Guild Wars 2

Other games just use expansion as chance for a hard reset of things that do not work.

While we are at the other game. Feral druids/caster druids in vanilla compared to the burning crusade anyone?

ANet just won’t give themselves a chance to reset the game and start from scratch with things that do not work. Sort of sad. tPvP meta bullkitten just ruins it all.

Expansion pls.

Dawdler.8521:

Fun thing to watch if you want to get nostalgic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiWcN0jmWiE

You may notice first the awesome shatter/summoning sounds (and Thief pistol sounds!). The Mesmer has Shadow Refuge instead of the Thief, forward Phase Retreat that cause damage (and for some reason cause swiftness to enemy mobs), scepter that sound like a 150mm tank gun, insta-popping of 2 Phantasmal Duelists, Chaos Storm that cause poison, cripple and apparently insanity, instant staff auto-attack on target, commanding phantasms to move to location and omgisthatafreakininstakilllasergreatswordthatsoundlikeafreakinrailgun?!?!

The best part of this trailer is how the mesmer casts two iDuelists at the same time, they kill off two different mobs and he can shatter them on the last.

That is exactly how those phantasms work. NOT.

Bugs? What bugs, I only see features.

The game is stale.

No new weapons for professions, no new professions, nearly no new traits, utility, whatever.

With this bloody focus on eSports kitten, ANet fears to introduce anything new to the game to unbalance the already unbalanced.

I, by now, would be even willing to play ESO, if someone sends me a free code and time card, just to see something new…

I see what you did there.

Nerfing PU setups. But what about clone death builds, that have been nerfed to uselessness already, you just kill them off.

We need some clear buffing in regards of PvE, which you totally neglect. Shatter would need some serious fixing to be competative in this game mode.
Right now, build diversity in PvE is Phantasm with mantras, or Phantasm without mantras. That is not enough.

I hope, the devs look further than PvP, because this game has more to offer than being a failed eSport.

TexZero.7910:

Black Box.9312:

TexZero.7910:

DiogoSilva.7089:

I like the idea that warriors can resist to movement-impairing CC (flavorful with their “sturdy bodies”), but I dislike the idea that warriors can Ride the Lightning with their greatsword.

Would be nice to see their GS leaps range be decreased to 900 and Rush requiring a target (alongside being bug fixed, so it’s actually useful in combat). What do people think of that?

Yeah, no.

Why is everyone so bent on having forced targets in an action combat system ?

Additionally what GS leap ? Warriors dont have one.

You know what would be lovely, FGS reduced Whirl and Dash range to match Warriors GS.

FGS is an elite skill with 120 seconds of downtime on a class with light armor and low base HP. Nice try, but hardly a valid comparison.

Oh really you dont say, remind me which class has the 900 range blink, the 66%movement speed increase and invulnerability as well as RTL and BS… yep. Want to talk about abusive mobility Ele, Thieves are the king of it. They are just too busy QQ’ing here to realize it.

Thief and eles have the lowest base hp, and both lower tier armor than the warrior, mobility is part of their defense.

All I see after this skill bar, that warriors will stay in every tPvP team, gods in WvW and faceroll in PvE.

Wait, nothing has changed…

Do you have a recording to proof this? No.

So where is my money?! ^^

I won, give me gold naow!

Seriously I did, I am a PeeveePee god.

Maybe not.

lazycalm.5186:

You must have been playing Mesmer for so long you can’t even remember how it is to fight against one. The targeting and untargeting mechanic is sick broken, especially in a PvP scneario. The advantage to the Mesmer vs incompetent players is huge.
You probably couldn’t win against one, that’s why you joined the band

Fixed that for you.

Besides my mesmer, I play:

DS Necro: At least in my eyes the most fun way to play open world, feels greatly OP compared to mesmer.

D/D Ele: If I need some distraction I tend to play the ele. Completely different playstyle, still very active.

All other classes just bore me to death.

For the rare case I log in to GW2, I play the story with my mesmer. It just feels natural this way, as he has been the reason I started GW2.

Then I get pretty much annoyed that stuff does not die fast enough and log on to my necro.

Maybe ANet will eventually fix the class in general PvE, but I would not count on it.

coglin.1867:

Carighan.6758:

Will we get any coverage about PvE or WvW balance? Really not trying to be angry here, but the attention such a miniscule game mode is getting at the total expense of any balancing in regards to the two large game modes is really disheartening.

It’s not that the imbalance itself is annoying, but the lack of even acknowledging the issues is. I can do years of waiting. Waited 7 years for some changes in WoW. But at least the devs replied in vanilla-era threads that they’d like to do a change there or here but had no resources for it.

And what are the issues?

How do you want WvW balanced? Balance to roamer vs roamer? balance each profession based on zerg vs zerg fight? balance each profession for assaulting a keep? Balance each profession for defending a keep?

If you are going to claim there are issues, it is perhaps best if you list them. As well, what you claim as issues may be non-issues to the rest of the population.

The only issue I see is that GW2 still wants to be an eSports.

Hitman.5829:

silentnight warrior.2714:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Hitman.5829:

Terrahero.9358:

30seconds of regeneration isnt all that amazing. 130hp/sec, that doesnt in anyway compare to Warriors passive healing. Who, without gearing for healingpower get 362 from Healing Signet and another 120per second from Adrenal Health.
No contest, Warrior is far and beyond much better in this department. So i dont see how this is relevant.

There are time gaps in the battle where the mezmer becomes invisible, or plain simple distracts the enemy. During that time the Mezmer is not being attack, this means that he is gaining regeneration WITHOUT his HP bar being affected. On contrast, a warrior during battle is healing BUT the damage to his HP is CONSTANTLY affected.

• If healing signet gives approximately 400 HP/sec and you are getting hit for 400 damage every second, then that nullifies the effect of healing signet.

• On contrast, you cannot put constant pressure on the mezmer because of all his teleports, invisibility, dazing, confusing clones. This gives the Mezmer some time to regenerate his health with out his HP being affected. THIS MY FRIENDS IS PASSIVE PLAY!

So the warrior with his big health pool would just not give a kitten, because he would actually not even taking any damage, while the mesmer would have to use all his tricks to actually mitigate the damage taken.

What is your kitten argument here?

While one is doing active damage with passive defense the other is doing passive damage with active defense. Passive damage will always be bigger than 400 HPS.

That is my point, with passive damage being MINIMUM 400 damage per second you can nullify the warrior healing signet.

You are just nullifying the passive healing not the signet.

And to be honest, this idea of passive damage is not really working here. Mesmers have no real passive damage. No aura that is pulsing around the mesmer, no proccs or whatever.

Mesmers have summons, they can be cast, they do damage, if not destroyed.

So a mesmer has to cast a phantasm, sounds active to me. The cast can be dodged, evaded, blinded, whatever, so nothing passive about this part here.
The phantasm itself can be dodged, blocked and so on and destroyed. It is bound to one character. So all of the damage can be mitigated at any time. Kitten, you can outrun phantasms. And the phantasms attack once in a blue moon (if they do so at all, looking at you, iWarden).

Seriously, if you have problems with phantasms in PvP, or finding the real mesmer, nothing can safe you.

It is like you are complaining that a warrior can actually be damaged by a mesmer. If a mesmer is traited for phantasms (who would do that in PvP anyways) how else would he do damage?

Tone down phantasms (their AI is so hard a failure, especially in PvP, that noone should care) and up all weapon damage on all weapons. Good.

I fear you would greatly regret this change though, because if you have problems with mesmers that hurt you with phantasms now, you would get your kitten handed on a silver plate all day long.

Hitman.5829:

Terrahero.9358:

30seconds of regeneration isnt all that amazing. 130hp/sec, that doesnt in anyway compare to Warriors passive healing. Who, without gearing for healingpower get 362 from Healing Signet and another 120per second from Adrenal Health.
No contest, Warrior is far and beyond much better in this department. So i dont see how this is relevant.

There are time gaps in the battle where the mezmer becomes invisible, or plain simple distracts the enemy. During that time the Mezmer is not being attack, this means that he is gaining regeneration WITHOUT his HP bar being affected. On contrast, a warrior during battle is healing BUT the damage to his HP is CONSTANTLY affected.

• If healing signet gives approximately 400 HP/sec and you are getting hit for 400 damage every second, then that nullifies the effect of healing signet.

• On contrast, you cannot put constant pressure on the mezmer because of all his teleports, invisibility, dazing, confusing clones. This gives the Mezmer some time to regenerate his health with out his HP being affected. THIS MY FRIENDS IS PASSIVE PLAY!

So the warrior with his big health pool would just not give a kitten, because he would actually not even taking any damage, while the mesmer would have to use all his tricks to actually mitigate the damage taken.

What is your kitten argument here?

We all hope for some shatter buffs in the next balance patch for PvE.

Shatter is still a good choice in open world though, and at least you won’t fall asleep while playing (like with a phantasm build…)

An expansion worth of content – srsly!

In the end, the OP has no clue what he is talking about in regards of mesmers.

I will hold his hand and help him understand, because he really seems to need this to be done.

Mesmers and Clones. An Overall Balance Overview in different aspects of GW2

PvE: The only viable setup for mesmers in PvE is with phantasm traited for damage. This also means, that clones are as useless as a veteran of GW2 that has no clue about the game.

tPvP: If the mesmer is lucky enough to get a spot in a tPvP team, the only setup he will be using is a ultra glasscannon zerker shatter one. It is probably the most fragile trait setup in PvP and the mesmer actually dies as soon as you fart roughly in his direction. This build only works with heavy coordinated team support, otherwise the mesmer and his clones are dead in a blink of an eye. Teamplay is overpowered, nerf it.

sPvP: You probably heard of PU. And in the end this is what you are whining about I think. Unfortunately, PU is the only setup that works in sPvP if you actually aim for scoring. The problem with PU on the other hand is not the clones, but as a veteran of GW2 you know this. PU punishes players for being noobs, clueless or just simply bad.
Clone death builds have been heavily nerfed with the last balance patch, shatter is too fragile without proper team support and phantasm won’t work because of the broken AI. No alternative to PU means people will play what works.

WvW: In proper WvW, which is about taking objectives and stuff, people run in a zerg. If you have more than two mesmers in your zerg, you are actually hurting your team. Mesmers in WvW are utility bots for veil and portal, clones die way too fast in the action to be of any use.

So what is the OP actually talking about, because clones simply seem to not be a problem in GW2.
Well he is probably talking about dueling and small scale roaming in WvW, which is a totally useless hobby in the greater scales of events which make WvW what it is, or in the entirety of GW2 game modes. Nothing will ever be balanced around it anyways, as it does not matter.

Will PU get nerfed? Maybe, but nothing will change in regards of clones.

The only thing that the OP proofs, is that doing something for a long time does not equal getting good at something.

So you do not even play sPvP and all your moaning is about WvW?

That makes this thread even funnier. ^^

“The “Game’s Overall Balance” in the only game mode I play."

Yeah, awesome damage you get there with PU, I would call it insane!

Great troll thread, would read again!

Wait, what you say is that you have a hard time to spot the real mesmer?

Sounds like a L2P issue to me, seriously. Even though you do not want to hear this you said.

If you straight forward said, “NERF PU”, or something like that ok. But having problems with those craptastically scripted clones? That just makes you look clueless.

spoj.9672:

Using wvw as a reference to balance is kind of pointless.

Why? Is one out of three game modes not worthy for all classes to be on the same level.

If your point is that large scale battles are never balanced anyway, than you could simply throw balance out of this game.

Noone needs balance in PvE, as all content can be done with every class anyway… Sounds great.
Noone needs balance in WvW, as there is never balance anyway… Oh, good.

Balance around PvP? Nah, only around tPvP, so we have this great eSports stuff going on. Works pretty well, with two out of eight classes (war/guard) being on every team. Looks totally balanced to me.

In the end, who needs balance? Why is anyone moaning anyway?

BS.

Muchacho.2390:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Breakdown of GW2 balance:

Necro: Scissors
Ranger/Engi: Rock

That would imply necros get beaten by engies/ranger, but arent condi necros a a good counter to condi engies and condi ranger?

I think you might have missed the point… ^^

Dual wielding axes, like the phantasm.

Illusionary troll.

“You thought you could close this gap? Teleporting on the spot for the lulz!”

BrunoBRS.5178:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

Honestly, who cares about tPvP?
All those great eSport sponsors for GW2?

oh, you’re one of those people. nice blacklisting you.

One of those people?

One of those people who try to see the bigger picture? Shame on me then, for caring more for the game than some peoples 15 mins of video game fame.

The point of this discussion is still that Portal is not mobility, it is utility, because in the end it brings you nowhere but to where you started. And this game does not look like a nascar simulator to me…

Honestly, who cares about tPvP?
All those great eSport sponsors for GW2?

So you say balancing around something a fraction of the GW2 community cares for, is a valid example of the mobility of the mesmer profession?
Returning to the spot where you came from resets your mobility to where you started before you have been mobile. So one could say that Portal is the opposite of mobility.

Kitten tPvP arguments have pretty much ruined the mesmer profession in all other game modes, the mesmer is the least mobile class in all of the game.

Stop balancing this game around something that most of the players do not care for. GW2 did not etablish itself as an eSports in the last two years, and it probably never will.

Get. Over. It.

lordkrall.7241:

Yes, it was some major bugs.
THAT WAS FIXED WITHIN 12 HOURS of release. That is a very fast fix, many games wait until the next scheduled maintenance or update do add fixes like these.

How about those kitten dolyaks? The event is just broken, every time i log in.
12h are over for sure.

Why would you use any of these in PvE?

I know there is this slightly elitist talking that anything works in PvE, but hey, why make your life as mesmer even harder than it is?

Cygnus.6903:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

So going back to where you started after 5000 units is really cool mobility – if the map is like 5000 units big. Portal is not mobility, it is utility.
Let both run 10.000 units in one direction and see where the mesmer will be when the warrior is at the goal.

Still, a mesmer escapes better then a warrior does.

Yeah, escaping is such a fun thing to do.

BrunoBRS.5178:

xbutcherx.3861:

Please enlighten me how is this related with Profession Balance?

discussing mobility, escapability, and roaming potential.

it has everything to do with balance.

So going back to where you started after 5000 units is really cool mobility – if the map is like 5000 units big. Portal is not mobility, it is utility.
Let both run 10.000 units in one direction and see where the mesmer will be when the warrior is at the goal.

Iavra.8510:

No nerfs \o/

Ninja nerfs probably, what would an update be without mesmer getting kicked in the teeth?

Mesmers simply have no bugs to be fixed.

Let any profession wear any type of armor.

If that is possible, you can fool around with armor types.

I switched from mesmer to necro as my main. Strange… ^^

Rangers should simply level a mesmer in PvE, and do larger scale DEs at 80.

This would help them to grasp why at least some mesmers are unhappy with the game.

Lifestealer.4910:

Neptune.2570:

Lifestealer.4910:

i went to duel server and duelled many mesmers and they seem fine, too strong if anything. Lots of evades, invulnerability, damage from shatter and even unspecced phantasms.

You can’t have everything bro if you want to have your teamplay potential increased then your class needs ALOT more counterplay.

Did you try putting more than one condition on the Mesmer, or using any AOE spell whatsoever. Or standing on terrain slightly higher then what the Mesmer is on so none of his shatters or leaps can reach you. Needz moar countaplay.

i did in fact put conditions but most mesmers in duel server traits for condi clears and it was on open field for most of the duels so its fair.

Show me this artificially made up situation working in favour of the mesmer (avoiding his major bugs) in any real PvP/WvW situation. Even in PvE this won’t happen, and there you can most of the time choose where things will happen.

So what you say is, the mesmer is fine, as long as you manage to somehow create an artificial environment of bug-limited space…

There is no easy solution, otherwise it would have been fixed by now.

I played in Europe and Japan, doesn’t matter where you are. You will have to verify your IP though.

Mesmer bugs are a myth. After existing forever, they are now a feature of the profession.

Also, all high-end tPvP mesmers play shatter, nerf shatter! Nerf it in PvE too, as you always do. Noone cares anymore though…

Player.8373:

Op what kind of build are you running? I duel loads of them and I don t have any problem with them.

And what kind of problems are you facing? I might can help you.

(I play necro aswell)

All together it sounds a bit like a variant of:

“I am scissors, paper is fine, nerf rock.”

Only that we would have to go with:

“I am scissors, but I do not know how to beat paper, nerf paper.”

Never crossed the way with a minion Necro, did you?

The point is, 4 mesmer out of 30 players with 8 professions available is just average (well, 30 / 8 = 3.75, so 4 is the closest to average).

On the other hand, high-end tPvP does not normally reflect generall game balance. All mesmers run the same setup, shatter, none of them is PU.
Does this make PU a bad spec? If you only use this sample than yes, shatter is better. When was the last time you saw someone complaining about shatter though?
This spec only works to what we see in the tournament because of the composition of the teams.

runeblade.7514:

Mesmer is overpowered?

Maybe not, but they are definitely not weak. Mesmer do see tons of high level play.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2bw0uz/all_the_builds_from_eu_tol_qualifier_2/

4/6 teams include mesmers in their teams.

2 teams have a Necro.
1 team only have Ranger.

Statistics of note:

Every team has a Guardian
All run staff
6 in Honor
Trooper Runes
Cleric’s Amulet

Every team has a Warrior
All are hambow
All but one running the same 3 stances (Odd one out still running 2 of 3 as stances)
All running 6 in Defense and Discipline
5 of 6 run 2 in Tactics
66% run Hoelbrak Runes, 33% run Strength Runes
5 of 6 run Soldier Amulet

Every team has a Thief
5 of 6 running Sword as mainhand (4 of 6 running S/D)
Everyone takes Shadow Refuge and Infiltrator’s Signet
Half and half on third utility being Shadow Step or Signet of Agility
Every thief runs 2 in Deadly Arts and 6 in Trickery
Most running typical 6 in acro, strength runes, sizer setup
Every thief uses Berserker’s amulet

Every team has an Ele or Engi
50% Ele, 50% Engi

Ele
Every ele runs D/D, Signet of Restoration, Same 3 Cantrips
2 of 3 Ele’s prefer FGS
Exact same traits, sigils, runes, amulet.
one out of three people took a different elite. Otherwise all 3 ele’s are exactly the same build.

Engi
Lots of variation. Not much that I can see across the board.
All but two teams have a Mesmer (Other two are Ranger and Necro)

Mesmer
All mesmers run Staff + GS
All mesmers use the same heal and utilities
3 of 4 choose Mass Invisibility
Exact same traits across the board
50/50 on Runes being Traveler’s or Strength

TL;DR

“Meta” Party Composition:

Bunker Guardian
Hambow Warrior
Trickery Thief (Most emphasizing mobility)
Ele or Engi (Mostly used for side-bunker and condition pressure)
Most likely to be a Shatter Mesmer (And if so, double ranged with portal.)

Of the 30 players that participated:

Only one Necro
Only one Ranger

TL;DR

Everyone is emulating Team Mist every time, 85% of the time.

If the idea of GW2 eSports is that everyone is running the same setup, they did well.

RyuDragnier.9476:

maha.7902:

RyuDragnier.9476:

maha.7902:

Do you even play Mesmer? They are not wanted in pve. They are absolute garbage in pve. They’re literally the joke of my guild. They’re wanted in wvw for veil then you might as well get lost. In PvP, well I’d say the lack of mesmers at high level, and high level mesmers playing other classes says enough about how good it is there.

Funny, every party I’ve been in for dungeons and fractals wants Mesmers due to how much damage they can dish out, their ability to reflect every projectile back at the enemy regardless of direction it’s fired in (completely trivializes several bosses), their AoE condition/boon controlling (makes the golem boss in CoE a joke), the ability to half the damage everybody takes with the Phantasmal Defender, a line of stealth, etc. If your guild thinks they’re useless, then I’m sorry, but the people in your guild know not of what they speak of, and are probably (I’m saying this in the kindest terms) ignorant.

Mesmer has worse than average DPS, and that’s assuming even longer fights, on shorter fights (below 30s) their DPS is abysmal. Sounds like your parties are uninformed and don’t realise that mesmers are completely replaceable by guardian. As for boon removal on the COE golem you realise you can just kill the turret for protection? And I wasn’t aware that being in the guild that basically sets the meta game meant we were uninformed, maybe you should do a little research.

Delusional, you are. You’re so stuck on the meta that you can’t see anything outside of it, and probably don’t know of any builds that can help the party that are outside of the little box you’ve set for yourself. Think outside of it man, make up some new builds, try them out, there’s no excuse not to try.

And FYI, most players don’t care what class you enter a dungeon with, because most players play for fun. And as far as I remember, don’t those turrets have a 10s respawn rate? Most parties I’m in ignore them simply because a Mesmer with Sword mainhand can just strip the boons fast and easily (and it always seems to target the Retal, which is the one most people seem to get taken out by).

Dear heavens, what rock have you been hiding under the last few monthes?

Think outside the meta? The mesmer is not even in the meta right now.
How would any mesmer actually be able to think inside of it then? People have no clue about this profession and try to give advice. This will surely help.

Go Lazy Kai, if you don’t like to shatter take the Phantastic Phantasm variant.

It won’t get any easier than that. You will find them in my signature.

Step 1: Give Veil to thiefs, give Portal to eles.
Step 2: Delete mesmer profession.

Result: Noone, in not a single game mode would miss the mesmer profession in GW2.

In open world, running anything but GS and S/F will just slow you down.

Both, Lazy Kai and Go Go Power Ranger are absolutely viable in open world.
You can pick a shatter or a phantasm variant.

You will find them in my signature.

If it is tuesday and patchday:

- Log in
- Play personal story
- If there is a new map, run around and go some places
- Log out

All the other 13 days in between:

- Log in