Guild Wars 2

nekretaal.6485:

If you want the 25% move speed, then you want either locust signet or quickening thirst.

Quickening thirst is the best: it works in and out of shroud. I think it’s the trait that you want after reading your complaint about signet of the locust. Every necromancer build can use a dagger. Dagger Offhand is good, dagger main is the class’ best weapon.

Speed of Shadows is just bad for speed. Think about it: you are in shroud 33% of the time or less, and zero % of the time when you need pure traveling land speed.

You take Speed of Shadows for the Death Shroud recharge reduction.

Here’s my issue with this. I also want in combat movement speed. There are some encounters where in combat movement speed is important…mai trin cannon phase always comes to mind. Mai Trin can also be an encounter where you have to chase her around during combat….pugs who always want to kite/range her…forcing everyone else to chase. That’s just an example, but I’m sure there are other situations where it is important to be able to run at a decent speed while in combat. Yes, you can just drop shroud and take advantage of Signet of the Locust/Locust Swarm…which is the current option we already have. The whole point of the 25% movement speed on this trait, I assume, would be to allow us to keep attacking (with shroud) during movement fights. It does give us this, technically, its just a pain with needing to double up on traits/utilities to do this with it.

Yes, again, I know there is quickening thirst in the blood trait line…but that is really beside the point. Its a defeatist mentality to ignore the thing that’s bad (restricted speed of shadows, restricted signet of the locust) and take something that you don’t really want (the entire blood magic trait line)…just because you either don’t think the bad thing will ever get fixed or because you don’t want to speak up about the problem. A friend said something to me once, that I will never forget. It was a very simple and colloquial truth…“a closed mouth doesn’t get fed”. You have to speak up and ask for what you want, or you may never get it. The way I see it, there really isn’t a good reason they can’t fix this, so no point in not at least throwing it out there…even repeatedly until they get sick of seeing it.

I’ll add this as well. There’s no way I would take Speed of Shadows just for a 3 second cool down reduction when Unyielding Blast is in that same tier. I’d go with the option that increases my outgoing damage over 3 seconds off of an already low 10 second cool down.

If they could provide a single reasonable argument as to why this restriction on only working in shroud would unbalance the necromancer/reaper…then I would stop asking, but I can’t think of one at all. Its not like there isn’t a similar effect already available that does not have this restriction for the necromancer.

ronpierce.2760:

Frankly? I say Baseline the Vital Persistance degen, make utilities work in DS (so Signet speed just works in shroud), Add the Speed of Shadows cooldown Reduction to VP and make Vital Persistence (or Keep Speed of Shadows name) a Master Trait that reduces Shroud and Shroud Cooldowns by 20% and add a new adept.

That way, we can finally opt out of Soul Reaping in PvP. That’d be neat. (Numbers may need adjustment due to balance.)

I honestly don’t know why they need life force degeneration to begin with…at least not while in combat. Its not like enemies don’t dps us out of shroud anyway. That’s enough of a counter to shroud in my opinion…that incoming damage takes our resource for staying in shroud away. I’m 100% for utilities in shroud…I really want to play a complete class instead of half of one anytime I use my class mechanic.

TheLastNobody.8319:

You also factored in the 30 percent edited cooldown on DS right? That’s extremely useful for deathshroud flash skills like weakening shroud and FiTG. And the 25% movement speed is great for catching up to and keeping enemies in your 1200 range because odds are, they’re probably crippled or chilled from fighting you, letting you squeeze off a couple more life lasts to finish em off.

You can also take quickening thirst in the BM tree for the movement speed boost. Though your complaint I do think is valid for Speed of Shadows.

Yes, the 30% shroud CD reduction is decent. My only complaint is with having to take both a utility and the trait to have the 25% movement speed constantly ( if I use my class mechanic or not)….unlike any other profession…just because of their determination to keep all of these restrictions on shroud. It took them years to back off of the mesmer run speed flavor restriction…I’m just hoping they don’t do the same thing here. Its a little different in this case, as we do have swiftness options…its just the issue with these unnecessary restrictions making us waste precious trait/utility slots for no other reasons than the restrictions. Its not even like 25% movement speed is game breaking…all they would need to do is drop either restriction…its not even like having signet passives work in shroud would be game breaking either. I would much rather have signet passives work in shroud honestly…the 30% shroud cd reduction is only like 3 seconds. I am aware of the dagger trait in the BM tree, but I really have no interest in a weak siphon trait line…especially when there is a trait in a line that I am interested in….that could perfectly provide what I am looking for…if they just stop with the unnecessary restrictions.

Also, most really going for Speed of Shadows, are probably doing so for a shroud based build instead of a shroud flashing build. They are probably looking to stay in shroud as much as possible, and would not get the maximum benefit from FitG.

The current implementation of this trait in Soul Reaping apparently only applies the 25% movement speed while in shroud. This trait is in direct competition with Soul Marks and Unyielding Blast. I don’t even need to say how desirable these latter two traits are, for many builds. My issue with Speed of Shadows is the restriction to being only while in shroud. If we make a major trait investment in movement speed, at the cost of other worthwhile traits, I don’t feel it should be restricted to only being active while our class mechanic is active. I feel this makes it redundant with our movement speed utilities and warhorn skill. If I want to maintain 25% movement speed at all times, then I need to waste a utility slot on Signet of the Locust and also a major trait on Speed of Shadows. Both of these are currently suffering from the long list of necromancer restrictions (Signet passives not working in shroud, Speed of Shadows restricted to only working in shroud). Honestly, I would be fine with choosing either Signet of the Locust or Speed of Shadows, as I despise slow run speed…but not having to choose both just to compensate for what I think are just unnecessary restrictions.

Truefrost.6815:

azizul.8469:

well, Reaper actually kick kitten in dungeon. but, till then , yeah……

Err, what? No it didn’t. This previous beta it was BARELY performing above normal DS build, lol. Dagger build was still better, hell… It was only useful for RS so you could AoE but even that wasn’t so great.

Agreed, they need at least one % damage modifier on RS to make Shroud attacks better than not using Shroud.

Derigar.7810:

Where are the new Profession icons you promised us when changing to an Elite Specialisation? This was honestly a big thing I was looking forward too… It also makes sense in a PvP perspective to know what elite spec your opponent has.

They backed off of that whole concept pretty quickly over casual forum crying, due to people not wanting to give up any utilities/skills from the base class. I was also looking forward to them being nearly separate professions. The current implementation is pretty good though…close enough to what they originally advertised. Its not currently enough to warrant a new profession icon though…especially since you can just swap a trait line and be right back to where you started.

spoj.9672:

Misguided.5139:

Apolo.5942:

In their mind, GS has to be worst than dagger in a 1v1 situation, they only uped it, because it was even worst than they actually intended.

If GS were stronger than dagger against a single target and was also better against multiple targets, why would anyone use dagger?

You are looking at it the wrong way. Dagger auto attack should be better than greatsword. But greatsword should provide better burst and other tools. Then you can have a dagger + greatsword rotation.

Yes^

Like the guardian sword + greatsword rotation. Neither weapon invalidates the other. In fact, they synergize with each other and make a rewarding rotation to swap between the two to achieve an optimal balance.

Beastmaster/Chimera incomming! I can see this having strong potential, but its probably going to be condi based with a torch as its new weapon.

Zenith.7301:

What about turning Shivers of dread so we do 10% additional damage to targets under chill as well?

Yes^

This would be perfect. An added bonus for maintaining chill on targets! Would also be huge towards making RS the bonus it should be…instead of a possible dps loss. Would fix this extremely lack luster trait as well.

nekretaal.6485:

Not really in favor of this idea.

We’ve got too many enter/exit shroud procs and they are mostly underpowered because of best case balancing (they are balanced on cool down of death shroud but death shroud is gated by cool down and by life force).

Also, anet is being cautious with chill. Chill isn’t really strong (make a permanent chill ranger and see for yourself), but one people still think its strong. I’d rather have chill on skills that are generally useful even without the chill, so tweaking chill in/out of the meta doesn’t kill the class.

Extra chill on GS1 is a good start. Is it enough chill? We’ll see. The greatsword is very glass cannon right now, with it’s only non damage skills very weak.

Significant cast time and Cooldown reductions on focus 5 would help a lot too. If they have to remove the bonus damage to give us that, that’s fine with me.

Finally, the Reaper’s chill on fear minor trait is really weak, given limited access to fear. Would it be better to just baseline put fear on RS3 and rework the minor entirely?

With the apparent chill up time for the revenant, it doesn’t look like they are being too cautious with anyone except necros/reapers. I also think RS3 is perfect the way that it is. I was wary of even having fear on a RS skill as the one thing I didn’t want was for our skills to force mobs out of melee range…I was pleased to see that you have to activate the fear manually on a second stage of this skill. Shivers of Dread does well in minimizing the distance the mobs run from this 1 second fear, however It would be so much better if they were feared in place…instead of running at all…maybe even frozen and feared at the same time. I do think Shivers of Dread could use some additional benefit due to our general lack of fear options and the fact that we only get two minors due to this being an elite specialization line. Maybe they could also add chill to Soul Spiral…in addition to the poison…possibly add this in to the Shivers of Dread trait. I see the poison on Soul Spiral as synergy for Putrid Defense…it should have equal synergy with Cold Shoulder.

ZDragon.3046:

ODB.6891:

I’m also of the opinion, after reading the arguments in this thread, that having both shrouds is a bad idea. I’m not saying this with the over dramatization that some are saying…“insinuations that people are wanting reaper trait line to be mandatory”. I don’t think anyone asked for or wants that…the whole reason why people want both shrouds is because the profession needs to be versatile enough to adapt to the encounter you are currently in. It doesn’t make sense to be limited to being able to do nothing….just because there is not an option to attack in melee range. In a pve encounter, sometimes you do have to change tactics mid fight several times. I do see why people are resisting this idea to have both shrouds, looks to be all about not wanting to be pressured to choose the reaper specialization to be equally effective. This is a valid concern and would definitely be undermined by making it possible to have both shroud versions in the same build. I think the real solution is to provide a decent power ranged weapon. That way reaper builds could just drop out of shroud and attack with weapon skills when ranged combat is required.

Let me go ahead (as a person who pretty much plays nothing but necro) address this one. The problem with dropping out of rs for ranged combat is ranged weapon options. We have a staff with a very slow projectile auto and mid to subpar damage, which by the way is also easily side step dodge-able. If the foe is moving you wont hit anything. Marks only do so much and even if you drop all 5 it wont be enough. now for the Axe if you count this thing as an effective ranged weapon you are just being down right silly. Axe has like 600 range and pretty low damage the auto is crazy slow. Effectively DS is the only good ranged option a necro really has. Life blast is a great tool and while it is slow it hits hard.

You drop RS and a ranged foe will still shread you to bits. Ranges and engi’s killed me every day all day of the beta weekend because they had super great ranged game and i had 0 ranged pressure I could apply. You cannot catch some one who speends 70% of there time more than 600 range away from you with RS its a lost fight every time.

I honestly think DS and RS are both needed as a f1 and f2 even if it means leaving one puts both on cooldown. So you cant instantly jump from one to the other ( that would be op)

The last few sentences of my post specifically talk about needing a decent power ranged weapon. This is something that is commonly known that we do not have…we need one. I also strongly feel they need to back off of the tons of restrictions they apply to necros and give us the tools we need to function properly in this game…meaning reflects/blocks/vigor. I’ve been saying we need spectral wall to be a reflect for a long time…they have just been ignoring us in favor of their flavor restrictions. We also need death’s charge to be a faster and further reaching gap closer. They should also drop the, completely unfair, restriction of no utilities in shroud so we can deal with ranged kiting while in RS…that combined with a spectral wall that actually blocks/reflects projectiles would be what’s needed to deal with pvp kiting scenarios. Ultimately, I wasn’t really commenting for a pvp perspective, but I think the fixes I just went through would deal with that problem. I don’t really think having both shrouds would be fair to those players who don’t want to take the reaper line. I think fixing our base/weapon/utility problems would be the better fix. I personally am not going to play any build other than reaper. I do see the validity of the situations you are describing in pvp…I even see them in pve. They just need to implement the right solution and do it in a timely manner.

Palador.2170:

A small word to those that want exclusive looks as rewards for harder content:

I will not respect you for having these “rare” skins. I will not bow down to you, treat you any better than any other player, or even assume you have actual skill at the game. I do not care if you have the PvP wings, raid-only boots, and the kitten less chaps of WvW domination.

However, if I see you wearing all of the above, I’ll know you’re a clown that can’t dress themselves. That you’re someone shallow enough to think that such things should be important to how people view you. And that you’re someone I’d prefer to avoid, if not outright disrespect.

My respect goes to those that prove themselves to be good people. That know how to make a good looking character. That I’d actually want to be around. THESE are the people that make a good community, rewards don’t do that.

I don’t want overly locked or “high skill only” skins, because that can cut them off from a lot of good players. I want those good players to be happy and stick around. But when such exclusive skins do happen, I don’t cry too much about it. It’s just another indicator on my “worthless player” check-off list.

Lol since you don’t actually know these people, to judge them poorly based on things they have actually accomplished…only makes you look like you would be the one not worthy of respect.

I’m also of the opinion, after reading the arguments in this thread, that having both shrouds is a bad idea. I’m not saying this with the over dramatization that some are saying…“insinuations that people are wanting reaper trait line to be mandatory”. I don’t think anyone asked for or wants that…the whole reason why people want both shrouds is because the profession needs to be versatile enough to adapt to the encounter you are currently in. It doesn’t make sense to be limited to being able to do nothing….just because there is not an option to attack in melee range. In a pve encounter, sometimes you do have to change tactics mid fight several times. I do see why people are resisting this idea to have both shrouds, looks to be all about not wanting to be pressured to choose the reaper specialization to be equally effective. This is a valid concern and would definitely be undermined by making it possible to have both shroud versions in the same build. I think the real solution is to provide a decent power ranged weapon. That way reaper builds could just drop out of shroud and attack with weapon skills when ranged combat is required.

I think our minors are just a bit under tuned. They lack enough benefit considering elite specs only get 2/3 minors…as the first minor is just the elite spec itself. I think that Shivers of Dread is a bit lack luster considering the duration of our chill effects and the lack of quantity regarding fear options we have. It just needs a second bonus added to the trait to make it up to par. Cold Shoulder would be decent, if it made a decent impact on our chill duration and reduced incoming damage enough to make reaper shroud sustainable in melee combat. The current and suggested numbers both only offer a negligible increase in chill duration…20% of 2.25 seconds isn’t even 1 additional second. The trait would have to offer 80-100% duration increase to even be effective. That is pretty much our only sustain trait to maintain RS in the reaper line….otherwise, we just get bursted out of RS in seconds.

Vydahr.4285:

ODB.6891:

Vydahr.4285:

Though, on the side of new skills, they could be balanced around DS/RS as being a different state. As in, limited time, and perhaps requiring a set percentage of LF to be used. That way it’s still balanced in terms of risk/reward. Because using pre-existing skills, there wouldn’t be much risk in using them, only reward. And I think that risk is necessary if we are to get utilities/heal/elite in shroud.

No profession has a “risk” in using their utility skills…other than them being on cool down after use…at least no profession currently in game. Why should necromancers/reapers be any different. Surely you aren’t trying to say that DS/RS is so powerful that we should be penalized for it? If people/developers really believe that…then take away the extra hp and let DS/RS function like an engineer’s kit. I’d gladly trade away some extra health that evaporates in seconds of being focused…in favor of actually getting to play a fully functional profession…versus half a profession at a time.

Revenant, a different profession that can have an entirely different utility bar, has risk in using those skills because of energy cost. If we get utilities in shroud, it should use a percentage of LF for each skill. I think it’d be fair

Revenant, not currently in game, so its mechanics are subject to change at this point. The cool downs are non existent on its utilities as well…which eliminates the only real “risk” associated with using them..provided they can maintain their energy mechanic. This is a mechanic that is still in debate until the class gets in the hands of all ANET’s customers and really gets tested. The revenant’s energy resource is not something that degenerates from using their class mechanic constantly. It is something that they can even get a significant amount of just by switching legends. It is a mechanic that they don’t have to switch away from their current skills to use and something that enemies can’t deplete by attacking them. In short, this is a completely different mechanic than what necromancers/reapers have and is in no way related to the topic…which is why I originally said “currently in game” in my previous reply.

This idea that necromancers/reapers should have to pay a penalty for access to the same thing that every other profession has no penalty to access is beyond me. Its like when someone gets abused to the point where they ask for more abuse voluntarily. The whole mentality ANET has with necromancers/reapers…that everything associated with the profession has to have a 10 page list of restrictions…is a huge part of what has been keeping this class at the bottom of the pve desirability list for so long.

Vydahr.4285:

Though, on the side of new skills, they could be balanced around DS/RS as being a different state. As in, limited time, and perhaps requiring a set percentage of LF to be used. That way it’s still balanced in terms of risk/reward. Because using pre-existing skills, there wouldn’t be much risk in using them, only reward. And I think that risk is necessary if we are to get utilities/heal/elite in shroud.

No profession has a “risk” in using their utility skills…other than them being on cool down after use…at least no profession currently in game. Why should necromancers/reapers be any different. Surely you aren’t trying to say that DS/RS is so powerful that we should be penalized for it? If people/developers really believe that…then take away the extra hp and let DS/RS function like an engineer’s kit. I’d gladly trade away some extra health that evaporates in seconds of being focused…in favor of actually getting to play a fully functional profession…versus half a profession at a time.

Vydahr.4285:

I could get behind this. Necro having another stun-break would be nice, especially where Reaper is a melee brawler-type spec. And having it inherently in shroud beyond just FitG would be great (because, let’s be honest, a DS/RS build doesn’t want to flash shroud. Those builds want to stay in shroud as long as possible, making FitG not nearly as useful)

This ^

The current stun breaker options don’t work for RS/DS builds. FitG only works if you are not already in shroud. We still don’t have access to our utility bar in shroud, so if they are going to continue to refuse to allow us to play a complete profession, they need to give us a low cd stun break on a DS/RS ability.

The logical alternative, however, is to stop gimping us for flavor reasons and just allow us to use our utilities in shroud.

Zenith.7301:

Please, take a look at the minors and adept trait tier for PvE. We just don’t have good options.

I also think reaper shroud requires tuning up, it’d be silly for it to be a DPS loss over using greatsword or dagger considering this is a resource you build up.

You SHOULD want to go into reaper/death shroud whenever you can to beef up your offense/defense.

This^

I think Shivers of Dread does warrant a change. Considering how little access reapers actually have to fear and the fact that we only really get two minors on an elite specialization, there should be some additional benefit to Shivers of Dread.

I think the adept tier would actually be good if chilling nova was allowed to be good. Our damage mitigation is based on enemies being chilled. This also goes back to the issue with minors in the reaper line since cold shoulder…even at 20% chill duration increase…is not even a 1 second increase on our chill duration skills. It all comes down to whether they want us to perma chill or not…it really seems like they don’t, which is perfectly understandable. That being the case, our damage mitigation needs to be moved to something they don’t mind us doing. If we have to be immobile/slow with no active defenses or even vigor…then our mitigation needs to be significant and moved to something we can keep up constantly. As far as pve goes, we have tools that are not going to do anything for us against bosses (fear and blind). We’re going to need something to allow us to eat all that spike damage if we aren’t going to be allowed to avoid it. Blood magic is good for a trickle of incoming heals, but that isn’t going to do anything for spike damage. The majority of testers seem to have a consensus that RS is squishy for a melee build, so something seems lacking. I didn’t really see that point addressed in the coming changes.

I 100% agree with Shroud needing to be a bonus that you want to use every time it is available. It definitely should not be a dps loss to use our class mechanic, which like you said, is a resource we have to build up and maintain to use. If we build for shroud via soul reaping and reaper…it should out perform our actual weapon skills. It should also be able to maintain the chill on enemies…or whatever they decide to do to allow us to actually survive in melee.

Please also reconsider keeping us stuck playing with half a profession when using our class mechanic. Utilities in shroud please.

Tristan.5678:

Chill is useless crap…. I beg arena remove this OP CHILL from auto ( how arena thinks ) and give to auto something more useful ……. just hands down for reaper …

My problem with chill is that they built the reaper around chill as a basis for our damage mitigation and group support, but then decided they really don’t want us to have chill before we even got to try it. They didn’t replace it with anything else to fulfill that function (damage mitigation via cold shoulder and enemy attack cool downs). I’m fine with them changing their mind about chill and its function for the reaper, but they need to replace it with something they don’t mind us having in its place….something that fills that same mitigation role…preferably party wide like chill did.

They really are making reapers/necros the red-headed step children of this game…especially with the way they are showering revenants/heralds with all the support and utility that they absolutely refuse to give reapers/necros.

Really, the only OP points I empathize with are iLeap and oh sword #4.

I don’t really think iLeap should give distortion…as we have enough distortion and I don’t think we need to buff inspiring distortion any further. I would rather see iLeap reversed…have the mesmer leap in first and the clone spawn where we started…then have the swap take us back out of melee. This is more in line with what sword mh is all about. Dancing in and out of melee to get our blurred frenzy and an AA chain in. This would possibly give our clone a little more chance at not getting insta-gibbed as well as the mesmer would be the focus of the attacks until the swap.

I think oh sword #4 could use a 1s evade frame, not distortion…for both the mesmer and the clone…that would be more fitting than a sustained block.

Truefrost.6815:

For pve slow cast speeds are fine.

So wrong that I can’t believe you actually believe that. Slow cast times are less bad in pve than pvp, but still terrible. No matter what ANET does, pve is always going to be about blowing stuff up as fast as possible. They are always going to try to compensate for that with mobs/bosses that one shot players. Standing still trying to execute slow motion attacks are just asking to get one shot mid cast. Taking forever to execute attacks while the rest of your group is blowing stuff up at light speed is terrible. ANET needs to stop gimping function with flavor excuses. If they want to go with a theme, try going with themes their own game is based on….active defenses, mobility, and group utility.

This article pretty much summed everything up perfectly. They didn’t even dig into the problems with the elite specialization specifically though… extremely miniscule chill duration despite our only survival traits in reaper being dependent on chill, even more fragile reaper shroud, still lack of utilities in shroud, slow and un-landable attacks with GS, still kitten mobility, shouts having cast times, signet passives not working in shroud, RS #2 not stopping at our target, terrible life force generation both in and outside of shroud, and still the persistent lack of active defenses. Something’s got to give here.

I think they just need to abandon the “second health bar” concept entirely. Its the entire reason they are so dead set against giving us equivalent active defenses and utility in shroud…they can’t wrap their minds around the fact that being a meat shield (second health bar) is nowhere near as effective as being able to actually not take damage entirely (block/invuln/evade). Necromancers already have high base hp, we just need the proper tools aligned with the overall game design…to be effective and synergistic. This game is not designed around face tanking…its designed around dodging, blocking, reflecting, mobility, etc…a lot of this comes from utilities on professions. Its designed around team support (boons and combo fields). We need access to all of that…just like every other profession in the game. We don’t need flavor restrictions that block this effectiveness….trying to fit a theme (looking at you monster movie/low mobility/reaper). This whole attrition, second health bar, low mobility, flavor concept they have been stuck on is like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole…we teach our kids that that doesn’t work in pre-school. Yes, it will take a bit of work to correct this inequity, but the game will be much better for it. Give us our utilities at all times. Stop handicapping us. Please fix!

TexZero.7910:

I dislike the daily changes. I personally enjoy running 50,40,30,20 daily. It gives me something to look forward to doing and limiting that is silly.

I also dislike opening up the barrier to entry on fractals by making it a 1 and done deal. That to me will only encourage the wrong kinds of players to enter in to what anet has called end game dungeons.

There’s casual dungeons out there like AC / SE / COF etc… Fractals does not need to become that experience.

Hopefully they reconsider it.

This ^

Its getting really disgusting how they are noobing everything down in the game. There is nothing interesting about making fractal mobs into hp/toughness stat sticks and increasing the one shot probabilities of every random mob’s auto attack.

They are being dishonest with us about their intentions…or either they don’t understand their own changes. They aren’t increasing the viability of any profession/build by doing these things. Condi builds were already viable…they just were not preferred as they take take longer to kill mobs due to having to wait for condi ticks. So now you make everything take longer with adding more toughness…so because one build style is slow…make everyone slow…that leaves a bad after taste in my opinion. You just decreased the enjoyment of one group to give a placebo to another. Where’s the compensation for berserker builds in this change? Condi builds get more survivability by default because they only rely on one damage stat…so these changes just swap the meta…accomplishing nothing worthwhile…you still have a group that is not preferred. Way to waste development resources. Not only that, but you are putting berserker in a worse position than condi was previously…now berserker is going to face a double penalty….slower killing speed (the entire point of berserker) with significantly increased chance of getting one shot…by any random fractal mob (precision scaling). Add to that the bright idea to make reflects just flat out not work on some instabilities?!? That is just another blatant nerf to berserker builds, as gear with defensive stats can pretty much just face tank some of the projectile madness.

These stat scaling changes don’t increase viability of any gear…they just make defensive stats and condi required…at the expense of all players who bought into your game design for fractals and invested in berserker gear. Prior to this, all gear was “viable”. All players could clear the content, without having to change out their gear. Depending on the level of fractal mob stat scaling…this is a really bad and poorly thought out change…likely just ripped straight from exaggerated and uneducated forum crying.

Fractals were touted as the high end content in this game…meaning the exact opposite of casual. It was advertised as being the content for skilled play. How exactly does changing it to requiring face tank / heal spam / condi endurance marathons make this high end skilled play?

I definitely understand the appeal from a developer stand point of getting the maximum amount of players into the content…to justify development resources…but you are completely missing the point of why you added this content to begin with. I definitely don’t agree with these changes. Depending on how bad this is, I may not even be able to find a justification to log in anymore. I can only stomach so much open world 1 spam zerging. I’m not really interested in any pvp modes in a game that doesn’t actually balance professions. Pretty much the only content that remotely interests me is high end, skilled, coordinated group play. Now you are possibly reducing that to face tank, heal spam, condi endurance ordeals.

On top of that, now you are also going to take the randomization out of fractals?!? That’s one of the few things that made fractals not boring…not knowing which fractals you would get. Granted, I despise the underwater combat in this game, so I always rolled swamp for the first fractal…but even that had randomization on which swamp boss you would get. That is more of an issue with hating that one fractal…than not liking randomization.

Its sad that you guys managed to pull the worst possible things from forum feedback to implement…and are likely dead set to implement this kitten no matter what we say at this point.

Purple Miku.7032:

It is the venue to voice concerns, but what I mean is that you’re kind of already complaining about having to switch to condi builds and that berserker gear is going to be rendered useless when you don’t know whether or not this is true.

You know that they will increase the scaling on multiple attributes rather than just health and outgoing damage, but you also know that they are releasing FotM-specific consumables from the vendor in the mistlock observatory. Could it be that these consumables will give us an insane amount of crit chance in certain fractals? We don’t know, but it could be.

There could be a lot of things. After all, they specifically stated at the end that the blogpost was only part of what they had in store for us and they didn’t tell us what exactly they were going to do.

Expressing concerns about maybe having to switch gear sets is one thing, but your post seems like you have no doubt that it will happen which is why I’m trying to tell you in as kind of a way that I can muster whilst still being realistic that you’re being a little quick to jump the gun. :|

When I comment or post on something, it will be more based off of specifics revealed and their previous actions. It will not be based off of the possibility of them doing something different than their trends have shown. I will be pleasantly surprised if they do go against a negative trend I post about though. That being said, I don’t take the consumable into account because they have not been specific about what it will do. I’m of the opinion that consumables should be optional. Based specifically on what they have revealed and previous patterns…I think my concerns are reasonable. I don’t need “kindness” in responses btw….just say what you have to say that’s relevant and leave the targeted catch words out.

Purple Miku.7032:

You are complaining about something you know nothing about other than vague descriptions. It is possible to make other gear sets slightly more appealing to use to the average player without completely trashing berserker gear.

Worry you should not, at least not without specific details.

The “vague” description is pretty specific on what direction they are going. Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t this the venue to voice these concerns..I’m sorry…“complaints”?…or should I call them “worries”. We know exactly what toughness does for condi versus power…nothing vague about that. We know exactly the stat combinations on gear…how the increased precision scaling on mobs will affect some condi setups versus berserker/assassin setups. We know exactly what the preferred sets are in other game modes. I think the information is not as vague as you intimate. The only vagueness is on the level of the scaling they implement…and we know they are going to implement it if they have gone as far as this announcement. A reasonable assumption is that the scaling will be substantial from fotm 50 to 100. Now is the time to express concerns…as soon as they announce it.

So there was exactly one area in the game, where berserker gear was preferred…that received any type of recurring updates. Every other game mode preferred gear with more survival stats. Its looking like condi will be the new PvE meta now if the fractal update is any trend on what to expect in PvE and the still vague “challenging group content”. Where exactly does berserker gear fit into the game now? It seems like ANET just wasted a lot of resources to shift the same problem around in game…and possibly create a new issue. Previously, condi was trash in PvE due to ramp up time on damage and the efficiency of direct damage. Now condi will be king due to its reliance on one damage stat…leaving room for two defensive stats and toughness/hp scaling …that condi does best against. Good job?…now you have a different disenfranchised gear set…only this time…there is no other game mode that prefers this disenfranchised gear set.

I think it is possible this will make more people play fractals….at least in the short term. I think the long term effect will be that casuals will be even less likely to play fractals post fotm 50. I’m of the opinion that casuals really don’t want a challenge…that’s pretty much why they generally wear the most “safe” gear choices possible (nomad, clerics, soldiers, etc) and want to range attack everything. The addition of scaling hp, toughness, and precision to fractal mobs post level 50, is not going to work out like they think. ANET doesn’t really learn from the past…they apparently don’t remember the nerf cries from casuals about fractal difficulties that caused them to nerf several fractals. Do they really think making them harder is going to somehow not end up with the same nerf cries? Nerfs cries in this game…as far as pve goes…don’t generally come from hard core players…they come from casuals. When nomads start getting one-shot and two-shot by random crits from 50+ fractal mobs….

Don’t get me wrong, I like harder…just depends on how they implement harder. Different mechanics are generally good…what’s not good is this current and pretty obvious focus on trying to make zerk not be viable for end game fractals. This hp, toughness, and precision scaling is going to bite them in a bad place. Casuals thought it was taking them a long time to clear fractals before…lets see how well they do 50+ now in their nomad gear versus this toughness and hp scaling. The same nomads that were getting downed pre-precision scaling mobs will still get downed now with the increased crit rate of these mobs. I can see these changes being good for condi builds…actually gives them some usefullness in fractals, but I’m not going to redo all of my ascended gear just for a poorly thought out forum balancing issue….just to try and make casuals feel better about fractals….especially when I think this will be a failure anyway. What was really the point of this anyway….a forced switch to condi gear as the new meta? There is no change in this game design that will not have a meta of some specific gear set. Something is always going to be best.

Then there’s the issue of reflects. So what was the point of this change? If you don’t want players to reflect projectiles…why are these skills in the game? Replace them with something you don’t mind us using instead of making current skills useless or inconsistent. That’s just bad game design to make skills not work correctly consistently. You talk about wanting the newbies to learn the game easier…making skills sometimes not work properly does not accomplish that. I know where this idea came from though…I’ve seen it on the forums where players were crying about being kicked for not using reflects appropriately. I’ve seen it where they were crying about reflects trivializing encounters. I’ve seen it where they were crying about reflects scaling off of offensive stats but not defensive ones. I guess we can chalk this up to ye olde forum balancing as well.

nekretaal.6485:

We are very concerned about reaper because

1. Melee builds need survival tools that the reaper doesnt have

2. Melee builds need chase down tools that the reaper doesn’t have

3. reaper, at least greatsword reaper, may have really poor life force generation. Even if the grandmaster trait makes up for some of this, reaper should get something better from its grandmaster trait than life force to make up for the terrible greatsword life force.

4. Reaper GS chill access depends on a 4 second chain attack all hitting, but the attacks are slow and well telegraphed.

4a. Chill is supposed to be the main control tool of the reaper, but chill got nerfed hard that the condition will not fill this function very well.

5. If reaper damage is not best in the game top notch, then the whole class theme falls apart. Reapers, instead of being feared will be trying to run away from eviscerate warriors for example.

6. Axe and Focus are needed more badly than ever. With Reaper shroud and greatsword both melee, there is a real need for a legitimate power weapon tools (staff doesn’t count). Unfortunately, those two got Dhuumfired in beta and still suck today.

7. What OP said, shout and utilities don’t matter if we are going to be stuck taking (weak) stun breaks for utility.

8. The traits look very weak & boring, here’s what every Pvp & WvW reaper will take: (1) immobilize duration reduction (2) more life force to make up for greatsword life force sucking and (3) more life force to make up for greatsword life force sucking. That is very boring, even if the particular numbers turn out make the traits strong.

9. No scaling defenses for team fights & no team utility for team fights.

This^

They managed to fix a grand total of one of our issues…while leaving all the others intact…and even creating several new issues.

The one issue they did fix is our melee attack viability (cleave). The reaper definitely fixes that. They have not even attempted to fix our lack of scaling defenses…which are absolutely essential to surviving melee combat…which leads right back to the viability of the reaper and the ability to use the new melee cleave.

They have not even attempted to fix the conflict with our class mechanic and the other half of our skills…the utility bar. Its like expecting a guardian to be anywhere near their current viability without their utilities. Imagine a guardian unable to use wall of reflection at a moment’s notice. Utilities definitely do matter. The shouts definitely do matter. Contribution to your team definitely does matter. They are expecting us to play half a profession at a time, while every other profession has access to all of their skills at all times. It would be different if RS had so much utility that we had no need for utilities…but we know that is not the case.

On top of that, they are consistently taking away any viable healing skill we have. Why on earth, would I choose a healing skill that makes me take more damage? Why would I want to take a healing skill that requires me to stay in a tiny circle to reap its full benefits? Why would I want to take a healing skill that requires me to take damage to reap its full benefits? They even just nerfed the siphon on SoV to non existence. Why would I want to take a heal skill that is based on a minion…that can be killed…to negate its entire effect? Its like they are trying to force us to take the shout heal. Are they going to nerf the shout heal too once we switch to that? Its like they are determined to make sure we don’t have a viable healing ability…we drop consume conditions when they made it suck and moved onto the semi viable SoV…they quickly nerf that too…

The ranged attack thing is a bit of a new issue too. They really need to give us the chronomancer treatment…they should have added RS as an f2 in addition to DS. I guess we can just ignore the majority of the reaper build and just drop out of shroud and use a staff when we need to range…

starlinvf.1358:

Zev.3407:

Id rather keep weapon swap and they alter/buff the skills . . . o wait thats exactly why vwe have betas and feedback, that IS what is happening.

If there is no weapon swap the class feels very limited, and we would be screwed in situation where we need both range and melee. With elementalist you can switch atunements and have different ranged skills, engi has tons of kit options. Rev felt so predictable before with it’s limited custimization.

That is a problem that still exists, even with the weapon swap. All the Weapon swap did was band-aid the underlying problem of lacking cross-compatibility between weapons and legends.

I know I’m gonna catch flak for it, but comparing to every other class in the game, you have a range of synergy between weapons and traits….. but no class other then the Revanent requires a Specific weapon for an entire trait line to operate correctly. Even Marksmanship (the next closest pigeon hole) is broad enough to be used on an All-melee ranger.

No flak at all here. The current traits for the Revenant are really bad. The lack of synergy between trait lines is awful. You can’t even merge those things into a coherent build…as they don’t work together to provide greater functionality…which is what a “build” is all about…the sum being greater than the parts. They really need to rework this. I’m not sure how they let this get past the drawing board…they literally paid someone to come up with this hot mess. I’d be embarrassed as a company to show this to anyone. You are absolutely correct, no other class has this absence of synergy across weapons and trait lines…so they have plenty of examples on how this should be looking. They do have a tendency to try and go the special snowflake route, which they should have learned from by now though. The reason necromancers and reapers are so busted now is because they try to focus on flavor over function sometimes…in direct conflict to their overall game design. It just took them years to start backing off of that regarding necro melee, mesmer ooc movement speed, and guardian ranged options. I’m still worried about how they are repeating their mistakes with the guardian minor that requires you to be at a certain range for it to work. Its the zeal mess all over again with the minors based on symbols. At some point, you need to learn from past mistakes and from current examples.

Seera.5916:

ODB.6891:

doddbox.8153:

…I’ve also had mesmers that insisted they were faster than Guardians but refused to use portals, ever…

I’ve never understood the obsession non-mesmers have for portal in pve. Literally, the only real useful application of portal in dungeons/fractals…that hasn’t been patched out…is for covering for others failures. That’s usually on swamp…where a competent team can just do the same thing they do when there is no mesmer…and just run the correct path. I guess its useful on the harpy fractal, to compensate for someone who fails at platform jumping. I personally think that it is a waste of a utility slot, if it is purely to cover for fails. It certainly doesn’t make a player “faster” to use a portal…as the portal mechanic requires you to have already been to the location for it to teleport you back to that location.

Edit: forgot the one fractal where it actually is useful…the heat room in the reactor fractal.

Portals are also useful in Cliffside when you’re going up against the arms to get from one arm to another quickly.

That’s true…more of a convenience factor though.

thrag.9740:

I don’t like to kick. To me, there are 5 people in that instance. If your party wiped, every one of those people should ask themselves “what can I do to fix this”. My opinion is that dungeons are so easy, I should be able to carry any group through. Fractals are another story, I’m not good at them yet, and I need to be carried a bit. But if I think a fractal group is garbage, I prefer to leave the group. I don’t want to place blame on someone other than myself. To me, picking out a single person on your team, and kicking them is like saying “I need someone better than you to carry me”. I don’t agree with it, to me that’s not what a team is.

I also prefer to leave than kick. Less conflict involved. I admit, I currently do not join a group if there is a ranger or necro in it. If I see a ranger or necro join the group….I almost always drop group without a word and look for an appropriate group. If I’m in a fractal group and someone tries to pull a bait and switch…and switch to a ranger/necro…that is a situation where I will likely initiate a kick…especially if I watch the ranger and I see that bear pop out in combat. I’ll also drop group when I see group damage so low that it is taking 2-3 times the normal time to kill things…that bodes ill for the rest of the run…usually means 1 or more nomads in tow. I also bail when I see a mes camping GS or a guard camping staff. Camping range is just so bad in most fractals. The only exceptions are when its a fractal group under level 10 where I can pretty much solo it…no matter what the rest of the group does.

doddbox.8153:

…I’ve also had mesmers that insisted they were faster than Guardians but refused to use portals, ever…

I’ve never understood the obsession non-mesmers have for portal in pve. Literally, the only real useful application of portal in dungeons/fractals…that hasn’t been patched out…is for covering for others failures. That’s usually on swamp…where a competent team can just do the same thing they do when there is no mesmer…and just run the correct path. I guess its useful on the harpy fractal, to compensate for someone who fails at platform jumping. I personally think that it is a waste of a utility slot, if it is purely to cover for fails. It certainly doesn’t make a player “faster” to use a portal…as the portal mechanic requires you to have already been to the location for it to teleport you back to that location.

Edit: forgot the one fractal where it actually is useful…the heat room in the reactor fractal.

I can pretty much agree with this. I was already planning on not using a GS as my primary weapon, upon seeing the revealed reaper details, for life force generation and attack speed reasons. Was pretty much just going to swap to it for a couple of its abilities as needed.

I love the hex idea. Much better for the reaper thematically as well as functionally. The whole concept of the shouts being trash unless you have a certain number of enemies in range is just bad. We have plenty of things that can deal with being swarmed by trash…we need stuff that works on bosses/low numbers of targets too. I think they should switch to hexes instead of this currently extremely lame shout set up.

EremiteAngel.9765:

ODB.6891:

Ravezaar.4951:

…DS is an inferior defence mechanic in gw2 cause it dosent SCALE with 1vX…

This^

This is one of soooo many reasons why they need to stop trying to have DS/RS as our defense mechanic. It is apparently too much for them to balance that properly. Strengthen it versus more than one attacker…and it is completely OP versus one attacker. They could try making it scale versus the number of attackers. They already have the code in game to do exactly that…its what they use to scale bosses in open world. The problem with that is that it would make DS/RS ridiculous in WvW. The only real solution would be to remove the second health bar function of RS/DS and have it only work like an engineer’s kit…based on life force as a resource. Take away the whole part about being attacked taking away life force. It would be like a combination of warrior’s adrenaline and engineer’s kit. Just let us have our utilities/active defenses in place of using DS/RS as a failed hp sponge.

i guess this works too.
take away its use as a 2nd health bar.

modify all our existing mechanisms to include more defensive abilities.

example:

shroud 2 should become instant cast, blink and stun break + its current chill.

spectral grasp should become instant cast, blink and stun break + its current chill.

spectral walk should become immunity to all damage for its duration and stunbreak on return.

wells should give added protection boon on cast with pulsing stability

signets should give added aegis boon on cast

corruptions should have their effectiveness amplified by at least 1.5 times.

scepter 3 should add stun for 3 seconds on hit

etc

um…are we sure we want to remove DS as a 2nd healthbar?

if we do that, there are too many things that needs to be changed for a necro.
hell everything will have to change.

I think your suggestions are on the right track. Some of it may be a bit much though.
Stun on ranged weapon is wrong imo.
I wouldn’t attach stability to wells…would pretty much make them mandatory
I like the aegis on signet cast, since I see necros/reapers as dark themed guardians
I think spectral walk still needs to stun break on cast, but it definitely needs the immunity
DS/RS 2 should both be instant cast just like you suggest…I would include an evade instead of stun break though…and yes…they both should leap/teleport the caster
Spectral grasp needs to be a self teleport to target …no cast time
Reflect on spectral wall
Projectile destruction on corrosive poison cloud
CD reduction on spectral armor + longer protection duration + stability
Corruptions do need to be stronger…with exception of BiP maybe
Remove the cast times on RS auto and RS 2.

I 100% say yes, to being sure about removing the second health bar function. Its the one true thing holding this profession back from improvement/balance. It may seem like a lot of work to make these changes, but its really not. Sprinkling around existing mechanics onto existing skills similar to what the other professions have would be just a repeat of what they already did with every other professions…only not having to start from scratch…pretty much a copy/paste…or better yet…forum balance like they do already and just use our suggestions.

Bhawb.7408:

I’d prefer to wait on Reaper update till I can play it. I don’t honestly trust ANet to balance without player feedback, I’d rather have them do nothing and just let us get our hands on it in a beta, then let us tell them what to do.

That’s the way it always works in this game. They throw out some terrible kitten and forum balance years later. The extra problem with necromancers is that they are too stubborn to devote resources to completely rework shroud.

Ravezaar.4951:

…DS is an inferior defence mechanic in gw2 cause it dosent SCALE with 1vX…

This^

This is one of soooo many reasons why they need to stop trying to have DS/RS as our defense mechanic. It is apparently too much for them to balance that properly. Strengthen it versus more than one attacker…and it is completely OP versus one attacker. They could try making it scale versus the number of attackers. They already have the code in game to do exactly that…its what they use to scale bosses in open world. The problem with that is that it would make DS/RS ridiculous in WvW. The only real solution would be to remove the second health bar function of RS/DS and have it only work like an engineer’s kit…based on life force as a resource. Take away the whole part about being attacked taking away life force. It would be like a combination of warrior’s adrenaline and engineer’s kit. Just let us have our utilities/active defenses in place of using DS/RS as a failed hp sponge.

Bhawb.7408:

Vydahr.4285:

That being said, I think DS could be made more of an actual defense mechanism if it gets more of that kind of augmentation. I don’t see the point of making it less effective than it already is

The point is that Death Shroud shouldn’t (in my opinion) be something you sit in for 60 seconds after building for a long time. You should build it quickly, and then use it instead of building up an effective HP pool of 66 thousand which is what you have with vitality-focused gear and full life force against direct damage. Instead, drop that number so that you don’t have the potential to tank massive amounts of damage in one sitting, and instead be able to build full LF extremely quickly but it also goes away somewhat fast, and at the same time give it proper defenses, like invulns, blinds, etc.

The point isn’t to nerf DS at all, it shifts the effectiveness from DS being something that is extremely hard to build and ranges from useless to insanely powerful while full, to something that is quick to build and used often, but only moderately powerful with each full bar.

My main issue is that I don’t think DS/RS should be our primary defense mechanism. I think they need to abandon the idea of DS/RS being an extra health bar and allow us to have some decent active defenses like every other profession…available at all times. I like that you will be able to trait for cold shoulder and putrid defense…in order to add some survivability to RS/DS, but the built in damage reductions need to go. It should really be like an engineer equipping a kit…damaging us should not take away life force. The only things that take life force away should be use of skills that require life force. The whole reason they refuse to give us active defenses is that they refuse to decouple our survivability from RS/DS. This also is the reason they won’t let us have access to our utilities in RS/DS. Decoupling survivability from RS/DS solves both of these issues and gives us real functionality. It would allow us to be balanced with other classes without this failed “attrition” model strangling us. It would remove the issue you were talking about with full defensive gear and full life force…versus full offensive gear with full life force…the life force wouldn’t be anywhere near as much of a factor anymore.

I do want there to be builds where you do stay in RS/DS as long as possible. I want there to also be builds where shroud is only used sparingly….build variety. I think the combination of the upcoming reaper elite spec, in combination with the existing soul reaping spec…would lend nicely to a build where your primary focus is maximizing RS and utilizing RS abilities.

I like everything in this list except the fix for Signet of Undeath. I’m really not a fan of things that depend on getting hit. The whole point of smart game play is to avoid getting hit. That’s the core of the active defense and dodge system this game is built around. I think the passive should still stay as constant life force generation, but the percentage definitely needs to increase. 1% every 3 seconds is terrible. I like your suggested changes to the active.

They really do need to implement these changes. Would go a long way to fixing necromancer / reaper functionality.

___________________________Heal Skills___________________________

• Well of Blood
  Water field

• Signet of Vampirism
  Should be a siphon and the passive should work on hitting enemies..not being hit. Make the passive work in Shroud.

• Consume Conditions
  Make it spectral. Remove the self inflicted condi.

• Summon Blood Fiend
  Your text here.

___________________________Utility Skills___________________________

• Spectral Wall
  Add reflect here and remove the fear.

• Spectral Walk
  Add resistance boon.

• Spectral Grasp
  Just make it an aoe pull without the projectile.

• Spectral Armor
  Add stability

• Plague Signet
  Make the passive work in shroud

• Signet of Spite
  Make the passive work in shroud

• Signet of Undeath
  Make the passive work in shroud.
  Increase the life force gain.
  Make it an elite.

• Signet of the Locust
  Make the passive work in shroud

• Well of Power
  Your text here.

• Well of Suffering
  Your text here.

• Well of Darkness
  Your text here.

• Well of Corruption
  Your text here.

• Epidemic
  Your text here.

• Corrupt Boon
  Your text here.

• Blood is Power
  Your text here.

• Corrosive Poison Cloud
  Your text here.

• Bone Fiend
  Your text here.

• Flesh Wurm
  Your text here.

• Shadow Fiend
  Your text here.

• Bone Minions
  Your text here.

__________________________Weapon Skills__________________________

• Axe Skills
  Your text here.

• Staff Skills
  Your text here.

• Dagger Skills
  Shave cast times and remove the channel.

• Warhorn Skills
  Blast finisher on wail.

___________________________Elite Skills___________________________

• Plague
  Your text here.

• Lich Form
  Your text here.

• Flesh Golem
  Your text here.

• Signet of Undeath
  Make it an elite

_________________________Shroud Skills_________________________
Make shroud a resource bar instead of a transform. Decouple the survival from shroud so that we can have some active defenses…attrition just doesn’t work unless you devote every trait/utility to it specifically.

____________________________Spite____________________________
Fix unholy fervor…the 10% more damage to vulnerable foes should be independent of weapon.
___________________________Curses___________________________
Your text here.
_________________________Death Magic_________________________
Your text here.
_________________________Blood Magic_________________________
Your text here.
_________________________Soul Reaping_________________________
Foot in grave needs to keep reapplying stability while in shroud.
Speed of shadows should make death’s charge into an actual leap instead of just a jog.
Speed of shadows should make the necro immune to movement impairing effects.
The piercing from unyielding blast should be baseline.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Despite everything, I know the majority of us will buy the expansion because of the updates to the game and future Living Story content.

Look at it this way: You’re unlocking future, and free, content.

Don’t get it twisted. The expansion’s content, new class, or fluff are not its biggest selling points. Access to future Living Story, Seasonal, and Special Events episodes, achievements, and rewards are.

True statement. I currently do not see enough included in the expansion to warrant a purchase for $50. I currently do not trust ANET to fill in enough value into their blank check for my pre-order. I currently don’t trust ANET to actually deliver class balance in all game modes. Its all going to come down to ANET either giving us proof or blind faith. I, personally, think that they have destroyed blind faith. If you believe in unicorns/blind faith…then buy at will….believing that somehow they will deliver on all your hopes and dreams in some future utopia version of GW2, that will somehow be delivered in a free content patch in HoT.

Stop trying to make a special snowflake. There are too many breaks from the core game functionality/design on this new profession. No weapon swaps, with insufficient compensation. Nearly incompatible trait lines/specializations…needs much more synergy. Lack of mechanics to switch back and forth from ranged to melee…repeat of weapon swap issues. Lack of utility customization. A lot of encounters actually depend on appropriate utility choice for smooth completion. Apparently cast time and mobility issues.

I see the mobility issues are going to be addressed on the last baseline legend, but that still would leave the other legends with the mobility issues.

You have already tried the special snow flake approach a couple of times and it always falls flat on its face. Attrition necromancer with terrible mobility, nearly non-existent party support, and terrible active defenses. You see how that has worked out in pve. Mesmers with their previous lack of reliable swiftness, due to previous flavor restriction. Clearly that has been re-evaluated. Guardian with their previous terrible lack of decent ranged options…now an entire elite spec to fix that. Don’t keep making the same mistakes…special snow flake is bad! It needs to have a core set of functionality that is homogenous with the game mechanics. Flavor on top of that is great…but don’t omit the core.

cocowoushi.7150:

Kidel.2057:

Not only bosses. Many situations require some party members with ranged weapon (like the platforming part with harpies, that is already pretty bad for the lack of swiftness if you have no hammer)

Again, not REQUIRED. You can melee harpies fine, in fact if you have a guardian with you its preferred to stay close to them for their blocks/reflects. Things like “required” and “mandatory” mean you can not complete something without something. The only ONLY thing in fractals you can not hit without range are oil buckets in Battleground. And EVEN THEN you can just ignore them, break the doors, and run. Anomaly is helped with having range if all platforms near it are missing, but they come back pretty fast.

Again, I agree Revs need weapon swap and another range option, but not because of fractals.

All of this^

Was wondering if everyone actually believed you needed or even wanted range in fractals lol.

Gunsnroll.2657:

ODB.6891:

The hammer looks like it will finally make melee an option for engineers.

Reading things like these makes me cry.
You keep talking about melee, but sadly, you have a very poor idea of what it is.
Melee was never an option to engineers, it’s mandatory.
If you would have at least tried it, you would have seen that engi got many things that are buffed at melee range. You just see “range: 1000” under rifle skills and you assume you have to play it ranged.
The thing that will decide if hammer is worthy will never be that number you see after range, it will be its damage, if hammer can outdps the rifle, then we will take it, else we will still play rifle in melee.
And I’m so sorry for you if you think engi use their rifle auto.

What I’m sorry for about you is your poor attitude and the way you think you are entitled to address others over the internet. I’m sorry you weren’t taught any better. I’m sorry you think you know anything about me or how I play engineer. I think you should apologize to whoever was supposed to teach you how to talk to other humans, because you just made them look bad. I think maybe you should cry. Engineers may be in semi/melee range, but that is definitely not melee combat…at least not how it is with any other class except ele. The closest thing engineers have to actual melee combat is the tool kit. That is a utility, not exactly a weapon…like the topic of this thread is actually about. I think you should take whatever personal issues you have and work on those in private instead of bringing them to the forums to address others.

Thank you for such a quick answer. I know I’m not taking that trait then :p

I just want the double standards to end. They need to stop singling out necromancers for their completely off base flavor reasons. There shouldn’t be any profession that can’t move around freely in combat. There shouldn’t be any profession that loses access to their utility bar just because they use their class mechanic. There shouldn’t be any profession without some combination of active defenses (block, reflect, invuln). I’m sorry, but active defenses are the cornerstone of this game…neglecting necromancers in this respect just doesn’t make sense. If they are so set against giving us a true block/invuln…they need to revert that old nerf to shroud where damage done to shroud carries over to our actual health bar. At least that was a make shift block. Balance it all after they fix these disparities.

The wording of the trait is currently very unclear on this point. I’m interested in the answer too.

Rising Dusk.2408:

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Gain Life Force every time you cast a spell. Life Force gained: 1%?

This would be awesome for Signet of Undeath’s passive effect, actually.

Signet passives while in shroud please :-/

The only, previously unplayed, professsion…that I will give a shot now…due to a new weapon…will be engineer. The hammer looks like it will finally make melee an option for engineers.

I will likely continue to main my mesmer, but not for the new weapon. I will definitely take the new elite specialization…just not really interested in the shield mechanics.

I may as well consider my guard a second main, but I will 100% not trait into the new elite specialization…therefore I will not even use a longbow. I think they did a terrible job with the guardian elite specialization.

I am very interested in the reaper. I leveled a necromancer just in preparation for the reaper, but I am skeptical of how much I will even make use of the greatsword. ANET’s insistence of trying to attach penalties to necromancers and everything they touch is really frustrating. They want the GS to be slow, they want to limit mobility, they refuse to let us play the whole profession (no utilities in shroud), they refuse to allow any true active defenses (blocks, reflects, invulnerabilities). In the end, even the GS may be pointless if dagger still outpaces it. Depending on the uptime of reaper shroud, I may not even use a GS as RS doesn’t depend on having a GS equipped. I may be able to get all my “cleavage” just from RS. If that’s the case, GS may just be my alt weapon to swap to. So no, doesn’t look like necros getting GS will make me swap mains either.

I can’t imagine any new weapon a warrior or thief would get would make me swap either.

If ele is really getting a 1h sword…and it will be true melee…that may be a game changer though.

Still no interest in anything ranger related

Revenant is going to depend entirely on the power/melee legend and its weapon sets.

Aeolus.3615:

EDit: if shield 1st skill had a bash/rush atack spreading prot to allies it will be even a good offhand to use with sword.

I’d actually use a shield on my guard if this existed. Well this and the absence of knock back.