Thats already not possible / fun because most are in the gem-store.

Many of the complains you see now are coming from things that are put in the game to get people to buy gems. Living story is there to have an excuse to put also temporary items in the gem-store and have people logging in. same for time-gated content.

No fun in collecting pets because they are mostly in the gem-store.

Gold driven system because them people are more likely to buy gems to convert to gold.

What do you think about an ingame barber where you can cut your hair for 15 silver.. well then they can’t sell the hair using gems.

Anet should focus on expansions as income not on gems. Then they would be able to improve the game in stead of having to make compromises to get people to buy gems.

In a way they made a ingame poll about this. Do we want a gem-store focus? The gem-store guy Evon lost the election.

So go focus on the expansions.

Then again.. while there are still many people with bad money management skills who spend many money on the gem-store because every time Anet creates a sense of urgency or whatever to get people to buy an item they can’t refuse.

Adine.2184:

Between waypoints and the fact that every class already has a speed buff of one sort or another there’s no need for mounts

Adine.2184:

Between waypoints and the fact that every class already has a speed buff of one sort or another there’s no need for mounts

No need could be fun. Problem might be the instead based maps.

Beside waypoints make the world smaller. Better remove some of them and then put mounts in it’s place.

That is a funny thing, back in the beta I remember some GW1 fans (some of them seem to hate mounts, don’t know why. Apparently because WoW has them) said mounts where bad because they made the world smaller while in fact they don’t really do.. waypoint however.

I will have a look but did not find something that really ‘did’ it.

But the pill looked to as a refference to the Matrix so I do really wonder if there also is a blue version in the game.

And there are sun-glasses in the game but not as weapon armor.

Thnx but thats not really what I am looking for.
Just for if it’s not clear. It’s more this look I om searching for.
[img]http://thefinalcurtaincall.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/je-montrerai-c3a0-ces-gens-ce-que-vous-ne-voulez-pas-quils-voient-je-leur-ferai-voir-un-monde-sans-vous-un-monde-sans-lois-ni-contrc3b4le-sans-limites-ni-frontic3a8res-un-monde-oc3b9-tout.jpg[/img]

I come to the forum with a questions, to report a bug or to show criticism over thinks in the game or business decisions. I might defend something once in a while but thats not why I am go to the forums.

What I think is strange is that there are people coming to the forums to only defend the game.. If you like it so much then play it. You might show your voice as well.. it’s good to hear two sides but the people who are almost always on the forum while they seem to love every thing Anet does (as it’s more that then something else) I don’t understand.

If you just take everything without being critical about it thinks will only get worse.

Why not just walk away. Not everybody just walks away some people try to change what is wrong. Besides walking away also means walking away from your investment being it time you spend or money you paid for the purchase and walking away from the guild or friends.

Now if you would say.. if you have so many complains then don’t buy any more gems then I would agree but staying away from the forums is a little strange.

You are on the forums trying to ‘change’ the forums because you don’t like the forums. Why are you doing that then.. because for you the game part is fine but the forum part is bad. Walking away is an option but not one many people will do without a fight.

The whole mini system in GW2 is boring because they put most of them in the gem-store so where is the fun in collecting them?

Then many other where linked behind temporary content what is also boring.

It’s to bad Anet wants to use the cash-shop to make money instead of using expansions. Thats why they do these thinks and it’s not good / fun for the game itself.

I did see this item
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Prototype_Nutriment

It made me wonder. Is there also a blue pill? So a similar item with the same icon but then blue. And if there is where to get it.

That again made me wonder if there are any trench coats in the game and sunglasses for armor. I know sunglasses are availible for town clothing.

Knighthonor.4061:

This is a thread on MMORPG.com
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/397542/page/1
Talking about how Leveling really arent that interesting of a goal, after so many MMOs have this same goal in their game.

When I first started playing MMOs, yeah I thought Levels were cool and needed. But that was before I open up to the reality after playing MMOs and leveling for a while.

I realized then, just how meaningless the levels really are. Its just a visual content lock. I join a game, “FORCED” to level, just to get access to the things I enjoy as being fun. The World is small as a low level. Gets bigger as a high level.

This takes away the fun and gates it behind a lock. the key to the lock is the dreaded “you must be level X to do Y”

MMOs are now full of meaningless Leveling.

Some MMOs add large grinds to the above scenario of “you must be level X to do Y”, and yet that still only makes the situation worst.

Some MMOs have shorter grinds of this. But its still a Useless grind. No matter how shorter or harder the grind of leveling in a MMO is, its still will be a meaningless grind.

In GW2 we have a down scale system. We have a up scale system for WvW.

Why not get rid of Levels all together so we have the freedom to just have fun and play what we like.

How long are levels really suppose to keep your players entertained?

I want all content, to be for all players. No leveling content, not stupid leveling hearts.
All Content for ALL PLAYERS!!

You are partly right but MMO’s are also build on progressing your character. It might work very well t do that without levels and armor being a big issue but the question is how.

Somehow you need to create progress. I thin it is possible by progressing other thinks like crafting, housing, claiming land if you have fractions, special armor, collecting pets and mini’s, doing achivements, unlocking content (but not based on level and armor).

I don’t think farming or grinding is a problem. It can even be fun. The way it is implemented is the problem.

If it is time-gated it is bad, if it is extremely hard to grind for multiple ingredients you need to make something it is ver bad.

Grinding for currency is bad.

But if you can just farm the materials you need in a decent way it can be fun. It’s a reason to go out in the world. (Then again.. what would I craft.. ascended weapons or a legendary.. I wants fun thinks to ‘craft’).

Grinding for very rare drops is no problem if the drop is not required and it is indeed the item you want not currency you need to buy it.

What many people complain about it that it’s the wrong sort of farming / grind.

Multiple (not just 1 or two to make a very rare item.. like with the charged lodestones / cores) ingredients you need are very hard to farm.. basically impossible. But simple because of the many people in the world it will drop. That means you will get it form the TP so you option is to farm for gold. Thats much more rewarding. But farming for currency is the boring way of farming.

Same with dungeon-tokes. It would be no problem is there was another goal you could farm a dungeon for and then have a dungeon tokens as an extra but thats not the case. Those tokens are the target so once again currency farming. Boring.

Then the laurels you get from daily so a time-gated grind and the gold that you need so much is also a much time-gated.

So no farming and grinding is not a problem.. the form of grinding / farming is.

tigirius.9014:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

tigirius.9014:

I’d say that two major things they could do to improve the overall game is eliminate RNG entirely and remove DR from the open world.

I will now address the problems with your idea.

1) Eliminating RNG means you also eliminate the rarity system. This kill the game, as once you provide a guaranteed way to get something, there’s no further need to do the content over. Then a short while later, all players will have the same items, and completely run out of things to do.

2) Removing DR hurts the economy. Certain players would benefit from continuous runs, allowing them unlimited income potential. Other players with limited time can’t complete, thus a huge wealth gap is created. The players that can afford to play more will have more available money, and will then control the Open Market. Inflation will be rapid, and all casual type players will hurt more.

Both these ideas are bad for the game, and will never happen.

Actually no. There’s a game I’m playing right now that doesn’t use the RNG system like this game does, but still manages to make the game interesting and fun and not a grind to upgrade your gear. It has a 1 hour timer sale on it’s vendors in which you have to have a sizeable amount of the currency (equivalent to this game’s karma) in order to purchase the said item. The sales people are spread out across the map and the items bought cannot be sold. They are high quality special weapons with great damage. So you see you can have a better system then the 1999 version of RNG that this title uses and keep the game honest and fun while eliminating the grind or the chance to get 0.

DR is no longer necessary as bots have resorted to farming nodes. Removing DR wouldn’t harm the economy now that they’ve made proper changes to how MF works and how MF can be accumulated. You either have to craft to death and salvage everything or collect lots and lost of green blue items and salvage those to get enough of the material to max your MF in order to do anything with drops now and most bots aren’t going to bother really. Combine this with the fact that they have nerfed the dungeons loot recently as evident by the complaints I’ve been reading both in forums and in game in map chat and there’s no real problem.

And Finally, it would benefit the players to remove the DR because DR combined with the ongoing lopsided loot algorithm would pretty much ensure that players who were and are cutoff from the loot that those who don’t have this bug with their account would once again get loot properly again. This market has already been plagued by players who had entirely too much control simply from the methods they used in the loot system in the first place that allowed only certain players the ability to gather together multiple precursors during certain events and the costs of the items is growing with DR in place, making items MORE available would even the playing field and allow certain items to come back DOWN in price not the other way around.

In that game you are also farming for currency and then buying the stuff you want and that is boring.

However you need a mix of ways to get your items. Tokens in dungeons for armor is fine but make also some rare items (including skins) drop with a low drop-change (So RNG).

Make very hard content and give it a skin / weapons/ itwem it will always drop but at the same time you can also implement a rng drop for the same content.

make vendors sell stuff including selling it with a limited available number for an x period.

Make some very rare world drops,

Make some even lower drop change on a type of mob people can easily farm in one area but it is still very hard because of the rng,

Make traditional quest that reward thinks,

use achivements,

and then indeed also have a few weapons like infinitive light that are extremely extremely extremely hard to get and rare. Problem with those weapons here now is that a legendary is not ascended and can change stats while those extreme rare exotics are not. Getting them might however even be harder.

chemiclord.3978:

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

What would you define as “meaningful content”?

A new zone that players will chew up in a week then moan there’s nothing fun to do.

If you release content every 2 weeks or every month you get exactly that. People all rush it then.

When you release much more at once it’s so overwhelming it takes much longer and they can fix things like sitting on chairs, a baker selling bread and so on.

They really censor everything also stuff that is not bad. Besides that the filter is not very good.

It is a little stupid isn’kitten

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

morrolan.9608:

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

• “the best stat gear requiring crazy amounts of time to earn,”… it takes about 2-3 weeks to get a best in slot item. Yeah… crazy amounts of time, lol.

To get 1 item, yeah it is crazy, in most western mmos you should be able to get almost fully geared in a new tier in that timeframe.

just a tiny exaple:

BIS item in WoW: http://www.wowdb.com/items/105349-bracers-of-the-pristine-purifier#contained-in-object

3.4% droprate in a endgame raid

Yeah I’m sure you have this in a few tries. Do you want more of those exaples?

The question is how much does it difference from the SiS?
3,4% drop-range. That means that after doing it 8 times the change for it to drop is > 25%.

And the change that it has dropped is bigger then the change that is did not drop when doing it 15 times.

It would not be great if you would HAVE to do that for your whole armor set and it makes a big difference for SiS but if SiS will work as well then this is a fair way for those people who really want BiS so they have something to work for.

Compare that some some items in GW2. Some items required to make something are harder to get that your WoW BiS item and then you need 100 of them. Buying is a option but less fun.

“raid systems that need huge numbers of people online simultaneously to organize and play”

Yeah also that is one that would be great if it was in there. For multiple thinks it is like what they said and was indeed good they did the opposite and for the the thinks they said but was not so good they did not change is.

“thousands of wash/repeat item-collection or kill-mob quests or dailies with flavor text support” You really wanna day that this is not in because you have a little choice for your dailies? I am sorry but if something is very much in this game it is this.

People are doing there daily achievements, daily boss kills and events are mainly kill-mob quest.

Xcom.1926:

Wow, I read what Colin said. And it is AMAZING to me how they completely made a 180 from that. This was the funniest. He is doing the OPPOSITE of what he said.

You get leveling systems that take insane amounts of grind to gain a level, loot drop systems that require doing a dungeon with a tiny chance the item you want can drop at the end, raid systems that need huge numbers of people online simultaneously to organize and play, thousands of wash/repeat item-collection or kill-mob quests or dailies with flavor text support, the best stat gear requiring crazy amounts of time to earn, etc.

“loot drop systems that require doing a dungeon with a tiny chance the item” that part is not in there.. However it would be much more fun if it is. But in multiple aspects they are indeed doing the opposite.

For example they say they want people do do thinks because it’s fun nod because the games tels you to do it. (non literal quote). What does Anet, if people don’t do some thinks they put it in a daily achievement. Thats a real example of something thats the opposite of what they said and personally on a level that I never saw in another game. In another game they try to make it fun or rewarding here they put it in the daily. As if they see that nobody does it and then go like.. this is really fun just put it in the daily and then they see.

At the same time I do feel for some of the developers. See what they put borderlands. People put time into that and now nobody is interested in it. Even worse, Anet put it in the daily to get people to do it. Meanwhile many players would prefer to have the lake back. And thats not the designers their fault but the person who came up with that idea.

WvW is kinda fun but could be great. You should be able to claim land with your guild, build castles fight for other land and so on.

”Nobody likes RNG, rare 0.0000005% drops from stupidly easy or difficult bosses .” No at difficult bosses it could be 0,01. Mobs can be 0,005. Yes for some items I would like that because it gives a great feeling if you then finally get that item. And personally I would not want a rare item so people could kiss my feet but so I can create a unique look.

“because people want to know that for each hour or two they put into the game they are making tangible progress “ if it’s 0,005 you know that for each kill the change of getting it is better. What I don’t like is that you now need items to make something but farming go’s way to slow.. that item has a 0,01 drop change and ten you need 250 of it and to make it worse you can’t really farm them because the thinks you need are not all in the same place or are time-gated and so on. so you can better just farm gold and buy it. Thats not fun. And indeed grinding for tokens or better said currency is not fun. ‘Grinding’ for the items you need (crafting materials / recipe’s) or the items you want (special / fun items, mini’s, armor, skins) is much more fun.

“they want a one time thing to have an epic reward, and be tangibly progressive.“ That would not work because you can onlyu do it once but a few of those think might be in the game and then make it really really really really hard. Might also be part of 3 challenges. A raid challenge, a personal fight challenge (you can only do alone) and a JP challenge. If thats really really hard you show skills on multiple levels and can get some reward for it but if that is one reward then you would do it only once so while you should have a few of those thinks in, dungeons and bosses and raids you do in the hope of a rare item drop should also be in there. And token can be an addition thats fine. The token system with dungeons is not that bad but it should not be the main reward but a side reward. A dungeon should have a few rare items it can drop and then while going for that item in the meanwhile you also get your tokens for the armor-set.

Saviourslave.6715:

I’m no expert on this at all, let me get that out there first. I’m not all-knowledgable on everything Anet does or the community knows, but I do read the forums alot, and you guessed it, I just read about how much the general forum-posters think anet is doing wrong.

~

When I complain about something I usually also say how I think it should be but to answer your questions fast.

Craft. I want fun crafts that get you a fun nice thing every level so you are working towards that all the time in stead of just going for the max level because only then it because useful or fun. At the same time crafting can send you all over the world by putting special recipes and so on after quest (addition of traditional quest) or in dungeons and so on.

Farming. You should be able to farm the stuff you need, not need to do a lot of stuff you don’t want to get gold to then buy what you need / want. That is boring. Now it’s to gold-driven.

Loot. Same, I want items to drop that I want not gold or other currency that allow me to buy it. Thats just not fun.

Open word bosses can not be hard because there will be always people who don;t know what they are doing and they can mess it up for the whole group (see Tequatl). But easy bosses are boring so in addition to that they should add raids with really hard bosses that require tactics. Because you are with a raid you can do those thinks.

Dungeons need to be rewarding (in gold but also in drops like skins, armor, mini’s or mounts) they might be hard but not to long (like Arah or the new dungeon). MF was a good example. Not to long, rewarding and required tactics.

I would like to see traditional quest added.

I want Anet to focus on expansions for income so there is no need to put hair in the gem-sotre but we can get a barber in-game and there is no need for temporary stuff to create a feeling of urgency.

I would want an open world in stead of instance maps.

I would add mounts and remove many of the waypoints, and poi’s.

Open world housing.

Fractions

open world WvW with guild castles and so on.

That are so some of the thinks.

And for the people who think.. much of that has nothing to do with how Anet could make rare gear and loot acquisition. It does. Part of it is new loot (like mounds). Quest can send you on an journey over the world and then give a reward, Open world WvW with guild castles means there are ‘castles’ as a reward and you need material you can gather with a whole guild and so on. It all tights in to some form of loot / reward.

There are many many threads about this and yes a lot of people don’t like it and many people like expansions (some don’t).

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Sorry, but this deserves it’s own thread. So it’s been said that there’s “probability of a new race or profession is high and so are the currently unreachable lands of the original Guild Wars”.

My speculation is quaggan playable race. As for profession, pure Ritualist would be nice to see. I miss my Spirit Spammer builds that would make an unending mini army of ranged attackers.

They literally said a new profession was the last on the list.

Pirlipat.2479:

There is a lot of preaching going on in this thread.^^ Did I pay a years sub worth? No, but I spent some money here and there, when I liked the item. And I don’t regret it a bit.

Honestly, I’m not happy with everything in this game, but overall I enjoy it alot, otherwise I wouldn’t play it anymore. I don’t “invest” in my characters.

On the other hand everyone telling us that spending gems on the shop is supporting the “wrong” way: how do I know that “your” perfect way is the way I would like? When I read the forum I get the impression that many people want things that would make me stop playing.

Maybe it’s not the wrong way for you. Maybe you dislike the idea of an ingame barber and a place where you can also farm for materials you want / need in stead of just doing a lot of things to get gold to get your items. Mayve you like the temporary nature of the LS.

Thats why I explain what I see as ‘wrong’ and it’s on you to decide if it’s really wrong for you as well. But many people do indeed see such things as wrong but don’t see the link with the gem-store focus. For them I tell them how I see it.

chemiclord.3978:

The only way you “change what is wrong” is when the other side actually thinks there is anything “wrong” to begin with.

When the other side does not think there is a problem, they are (not surprisingly) going to ignore your solution to a problem that doesn’t exist.

That it doesn’t exist in there eyes does not mean it does not exist in reality. So I need to make sure they see it and thats what I am trying to do.

chemiclord.3978:

Devata.6589:

I am not somebody to just walk away.

Well then… I hope you enjoy your endless frustration and anger. Because the gem store is not going anywhere, nor are the business practices to encourage people to buy from it. It’s here for good, and will continue to be here until the game’s servers shut down. So go ahead and keep screaming at the sun for rising.

Personally, if I was so angry at something, I wouldn’t have anything to do with it… but I guess that’s just me.

(I don’t ask for the gem-store to go)

It’s more then just screaming and ‘we’ did have some succes with other topics so we will see here.

I prefer to change what is wrong, not walk away from it.

Besides walking away also means walking away from the invested time and walking away from the guild and there is nothing wrong with the guild.

Well they are good at deleting threads and comments they do not like.

For example there was a post just a few min ago about to many censorship on the forum. The next comment said.. this will also be deleted. I then typed my comment being: (It fits in this conversation)

“True. The topic [I Would Like My Digital Deluxe Items Please] that I did not create.. just for the record. Was also removed. There was nothing wrong with that topic, there where no bad thinks in it.

However these sorts of topics might simply be removed with some bad excuse. You can then mail NCsoft who give a bad excuse for it’s removal. That might even change from the original one. I remember that one thread of me once was removed because it was ‘rude, condescending, and/or inflammatory’ what it wasn’t. So I mailed NCsoft and they could not really deny that it was non of those thinks so then it became then is was considered trolling. Also nonces, no trolling at all but it’s a vague word so easy to use.

The last thread that was removed I also mailed NCsoft. Didn’t even read the mail they send back as I know they would not put it back anyway but at least I showed my dislike about it.

I might be somebody showing my dislikes here but I almost never get a post of thread deleted on other forums (also if it’s negative)."

but by the time I press ‘post’ the topic was deleted.

So in my opinion they do remove to much, not to little.

chemiclord.3978:

Devata.6589:

At the same time there are also many more people that seem to think the same way.

Walking away would also mean walking away from the invested time so far and walking away from an amazing guild. So I prefer to bring this problem to the attention.

And Arena.net doesn’t think it’s a problem. They don’t agree with you. It will not change. Period.

So now what? No matter how long you scream at that wall, it’s not going to move.

Walk away.

I am not somebody to just walk away.

P2/2

The living story and especially the temporary nature that it has (or had?) is also related to that same questions, how do we get people to buy gems. Every 2 weeks a new ‘story’ means you have every two weeks a good excuse to put new items in the gem-store and the temporary nature also means you have an excuse to take them out again. And why taking them out again. Thats a marketing trick. Create a sense of urgency and you sell more.. they get you to buy more gems. Meanwhile it helps people to log in what helps to see the new items, then they try to convince you to buy.
I would have more fun if I could do thinks on my own pase and if there is really something I need / want work towards it. That would make it more fun but it does not fit there cash-shop focus if they would do that.

We can go on with the new hair-styles. I think this game would be better if there was a barber in the world and there you could cut your hair for 15 silver. It would be fun, it would be more immersive it would fit in the world. Once in a while some extra hair as an option would be nice and don’t get me wrong I am willing to pay for that.. with an expansion (just like with all the examples I talk about. I don’t expect Anet to make a game for free). But what do we get.. special hair that you can buy with gems. Changing your hair every two weeks is not really an option like this is it? But it is in there because Anet needs to make money, they do that using the gem-store and so need you to buy gems. If they would put it in the open world it might make the game better and more fun but you would not be buying gems. And once again the focus on the gem-store / convincing you to buy gems, was (imo) negative for the game.

I loved to go out and find mini’s in other games. Meet NPC’s all over the world that sell them. Do quest and get them, do dungeons to get them, even farm a few mobs 10000 times to get that very rare one and so on. But that would not make you buy gems so here most mini’s are in the gem-store and then (because of RNG) many end up in the TP what is no problem for them as it increases the value for gold (what makes gem 2 gold better.. the gold driven part). So the fun in collecting mini’s is gone. I don’t think it’s fun collecting mini’s in GW2 because of this. And I am talking about the act of collecting in this case. There are some really nice mini’s in the game. So once again an example how something that can be fun is destroyed because of a focus on the gem-store.

There are more examples but I think this part should be clear by now.

It’s the negative effects on the world of the focus on the gem-store (meaning they need to convince you to buy gems) that I don’t like.

You yourself say.. yeah I also don’t like the RNG boxes and the Living world, but maybe you should see that they have that the way they have it because in that way they get people like you to buy gems. Thats the main reason. If they would change that because of to many complains you can be sure they will come with other tactics with similar negative side-effects because as long as they focus on the cash-shop for income they need to get you to buy gems. “How do we get people to buy gems”.

If you want to really do something about those bad thinks you need to understand where they are coming from and then you might understand that buying gems is only gonna make that worse or at least is not helping to fix it.

For the record. I do not blame everything I do not like on this focus (I know some people might try to trow away this long post with a one line comment saying that). I would have preferred a real open world in stead of instanced maps, I would have preferred traditional quest next to what we have now and there are other thinks that I think could be better and I do not see as related to the gem-store focus. But yes I do see a lot of ‘in my eyes negative’ things indeed related to that gem-store focus.

I am also willing to pay for all this stuff. I know Anet has as goal making money and I am not somebody that is against that. However I am willing to pay for that with an expansion so we do not need to have all those negative effects we have now.

P1/2

Elthurien.8356:

Devata.6589:

At the same time there are also many more people that seem to think the same way.

Walking away would also mean walking away from the invested time so far and walking away from an amazing guild. So I prefer to bring this problem to the attention. We did have some suggest with bringing the temporary content stuff to there attention it seems looking at the last few patches. and ‘we’ also got the expansion back on the table where it first was off the table. So I will give this a try. I came to GW2 hoping to play it for years, I don’t like MMO hopping. This is the second MMORPG in my life I really invested time in so I won’t walk away that easily.

Besides maybe some gem-buyers also hate the negative side-effects bud did not see them as related. If I was to convince only one of them that would be a win I think.

What exactly is it about gem-buying that you are against?

• Do you not like Living World?
  I can understand this, as I’m not a huge fan of it myself.
• Do you not like RNG Gimmicks like skin tokens hiding inside Black Lion Chests?
  I can understand this, I hate Black Lion Chests and have only ever bought keys for them once. When I realised what a complete waste of money they are I never purchased them again.
• Do you not like people converting gems to gold?
  This is where the majority of my money goes, because I don’t have time to waste farming resources in PvE when I spend so much time in WvW.

snap~

To answer you last comment first. I do blame them first. But the only way to get them to ‘design it different’ is by getting the people like you to at least understand my viewpoint.

I will explain your question the best I can so I hope you will take your time to read and to try to understand it but it will be a long read. You asked for it

Let me start with saying.. It’s not the gem-store I have a problem with. It’s the cash-shop focus to generate income. In this case in stead of an expansion focus to generate income. Or even more precise, the effects that focus has on the game-world.

To start with your examples and a short explanation.

• Do you not like Living World?
  No I don’t like the way it is and do I blame the gem-store focus for a big part for that.

• Do you not like RNG Gimmicks like skin tokens hiding inside Black Lion Chests?
  It’s not the RNG box itself as I won’t buy it anyway it’s more the fact that it is in there.. This will come more clear later I hope.

• Do you not like people converting gems to gold?
  I also have no problem with that.

What I have a problem with is the side effects of that focus. Taking your own examples. For example the gem to gold.

Anet is now focusing on making money from the gem-store and that focus means they will try to make people like you buy gems to do that. It’s those thinks I do not like. In this case what they do is, they make sure the game is very gold-driven. Gold is very important in this game. Farming for gold is better then everything else you can do to get what you need.

I prefer a game where when I need an item I can go and get in a reasonable way. But because Anet tries to convince you to convert gems to gold they need to make sure gold is very important. Farming is in some cases no option at all but buying it with gold is almost always the option. In that way they make converting gems to gold more interesting.

So this is one example of a side effect of that focus and I do not dislike the fact that people convert gems to gold I dislike what Anet does to convince people to do that. It changes the ingame mechanics in (imo) a bad way. If they would focus on expansions in stead of the gem-store for income they would not have to try to get you to buy gems they would try to convince you to buy the expansion.

The question “how do we get him to buy gems” changes to “how do we get him to buy the expansion”. And for the gold-driven part that means there is not a good reason to make the game so gold-driven. Let them farm there goods, play there game and so get there things they want. For me it’s more fun to play the game so farming what I need in stead of having to do a lot of thinks with the pure goal of getting gold so I can then buy what I wanted or needed.

Same thing you get with the RNG boxes. They have those in there because they want you to buy gems and if you can buy a skin for 50 gems then you pay 50 gems and have the skin. Now if they hide them in RNG boxes of 1 gem a box you need to buy a 500 boxes in the hope to get the skin you want. (I know the prices are much higher. But I work with prices I think are more appropriate)
So the gem-store focus (them using the cash-shop as main source for income) is the reason for the RNG boxes being there.
>

chemiclord.3978:

Really? Because as I recall an expansion was never OFF the table. The entire article that spawned this discussion was Colin (?) claiming that if they felt they could deliver an expansions’ worth of content via the Living Story that it made sense for them to do it that way.

At least that was how I interpreted it, and ya know what… I agree with that. If they want to (and can) deliver that much content for free (hoping that it will entice gem store sales), I’m sure as hell not going to stop them.

Yes and No. The following is what happened. Many people did expect an expansion somewhere a year or a little more after release. One of the reasons for that is that Anet was known as a B2P company so then you need regular expansions. When you have a expansion after a year that also means you are working on that even before the release of the game.

Then about 5 months ago it became known that ArenaNet was not working on an expansion.

In a later interview when ask about this they came with the LS story. The following thread went about that:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/GW2-unlikely-to-get-expansions-Interview/first
And then yes he says it’s on the table but he also says “So right now we’re not really looking at expansions as an option”.

In the interview he also says “"If we do this right, we will probably never do an expansion and everything will be going into this Living World strategy.".

I think it’s fair to assume the goal is to “do it right” and with that yes a Expansion was really of the table.. The part of it not being of the table is then more that it would still be an option if they would not do it right. So as a back-up. But as real future plan it was for sure of the table.

(Also see the question of the interviewer:‘But what about making money? Guild Wars 1 survived on paid expansions, editions, add-ons, whatever you want to call them’ so I am not so special in assuming that was also the plan for GW2. It’s a name ArenaNet build on with GW1 and by changing money for GW2 they in a way showed they would continue that way. In stead they basically asked money for a F2P game.)

chemiclord.3978:

Devata.6589:

Well I did explain how it works and it might not sound reasonable and rational to you, that does not mean it is not true.

Like I said it are the side-effects.

GW2 was going down this path whether you liked it or not. And apparently, quite a few people do… because they keep doing it, and remain committed to it. With that in place, all that’s left for the customer is to support what you like, and don’t support what you don’t.

If you don’t like it at all… then it’s time to walk away.

At the same time there are also many more people that seem to think the same way.

Walking away would also mean walking away from the invested time so far and walking away from an amazing guild. So I prefer to bring this problem to the attention. We did have some suggest with bringing the temporary content stuff to there attention it seems looking at the last few patches. and ‘we’ also got the expansion back on the table where it first was off the table. So I will give this a try. I came to GW2 hoping to play it for years, I don’t like MMO hopping. This is the second MMORPG in my life I really invested time in so I won’t walk away that easily.

Besides maybe some gem-buyers also hate the negative side-effects bud did not see them as related. If I was to convince only one of them that would be a win I think.

pdg.8462:

I don’t need quests to motivate me to go explore some cave like the OP needs. And I certainly don’t want something akin to the “quest log” as those tend to fill up quickly and I feel pressed to finish all those quests, even the ones that are no longer appropriate for my level; well, that’s just me.

You are correct that you should not be required to do all quest. Doing the quest you like the best should do the trick.. not showing question-markets above quest-givers might be a help there.

But in GW2 you do need to do all hearts and vista’s and waypoints (not events) because it gives you map-completion that gives you a reward (one of the better rewards in the game I think) and eventually leads to world completion that you then need to get a legendary.. and then you can do exactly the same again with your alts… Oow the joy.

So the way it now works is how you say you do not want quest to work.. except for the quest log. But personally I don’t see the quest-log as problem as long as you do not need to do everything. You collect the ones you like or more and when you are a to high level you drop the low level quest out of the list.

Vayne.8563:

HiddenNick.7206:

Vayne.8563:

perilisk.1874:

“When I’m walking down a road and I see a small cave in the distance and there’s no point of interest, vista, skill point or heart in there, I have literally no motivation to explore there. Now, if there was the possibility of me finding a quest in there which would nicely reward me I might have the motivation to explore the world a bit more.”

Why do you need some sort of reward? Sure, if there’s nothing there but a couple of mobs, that’s boring. But just adding something of interest, a neat sight, a little story played out in the environment, some NPCs talking, an easter egg or unique mob, etc. would be enough for a lot of people.

There are things like that hidden in caves in this game. Even something as simple as a rich ore vein, or some character you can talk to.

It doesn’t happen all the time (because if it did, it wouldn’t be special) but it does happen.

But there is no lore or story tied to that vein or chest is it? And is that vein a start of a longer and more complicated story? No… It isn’t.

There are other things I’ve found in caves besides Ore veins. That was but a single example.

I mean it would be really REALLY stupid if every single cave had an NPC in it, that would give you a story about the world. But there are things in this game off the beaten track that you can find that give you some sort of story or information or whatever.

I’ve found most of the jumping puzzles in this game by exploring as well.

Story about the life of the NPC (Like in OP’s example) would also be nice (does not all need to go about the world). Yes you are correct there are some paces where such little stories unfold but it’s just happening.. I am not part of it. It does not make me go explore or do anything and thats why a quest can be better. And those thinks where I am part of.. events, feel useless because they keep happening over and over again. When doing a quest you see progress for you the world changes a little bid but with the events it’s just a reoccurring thing all the time and nothing really changes.

In Kessex Hills you have that bridge that you have to defend every time you get there.. it’s like.. I just did that 10 min ago, and 10 min before that. The feeling of victory also gets lost that way.

chemiclord.3978:

Part of the problem is that Arena.net tried to introduce a different way of playing MMOs to an audience that had grown accustomed to a certain way of doing things.

Players quickly grinding through lower level content and squatting in the highest level zones is HARDLY unique to GW2. Go to ANY MMO and you’ll see the same thing. Players have been conditioned to “grind through, hit endgame, and the game REALLY starts.”

Now, the question I have repeatedly had for Arena.net is… “So?” They had a laundry list of problems about traditional MMOs that I’m not convinced are really problems.

For example, they didn’t want people to choose a race based on racial skills, so they made those racial skills considerably weaker. But… how is that a problem to begin with? Ironically, it didn’t even solve the supposed problem to begin with… a good many people still chose their race for trivial reasons.

It’s the same sort of thing here. Why are instanced “raids” and a traditional “endgame” a problem? Don’t tell me “because it demands vertical progression.” It only demands such progression if you create a system that requires increasing stats.

I like that they are STARTING to create content that requires more coordination to complete… even though I still don’t get why it has to be “5-man” or “open world.” Why is 10 or 20 player instanced content this terrible thing that must be avoided at all costs?

They don’t want mounts for… reasons. Apparently they do… something bad. So? Why are they a problem? Is the waypoint gold sink REALLY that big? Who cares that you’d give something that gives, I dunno… 50% increased movement speed?

It’s these sort of things that, while not gamebreaking for me, still make me wonder how they are really problems to begin with.

Because WoW?

Elthurien.8356:

Devata.6589:

Who did here that should be in the expansion? It sure wasn’t me.

Huh?

Missed the word ‘say’. I have edited. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

chemiclord.3978:

Devata.6589:

Im Mudbone.1437:

Devata.6589:

Tower Guard.5263:

Devata.6589:

What is funny is that I see multiple people say. I spend (a lot of) money on gems but don’t like the way the game is going now so might stop playing / spengin money.. The way the game is going now is strongly linked to the gem-store as its being build around the whole idea of how to get people to buy gems. And indeed thats not good for the game.

So basically buy spending so much money you guys made the game go in the direction it is going now. Hopefully you learned your lesson. There is no bad thing in giving money however, better do that for expansions so you know the game will go in the correct direction in stead of spending it on a cash-shop resulting in a game focusing itself around that with all negative side-effects that come with it.

For your information, I stopped spending when the content was not to my liking, I haven’t spent anything for the last 2-3 moths or so, since Zephyr Sanctum.

Yeah thats very smart of you but you are aware that you help them to go into this wrong direction? Thats all I am saying. Some do understand that some don’t. It’s important that people do understand that.

And some just don’t care.

Sadly true.

He ruining ruining things by supporting the things he likes… and not supporting the things he doesn’t?

Dunno, sounds like he’s being reasonable and rational to me.

Well I did explain how it works and it might not sound reasonable and rational to you, that does not mean it is not true.

Like I said it are the side-effects.

Elthurien.8356:

Devata.6589:

If you would not pay for gems (well and people like you) but would pay expansions then you didn’t need to pay money to not having to be wasting your valuable time doing the things I don’t enjoy.

But because you do other people have to. Or they get bored with the game.

Funny enough the time-gated content is part of that tactic you help to create as it is part of the “getting people to log in” and then hoping they will buy stuff. So basically you helped to destroy the game for yourself and for us. But it’s good to read you did stop spending money now.

Just in the future be sure you can better spend it on expansions or if you don’t mind a clock over your head.

You’re living in a fantasy if you think Arena.Net had any intention of having a limited gem store and relying on paid expansions, GW2 was designed around the Gem Store, so me (and people like me) not spending money in the gem store would have quit the game long ago when we were forced to craft or do PvE for any exotic gear beside Invaders.

If GW2 launched without the gem stores option to convert gems-gold, they would have lost a hell of a lot of revenue, revenue that is used to create things like Living World every 2 weeks, constant additions of art (it takes a lot of resources and time to design, create and implement a set of weapon skins), hiring more employees, upgrading and adding new tech, creating new and improved systems for the game and countless other things that most people are unaware of.

I am quite happy to pay to help make this game a great game. I don’t expect special treatment for spending as much as I do, because I’m aware that a decent portion what I spend goes back into the game, whether it’s through paying somebodies wage, additional art assets, new maps, new content, or even additional tech upgrades.

When design direction starts taking advantage of me (Ascended Crafting) and time-gating things to coerce me into buying more and more gems-gold, that is when I stop buying gems. I don’t give a kitten about paying for expansions, if those expansions increase level cap or add more vertical progression or power creep to the game.

If GW2 was build around the Gem-Store and so basically uses a F2P model (income on cash-shop) they should have made the game available for free like all F2P games.

Anet was known for it’s B2P model from GW1 so if I am living in a fantasies world it is because Anet showed how that world would exist with GW1.

Once again somebody tels me they need money.. Yeah I know that.. I just want they generate that with expansions not with gems because all the negative side-effects.

You don’t see or better don’t care about those side-effects and thats also why you think you help made this game better. But the way I see it (caring and don’t liking those effects) you help to destroy this game by buying gems.

About how you don’t give a kitten about paying for expansions, if those expansions increase level cap or add more vertical progression or power creep to the game.

Who did here say that should be in the expansion? It sure wasn’t me.
Not that I would care, I don’t mind higher level cap but it would be nice if the armor would just stay the same. However thats not the point here is it.

Delryn.7235:

~

So onto my main point, GW2 needs quests. Once again, I don’t mean “gather X things”, we already have that, we don’t need more.

What I do mean are quests which make you go out, explore, discover and challenge yourself in the world. Right now GW2 is completely barren and empty of substance and content in the open world.

When I’m walking down a road and I see a small cave in the distance and there’s no point of interest, vista, skill point or heart in there, I have literally no motivation to explore there. Now, if there was the possibility of me finding a quest in there which would nicely reward me I might have the motivation to explore the world a bit more.

On top of that the quests themselves could make you explore the world to complete them, as quests usually do.

Think for example you explore a cave to find a dead body in the end with a note on it, you pick up the note which starts a quest. The note ends up being the last written words of the doomed person, in the note he explains how he regrets leaving his family in Lornar’s Pass, who are waiting for him in Pinion Pass.

You now find this note from a mysterious dead man and you have clues (it’s important not to just tell the players ‘go to location X’, let them figure it out but give them decent and simple clues) on where to go and what to do.

Once you meet his family they might reveal something about the dead man’s motivations, why he was there and what happened, etc.

I mean the possibilities are endless, imagine how epic it would be if you found this quest in a Lv1-15 area but had to go to a Lv25-40 area to complete it. Now you have a reason to go to this location, you have something to look forward to when you level up. You’re driven by your desire to find this location and continue on your quest, and imagine how fulfilling it would feel when you’re finally able to find Pinion Pass.

So in conclusion, I think GW2 needs these sort of hidden, mysterious, rewarding, and even challenging epic quests which send you out on an adventure. Also, rewarding is very important, players won’t be bothered unless they have a reward to look forward to. That’s why events feel so mundane after a while, their rewards are very uninspiring.

PS; quests are a great way to tell a story or dish out lore about the game, another thing GW2 currently lacks.

TL;DR – we need epic and challenging quests in the game which make you want to explore the world. Not talking about “gather X things”, we have those in the form of hearts and events already. GW2 is severely lacking depth and something to do in the world, and Living Story hasn’t been cutting it.

Sorry for the horrifically long post too.

Agree I been ‘asking’ for quest since the beta (mainly in fan forums but also here). It really makes a connection with the world. Here there are many NPC’s but I don’t feel a connection with the world of the NPC’s. In a way the world looks fake because NPS’s are seemingly having no purpose. I like to know the background of some of them and get a nice reward for it.

Your theath reminds me of those topics where I gave a similar example however you talk about a cave I talked about a little house. You go there find a woman who is worried because her son is lost, you go and discover he is eaten by some animal. Back at here place she ask you if you would give the sad news to his brother who lives far away. Eventually you get there (exploring the world) and tell the news. He is someone who breed birds for a living and to tank you for making the long journey he gives you one of his birds (mini). His neighbor then trust you and also ask you for a favorer and so on.

Something else that kept me exploring the world was fun-crafts like you have in some mmo’s. Most famous one will be engineering in WoW. In GW2 you explore the world mainly to level and to well see whats out there but there is no real unfolding story or goal to your journey.

Then again. GW2 makes money with there gems so nice rewards they prefer putting in the gem-store and it’s also not really one open world. More multiple maps. That does not help in this case. You don’t wander into a new area you load into it.

And while events feel useless non-world changing because they keep repainting. Quest end for that char so in a way you see the world progress for you. You did help that person and maybe that initiates a new quest.

Elthurien.8356:

I keep all the email receipts so I can manage how much I put into this game. Last check was quite substantially higher than a subscription MMO. To put it into perspective, I have payed for about 15 years worth of subscription since launch. Out of that time I have been afk for around a total of 4 months. I don’t mind though, the money I spend on gems and gems-gold means I can spend more of my game time doing the things I enjoy, not wasting my valuable time doing the things I don’t enjoy.

The only problem is when aspects of the game become time gated. Laurels and time-gated Transmutations for crafting means much of my time is now spent doing daily chores, gathering, daily achievements, charging stones, transmuting ascended wood and metal. Since these features have crept into the game, I cannot use money to avoid the grind, I need to use time, unfortunately time is more valuable to me. I spend 2-3 hours in GW2 on weekdays and around 6-8 hours a day on weekends doing WvW. I do not want to spend that time farming, gathering or refining for bind on account gear and since it is now time gated, I no longer have to spend money on it either. ANet is losing quite a lot of money from me and others like me since time gating was introduced.

If you would not pay for gems (well and people like you) but would pay expansions then you didn’t need to pay money to not having to be wasting your valuable time doing the things I don’t enjoy.

But because you do other people have to. Or they get bored with the game.

Funny enough the time-gated content is part of that tactic you help to create as it is part of the “getting people to log in” and then hoping they will buy stuff. So basically you helped to destroy the game for yourself and for us. But it’s good to read you did stop spending money now.

Just in the future be sure you can better spend it on expansions or if you don’t mind a clock over your head.