Guild Wars 2

We know why Scarlet attacked the Queen’s Jubilee.

It was done on a whim. This was explicitly stated by the developers during this interview. Scarlet had no reason, no plotting behind it, no pre-calculation. She just saw the event happening with Jennah saying humans have been tested and basically went “well they haven’t been tested by me!” So she just went and attacked for no true reason.

Those in continental Tyria use the Mouvelian calendar. It used to be 360 days with no months but split into four seasons (Season of the Scion (Fall), Season of the Colossus (Winter), Season of the Zephyr (Spring), and Season of the Phoenix (Summer)) – the season names are interchangeable in speech, but I’ve only ever seen dating using the “Season of the <name>”. Until the interview noted by Diovid, it was 90 days per season ammounting to 360 days a year – but with said interview they arbitrarily and pointlessly added 5 days just so the Mouvelian calendar and ours sync up (totally unnecessary) with no explanation for how it works into the seasons. Personally, I take that interview’s bit as “non-existent until shown in-game” but that’s just me and my fanon discontinuity

It should also be noted that while originally the Mouvelian calendar had no months (only the Canthan calendar did – with 30 days a month perfectly), mention of months have been made during Flame and Frost… though how this fits in is unknown, and based on The Trek of the Zephyrites months are not used in dating. Dating calendars happens as <Day> <Season> <Year>. E.g., 09 Season of the Scion 1320. Cantha was different, dating as <Day> <Month>, <Year>. E.g., 27 Suzhen, 1582.

Furthermore, I’d like to point out that New Years for Tyrians happens on the Spring Equinox (first day of Spring) – Wintersday is their “end of winter”/“New Years Day” event, happening during the last day of the Season of the Colossus/Winter. So while we experience Wintersday in December – in order to sync up with our Christmas and New Years Day and other winter holidays – theirs is actually occurring in our equivalent of March 20th-ish (since our spring equinox changes). Further reason why I think their attempts to sync up the calendar is kitten and utterly pointless, since they’re now saying that the event which was and always has been a celebration of winter’s end is now happening near the beginning of winter…

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Well that doesn’t entirely exclude them from building it. They were a whole different culture of people, and most of their architecture seems to be wasting away in the Crystal Desert at the time of GW1. So I didn’t want to leave them out. Who knows, they could always red con them in some how.

Incredibly unlikely. The only recorded presence of the Margonites as humans was in the Crystal Sea and Unending Ocean, and their only structures known to exist or existed are boats – of wood. Post-transformation they do have structures made out of the same black-with-purple-glow metal as the Torment weapons, which are only seen in the Realm of Torment.

It would be immensely odd and out of character to find Margonite presence not only further north than any human is known to have been (in large scale) excluding Ascalonians pushing the charr back, but to see them in the largest mountain range in the world so far away from their homeland? It would be like saying Atrumm Ruins was probably built by the norn.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

I disagree. Ogden doesn’t recognize it as dwarven architecture. But meanwhile the Stonesummit have been building weird stuff, which he may not be familiar with. So it is possible that he’s simply talking about his own people, and not this splinter group of evil dwarves. While they probably didn’t build it, I would not exclude them simply because of Ogden’s quote.

Not only is the Stone Summit recent (founded by Dagnar so less than a few hundred years old at best), but we see their architecture in mass and it is nothing like the Eye of the North. Not only that, but Ogden has more than likely seen Stone Summit structure too, given that it litters the Southern Shiverpeaks.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

We’ve never really seen a Mursaat city, nor seen any of the Jotun structures of the past. It indeed doesn’t match any of the Mursaat constructs we’ve seen in GW1, but again, there could be a lot of Mursaat structures we haven’t seen yet.

While we cannot say we’ve seen a mursaat city, we’ve seen mursaat architecture – and the Eye of the North is far from a city anyways.

And you’re wrong about the jotun structures – all non-hut structures of the jotun are “structures of the past” – the jotun live in the citadels of their ancestors that were built when the giant-kings ruled. And the Eye of the North look nothing like them.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

I know they are a seafaring race, which is why I said it would have to be a redcon. You could have them sail almost anywhere, if you’re willing to bend the lore (which the current writers have shown to do on occasion).

There’s a huge difference between “sailing anywhere” and “putting a sea faring race in a tall mountain range that was devoid of humanity until the Ebon Vanguard in the 1070s.”

Impossible? Certainly not. But it would require a bending of lore that’s closer to breaking than the krait working with Scarlet in the Toxic Alliance.

You cannot really prove that “everything on Tyria would die” without magic. I mean, humanity, for example, came from a world with little to no magic. To simply say that magic is the “lifeblood of Tyria” is no different than saying that magic courses through the planet and thrives everywhere and that there’s a very strong chance of things dying off without it – but given the fact that things can and have survived without magic (how the world is at the end of every dragon awakening cycle for example), to state that everything would die off is definitely false – unless after every dragon awakening and consumption of all magic in the world, all new life comes from somewhere else rather than evolves from previously un-sapient species (while dragon minions do target wildlife, they don’t seem to focus on them so much as the sapient actively-magic-using species).

Besides, can you be certain she was being literal? ArenaNet loves to beat around the bush or be elusive/unclear about topics they answer.

And literature can deal with laws of physics if the writers wish to. And who’s to say that ArenaNet couldn’t take a story to an alternate reality? ’sides, multiverse within the GW-verse existed long before WvW and any other kind of cross-server stuff happened. The first cross-server things around was Hall of Heroes and the Favor of the Gods, which in lore only specified that the gods cast favor on a specific world (as opposed to universe or dimension).

Just a note: when the GWW and GW2W state different things, this is because GWW states the lore more often than not as the perspective of how lore was seen during GWW1’s timeframe to the players – how the lore is presented in the first game – rather than how it is seen/presented in GW2. GW2 has made ‘corrections’ on ‘false histories’ such as with the Bloodstones thus resulting in the two wikis telling different stories.

The “truth” as it is currently known to us is much as Gulesave said, but that is highly simplified.

During the previous dragon cycle, five races had survived to a certain point: jotun, dwarves, Seers, Forgotten, and mursaat. The order of events that followed is unclear, but three major things happened:

• At some point, the mursaat had betrayed the other races, using their magic which was most effective in combating the Elder Dragons and their forces (or so it seems to us at the moment) and nearly wiped out the Seers – why isn’t clear, but upon nearly wiping out the Seers they fled into the Mists for self-preservation.
• The Forgotten had learned to counter dragon corruption, and freed Glint from Kralkatorrik’s control, giving her free will. She then hid the remaining races from the Elder Dragons, forcing them to starve into hibernation.
• The Seers – presumably inbetween the first two points, possibly the cause of the first point (mursaat’s betrayal) – had created the Bloodstone. From what is unknown, but they had gathered all magic in the world that was not yet corrupted by the Elder Dragons and sealed it within the Bloodstone, which allowed the Elder Dragons to be beaten by playing the waiting game that was ‘put them to sleep through starvation.’

When the Six Gods arrived on the world, they collected many magical artifacts, one of which being the Bloodstone. Over centuries, they had tapped into the Bloodstone to return magic to the world – humanity saw this as the Six creating magic, as they were not used to magic at the time (both in Tyria and the world they came from before). In 1 BE, Abaddon had went and unleashed an extremely large amount of magic, gifting unique forms of magic to different groups. At some point as well (before or after this), the gods had tapped into Zhaitan’s magic to strengthen the Bloodstone. All of this led to wars between humanity and other races, leading to lots of bloodshed throughout Tyria. King Doric traveled to Arah and pleaded for magic to be returned – the gods complied, reducing the magic in the world – which to humans was told through the ‘creation’ and subsequent sealing with Doric’s blood and shattering of the Bloodstone – by shattering the Bloodstone (whether the sealing-with-Doric’s-blood is true or not is unknown) – which led to the war between Abaddon and the other five gods.

The rest is non-disputed between sources.

You’re probably thinking of Oola’s Lab in Metrica, where she tied her own soul to a golem.

It wouldn’t be Margonites, as while they were on Tyria they were humans. :P Stone Summit = dwarves so ‘not dwarven’ means ‘not Stone Summit’. It doesn’t match known jotun, forgotten, or God-made architecture either. Best we can tell it doesn’t match tengu or mursaat architecture either (though we have very little evidence of their architectures).

Beyond “extinct races” we only have the Seers. And given we know there’s been multiple cycles to the Elder Dragons’ rising, it could have been a structure from a previous cycle before last.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

I had almost forgotten about those. I always kind of assumed that after Nightfall, the damage that was done would have been repaired. I imagine Kormir would not leave such a massive rip in space/time to exist, with all kinds of nasty creatures spilling out. We never got to see such repairs during GW1, since all campaigns tend to be frozen in that one moment of the story, and thus never changing. But it would not surprise me if that door was now closed thanks to Kormir.

Why would “all kinds of nasty creatures” be “spilling out” from the heart of Kormir’s own under-control (or so we’d presume) realm?

BrotherBelial.3094:

I thought Aatxe where part of the shadow army. As they appear alongside shadow army members in FoW in GW1. Crawlers and behamoths I thought where the “normal” residents of the UW. I think the driads(can’t remember the names) are also part of the Dhuum and Menzie army’s if I remember correctly.

Aatxes are natural inhabitants of the Underworld, but some were enslaved by dryders (I think that’s what you mean by ‘driads’ which you likely were thinking of dryads which are nymphomaniac forest spirits in greek folklore :P) whom were only part of Dhuum’s army.

1) You can edit the wiki yourself easily.

2) How do you define “lifeblood of Tyria”? Will Tyria die without magic, or is it just so much a part of the world that the two cannot be distinguished? All Angel says is that magic flows across the world and within it. She does not explain the nature of magic at all. Simply saying that magic is the “lifeblood of Tyria” does not state that it is the soul of Tyria nor does it state that it “permeates everything in it, including the people.” (Though the latter does get heavily implied in several other places).

3) The wiki is not wrong at all. Magic is still an unclear force. Just saying it is the “lifeblood of Tyria” does not define or describe what magic is, just how important it is to the world and how much a part of the world it is. Besides if you read the rest of the paragraph you’d have: " It is known to be a finite resource that is just as much a part of those living in the world as the world itself, being intertwined with the ecosystem, and powers spellcasting." Syntax aside, the bolded part states the exact thing that Angel McCoy stated.

4) The wiki does not contradict your beliefs nor Angel’s statement and was, in fact, rewritten recently to match Angel’s interview.

5) About the Mists and multiverses, the fact that multiverses exists has been known since Prophecies, in the Prophecies manual excerpt about Lord Odran – “Over the years, Lord Odran learned to use the Rift to travel across the multiverse.”

The Six Gods – per Jeff and Ree – ceased/gradually reduced contact with the events of Nightfall so as to allow humanity to learn to grow independent rather than being reliant on the Six for all of “their” problems, big or small. In GW2, we can learn from Priestess Rhie that humanity has searched for the Six but cannot find them, only allotting their location to simply “not within the Mists.”

As the Six ceased contact, so too did their avatars cease contact. It was through the avatars that humanity was capable of accessing their realms with exception of apparent tears-in-reality (Door of Komalie and Mouth of Torment – which only lead to the Realm of Torment). The status of the Door of Komalie and Mouth of Torment is unknown, but with the loss of the avatars, we lost connection to the realms. The state of these realms are thus unknown, since all means to access the realms have been lost – in the past 250 years, there were attempts to access the Underworld (if not elsewhere), and said attempts resulted in Godslost Swamp’s little mayhem.

Uh, Adine. He asked about the Eye of the North years. You can only access them during Prophecies, which places them at 1072 AE – rather than 1078 AE, which is EotN’s year.

It would be from Thaumanova, not to. Though it was reversed in GW1, they likely realized that it didn’t make sense (or alternatively completely forgot about it like the previous mention of there being only two passable passages into the Shiverpeaks from the eastern side – the northern one connecting to the Blood Legion Homelands, not at where we get Frostgorge-Fireheart connection).

Would be funny if it was just a two-room house for a Giganticus Lupicus like the one seen in Arah. So much mystery and power and awe and fear attributed to something so insignificant to that enigmatic dead race.

Druids were originally humans who “shed their flesh” to become closer to the Maguuma. As the heart dialogue Psynch quoted, the husks seem to be a recent thing though we do have one druid stating it is its ‘husk’ – and that it left due to being called south. What this calling was is unknown, whether those husks were always there and simply recently discovered or had recently appeared (druids moving in and leaving their husks) is unknown. Either way, it would appear that the druids don’t treat them as mobile bodies, otherwise why leave it to head south if the husk could? (and there’s the lack of movement upon completion of said event)

I would argue that the husks are simply immobile “homes” for the spirits to inhabit while not on the move, and they recently just got discovered. Issue with that is that there are husks in the now-destroyed Henge of Denravi, where we should have seen some in GW1.

The wiki page you saw likely is referring to the ending cinematic which gives a glimpse into various points of the future – Livia finding the Scepter of Orr, Pyre leading his rebellion, Primordus waking up, the Pale Tree moving with no one around (the “birth of the sylvari” as mentioned but isn’t so as the Pale Tree is too small still). These all take point in different ime periods – Primordus waking, for example, happens 50 years after Eye of the North. But we witness it as part of the cinematic.

The timeskipping during the cinematic is something a lot of people don’t really seem to grasp, because said same cinematic also shows the PC and other heroes walking away from the Great Destroyer’s chamber which is where Primordus was hibernating and I’ve seen more than a few jabs at how the PC just walked away when an Elder Dragon was waking. I’ve also seen comments by folks who claim Livia found the scepter in 1078 AE based on that cinematic, and that it was retconned with War in Kryta to be post-1079 AE… despite, again, the time skipping nature of the cinematic (read: there was no retcon).

Psynch.4087:

Do you know if it’s possible to enter Maguuma (Henge of Denravi/Bloodstone Fen) during the EotN years?

You can only access the Tarnished Coast in Eye of the North – which is technically part of the Maguuma Jungle, but the coastline of it. The only non-EotN-exclusive location you can visit for 1078 AE is Ascalon, during two specific quests related to Gwen. Though during Nightfall (1075 AE) there’s a quest that takes you to Bloodstone Fen. There’s also the War in Kryta which does feature Kryta, Far Shiverpeaks, Tarnished Coast, Maguuma Jungle, and Ascalon areas (mainly Kryta) in 1079 AE. But Henge of Denravi/Bloodstone Fen is not included.

Yeah… don’t see it.

To be an incarnate of an Elder Dragon, said Elder Dragon must be dead.

The only dead Elder Dragon there is (known to us and the previous cycle) is Zhaitan.

For the GW1 map: http://wiki.guildwars.com/images/3/3d/Ullen_River_map.jpg

The Ullen River is the blue river clearly defined in the unexplored portion, and where it reaches Tangled Root it heads up, on the edge of the explored area, to Henge of Denravi. There’s also a series of shallow pools and creeks heading west from the same position it diverts north (bending to the north around Maguuma Stade).

As for your observations – it’s possible there’s an underground passage in the river that’s blocked off by players but I find it doubtful. I can say with certainty that the water at Henge of Denravi goes south into Thaumanova and once more towarsd Fisher’s Beach Bend though.

I would say that a combination of mechanical limitations and the apparent implication that the personal story was written after the maps were made (or at least by two non-fully-communicating teams) created this discrepancy. I can imagine that they placed it where it was placed for level purposes. I know that they moved one in the norn storyline to a lower-level area because where they originally wanted was too high (I believe this was in the lost heirloom storyline when meeting the kodan).

Nonetheless, it is stated that the river flows west and that’s where Malyck’s pod comes from during the final story instance with Malyc (Snuffing the Embers). I guess you’d have to look for a youtube video or something since the dialogue isn’t up on the wiki though.

The Ullen River in GW1 didn’t make sense either – y’see, the water flowed from Henge of Denravi… but also flowed from Riverside Province. It’s a river with multiple sources.

I doubt the direction of river flow changed much in 250 years with no apparent artificial redirection.

FlamingFoxx.1305:

-snip OP-

I have a few theories on the largos myself, the main one is that they share origins with humanity. Reason for this is many, but I won’t delve off-topic. But in short: their naming, their culture, and their physiology is too similar to things related to humanity or the Six Gods to ignore.

But them worshiping Abaddon? Possible, though I wouldn’t limit it to just Abaddon. Sayeh’s mention of going into the temple likely relates to her apparent interest in lore and history – it’s not obvious, but her knowledge of the Orrian writing, her knowledge on the Blue Orb, and her apparent understanding of other cultures (if she had not had ample interaction with other cultures, she should find them odd and strange that they do not do the same that she does – then again, this is an aspect that is very lacking overall throughout the game and seems to apply only to the norn).

FlamingFoxx.1305:

“god of the depths, seas, oceans and secrets. "
Source? He was the god of water and secrets, and I think that at one point it was truth or knowledge rather than secrets. But just because he’s the god of water doesn’t necessarily mean he is the god of depths, seas and oceans.

He was originally called the “chief deity of water and wisdom” in pre-release Asian lore documents. Then there’s was Jadoth’s call out to Abaddon, calling him the “Lord of the Everlasting Depths, Keeper of Secrets.”

I don’t think he was ever explicitly called a “god of seas and oceans” but those are just extensions of him being the god of water.

[quote=3323096;lakdav.3694:And to note, Abaddon was the god of secrets. He is noted as such throughout Nightfall. Kormir took his place, and became the goddes of truth and knowledge. Just like Abaddon’s essence, power and knowledge is somewhere in Kormir, truths and knowledge hold the potential and the chance to be secrets. Thats the transition of aspects when divine power finds a new host. Its full of connotations. If it was all denotation, there would be no difference between the two whatsoever.[/quote]I just want to note that, originally, Kormir was called the goddess of truth, secrets, and knowledge. Usually just “goddess of secrets” or “goddess of truth and knowledge” (or the latter, split).

It is stated in the final story step that Malyck’s pod flowed in on the river from the west (sadly, dialogue is not on the wiki – for some reason it had the dialogue of a story step prior). While the river does have a waterfall to the north, following it south it lead into Metrica Province (connecting between Venlin Vale and Hexan Regrade) and will eventually bend west as it hits Fisher’s Beach Bend. Following the unexplorable map, you can see it continues until it ends in what was called The Falls of GW1 – traveling through what was Tangle Root.

So Malyck’s Tree is in what is now called the Magus Falls, specifically either in The Fall, Tangle Root, or somewhere in-between.

Incidentally, this is the Ullen River. Well, the Ullen River and its many forks. Where the Ullen River began and ended wasn’t exactly clear – it was originally just depicted as a river wtih a checkmark shape that ran from Henge of Denravi until Riverside Province and up into Twin Serpent Lake, while there were shallow pools/creeks running west through Tangle Root. But with Eye of the North we got the river in Riven Earth which seemed to connect to the Ullen River. Now we have a river that goes from The Falls to Ventry Bay (and thus the Sea of Sorrows) with forks leading to Skrittsburg, Henge of Denravi (passing by Thaumanova), and the old Riven Earth waterfall (no longer with faces sadly). An extra fork was added I suppose. Or what leads to Skrittsburg now is what was leading to Riverside before…

Especially since the game is scaled down in size of actual size – Ebonhawke to Ascalon City is more or less a straight line (which isn’t so in-game) and takes 2 nights 3 days to travel the path – while rushing on foot.

It’s quite obvious what the significance of the number 6 is to be. You see, if the five gods did not bless our characters in Nightfall than the Sixth God would have been capable of utilizing his most ultimate attack: each of the Six Elder Dragons coming forth from the Sixth God’s Six Eyes.

That’s right. Abaddon’s Six Eyes are channels for summoning the Six Elder Dragons.

This is a forum dedicating to discussing canon. If you want to make up fan-fiction, you’re welcome to do so in the place dedicated to such. This isn’t censorship, by the way, but trying to tell you the canon which you constantly deny happening.

On a side note: it isn’t cogent with ArenaNet’s canon if your fanon is contradicting it.

The thing is, Avariz, human sacrifice is NOT used to charge up the bloodstone – let alone “bloodstone magic.” We aren’t slaying the act of human sacrifice isn’t morally wrong. We’re saying that you’re misunderstanding what the sacrifice was for.

Everything “evil” you’re attributing to the bloodstones is not actually part of the bloodstones or their functions themselves.

• The sacrifices are used to power the soul batteries, not the bloodstone nor the magic within the bloodstone.
• King Doric pleaded for the reduction of magic on a general scale. This was not limited to magic from the bloodstone per se. Furthermore, the tale of King Doric comes about alongside the original belief that the Bloodstone was made after the gift of magic was introduced. We actually don’t know if what we were told of King Doric is truthful or not in regards to this, since the original “historical facts” that a drop of his blood was used to seal magic within the newly-made Bloodstone is now questionable.
• King Doric had no control over the original Bloodstone – only the gods did. He and his nation and all other nations merely had magic – not “Bloodstone magic” just “magic.”
• Per original info, the only human sacrifices that would affect the Bloodstone is that of King Doric’s line – e.g., only sacrificing royalty would do what you’re saying is done by any human sacrifices. But again this is something that’s called into question.
• On a side, Abaddon’s Mouth is not spawning grounds for the Titans…

I would like you to actually do some more research on this topic and not twist our words when you reply to us, please.

draxynnic.3719:

On Shiro… My interpretation is that after his death, he was essentially looking out for himself the whole time. He didn’t actually care about revenge per se – the Affliction was a side effect of his activities (one he took advantage of, but he never seemed to have a “get revenge on Cantha” motive there) – he was just looking to reincarnate himself regardless of who it hurt along the way. He went for the Imperial line because he needed to spill imperial blood to achieve his reincarnation, and he built an army before that because he needed an army for his invasion of the palace.

So when he came face to face with Abaddon… it’s reasonable that even if he was aware of Abaddon’s role in his fall, his thinking was less “revenge” and more “how can I make the best of this bad situation” – which in this case means serving Abaddon.

I also have a suspicion that the reason why Shiro came back when he did was because one of Abaddon’s agents or allies slipped him a few hints as to how he might be able to reincarnate himself – so it’s entirely possible that Shiro’s response to Abaddon was more one of gratitude than of blame. After all, isn’kitten bit suspicious that Shiro showed up on the tail end of Khilbron’s failed bid for domination of the continent of Tyria?

I would argue it’s most likely that Shiro came into contact with Abaddon – or one of Abaddon’s cronies – in the Underworld shortly before becoming an Envoy, and convinced him that working for Abaddon would result in a new life (as a bargaining tool – “Work for my master, and he will provide you the tools to return to living” kind of deal, though Shiro still had to look up the exact details himself in Canthan libraries). His act of making an army seems to have been happening long before he actually discovered he needed imperial blood to return to life, so I think he was intending something else after becoming mortal – just perhaps not what most folks (Togo, Mhenlo, etc.) sans Suun thought which was taking control of Cantha himself (which is hinted at being a possible reason for his assassination of Angsiyan in An Empire Divided – before the truth of the Fortune Teller’s actions being revealed via flashbacks).

But I agree that nothing he does really say “for revenge!”

I wasn’t stating that Zhaitan was being forcedly immobile. It’s the seat of his power this cycle, having only enough grasp outside Orr to reach the Ring of Fire and northern Elonian border. Where else is he to go without putting himself on the front lines or in enemy territory?

Same goes for the other Elder Dragons – they’re all remaining within their territories, using minions as vanguards and moving about within occupied lands. Only Kralkatorrik is an exception, and he had a reason that no other Elder Dragon had: hunting down a traitor.

Well, if you think about it… Glint was freed by the Forgotten in Arah – the Altar of Glaust was not moved, by the sounds of the dialogue, and per the Orrian History Scrolls in Shelter Docks, Dwayna arrived on an already-partially(?)-built Arah. The former signifies that Zhaitan was not in Arah at the time of Glint’s obtaining free will, as why would the Forgotten perform such a ritual on Glint in the heart of Zhaitan’s territory – it instead implies that Arah was part of Kralkatorrik’s domain (the existence of Kralkatorrik’s blood in the Crystal Desert that Glint had collected for the thousands of years since the ED’s hibernation implies that the Crystal Sea was also Kralk’s domain) – yet Kralkatorrik fell into hibernation in the now-called Blood Legion Homelands.

It is possible that the Elder Dragons – or at least Zhaitan – had moved to Arah in the final years of the Elder Dragons’ activity in search for magic to feed on – be it the Bloodstone or the Six Gods. The centralization around Tyria (three in the continent, possibly four, and one nearby to the north with only one not nearby) would support such as well.

Just theorycrafting though. But the history of Glint does heavily imply that Zhaitan was more mobile last time than he is this time.

The Infinite Coil Reactor is actually still under construction. And it shoudl be kept in mind that time passes as you go to higher zones – the standard dynamic events of Queensdale and Kessex Hills are not occuring at the same time that the Seraph army are taking the fight to the Ulgoth. Nor are the events in Plains of Ashford/Diessa Plateau taking place at the same time as forces are pushing back the Flame Legion in Fireheart Rise.

Several weeks if not months pass between the events of Metrica Province and Mount Maelstrom. So there’d be even that much longer time between Thaumanova’s explosion and Infinity Coil Reactor’s incomplete construction that we see done.

And given the instability of the reactor (CoE dungeon, particularly story), I wouldn’t doubt that they rushed it.

Plus, keep in mind that the Inquest have lots of resources and manual labor (in the form of golems) as well as magic to help construction. Construction by asura is much faster than your construction in modern times (especially compared to pay-by-the-hour construction, having worked with unions who pay by the hour, I know first hand folks like to sit on their kitten s as much as possible to lengthen the amount of pay they get).

Since when did “perfect sense” ever come into play with insanity? Might as well be asking the Joker to act logically.

And it’s not like Shiro is infallible. Just because we know something about Shiro doesn’t mean he knew it himself.

As to Adelbern – he started to lose his sanity with the Searing, like a few other Ascalonians (Sardalec Sanitarium existed for a reason), and he fell further into insanity with Rurik’s death. I think his insanity was just a case of post-traumatic stress disorder than being caused by Abaddon. Ghosts of Ascalon highlights Adelbern being a madman quite clearly, but his insanity was caused by more mundane reasons.

Technically, their time is only confirmed to be after Glint having undergone that ritual by the Forgotten. The Six – or some of them – could have showed up on Tyria while the ED were awake. Though it’s unlikely, but it would explain why humanity was sent south after being brought to the world at Arah.

Obsidian.1328:

So you’re saying he went from loyal soldier to disturbed traitor…then back to loyal soldier?

No, I’m saying he went from loyal soldier to twisted traitor – he never “went back”, his act of traitorship was insanity taking fold, and this turned him to Abaddon’s side (Abaddon seems to use insanity has a tool as seen even more so throughout Nightfall).

Obsidian.1328:

What I don’t get is why, after 200 years and surely finding out the Teller’s motives in the Underworld by then, he doesn’t carry any ill will against Abaddon.

Nothing says he found out about the Fortune Teller.

We can only speculate as to why Shiro knowingly served Abaddon – or if, for that matter. We only know that the Fortune Teller twisted Shiro from loyal soldier into a pawn for Abaddon’s use. My theory would be that Abaddon offered a place of power among his troops (he is called a general in Gate of Madness, after all) and Shiro gave into the temptation of that after being ostracized as a traitor for an act he may have tried to self-defend as self-preservation.

Point is, the change makes perfect sense and has been seeded since day 1 in Shiro. Of all villains in the Guild Wars universe, Shiro is the most realistic and believable.

That’s an arguable point given the nature of the Eye of the North facets – stated by Jeff Grubb to be seen as the way they are due to them being reflection of the power the Six Gods drew upon.

Though this may simply go as far as them using Zhaitan to strengthen the Bloodstone(s) before leaving the world.

Blurk.6231:

As far as I know Tyria doesn’t even know horses, even though there are centaurs! Doesn’t make sense at all!

There’s a multitude of mentions of horses in the lore and since GW1 (Necrid Horsemen). We just don’t have any models of them, but they exist even in modern Tyria (as seen in Edge of Destiny).

You seem to not realize there is no difference between “Bloodstone magic” and “magic” – all magic in Tyria is the same. Magic stored in the Bloodstone was once up in the open world. Magic in the open world was once devoured by the Elder Dragons and released. “Dragon magic” is magic that was once in the open world and had previously been devoured but has not yet been expunged into the open world.

Magic is magic, irregardless of its source. Only possible exception is divinity, though whether this is traditional magic or not is unknown – but it certainly isn’t Tyrian, and that’s likely what makes it so unique (possibly the Forgotten’s magic too).

And you don’t need to sacrifice people – human or not – in order to utilize the magic which is constantly leaking out of the Bloodstones. The sacrifices was for the soul batteries, who’s sole purpose was to seal the Door of Komalie.

webtoehobbit.4201:

Konig, king of the lore boards, don’t anyone else dare come up with a theory, cause only his are right and everyone else just doesn’t know what they’re talking about

While I do often play the devil’s advocate, I do not hold this stance at all.

And I SEVERELY hate it when people claim I do, even in jest. ~_~

Whatever. I think I’m done here.

Firstly, I know full well I’m not always right. Secondly, I did state that “Unless something new’s come up, which I think I recall mention of such a thing but never saw a source.” I didn’t mean to be that I was infallible, just that everything I’ve seen – even an interview with TowerTalk released… actually 3 days after your Youtube link.

Interesting contradition.

But what Colin states there is just a more flimsy non-solid way of saying what they’ve been stating before. What was said previously was, paraphrased, “we want to replace expansions with living story updates and are pushing for that, but if it doesn’t work as we hope we will consider expansions again.” Aka “no plans for expansions now, but we may consider it if our plans flunk out.” The interview with Scott states that the next Living Story plot after Scarlet will be Elder Dragon focused.

Take it as you will, but all of it still points to me as the same old same old: “we intend to have living story updates replace the need for expansions.”

It “can” happen but ArenaNet doesn’t want it to. It’s their begrudging plan B.

I don’t think there’s any other kind of chaos magic, TBH.

Risingashes.8694:

When? Because in:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fighting_the_Nightmare

“Caithe: I am in Tyria, a land far away. Soon, you’ll awaken here, but for now, you live in the Dream. I can’t explain right now. We must hurry. Something is poisoning the Dream.”

Caithe says very clearly that she isn’t physically in the dream. Tell me which mission you’re referring to.

Scroll down, to just before fighting the Shadow of the Dragon.

Caithe: “Wait…something’s happening. I feel…”
Caithe: “The Pale Tree has breathed her strength into me. She’s made me tangible…but only for a few moments.”

And she becomes physical.

Risingashes.8694:

There is a big difference between a corrupted shubbery, a crystalized tree, and a sentient being.

Unlike real life there are plenty of sentient plants in Tyria, but none are corrupted by any known dragon.

That’s because none of the plants are near dragon corruption. It would be like arguing centaurs are immune to corruption, or dredge or skritt or jotun or grawl or wurms… etc. etc.

Flesh is flesh. Bark is bark. What makes corrupting a rodent any different than corrupting a human? What makes it any different to corrupt the bark from an immobile tree than to corrupt the bark of a mobile and talking tree?

You’re arguing based on lack of models, and arguing a difference between sentient and non-sentient flesh. Yet Zhaitan can corrupt corpse (non-sentient) and living (sentient) equally so. Jormag can as well. Where’s the difference?

Risingashes.8694:

Was specifically referring to the story you mentioned.

Which ignores all other mentions. I gave one example because I knew it off the top of my head.

Risingashes.8694:

Faolain is the Grandduchess of the Nightmare Court. She isn’t a strung out junkie, she’s the leader of the bureaucracy. Do yo believe that is support for the Nightmare being unable to be recovered from? Because to me it just seems like Faolain has found a solid seat of power and isn’t being offered an equivalent alternative.

She wasn’t always the Grand Duchess. Cadeyrn pulled her into the Nightmare fully. And there’s never mention of her being of the Nightmare Court during Edge of Destiny and we don’t know when she was pulled into it by Cadeyrn – just that she was tainted by the Nightmare before joining the court.

Risingashes.8694:

Okay, but that’s still not exhaustive by any stretch. At most we can say that we don’t know if dragon corruption can be recovered from apart from C. But nothing has been uncovered so far.

But it’s still more exhaustive than what you can provide by any means. While we don’t see it, the Pact, Priory, and Order of Whispers if not more had been looking into means to counter or prevent dragon corruption. And it results in nothing (until Arah exp). Maybe they’re not looking in the right direction. Maybe there is no other direction to look in.

You cannot argue that “maybe there is such” without any form of supporting evidence. The moment you do that – which is everything about your theory mind you – is the moment I can proclaim that humanity came from Earth!

And on a side, can you please not separate every single line from each other. Respond to the same responses in a group… it creates what are called “quote wars” which are very unappealing – and very long – to the eyes.

Risingashes.8694:

Jormag most certainly is in the dream, as the Sylvari know of Jormag.

False. Knowledge of Jormag may be in the Dream (do remember that not everything a sylvari knows is in the Dream of Dreams). But visual knowledge of Jormag? No known sylvari has seen Jormag, unlike Zhaitan where it’s “only two have seen Zhaitan and lived.”

Risingashes.8694:

So your explanation for what the line means is that it means nothing. As I said- you can either believe it means something, and the Pale Tree actually communicated that. Or that it’s meaningless gibberish.

I believe that something included in a short story isn’t complete gibberish as that seems like a waste of time.

I’m not saying it’s meaningless gibberish. It is the motivation for Scarlet. It is highly important for Scarlet’s personality, motivation, and overall plot. I’m saying that she’s just mistaken in what she saw, and what she saw was a figment of her imagination – e.g., not real, but she takes it to be real. Meaning that what she saw isn’t truth, but she percieves it as truth.

Like with Shiro from GW1: He was convinced that the Emperor was going to kill him, he went insane over this foretelling by the Fortune Teller. But the truth was that the Fortune Teller was manipulating him. Whether or not the Emperor intended to kill Shiro is unknown, but even if he didn’t the fact that Shiro believed he would is critically important to the plot. Same with what Scarlet “saw” – real or not, it is critically important to the plot.

Risingashes.8694:

It doesn’t. Feel free to float an alternative explanation.

Why would comprehending the forces that shape the Sylvari cause society to collapse? Isn’t this exactly what would be true if Mord was really behind the dream and the Pale Tree was covering this up?

Simple: it is in her mind. She wants to believe that there’s something more – some complex reason for her own existence. She’s egotistical (fact) and highly narcissistic (fact). She creates the delusion that she can discover something that puts her on par if not greater than the Pale Tree herself, and pushes for it given her personality.

There’s no true meaning behind it, just that Scarlet fabricated some reason to make herself believe that she is superior to everyone else, which she does believe (see the interview I previously linked).

Risingashes.8694:

If Maguuma was the next zone planned to be developed, which having two dungeons in the area suggests, then the Jungle Dragon was also the next dragon to be focused on.

Which makes the lack of anyone knowing anything about him point to something odd.

If you pay attention in the game, then everything points to Jormag being the next Elder Dragon. It is subjective.

Risingashes.8694:

All the information provided in the race previews were based on current information. A newly revealed Jungle Dragon would shake up that paradigm. That isn’t “contradicting previous information” that’s a natural progression in a story.

Working under your definitions of contradiction would mean it would be impossible for anything to change or any new threats to be introduced provided a dev had said anything without a 3 page list of provisos.

To say that sylvari are immune to all Elder Dragons in the fact that they die when touched by dragon corruption, then go about and say “hey, they’re not immune to all Elder Dragons’ corruption” is in fact contradictory to older lore.

BeoErgon.9107:

Ronan runing away with the seed can be seen like “escaping”, don’t you think. This and the love might have been a shield for the Sylvaris, yet it is a flawed shield if the NC are dragon corrupted.

I would disagree. If the seeds were made by Mordremoth, then they’d be corrupted from the very beginning. They would have been corrupted upon creation. If, however, they were not made by Mordremoth but still twisted by him, they would have been such during the previous dragon rise and simply be hibernating like The Great Destroyer and Drakkar.

Risingashes.8694:

Only if Fire Elementals didn’t exist except right before Primordus woke up.

Only if Fire Elementals only existed in the place Primordus woke up.

Key differences, and why Sylvari being connected to Mord makes sense while Fire Eles being connected to Primordius doesn’t.

On your first point: We have three cases of dragon minions existing before their respective dragon awoke – Glint, Drakkar/Svanir, and The Great Destroyer. Moot point.

In the later: Icebrood can be seen far from the Far Shiverpeaks, where Jormag lies. Branded can be seen far from the Crystal Desert, where Kralkatorrik reside. Destroyers can be found throughout the continent. Dragon minion presence is not limited to a certain radius to their respective dragon. Glint, for example, was in Arah during the previous dragon rise – Kralkatorrik’s placement best we know was in what’s now called the Blood Legion Homelands.

It doesn’t make sense for sylvari to be connected to Mordremoth anymore than it makes sense for standard treants to be connected to Mordremoth.

Risingashes.8694:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/A_Different_Dream

I actually did do that storyline. And he does have amnesia. The quest above it specifically to meet a shaman to restore his memory which Trahearne believes was stolen by the NC.

Feel free to paste anything that suggests he doesn’t have amnesia.

Wrong step. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Source_of_the_Issue

Just look at the dialogue there. Malyck remembers everything perfectly. There is no “now I remember.” It is “this is where I washed ashore. And this is where I awoke.” No epipheny. No revelation. Just recounting of things he remembers.

The amnesia was assumed by the sylvari PC because when the two first met, Malyck stated he knew nothing of the Dream of Dreams, Pale Tree, or the Grove. The amnesia was a complete misunderstanding on the PC’s part. Malyck never forgot.

As you stated, the path for Trahearne is going to a seer (not a shaman) to look into Malyck’s past. Both paths hold the intention to restore his memories… because of the misunderstanding I mentioned. Caithe’s path shows that Malyck never forgot. Trahearne’s path shows that Malyck wasn’t part of the Dream of Dreams (and mildly suggests the possibility of a different Dream unconnected to the one the Pale Tree and White Stag are a part of).

Risingashes.8694:

This is a bold claim. Why? It seems you’re assuming that your theory: that the NC are corrupted, and my theory: that the dream is the dragon are both true. And therefore mine is wrong.

I’ve been saying from the beginning that the NC have nothing to do with the dragon. If this is true then the Dream vs Nightmare faceoff still makes complete sense. The NC are simply rejecting the destiny hoisted on Sylvari via the dream, which just so happens to be sources from Mord and heavily controlled by the Pale Tree.

Actually, my statement doesn’t assume the Nightmare is the dragon corruption. My statement was noting how the Nightmare is the hostile side of the Dream of Dreams. If the Dream of Dreams was the Elder Dragon – or the Elder Dragon’s consciousness – then the entirety would be hostile, not just a portion of it. Elder Dragons, by nature, are violent.

I would agree only so much as Jora’s case, or Zojja and Snaff breaking free of being corrupted mentally (by the Dragonspawn and Kralkatorrik respectively) during Edge of Destiny. Corruption isn’t an immediate effect – not always – and if not performed in full it seems possible to escape its effects.

I wouldn’t call it “prevention” but rather “limited exposure” or “escaping” – you do not block its effects, you just aren’t exposed to it long enough.

A minor correction on your first paragraph that really affects the entirety of your post: innocents were killed to power soul batteries, not the bloodstones – the bloodstones seem to be just used to channel the energy of the soul from the body to the battery. Humans were not sacrificed (to our knowledge) on the Ring of Fire bloodstone – the soul batteries were transported from the Maguuma Jungle to the Ring of Fire. In neither case was the Bloodstone “activated.”

A correction on the second paragraph: Nothing actually says those “Devotees” were souls nor sacrificed. And it has been corrected by Angel McCoy to show that Abaddon wasn’t the only one to give magic from the Bloodstone (Abaddon didn’t give the Bloodstone – that was made by the seers long before). And the conflict that magic brought was between more than just humanity. As for last sentence, see above.

Krait Obelisks are similar to the bloodstones only in that they contain magic. It is unknown if sacrificing on them does anything to said magic contained within.

As for your paragraph on dragon magic… “Dragon magic” is the corruptive magic expunged by the Elder Dragons to make minions; they devour any kind of magic, corrupt it, and release it. Though during hibernation the magic they release is not corruptive so the corrupting part has to be a proactive action.

BeoErgon.9107:

Konig… I was not talking about Sylvaris being minions or corrupted by default, but Sylvaris as being an army to be raised and THEN corrupted after that.

And since we don’t know how Mordremoth corrupts, how can you say that love and care does not prevent it? AS far as I know Sons of Svanir are corrupted by greed and promises of power. Humble men might not be corrupted. If Mordremoth uses pain and suffering to corrupt a plant, make it grow thorns, then why could not the inverse prevent that corruption (I am not talking about curing it, but just preventing it, just like an humble norn may resist the icecube dragon one)

And please, don’t talk about Malyck because he is not a reliable counter-argument since we know nothing about his tree (how convenient from the writers)

What I wanted to tell here is this : if NC are corrupted by the Green Dragon, then maybe Sylvaries were created to be used by the dragon to corrupt them and get its army.
PRimordius has rocks, Zaithan corpses, Jormag greedy men,… Mordremoth cultivates Sylvari and when mature corrupts them…

Fair point but seems redundant for an Elder Dragon to do – and too risky. Illogical at best and immensely unlikely at worst.

Because corruption is magical for all Elder Dragons. They have different ways to go about it but what occurs is the same – they twist physical matter and change them/it into living breathing elements. The Sons of Svanir are not corrupted by their greed and promises of power – Jormag uses promises of power to lure in beings so he can twist them willingly, rather than by force. “Humble men” as you put it would still be corrupted, though they may have a chance to resist – see the Honor’s Voice during Honor of the Waves story mode, whom is corrupted by force; on the flip side, Jora escaped corruption by breaking free and not listening to the promises of power unlike Svanir. And even then, Jora was still afflicted by the corruption – though only so far as having her ties to the Spirits of the Wild broken.

What you point out is not how corruption works, but how Elder Dragons appear to prefer corrupting. Zhaitan can corrupt living beings as well as the land itself, for example. They are not limited to these things we see them corrupting. Primordus prefers rocks, Zhaitan prefers corpses, Jormag prefers seducing. But they can and will corrupt by other means.

Simply being humble will not stop an icebrood from corrupting you. Nor would being loving prevent corruption by Mordremoth should it corrupt by inflicting pain (which does seem to be how it prefers corruption if the NC are tied to Mordy).

Risingashes.8694:

They’re a plant race, who were found in the same zone as the plant dragon. That is what supports it. I cannot be proven because we haven’t been given any relative information.

By this argument, fire elementals are automatically minions of Primordus. Ice Elementals are automatically minions of Jormag. Etc.

That’s far from support.

Risingashes.8694:

Malyck has amnesia. That is the misconception. People say “Malyck doesn’t know of a dream therefore his tree doesn’t have a dream” but he has amnesia- Malyck not remembering something is less than useless as a form of evidence.

If you went with Caithe to find his history, you would know that Malyck does NOT have amnesia. This is a mistake folks arguing against Malyck being evidence to counter the whole “sylvari are dragon minions” theory often make.

Risingashes.8694:

Which hasn’t been confirmed as we’ve never encountered the Jungle Dragon, the only dragon that actually corrupts the material Sylvari are made out of. You know what else the other dragons never corrupt? Plants. Show me the Destroyer Oakheart or a Crystalized Oakheart and I’ll concede this point.

Immunity to all other dragon corruption. As for corrupted plants, see above.

Risingashes.8694:

How does the Nightmare in any way hurt my theory?

If the Dream of Dreams was Mordremoth, then the Nightmare and the Dream conflict wouldn’t exist.

Risingashes.8694:

Mord’s absence from the dream despite being 1 zone over from the tree itself.

Means absolutely nothing. Jormag’s not in the dream, because no sylvari has seen it.

Risingashes.8694:

Quite clearly talking about Mord, otherwise the line is just complete metaphysical nonesense.

http://wartower.tumblr.com/post/60458277036/this-lorespecial-is-about-scarlet-briar-the-evil

“She did not see what she thought she saw” – paraphrasing Scott from linked interview. In short: Scarlet Briar was put into a sensory deprivation machine and did not see what she thought she saw (which is the Eternal Alchemy). What exactly this means is unclear, but given the nature of the machine it seems she simply hallucinated – that tends to happen when you lose all your sight, hearing, smell, touch, and taste; that and going utterly batkitten crazy.

And I fail to see how stating that seeking out the forces that made sylvari will unleash them automatically mean Mordremoth. Tyria is a world full of sentient plants, why do the sylvari automatically get special treatment and get proclaimed “DRAGON MINIONS!”?

Risingashes.8694:

The original map sent out to collectors edition people had 2 additional dungeons, both in the Maguuma region.

I also fail to see what this holds to do with anything. On a side, I’d like to see this map. I bet one of those two dungeons is Fort Vandal.

Risingashes.8694:

Well this just doesn’t seem logical when examining a subject where the claim is that the developers are purposefully keeping information vague in order to protect a reveal.

I realize such a viewpoint is vulnerable to falling in to conspiracy theory, the CIA put microphones in my teeth, regions- but I don’t believe my theory falls anywhere close to that currently.

Keeping information vague is vastly different than contradicting old information or producing false information.

ArenaNet ALWAYS only gives out vague information. Or rather, they do 85% of the time give or take off the top of my head (as they say, 90% of all percentages used in an argument are made up :P).

Risingashes.8694:

Justify this. Because in A Light in the Darkness we enter a vision facilitated by the Pale Tree. Why do you believe it’s a ‘location’?

I would say the Dream is the way Mord commands his minions, but because of the Pale Trees influence only the most non-harmful quests get through. This is why most of the tasks concern killing other dragons and travelling eastwards.

It’s more than just A Light in the Darkness, and that was more than just a vision. We physically entered the Dream. Caithe did the same during the sylvari tutorial.

You cannot physically enter a vision or some mental connection. Only your mind can. But we (and Caithe) went there with our bodies.

Risingashes.8694:

Yes but characters work on the same lore that we do. No one knows about Mord and therefore they don’t know of any dragon that could hypothetically corrupt them.

So you’re going to argue that Mordremoth is the one and only dragon who can corrupt sylvari?

Risingashes.8694:

The other dragons corrupt flesh. Sylvari are plants, this makes a fair amount of sense.

You are wrong here. Go visit Orr and Sparkfly Fen and you will see that Zhaitan’s corruption spreads to the plants there. Heck, there’s an entire heart just about pruning corrupted plants. Go to the Dragonbrand and you will see a bunch of twisted trees – in Lowland Burns there’s even the Noxious Branded Plant. (sadly, wiki doesn’t have a made article for it).

And yet, it is Zhaitan’s corruption that is emphasized as being immune to.

Risingashes.8694:

And how are we defining ‘influence by nightmare’?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gavin

Gavin is part of the nightmare court but acts like a fairly nice and honourable guy throughout his storyline.

Half the nightmare pod rescuee in TA story seem perfectly fine once released.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Heart_of_Nightmare

Is this really the exhaustive method of bringing someone out of Nightmare? Two lines of generic text? No potions, no 4 week detox, no long term mentor, or maybe spending more than 2 minutes doing anything?

Does this really satisfy you as proving that it’s impossible to bring someone back from Nightmare?

How does one become influenced is a question that needs answering still. For the pods’ situation, it is clear that they hadn’t been fully converted. Gavin is like a black sheep but not the only one and he among others show that there is no singular mentality among the Nightmare Court (which differentiates them from dragon minions).

And there’s more than just the two lines in regards to trying to bring someone back from the Nightmare. Caithe, for example, had spent years trying to convince Faolain to return – part of this is covered in the novel Edge of Destiny (which also shows, alongside TA, that if one is not fully but only partially influenced then they can still return).

Risingashes.8694:

Why do you believe this?

Because it is the one and only case seen and – I should note – it has been mentioned by many NPCs that they joined the Orders or the Pact in hopes of finding a ‘cure’ but have become convinced there is no cure for dragon corruption (one such case being the R&D lab in Cursed Shore).

BeoErgon.9107:

If we agree with you that corrupted oaks are minions of Mordremoth and the Nightmare Court are corrupted Sylvaris, what if Sylvaris were meant to be corrupted in the first place?

That’s the same exact theory – sylvari as dragon minions = sylvari are corrupted.

Furthermore, I’m not saying that the NC are “corrupted sylvari” – I’m saying they’re influenced. Like how Jora was by Drakkar. She was no icebrood, she resisted the corruption but still suffered from it (couldn’t take on Bear Form; she was disconnected from the Spirits of the Wild). The Nightmare Court would be similar – they are not corrupted, by they’re influenced by Mordremoth via the Nightmare. A lot of the Nightmare Court differ in their personalities greatly, some not even liking the hostility that others give (Gavin, I think the name was, from White Stag storyline). This is different from all other dragon minions, and it’s unlikely that Mordremoth is the black sheep that lacks the immense fanaticism and hostility all dragon minions possess.

And your theory has a major flaw…

BeoErgon.9107:

Sylvaris (in general, not those of the pale tree) have a reason to exist, and I think the Pale tree is not aware because being raised apart and grown with love and care… Who guarded them and for what purpose?

Love and care does not prevent dragon corruption. The only thing known to do such is magic of the Forgotten. The Pale Tree would not be spared from being corrupted if it were a minion unless there was some contact with the Forgotten – but there’s no evidence nor implication of such occurring.

Furthermore, Malyck would also need to have been influenced by the Forgotten’s magic otherwise he would be more like the Nightmare Court or standard dragon minions.

DarcShriek.5829:

Konig Des Todes.2086

Three of the six Elder Dragons had known harbingers, if you will, to bring forth their coming – a single dragon champion that awoke before they did. Zhaitan, Mordremoth, and the DSD may as well. The Elder Dragons will awaken eventually anyways, but these champions serve to hasten that effect.

So no, I am not assuming that Mordremoth is awake.

“Harbinger” is an interesting word choice. Malyck is known as the Harbinger to the NC.

There was no intended connection meant to be made there. I was actually thinking of ME’s Harbinger and the Harbinger of Twilight/Nightfall from GW1 Nightfall. Harbinger being simply a form of herald.

Which is what Malyck is to the Nightmare Court: a herald to show that the NC do not need the Pale Tree.

CHIPS.6018:

Let me clarify for you why that Charr tank is not a tank.

Look at this video here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7KroXu0TAo

1) Who is protecting who? The tanks should be at the FRONT to protect the solders. NOT having the soldiers up front to protect the tank. The tank should be up FRONT running over enemies and breaking though trench lines. NOT staying back and firing away (that’s the job of an artillery cannon, not a tank).

Now if the enemy have anti-tank guns, it is common to have foot soldiers advance first to take out these guns (even then, the tank would usually advance shortly after the infantry to try to take out those guns themselves). But that is not the case here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkgkFiMUyfs

2) The player cannot even enter the tank . She had to stand outside to use the tank’s main cannon. So the tank offers zero protection. It was the soldiers at the front line who protected the player (and the tank).

This Charr tank is an artillery cannon mounted on wheels running to steam power. That doesn’t make it a tank.

3) We never saw how “fast” these Charr tanks are. But given how easily they get stuck (as seen in Arah) and they run on coal steam power, it is doubtful they can break 5 mph (you can out-walk it).

4) When the enemies can just stand there and face-tank that Charr tank’s main cannon, it’s damage is too weak to put any sort of “fear” into the enemy. This means an enemy can carry an explosive, run to the tank, face-tank the first hit, plan the explosive onto tank, KABOOM.

If the Pact do not start making real tanks, then they should change the names of these Charr vehicles into something more fitting in their role: Scouting and Reconnaissance Bikes.

1) Not all tanks are meant to go before the infantry.

2) Mechanics. Isn’t it completely SHOCKING that there are mechanics that cannot be taken as lore? If ArenaNet hadn’t kitten their entire game’s mechanics and aesthetics, you can bet your kitten that you’d be standing atop of the gun or your model disappeared and camera showing as if you’re in the tank.

3) Actually we do see how fast they move in Orr. And as someone pointed out they do races with these. Not much of a race if you can outrun them on foot.

4) Y’know, most enemies I fight except things like Risen Giants and Risen Abominations get one-shotted by the tanks in Orr. So either you have a crappy experience, aim, or whatever, or we’re playing two completely different games.

Also: Balance Mechanics.

Yeah, they’re not standard tanks. But they sure as hell aren’t as bad as you make them to be. It’s really tiring to see folks like you complain about far more than what’s actually wrong with the game.

Sublimatio.6981:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Kralkatorrik awoke in 1320. The game is in 1325, and dialogue suggests that it was within the last year if not within the last couple months.

Which dialogue? Can you quote please?

Mainly at the survivor refugee camp SE of Thaumanova. But pretty much everything about the Thaumanova area shows “this is very recent.”

It was meant to be linked by storyline. That’s all I know about it myself, and I only know via draxynnic’s mentions.

As for Shiro, apparently you don’t know his background very well. He took orders as a loyal bodyguard of the Emperor for years – until the Fortune Teller told him he was going to be killed by said Emperor. It shows in Factions’ little flashback scenes that Shiro was very conflicted or just outright going insane over the Fortune Teller’s words until the very end – though he did prepare for killing the Emperor instead, all evidence points that he was hesitant until Angsiyan went and changed the plans to allow his entourage to join inside the temple.

Furthermore, Shiro Tagachi spent 200 years (roughly) inside the Underworld. Yes, a vast majority of the time after death Shiro was not an Envoy. Shiro literally became an Envoy… then nearly immediately betrayed them. He joined the Envoys for the sole purpose – it would seem – of returning to life.

All of this can be gleaned just from An Empire Divided and Factions itself. So Shiro was very much not “didn’t seem like the type of guy to take orders from anyone” nor was he “the type of guy to want to get back at the dude who tried to play him.”

Shiro is a classic case of a “noble” soldier who is turned evil by trickery. Though he was ruthless in his service against the Emperor’s enemies, he looked down on himself despite his obvious skills and he was by all appearances unquestionably loyal to the Empire. It was the Fortune Teller’s influence which led him to self-preservation over his life-long loyalty, as well as him tapping into dark forces that over the 200 centuries of wandering the Underworld and being constantly asked to become an Envoy (a position he had refused constantly for reasons known only to himself) had eventually twisted him to evil. In Factions, when we see him in present time you would not even consider the notion that he had once been a good (albeit ruthless) person. Nor does anyone view him as such anymore, even his contemporaries (well, until we go into the Realm of Torment and do the quest chain that reveals the nature of the Fortune Teller – those contemporaries met there note what’s mentioned in An Empire Divided: that Shiro was an overly dedicated person, even if offputting and to quote one of them “cold blooded”).

Some choice quotations to prove your view of Shiro false:

“Long ago, Shiro and I fought as brothers in the elite Imperial guard, and he was cold-blooded even then. Even so, none of us believed our eyes when he turned on Emperor Angsiyan and slew him.”

“You know, he did not always have such darkness in his heart. Ambitious, yes, but loyal to Cantha and a true guardsman.”

“Although it has been many years, I still cannot believe that Shiro alone committed the treachery against emperor. During preparations for the harvest ceremony he was on edge, talking about a fortune-teller and a choice he must make. He made no sense at all, and the whole thing still doesn’t. But then again, perhaps it can all be explained by how far out of his mind my poor comrade had gone.”

Even if you ignore those lines because they come from Nightfall, you can just read this section of An Empire Divided to see his life accomplishments; or alternativley look at the cinematics in Factions that depict Shiro’s past. Here he shows he has little self-value, seeing it as utterly ridiculous that he would be remembered so long after his death. Here he shows that he find it immensely odd that the Emperor would pay attention to him – again showing his lack of self-value. Here he shows his denial of the Emperor possible of feeling threatened by him; and here shows him slowly going mad by the Fortune Teller’s words.

All in all, Shiro’s history and words show that he is not someone who wouldn’t disallow following someone, nor is he someone to just simply want revenge. Besides, by Factions – even before Nightfall, it was clear that he was far different than he was in life.

More than likely, it is simply mechanical. A lot of the cliffs and tall hills seen in GW1 were more out of the design intention to block off the “edge of the world” as it is called (in regards to the edges of the zones). Same here, though in GW1 they could have done cliffs downward since there was no proper z-axis.

These mountain borders that hold nothing inside them like caves and the like are probably nothing but mechanics due to the limitations of single-point zone entries. If ArenaNet had gone the full route of having the borders simply seamless and load as you cover areas (thus no zone names), then there’d be no need for these “boxing mountains.”

If a lore explanation is ever given – which I hope none ever is and instead they just treat it as not there – it’ll likely be due to Primordus’ tunneling about or simply “it was always like that.”