Guild Wars 2

Hint: get Phantasmal Fury (Fury for Phantasms) or Retaliation for them. Then you don’t have to wait until the attack.

Alot players have “problems”/complains with the current shatter mechanics. On normal mobs it’s not worth to instantly shatter them, but do so at mob’s last ~20% life. I wonder, if this is even different on shatter builds. Using them as AoE blast in mob-groups is kinda risky.
But once you have a “reliable” source of clones and a bit bigger target, shattering does help. But it always depends on traits as mesmers.

“Fortunately, the mobs don’t know which is the real me”

@EasymodeX
I miss the “Condition Build” (Staff) and the “Bleeding Build” (SI + GS + prec). I got the feeling that at least the Condition Build is quite common.
There’s also the unreliable interrupt build … but dunno if anyone actually goes for that.

Pay.8713:

I do have the bleed trait on illusion crit which does happen a lot and +15% duration on that is helpful but don’t care much about it (more than I would on swiftness while I get hit). Point was it does give stats and no-one ever mentioned build specifically, but running Condi damage in WvW isn’t going to be as good as Power for Phantasm damage on siege.

I hope you know that +bleed duration won’t help mesmers unless they are lucky with staff hits or have bleed runes in their weapons. SI bleed is caused by illusions, not you, and illusions don’t copy +condi duration.

^
but don’t forget that critical damage is lowered by autoscaling. This hurts way more than condition damage scaling.

It’s a known issue. Mesmers are a rushed profession – as devs said.

Current fixing rather take care of overpowered features than underpowered ones.
Hope that they’ll rework alot memser features any time.

overlordchin.7583:

Nretep.2564:

well, assuming you have
- 3 iDuelists up (not fitting for environmental targets, pvp, wvw, normal mobs)
- Sharper images
- all 3 iDuelists shoot while the combo field is up
- you have 60% crit + phantasmal fury trait
- they don’t ever fix the 100% combo bug from iDuelists
- the target has <7 bleedings
- the target has <2 confusions

3×8 shots * 80% crit = 19 crits -> +19 bleedings
3×8 shots * 100% combo = 24 combos -> +24 confusions

if they fix the bug, it’s
3×8 shots * 20% combo = 5 combos -> +5 confusions

I suppose 3 iWardens would do a better job once they fix the 100% combo.

So the idea is to have 3 duelists up and then pop chaos storm or other combo field? But I tried with a duelist and popping the combo field and it def aheres to the 20% combo finisher. 8 – shots with 1 – 2 proc’d combos. Only 1-2 stacks of confusion trigger where teh warden seems more effective but seems to die nearly instantly when i pop it leaving me with no chance for multiples. On top of that the timing of getting a combo field in place before the attack seems problematic at best since they attack nearly instantly after summon then have a long cd before attacking again and chaos storm / other fields dont last but a few seconds. Time warp is most effective but very long cd….

Is there any better way of stacking confusion on an enemy? I feel bad b/c it feels like this thread is being side tracked

I also criticized what MeveM said there.
The probability of having 3 iDuelists up and them shooting at the same time is more than just low. And just before they shoot hasting a Feedback dome isn’t easy either.
But as my lastest news are, the combo finisher of iDuelists is bugged at 100% instead of 20%, has this been fixed yet ?

Generally, my most reliable source of [Confusion] is either Scepter #3 or Clone Death Trait or Shatter Trait or F2 Shatter or underwater Trident clones. All of those don’t stack up alot stacks. Most would be Scepter #3 + F2 = 5 + 3 + 3 = 11 Confusion stacks. But I haven’t effectively used combos yet. The iWarden is nice, but not reliable – as you said.

I recommend the later two if you actually plan on using HealingMantra.
Harmonious Mantras just consumes too many points into the first tree. And Protected Mantras is just … too weak (200~300 def while casting).

And for additional synergy, there’re
- Empowering Mantras
+4% damage per charged mantra

- Mantra Mastery
Mantras recharge 20% faster.

If you are lvl40+ and want to deal damage as mesmer (don’t go for a tank build …) get at least 15 points in Dueling and get precision gear. You should learn the rest automatically while leveling.

MeveM.7913:

Point is, each pistol illusion shoots 8 times. That makes it 24 shots from 3 illusions. Each and every single projectile (gun shot, arrow) that goes through a chaos storm or Nullfield causes a combo. In this case it’s 1 confusion per shot fired by the illusions.

So technically if all 24 shots crit, it’s 24 bleeds and 24 confusion every time the pistol illusions shoot. I usually get around 15 bleeds and 24 confusions.

well, assuming you have
- 3 iDuelists up (not fitting for environmental targets, pvp, wvw, normal mobs)
- Sharper images
- all 3 iDuelists shoot while the combo field is up
- you have 60% crit + phantasmal fury trait
- they don’t ever fix the 100% combo bug from iDuelists
- the target has <7 bleedings
- the target has <2 confusions

3×8 shots * 80% crit = 19 crits → +19 bleedings
3×8 shots * 100% combo = 24 combos → +24 confusions

if they fix the bug, it’s
3×8 shots * 20% combo = 5 combos → +5 confusions

I suppose 3 iWardens would do a better job once they fix the 100% combo.

Isn’t it better to first choose your personal preferrence and then ask for the fitting build instead of browsing a catalogue of builds and choose the one you like?

As far as I know there are:
- Bleed
- Condition
- Direct damage
- Phantasm damage
- Support
- Tank
- Shatter

But most don’t force you be a pure build, so you can choose how much of which build.

@Rodastra
For me Nullfield instantly removes all conditions on me but only one boon from enemies at a time.
iDisenchanter removes all boons and all conditions from me each time it attacks. I had the feeling that the condition removal is in its aoe and the boon removal at the target.

@boni
that’s a beta remnant, before [Confusion] got reworked. Trident and Scepter both applies confusion each attack. Confusion got stronger and removed from auto attack.

Barab.9016:

I am sure this was answered else where but do the +condition dmg on equipment and weapons apply to clone condition dmg ?

illusions, yes
plants (sylvari plants abuse sharper images), no

Yay, MOAH healing mantra users !!!

Personally I recently started using the “+4% dmg for each mantra” and run around with healing mantra and in a party with Mantra of pain. Depending on the environment I also add the other Mantras and bam +12% dmg.
But I’m not sure, if I stay with this trait. -20% Mantra CD is awesome, too.

With my twink I always whine, when I have conditions. “Remove condition on heal” is SO comfortable with healing mantra. I feel like I’m spoiled.

@MeveM
You have to differ “Condition Build” and “Bleeding Build”.
As Embolism explained, Condition builds focus in alot different conditions with staff and iWarlock.
Bleeding builds focus in crit chance with GS and/or SW/Focus/Pistol

Because the iWarden is summoned right next to the target and gets hit by every single AoE attack.

Personally, I think they all have the same. I think giving defense- and support-oriented Phantasms more HP makes sense, but the all die on a single strong hit (even iDefender).

I think you might be mixing some different … “features” of the game.

- There is an “autoattack on target change” checkbox in the option menu, but I have no clue what exactly it does.
- If you change a target (tab or LMB) you autoattack (usually #1) does not change to the new target. You’ll keep attacking the previous. Once you command an attack/ skill (pressing [1~0] or RMB) the new target will be attacked. This should include all (?) Illusion-summoning skills)
- Dueling X – Clone on dodge. This trait creates a clone each time you dodge during combat (assuming you have 2- Phantasms). Those Clones are unfortunately not set at your taget, but the closest to them.

I’d wonder if those abilities suffer from connection issues. I’ve seen other server-side features, which would’ve fitted client-side before.

Chaos Storm is a combo field.
If you use certain combo skills in a combo field, it grants you additional effects. Like Chaos armor in etheral fields.

Check the wiki for combo effects for detailed infos.

even in AC there’s alot use for reflect skills. First the spiders, but mainly the profession ghosts.

Temporal Curtain and iWarden aren’t reliable for reflecting purposes, but on some enemies, they just works.
At the same time TCurtain and Feedback are combo fields, which is nice for the party. Casting iWarden in a Feedback dome just looks devasting.

But generally, you’ll have to change your skills and traits according to the room you enter. You have to memorize each mob in each path in each dungeon for being effective. And reflecting isn’t needed in 75% of the rooms. And with the low uptime of the reflect skills, it’s not effective.
You’ll learn this by playing, I suppose.

EasymodeX.4062:

Sidenote: A safety net for difficult jumps is something no other class has.

A safety net prevents you from falling or prevents you from dying from a fall. Portal doesn’t solve it.
It’s more a savepoint every 60s (assuming you don’t die or don’t fall unexpectedly into water).

@OP
it’s a known issue. Either getting Dueling II or Inspiration 5 will give Illusions an instant attack (damage even a bit before you see them). This is the most essential for iWardens and iSwordsmans.

@Vexor
Illusions 5 is mandatory.

“Why should i do more damage to a mob further away than closer ? thats against the rules of Physics anyway.”
Why do you want to use the Rocket Launcher at close range and the knife at long range ?
It’s against the Physics anyways.

I’d also prefer it to deal the middle damage at all ranges, but the devs intentionally made it a sniper weapon.

Mesmers are not meant for damage (even if they can deal a decent amount), but for their utility.
Good Mesmers are super survivable. Not by their armor, but mobility, stun breaker and teleport abilities – especially with the Staff. I know most ppl don’t like Mantras, but Inspiration IV + X with Healing Mantras makes you pretty durable. For even more healing, you can bind MoPain (Insp IV) to another slot. Duelling VII might be too expensive for most players.

But the utility … AoE Stealth, Blink, Portal, Veil, MeatShields, ReflectDome, ChaosField, TimeWarp … I find dungeon parties because I’m a mesmer.

[ Edit ]
and condition removal. iDisenchanter can be strong. And is the most useful spell at the CoE explo buffing golem.

Tweek.3190:

It can kill enemies around the same time as my staff (using focus as secondary), sometimes incredibly fast and sometimes a bit slower. Granting my clones fury makes the bleed stack,

You can give your clones fury by using the staff, not the scepter. The Trait only affects Phantasms (and even that on a buggy way).

Westibone.3985:

Nretep.2564:

At the same time it’s a stun breaker.

It’s actually not a stun breaker. You can use it while stunned, etc., but the effect still lingers after you teleport.

Right, wiki says it’s not even flagged as stunbreaker. But it behaves like Blink or Mirror images (which are flagged so). You can successfully cast it, but are still 1+s unable to move or use non-instant spells.

test it on any doll.
Yes, it does at a max of +12% damage from 4 Mantras. But for Mesmers only worth on environmental targets (walls, sieges and towers), since you sacrifice like everything else.
But I’ve also heard that some ppl grow accustom to Mantra builds.

Personally I only use Healing Mantra and switch one other slot to another mantra for special areas. So I prefer using VI/X/VII over XI.

Everspace.4319:

Tweek.3190:

Staff bounce seems to prefer allies over enemies at the moment. This makes tagging mobs for mesmers even harder.

It’s probably because might and fury on an ally are better than burn/bleed/vuln on an enemy.

Or at least that’s the way I see it.

I think it’s pointless to give your clones might …

It’s a defensive skill, not a clone generator. Like Scepter’s #2. For a defensive skill it’s not meant to teleport towards your target by facing in the opposite direction. Imo the skill is mean to be an emergency escape (or retreat). Perfect for stunned, rooted or other situations where you just can’t walk. At the same time it’s a stun breaker.

I’m not saying, that the regeneration trait for phantasms is great. It’s a minor one anyways. If you want to be supporter you get it anyways (15pt, not 20). It could be buffed a bit – like giving every phantasm the Duelist version, but it’s not bad either. Just assume Retaliation + Fury + Regeneration would actually work as intended.

As for support build, you should depend on other stuff. No class is greatly capable of mass healing (is there ?), but mass support. With the staff you can use chaos field (chaos armor combo) and boon field and the Staff #1 for the same. If you want to mass heal, getting Inspiration X + Mantra of Pain spam will be better. This is probably one of the best ally heal-ability of the whole game. Combine it with iDefender and a ranged Phantasm (even iDisenchanter) and you’re quite the supporter/healer.

^
did you read the whole “technical fats” I stated?
Even if would be able to summon your 30 clones (unprobably; ever tried to summon your clones in an event with 10 participants ?) all 30 clones would die when the first target died – after approx 1~2s. Then you’d be at 10 squishy players again (or 8~9 since the enemy attacks, too).

Using Mass Invisibility with 10+30 allies … I’d laugh.

Since you (TS) don’t have a Mesmer, I think you don’t even know how Illusions/ Clones work.
Basically, what you describe is a Necro/ Ranger tactic – running around with your minions. This can’t be done with Mesmers/ Clones. Clones void to exist (die) if they don’t have a target. So you can only summon your clones in combat, not walk around with them. You’d have to wait to run into enemies to get your 10*3 minions. When you can target the enemy, the enemy can target you as well. Then every mesmer picks the same target (the front one) all 30 clones attack this one. It will die in a second (sharper images, otherwise clones don’t do damage – if you didn’t know) and 50% of the mesmers’ clones couldn’t even be summoned in time, since the target died – yet their CD applied. But regardless of that, all clones will die as well, since they don’t have a target anymore.

tldr;
Try this with necros, not mesmers.

I believe you posted this somewhere else before.
It would be ridiculous overpowers if you walk around with 3 iDuelists. It would be ridiculous to run around with iWarlocks.

The problem is not that you can’t summon those without target (illusions can’t live without target), but that even when it fails, the whole CD is applied.

[ Edit ]
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Clones-Phantasm-issues

The range is decent.
If you use a GS and kite/ dodge, you don’t need Regeneration, since you don’t get damage
Imagine the Regeneration buff would also work on allies (including other phantasms and NPCs) and not just you. This would grant even GS users a support ability.

Ribos”

Sure, you’re going to keep moving, but unless they’re crippled, you’re either not facing them (preventing you from attacking)

if you use [move left] as default buttons and not [turn left] you can perfectly circle mobs without turning your back to them.
And furthermore normal mobs usually fall before they reach me. Dodge back or side, use GS #5 and done. For Higher HP mobs (veteran +), you can keep dodging, since I have perm vigor from traits and crits.

As lvl40 Mesmer the highest DPS build is probable Sharper Images (Duelling 15) build with GS. GS is offense, Staff is defense/ support.
GS with Duelling X and 1~2 illusion utilities can also make for a shatter build, which has to be tested individually (I only shatter on higher HP targets).
To balance the damage sources between bleed and weapon, you could wear Berserkers equips. With 3 Illusions up (GS #2 + #4 + dodge) You should deal 50%+ damage from your weapon and 50-% from Bleeding (except on environmental targets (immune to status effects)).

Staff + additional bounce might be decent, but only works in ~melee range, which makes Mesmer very vulnerable. This is not a needed trait for non-staff mesmers.

But remember, that I only wrote about DPS, not support/ heal or hybrid builds. Nidwin did this.

Be sure that shattering does not trigger “on death” effects. Your tactic might work well if you shatter them and immediatly after that spawn your crippling Phantasms AND other clones. But I don’t really know why you need perma cripple on your targets ?
If you use GS, you’re a running Mesmer, not standing around and hoping the the targets to only attack your illusions. You keep running and dodging (Duelling X).

I’m a bleeding build and I rarly use shatters at all, since the normal mobs fall before I can shatter effectively. Just at bigger mobs I shatter since I can re-summon 3 new illusions within 1.5s. Just since those abilties have semi-high recharges, I don’t bother shattering on normal mobs.

Rouncer.7569:

Why would you want to run 5x Runes of the Thief and 1x Crest of Rabid instead of just running 6 Coral Orbs?

179 precision + 77 condition + 14 toughness vs 120 precision + 84 condition + 84 power

I’m a bleed build and 59 Precision equals almost +3% crit rate. The difference in condition damage is negligible.

So it’d make
59 Precision + 14 Toughness <> 84 Power

I’d get (and got) the precision. 73% Crit chance + Shaper images + GS is kitten on non-environment targets. I can get 8+ bleeding stacks on a single target within 2s.

For damage:
5x Superior Rune of Thief
1x Seal of Rabid

I always used the staff as defensive/ supportive weapon. So the phase retreat has the meaning to … retreat and not to spawn clones or move faster. The point was to teleport out of an AoE, even when downed.
I wonder if something changes for me (when I equip the staff again).

You may call it “the deepest class”, but most call it “the rushed development”, like the developers said themselves.
The problem ist, that the devs seem to be busy to fix game breaking, event and balancing issues first, before they implement integrity into Mesmers.

I doubt it’s working as intended since Duelist has another frequency as others. Afair there even are soe without regeneration.
Additionally Regeneration blocks retaliation and fury. Doesn’t look like “intended”.

But yeah, that’s the current state. Most Phantasms grant AoE regeneration at ~50% of the time with a range of ~200. So it’s only advisable for ranged phantasms on a stationary target or Melee phantasms and melee players. Duelist grants almost 100% regeneration all times. And for all regeneration granting phantasms counts, that the first regeneration tick starts after their CD, not immediatly when they spawn. This makes it barely worth.

zexion.5842:

The activation time isn’t faster the projectile just goes faster. It is still trash weapon.

But scepters attackspeed was depending on the projectile speed, wasn’t it ?
It was a “big” issue, that scepter’s #1 recharge (CD) was depending on the distance to the target. With +33% speed it should boost the scepter quite a bit. Gotta test this later.

It’s called “Chill” I think. Or actually, Chill is stronger

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chill

I’d also prefer Staff/GSword but the Focus is just too important. faster move + unfair pull.

The Staff CAN also give you Swiftness. Chaos Area gives you swiftness in ~33% of the cases.
The other reliable but weak option is blink.

Last but not least, the Trait “move faster for each illusion” …

Well, you can’t have everything.

Theoretically clones use the #1 skill of the equipped weapon, even when you have picked up another weapon, the equipped one counts.

Technically they do not. Every clone attack is hard coded and can be different to the owners weapon. This is visible with staff and trident (and lacking traits). If you boost your #1 attack, you don’t boost your clones #1 attack – like the bouncing trait.
Staff clones use “ground travelling” projectiles. This may be disadvantageous on projectile reflectors (like traited focus wall). Trident clones apply confusion each attack, which makes them quite overpowered.

Clones also deal damage. This damage is scaled to yours. I think it’s like 2% of what you deal. So don’t complain with a lvl5 char about game mechanics.

And here I didn’t even mention Conditions on attack, on death or on shatter.

And remenber that crit damage is (stupidly) scaled by level.

Decent damage, utility, survivability, melee.

Why don’t you choose the class [God] ? or [Chuck Norris] ? Would sure make your build strategy easier.

nah, summon 20 “holograms” withing a GTAoE of ~10m diameter (like TimeWarp).
Holograms look like you (and your party) and run around wildly in their AoE. They don’t attack and can’t receive 0 damage. Triggering this skill resets all target marker on yourself. Lasts 10s.

I never had any problems in either stealing boons (only) or transferring my conditions (only) with Arcane Thievery. Has always worked as intended for me.
The only thing I think I’ve read is, that it’s limited to 4 boons/ conditions per use.