(edited by Nretep.2564)
I just respecced my Mesmer’s traits and noticed that almost nothing in the Illusions trait path seems to be working. I just did the math and I am getting the bonus 300 condition damage, but the shredding rate is not reflected on my shredding abilities. Illusionists Celerity did not affect either my staff illusions or my sword illusions. Phantasmal Haste did not affect either my Warlock or Berserker. I have not tested some of the others or the passive skills, but I noticed this because I could have sworn I had about a 10sec recharge time on my Warlock if not the Berserker and it’s currently just over 14sec and 16sec respectively.
Upon trying to respec again, just in case it would miraculously fix it, I started by putting traits in the Illusions path first and sure enough it started taking time off the illusions – however it seems as though the recharge times will not drop any lower than 14.5 and 16 sec for the Warlock and Berserker respectively, regardless of adding any more traits (like Staff and Sword 20% traits, or 20% Phantasms) that should reduce them. Same for the clone summoning abilities.
Do they not stack now or is this a bug? Even if it’s not additive to where I see a massive decrease I should still see some kind of change by adding more recharge reduction, right?
You have to verify the reduction of skills’ CDs while using them and looking at the timer (hard with sub-seconds), NOT with observation of the description only. The tool-tip is not always updated.
Phantasmal Haste
lowers the Phantasms’ skills’ recharge and not
the Phantasm skills’ recharge.
Meaning, they attack “faster” themself, not “you can use the spawning skill sooner”.
For the direct answers, I refer to Carighans post.
for the build question:
Duelling 25; II & X (once II gets fixed)
Chaos 5
Illusions 20; III/V & VII/X
+ 20 Points for personal interest.
-
Rampagers equip; GS; Mirror Images; Kiting
ImO the most important trait at lvl40 (master unlock) is sharper images/ duelling 15. It’s essencial for GS illusions. It doubles your DPS with decent crit.
Deceptive Evasion (Duelling X) is comfort, but awesome.
Chaos 5 (auto regeneration) is nice, too.
And Illusions 5 is also must for Mesmer.
ImO:
Precision > CondiDmg > Power ~ Toughness
Toughness for “tank”, Power for Glass Cannon.
Rampagers Equip is prefect for the glass cannon bleed build:
Precision > CondiDmg ~ Power
The Exotic setup is unfortunately
Toughness > Precision ~ CondiDmg
The difference seems small, but it’ll make a difference of 4~5% critical chance.
Best rune would be Thief. With Rampager + thief, you could get >70% crit
As general hint:
do not get “increasing bleeding duration”, “+5% crit chance” or similar stats, they don’t work on sharper images.
If mobs were invulnerable at spawn, mesmers would be the worst for preparing. Alot skills need to damage to cause secondary effects (like spawning illusions). So instead of preparing, you’d be wasting your CD because you didn’t see, that it was still invul.
There are multiple effects “on heal”, which would make it awkward if you disabled heal on full health.
I dunno how it’s with shatter effects, but well, both of those things happen to me, too.
Imo
GS = damage/ long range
Staff = Support
Scepter = Clone factory/ Midrange
Sword = damage/ melee
All stats visible in your hero menu directly affect illusions.
Oh my god, a Mesmer who specialized his whole char on a single ability can deal 90% damage with his skill to my squishy char. Must be nerfed.
I’m lvl80 Mesmer with Bleeding/Support build. My iBerserker deals up to 3k damage (3 critted hits). If you got 3.3k HP, it’s not only the iBerserker which needs to be nerfed, but basically all players you face.
In my experience from CoE and SE explo as Mesmer:
Forget the damage build. Usually I’m Bleeding build but on 50+% of the cases illusions hurt more than they are useful. My non-illusion damage is always lower than all other classes.
I prefer switching to support build. Going for staff and focus (pull) to support others. If possible, I AoE heal with Mantra of Pain casting, I cure conditions with nullfield and disenchanter, I grant boons with Staff + additional bounce, AoE field and TimeWarp. On certain mobs daze Mantra and projectile reflect dome do wonders, too. Finally another important role is to survive and probably heal. The staffs evade + blink is really powerful for those things.
Thanks to those support and utility abilities of my mesmers alot of my (random) party players thing those dungeons were un-playable without a mesmer. Yet I barely deal damage.
for leveling at lvl40:
Duelling 15: Sharper Images
+ green precision gear from TH
+ probably Duelling 20:X : Clone on dodge
And you’ll see how fast you can level.
You read this in Wiki ?
before saying “it’s OP”, better test them yourself.
As personal note, I usually solo and usually use the plant farm from Sylvari (or the wolf) rather than any Mesmer ulti.
Well, iDuellist is more reliable in terms of damage and regeneration (most likely bugged). The Daze shot isn’t bad either.
But in instances I found the veil-pull from Focus so good, it barely leaves my off-hand. You can pull mobs from groups, grant swiftness and even interrupt a whole mob. iWarden is … situational.
The do damage. The damage is scaled by your own damage.
The do apply conditions because teh condition say “apply bleeding on illusion crit”.
- Healing Mantra & Mantra of Pain
- Heal allies on Mantra Cast
- Cure condition on heal (for yourself)
- Regeneration from Phantasms
- Staff as first weapon
- iDefender, iDisenchanter and reflectDome on some rare occasions/ areas
- Mantras recharge faster/ difficult to combine with Clone on Dodge
- Rune of Water ?
- Scepter + Focus as second set
I use most of those things with my hybrid supporter, at least in dungeons. Usually I use the GS, but for dungeons I use the staff. With this (and AoE field) you buff melee fighters. As equips I only have supporter staff (healing power), rest is Prec/Pow/Condi and Tough/Pow/Pre.
Most important is, that even while being almost the most fragile char, I survive the longest. You need to learn to kite. The staff helps alot with his evade skill (2). I don’t use it to create clones, but to free myself.
Clones and Phantasms don’t trigger the “On Crit” effects from sigils, Condition Duration sigils, and unsure if they receive the permanent bonus from Accuracy or Force sigils. All the “On Kill” sigils still activate/increment as expected, though.
This is because damage from a Clone/Phantasm do not reference you specifically, and do not show up in the Combat Logs. Thus a Crit from a Clone/Phantasm, is not a Crit from you which the Sigil references. As is Conditions/Boons from a Clone/Phantasm is not a Condition from you, thus no benefit from extended durations for either.
On the other hand, the “On Crit” sigils do work well with Mind Wrack and Cry of Frustration. These two damaging Shatters do reference you for damage, thus triggering the effects.
Basically all sigils (which don’t affect your base stats) don’t work with Illusions.
“On kill” isn’t different. Illusion kills still count as your kill. You get loot and exp, even if only your illusions attack. So you also get your own sigil effect, not illusion’s sigil.
I also have to say that most phantasms (Dmg/time/effects) are nicely balanced. In todays patchnotes you saw even nerfs.
I like the concept of the iDuelist, iWarden and iBerserker. The deal damage the instant they spawn, making them act like damag spells. But unlike other classes’ damage spells, they might attack multiple times. The iBerserker is pretty much my highest burst damage spell.
What I don’t like is the AI and trait boons of them. Trait boons are mutual exclusive. Regeneration is too late and short. iDefender kamikazes targets making him last like 2s with a HP buffer of like one attack. iWarden does follow the target in a really wierd way.
would Mesmers be over powered if illusions persisted until out of combat?
in Mesmer
Posted by: Nretep.2564
Well, “out of combat” is too much, but I suggested something like “die after 2~3s without target” instead of “die after 0s without target”.
And for phantasms, they should start their CD if the target changes.
I also killed alot Veteran flagged mobs myself. I’m still having a hard time with Champion flagged ones.
The main point of good Mesmers is the kiting. You’ll learn it by time. Helpful is the “gain vigor on crits” minor trait, especially with crit builds.
Yesterday I played CoE instance with Guardian, Ranger, Necro and Elementalist. I died the least, often kept the attacking-chain myself (not that they were bad). At the last boss, I didn’t die once. Even if he immobilizes, uses target aoes and fills 60% of the room with aoe circles (which drain 80% of my HP), as long as I have room to kite, I didn’t have problems. Damaging isn’t the main aspect of Mesmers and you can’t fool big bosses with illusions either, but he didn’t manage to kill me.
Scepter is an allround weapon. Mainly for Shattering purposes since it’s the clone factory.
Staff is the support and aoe weapon. I only equip it in instances.
Sword is the melee weapon with high atkspd. Fitting for Sharper Images builds.
GS is the sniper with “high atkspd”. Fitting for long range damage and Sharper Images builds.
You’re using pretty much the wrong weapons to cause high dps.
Mesmer is not meant to be the uber player in solo pve.
In instances we have some “vital” abilities.
If you want to damage, use GS + Sharper images + Precision.
Yet, you’ll still stay vulnerable. Learn to kite/ dodge.
I thought staffs attack has a total range of 1200. If you attack from 1200, there won’t be a bounce, if you attack from 900, there’ll be a 300 ranged bounce.
Maybe it’s a combined version, but I thought I saw the bounce trying to reach me again and just stopping in front of me (no granting boons). But once I stepped closer, it hit me. So I came up with this “total range” idea.
Is warden MEANT to be a stationary phantasm?
Before you say “yes” – if Warden is meant to be stationary, why does it follow an enemy if they move out of line of sight? – It’s behaving as a ranged attacker yet attacks in melee
Doesn’t seem like it’s working as intended
If iWarden moved around I’d be rather annoyed. I don’t want to chase it to be protected by its Reflection.
No, the iWarden does not move while attacking. But during its cool-down.
Within a ~900 range (or like the previous poster said) it follows the target. Sadly, it just follows until a ~900 range and start attacking “from there” again.
Technically this is a bug. The warden is either meant to follow its target at a ~200 range (just between its attacks, like all phantasms). Or it’s meant to be stationary and mustn’t ever must its spot (by its own).
I’ve tried Sigil of earth for the first time yesterday. I haven’t managed to get 2 bleeding stacks with GS hits yet. I don’t know if it has a 2~3s CD, I didn’t test long.
It’s nice if you have a bit condition damage. It almost gives you a permanent single bleed on the opponent. For me, it deals 90 dmg tick and should be one of the most powerful (in terms of damage adding) for me.
The “gain stats-stacks on kill” seem nice, but only are for PvE. In instances, pvp, wvw you’ll be downed so often, that you won’t get more than double stacks.
Sigil of Accuracy (+crit chance) seems nice at first, but I’ve heard that it won’t affect illusions and therefore is crap (for me).
I also considered direct stat (not sigils) component. +25 precision is nice to have, especially if you’re illusion dependant.
I see no problem with HealingMantra. Especially traited with “remove conditions on heal” and “heal allies on mantra cast”, I feel it to be very superior to eathers feast. With the second, even MoP becomes useful for yourself and allies. Here it depends on IF you want to support or be egoistically and only deal damage.
The main issue of Mantras is still unsolved. Their main purpose is still great. Upon a charge you can use the effects unconditionally. With healMantra you can heal while being hit, while dodging, while locked, while casting and even while falling. As said before – combining with different mantras you can use the charges while charging the other mantra.
I think passively charging could be an option. Personally I’d prefer a “reduction in CD” if you keep the charges long enough. Kinda like “the original CD runs immediatly after casting finished”. So you skipp the CD if you preserve the charges long enough.
I’d also like to see an option to recharge a second charge if you’ve only used one.
This is most likely not a bug, but intentional. I observed the same with other projectiles (like ranger ones). The attack range is 900 (for scepter) but the projectile travel a bit further than that. It’s an unreliable increase of projectile range, but not attack range. Be happy about that.
This doesn’t work for the GS, since it doesn’t use projectiles.
And I believe it also doesn’t work with Staff, because it uses “distance limited” projectiles. After 1200 they disappear. If used <1200, they bounce up to an accumulated distance of 1200.
All of the 2 part illusion summoning skills are bugged in this way. It is already well known and documented.
^ this +
if you display the CD time on the skill, it’s always floored. So a 12s CD will never show the 12 itsself. 11.99999s floored will still display the 11s for 1 second.
Well, I usually start at long range with my GS (well, it’s the sniper weapon). I don’t start with 1 or 3, but with 2 and immediatly followed by 4. Since 2 has a projectile time, at ~1200 both skills hit at about the same time and I instantly have two illusions. After that I either way for a new 2 or dodge to create a third illusion.
I barely use 3, since it requires targeting. I use it in longer fights or to remove boons.
So if I’m understanding you correctly Nretep, I need to stick to one weapon until I achieve the full 25 stacks. Then when I switch to another weapon, I can build up another 25 stacks.
It was my experience that even after getting 25 stacks with my staff, when I switched to my GS which had an increaser as well, the buff indicator did not switch out to match with what I had on my GS.
I’m willing to concede that I might be doing it wrong. Do you think you can provide step by step instructions as I’m having trouble understanding what it is you mean.
he’s lying because it does not work this way. just tried this in game
precision on mh, condition on oh = only precision stacks
I didn’t test different stacks. I didn’t think they’re mutal exclusive. Well, that sucks.
But I think you can still use an extra weapon. Like, buy any stat-stack weapon, equip it, stack the kills and unequip it.
#1: iWarden + Phantasmal Haste + Sharper Images
#2: iDuelist + Sharper Images
@Disenchanter
I don’t see why so many ppl dislike it. I always thought that it’s just very situational. Like NullField, you barely use it.
But here, I found the iDisenchanter the most useful spell in CoE at the golem with boon towers. Just spawn 2~3 iDisenchanter and you don’t need to kill the towers.
Kinda important is Duelling 15: Sharper Images.
It’s pretty much so powerful, alot ppl (including me) use this as base of their build. Especially with Pistol or Focus.
Also important is Chaos 5.
Really helping is Duelling 20:X: Clone on dodge.
GS has two illusion skills. Adding a dodge there and you have 3 illusions with bleeding within 1.5s. Especially with Duelling 5: Vigor on crits.
Personally, I have 0/25/5/20/20, focussing on bleeding and a bit healing. Condition removal on heal works well with dual heal from mantra. And with Inspiration 20:X it’s kinda a tripple heal. The regeneration on Phantasms rarely works, but can be helping as well. Finally Illusions 20:X for condition damage and uberWarden.
Did you check the CoE merchant in Lions Arch ?
I think phantasms/clones will give you stacks of “Gain X stat when you kill a foe,” if they kill something because they count as a skill, but the chance on crit and weapon swap sigils wont proc for them because they’re technically not using your weapon.
you get those buffs since it’s still “your kill”.
There’s the exotic “burst dmg build” with mantras.
But probably the most common (and probably the best dps) one is the condition/ bleed build. It focusses on Sharper Images + clones + precision + condition damage.
The main problem with this build is the 25 bleeding stack limit. it’s perfect when playing alone, but with multiple players, you’ll face the wall pretty soon.
- Sword (MH): Fast close combat
- GS: Sniper (multi-hit)
- Staff: Buff/Debuff & AoE
- Scepter: Midrange & clone factory
- Torch: range confusion phantasm
- Focus: melee-multihit phantasm
- Pistol: range-multihit phantasm & dazeshot
- Sword (OH): melee fast phantasm
NretepSo best option for Illusion fighters are still stat-charge sigils. “+10 precision each time you kill a foe”.
If you use a GS, you can put precision on scepter, condi on focus, power on trident and toughness on spear. Charge all counters and then use your GS with +250 stats, unless you map-move or are downed.I tried stacking the stat on kill sigils and it did not work. Basically, the first one to proc was the only one I could continue to prokittenil I died. I had one on my staff and another on my trident. Maybe it was due to the underwater/land differences?
you mustn’t switch the weapons (while stacking).
If you actually use them as I said (4 sigils on 3 weaponsets), you need to stack them for each weapon set. So you’d need to kill 75 foes for the full effect. But then you’d have 4x +250 stats.
After you have all the counters, you can switch the weapon all you like, but you only get counters from the active weapon.
You use the scepter (+focus) and complain about the ranged damage ? Why don’t you complain about sword/sword’s ranged abilities ?
The scepter is not a damager, but a clone factory. Effective in midrange when you have “on clone kill” effects. The other skills are nice but minor.
And Focus is also not a ranged weapon. Use Pistol.
No.
Depends on how you want to play.
I set my eyes on the “get +10 [stat x] when you kill a foe”. Other options are “[condition x] on hit” or “heal on hit”.
So best option for Illusion fighters are still stat-charge sigils. “+10 precision each time you kill a foe”.
If you use a GS, you can put precision on scepter, condi on focus, power on trident and toughness on spear. Charge all counters and then use your GS with +250 stats, unless you map-move or are downed.
Illusionary Whaler – looks like a phantasm but does damage like a clone, does not grant rgeneration (from Phatasmal Healing), does not have Fury (from Phantasmal Fury).
instead of direct damage, is causes 3 stacks of bleeding each attack.
Fury is cancelled from retaliation, retaliation is cancelled from regeneration. Regeneration only applies after 5~6s and if you’re close to it.
Also, someone knows when we grant regeneration to allies if it takes our stats (healing power) into account or the stats from the one getting regeneration from us?
I believe regeneration is like Protection. It can’t stack, only be there or not. So it recovers like 1% of the users HP.
But I haven’t tested it.
Those are possibilities, not necessarities.
If you want to heal with Mantra of Pain, you could do it. But you sacrifice a utility slot and “remove a condition on heal”, since it doesn’t trigger on it.
I think stealing a 30 mins buff (there are still some mobs with it) and give it to your party is as useful.
I also haven’t tested the “heal a small amount when shatting”. But since resetting is so cheap, you could test all traits.
- Phantasms grant regeneration to allies (Inspiration 15)
- Heal allies when casting Mantras (Inspiration 20:X)
- Remove a condition when you heal (Inspiration 10:IV)
- Heal when you shatter (Inspiration 30:XII)
- iDefender (utility)
- iWarden (focus)
- iDisenchanter (utility)
- Less damage while casting Mantra (Duelling 10:VI)
- Mantra recharge 20% faster (Duelling 20:VII)
- Arcane Thievery (utility) + Signet of Inspiration (utility)
- Regeneration when <75% HP (Chaos 5)
- Bouncing attacks have one additional bounce. (Illusions 20:VII)
But personally, I switched from Tank/ Support build to Bleed/ Heal
0/20/10/20/20 build
nuff said, I guess.
Every Mantra Casting uses three words to “describe” their effect. I like them.
I find the Pain ones rather agressive than negative.
Well, someone said, that the illusions’ stats are those of your current stats (including boons). So even if you’d get fury after you summoned them , they’d get +20% crit chance, too.
I haven’t made tests myself, but afair the 30 mins fury I stole once, had a great effect.
The “5% damage when …” is another thing. No clue here.
As for sigils, getting Power & Precision (base stats) is never wrong. They’re transferred to your Illusions for sure.
Focus:
+iWarden:
Even if he’s not necessarily supposed to move, he moves towards his target at a ~900 range and starts his attack then.
For more DPS, Duelist 15 (Sharper Images) + Precision Equip + Pistol.
If you got Phantsmal Haste, use Focus.
Yeah I agree with you guys, GS3 in its current state is pretty poor. It doesn’t do amazing damage and has no other effects, it locks you in place, the area is really small for an AoE, and its ground-targeted.
Mirror blade is like 100% better in all aspects. I would like if they either increased the area for mind stab, added an additional effect (condition) that it does, or made in targetable like mirror blade.
It’s secondary effect is “remove one boon” and I’d say it’s quite effective.
I’d love for them to add a key modifier to the ground target skills that force them to center around the current target. So for instance hitting 3 does the normal behavior, but hitting Ctrl-3 causes the skill to cast at the feet of your target.
I’d prefer a “keep pressed for 1~1.5s for autoresolve on target”. For all ground targeted offensive spells. And “on self” for support ones.
(edited by Nretep.2564)