Guild Wars 2

Jana.6831:

Ansau.7326:

Jana.6831:

I’m just throwing in that I’ve been able to flip all camps on our BL (citadel WP as only WP) within one tick ( = 15 mins). Yes, flipping camps was my sport. One took me 1,5 mins from start to finish (first attack until it was my team’s colour).
Try that on the new BLs.

Camps from desert take pretty much the same to clean up, if not less. Elite specializations brought a lot of power creep and aoe pressure that counter the difficulty added, plus now dolyaks are out of range.

With several builds you can even spend about the same time capping than actually killing the npcs, which takes around 40s from the first hit until you capped, and your 1.5min is far from being surprising, even before HoT people were taking a camp in 40-50s.

PD: Capping ring lasts 20s, not 30.

I really don’t get why no one seems to understand me.
1) I tried to estimate the time from point to point (not really keeps or center of keeps) on the old borderlands – that’s why I brought this up.
2) I said that I found an old video in which the ring was up 30 s – I also said in the same sentence that I haven’t watched the time since June, so I have no idea whether or not that changed

3. All of this irrelevant anyway as the only thing that mattered and why I brought it up was that you could run around all camps (= more than the BL) within 8 mins on the ABLs.

I could explain a bit more what has changed when capping camps and whether or not it’s easier or faster or whatnot – but that wasn’t my point

To add to that:
If you were a lone roamer trying to avoid the enemy zerg, you could criss cross the map almost anywhere. You weren’t stuck running along a funneled path or forced to take the long way around which will triple the distance.

If I was trying to annoy the enemy I would do things like hit SE camp, tap hills, tap garri, tap bay, tap bay, flip NW. Travel times included that would take about 5-7 minutes. I don’t even want to think about how long that would take on the deserted bl.

Dusty Moon.4382:

Deniara Devious.3948:

Alpine borderland was:
1. simpler & easier to learn

>Simpler yes and flawed design

2. smaller & faster to travel = less time spent on traveling, more time spent on fighting and having fun

>It has been proven there really is no difference between DBL’s and ABL’s as far as travel.

3. every tower had strategical meaning e.g. you could built a treb on it to attack nearest keep

>No – sorry they didn’t. Same with on the new maps.

4. supply camps were located closer to the other objectives, shorter distance for supply runs

>Nope – about the same.

5. Alpine borderland lacks gimmicks, which just detract from game play, like shrines, jumping pads, wind blowing you off the bridges, auto fire cannons etc.

6. The keeps and towers were much smaller, making them easier to scout

>BAY was a pita to scout because of the amount of running. No difference between the new BL’s

7. The original Alpine borderland had a lake. Underwater combat, yeah!

>Underwater combat – BLEH!

And last, but not least: the Alpine borderland felt more like home, more like a location you would want to fight for. Maybe because it had forest, meadows, lake, hills and snow and buildings also looked more normal instead of the alien design of earth keep of desert borderland.

>People complained about the ABL’s being stale and people started leaving. Now people want ABL’s back, so they can complain some more.

1.What was flawed about the overall design?

2.That’s a straight kittening lie. Compare a fight over SW camp on Alpine vs. Deserted. Look at how long it takes to respawn and run back. Or if you are on the Sr cornet of the map and you see a fight is happening on the NW, on the alpine you could pretty much Mahe a straight shot, on the deserted you have to run up and around until you did the paths that take you around barricades and cliffs.

3. Yes they did all have strategic value. All except one could treb keeps, and the one that couldn’t controlled choke points.

4. Yes they were.

5. I guess you agreed with this?

6. Did you ever scout bay? You just had to move a few feet from the NE gate to be able to check every outer wall and gate. This was also the closest gate to garri making it especially quick to scout.

7. I main a ranger so I’m all for underwater combat lol. “C’mere and rez me unlikable underwater pet”

Lastly people complained about everything being stale after years of neglect, that doesn’t mean they wanted their game mode transformed into the pile of kitten that HoT delivered.

lil devils x.6071:

Aeolus.3615:

lil devils x.6071:

Aeolus.3615:

lil devils x.6071:

Aeolus.3615:

What is a hot system?

PVE, grindy, gimmicky, bouncy environmentally NPC focused material.= HoT system. ( AKA~ Banners, airships, more NPC’s, Grind PvE to be able to play WvW, stupid crap popping out of the ground, auto WP, spend all your time running around aimlessly and PvD than in PvP action… )

(…)

That is why removing that garbage is only one step in improving WvW and making it grow. They have to start treating it like a large scale PvP battlefield rather than a PvE map where you can also attack other players. They need to focus more on rewarding player skill while fighting over objectives to actually start to improve it. PPK needs to take priority over PPT, completely changing the way game play is valued and rewarded in the game mode. they need to personally reward fighting other players over objectives MORE than PvD, kill NPC’s for a chest and win. You would no longer win by Ktrain and PvD, instead, you would win by having more kills at the hands of players over objectives without the use of siege. You get increased PPK, LOOT and Xp for fighting players over objectives, both attacking and defending them, and not reward PvD, Siege humping and ignoring objectives at all.

They need to realize that there are many ways to improve WvW game play and the PvE Gimmicks are not one of them.

Gimmicks…make game easy even for awfull players that come for other games, and give them a chance and i think this is what gw2 is about.

Working only on rewards and ppk, is just like give sugar to a patient and tell that it is a medicine that cures of all his/her problems whiel the problems continue, game needs much more in depth things to do.

Um no, Gw was never about making it easier for players who suck, it was about reducing the grind and being able to come in and play with a top level character without having to play PvE to do so. That w as what set Gw1 apart.
It doesn’t " help" the individuals who suck due to anything that can be done by the individual can be done by the zerg, So in the end you just have the zerg all using the gimmicks against the few in addition to them sucking.

EVERYTHING implemented in the game mode should be expected to be used by the Zerg to their advantage and gauge how that affects the game mode prior to implementing such things. Gimmicks only make that worse for the individual, not better if you are playing on equally populated servers. If they actually solve the core issues with the game mode, every server will have a zerg, zergs will be attacking and defending fighting each other inside structures and will come back to defend their objectives due to it being worth their time and effort to do so. The individual will always be at a disadvantage to the zerg no matter how many gimmicks you implement, as it should be in a massive multiplayer PvP zone. The individual is not expected to survive or fight the zerg, if they are unfortunate enough not to get away from them and become road kill, they need to let their own zerg know where they are instead.

Well said.
I swear this whole thread feels like an argument between GW1 players and the generation where everyone gets a trophy. I

Shadelang.3012:

@Puck

Heres the thing I was getting at with the forums. Most players DON’T care enough about an issue to get on the forums and talk about it. The ones that do are usually unhappy. An unhappy player is statistically more likely to make a post than a happy one. That’s a recorded fact shown evidence of which is shown in every game forum ever made by ANY developer. So OBVIOUSLY the forum is going to have mostly negative comments inbetween “Discovery” phases (something new that shakes it up that causes actualy discussion eventually the discussion dies down and those that are unhappy with the current state of the game voice there opinions)

Again I wasn’t even REMOTELY trying to claim that HoT as a whole didn’t lower the WvW Population.

Whether the majority is against it or not is what doesn’t matter. You can fix a problem without taking a chainsaw to it. Something anet learned after Half the PvP forum spent a year and a half raging at them for one axe nerf after another. Nerfs that were brought on because the vocal minority had the floor and made it seem like the end of the world. Instead of rounding up every single aspect of HoT WvW and tossing it out the window we can look at what they did RIGHT and keep it. Even if we don’t fully agree with it. And don’t just say (Oh they got NOTHING right) now THAT is being dishonest.

I’m honestly struggling to think of one thing they did get right…
The only thing I can think of is the yak defence buff…. but even that’s screwed up since upgrades no longer rely on supply.
I know, I know, you still need X amount of yaks to make it in for an upgrade but that’s not the same as having to manage supply. You used to have to make hard decisions about whether you could start an upgrade, if you should save up more supply, if you should use supply for repairs or if you could hold out until an upgrade went through, etc.
It added depth to the game. Since that depth was removed I’ve never seen a fight over a yak. Players kill them if they happen across one but the small scale fights that took place over getting that needed supply into a keep just don’t happen anymore.

The better option is to bring back the alpine map without the garbage and then they can try inserting 1 new feature at a time.
That way players are getting new continuously getting new content to test and if it sucks Anet won’t get all kitten about removing it because it’s just 1 thing, not a whole bunch of kitten they are overly attached to.

Shadelang.3012:

And tell me puck. How much gold did you YOURSELF sink into upgrading towers and camps?

I can say with some certainty its atleast over a thousand for me. Even if it swaps back I probably won’t be helping out with that anymore. Most of the times I upgraded things it was simply because time had passed and no one else had bothered. Partly because it was felt that defending and objective simply had no meaning. After all there wasn’t any point in trying to hold a tower against a larger group unless you had an organized group yourself…atleast in the eyes of the player base.

You seem pretty eager to throw the word PvE around as if it means something. And your last few points its been pretty clear you don’t hold much respect for my opinion. (You aren’t exactly subtle)

I would list my credentials but the simple fact is you wouldn’t care. You have already made your decision. And you aren’t really reading what I am typing except to pick at it. Its pretty obvious in how your replies are now mostly thinly veiled insults.

Speaking of minority. I wonder how much of the playerbase actually CARES enough to come on to the forums to talk about the game. Last I checked the number of people that even got on to forums in the first place WERE the minority. So that in itself has no meaning here.

Sentries doing the work of scouts? No. Its sentries having a purpose and giving scouts the basic knowledge they need to do their job. (This sentry is alive. Meaning the enemies are probably gonna go through X route to get to Y Tower/Keep) it doesn’t take away anything from scouts. Sentries cover TINY portions of the map. But they cover routes letting the scouts focus on routes that AREN’T covered. And telling them what places are more at risk than others.

Structures getting upgraded on there own was purely a quality of life decision. After literally years of a select few people throwing gold in and getting nothing out of it. It wasn’t the Majority that upgraded towers and camps. It was the minority that happened to notice (Hey this isn’t upgrading and its full of supply. Let me do something with it)

Everything else in your post is pure vitriol in the hopes of discrediting the person your talking to. And your not even that good at hiding it.

All of my gold goes to WvW. I don’t have any legendaries, I have never even fully leveled a crafting profession. My money is spent on siege, food/utility buffs and (previously) upgrades. Even when I was hitting enemy bl’s I would start an upgrade in everything I flipped.
You previously spoke of using a bomb to blow up supply. We already had that. I can’t tell you how many times I would run to a camp or sit in a tower and drain the supply right in front of an enemy zerg, give them a little wave, and then escape and laugh spam when I was a safe distance. I’d frustrate them so much I’d get half the zerg chasing me.
That was removed from the game (unless you grind PvE to get GH upgrades to build your precious bomb).
As for you point about how many people come to the forums… it doesn’t matter. It’s clearly evident by the amount of player that have left the game that HoT was a failure. It’s clearly evident out of the players that do post, the majority do not enjoy the changes. You can try to say “but some do like it”, and “we don’t know exact numbers”, but that doesn’t kittening matter. If you can’t admit that the majority is against the HoT garbage than you are being dishonest with either us or yourself.

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

Edit: Thats the reason I am advocating* for atleast some of the new systems to say. The shield generator especially. If we could have defending the wall from the trebs with say 2 shield gens. The rest of our people would have been free to start making attacks on the tower.

If you had shield generators to completely nullify their trebs they wouldn’t have stuck around for a 2+ hour siege so everything else you said is irrelevant. They would have just moved on to something easy and there would be very little action anywhere. Sounds super fun, I bet people would love to log on for that. That is clearly why WvW is doing so well since HoT dropped.

Think about it, you had a force that severely outnumbered you and it still took them over 2 hours to bust a WP’d keep. That is an incredibly long time for a video game, and you are trying to argue that somehow that wasn’t fair for your side because of the mechanics….. really?

No thats not what I am trying to argue at all. I am not gonna say that we “Should” have won that fight in any way shape or form. We were out manned pretty heavily as you said. What I am saying is that there wasn’t any fun there ANYWAY. We held them. But none of us enjoyed doing it. Which made it less likely that any of us would be willing to go through it again.

I fully agree that we should have lost it. It just makes sense. But a feeling of helplessness if a video game is NOT a good thing.

At this point I’m convinced you don’t know what you want. What exactly would make you feel all warm and fuzzy about losing a keep to vastly superior numbers?
If it’s pulling a lever and having PvE gimmicks like an airship to come and bomb them for you then maybe you are playing the wrong game mode.

Quite litteraly all I have argued against is taking away EVERYTHING that HoT brought all at once. Start with the biggest offender. The map. THEN see if any of the other things are actually issues. You can see what many of the new stuff was built to address. But its hard to see if they actually DO anything to address those problems in the current state of the game. We can get rid of them if their* harmful for the game once we know for a fact that they are. Not just that their* tied into HoT and bad by default.

Edit: I mean hell. Even the scientific method we all learned back in GRADE school taught to change things one at a time or you may not learn what actually made the change you observed.

We’ve literally already tested every one of these changes on EB….. Just to clarify…. EB is a pre-existing map….

Yes. And I and my friends atleast have had positive interactions with most of them. The airship wasn’t some massive game changer unless we made it into one (Meaning it was still our own gameplay that made it into more than just a lightshow). The chill field bought time but was easily counterable and didn’t do much more that limit mobility for a short time.

The auto upgrade system has been a godsend to me. And the yak escort buff made it possible to protect yaks from things like permastealth condi thieves. Forcing them to fight me first. Making escorting a yak actually have meaning.

The shield generator’s help deal with treb spam from red keep. (from the treb locations that cant be reached with aoes) But there still bypassable. And they don’t prevent SMC from being taken by any means. They just make it so that a more personal approach is necessary (Meaning fights are more likely) rather than letting trebs do all the work for you.

Sentries actually have purpose. Which they havn’t since day 1 besides granting a bit of free karma. They were more useful to the enemy team than they were to there own team (Clearing one side of sentries to trick the team they belong to sending scouts there while you hit something on the other side of the map).

The biggest offenders I saw were dragon banners and speedy yaks. Both of which I FULLY AGREE need to be tuned down. Or if they still stay game breaking can be reworked. But there are aspects of the system that are more beneficial than harmful. And its those I wan’t to preserve.

Edit: The Bomb on the supply hut is also once of THE most satisfying things to have work when you watch and enemy zerg steamroll a location you just spent an hour escorting yaks to. Atleast you cost them something for it. Supply if nothing else forcing them to restock elsewhere.

You and a handful of other enjoy it but you are in the minority.
I bet if they gave siege razor some minions to build and man siege for him and let him k-train the whole map, there would be plenty of PvE players that enjoyed that too. Maybe when you joined his squad it gave you an option to auto follow him and spam skills like an eotm zergling anytime you got near an enemy.
That way all you would have to do is log onto the game and let it play itself. Plenty of rewards, no thinking involved.
Maybe that could have been the solution for when you were hopelessly outmanned at garri. They would have had to break off some of the zerg to deal with siegerazor’s k-train.
I personally think it would be ridiculous but it’s no more ridiculous than having sentries do the work of scouts or having structures upgrade on their own.

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

Edit: Thats the reason I am advocating* for atleast some of the new systems to say. The shield generator especially. If we could have defending the wall from the trebs with say 2 shield gens. The rest of our people would have been free to start making attacks on the tower.

If you had shield generators to completely nullify their trebs they wouldn’t have stuck around for a 2+ hour siege so everything else you said is irrelevant. They would have just moved on to something easy and there would be very little action anywhere. Sounds super fun, I bet people would love to log on for that. That is clearly why WvW is doing so well since HoT dropped.

Think about it, you had a force that severely outnumbered you and it still took them over 2 hours to bust a WP’d keep. That is an incredibly long time for a video game, and you are trying to argue that somehow that wasn’t fair for your side because of the mechanics….. really?

No thats not what I am trying to argue at all. I am not gonna say that we “Should” have won that fight in any way shape or form. We were out manned pretty heavily as you said. What I am saying is that there wasn’t any fun there ANYWAY. We held them. But none of us enjoyed doing it. Which made it less likely that any of us would be willing to go through it again.

I fully agree that we should have lost it. It just makes sense. But a feeling of helplessness if a video game is NOT a good thing.

At this point I’m convinced you don’t know what you want. What exactly would make you feel all warm and fuzzy about losing a keep to vastly superior numbers?
If it’s pulling a lever and having PvE gimmicks like an airship to come and bomb them for you then maybe you are playing the wrong game mode.

Quite litteraly all I have argued against is taking away EVERYTHING that HoT brought all at once. Start with the biggest offender. The map. THEN see if any of the other things are actually issues. You can see what many of the new stuff was built to address. But its hard to see if they actually DO anything to address those problems in the current state of the game. We can get rid of them if their* harmful for the game once we know for a fact that they are. Not just that their* tied into HoT and bad by default.

Edit: I mean hell. Even the scientific method we all learned back in GRADE school taught to change things one at a time or you may not learn what actually made the change you observed.

We’ve literally already tested every one of these changes on EB….. Just to clarify…. EB is a pre-existing map….

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

Edit: Thats the reason I am advocating* for atleast some of the new systems to say. The shield generator especially. If we could have defending the wall from the trebs with say 2 shield gens. The rest of our people would have been free to start making attacks on the tower.

If you had shield generators to completely nullify their trebs they wouldn’t have stuck around for a 2+ hour siege so everything else you said is irrelevant. They would have just moved on to something easy and there would be very little action anywhere. Sounds super fun, I bet people would love to log on for that. That is clearly why WvW is doing so well since HoT dropped.

Think about it, you had a force that severely outnumbered you and it still took them over 2 hours to bust a WP’d keep. That is an incredibly long time for a video game, and you are trying to argue that somehow that wasn’t fair for your side because of the mechanics….. really?

No thats not what I am trying to argue at all. I am not gonna say that we “Should” have won that fight in any way shape or form. We were out manned pretty heavily as you said. What I am saying is that there wasn’t any fun there ANYWAY. We held them. But none of us enjoyed doing it. Which made it less likely that any of us would be willing to go through it again.

I fully agree that we should have lost it. It just makes sense. But a feeling of helplessness if a video game is NOT a good thing.

At this point I’m convinced you don’t know what you want. What exactly would make you feel all warm and fuzzy about losing a keep to vastly superior numbers?
If it’s pulling a lever and having PvE gimmicks like an airship to come and bomb them for you then maybe you are playing the wrong game mode.

Shadelang.3012:

“If the defense is adequate the attackers move on, if the attackers are too much for the defenders they give up immediately. How does this equate to a better system in your mind?”

And how would it be ANY different WITHOUT the new systems? Wouldn’t it still play out exactly the same? Then wouldn’t giving players more tools to use to try to break the stagnancy be a good thing instead of taking them away?

It clearly wouldn’t play out the same way. Your own story of spending 2 and a half hours defending a keep is proof of that. Players were more invested in their keeps before and would do everything they could to fight for them, just as attackers were more interested in breaking their WP’s to take deny them the ability to quickly travel around the map.
The system you are arguing for has failed hard. Yes WvW was slowly losing players due to stagnation but HoT drove off probably a good 50% (or more) of the remaining players. New content should excite people, not drive them off in record numbers.

Shadelang.3012:

Edit: Thats the reason I am advocating* for atleast some of the new systems to say. The shield generator especially. If we could have defending the wall from the trebs with say 2 shield gens. The rest of our people would have been free to start making attacks on the tower.

If you had shield generators to completely nullify their trebs they wouldn’t have stuck around for a 2+ hour siege so everything else you said is irrelevant. They would have just moved on to something easy and there would be very little action anywhere. Sounds super fun, I bet people would love to log on for that. That is clearly why WvW is doing so well since HoT dropped.

Think about it, you had a force that severely outnumbered you and it still took them over 2 hours to bust a WP’d keep. That is an incredibly long time for a video game, and you are trying to argue that somehow that wasn’t fair for your side because of the mechanics….. really?

Shadelang.3012:

Puck.9612:

Shadelang.3012:

I guess we remember different games then. Because what I remember was watching the walls on my Garri fall after defending it non stop for 2 and a half hours with absolutely nothing to show for it.

A 2 and a half hour fight for a keep is a reward in itself compared to what HoT turned the game into…
Maybe that’s where you and I differ, I would upgrade and defend things because I enjoyed the battles like this that it led to (win or lose). I didn’t do it just to watch the PPT tick away.
If you want to sit in an empty keep all day and watch the enemy k-train move on by because they don’t feel like dealing with stupid kitten like the airship…. I just don’t know what to tell you… we obviously enjoy different things and will never agree on this subject.
However it does seem like the majority of the WvW player base agrees with me on this subject and prefer fights to PvE mechanics that discourage fights and lead to k-trains, so for the health of the game maybe you should just accept that the HoT system is hurting WvW and quit trying to defend it.

When did I say I want that. I perhaps phrased my point wrong. That was 2 and a half hours of doing NOTHING. of sitting there dumping supply into a wall hoping more people would log on. Because my server simply didn’t have the numbers to succesfully push out. So all we could do was repair the wall the trebs were hitting for 2 and a half hours until they eventually just took and held every camp on the map and we were drained dry.

If it had been two and a half hours of fighting I would have been ECSTATIC. I would have spent the rest of that game session in a good mood likely because that would have been incredibly fun.

But that isn’t what I got. It was 2 and a half hours of frustration. Of listening to my entire server have a mental breakdown in the teamspeak. All because there simply wasn’t anything we could do at that time. We just didn’t have the tools to make a difference.

Why were you dumping supply into a wall that was being trebbed instead of building counter siege, or sending players to go make attempts on their keeps to try and draw them off the map? If you spent 2 hours repairing a wall that is more your fault than it is the games.

Really what you are complaining about there is how unbalanced the matches and populations can be. That has nothing to do with pre vs. post HoT systems. That same scenario can still happen now, it just rarely does because no one cares enough to spend 2+ hours on a keep when the enemy server will get their WP back immediately.

If the defense is adequate the attackers move on, if the attackers are too much for the defenders they give up immediately. How does this equate to a better system in your mind?

Shadelang.3012:

I guess we remember different games then. Because what I remember was watching the walls on my Garri fall after defending it non stop for 2 and a half hours with absolutely nothing to show for it.

A 2 and a half hour fight for a keep is a reward in itself compared to what HoT turned the game into…
Maybe that’s where you and I differ, I would upgrade and defend things because I enjoyed the battles like this that it led to (win or lose). I didn’t do it just to watch the PPT tick away.
If you want to sit in an empty keep all day and watch the enemy k-train move on by because they don’t feel like dealing with stupid kitten like the airship…. I just don’t know what to tell you… we obviously enjoy different things and will never agree on this subject.
However it does seem like the majority of the WvW player base agrees with me on this subject and prefer fights to PvE mechanics that discourage fights and lead to k-trains, so for the health of the game maybe you should just accept that the HoT system is hurting WvW and quit trying to defend it.

Dayra.7405:

Fixed number of maps is an inherent design-mistake of WvW.

Fix that and WvW would feel alive, do not fix it and it stays dead.

Do you really want EotM as test ground for WvW? I would think it’s horrible to let EotM people test and accept/reject what should go into WvW

I absolutely want a place for devs to test out their bad ideas before implementing them in WvW. If they were actually performing tests there I would go play it and give them feedback. I know a lot of my friends would as well. If they had done this pre HoT we might not be stuck with the stupid banners, airship, and all the other crap.

Valky.2574:

So WvW is dead and the only active place is EOTM and you want to destroy that to ?
lol

What makes you think putting the deserted bl in rotation for eotm would destroy it? It’s full of the PvE gimmicks those players enjoy. I bet if they ever got the dino skyhammer to work properly the k-trainers would love it. Less siege to worry about.

lil devils x.6071:

Puck.9612:

X T D.6458:

Puck.9612:

X T D.6458:

Sich.7103:

AC are fine…. You need 2 or 3 sups ac to really kill ennemy players….
1 AC alone do just nothing, it’s just good to kill proxy cata, and useless against ram. Even 2 ACs are not enough against ram. Basic AC are just useless.

I’m for limiting the max siege on the same spot at 3, for every siege. This should be fine.

I think at least lowering the damage and target limit would at bring them in line, I dont have a problem with them getting a small buff in damage against siege. But In its current form, its ridiculously unbalanced especially considering how many can be used at once in an area.

Why would you want to lower the target limit?

One of the reasons for this is because of the current siege cap. When you can have multiple ac’s spamming ranged skills that can each hit 50 players at a time. Nothing should have a target limit of 50, especially when its spammable by multiple people. This is just part of the imbalance.

Yeah…. I understand how ac’s work… that wasn’t the question.
Why do you think 50 people that don’t have the common sense to move out of ac fire (or to destroy the ac) shouldn’t be hit by it?
This is how aoe is supposed to work. The only reason the aoe limit is so small on other skills is because supposedly if they removed the limit the calculations would lag the game, and instead of coming up with a proper solution the devs chose this lazy way to patch it.

Often players think about it from the perspective of " Ac vs Zerg", what you should consider though that is not the issue, the issue is Zerg on ACs vs anyone not on ACs.. LOL the best way to solve this is to take away LOOT, XP and PPK for siege damage on players and greatly increase Xp PPK and LOOT for players who are not. That way you can have Zerg vs Zerg instead of everyone else VS Zerg on AC’s.
You always have to keep in mind that anything the individual can do, the zerg can do in mass. If you properly place AC’s, Bali’s cats and trebs you have a kill box where no one can get close enough to AOE any of them.

I have no problem with lowering the rewards for using them. I’m not arguing that people should sit on them instead of fighting. My personal belief is that you resort to ac’s when the numbers make fighting impossible and you have something worth defending. Even in those situation I prefer someone else take the ac’s so I can go pick off the fat kids at the back of the zerg.
I just don’t agree with lowering their aoe limit.

Dawdler.8521:

MSFone.3026:

Scrapper gets my vote, that’s all they seem to do is knickknack/pull people and do zero dmg and never die.

Not even close. Scrappers cant outrun you.

You only ever really have to run so far. Depending on their build scrappers have multiple access to stealth, double elixer s, blocks, super speed, etc. My buddy has been running around with elixer r and if he sees he is about to go down he just drops it and uses the stealth gyro. By the time they get the gyro down he is already ressed and gone.

I almost never die on my scrapper and at best I would call myself mediocre on it.

X T D.6458:

Puck.9612:

X T D.6458:

Sich.7103:

AC are fine…. You need 2 or 3 sups ac to really kill ennemy players….
1 AC alone do just nothing, it’s just good to kill proxy cata, and useless against ram. Even 2 ACs are not enough against ram. Basic AC are just useless.

I’m for limiting the max siege on the same spot at 3, for every siege. This should be fine.

I think at least lowering the damage and target limit would at bring them in line, I dont have a problem with them getting a small buff in damage against siege. But In its current form, its ridiculously unbalanced especially considering how many can be used at once in an area.

Why would you want to lower the target limit?

One of the reasons for this is because of the current siege cap. When you can have multiple ac’s spamming ranged skills that can each hit 50 players at a time. Nothing should have a target limit of 50, especially when its spammable by multiple people. This is just part of the imbalance.

Yeah…. I understand how ac’s work… that wasn’t the question.
Why do you think 50 people that don’t have the common sense to move out of ac fire (or to destroy the ac) shouldn’t be hit by it?
This is how aoe is supposed to work. The only reason the aoe limit is so small on other skills is because supposedly if they removed the limit the calculations would lag the game, and instead of coming up with a proper solution the devs chose this lazy way to patch it.

RlyOsim.2497:

#aprilfools

Message Body length must at least be 15.

+1

/stupid forum bug

RIP AR, I had some really good times there…

X T D.6458:

Sich.7103:

AC are fine…. You need 2 or 3 sups ac to really kill ennemy players….
1 AC alone do just nothing, it’s just good to kill proxy cata, and useless against ram. Even 2 ACs are not enough against ram. Basic AC are just useless.

I’m for limiting the max siege on the same spot at 3, for every siege. This should be fine.

I think at least lowering the damage and target limit would at bring them in line, I dont have a problem with them getting a small buff in damage against siege. But In its current form, its ridiculously unbalanced especially considering how many can be used at once in an area.

Why would you want to lower the target limit?

DeWolfe.2174:

Puck.9612:

wall of whine

EotM is now an established game mode and not something for the Dev’s to toy with. If anything, regular WvW has sadly become the more expendable mode. Just because you personally never liked EotM, doesn’t mean you are more important than an entire mode.

Btw, a BL map is not designed around a balanced three way fight. A balanced 3 way is an essential requirement for an EotM map. So no, the Desert or Alpine BL map cannot be used for EotM at all.

As I posted above, this request comes from individuals that have had it in for EotM since it launched. That’s why such it’s such an illogical request.

Just because a few bad players that can’t hang in real WvW have chosen to go there and farm uplevels doesn’t make it an established game mode. EotM isn’t anymore of an established game mode than the queensdale champ train was… The map has 2 purposes, serve as an overflow for WvW queue times and serve as a testing ground.

You say the deserted map isn’t balanced for a 3 way fight but you each team already starts with their own keep, and they are going to be actively changing the map, what’s to say they don’t make it completely balanced for a three way?

MSFone.3026:

Puck.9612:

…and bring back the alpine map without the HoT crap. Seriously… go read what everyone was actually requesting. We are tired of the stupid banners and terrible upgrade/wp changes.

EotM was supposed to be the testing ground for WvW changes, you can test out whatever you want there without disrupting WvW. That’s where the deserted bl belongs. Don’t make us keep waiting, we are tired of hearing things will be fixed “soon”.

NO! EotM map is hilariously awesome, Desert BL’s are just crap, delete them don’t use them to wreck something else.

Seriously worst idea, why would you suggest this over “get rid of desert BL altogether and bring back alpine.” Why try to wreck another part of the game?

EotM map is pretty terrible, sadly it is still better than the garbage desert map. However the dev’s aren’t willing to give up on the desert map and the EotM is supposed to be a testing ground for WvW so that is where changes to their crap map need to be tested.

The short matches mean they can change things without interfering with the week long WvW battles. They could even just put the new variations of the desert map in for a week to get feedback and then return the EotM map for a week or 2 while they make changes based on the feedback.

And let’s be real, most of the EotM players wouldn’t even notice the difference. I went there for a couple hours the other day to level an alt, I sent a guy flying off a ledge and I saw 3 people jump off after him….. (trying to kill him?)…. kittening 3 people leaped to their own deaths after a guy that was already dead.

Jayne.9251:

Puck.9612:

Kungsmurfen.2861:

I for one am not going to go back to doing all the upgrading for an entire server. No thx.

That’s fine, I’ll do it.

The only change the upgrade system ever needed was to change the gold cost to karma or badges. Auto upgrades and instant waypoints are a kittening joke.

I like and dislike this idea.

We all know that some mindless zergling isn’t going to cough up his precious badges or karma and contribute. The ones who will don’t typically zerg.

So with finite resources of karma/badges, it will eventually mean stuff just doesn’t get upgraded, because the regular upgraders ran out of badges.

I like it because it forces those selfless folks to go just have fun. But I don’t like it because at least with gold costs, some folks would send others funds in a pinch.

Plus badges for siege already ….

Y’know?

Edit: Per the OP, aside from the current hot gate and wall durability increase and sentry alert system, I agree, no hot stuff in alpine pls.

I was thinking you would talk to the npc and there would be an option to pay with either karma or badges. Let the player decide.
There could always be a third option for gold for those that prefer that…. I’m just always sitting on millions of karma, even after converting several mill to gold I never run out because I get bored of clicking.

Aeolus.3615:

Lowering native damage means that lot of groups will stand still inside AC shower as if nothing was hitting them, humm even inside toxic some groups can stand and needs several AC to stack good poison stack.
On sup ac ic damage lower than 1k, sometimes arround 750-900, max arround 2.5k.

Before nerf/abalance AC damage A lot of things need to chang.
.

That’s why I suggested giving a damage buff that’s dependent on the amount of players around who the ac is hitting.
Zergs would end up being hit even harder, or they would have to spread out which means they lose the protection from the 5 man aoe limit.
At the same time you wouldn’t have groups hiding behind ac’s instead of coming out to fight roamers because the ac’s would be ineffective against small parties.

Sviel.7493:

Dawdler.8521:

Sviel.7493:

At any rate, were you able to defend all of Alpine with just 5 people?

5 people could easily control and scout entire Alpine with minimal movement, requesting reinforcements in time.

On Desert you need 5 people just to scout undercroft and you will probably still miss the 20 people already on the lord.

The size difference and layout is actually quite massive.

I don’t think such exaggeration is helpful.

Puck

On multiple occasions I held hills by myself against groups of 20-30. I would use a good number of siege disablers and mortars/counter siege to destroy anything they had built or send them flying off the cliff.

I used to love going to an enemy bl and ninja’ing hills and then upgrading it to get its wp. I would get roaming fights for hours from people trying to cut off camps or try to take the keep back.
When they did call in the map blob I’d send out word to our own commanders that they could come join in the fight or go bust one of their other way points while they are distracted.

Those 20-30 people couldn’t have had half a brain between them ._.

Had they been on the switch back they’d have been safe from ACs and mortars and you would have had to jump out of the walls to siege disable—but you wouldn’t have been able to get all the catas at once. Also, being knocked back there is a much smaller drop that is non-lethal. Once through outer, the rest would be cake.

But I dunno, maybe you’re superman. If I recall, you weren’t in a boondocks tier, but ninja’ing Hills as a roamer really shouldn’t happen.

Usually when it was a large group like that it’s generous to say they had half a brain between them. It was rarely a competent guild group, they were out looking for fights. More often it was the pug tag who went straight for the easy spot because pugs are dumb and it takes them 20 minutes to walk to the siege sight and put their supply into it.
But the switchback could usually be hit by the 5 shot on the mortars, if they really had it tucked against the wall and I wasn’t getting enough hits on it I could still stealth disable over and over again to annoy the hell out of them.
But I’m gonna go with I’m Superman.

TheGrimm.5624:

That said never appreciated it when after spending a lot of coin upgrading a BL to have an enemy K-Train come along and just flip it back.

That’s exactly why that system is necessary. You invested time and effort into the upgrades and you cared about defending them. No one kittening cares now.

TheGrimm.5624:

HazyDaisy.4107:

However, most real wvw’ers are dead set against the KTrains and quote unquote gimmicks that come with eotm.

I like how people keep using “ninja” in regards to taking empty objectives in ABL, the other translation is K-Train. Does it have value to take them, sometimes if a server is going for PPT and sometimes for attacking another objective. But also it was quite often used by people avoiding fights to get karma and loot. Still remember whole guilds going to empty maps to take it over. Did they break up and take it in one swoop, no, they zerged each one down one by one and then moved to the next empty BL. Call a spade a spade at least.

I call it ninja when I’m solo or with a small group. Such as when my 5 man group caught the 2 opposing servers fighting over 1 of their fully upgraded hills. They both had big kitten blobs, the attacking server had busted through outer but the inner was full of so much siege they couldn’t make much head way and were stuck trying to build cata’s on the outer wall.
My group stealthed past the zergs, ran around to north inner, rammed it open, and snuck in while they zergs were fighting. We stealthed into lords room and managed to get the lord down to about 10% before anyone noticed, but at that point so much of their zerg was distracted or dead that they could only about 10 of them made it in to stop us and we easily wiped the floor with them and stole the keep.
That was kittening ninja.

Or sometimes it’s as simple as when I have spent the past few hours by myself harassing a bl, tapping the wp’s over and over, flipping camps, etc. and then I sneak through a sneaky cata spot, leave the keep, resume tapping things on the other side of the map to draw their attention, come back to get inner down, and solo the lord.

Either way, it’s never a k-train. And most the time if I did take a keep I would start upgrading it because at that point the fights are coming to me and I have the terrain advantage.

I say lower the damage by 50% ….. but increase the damage a player receives by 5% for every friendly player within 900 units of them.

Kungsmurfen.2861:

I for one am not going to go back to doing all the upgrading for an entire server. No thx.

That’s fine, I’ll do it.

The only change the upgrade system ever needed was to change the gold cost to karma or badges. Auto upgrades and instant waypoints are a kittening joke.

Sviel.7493:

Jana.6831:

You’re wrong on this.
We had hour long fights around objectives, sometimes even for days because everything could be countered. Bay couldn’t counter Briar though – that was the only case.
The ABLS were a lot more strategical than DBL not only when it comes to siege, also camps.

Listen to yourself. Carefully.

Jana.6831:

You’re wrong on this.
We had hour long fights around objectives, sometimes even for days because everything could be countered. Bay couldn’t counter Briar though – that was the only case.
The ABLS were a lot more strategical than DBL not only when it comes to siege, also camps.

You had fights because they were the only way to defend. The walls were barely an obstacle—especially since getting them to fortify is nigh impossible under pressure. The fights were not because everything could be countered but because there was no other choice. Also, people like fights. Every encounter on Alpine was just a fight with a few walls for scenery. It was great for about 3 hours when everyone had the maps queued and then it was awful depending on who had the most pop at the moment.

Now, I don’t want to diminish fights. No matter what happens, fights are going to be the best way to defend because they don’t cost supply and don’t incur supply damage. However, since even in prime time the home team is potentially outnumbered 2:1, fights should not be the only way to defend. To be clear, fights should be the only way to defend indefinitely, but not the only way to defend at all. A good server should bring enough people that it can fight and focus on whichever part of its map needs to recover supply from holding out until the fight can happen. This has the added bonus of letting off-hours players hold out better against the Karma Train.

Can you expound on how Alpine had more tactical depth in terms of siege/camps? I’m not sure what you mean by the first and have no idea what you mean by the second, so I don’t want to make assumptions.

On multiple occasions I held hills by myself against groups of 20-30. I would use a good number of siege disablers and mortars/counter siege to destroy anything they had built or send them flying off the cliff.

I used to love going to an enemy bl and ninja’ing hills and then upgrading it to get its wp. I would get roaming fights for hours from people trying to cut off camps or try to take the keep back.
When they did call in the map blob I’d send out word to our own commanders that they could come join in the fight or go bust one of their other way points while they are distracted.

TheGrimm.5624:

Again. EoTM has one of the highest populations. I don’t see those players out here asking for a change and since most WvW players consider it PvE, leave it alone unless you are going to add it to the base WvW scoring system.

" Edge of the Mists serves as a testing ground for the new features that may be introduced to WvW"
Straight from the official wiki. Let eotm actually be used for its intended purpose so the rest of us can get back to enjoying WvW.
I doubt the majority of the pugs will even notice they are on a different map as long as they have someone to lead the karma train.

No one payed for the deserted bl. That was introduced after the game went free to play.
A lot of people payed for the alpine map and enjoyed it for years before Anet decided to replace it with some gimmicky untested mess of a map.
Hell I pre ordered the alpine map the first day gw2 was available.

Emtiarbi.3281:

Is there a possibility of adding the dessert borderland as a PvE Map?

It already is a pve map. Go check it out yourself, the only thing you’ll see are npc’s and annoying pve mechanics.

…and bring back the alpine map without the HoT crap. Seriously… go read what everyone was actually requesting. We are tired of the stupid banners and terrible upgrade/wp changes.

EotM was supposed to be the testing ground for WvW changes, you can test out whatever you want there without disrupting WvW. That’s where the deserted bl belongs. Don’t make us keep waiting, we are tired of hearing things will be fixed “soon”.

Dawdler.8521:

Mike O Brien.4613:

Two weeks ago we polled the WvW community about Desert versus Alpine borderlands. The majority of players asked us to bring Alpine back. We’ll do that. It actually takes quite a bit of time to dust off old content and bring it up to the current game state, so it won’t happen in time for the quarterly release. Instead we’ll launch the quarterly update with improvements to Desert, use that as an opportunity to get the community’s feedback on those changes, then we’ll swap to Alpine when it’s ready. Changing borderlands maps like this will disrupt matches in progress, but we think that making changes on live servers, where everyone can test, is worth the cost.

Ah but there is no cost as long as you freeze glicko. Testing on live is great. We need a little break every now and then from the “serious” WvW, just like sPvP. Hell even another Golem Week™ is acceptable if it doesnt impact the matchups.

Absolutely no more kittening golem weeks….

Could you please just put the alpine back without kittening it up with the stupid HoT crap?
If you actually payed attention to what the wvw players were requesting you would realize we are tired of the broken kitten you introduced. No kittening banners, tactivators, or auto upgrades. Just give us our dammed map back.

TheLastNobody.8319:

…actually now I think about it the size of DB does make sense IF HoT had been successful in pulling people into WvW.

The size would have made sense if they added more camps and structures.
In the alpine map you had incentive to hold the keeps and towers. The keeps provided wp’s for faster travel and the towers were in treb range of the keeps.
In the deserted bl all they were was ppt, and you’re one wp was given to you as soon as you flipped the structure back.

@op
It’s not so much that the alpine is loved, it’s just that the deserted bl fails as a wvw map and is full of annoying mechanics.

gennyt.3428:

Sviel.7493:

I think Anet realizes that they are at a turning point in WvW. It has been put off for so long that they must make an effort now or, effectively, scrap it. It seems like they’ve chosen to put the effort in.

That’s not to say WvW won’t be put on hold again…just that we’re due for some updates before that happens, at least.

What’s given you the impression that they’re choosing to put in the effort? Not trying to be a smartkitten, honest question.

I heard big changes are coming “soon”
You act like that’s something they’ve told us before…

Shala.8352:

Puck.9612:

Shala.8352:

Do you really want me to start posting ALL the condi autoprocs? You would probably get to the conclusion that to avoid a condi burst, the opponent must be on a perma dodge!!!!

….What? Are you considering a condi burst anytime you get any conditions on you?

You aren’t going to avoid 100% of the damage, just like if you face a power build you won’t avoid 100% of the damage. You need to learn what you can ignore and what needs to be dodged/blocked/evaded/cleansed.

Gottchaaa XD XD
So you admit that the condi cleanse alone is not the counter to condi based builds^^
The problem is that not only the burst can come from not easy visible animarions skills, but potentialy from many procs at the same time, so potentialy from any action^^

Now inevitably comes the counter question: is toghness alone able to counter power builds? Oh god yes! that plus the amazing spam of boon we had with hots is the reason we had bunker meta last season in pvp! Oh no wait for real you only need one thing to absolutely obliterate power builds: weakness, wich is kinda spammable don’t you think?

Aniway i’m keeping talking to you guys about this, but you don’t seem to understand, i give up. I only know one thing: if condi requires so much skill, why every condi player i meet refuse to go power build against me? Cuz if he can win me with condi build, would be a piece of cake killing me with power build right? Or is it just a matter of counterplays?? How many times i have to repeat myself? CLASSES ARE NOT BALANCED ON DEALING WITH CONDITION DAMAGE, POINT!! And this is the reason noobs are carried by condi dmg.

My last chance then i give up, it’s useless to demonstrate how unfunny condition dmg is, cuz you probably are slow finger/brain and you are having fun while killing people while beeing relaxed in a safe spot with your tanky condi build, so i leave you with my spamm video, and keep thinking you are pro by roaming with condi build, to me you just want to run with a faceroll build:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVO1okVpj2Q

Shala.8352:

Do you really want me to start posting ALL the condi autoprocs? You would probably get to the conclusion that to avoid a condi burst, the opponent must be on a perma dodge!!!!

….What? Are you considering a condi burst anytime you get any conditions on you?

You aren’t going to avoid 100% of the damage, just like if you face a power build you won’t avoid 100% of the damage. You need to learn what you can ignore and what needs to be dodged/blocked/evaded/cleansed.

Dusty Moon.4382:

Puck.9612:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Heartpains.7312:

I do not get your point exactly Dusty, but I suppose it is something like golems/class thing affecting the other, such as the Mesmer’s phantasm damage getting increased while you are in the golem, these are not big issues and can be fixed, but that’s not my point, I just want the 25% movement speed can throw it anywhere even in the golem mastery. =)

Also many things are/were issues because anet didn’t care to fix wvw bugs ><

Well, A golem is a piece of siege and as such, should replace the effects of the player’s armor, etc. that is using it.

Mesmers’ and portals, that is what is used.

This is a MINOR problem. There are more major things that should be addressed first, in reality.

It’s a minor thing but it was a dumb thing for them to change.
I feel like it was another one of those things that was only changed to encourage people to buy HoT.
Take away 25% speed buff
Give new specializations (like scrapper, tempest, etc.) ability to grant golems super speed.

Sorry – you can’t give golems superspeed or any speed buff as they are siege. They get granted the buff themselves when they break through a gate. That is how it works.

I don’t mind this as Golems are so hard to kill by players. Also, as I said, Golems before could use certain weapons and skills so they were broken now they are working as intended.

Go try it.
Unless they changed it very recently you can give them super speed but not swiftness.

Dusty Moon.4382:

Heartpains.7312:

I do not get your point exactly Dusty, but I suppose it is something like golems/class thing affecting the other, such as the Mesmer’s phantasm damage getting increased while you are in the golem, these are not big issues and can be fixed, but that’s not my point, I just want the 25% movement speed can throw it anywhere even in the golem mastery. =)

Also many things are/were issues because anet didn’t care to fix wvw bugs ><

Well, A golem is a piece of siege and as such, should replace the effects of the player’s armor, etc. that is using it.

Mesmers’ and portals, that is what is used.

This is a MINOR problem. There are more major things that should be addressed first, in reality.

It’s a minor thing but it was a dumb thing for them to change.
I feel like it was another one of those things that was only changed to encourage people to buy HoT.
Take away 25% speed buff
Give new specializations (like scrapper, tempest, etc.) ability to grant golems super speed.

I rarely waste my time with a condi mez. I’ll poke at them and if they are halfway competent I just cleanse and move on. They can’t chase you down to kill you.

I see them the same way I see full soldier daredevils, or the old nike warriors. They are more of an annoyance than they are dangerous. They are trollish builds that are only effective if you play their game.

Mypinkbunny.4513:

I have an issue with builds that spam condi’s, i play a druid and even i cant surive a condi mez or a condi reaper. If your 3 or 4 man roaming group runs in to a group running 2 or more condi people your kittened. It needs looking at or capping condi back to 25 stacks. Its to cheese to fight against it.

My druid runs circles around condi reapers. This isn’t SPvP where you are trying to contest a point, keep your distance, use your stealth, keep your pets in between the reaper and yourself. They take time to die because of DS but druid has the advantage in that fight.

If you have a bunch of cracked jars that are leaking water faster than you can put it in, would you waste your time trying to make sure they have an equal amount, or would you try and seal the cracks first?

If they eliminate servers they will drive more people away.
If they eliminate too many servers you will start seeing huge EB queues during NA prime, forcing people to play the kittenty deserted bl, kittenty EotM, or kittenty PvE while they wait. A lot of people will just log off instead.

They need to fix the bigger problems first (which includes kitten near everything they’ve done since the stability change). Once they make the game playable again we will get a better idea of what the population for each server is. At that point they should remove all of them and come back with (fewer) new servers with different names.

STIHL.2489:

Ahratan.1098:

Boring mechanics and Stability
There are too many skills in the game which are frankly zero fun to be on the wrong end of. Knockdowns, knockbacks, stuns, etc. And there’s only two remedies, stunbreakers and stability: the former is usually a one-off with a long cd and the latter is not easily available to everyone.

So you see the problem: lots of boring effects and no good way of stopping them.

Then HOT came along and added a ton more of these boring effects. And also stability got nerfed.

You see how the problem got worse.

If you’re going to have so many boring control effects, stability needs to be widely available. On loads of abilities, on runes, in new WvW skills, everywhere.

This is a very solid point.

I presented an idea like this, with special WvW Vendors.

STIHL.2489:

3: Even More Reward.

Lets be real, nothing says “validation” more than having your own little items reserved for you. In this front I believe that Badges of Honor and Proof of Heroics should be the currency for “Invader” gear. However, I believe like Tiered Cultural Armor, what should be Offered is Tiered Invader Items.

What this means is that each Tier of Invader has their own Merchant with their Own Prices, that provides Exclusive Gear just for them. However, you can always access lower tier merchants, IE: A Silver Tiered player can still buy from the Bronze Tier Merchant.

What should be Offered:
Armor – and as opposed to it being solid in various sets, just set the armor to pick you own stats.
Weapons – Same Deal as Armor
Commander Tags
Food – Effects that are WvW Centric, IE: +5% Damage with Siege, +5 Supply Capacity
Oils – Effects that are WvW Centric. (See above)
Back Skins – Flags, Banner Poles, Etc.
Shoulder Skins- Flags, Banners, Etc.
Bracer Skins – Flags, Banners, Etc.
Siege – IE: Silver and Above Could buy Superior at Discounted Prices, Platinum and Above could buy Legendary Siege.

While anyone could buy the Standard Invader Armor currently available, with Each Tier starting with Bronze, would have their own Unique Skin Set for Armor. While the Weapons would be the same Skin, I propose that each tier has their own noticeable color theme.

I am sure this might take time, and my suggestion should be put in, Top Down, IE: Put in the Stuff for Diamond Tier First, and Then work down to Bronze Tier. That way, people can have something to work for, while no one is left with the “Well when do us Diamond Players get stuff?” I mean all know that if you play WvW long enough you will get Diamond Tier eventually. So put that in First, and let them know, more is coming.

This also stops people from just going into WvW to farm for Badges and Proofs, thinking they are just gonna buy something.. Nope.. gotta earn that new shiny!

If they added in a series of Runes and Infusions that lets say, offered resistances, counters, and in some cases Immunity to Control Effects in WvW, for higher tier raiders, this would counter this very problem.

IE:
Rune of the Borderland Scout
Power +25
Run Speed +10%
Power +50
Run Speed +20%
Power +100
Gain 3 stacks of Stability when Stunned, Immobilized, or Slowed

Infusion of the Golden Commander
-8% Duration of all immobilizing effects.

I mean these are rough ideas, and would need to be adjusted to make them more inline to match the game mechanics, and not be too powerful or make people to immune to builds, but given since you can have a totally different build set up in WvW then PvE or PvP, it might really balance out the WvW playing field, like anything, it would need to be tested, and checked on how well it worked, so that it did not totally kitten the balance in some other direction, like making any control effect worthless.

InB4 they add this rune as something you have to grind for in silverwastes or a HoT map.

They should just base the armor on wvw ranks. Something like every 500 levels gives you a chest that lets you select 1 piece of armor, weapon, or back piece.
Take into consideration current ranks so vets can get what they’re owed.

Sirendor.1394:

Dawdler.8521:

Well EU tier 9 definetly need to go. I dont play there but I can honestly not see that being fun for anyone. Just look at it. Give a weeks warning, a default server to transfer to and free transfer of choice (the default is where you go if you dont use your free transfer). Then, shut it down.

Hey there!

I am from tier 9 EU (Vabbi)… and I can honestly say it has not been as dead as this ever before. That said, I do not think that server merge is the best solution. If you haven’t noticed, all the servers are losing people, not just low tiers, and it’s not like that exodus is being stopped by anything (I blame slow reaction time and being stubborn on arenanets part).

So you merge the current lowest servers into other servers. Will that change that fact that more and more people are quitting WvW? Nope, before you know it the new bottom servers are a target for merging aswell. Rince, repeat.

Merging servers is not a long term solution. It will make WvW slightly more playable for those on bottom tiers, but it doesn’t fix the underlying problems like stability nerf, class balance, guild gimmicks, pve borderlands, pvd, coverage wars etc.

This guy gets it.
Population balance needs to be looked at but the first step is getting rid of the bull kitten that caused the mass exodus (and that is still driving people away.)

Jaina Ashlynn.1043:

Stand The Wall.6987:

youre in t1
shocker

Well that screenie definitely wasn’t taken in ARBL.

RIP AR