Guild Wars 2

I don’t think it’s the players that don’t appreciate the Thief… at least not the Thief players.

I believe it’s the devs that do not appreciate the Thief.

Sadly, the longer I’m around here, the less I believe the Thief is going to get fixed any time soon… unless you mean “fixed” in the way that dogs get fixed. I would say that I am losing faith, but I have no faith. Unless the devs are secretly overhauling the Thief behind the scenes, I just don’t see it happening, sadly. If they were doing it any other way, then you would see simple things like Withdraw’s healing increasing 10% in one of these small patches. We are literally talking ONE number in ONE line of code… or perhaps two numbers if you count the Healing Power coefficient.

Unfortunately, virtually every change AFTER June 23rd has been negative for the Thief. Yeah, 3 of 10 pistol skills got a damage increase, but all 10 got their range reduced. Improvisation can reset Physical skills now, but that’s a double-edged sword in itself. In fact, the ONLY truly positive thing I can think of is Death Blossom’s evade duration increase.

By the way, let’s not forget about the extinction of Vampire runes. The Thief was the one profession that needed them the most for survival.

AegisFLCL.7623:

Thief has no viable way of might stacking without wasting all utility slots and giving up defensive cooldowns.

- Redesign of traitlines for a form of self might stacking like other classes

I think Might stacking would go a long way for the Thief. It could allow us to start taking Vitality and Toughness gear so we can survive without losing all of our damage output. And it would also allow Glass Cannons to actually hit like Glass cannons should!

As in my Of Shadow and Flame post, as much as I dislike the Shortbow, I say add a Fire Field on Cluster Bomb (or Detonate Cluster) even if it’s only for one second. Let it self-combo just as Black Powder does.

It takes half a second to shoot a Cluster Bomb. It also costs 3 initiative. Plus, it takes time to actually hit the ground (depending on distance). Yes, we can “spam it,” but it takes time to max it on ourselves and depletes all of our initiative. It can be used for ranged team support, but getting Cluster Bombs downrange can be SLOW.

EDIT:
Unless I’m mistaken, it will take 9 Blast Finishers to reach 25 stacks of Might with a Fire Field.

9 Cluster Bombs = 27 initiative

27 – 15 (initial initiative) = 12 initiative = +12 seconds of recharge

In other words, stacking Might will take significant effort and time, and even when completed, the Thief is left with no initiative and probably about 5 seconds (or less) of a full 25 stacks of Might. To reduce the time required to stack, you’ll have to start traiting or using/slotting utilities to do so.

Zdenny.2704:

OP is right, devs gives thief some exact abilities and ppl are just crying here that they want to play different style than the thief is set for.

That is incorrect. The devs REMOVED things from the Thief, and they are SELLING things in the form of Daredevil. They haven’t GIVEN the Thief or its players anything.

However, if you or the OP would be willing to gift HoT to the rest of the Thief community, then maybe the “whining” will lessen.

Eisenwald.8562:

You got my attention with that nearly 18k backstab…what the kitten kind of build is that you’re running? Did the enemy have max stacks of vuln and did you have max might stacks or something? I just don’t even see how this is possible but you’ve got screenshots to prove it.

Signet/Trapper.
25 stacks of Might on me, 10 stacks of Vulnerability on my target.

Complete ambush build. I did feel a bit sorry for the Thief I hit. I say I “one-shotted” him because my Backstab was the only damaging skill I used. Set a Shadow Trap on a point, saw him coming, I ran away like a coward and let him see me go. He tripped the trap, I popped Assassin’s Signet, activated Shadow Pursuit (Shadow Trap), and Trip Wired on top of him. Backstabbed him while he was down. RIP, Thief :-(

However, I was proud of my Warrior kill. We were locked in a duel on point. He nearly got me a few times. But my traps cooled off, and I decided to lay one as I was running through the point. He triggered it, and I was able to get my shot in. Sadly, it usually doesn’t work that way.

Anyway, here are pics of the build. And I’d change some of the traits if I’d want a chance at an even higher damaging Backstab, but this one is dependable. I’d also go with Scholar runes after the Vamp nerf. By the way, I have sigils of Force and Impact on my Dagger/Pistol.

The bottom line… Thief is definitely OP at defending a point. Even more than D/D Elementalist ever was… well, you know… if the opponent stops moving, suspects nothing, drops his guard, doesn’t set traps/wells/marks around him, or have invulnerabilities/passive defenses that ignore CC.

arenta.2953:

were they wearing all their armor pieces?

Well, I didn’t see their undies. Not even skin that I can remember. I would find it odd for two players to both be running without all their armor, though. If they were naked, perhaps, but not just random armor pieces missing.

However, I do practice on naked golems :-)

arenta.2953:

if you mean in sPvP. then any backstab hit would never go above 6k. unless u missing pieces of your armor.

I beg to disagree. In one match, my Thief “one-shotted” another Thief with a 17.888k Backstab. She also downed a Warrior with a 13.347k Backstab at the end of the match. Both were fully armored…

EDIT: It happened on September 1st, 2015.

For me, the main problem with Dagger/Dagger is the lack of a FULL gap closer on the actual weapon set. Dagger/Pistol has Shadow Shot. Shortbow has Infiltrator’s Arrow. Sword/X has Infiltrator’s Strike. Getting close enough to actually use Cloak and Dagger is an issue for me. I have to rely on Steal and Infiltrator’s Signet. So if I dodge to evade a melee attack, I just took myself out of range to Stealth. And if I’m fighting a ranged opponent with things on cooldown… I’m in serious trouble.

Not only does it lack the ability to Blind, but it also lacks the ability to Interrupt.

Please make the Thief worthy of being feared again. Yes, think of Balrog-level fear!

Give Shortbow 2 (Cluster Bomb or Detonate Cluster) a Fire Field so we can stack Might on ourselves… so we can actually build with Vitality and Toughness and still do decent damage.

Thank you and good day! :-)

Jana.6831:

But I’m kind of not myself today – so..

Invasion of the Thief Snatchers!!!

merrykitten .9423:

After dying so many times, your body becomes used to the dmg, so you just become completely immune. Almost every thief has unlocked this, how come you still havn’t done it yet? In fact, if you die 100000000000000000000000 times, you will gain the ability to teleport to any enemy on the map and instantly kill them, this skill is so kitten op!

Ah, so that’s the “Ghost Thief” build I’ve been hearing about so much!

AlCojester.4316:

On behalf of zdenny:

Thieves = King Arthur

merrykitten .9423:

T is the troll level measured in kittens (since Anet loves cats so much)

But I thought ANet hates cats.
Kittens are always getting kicked around here :-(

Blaine Tog.8304:

It definitely, certainly, absolutely, positively should not prevent stealthed allies from applying Reveal to themselves by attacking, though. Stealth skills are balanced around the understanding that they cannot be used in quick succession. Breaking that would be incredibly foolish, plus massive machine-gunned damage from out of nowhere would be intolerable to play against.

Wow! I can actually see it! People may actually want more than one Thief on a team just for Shadow Refuge! :-D

Picture it… the beginning of a match. One player from each team goes for their home points. The other 4 (Thieves included) rush mid. 8 players clash at the point!

Opposing Thieves each throw down Shadow Refuge in the center of the point. All of the players dash inside!

We have 4v4… everybody invisible and silent. Everybody swinging wildly in the air. AoE’s getting stacked on that one spot. For 4 solid seconds, the mid point literally looks like a ghost town. But if you could put on special goggles, you’d see the war of the ages happening! :-D

Add a second Thief to your team, and you’d have the advantage of another 4 seconds of invisibility… but you would be allowing the opposing visible team to cap the point. What to do? What to do??? :-D

Wow, wow, wow, WOW!!! It’s like this scene… but imagine right after the initial clash, everybody vanishes!!! :-D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FixGtngBdhE

Zero Day.2594:

As flawed as that may seem, I believe it comes from the same notion of +1 for the thief. Since we’ve already established that 0 < T < 1, T is then a fraction. However, players cannot be quantified in fractal form, as in there can’t be a half a player, they then proceed to round up T, giving it a value of 1. Like wise 1.1 is rounded down to 1 so that 4,344 * 1 = 4,344.

From this we can also deduce that T may very well be 0.5 <= T < 1, since in order to round a number up it has to be at least half or more.

Eureka!!!
So that explains it all!!!

Thieves are not real players! They are merely AI that anticipates a player’s actions. That would account for all of the oddities that gets attributed to latency. So a Thief is just slightly different from a Ranger’s pet. Not necessarily better… just different.

But that begs some questions…

Why does ANet keep up such a charade? Was the Thief always an AI? Or was it merely patched to be sometime after launch? And who was responsible for making such a change???

merrykitten .9423:

since thieves are supposed to be hiding

Well, they were hiding… until ANet gave everyone and their mother skills that Revealed the imaginary Thieves. That would also explain why Thieves were not given those skills… because they were hiding when the skills were given.

Zero Day.2594:

That mathematical model seems rather flawed, Dr. Kage.

Of course it does. It is based on ANet’s mathematical principles, not mine :-P

According to them…
(4,344 * 1.1) = 4,344

But yes, the “T factor” seems to be one of those crazy phenomena that defy common sense.

Yes, “a = o” unless “t” is involved. Simply because “a” cannot Rally off of “t” where “o” can. Not to mention that “t” anywhere near more than one “o” soon becomes “dt” (Downed Thief), and that can theoretically cause all kinds of results. Not only can “do” Rally from “dt,” but “a” may actually become “da” from trying to revive “dt,” not to mention that “dt” in one equation is of less value than “t” in another equation in another location.

Sadly, that is the truth :-(

Coolguy.8702:

3.) have parcenous strike steal 2 boons.

Wow! Inspiration for a new Thief Elite Spec! :-D

Charlatan Priest

Skill:
*Parsonage Strike:"
Transforms the target into a holy house. Thief breaks in and steals two boons, then sets fire to the house. Transformation ends when downed or cleansed by a Water skill or combination. Costs no initiative, but condemns the Thief’s soul to eternal punishment.

Zero Day.2594:

Where T is the value of thief.

2+T vs 2 -> 2+T > 2
1+T vs 2 -> 1+T < 2

From this we can follow that T is 0 < T < 1 .

Thus, if two thieves were to + 1 a 3v5, it would still be 3 + 2T < 5 .

It also proves that a thief + 1’ing a 0v1 the opponent would still be at advantage, since 0 + T vs 1 -> T < 1 as shown above.

We just need a fight were X+T = Y to solve for T… and find out the true value of T (or rather, Thieves)

Unfortunately, it gets more complicated than that. Sometimes, T is actually negative. We must take the number of opponents into account.

t: Thief
a: Ally
o: Opponent

a = o

If xo <= 1o, then t > 0

If xo > 1o, then t < 0

so…

t + 1a > 1o

but…
t + 2a < 2o

But even that doesn’t tell the whole story. We have yet to even get into the value of a Thief with low health… and don’t even get me started on how much a downed Thief will cost your team. It’s deducts at least 0.5 from your total… probably closer to a full 1!

Zero Day.2594:

But don’t the thieves + 1 the 3v5. So + 1 + 1 is +2? 3 + 2 =5 …

Don’t you remember? Thieves are the “+”…. not the “1”

Thieves only +1.
They do not +2 or +3 or +4.

Because Thieves only enter fights where their team’s number of players equal the opposing team’s number of players.

So a +2 would mean that there is currently a 2v2 before the Thief enters.

And any fight where there are at least 2 opposing players means a Thief will melt do to AoE’s or get hacked up by cleave.

Therefore, Thieves only +1… and only against certain builds and in certain situations.
Basically, out of all of the possible combat scenarios, a Thief only engages in very specific opportunities. Think of such scenarios like prizes…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aUQkbXWwJhQ

Dahkeus.8243:

This would really mostly help thieves that aren’t evading properly in their refuge. Meanwhile, the major problems that thieves have would persist.

The initial thought was for this change was to avoid Revealing skills. Especially something like Lock On which isn’t very dodge-friendly.

Oh yes, the Thief has other problems that should be fixed. This is simply a little counter to Reveals. And it would make the skill more fitting for the name of Shadow Refuge :-)

We’ve all heard the argument that the Thief is weak in 1v1 scenarios because it is so mobile. That it would be unfair for a class to be the most mobile and strong in 1v1.

But that is not a thorough argument. First of all, it seems to imply that in order to be a strong 1v1 fighter, a class must have limited Mobility. It also does not go on to list what the “solution” to balance Mobility is.

So I’m asking this.
What is the balance of Mobility? Where does it fit into the “balance” of Guild Wars 2?

I believe I understand the concept that GW2 wants to go for. There are actually two different “scales” that you can choose to build for…

Offense vs. Defense
Direct vs. Condition

Offense
Power, Precision, Ferocity, Condition Damage

Defense
Vitality, Toughness, Healing Power

There is also another dichotomy between Active and Passive actions and effects… such as the Thief’s active defenses of evading compared to the passive defenses such as a Warrior’s Defy Pain or a Mesmer’s Mirror of Anguish or even a Boon such as Protection.

Now, what is Mobility classified as? It can be used offensively to pursue a target or get to a point. It can be used defensively to escape an opponent. I would say that it fits in more as “Utility” than either of the other two.

Even if Mobility can be used offensively, you must look at the bigger picture. Yes, it can help you to overtake a fleeing opponent, but then what? It doesn’t cause the Thief’s attacks to do any more damage. It doesn’t allow the Thief to take absorb any more damage. All it does it get the Thief from Point A to Point B in a shorter amount of time.

To add onto that, the Thief is primarily a melee class. That means that it must be in melee range to do its damage. Mobility does not give the Thief any reach advantage. It STILL must enter within the same melee range in order to deal damage. Therefore, that Mobility does not give either an offensive or defensive advantage to the Thief.

In addition, in Conquest, scoring is based around certain locations. Most combat will take place at those locations. Mobile or not, everyone makes their way to those locations. Mobility only gets the Thief to and from those locations faster. However, what can the Thief do once it has reached its destination and sees an opponent coming? It’s too weak to fight on its own regardless of the Mobility… which rather defeats the purpose of getting to a point first, because the Thief will either have to have backup there already or must retreat. And with Conquest maps being rather compressed in size, the advantage in Mobility is lessened even further.

What exactly gives the Thief such a Mobility advantage? Swiftness on dodge? Signet of Shadow? Shadow Step? Heartseeker? Runes of the Traveler? Infiltrator’s Arrow?
Save for the last, what makes it so much better than any other profession?

After all of this, does the Mobility advantage really warrant such a reduction in offensive or defensive ability? Utility is great, but it doesn’t justify the inability to fight and win in a 1v1 scenario in a combat game. And that’s really what Conquest is… a combat game based on locations. It is not a locational game with combat included.

If you disagree with that, then please state where in the realm of balance Mobility fits… and how a Thief can build to be strong at combat instead of running from point to point. Or at least what balancing changes can be made to the Thief in order bring in a more combat-centered nature.

The Thief would still be vulnerable to AoE’s, CC, Knockbacks, and Conditions. Shadow Refuge would still be a “Here I am, please bomb me” sign.

But yes, if used offensively, it may give an opposing bunker a second or third thought about staying on point for those 4 seconds. It’s not as though the Thief can cap while Stealthed… or that it can drop Stealth at will if there’s nothing on point to attack after Shadow Refuge ends.

The bunker would probably just AoE the point anyway. And the Thief may end up just playing mind games as it leaves to lick its wounds after the duration is over. There’s only one way to find out! :-D

Yes, there should be counters to Shadow Refuge (knockbacks, etc.) to force the Thief out of the area of Shadow Refuge, thus revealing the Thief.

However, shouldn’t a Thief have some benefits in return for the risk of staying inside a limited boundary for the duration?

I propose the following…

Shadow Refuge lasts for 4 seconds. For those 4 seconds, if the Thief (or anyone inside) exits the boundaries before the duration is complete, they will immediately lose Stealth (if you must apply Revealed as it currently is, fine).

However, while inside Shadow Refuge during that 4 second duration, the Thief (or anyone inside) cannot become Revealed. Not only will this protect the Thief from enemy-based reveals (such as the absurd Lock On trait), but it will also act as a deterrent for melee opponents to follow the Thief into its Shadow Refuge, knowing they would be at risk of multiple Backstabs and other Stealth Attacks. They could still do so, but it would have a higher risk.

Once the 4 second duration is over, everything works as normal.

A dream is a wish your heart makes when you wish upon a star… or something like that! :-D

It’s more sustain. That’s all it is. Again, not looking for passives.
I think your way of thinking is a side effect of too many nerfs.

20 initiative is 5 more than we have now. That’s not even one Infiltrator’s Arrow, Black Powder, or Cloak and Dagger. It only adds one more full attack of anything else. OP spam bot? Really?

A dodge saved is a dodge earned. A Thief has no invulnerabilities. A non-Daredevil Thief has neither blocks or Bounding Dodger. Vampire Runes are a thing of the past. Why should a Thief not have an active defensive advantage if played properly to offset the lack of passive defenses?

Just some thoughts. I understand the Thief is unique, but it seems to be “balanced” following the standards of every other profession, so why not see if we can steal a benefit or so?

1a. Increase to 20 initiative baseline.
or…
1b. Swapping weapons refills initiative bar. Yes, this is the steal.
(Personally, I still want instant weapon swap instead)

2. Only a dodge roll that does not “evade” an attack uses endurance. This still requires “skillful” gameplay, as they say, but it does not punish a Thief for dodging successfully. After all, Thieves do not need invulnerabilities or other passives as long as they have the necessary active defenses.
and maybe…
2a. Any dodge roll inside or through an AoE does not use endurance. This will allow a Thief to survive getting caught in the middle of heavy AoE teamfights.
and/or…
2b. A completed dodge roll inside or through an AoE grants 1 second of immunity to new conditions (new conditions cannot be applied, it does not affect old conditions). This will allow a Thief to engage a target that has AoE’d itself just long enough to get one strike in, then disengage. This may or may not need a 2-3 second cooldown.

Are these too much when compared with other professions? I’m all for keeping the Thief an “active” playstyle. But maybe some more actives to counter all of the passives. And this is for the base Thief profession… not requiring Daredevil.

evilapprentice.6379:

fixing things to work the way they say they work isn’t a buff, it’s simply Anet doing their job.

I would agree, but the other recent “fixes” sure feel like nerfs.

Ah, so true!
I suppose Improvisation will try to recharge physical skills even for players without HoT and the Daredevil, eh? :-(

Thief

Deadly Arts: Improvisation: Fixed an issue that prevented this trait from recharging physical skills when stealing from an enemy.

The newest patch actually did something 100% positive for the Thief!!! No nerfs at all!!!
It only has to do with the Daredevil, but it’s a start! :-D

Ps. Well, that was the only documented change for the Thief. So be on the lookout for ghost changes… like the one that removed the ability to keep stolen items from pre-match.

Ah, thank you so much, Mr. Joel… for everything you’ve done! I’m really enjoying the Action Cam!

If I may ask, would you consider implementing an option where the camera actually follows/tracks the target (keeping the target centered) like some flight sims have? While we can do it manually, it would be wonderful to have it done automatically with a key toggle.

Joel Helmich.7398:

pointing the camera down does not shorten the Heartseeker’s leap, making it much more difficult to jump inside Black Powder multiple times.

The behavior you want is almost certainly a bug in the first place, so I’m not sure what to tell you.

Oh, interesting. Thank you.
Yeah, in case you’re not aware, with the normal camera, Thieves can point the camera straight down to cut their Heartseekers very short… as long as there is no target selected. It allows us to leap through Black Powder up to 4 times, allowing us to extend our Stealth duration for a few more seconds… which we really do need just to survive. It becomes second nature to point the camera down, it seems.

Zanyu.2017:

Daredevil
The second assassin I consider in this game.

Just for some clarification… an assassin is someone who chooses a target, engages on his own terms where his opponent has little chance to survive, and works best on his own.

An assassin is not someone who has others hold a victim down while he delivers the death blow.

Those are two entirely different things. That is why I cannot truly label anything involving the current Thief as “assassin.” Yes, while there are some “assassin” builds that have the potential to kill some opponents in 1-2 shots, there are SO MANY passive defenses and AoE’s in this game, those buiilds are hardly effective… especially once someone knows what you’re doing.

Shirk.6421:

You’re already taking half of a player’s health with one backstab

Shirk.6421:

thiefs can take half my hp with one backstab combo.

These two statements are not equal.

I can build to have a very powerful Backstab combo. However, I cannot build to have a very powerful Backstab. And even the combo uses all of my utilities, so I’m left pretty helpless afterward. If it doesn’t down the target, I’m in serious trouble.

As Thief, I have to deal with Thieves also. And as glassy as I am, I can’t remember the last time one burst me down from full health… even with a daze and stun opener from Stealth.

However, I can tell you that I’ve been insta-downed by a Mesmer burst from Stealth. It happened so much faster than any Thief attack I’ve ever experienced. I wish I could hit as hard and as fast.

witcher.3197:

Ranked is disabled so people are forced to play Skyhammer and other maps that are unfit for proper PvP (there is a reason why those aren’t in ranked). We have no choice. What stops you from rerolling, on the other hand?

Because the Thief is unique. It has a style unlike anything else. It is like the anti-Skyhammer compared to other professions. I can choose what skills I wish to use whenever I wish as long as I have the initiative to do so. I don’t have to do choreographed skill rotations. It’s completely improv and adapt.

To play something other than the Thief for me is like playing Skyhammer every match for you. It is all about personal preference. And we are both in bad places right now.

Right now, the Thief is as unfit for PvP (literally “Player versus Player”) just as you say Skyhammer is. It did not used to be, however. Thief players just want to become fit to actually fight 1v1’s based on skill again.

Of course, if other professions were given the initiative system, that could also be an alternative, but that’s not happening any time soon.

Zero Day.2594:

Though I really do want to hear it from him/his video…

Yeah, he starts somewhere around the 19 minute mark…
http://www.twitch.tv/narcarsis/v/22231491

EDIT:

Watch the last broadcast for hope ^^

Ah, well, never mind :-P

glaphen.5230:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_jlkY5KR00

Hehe, we’re in the PvP forum ;-)

Umm, Mr. Nukem, sir… perhaps you should make sure your next game is better than your last one before you begin to influence another series.

Well, on second thought, please assume that aliens have mindjacked the ANet devs, and fight to liberate them from their captors please. Especially the Thief devs. I think the aliens believed that Thieves were the only true threat to their plans of world domination, so they nerfed the Thieves HARD. Now, they just watch in amusement as Thieves run around the battlefield with no desire to actually engage anyone.

Hmm, actually, you may need to call the Boss from the Saints Row series also… because it sounds like something that happened in those games also. So, again… if you have connections, please use them! Thank you! :-D

Been there. Done that. Been happening to me since the June patch.

Kharr.5746:

Do this: Equip a full set of traps on ranger or guardian.

Notice he did not include Thief.
Because not even perma-Stealth with traps can kill things with it.

nacario.9417:

At least theif is lore friendly, once beggars and cutthroats are busted they attempt to run and hide

Perhaps lore-friendly, but not living up to its name. Sadly, it seems the only thing a Thief can steal these days is a little bit of your time… as you have to stop for a few seconds to swat and stomp them.

Doggie.3184:

Tiny changes in elevation or small pebbles will cause Steal to pull out a tiny dagger and seppuku.

I so want that animation!
Surely, it is more honorable for Thief to die by his own blade than that of his enemy!

Interesting. Thank you.
I just changed the topic title to reflect issues with the Thief in general.
Maybe we’ll get more reports.

Thanks, I’ll check it out! :-)

I just entered the game for the first time since the update. I managed to get the Action Cam working, and really enjoy the concept.

From just playing with it a few minutes, two things seem to happen with Heartseeker, though my lag really kept me from telling if it is working as normal…

1. A second Heartseeker can be performed in a different direction immediatly following the first. There’s no need to give a slight pause between them. That’s the good news.

2. The bad news… pointing the camera down does not shorten the Heartseeker’s leap, making it much more difficult to jump inside Black Powder multiple times.

Can anyone else confirm this with the Action Cam on? I REALLY want to love it, but the second issue makes me second guess it. Thanks!

EDIT:
Has anyone found any other issues with the Thief’s Action Cam? Please share.

LovefulfillsAll.4870:

Caed says “screw thief”.

He didn’t say screw, he said it more passionately, but I sugarcoated it a bit.

Just curious… where/when did he say this? I want to check it out. Thanks! :-)

Kayleah.5791:

what happened exactly? So far I’m loving the Thief but … now you guys are making me worried lol

Do yourself a favor and don’t read any of the answers you’re going to get here.
You’ll be MUCH happier!

Ignorance is bliss! ;-)

Exedore.6320:

What happened with most of the the elite specializations was they overbuffed them during test to make sure they felt good mechanically and haven’t yet done a solid balance pass on it.

Great, why do I have a feeling that they are going to “balance” Daredevil by nerfing the Thief’s Trickery line and Pistol’s Black Powder???

Tarkan.5609:

Steal: stealing in SPvP pregame allows you keep the bundle when the match starts

Flanking Strikes: When used with the trait “Trickster”, “Flanking Strikes” actually has a 36s CD instead of 48s CD how it’s supposed to be.

Ankle Shots: raises pistol range by 150 but does not state it in the tool tip

Sadly, I know the first one was “fixed” a few weeks ago. The second is listed as being fixed. The 3rd one is listed to have been fixed by removing the range increase instead of changing the tooltip. Can’t confirm the 2nd and 3rd because the HoT update is too big and my connection is too slow.

Why can’t we get some beneficial fixes???

Hmm, what about allowing non-HOT players to “test” the elites inside the PvP Lobby only, but not actually in a match? At least they could try the new skills against golems, see how they like them, and perhaps learn how to counter them.

That’s because the Thief is so OP, it takes 4 guys to beat one!

-Shakes head in disappointment-

SolarDragon.7063:

You’ve suggested a plausible explanation, assuming that tripwire will trigger if deployed on a stationary target. Is this correct?

Ah, a trapper Thief. I’ve been running that occasionally since the June patch hit. It’s nothing new. It can make Backstab and Heartseeker actually worth using for a D/x build.

The problem is it pretty much removes your sustainability in any fight that is not a complete ambush. It’s also risky as can be if you don’t ID your target before you engage. There’s simply too much AoE and too many passive defenses in this game.

I like the concept.
ALL Thief attacks should be unblockable.
Yes, make it baseline.
There are plenty of other types of defenses available.
Let the Thief counter it’s own weakness by inflicting it on others as well.
That should balance out things a bit.
Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Thief

Death Blossom: Extended evasion by 200 miliseconds toward the beginning of the ability.
Vital Shot: Fixed a bug that caused this ability to gain increased attack range when traited with Ankle Shots.
Shadow Shot: Fixed a bug that caused this ability to gain increased attack range when traited with Ankle Shots.
Flanking Strikes: This trait is no longer doubly reduced by Trickster.

Call it bug fixing if you wish, but where’s the bug fix that increases Withdraw’s healing?

Notice how this works. We get one buff to three nerfs. The same thing happened with the last patch. Only 3 Pistol skills got buffed, but ALL 10 got nerfed at the same time.

What’s the next set of buff and debuffs going to be?

It’s also very annoying that Elementalists can use their mist form when downed to escape through a gate to complete safety. I don’t understand the logic or balance :-(