An elementalist has too much sustain. In a 1v1 battle versus a zerker of any kind they cannot die, yet they cannot kill. Playing against tempest eles is so utterly boring.
Thoughts?
well, yes…
Problem is, theres no other build for ele that works. Ever tried an amulet without very high amounts of healing power (so anything other than clerics or menders) on an ele? It’s bottom tier trash. Ele always relied on it’s sustain to win 1v1’s, with cele amu gone, clerics/menders is the only choice, since the ele benefits more from higher amounts of healing power than from higher amount of DMG-stats in basically every MU.
But I’m sure the same ppl that cry about ele being too tanky were the ones that wanted to get rid of cele amu, where the ele was actually fun to play and most MU’s required skill.
Ele is in a really weird spot right now, since clerics S/F ele is very strong (but does no dmg, so many ppl don’t like to play it) but every other weapon set or amulet is absolute garbage (okay, I think menders is decent as well).
And I mean completely unusable utter warrior-tier garbage. :P
The main problems are:
- Healing is too low on low amounts of healing power
- DMG is too low in general
Now, if you take away more healing, you’ll simply push Ele even farther in the corner of full-support/healer or completely out of the meta, since clerics will still be the only thing that really works.
The fact that clerics works so well is that the counter to high toughness/low HP is conditions, but the clerics ele build is pretty much the best build in terms of condi-cleanse there is.
Solution:
- Higher healing on low healing power amounts, no changes in the higher healing power amounts.
- Fix the soldier rune bug that cleanses like 5 too many conditions and probably rework diamond skin to sth. that requires skill.
What are SAB Auras?
…. attcking them offpoint before they get there. It puts them in a loose-loose situation. They can either try to fight me, therefore not be participating in the teamfight and try to kill a class that will always escape.
Or they can ignore me, allowing me to deal some serious damage and give me free kills on the players that have to retreat from mid to heal.
You won’t do that one single time against decent teams without getting heavily punished for it. Overextending alone into multiple ppl is just bad play. Best case scenario against good teams is that you’ll have to use important CD’s to escape without doing anything.
Thief should at first either get close or help getting close, then either try and get a kill mid if there are only 1-2 enemies there or decap far.
Moa should be changed completely, it’s just a dumb skill. Other than that, they’ll need to put an ICD (5 seconds) on Illusionary Reversion and Chronophantasma.
I am not very experienced on thief, but when I play it, I like to go for more 1v1 oriented builds than just gankers. I’ve played S/D back when it was actually pretty decent and currently, I think D/D fits that role best. I currently don’t think I have huge advantages in 1v1’s, but I also don’t feel like there are unwinnable MU’s. I use this build that I actually think is pretty decent:
I absolutely love bandits defense btw. it’s so strong against many classes and it’s a very short CD with a decent block, stunbreaker, endurance refill and a knockdown. I really don’t see any reason why not every thief should run this, regardless of build. Srsly, this might be one of the strongest utilities in the game.
Simple rule to follow if you are a Thief that is accurate in more situations than not, is:
If you stay somewhere longer than 10 seconds, you’re doing it wrong.
It’s really an issue of reaper and chrono…. I don’t think reaper is in a bad spot, cuz if you actually wanna survive in teamfights, you won’t be able to take many boon-conversions as utility (like signet of locust+trait or corrupt boon, which are the ones that do a lot of the heavy lifting in terms of “burst condition damage”).
On the Mesmer, the biggest Problem is IMHO Moa, which is just a dumb skill. Also, retaining Illusions after a shatter is a bit too easy with Illusionary reversion and chronophantasm, I can just press F1-F4 and seem to always have 2+ illusions….
There’s no need whatsoever for a big nerf to conditions in general, nor a buff to condi-cleanse.
Please for the love of god put a cap on the amount of dmg per sec you can take from condi… just like gw1. torment and confusion can go over a bit if moving or attacking… but other than that the condi pressure is just stupid. condi is just mindless spam and the payoff is absurd. Thanks
I think specifically nerfing the builds that are very strong is probably better. I don’t like nerfing general things just because some builds associated with it are too strong, it has to many implications and could hurt build-diversity.
Also, I never got the “mindless spam” argument. It really has nothing to do with conditions at all. Good players will have to adjust which skill to use when just like on any other build.
I think it might be because of the super adventure box.
I’ve used rise on almost any build since it cam out, it’s one of the few great tools to survive focused dmg in teamfights.
Spectral armor is decent, but the alternatives are IMHO just better.
so a few pro league necros were using sigil of intell and (hydromancy?) I believe on the staff. was just wondering what the method behind their madness was on these sigil choices. seems like leeching or geomancy would be a better choice.
Int+hydro on staff give a total control on plague signet from curse line and full marks dmg.
As long as u lower ur crit chance intentionaly so u dont proc plague at a wrong moment.
This.
Shroud alone is not enough to proc the weakness from weakening shroud and plague sending, also, the DMG on Staff 4 is pretty decent, so IMHO it’s worth it to take the int sigil.
Another neat thing is to switch to staff in fights when being attacked and activating a shout; since they can crit, you can remove a ton of condis while stunned.
D/D with paladin can be good against condi-builds if you take DS, cleansing water etc. but in most 1v1’s, you get out-dps’d or outsustained.
I’m currently toying around with a menders build, but you cannot run that without focus, so Dagger/Focus is likely going to be the only choice for PvP currently.
Some interesting Ideas, gotta try them out.
If I go for a damage-oriented build, I currently play this one:
Atm. I have decent success against the condi-builds in 1v1’s (Mesmer and Necro). Gotta say that the MU’s require a lot of practice though, one undodged Moa or Shroud 5 for example will make you instaloose.
It’s also decent in teamfights, but I struggle heavily against good Revs and Scrappers, since they either out-dps or outsustain me. Haven’t played too many druids yet, might be a hard MU again cuz he’ll outsustain you.
Clerics is obviously better overall and there are better builds that fill the role of a D/D-Ele currently, but it’s not bad for a few league games. It’s also good enough that you can actually win most MU’s if you know what you’re doing and are able to outplay the opponent.
Basically just a worse version of the burn guard that has existed for ages. Totally unusable in the current meta though.
Play smart and it’s not as bad, here are some ways to deal with it:
- Target druid first (yes, if there are two in a fight, this won’t work as well).
- CC druid
- Be constantly aware of the druids positioning and force him to play defensive, this will negate a lot of dps/CC from him and you’re already on top of him when he wants to rez.
- Force druids into 1v1’s, since SaR does nothing in 1v1’s.
- Just blast the druid with cleave while rezzing.
- Force druid to use his only stability (ult) before he can rez.
- Moa him (with mesmer signet or engi-elexir)
Also, keep in mind that SaR is one of a few things that make druid useful in teamfights, there are tons of reasons why he’s actually not that good in teamfights though (pets get worse the more players you are up against, not much reliable burst, not that hard to kill, no AoE, CC-chains can dominate a druid etc). So, SaR can be impactful and you see it very well when it does it’s job, but the druid is a whole is really not too strong in teamfights.
I really think ppl are just lazy to play right when complaining about stuff like that: There are more than enough answers to SaR.
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The problem of the celestial will remain still if nerfed, expecially for the elementalist.
The main problem wasn’t that grant a little more bonus than the other amulets, the problem was that was able to make a class extremly versatile like the ele a hyper bunker with the damage stats of a dps.I’m ok if you add back the cele, but you have to make all the classes totally unable to stack more than 12 stack of might by himself during a fight. Expecially about eles.
But ANet will never make a rework like that, then add back the celestial will only restore the old ele dictature and remove all the actual build diversity.
Yes, play only a cleric to be the best is bad, but there’s still different good builds and Roles you can try.
- Ele never had the dps of a clear dps-dealer, it won the 1v1’s because it could outsustain other builds. Ele basically only really won 1v1’s when it directly countered the other build (like against necro, because of diamond skin), or against pure dps classes with very low sustain, which shouldn’t really 1v1 anyways, only in rare instances when they hardcounter a certain build for whatever reason.
- Mightstacking can be dealth with better now because of more and better boonremoval.
- Other mightstacking classes like engi would likely still use pala/marauders amu, since the trend for scrappers atm is towards more dps and since they don’t need the healing power.
- Druid might benefit from cele amu and can mightstack pretty will, but it’ll likely be similar in strength as menders amu, maybe even worse.
- Necro can mightstack too, but will likely still use merc.
The mightstacking argument really isn’t valid as a reason against reintroducing cele. It’s really all about the ele just needing the toughness+vita+healing power to make any builds that aren’t just pure bunkers/support.
class diversity is kinda okay, but build diversity is IMHO not that great:
- Ele now is locked into a single amulet and a single weapon set. In S1, there at least were some Staff and some Dagger/Focus and Dagger/Dagger builds possible.
- Rev’s are mostly power now, last season, there were more condi-revs, which aren’t as good anymore.
- The other classes pretty much have 1 decent metabuild each, the necro is probably the most diverse, with different traitlines, runes and even amus being used quite often. War still has no strong builds and thief got a bit better, but still not as good.
So IMHO no differences in classes that have good builds, but especially ele and rev have fewer different possible builds.
That being said, I think that the maybe 6 best metabuilds are closer together than ever, we might not even see multiple stacked classes in ESL even without the no class stacking rule.
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
Maybe I just want it back cause I play Elementalist, but I want some damage back…. Clerics is getting old
Same here.
Removing cele really only hurt ele and only in build diversity. (still strong, but less different builds, at least some different weapons were viable last season, now it’s just dagger/focus).
Scrapper and necro would still use pala/marauder/merc anyways, maybe druid would run cele, but it would be similar in playstyle to the builds most druids play now. Other classes would’ve likely not use cele amu.
I’d be fine with a 500 stat cele. Hell, atm. I’d even take 450.
OR
they could just buff the healing in the lower healing power amounts of the ele, you know, like on the scrapper, where the healing is already ridiculous with 0 healing power on stats. Or they could give the ele some trait to buff healing power a bit.
….I just wanna play sth. with a bit of dmg again on my ele. :P
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
Removing cele was not a mistake because it favored might stacking classes, basically giving them 1k+ power and condi damage and 560 in everything else.
@OP Mercenary is just fine. It, Paladin and Menders gave us some new combinations beyond Carrion, Marauder and Celestial. Taking away Mercenary won’t stop you from getting rekt by Reapers, which really aren’t all that OP anyways. They are killable, just learn to kite when they go into shroud.
In theory, yes, but there are several factors to take into account:
- Scrapper is one class with heavy mightstacking: But the healing is already more than high enough without any healing power on the amu to sustain in 1v1’s and to stay alive in teamfights.
- druid is another class with heavy mightstacking and cele would likely be used, but menders works as well and likely gives more dps, since the more common builds nowadays don’t really use much condi-dmg. Cele might still be better though.
- Ele was the class most dependent on cele amu, but Ele really doesn’t have that high mightstacking anymore. Also, I’d argue that many ppl think the new clerisc amu build is moer annoying than cele.
- Reaper had decent mightstacking, but doesn’t gain much from the healing power, it’ll likely use merc even if cele would still be in the game.
- Also, boonstrip got way better, so mightstacking in general is less of a problem and there are more and stronger counters to it.
All removing cele did was pushing ele towards a heavy bunker/support role and destroy some of the build diversity. Even if sth. turned out to be too strong, it could’ve easily been handled with specific balance-changes without removing the amulet. Even a small nerf to the amulet would’ve been much better than removing it completely.
I get this like every 2nd match, it’s really annoying. Just type /dance and you can move again… for whatever reason. :P
That’s one reason I want tournaments back: There is really no good reason for ppl to team up!
Playing wih 4 other ppl on teamspeak and coordinating the whole thing is work; you need to find a good team, learn to play together, w8 for everyone to be ready etc. so you should be rewarded for it in some way. In the League-System, you get punished for playing with a team, so why bother?
removing cele was a mistake and removing merc would be one as well.
I use Menders most often, for several reasons:
- Healing power also benefits the whole team and druid really needs that to be useful in teamfights.
- Paladin’s amu has higher offensive stats, but tons of dps comes from the pet anyways – no healing comes from the pet though….
- The very high precision-stats on paladins aren’t as good as they seem, cuz you have no added ferocity, so the ~500 stat-points in precision net you a ~12% dmg increase, depending on which on-cit procs you use, 30% crit-chance will often be enough to use them effectively (1.25s for 3 pulses on solar beam = 1 crit, which means 1 proc every 2.5 seonds, so just spamming Staff1, you have enough crit-chance to proc air every 3 seconds).
- Dolyak runes are by far the best on druid (astral force every 1s), gives toughness.(good way to make up for the lack of toughness on the amu)
- Signet of Stone, which is very strong to survive in teamfights, also gives toughness. (another good way to make up for the lack of toughness on the amu)
- The current meta features many condi-builds.
- The added healing and teamsupport actually gives the druid a more defined role as a strong support, if you use paladin, you might as well not play a druid at all.
I was strongly in favour of paladins at first and was confused to see every1 use menders, but after extensively testing it, I have to agree it’s the better option more often than not.
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
Spend that 200k on fixing the game, give the pvp team a bonus if they fix the problems that are. Spend that money on some new content or what ever, but dont pay “pros” 200k, for 1k twitch. Throw the “E-sport” to the garbage, it’s embarrassing.
No rewards for competitions -> no1 plays the competitions -> much fewer players in PvP and fewer content like stramers on twitch -> PvP is dead.
Those 200k are well spent.
Pro league finals has less viewers then random LoL solo qer who streams how good he is at picking his nose.
Yeah. PvP is not dead in this game. /kappa
So?
There’s always sth. bigger, doesn’t mean the 200k was a wrong investment.
Spend that 200k on fixing the game, give the pvp team a bonus if they fix the problems that are. Spend that money on some new content or what ever, but dont pay “pros” 200k, for 1k twitch. Throw the “E-sport” to the garbage, it’s embarrassing.
No rewards for competitions → no1 plays the competitions → much fewer players in PvP and fewer content like stramers on twitch → PvP is dead.
Those 200k are well spent.
noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Lol, only noobs think DH sucks.
Depends.
In the high tier ESL meta (even without the no class-stacking rules), DH really isn’t great at all, mostly because of the many hardcounters:
- Scrappers
- Rev’s
- Clerics Ele
Often, they hardcounter DH so hard in teamfights, that it benefits the whole team (swirling winds, magnetic aura, defense field and stuff like that) and DH looses a lot of it’s teamfight-power. Also, because of low mobility and not the best 1v1-capabilities (smart teams will rotate the right player and get a freewin in every 1v1), you can’t simply go for 1v1’s.
Now in the current ranked meta, things look quite differently: much less rev’s and scrappers (noticed that on all levels from Div1 to Div6) that do well against DH and much more thiefs, mesmers, necro’s that neither do well against DH in teamfghts nor in 1v1’s.
That’s my main problem with DH, it goes from useless to likely OP just based on what you are playing against, no other class has such devestating hardcounters like DH, but is as strong if it’s not effectively hardcountered.
Tournaments disappeared because nobody ever took part in them. Just look at the turnout to the most recent AG cups.
I can remember a time when tournaments were played quite a bit, even though they implemented this weird necessity for tournament-tokens, which was totally counterproductive.
Yepp, there is just no incentive to team up and allowing players to team up has often been sth. that MMO’s did better than MOBA’s for example, for a multitude of reasons. Also, playing as a team is where the game actually gets much better IMHO, but it’s useless to go and find a team when nobody has any incentive to play as a team.
nah.
they will not bring back things they removed.
You certainly put a lot of effort into your well formulated comment, but just because things haven’t happened so far, doesn’t mean it’s impossible for them to happen.
I think tournaments were the best iteration of PvP in GW2 to date, for ppl who don’t know what they are: You Q up with a team, play 1 Map, if you win, you play against another team that won the first Map, if you loose, you start on the first Map again. 3 Maps are played in total in the rewards for each win get higher the more wins you have in the tournament.
Why tournaments are good for the community:
- The frustration level isn’t nearly as high as in the league-system, because you don’t loose sth (like pips) for a loss.
- There is a naturally implemented difficulty-curve, without relying on a broken MMR-System.
- The rewards were big enough to make ppl actually want to team up with 4 other players, in order to get to win the tournaments. In the current system, most players just solo-Q afaik.
- Q-times are shorter (which is another reason more players will team up), because there is no need to differentiate players based on their MMR or Division.
Why tournaments are good for ANet:
- Players that play together with other players are more attached to the game, because of social ties they’ve built in the game.
- With a necessity for 5-man Q’s, ANet could easily implement no class stacking to alleviate the balance-issues.
- No need for ANet to work on an MMR-system.
- Bridge the gap between Stronghold and Conquest by implementing Stronghold into the rotation.
- The tournament-system already existed in the game, so there isn’t much work to do for ANet.
- There is a possibility for certain events that could attract more players (see below).
Other possibilities of Tournaments
- Big weekly Tournaments with more than 3 rounds.
- Fun events with certain rules, like only core-specs.
- Ingame spectator-modes for the last round of the tournament and/or teams with the most tournament wins (like in GW1).
- The performance in Tournaments could easily factor into the challenger-league position of teams.
- ANet could make the league systerm true solo-Q only, which is what many people want. Teams would then still have the tournaments.
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
It wasn’t the plan; everything got thrown off by two unexpected cancellations. Use some common sense.
It’s always like that.
I don’t ever watch it live – I w8 2+ hours and start watching the vod’s on twitch… It’s easily about 80% where no1 plays or at least the builds are shown.
Why ruby? I see players doing stupid stuff constantly in dia and leg as well, for example:
- Running into an obivously lost teamfight just to die as well
- Not stomping/cleaving/rezzing, or doing the wrong thing with the wrong class. Like clerics ele’s should almost always stomp if they have earth5 or the overload for stability rdy and necro’s should almost always cleave if they have shroud rdy. And it’s important that they HAVE these things rdy at the necessary times, that’s what makes a good player; knowing what to use when.
- Rezzing when they obviously take too much cleave
- Staying in a fight as a DPS when there’s no chance in hell that anything get’s killed of the enemy (like against clerics ele + scrapper, or 2 clerics ele even, me being a clerics ele as well that could easily hold off the two, but no, 1 rev decides to stay and bash onto the ele for 5 minutes, while I’m constantly telling him to leave…)
Also, bad positioning is just a huge problem, I see tons of players just overextending heavily and then blaming me for not healing them. -.-°
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
Both the winstreaks and not being able to loose pips at 0 pips of a new division (or even tier) makes the order of your wins much too important. S2 is IMHO much better than S1, but it’s still a very flawed system that needs a complete rework.
Just give us back tournaments or implement a working ELO-system.
I am getting absolutely kitten on by the combined CC and condi spam of multiple necros and I have no clue how to counterplay. Please help.
Ele probably has the least problems against necro, but if you eat tons of CC, it can get hard. The best tips I can give you is:
- Positioning: Don’t be stubborn and simply stay on point to die – run and resustain. Teleport can help a lot here, since necro’s won’t be able to follow you up ledges and stuff.
- Use your Overloads as stunbreakers: If you need t play defensively, w8 for a CC to hit you until you Overload to break the stun.
- Stay above 75%: You don’t have to use your heal when you’re at under 50% for example, you need to stay over 75%, since 1 condi-remove every second is way more important than using your heals for maximum efficacy against condi-builds.
- In terms of build, go for soldier-runes, invigorating torrents+cleansing water and Diamond Skin obviously. I go for cleansing waves over aura-share if I face 2 or more cndi-builds on the opposing team as a rule of thumb.
It’s much better than S1, but atm. it’s not much fun, since 5 pips before legend, I went from a 90% win rate until diamond and about 70% in diamond to a sick loosing streak. And no, I didn’t play perfectly, but in most of the games I had some very suspicious teammates that just simply played wrong at first glance.
It’s just a salty solo-Q pip-grind. Compare this to what we used to have with tournaments:
- They actually made you wanna team up with 4 ppl.
- They had appropriate rewards.
- A loss didn’t set you back, but just didn’t gave you the rewards you were looking for and you simply q’d again.
- It had a simple implemented difficulty-curve; “winner stays in tournament”.
It was just so much better.
I love how everyone, regardless of games played, if they ever even played in a semi-competetive team or not, which league they are in etc, always assume that they are doing nothing wrong….
And at first glance I see several things the OP could’ve done better… -.-°
Well, what did you expect?
- You play a bad build
- Your team has a bad comp (you could’ve switched to support-ele)
It’s as easy as that.
I’m going to try it for myself later., but I’m curious if anyone is using bunker guard this season, and if they are having any success?
currently playing this and it has the potential to become meta.
Can you please elaborate on this a bit? I’m interested because it looks a bit like my PVE build and that fascinates me, but I’m still doubtful.
Not much to elaborate. Still gotta work out which heal (trap, shout or shelter) and which elite (shout, meditation or even the trap) to take against which comps.
It does even less DMG than Clerics Ele, but the support is insane and it obviously has better rezzing. On average, I do 300k heal on allies, 500+ condi’s removed and 1000+ boons applied to allies. Also, it has tons of AoE-stability and otherwhise strong stomping.
Necro’s are quite hard to deal with though, but they’ll likely fade out of the competetive meta anyways, since they’re too easy to kill.
I’m going to try it for myself later., but I’m curious if anyone is using bunker guard this season, and if they are having any success?
currently playing this and it has the potential to become meta.
At least in EU, nearly every team replaced druid already. And since I main it I can assure you that rev is heaviliy favoured in those 1v1s. I did plenty of test duells with pro league revs to try out different strats. Considering the rev is on a certain skill-lvl he will have about 70% winrate. But that’s not the topic here.
And as I said, 1v1s only shouldn’t be an indicator whether the class is fine or not. You have to consider the overall picture.
Did u run menders amu? I guess I can see rev doing well against druids; I also think druid isn’t as good as the new mesmer anyways and I probably wouldn’t run a druid in teh current meta either.
And yes, 1v1 isn’t the single indicator of how good a build is, but there was a time when rev actually did very well in a multitude of 1v1’s that were used in the meta, which totally put him on top of the meta (being so mobile, the best +1 in the game and decent in teamfights is already good, but if you then also have a few 1v1’s you’re favoured in, it gets out of hand). That’s also why I don’t think rev is AS good anymore, just cuz there are more unfavoured 1v1’s for the rev in the current meta.
@PowerBottom
I know which is the meta comp and trust me if there wouldn’t be an esl class stacking rule a lot of teams would run duable rev and this rule is the only reason you have your “deverse meta”Btw in the current meta revenants win against druid and also against reapers considering the rev is not using paladin but ok….
Anyways, saying this class is fine because it’s not favoured in certain 1v1 is like saying reaper is fine because it loses 1v1 against thief.
@Mysticjedi: Not even worth to give a real answer to this. There is no need to argue with people who say that rev would be fine currently – they are clearly to unexperienced to hold a discussion on the same lvl, sorry.
I’m gonna ask some players what they think about rev currently and how many they’d run, I’m quite curious about it too. I could see teams still running 2 if they could, but I can also see teams swapping one rev out for a mesmer/druid.
And in terms of marauder-rev beating druid and reaper – I heavily doubt it. It’s possible, but the MU is surely not in favour of the rev. I haven’t tested how well the “new” menders druid does against rev though, cuz I don’t really like that amu on the rezbot-druid at all (I prefer pala+water or druid-runes), exactly because druid might be too squishy otherwise against power-rev’s and scrappers. And having a squishy rezbot kinda defeats the purpose… ^^
I think revs aren’t too bad in the current meta, since the new mesmer is afaik quite favoured against them. So in the current meta, they loose to scrapper, necro, mesmer, ranger and they won’t kill the ele. So it’s basically just a +1 that’s also useful in teamfights (but not too useful, a balanced amount of usefulness IMHO). I actually think that even without the class-stacking rule, many teams wouldn’t play 2 revs anymore, but that’s just my assumption.
I actually begin to enjoy the meta quite a bit. Yes, you see a lot of mass-reapers in ranked, but that’s not really the best setup at all and has some big disadvantages. Rev’s aren’t played often in ranked anyways IMHO, so no big problem there either.
The current best way to set up your team is IMHO:
1 clerics ele
1 merc-reaper
1 pala scrapper
1 marauder rev
1 rez-ranger or new mesmer (I prefer the mesmer)
I think that’s a pretty fun and diverse meta.
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
I really like the Idea of having the effects trigger on certain combo-finishers. But srsly; we have more than enough projectile-hate in pvp atm. ^^’
1) Buff some skills/weapons/traits that are never used
2) New Maps
3) bring back tournaments or other things you can only play with 5 players in a team, with enough rewards to make ppl want to team up and play with a full team.
stop whining about necros, it’s bad if a team runs more than two! Yes, Necro’s are strong, but they have clear disadvantages that get unsurmountable if they aren’t made up by other classes on the team:
- horrible mobility
- horrible sustain
- bad rezzing/stomping (stability mostly only in shroud)
- Also, there is considerable overlap with multiple reapers, since they all spam the same conditions, which can be dealt with by smart cleanses.
If you loose against mass-reapers, it was because your team didn’t adapt to it and didn’t play smart. I can definitely see 2 reapers being useful in an ESL team, but more than that is simply not smart.
The Problem is that ppl push far with the wrong chars and with the wrong players on close/mid.
If you have some sustainy classes mid, like Ele, Scrapper or sth. and a very mobile class getting close (rev), so he can join mid really quickly, it can work very well. Of course, the player pushing far should be able to win or stall the opposing player there as well, so there’s often a bit of guessing involved and the player pushing far should immediately go mid if he see’s a MU he’s not gonna win/stall (and be able to disengage when needed).
Problem is that ppl don’t think about it in terms of overall strategy; they see ESL-teams do it and just go for it, without thinking about why it worked. A lot goes into making strategic plays like that work and it’s mostly stuff you don’t learn by just solo-q’ing.
It can be just as bad to just send 4 players mid though: if you don’t have enough DMG mid and they have 3 tanky classes there and pushing your far with a strong 1v1 class in a for you unfavourable MU, you’ll not get mid and you’ll loose close+far.
Guess this game has strategic depth after all…. :P
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
1) Day1, only played like ~5 games a day though
2) T1 Ruby
3) Between 80 and 90%
4) Not stuck at all
5) Nope
6) Yes, but not as much as last season, mostly cuz I have tons of other stuff to do though.