If we were still in launch GW2, I would agree with you, but we aren’t.
Light Fields have become much more valuable now, not only because of the better Leap and Blast finishers, but also because conditions are much more prominent in all game modes. Is it better to blast heal for 1.3k or wipe off those 10 burn stacks? I’d generally prefer the burn to be removed, as that “heals” far more. Or the immobilize so I could dodge. There are many, many times when a condi cleanse is more important than 1.3k health.
Light and Water fields are both supportive in nature, and both are valuable now because of how the game has changed.
For what it’s worth, I agree it would make more thematic sense for Well of Blood to be a Water Field, but I don’t think that would actually improve the skill.
Well of Blood synergizes better with what finishers Necros do have as a Light field rather than water.
Mainly because two of our best finishers are both in Reaper’s Shroud where healing gets totally wasted. Mass condi clear/light aura are both better.
Not exactly. Corpses usually persist until players have taken all of their loot from a kill.
I don’t know every reason for them to linger, but unclaimed loot is one.
Its “impact” is one game mode, so you are already just wrong. How difficult would it be for them to just say “WvW uses the PvP version?” Not at all. The split is already there, they’re just changing where the line is drawn.
Not a waste but balanced.
Deathly Chill in its current state (3 bleeds for 5 to 10 seconds) should also have an ICD of at least 2 seconds.
Why?
Because Necro has so many skills and utilities that apply chills which allow them to stack up a large number of stacks. It’s even more of an issue for those skills and utilities which pulse. PvE also has an issue with an ice environmental weapon which has an auto attack that allows you to get and maintain about 40 stacks of bleed.
Adding an internal cooldown would bring the trait back into balance while still allow chills to add bleed stacks.
I don’t think it’s unbalanced, maybe underpowered. Necros are still behind any other profession in the dps department.
Underpowered? You just haven’t seen it in action yet.
I will guess that you are talking from WvW perspective, while the rest talks either from PvP or PvE one.
Yes, Deathly Chill in WvW is overpowered because, as with many skills, traits and effects, WvW shares balance with PvE where DChill was recently buffed. The solution to this problem is splitting Deathly Chill balance from PvE in the same way they did split Epidemic, not internal cooldowns.
I’m talking about both WvW and PvE (not dungeons, fractals, raids). That just creates more work when a 2 sec ICD should be adequate ir they can just bring it back to a single bleed stack.
Yet that solution would further cripple necromancers in raiding, fractals and dungeons. They aren’t separate from PvE. And yes, raid balance is the most important factor because anything works in open world. Open world balance isn’t even a thing.
It’s recently been causing some issues in WvW and especially when combined with epidemic. Just because something makes a class more competitive in raids, doesn’t justify there not being an adjustment to something that is a little over the top. It’s a similar rationale that I’ve seen some people use to justify exploiting. And no, I’m not saying this trait is exploiting in case you somehow reach that conclusion for some reason. Other areas shouldn’t go unbalanced just so necros can keep up in raids.
Or maybe, they do the split balancing like was suggested and you ignored.
Only buff I could see is reducing its recharge.
If they went insane they could make it grant chill/cripple/ward immunity for the duration.
I’d prefer the second.
I wish minion mancers didn’t exist. It’s difficult to even target the necro and it turns into a utter FusterCluck if there are two on the same point.
Hit “tab” once and you immedietly get the Necro.
That said, minions are quite helpful for doing things like soloing dungeons. Boss attacks still hit really hard, so having them target minions instead gives you plenty of time to build your life force for when they do actually target you.
Do you think it would help if the trait was in blood magic? I think it was also nerfed to have a cooldown on the shroud activation. Anyways mind sharing your build I’m willing to try it
That’s the current version of the PvP build. WvW is similar, though with mostly Zealot’s gear.
It’s not top-tier by any stretch of the imagination, but it deals decent damage while being stupidly resilient. Not a great teamfight build (it can contribute, but not that well), but it handles 1v1’s and 1v2’s quite well against most foes.
As for if it would help being in Blood Magic? It certainly could, though it does work excellently with Shrouded Removal. At the same time, Blood Magic desperately needs a usable Grandmaster in solo situations where you aren’t running wells, and is the “regain health” line anyway.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
When the trait first released, I did actually have a strong build for it. Things have changed a bit since the Specialization update and general power creep. While the original build is stronger now than it was then (Shrouded Removal is a hell of a lot stronger now,) it didn’t keep up to everything else getting stronger as well.
I think it would actually be a good build if:
- the heal amount was higher
- Master tier of Death Magic was worth anything outside of Minion builds.
Umm, the GS auto chain ends with the entire sword being encased in ice. It’s extremely easy to see when it ends.
On a semi-related question, would you be running “Nothing Can Save You!” if it were instant-cast?
No, life force generation is currently based on enemy deaths as far as I was aware.
All weapons (excluding offhand dagger) have LF generating skills. A slew of Utility skills do as well.
See link for list:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Life_forceLF from enemy deaths is literally the smallest and least relevant source of LF. For theory crafting purpose you basically ignore it completely.
Which is also why Soul Comprehension is the most worthless trait in the entire game. It may contribute for about 1% of total life force gains when equipped. In PvE, not PvP (where it’s assuredly lower).
I thank you all for your input on ST and BC, but lets stay on topic.
Crinn, that’s fantastic. I honestly didn’t think of that. The trait seems so much better now.
Does it trigger on down players too?
Mesmer Clones rarely exist with less than 25% health, so keep that in mind.
I actually don’t know about it working on downed players or not.
Spiteful Renewal will not heal through Shroud, though it will still remove a condition then.
It works like this:
You strike an enemy. If that enemy is below 25% health, this may proc. If you have a condition and it is off cooldown, it will remove a condition from you. Then, if you are not in shroud, it will heal you.
Yes, it is. Annoying, but it is intended.
While in Shroud, you DO NOT gain life force for nearby deaths. Only from skill effects like Life Transfer or Spectral Armor or traits like Chilling Victory.
I’d like to see a trait that blinds nearby foes on enter/exit of Shroud. Honestly, we need better blinds if that is our “block.”
Unless they changed it (never saw a patchnote saying as such), Reaper’s Onslaught does affect stomp and rez speeds. Also reduces channel time for Temple of the Silent Storm and Champion’s Dusk buffs.
If you run Decimate Defenses, you can usually skimp out on Precision to a point. Anything you get above 50% crit chance is effectively wasted stats.
Or give a Dark Aura on Leap: new effect that siphons life from attackers. Probably about 2/3 of Retaliation damage, but you gain the amount as health, too.
Realistically, how can a skill named “Nightfall” have any combo field type but Dark?
Probably a tooltip bug. It certainly used to work as expected.
Yeah, no. He was keeping the frontline topped off quite well with ease. That wouldn’t have been possible if he were present in the frontline himself.
Mind showing off the build?
Ventari Rev looks fantastic in group WvW now.
Unblockable projectiles ignore all reflects and destruction, as do siege.
But CPC is still a very good utility. Rangers have one ranged skill that they can use against you through a CPC, and if you place it on yourself, for those 8 seconds, most classes have to fight you under Weakness and Poison if they want to do anything at all.
um that is exactly what shroud does, -50% damage taken, infact its better than protection, it just doesn’t last forever. And necro do infact have access to protection aswell.
We have extremely limited access to protection in very short durations. And yes we do have some other sources of of scaling mitigation.
looks at my character where I maintain 75-100% Protection uptime solo
Okay.
Honestly, we just need more sources of life force gain that scale with the number of opponents. 1v1, our life force is fine, it’s the CC vulnerability that kills us.
Teamfights, it’s more often the life force that’s the issue.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Marjory's_Dagger_Skin
Makes some of our skills very hard to see, which is fantastic for PvP/WvW.
One thing to know about Vampirism and Scavenger runes is that you can “prime” a lifesteal before a fight by using your heal skill. Any time you are between fights is a decent time to do this, as your heal skill is usually back up before you need it again, and it gives your first strike an extra ~1k damage.
The buff you get lasts 16 hours if you never hit anything, so you might as well.
I ran it on my Necro. Honestly, it should be easy regardless of class if you have a ranged weapon. Tough to melee, though.
Never had an issue with either skill functioning.
I love using Suffer to transfer a Taunt or Fear, though :p
Spectral Wall will actually work nicely. Wall skills ignore evasion frames.
In PvE, just use Chilling Nova or Augury of Death. Both work well for Power builds.
No change needed. It’s good as-is.
Lame in PvE, I will admit, but everywhere else?
You’re correct. Had to go into the Training Area to test it, but you are correct.
All siphons (except Dagger 2, which I believe is coded specially) ignore Armor and damage reduction of any kind.
Actually dagger 2 isnt the only one that doesnt ignore armor and dc. SoL and our downstate auto life leech also get effected by armor and dr. Those skills also can crit, which other siphons cannot do.
Signet of the Locust is armor ignoring and can’t crit. It’s a true siphon.
Spear 3 is like Dagger 2 and Downed 1, though.
In PvE, Healing Power on Necros is never really worth it. Our group heals just aren’t that great overall (even if they do have absurd scaling, they are too infrequent). I do it, but only because I don’t want to invest in yet another set of armor for my Necro.
In PvP and WvW, it can really throw off your opponents. I have had people lay enough damage into me to kill me three times over and I’m still healthy. They just don’t have cooldowns left after that, usually.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
and the healing portion is based on healing power, I’m guessing. Is the scaling from power and healing power significant enough to be considered? (Power you’re gonna stat for anyways, but wondering if healing power scales well for this.)
On Vampiric and Vampiric Presence, not really. Combined they give every hit a .9% Healing Power coefficient. Vampiric Rituals isn’t really worth building Healing Power for either, as it only scales at .5%
I don’t know the scaling on Vampiric’s minion siphoning effect. I will calculate that in-game and get back to you. It’s better than the self-siphon, though.
Soul Eater: 4% Healing Power/Gravedigger hit
Augury of Death: 2% Healing Power/Shout hit
Signet of the Locust has a 50% Healing Power coefficient/target. Blood Bond/Signet of Vampirism have 24% Healing Power/stack. Both give great returns when you get more than one hit.
Life Siphon (Dagger 2) is 10% Healing Power/hit (up to 9 hits). 90% Healing Power coefficient on a 12 second cooldown is higher return than most Healing skills. Keep in mind that this doesn’t behave like most siphons, since the damage it deals is subject to armor and other damage reductions. However, also unlike other siphons, it can crit. It’s really a “hit 9 times, gain health each time you hit” rather than a siphon.
The following are gear/food and as such will not heal through Shroud:
Sigil of Blood scales with Power at 7.5% and Healing Power at 10%.
Sigil of Draining scales with Power at 7.5% and Healing Power at 20%.
Sigil of Leeching doesn’t scale with your stats at all.
Food does not scale with your stats at all.
Runes of the Vampire and Runes of Scavenging do not scale with your stats at all.
Depends on the siphon. If it’s from food, sigils, or runes, it does not scale with Power on the damage component, nor does it heal through Shroud.
From Necromancer traits and skills, the siphon will scale with Power for the damage portion, Healing Power for the healing portion, and will heal through Shroud.
Exact numbers on scaling vary with the source.
Vampiric Presence scales off of the stats of the Necromancer supplying the aura.
All siphons (except Dagger 2, which I believe is coded specially) ignore Armor and damage reduction of any kind.
(edited by Drarnor Kunoram.5180)
I think Superspeed is a bit much.
If I were to add anything to Spectral Walk, I would probably give it “while under the effects of Spectral Walk, ignore Crippled, Chilled and Immobilized”.
Either that or removal + immunity to those three while under its effects. Much like how Utility Goggles on Engineer makes you immune to Blind for its duration.
I would probably have it be even more effective at debilitation. Traits like increased effectiveness of Weakness applied, or greater healing reduction from Poison. Sprinkle in some unique debuffs (not conditions) and you get the class that just makes your opponents suck
Necros won’t be the highest damage class, but they really should make you dread fighting them because of the long, drawn-out slogfest that you will be getting yourself into where you can’t do anything effectively.
Oh, and much better pulls. Giving Necros a 1500 range no-projectile pull would be amazing.
Yeah, it does fall apart against Necro Scepter. Another possibility would be that it auto-stunbreaks with an ICD of 20-30 seconds and has no other effect.
I don’t think I agree with the Grasping Dead change, but I can’t argue much on most of those. Making Reaper’s Onslaught apply equally to both Greatsword and Reaper’s Shroud?
Here’s my idea for replacing Soul Comprehension:
Deadened Flesh: Gain Stability when disabled. (1 stack, 5 seconds). No ICD.
Doesn’t help prevent the initial disable, but it does make chain CC much harder to pull off.
I saw about five different enemy necros running both Blood and Death magic today in PvP (Gold Tier).
What is this new witchcraft?
Desperation, I’m sure.
The Healing Power bonus is honestly the better part of Last Rites. Contrary to what you constantly hear, Necros actually have very good scaling with Healing Power.
I definitely agree that core shroud is far less strong than RS. However, necro is probably the strongest core spec compared to it’s elite spec. Between seasons i played both core and reaper necro a lot, and corenecro is honestly fairly playable. Reaper is def better, but the difference is definitely smaller than other classes. Try playing ranger without druid or Mes without chrono. Far more significant difference.
The reason for that is that the design of repear is replacement and not addition. Whoever designed the chronomancer basically didnt understand good design principles as they just made it strictly better than mesmer and so obsoleted mesmer.
Robert Gee designed both Chronomancer and Reaper.
Why not stayin simple :
Tormentor’s comprehension : Whenever you corrupt a boon, you gain 1% life force 1 second ICD.
Keeping the idea of the trait and making it a fit for the forever LF starving condibuild that actually make sense.
Thats not a good idea for a minor trait because not every necro build even has corruption skills/traits. Minor traits should always be more general.
Also i dont think it suits deathmagic at all which is supposed to be a more defensive minion orientated traitline. Boon hate is more a spite/curses thing.
Anyone can use a scepter and corrupt a boon every 3 attack. Everyone can take an axe and use skill#3.
The purpose of soul comprehension is personal sustain what I propose is exactly that except that it fit more condi spec than power spec since condi spec will take scepter no matter what.
Also… in death magic we do have a trait that’s called corruptor fervor which take advantage of us using condition on foes.
Greatsword/Staff.
I know it’s not a good pair, but it is a weapon pair with 0 corruption ability on it. They recently changed some Guardian weapons so that every set had a Symbol for better synergy with Zeal.
When entering shroud, evade attacks for 0.5 – 1 seconds while dashing forwards a small distance. 10 sec icd. Boom.
Drop the dash and the ICD and I’d be cool with that.
Not base necro though lol. Shows what they think about necro, they dont care.
Guardian and necro are unique in that their elite HOT specs replace rather than build on the core specs. So there is no reason for necro shroud to be so bad vs repear shroud except for the fact they dont care. Same with guardian.
Warriors burst was replaced with primal burst.
They still have their regular burst, too.
Sadly a terrible choice, since core Necro has only one trait and elite skills that grant Stability. It would be almost decent with Reaper Shroud 3, but that ICD means it only applies the extra stack on every other pulse.
Even on the transformations, the extra stack is awkward, since it doesn’t last until the next pulse. Plague you don’t really care about it anyway, since the 3 stacks are difficult to strip and, even when they are, you don’t care about most disables in that form, since it keeps ticking away anyway.
No, I do not count Well of Power.