Guild Wars 2

We can keep complaining, but AN doesn’t give a kitten about us engineers. I don’t know how they do their discussions on what classes or builds need fixing or nerfing but I’ve lost all my faith on them. Turning a blind eye on us engineers after a major nerf that devastated the class while continuing on buffing the already OP warriors. On the latest interview, not a single mention on the engineer was given.

Not even a single mention about engineers.

AN dev team is one of the kittentiest teams ever. Consistently buffing the popular warrior while neglecting the least played class which is the engineer. It’s been a month since that game-changing nerf for the engineers yet not a single comment was given by the devs.

I really hope that someone from Anet realizes that the engineer fan-base loathe them for turning a blind eye to us. Not only because we are the least played class means they can just neglect us.

Lazy Anet team just got off from a vacation. I think it would be better not to expect major patches.

Anet Logic:

What?! Warriors can take on end-game bosses 1 on 1 head-on?
Let’s buff them some more.

What?! Engineers are the least played class and 50% of their skills and traits are still bugged?
Let’s do some nerfing.

Engineer grenade kit outshines all other kits, they nerfed it instead of fixing/buffing other kits. It’s the same issue here, elementalist D/D outshines all other weapon sets, they’d rather nerf it than fix other weapon sets.

I don’t see a reason why they won’t do an unreasonable nerf to the elementalists as well. I’ve lost all my faith on Anet team who’re too busy playing their warriors and thieves to even give a single comment to the engineer community who has been crying for justice since the grenades nerf.

Trivia Time!
Did you know that grenade kit/flamethrower kit which engineers use can be bought from certain NPCs? And guess what, they are stronger than the original kits!

FTW Anet.

haviz.1340:

Kyon.9735:

I’d like you to please elaborate how you can say that a D/D ele does not give up his offense/damage. Maybe it’s me who’s missing the point and maybe you can enlighten me. As for now, I believe Bunker eles win by prolonging the fight and the fastest to go down would be pure glass cannon builds who failed to do an initial burst attack. Though if you are able to prolong a fight w/ a bunker ele, it’ll take you no time to guess his/her attack patterns and it would be much easier to counter eles.
Cheers!

You lose your offense by speccing into bunker, set doesn’t. What d/d eles loses compared to other sets? You do have defensive skills (2 auras, healing on 2 skills, weakness, chill), strong damage skills (burning retreat, fire grab, churning earth, etc). The only burstier and more defensive set at the same time is S/D but it’s much harder to land your combos. Try playing more damage oriented d/d ele and you’ll see it still hasn’t issues with survival and damage.

Please try playing bunker D/D and test how much damage you can do bursting on a moving WvW player as a target. Then count how many of your skills hit and how many miss. All 3 of the strong damage skills you mentioned can miss easily and of course we don’t expect our target to stand in 1 place and take all that damage. But then again you’ll barely reach15k burst even if Churning earth, burning retreat, and fire grab hits unless you’re hitting a glass cannon or up-leveled or light armored enemy.

I’m sorry but I’m still unconvinced, you can try elaborating more. I’ll still stand on my ground, bunker D/D is not OP, it’s flashy. People are just not used to targets with very good mobility and when most of their skills miss, they claim that D/D/ is OP. D/D does not need to be nerfed, but rather other weapon sets need to be buffed.

haviz.1340:

Kyon.9735:

Instead of asking for a nerf, why don’t you ask Anet to buff other weapon sets for the elementalist? Isn’t that more logical since your complaints are D/D outshines all other weapon sets? You guys say that D/D is the only viable weapon set YET you want them to nerf it so it can be as weak as other weapon sets? Then after that you’ll ask Anet to buff elementalists again? Come on guys, let’s use our brains.

D/D ele is flashy, not OP. So what if D/D eles are the best class at running away or chasing people? D/D eles trait heavily to boon duration/toughness/healing so they don’t even have a lot of damage to kill/burst someone effectively.

A D/D ele gives up his/her offensive prowess for the sake of gaining more defensive attributes. It is a fair exchange. I lose damage but I gain survivability and good support skills/CC.

D/D Eles will be OP once they have that 22k HP w/ 2800 armor and deals 15k BASIC burst as per someone who has a 30/30/30/30/30 build…

D/D ele doesn’t give up his offense. All Fotm ele players do by playing bunkers. What needs to be nerfed is their bunkering capabilities so some people might man up and trait for some damage.

I’d like you to please elaborate how you can say that a D/D ele does not give up his offense/damage. Maybe it’s me who’s missing the point and maybe you can enlighten me. As for now, I believe Bunker eles win by prolonging the fight and the fastest to go down would be pure glass cannon builds who failed to do an initial burst attack. Though if you are able to prolong a fight w/ a bunker ele, it’ll take you no time to guess his/her attack patterns and it would be much easier to counter eles.

Cheers!

Instead of asking for a nerf, why don’t you ask Anet to buff other weapon sets for the elementalist? Isn’t that more logical since your complaints are D/D outshines all other weapon sets? You guys say that D/D is the only viable weapon set YET you want them to nerf it so it can be as weak as other weapon sets? Then after that you’ll ask Anet to buff elementalists again? Come on guys, let’s use our brains.

D/D ele is flashy, not OP. So what if D/D eles are the best class at running away or chasing people? D/D eles trait heavily to boon duration/toughness/healing so they don’t even have a lot of damage to kill/burst someone effectively.

A D/D ele gives up his/her offensive prowess for the sake of gaining more defensive attributes. It is a fair exchange. I lose damage but I gain survivability and good support skills/CC.

D/D Eles will be OP once they have that 22k HP w/ 2800 armor and deals 15k BASIC burst as per someone who has a 30/30/30/30/30 build…

Good coordination, I won’t that away from you. Though I’ll give credit to whoever pug commander was leading that mindless zerg for your success as well. Even if he charged alone, his zerg is sure to follow. Yet, nobody dared to charge in. 2 eles(staff), Engineer and a thief. Like other people say, 1 good D/D ele can break your formation. Even a warrior can easily break in w/ Endure Pain.

Cheers

“You’ve lost that loving feeling~” – Top Gun(1986)

“I see nerfed people” – The Sixth Sense(1999)

“My Precious” – Anet on their favorite classes, warriors and thieves. From LotR: The Two Towers (2002)

“I’m the king of the nerf!” – Titanic (1997)

Why the F does Anet hate engineers? They nerf the least played class but they buff the most played class? Just to add, not a single dev bothered to give justifications to all the nerfs. Now they do stealth nerfs as well?

Anet sucks at customer service. They don’t bother to listen to their customers yet they do all this advertising and stuff to get new customers.

If any Anet dev/mod reads this, all we want are justifications for the recent nerfs and how about telling us your plans for this class as well?. We have been ignored too long.

If they used to play a class like warrior or thief who can own someone by only pressing 2~4 buttons, then they’d probably get owned when they first roll a D/D ele.

ThiBash.5634:

They’re both versatile, but where the engineer picks something before the fight starts, the elementalist basically makes their choice during the fight.

Which also means that if an engineer truly wants run cc, they will do it better than the elementalist. But that same engineer will heal less than that same elementalist. Etc.

This came from the elementalist forums which pretty much sums up the comparison between engineer and elementalist versatility. All credits goes to ThiBash.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Kyon.9735:

First of all, that’s a pro losing to a noob controlling an OP character.

You’ve lost all your credibility here in these two sentences alone.

You never had any. What “pro” loses to a noob?

Is that what’s happening here? You lose all the time but choose to believe it’s because of “balance” since you are some ultra-pro? There is nothing any noob can do that can’t be countered. You can’t blame class balance because you “don’t want to dodge.”

Not getting hit is the name of the game. Always has been, always will be. It doesn’t matter how “OP” a single attack is if it doesn’t hit anyone.

If you are losing to any class just because you can’t combat them, that is not a reflection on class balance. It’s the balance between the keyboard and the screen. Warriors are EASY prey, they aren’t even on my radar as nothing they do stands out. The only thing they have gong for them is power hits if they glass-cannon and catch someone off guard. Rangers running S/D are far deadlier opponents.
Any toughness build is a deadlier opponent than a glass-cannon.

Glass cannons will forever be the realm of noobs. And the laughingstock of anyone who can avoid the bust and hit back at their squishy pinata selves.

Ok, I’ll give you one last chance before you completely embarrass yourself.

You put a Pro Racer in a Volks Beetle and race him against a Noob riding a Toyota F1 in a drag race. In a straight race w/o accidents, there’s no way a pro racer can beat a noob.

Now, you have a Pro player as an engineer against a Noob playing a warrior and let them battle head on, both having GC builds. In a battle for DPS, there’s no way an engineer can out-DPS a warrior.

If you still can’t understand, then let a rifle warrior fight a rifle engineer head-on w/o dodging/blocking. When a melee based character beats a medium/long-ranged character in a head-on ranged fight like that, isn’t it too obvious that something isn’t right?

Hopefully your mind is able to comprehend something like that. It seems that you’re too kitteny to even understand what open-mindedness means. You sir, are completely embarrassing yourself by believing in your own one-dimensional world where [Pro w/ lousy character + lousy gear] > [Noob w/ OP character + High End gears]. I’m usually a patient and cool-headed person but sometimes, people like me get tired of talking people who let their ignorance get over them.

Cheers.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Kyon.9735:

And another guy misses the point. Whenever you compare 2 classes, you should never take the skills of the pilot in account. That’s the golden rule. You can’t just say he can dodge or use whatever skill simply because not everyone thinks alike. Class balancing is about how players of the same skill set is able to utilize the character. When 1 skilled player loses to a noob player simply because the noob player is using a very OP character, it’s obvious that we need some balancing.

Now, when a warrior who’s supposed to be good at melee uses a rifle and beats an engineer who’s supposed to be good at long/mid range fight, isn’t it obvious that we need some balancing?

The point here is that Engineers should be buffed OR warriors should be nerfed in terms of ranged skills. We can’t have another profession outclass us in something that we should thrive.

Second, I have never seen a skilled player lose to a noob.

Third, Skilled players don’t lose to burst!

First of all, that’s a pro losing to a noob controlling an OP character.

You’ve lost all your credibility here in these two sentences alone. Sorry but I see no point in arguing with someone who doesn’t even want to open his eyes. While I’m aware how good engineers can be, I’m also aware how good other classes can be. So should you.

Over and out.

Destroyer.1306:

Kyon.9735:

Destroyer.1306:

Kyon.9735:

Destroyer.1306:

Not sure why people are concluding Warrior is a better class. If the glass cannons in these two videos ever met in combat, the Engineer wins pretty easily.

Let’s see… no special tactics/setup or whatever, GC Warrior would 1 shot GC Engineer before he is in the engineer’s range.

Oh, please. Kill Shot has the most obvious wind up in the history of video games. He literally has to kneel down and wait almost two seconds. The Engineer can skip and dance to any range he wants, all invincible like with Gear Shield, and then lay the smack down far quicker than the Warrior can. Plus, the Engineer has Supply Crate while the Warrior Elite is essentially a slightly-improved Elixir B he already used. Glass cannon rifle Warriors are truly useless creatures if anyone is paying attention to them.

And while Volley is equally easy to dodge, no one is going to dodge 7 hits that are instantaneous from the Engineer unless they are super lucky. (Analyze, Suprise Shot, Throw Wrench, SDx3, Sigil of Air.)

Funny how I clearly said that No special tactics/setup then you put them both in a situation. More importantly, you only put how an engineer could advance and counter the warrior while you didn’t even specify how a warrior could counter an engineer as well.

Please don’t be biased. Been playing engineer for 600 hours now and I clearly know how to counter/be countered. If you want to say an engineer can get close to a warrior by using Gear Shield while he loads his Kill Shot, then the warrior can definitely use Stability and Endure Pain to prevent from being CCed/out DPSed before he can launch Kill Shot.

If you’re putting those 2 in a situation, you better put how we can be countered as well. We need constructive ideas/criticism, not just some biased opinion where you don’t even give the other class a chance at all. That’s why I didn’t even mention any tactics and just put those 2 classes head on which would obviously result in the Warrior’s win simply because he has long base range and higher damage output.

Dude. What?

What are you even talking about?

I said if the two glass cannons in the two videos met, the Engineer would destroy the Warrior. Which he would.

Balanced Stance? Endure Pain? Do you see those skills on that Warrior’s utility bar?

Let me be as clear as I can. The glass cannon Engineer in this video would destroy the glass cannon Warrior in that video because he has more utility and his abilities are more difficult to avoid.

Now I’m going to go see if my new sweater fits and never think about this horrible discussion again.

Now that’s something I missed. If these 2 persons meet in game, I’d also vote hands down for the engineer simply because he’s much more skilled and knows how to utilize his skills.

On the other hand, what I was trying to point out was that when 2 players of the same skill level meet using this GC build, I doubt that the engineer can beat the warrior simply because a warrior is much more OP than an engineer, I doubt anybody disagrees. Sorry for the confusion there.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Kyon.9735:

I can’ believe you missed the point twice. The engineer video and warrior video is about class balance. Put 5 year old kids to pilot the engineer and warrior and teach them to click 1 button and let them fight 1 on 1. It’s quite obvious who’ll win.

The point here is a warrior has to click 1 button while engineers need to put a lot of effort. Hopefully you’d understand now how an engineer needs to sacrifice/put a lot of effort to reach the level of a warrior who simply does nothing but press 1 button.

Engineer dodges, MISS.

Not to mention traits will still save you. Whenever I get bursted out of nowhere, elixer S auto triggers and I have three seconds to to figure out a retaliation or escape. Even an insta kill hit still triggers it, I have actually been left with 0 hp because I got hit so hard with my health already low. Auto triggering traits have been nothing but glitchy kittens in fractals, Elixer S hardly ever triggers, I expect that has a lot to do with the engineer hate in fractals.

But the complaint “This ONE other skill makes our entire class worthless!!!” seems more like a complaint about the Warrior Kill-Shot being overpowered. Since they must be traited glass cannon to do it, and can themselves be killed by virtually anyone sneezing on their keyboard, I don’t see the complaint.

The game is heavily Paper-Rock-Scissors, there will ALWAYS be that “one class” and that “one build” that trumps any one other class/build you can come up with. But ANY build has another class/build which can decimate it. And any of these mythological “Uber-Builds” or “first rate classes” have numerous class/builds that can take them down just as easilly.

You know theives HATE engineers, right? Some guardians, too. As long as they are alone, I have never lost to a guardian. Partly because the class is so unpredictable.

NOT in sPVP, of course, the whole sPVP crowd seems to have this “one build to rule them all” mentality, but that’s exactly why they lose so much, everyone knows exactly what to expect. Seems to really only be a pugging issue, though, in tPVP it is all about team play, if you have a good team your engineer should not be being singled out for a 1v1 anyway. The mechanics of 1v1 fights should never be the determining factor in sPVP or tPVP, if it is, you’re doing it wrong.

And another guy misses the point. Whenever you compare 2 classes, you should never take the skills of the pilot in account. That’s the golden rule. You can’t just say he can dodge or use whatever skill simply because not everyone thinks alike. Class balancing is about how players of the same skill set is able to utilize the character. When 1 skilled player loses to a noob player simply because the noob player is using a very OP character, it’s obvious that we need some balancing.

Now, when a warrior who’s supposed to be good at melee uses a rifle and beats an engineer who’s supposed to be good at long/mid range fight, isn’t it obvious that we need some balancing?

The point here is that Engineers should be buffed OR warriors should be nerfed in terms of ranged skills. We can’t have another profession outclass us in something that we should thrive.

Amadeus.5687:

@Kyon do you even realise that the warrior in that video have one thing you need to dodge (which is insane easy to dodge) and is worth jackkitten when he miss that shot? He is so easy to counter that my 11 year old sister could beat him! The Engineer ain’t a one trick pony, seeing as he don’t suffer even half the amount of pain that the warrior would do if his Kill Shot miss! It’s stupid to compare two weapon’s that ain’t supposed to do the same and whine over one do more direct damage compared to the engineer rifle! Casia pretty much nail the situation about how it works
(also, the warrior is doing a lot, actually every single trait, gear stat and rune is taken to make max damage output, which again leads back to my point: He would loose any decent 1va1 because he got nothing when his Kill Shot is dodged/Blocked/reflected. The same goes for the engineer, which end up doing pretty close to the same amount of damage over a bit longer period, but with more CC and tricks up his sleeve, which I would take anyday)

I can’ believe you missed the point twice. The engineer video and warrior video is about class balance. Put 5 year old kids to pilot the engineer and warrior and teach them to click 1 button and let them fight 1 on 1. It’s quite obvious who’ll win.

The point here is a warrior has to click 1 button while engineers need to put a lot of effort. Hopefully you’d understand now how an engineer needs to sacrifice/put a lot of effort to reach the level of a warrior who simply does nothing but press 1 button.

Destroyer.1306:

Kyon.9735:

Destroyer.1306:

Not sure why people are concluding Warrior is a better class. If the glass cannons in these two videos ever met in combat, the Engineer wins pretty easily.

Let’s see… no special tactics/setup or whatever, GC Warrior would 1 shot GC Engineer before he is in the engineer’s range.

Oh, please. Kill Shot has the most obvious wind up in the history of video games. He literally has to kneel down and wait almost two seconds. The Engineer can skip and dance to any range he wants, all invincible like with Gear Shield, and then lay the smack down far quicker than the Warrior can. Plus, the Engineer has Supply Crate while the Warrior Elite is essentially a slightly-improved Elixir B he already used. Glass cannon rifle Warriors are truly useless creatures if anyone is paying attention to them.

And while Volley is equally easy to dodge, no one is going to dodge 7 hits that are instantaneous from the Engineer unless they are super lucky. (Analyze, Suprise Shot, Throw Wrench, SDx3, Sigil of Air.)

Funny how I clearly said that No special tactics/setup then you put them both in a situation. More importantly, you only put how an engineer could advance and counter the warrior while you didn’t even specify how a warrior could counter an engineer as well.

Please don’t be biased. Been playing engineer for 600 hours now and I clearly know how to counter/be countered. If you want to say an engineer can get close to a warrior by using Gear Shield while he loads his Kill Shot, then the warrior can definitely use Stability and Endure Pain to prevent from being CCed/out DPSed before he can launch Kill Shot.

If you’re putting those 2 in a situation, you better put how we can be countered as well. We need constructive ideas/criticism, not just some biased opinion where you don’t even give the other class a chance at all. That’s why I didn’t even mention any tactics and just put those 2 classes head on which would obviously result in the Warrior’s win simply because he has long base range and higher damage output.

Rezzet.3614:

insanemaniac.2456:

off hand pistol blows kitten use shield

pistol autoattack damage is crap compared to rifle

2 has ridiculous accuracy problems

BUT RIFLE DOESNT GIVE YOU 2 SIGILS!!

You do know only ONE sigil procs at a time then both go under cooldown?
wich makes having 2 sigils near useless.

I thought having 2 of the same sigils with the same cool down procs the cool down, but having a sigil proc every 2 seconds and another that procs every 5 seconds work? Correct me if I’m wrong.

Destroyer.1306:

Not sure why people are concluding Warrior is a better class. If the glass cannons in these two videos ever met in combat, the Engineer wins pretty easily.

Let’s see… no special tactics/setup or whatever, GC Warrior would 1 shot GC Engineer before he is in the engineer’s range.

The main problem here is that Anet did a major update on the Engineer class, then they left us all hanging after that. Not even a single form of communication was made for the past few weeks. Isn’t is common protocol to get feed backs from your customers especially on major updates? Not even a single dev has taken his time to reply. It’s really a shame because I thought Anet Team was a pretty good team but it seems they’re only focusing on certain classes especially Warrior and Thief.

Amadeus.5687:

Deified.7520:

Ghostpilot.6237:

Just to add a bit of perspective to this as a former Engineer (from launch) who finally got the hint and rolled Warrior, here’s a Rifle Warrior.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLTzyn6CGHw

That’s it. Im done. Rerolling something else. After watching both videos I can’t hold out any longer haha.

So after watching a 100% glass cannon one trick pony warrior attack people from safe place’s most of the time, hitting people running a way, and is showcaseing nothing else but “Hey if my enemies is stupid or don’t notice what I’m doing I can pew pew them”, and afterwards watch a quite well made video with a Engineer doing a way better job in harder fight’s you want to reroll? Goes for the rest of you guy’s in the thread that compare, you really think big number’s is what make a class good or not? <.< (Not that the Engineer movie is much more then huge number’s to, but at least some of the footage is actually a good fight vs a skilled player, and not just random shooting at fleeing enemies)

Do you even realize that the point of posting that warrior GC build video was to compare how a Warrior who does nothing special still beats a very skilled Engineer in terms of damage output?

Deified.7520:

Looks like she is running a class cannon build. Probably going down the precision tree, maybe full on donw the tool.

Yeah this build is very situational I feel. Good awesome video to watch. But they were either underleveled, or you just got the jump on em (though that fight vs the perma theif made me laugh).

Just in case the devs watch this video, this doesn’t mean we need to be nerfed, so please don’t nerf. Our class still needs a ton of work before it can be considereed good. The guardian portion of this video more symbolizes the problems with the class balance more than anything.

I agree, I hope the devs are not stupid enough to nerf us again because GC Rifle build looks OP when it’s fighting up-leveled/light armor classes. This is probably a 20/20/0/0/30 or 10/30/0/0/30 basic glass cannon build.

BTW I love how you used the build, especially against that kitten perma invi thief, probably the favorite class of Anet devs second to warrior. He pretty much got owned there. You pretty much have mastered the GC Rifle build for the class IMO.

Also, lvl 15 guardian owning lvl 80s was hilarious

Lite.3819:

Bargaw.4832:

People keep calling engineer versatile because he has no cooldown on kit swaping.

Engineers are in really bad spot right now, people refuse to admit it, because they think they are doing fine in dungeons, while in fact all you need in dungeons is tanky gear, heal skill + ability to dodge, fights take longer, but are impossible to fail because bosses have no enrage/regen.

Engineers are versatile because they have no cool down on kit swaps and the cool down are kits are relativity low.

Engineers are in a bad spot right now “because” dungeons are easy and there is little room for useful heavy crowd control. Dungeons are impossible to fail because bosses have very simple AI’s. “Harder” dungeons in GW2 are dungeons where boss hits harder not smarter.

So you’re saying that engineers are versatile simply because switching to kits which have mediocre skills have no cool down?

So tell me, of all the kits we have how many skills are viable?

Tool Kit – Only #3 and #4 are actually very useful.

Tool kit 1 – A melee attack that has a cast time? Sure, guardian hammer have cast time too but they do massive damage compared to tool kit 1

Tool kit 2 – 1 Second casting time and a single stack of bleed + cripple(2.25 secs) in a 240 radius. Bleed stack/duration is too low. It’s only useful when trying to run away from opponents.

Tool kit 5 – A very clanky magnet skill at 1200 range. It bugs more often than not because if your target is shielded by a single cell of structure, most of the time you’ll fail pulling your target.

Flamethrower kit – This could have been simply our bread and butter after the nades nerf. But no, #1 and #2 fails more often than not.

FT 1 – Should I even explain? FT 1 misses a lot especially when you/your target is moving. You see your target burning and dancing in the flame yet your attacks miss.

FT 2 – Another buggy skill. I’d love to see this fireball not get sucked by the ground

FT 5 – 1 stack of blindness for a 20 sec cool down skill?

FT Tool belt – 60 second cool down for 3 attacks w/ 3.25 secs burn? They didn’t even bother showing us how many stacks are left.

Elixir Gun – Nothing much to complain here aside from buggy #2 and crap heal #5.

EG 2 – Elixir F bugs a lot and animation is too slow. You’d often see this ball get sucked by the ground or bounce to your target and allies but not receive cripple/swiftness

EG 3 – Would have been more useful if it removes conditions from user as well. They could increase the cool down since Fumigate can remove up 3+ conditions. Putting it on 12 secs + affects the user is OP.

EG 5 – Given that this is a stationary heal, the pulse heal is too low. Could bump the pulse heal to 200~250 base w/o healing stats.

Bomb Kit – It’s more like Pew Pew rather than a big KABOOOOOOM… aside from Big ’Ol Bomb of course.

Bomb Kit 1 and 2 – Even when traited for increased aoe, the aoe is still too small.

Grenade Kit – Every engineer should know this by now.

If you’d like further discussion, please give a more comprehensive/constructive response rather than telling us that we are versatile since switching kits have no cool down.

Anet’s too lazy playing their warriors/thieves for an update like this.

Nah, just kidding. Actually, I think it’s a good idea along with Ejiofor’s. But this is probably impossible as this one is a MAJOR update. It will take months for tests before they can even launch it, it’s actually like remaking the engineer class rather than fixing it but if they do, engineer class will be viable again. But then again, I don’t see Anet committing on something like this just to improve one class.

Off-topic:
When a warrior/thief gets buffed by Anet, expect a nerf for engineers

My tank build FT engi uses Sigil of Perception and Sigil of Blood (Lifesteal every 2 secs on critical hit). After hitting 25 stacks I change to Sigil of Air. I’m pretty careful even though I’m on the front lines since FT range sucks.

Here are my stats w/o food

2,700+ Attack
37% base Crit chance (No Fury and no stacks of precision yet)
2900 Armor
24,000+ Health

hydeaut.1758:

Lifelike.5862:

Thank you Anet, for giving us this wonderful new toy to play with. Team-support Engineers salute you.

I imagine this would also work well with flamethrower builds too, come to think of it.

I guess Anet didn´t take special engi-skills into account when creating this rune, more the opposite (which may make them taking a look on special engi-skills . . .)

The Irony – It’s not that Anet didn’t take special engineer skills into account… they forgot that they even created the engineer class.

Just kidding
But great find to OP. Didn’t even know there were new runes like this.

Zuer.2814:

Maybe it’s because I’m just starting to learn the ins and outs of my Engineer, but I don’t really see any issues. You just have to adapt. I’m sure I’ll get flamed with,“I’ve been playing my engineer since beta/release! You just don’t get it!”, but I’m only lvl 35 on my Engineer and having no problems in WvW whatsoever.

I’m not flaming you, but you can’t talk at all about how easy it is to adopt since you’ve never experienced how useful nades are especially in higher levels. You said it yourself.

Here’s a scenario for you.

Engineers’ life Post-Patch:
Engi: Spam elixir to stack might, yeah keep it at 20 stacks baby! Nades are the only way to keep up with the damage other classes can do! Ah, my sigil of bloodlust finally reached 25 stacks after XX minutes! Oh, here comes an enemy zerg. Tower defense time! This is where nade engineers thrive!

Spams nades… Pew! Pew! Boom! Boom!

Engi: Oh kitten, kitten! My HP’s down to 30%! Gotta heal. Oh crap! I forgot I spammed my Elixir H to stack might! Oh, kitten I’m down! Ahhhhh, here they come!! Nooooooooooooooooooooooo! My 25 stacks of bloodlust are gone! Fak! Fak! Fak! Fak!

And Engineers lived happily ever after.

The point is, stacking sigils and might takes too long AND we could lose it in an instant, be it PvP, PvE, or WvW. I don’t get why people keep saying Nades are still powerful if you have 25 stacks of might and bloodlust plus we can have 2 sigils while using the grenade kit. They don’t simply understand that OTHER CLASSES CAN DEAL BETTER DAMAGE WITHOUT STACKING MIGHT AND BLOODLUST. WHY CAN’T THEY UNDERSTAND IT?!

QQ!

Townopolis.3607:

Kyon.9735:

Problem is, Healing stat is crap and you’re probably better off investing in other stats than Healing.

SE compares more favorably against regeneration at lower healing power levels as it has higher base healing and a lower total coefficient.

If people find healing to be relatively useless as compared to just investing in damage, I’m not going to argue. I’ve managed to make group healing work for myself, but I’m aware that’s partly because that’s what I find fun and engaging. What I will argue is that SE still stands up when compared to other forms of group healing.

Actually, I’m not disagreeing with you about how SE is useful pre-patch and post-patch. Been an engineer since day 1 w/ 500+ hrs playing time. What I’m trying to say is that I’ve experienced SE all changes and after experiencing the “bugged” SE, it’s just too hard to accept the 50% plus healing rate reduction. Bugged SE heals at for at least 400 with out healing stat then we have Kit Refinement to double it. Post-patch we have to overhaul healing equipment just to reach the same results, not even near though. What I’m trying to say is that it’s incomparable to the former SE, and now we have to stack on healing equipment just to meet the former healing power.

STRanger.5120:

maddoctor.2738:

Anet is very fast in fixing “overpowered” Elementalist bugs but very slow (they are still all there) in fixing important issues. Funny

Also noticed that, but it doesn’t seem fair to our proffesion, some bugs are waiting to be fixed for months

Hi there, have you met Engineer?

Kidding aside, I’m an engineer who’s trying to roll an Elementalist and seriously I’m loving it. Elementalists and Engineers are quite similar, with elems changing attunements and engineers changing kits to fit in the situation. The only difference is elems do massive damage while we engineers did crap damage pre-patch and post patch.

Townopolis.3607:

This thread needs more numbers.

Regeneration: 130 base heal/second w/ .125 coefficient.
Super Elixir: 140 base heal/second w/ .1 coefficient + 380 base impact heal w/ .2 coefficient.

@1,040 healing (full healing gear, jewelry, & runes, plus 200 from traits—does not include weapon stats for the obvious reason)…

Regeneration: 260/sec
Super Elixir: 244/sec + 588 impact heal

… over 10 seconds…

Regeneration: 2600 healed
Super Elixir: 3028 healed (assuming subject(s) stayed in the zone the WHOLE time)

The fact that SE is a zone people have to stay in to receive the heal is the biggest issue with the ability. On the other hand, it does open up some (comparatively minor) benefit in that allies can enter the zone after the fact to receive (some) healing. Possibly more importantly, there are some situations where movement is either already restricted (bunker) or the need to move is more predictable (dungeons).

I think SE remains approximately as viable for group healing as the ability to provide group regeneration. With Kit Refinement, SE is comparable (not too unfavorably) to permanent group regeneration. It has the drawback of being a zone, but the benefit of stacking with both regeneration applied by others (if that happens) and itself (if that happens). It is also about as good for burst healing as regeneration, which is to say not very.

I still like it, and remember that it’s only 1 of 6 abilities granted by taking the EG; it isn’t entirely reasonable to expect one ability to carry the whole kit.

Problem is, Healing stat is crap and you’re probably better off investing in other stats than Healing.

Decklan.7540:

So this build is basically a variation on the Tankcat.

Sorry, not trying to sound like a jerk, but it is becoming pretty apparent that the bunker build is the only viable thing left for the engineer. Which pisses me off to no end.

Yeah, this is totally TANKCAT.

ahmajo.3159:

Isslair.4908:

Stacks are useless in dungeons -_-

You’re skipping mobs anyways and get to downed state frequently. Stop theorycrafting.

Also, anyone confirmed that both sigils work? I saw some posts about only one sigil giving stacks.

I disagree, my guildy guardian and I can upkeep 25 stacks of might 70% uptime

But then, are you a guardian or an engineer?

Stop doing paper math. This isn’t viable in PvP/WvW. I believe I don’t have to discuss why since there are plenty of other threads where this has been elaborated.

Shinsanity.1938:

Rozbuska.5263:

Shinsanity.1938:

You guys are noobs. 30% damage reduction from the grenade auto-attack. Do you guys seriously spam the auto-attack that much to even make that much of a difference? I rotate through grenades, bombs, rifle, and heal skills throughout the fights. I do use the grenade autoattack, but not THAT often and I still do pretty well. I don’t see why everyone is crying so much about this.

You missing the point man. Noone who playing engi spam just autoattack. That is a point. We cant if we want do something against other classes no matter if its PvP or PvE. Personaly I am not some top pvp player on the world but I thing I am good enough. I play engi since beta and I have a lots of pvp experience in various games (for example Warhammer Online where I also play engi btw). Yesterday I making pvp daily in hot join no big deal and I met a thief who just spam Heartseeker. Nothing more than that no stealth no no heal no other skill just spam one skill and almost got me (I use bunker build) simple as that.

Point is Anet promise balanced classes its why I bought this game and no I dont reroll to other class. I want play engi. I just dont want play on my keyboard like on piano doin best what I can while some noobish kid pushing one button on his OP class and after die go cry on forum and Anet come with nerf.

I enjoy engi and I will play him no matter what I always found way how to win. But in past Anet promise some things, like they will balance due to their own experiences not on cry topics. And now I see post like “we test it on dummies and it work well” and I am so disappointed.. Sorry for bad english

And I’m trying to say, this IS a good balance.. How much damage do you get from your auto-attack in a fight? Me personally rotating through bombs/rifle/grenades/heals (as a good engineer SHOULD be doing since switching kits has 0 CD) I probably use it 1-2 times max before switching kits. My grenade auto-attack does 900 damage, so 2 auto-attacks would be reduced by 30% is what 600 damage reduced? Sigil of Air/fire procs for 800-900 damage on a 5 second CD for crits. I might be missing something, but I seriously don’t get what the big fuss is, unless you ONLY use grenade kit then I could see the problem.

So… what’s your main class, warrior? Seriously, I doubt your main is an engineer as to you don’t exactly see the point how this nerf affects our class at all. Did you even level through quests or did you just craft your way to make your engineer 80? Any engineer who grinded through world events and quests would know how this nerf hurts us both PVE and PVP.

It does stack. But Regen food heals for like 70, right?

Still highest DPS you say? So what? This isn’t viable in sPvP/tPvP or WvW. You mean you expect your target to sit patiently while you spam your elixirs and wait till you get 25 stacks? Also if you spam your elixirs, when the time you need to use it, you can’t because it is on cool down after using it to stack might.

So we’re highest DPS in paper, does that help the fact that it doesn’t mean a thing in actual gameplay? No. Engineers NEED to be fixed. Being highest DPS in paper doesn’t mean a thing.

Oh btw in case you don’t know, Super Elixir was not nerfed. It was FIXED. It was bugged pre-patch and always healed for the initial impulse of 400 instead of 400 initial and 150 for the following pulses. Get your facts right first.

You’re losing all your credibility here. Engineers suck at pvp in general, you say? Maybe you mean you suck in PvP as an engineer. More probably you think engineer suck because you use builds like these which are only useful for paper math.

Nerf? That was a FIX. FYI elixir gun’s super elixir heals for 400 initial pulse and 150+ for the following pulses originally.

They should buff it and return it to at least 300 per pulse.

Fix FT and other kits so ANet won’t get more complaints. Easy.

We don’t deal enough damage and we don’t heal enough. But still not enough to make me quit my engineer. I guess I just have to accept that I’m playing a mediocre class.

I generally use my FT on WvW and I tell you it’s very effective. I may only be doing around 2k~4k damage on lvl 80’s depending on their builds, but I’m hitting and tagging a lot. It sounds ridiculous but most people in WvW don’t really pay attention to the damage they get. They just dodge like hell as soon as something hits them continuously.

I’ll use P/S and switch to my beloved FT. Maybe get 25 stacks of Precision/Power then switch to 2 other sigils. Was thinking of Sigil of air and a lifesteal <3

Lightsbane.9012:

Rhodeo.7318:

Shoulders, Gloves, and Booties are from the Sorrows Embrace set. Coat and Leggings from the Orr Karma vendors.

There are only a handful of non-coat armours, most of them low-tier. Dulfy has a gallery up http://dulfy.net/2012/08/09/gw2-pvp-armor-collection/#34

only get those in spvp so that doesn’t do anything for me

You do realize that these PvP armor skins have their own counterpart in the game, right…?

Firearms trait (5 Points) Sharpshooter…

KirinDave.6451:

People keep saying, “Engineer is fine! Our DPS is great!”

Do not listen to these people. Engineer is not “fine.” It’s not actually “done,” to a degree that seems greater than most other classes. About half the engineer’s utility is completely divorced from gear choices that other players can make. For example, certain minor and major weapon sigils make leveling much easier, but Engineers are only just going to get access to them in the next patch (we hope).

It is absolutely a harder class to world PvE grind (pre-80) with than many others (possibly excepting mesmer, which is quite hard to work with pre-L40). I have done that grind and I am still wondering what the “right” way to do it is. I suspect anyone who tells you otherwise is not objectively assessing the class, and is instead saying “I enjoy the playstyle.” Engineer has the potential to be a very fun and powerful class, but is currently limited pending patches and balance tweaks.

In sharp contrast to this: power dagger+well+vampire necromancers can basically carve a bloody swath across any map. Warriors are unstoppable engines of destruction. Greatsword Guardians are not terribly exciting, but basically trivialize anything but veteran adds. Shortbow rangers with tanky pets are seldom in any real danger.

One thing that you can do well pre-80 as an engineer is in PvE dungeon runs for support. A lot of the story mode dungeons have many enemies susceptible to knockback, and you can design dungeon builds with plentiful blast finishers that the earlier, easier content rewards heavily. This in addition to WvW zerging (even post tweak, grenade engineers make sieges way easier) is where the bulk of my levels came from on my engineers.

Yes, engineer skills and traits are broken at most… but many people like me reached 80 without any problems at all. Seriously, you can’t just blame how broken a class is. If you’re having a hard time rolling an engineer yet other people aren’t, doesn’t it simply mean YOU are the one incapable of utilizing the class?

Mesmer is the least played class? Seriously, go around any LA Overflow and you’d see two mesmers before seeing 1 engineer. Engineer is the least played class followed by Necros (which is steadily rising in numbers). As soon as the class is fixed especially the tool kits and sigils, expect more people to start rolling an engineer. kitten I hate bandwagon people.

smapty.4270:

The strength of the engineer is your ability to knock people of of their cycle or “rotation” with knock backs and interrupts… You are basically a havoc maker bringing chaos to the situation and pushing the other player out of their comfort zone. I run a 20|15|15|20|0 build with rifle, flamethrower and bombs… With elixir R to fill in the last slot. The pushbacks and damage you can dish out will overcome most opponents pretty easily… 1v1 is a gimme… 2v1 takes some smart play to pull it out… Beyond that you are dead but you can hold them till you are overrun or help arrives to bail you out. It’s all about switching kits situationally. I have I have over 3500 power in this build yet still retain enough defensiveness to hold a point and/ or clear it for my teammates to push the other team off. Spvp is so hit or miss with your team that you really can’t count on much.. Unless you get into tourneys and then it’s a whole different game… I still run this spec in tourneys though because of the versatility of it .

In the pve world I run a pretty standard grenade/ elixir or bombs or flamethrower dependent on the situation build for dungeons or fractals (30|15|15|0|10) which I still feel to be very strong for both utility and dps.

The great thing about the engineer is the only limit is your ability to make work whatever build works for you…. If you play it right the sky is the limit but it takes a lot of dedication and practice with any given build to really make it shine (to its fullest potential). The class is strong but I feel it takes more work than a lot of the others to really succeed (this may be biased because I’ve only really played the engineer for any substantial amount of time)

-Sterno Lecturo
80 engineer – Sorrow’s Furnace

1 Versus Many would give an engineer a hard time? Looks like somebody hasn’t seen Mr. TANKCAT’s buid…

I only use grenades in large scale Zerg fights. Just keep your range and spam all the way and you’ll do just fine. It’s a big plus if you have grenadiers in your zerg team. People won’t be able to dodge well in that kind of situation. In skirmishes I use rifle though.

I do pretty well with P/P in Orr. I actually use 2 Rare Traveler’s Orrian Pistol of Traveler. Traits are 0/30/0/20/20. Remember, Crit>Power. I have 20 in alchemy to prolong the duration of Fury and Swiftness.

I go with an unusual Rifle glass cannon build w/ PBR Slick Shoes and Elixir B.

Traits are 0/30/0/20/20

Full Berserker set + Eagle runes. I do well in zerg battles as long as I keep my distance. Either way I have PBR and overcharged shot if ever somebody gets too close but it’s over when you get stacked w/ stun and immobilize

coglin.1496:

Ferum Flamebender.5910:

PotatoOverdose.6583:

Highest dps against an absolutely stationary target? maybe. Not really though, cause…you know…backstab thieves and all.

Exactly. Theoratically it might be the highest dps, but sadly enemies are moving…

You do realize engineers move too right? We can keep endurance up in ridiculous rates and have a ridiculous amount of dodges.

I am curious though, how do they dodge with a net shot on them? or after Glue shot? How do they dodge after throw shield stuns them? Were they countering with immobilize removal?

That covers all 3 weapons there. If your running around using nothing but grenades and staying in hat kit set all of the time, you are doing it wrong. There is a counter to everything in this game. You complain about moving and dodging players as if you sit there yourself and take what they dish out willingly. You are just as capable of dodging as they are. More so with Toss elixir S, invigorating speed, elixir R, adrenalin implant, adrenalin pump.

Infused Precision+ Invigorating Speed+Adrenal Implant are a ridiculous combo that allow you to avoid incredible amounts of damage.

If your trying to stand at max range in an open field in WvW, with grenade kit armed the whole time and not using any skills that support it, you will lose every time. At this point, it doesn’t read as if there is any issue with the grenades, but with the manner in which you are utilizing them.

You do realize Net Shot misses A LOT and only immobilizes for 2 seconds. Shield only stuns for 2 seconds only when your enemy attacks you, and one dodge inside a glue gun can break you free. Your argument is totally invalid since engineers can’t swap equipment in mid-battle and all your examples are from the 3 different weapon sets of engineer (Rifle, P/P, P/S) which means we can only get a max of 2 seconds(4 if you have a net turret) of disable. And how long does a grenade stay in midair before landing?

As for WvW, sadly AoE attacks can only hit up to 5 targets and obviously people dodge – a lot. So in reality, it’s not about “utilizing” engineer skills but the grenade kit itself has its own disadvantages

The Deployable Turrets trait is still bugged when using Healing Turrets. The F1 slot which is supposed to be Regenerating Mist is replaced by Healing Turret which means you have 2 Healing Turret skill occupying 2 Skill Slots. However, when you use either Healing turret(F1 or slot 6), the other one also starts to cooldown.