Guild Wars 2

Gaile Gray.6029:

I talked to a couple of the devs just now, and they told me this is a subject they’re still reviewing and considering how best to address. It’s part of a larger discussion, as you can imagine, and changes would necessarily involve a few elements, not just condition caps alone.

While there aren’t details on changes or a timeframe in which they would be done, you can be sure that this is being reviewed by the devs and considered as part of the big picture and potential adjustments in the future.

I too thank you for the candor. Its good to at least know what is going on. but 2 years working on a serious problem? I say this tongue in cheek, but has anyone on the team ever considered a run for congress?

It’s been about 2 years since I played too. The whole “gear grind” thing wore thin for me very quickly. Stat creep made me feel like I was on a treadmill. I felt like I never made any meaningful progress. Plus I was seemingly playing alone in the open world which got stale (for me) quickly.

It’s with some trepidation that I am going to play again for Halloween and see how it goes. I’m not expecting much so I doubt I’ll be disappointed. To the dev’s credit, they did make a few very positive changes in the past.

See you in game.

I keep hearing people say a +5% stat advantage plus an extra slot is nothing. Really? 5% a hit and more defense. That isn’t significant?

Finnway.2183:

A couple more thoughts:

• Crafting — Crafting materials are worth more than the items they create. It is cheaper to buy an item off the TP then to craft it yourself. The only reason to level crafting is for food/buffs, ascended gear, and/or role-playing.

• Challenging Content —PvE content is not hard. There are a couple reasons for this. Part of it is because when they designed the game they envisioned the majority of the players wearing rare-level gear. Someone above me also said that Anet probably intended WvW to be end-game for PvE players. This is probably accurate.

• Cosmetics —Once you get the cosmetics you want there is no more progression in this area.

• Fractals —Fractals are end-game content by design. They are more challenging then dungeons, they drop exclusive skins, and you’re working toward ascended gear. The problem with them is they don’t have a sense of progression outside of fractals because the only reason you need ascended equipment is for agony resistence (which is only useful in fractals).

- Crafting is not endgame. Crafting is crafting. You can persue it on any level toon you have. You can max crafting and never play with that toon at all.

-Fractals We can agree to disagree on this one. There nothing more than elite dungeons to raid. Doesn’t qualify IMO.

-cosmetics I don’t think cosmetics are are endgame. I don’t think equiping your toon is endagme at all. Its a longterm goal like titles. If it’s endgame for you then fine.

I think of engame of more being about new maps and content that you do at max level that is significant to your progression. I feel as if I should have some open world PVE content as endgame.

just my 2 cents. I am sure others disagree on some points.

Causic.3798:

SHM.7628:

Causic.3798:

SHM.7628:

Sylv.5324:

Has the OP actually defined what his endgame IS? ‘I want endgame’ with no clarification is not helpful.

There’s a lot of posts on this topic in which i describe what endgame is.. I’ll be more succinct about what I think endgame is and what it isn’t.

Endgame is: PVE content that was designed to be done by my max level toon once I have mastered it and reasonably equipped it. It helps if it is compelling and relevent to the story. I can include some be 80-85 maps

What it is not:

-chasing titles
-grinding
-Elite (or normal) duneons
-PvP
-WvW
-crafting
-a gear grind treadmill
-recycled content that I completed at level 70
-time fillers.

I am not knocking any of what I listed above. (with the exception of a gear grind treadmill) I am just saying they are not endgame.

So end game is repeated content?* You can already do that….
And what do you mean reasonably well equiped, shouldn’t end game be once your fully equiped?
Elaborate on this
“PVE content that was designed to be done by my max level toon once I have mastered it and reasonably equipped it.”

Agreed, reasonably equipped=fully equipped.

I don’t know what you are reading. I said repeat content is not endgame.

Can you redefine endgame then, yours is much too vague. FotM would fit your description of Endgame.

Raiding dungeons is not PVE endame. Its a group instance you raid for loot. Fun? perhaps, but not relevant to my characters development.

Causic.3798:

SHM.7628:

Sylv.5324:

Has the OP actually defined what his endgame IS? ‘I want endgame’ with no clarification is not helpful.

There’s a lot of posts on this topic in which i describe what endgame is.. I’ll be more succinct about what I think endgame is and what it isn’t.

Endgame is: PVE content that was designed to be done by my max level toon once I have mastered it and reasonably equipped it. It helps if it is compelling and relevent to the story. I can include some be 80-85 maps

What it is not:

-chasing titles
-grinding
-Elite (or normal) duneons
-PvP
-WvW
-crafting
-a gear grind treadmill
-recycled content that I completed at level 70
-time fillers.

I am not knocking any of what I listed above. (with the exception of a gear grind treadmill) I am just saying they are not endgame.

So end game is repeated content?* You can already do that….
And what do you mean reasonably well equiped, shouldn’t end game be once your fully equiped?
Elaborate on this
“PVE content that was designed to be done by my max level toon once I have mastered it and reasonably equipped it.”

Agreed, reasonably equipped=fully equipped.

I don’t know what you are reading. I said repeat content is not endgame.

MrRuin.9740:

Finnway.2183:

I agree. But every post level-80 reward in the game is tied to money. Skins are tied to money. You can buy things in the shop with money (transmutation crystals, for example). Reaching level 500 crafting costs absurd money. You can level alts faster with money.

btw, no need to be a snarky.

e money you can grind doesn’t do much beyond fluff. Even Legendary are fluff as you can get the same stats on weapons that cost far less.

I disagree that ascended and legendaries are all fluff. They provide a 5% stat advantage. If 2 people are otherwise on equal footing skill wise but one has a 5% advantage stat wise. The guy with the stat advantage will win almost every time. 5% more defense and damage per hit is a massive. It may sound small but it’s a huge advantage over time.

Stats are not fluff, stats are stats.

Plus, he’s right you need a huge amount of money to craft or buy such stat gear. That constantly puts you in a faming mindset. (not fun)

You have to aslo remember that not every player is you. You may play a lot more than another player. You may find this feels bareable. Others might starkly disagree.

Causic.3798:

I have a lot of fun trying to get ascended gear and skins. Run the weekly guild missions to get guild commendations till you get your accessory. Run fractals till you get the rings. Run dungeons to get gold for better skins. Or for different skins. I love having interchangeable weapons. Then theres dyes I have yet to unlock (celestial and abyss). Also need to unlock all the inventory slots. And the bank* slots. I still got more than plenty to do. I don’t think this game is for you.

I never said that there was nothing to do. I said there was no endgame.

Sylv.5324:

Has the OP actually defined what his endgame IS? ‘I want endgame’ with no clarification is not helpful.

There’s a lot of posts on this topic in which i describe what endgame is.. I’ll be more succinct about what I think endgame is and what it isn’t.

Endgame is: PVE content that was designed to be done by my max level toon once I have mastered it and reasonably equipped it. It helps if itis compelling and relevent to the story. I can include some be 80-85 maps

What it is not:

-chasing titles
-grinding
-Elite (or normal) duneons
-PvP
-WvW
-crafting
-a gear grind treadmill
-recycled content that I completed at level 70
-time fillers.

I am not knocking any of what I listed above. (with the exception of a gear grind treadmill) I am just saying they are not endgame.

McSlappy.1372:

Ether way I spent the time and gold farming so I’d get the better stats then exotic. If there were not better stats would not have bothered so I’d like and many others to get refunds on any crafted Ascended weapons. If they would refund the materials that went in to leveling to 500 and the weapons themselves I’d be more then fine with them getting rid of Ascended gear or making them equal.

There’s no way they would refund you for mats. It would be a logistical nightmare. You’d have to eat it the same way people did other times changes were made.

-when magic find gear was eliminated.
-when they reset FoTM.
-when jugs of karma were added and people previously grinded their butts off for exotics.
-when they do a class or weapon buff or nerf.

Tongku.5326:

I think it would be a very bad idea to remove ascended gear.

I do think it should be a reward for completing the hardest things in the game, for example reaching fractal level 55, or getting 100k kills in WvW, soloing Lupi, beating Liadri on 3+ toons, etc.

This way, there would be appropriate rewards for appropriate players. Instead, its go to newbie zone 1 and farm some trees and metal, go to newbie zone 2 and farm some other trees and metal, go to newbie zone 3 and farm yet another trees and metal, etc. kinda stupid. Where is the challenge in the journey ?

I disagree. I don’t think stats should ever be a carrot they dangle.

Shakkara.2641:

If Anet removes ascended before the end of the year, I’ll spend $100 on gems.

I feel simillarly. I wonder how may other people would be on board.

Sirendor.1394:

SHM.7628:

I agree The hardcore need something to chase. Give them all the skins to chase they want. While your at it, How about giving them some good looking skins? I have not seen even one mindblowing skin in this game.

Well something to chase could be anything really. Doesn’t even need to be just skins, as long as it didn’t have an effect in PvP and isn’t necessary for most things in PvE.

I agree 100%. I made that suggestion because many people have worked very hard at them. So just removing them with no compensation seems a bit cruel. Letting them keep the skins or trading them for culteral armor seems appropriate.

Vayne.8563:

SHM.7628:

Seras.5702:

SHM.7628:

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

If you only play 1 build then you’re only limiting yourself. Try other styles.

If you leveled 1-80 exploring the world then now might be time to jump into some dungeon groups.

Have you done fractals? Nope, cuz they’re 80 only. And they’re getting an update soon so there will be more to love.

WvW. Now that you’ve got your PvE build sussed out, try giving WvW a shot and finding your build for that. And gear…you’re gonna need new gear so that’s something to work toward. And despite the fact that WvW is accessible at level 2, you really aren’t competitive until around 80.

Want to do Orr but it’s dead (pun intended)? Then organize a group. Gather guildies, gather first-timers, gather random Lions Archers and lead your assault on the temples.

And most people find the Personal Story to be a highlight of the game. If you don’t like it you don’t have to play it, but many like it. It’s not always about the rewards, but the journey.

You can’t complain about no end game if you just don’t want to do it. It’s there. That’s like complaining that Papa Johns doesn’t have any topping selection because you only like pepperoni.

Its not that i don’t like what they are offering (Your Papa John’s analogy) I like the PVE a lot. (I am a straight up PVE player.) It’s more of a question of How its all laid out opposed it it being “bad”.

Some of what you said is true. I don’t really care for PVP. (Its not like I’ve never done dungeons) Obviously I haven’t done fractals on this toon because It just hit max level. I have leveled 7 toons to 80 already for the record though. Fractals and dungeons are not my thing. even less so in GW2 with its wonky camera.

You brought up living story. Yes, some of it was amazingly enjoyable. It’s either super fun or super annoying. The first week its a super fun and easy. After the zerg dies out its ridiculously difficult.

GW2 seems to only have 2 dificulty levels. Toddler easy and impossibly difficult. For example the halloween crafting was near impossible to do without purchasing the mats. High level crafting, legendaies, gear chase and map completion fall into this catagory for me too.

Seems to me that your entire problem would be solved by joining an active PvE guild. Then you’d have people to help you through stuff and wouldn’t have to depend on random people doing it.

A good and reasonable suggestion. I don’t think it would add endgame, but certainly useful. I’m taking a break for now. I’ve done that a few times already. On resuming, I’ve often found things very different that when I last played. (Sometimes that has been good and sometimes not so much.) I am not particularlly thrilled with fractals so the timing seems right.

Good stuff, Drop me a PM if you come across anything interesting, preferably free to play

Plagueis.9672:

Thanks SHM. Just asking, instead of GW2 what are you playing now? Is there another MMO that has your interest? I am always looking for something new to play. That is part of the reason that I am coming back to GW2

I’m not playing anything right now. I have one toon that is not 80. I’ve considered playing it through to finish, but i kinda lost interest. I have sufficient gold/karma to equip that toon when it hits 80, but lost the will to do so. This is my 8th toon. Frankly, it all feels too much like deja vous at this point. (Even with my less than stellar memory) The game is free so if I decide I want to play , I can.

I’m ok not playing until there’s a game I want. I’ve heard people say they are Giving D3 another look. I’ve also heard people say WoW has been changing up their model to make it more user friendly.

Meh, I can wait. I’ve been gaming a long time. I got my first gaming system in 1977. (an Atari 2600) I was one of the first kids to have one. My Mom’s friend wa a computer programming genius.

Since then I played a lot of RPG’ on consoles. I then moved on to MMO’s. I put in a lot of grinding over the years. These young kids come on all full of spit and vinegar. They want to (even like to) grind away. I understand the mentality. I’m just not there anymore.

I am very selective now. When i buy a game I want fun and quality. My days of proving myself are over. Been there, done that. Who has the time anyway? If I am going to devote my valuable time to play, its gotta be worth it. I haven’t seen anything on the horrizon that warrants a purchase right now.

Plagueis.9672:

Seriously though. I do like a great deal of what the game offers. I just get the constant feeling of being on a treadmill. I feel like I never reach my destination. I am casual, but I do play quite a bit for a casual. I just don’t feel rewarded. This game doesn’t reward skill it rewards grind

That I greatly dislike [/quote]

I agree with what your saying. However, like any MMORPG out there, there things we like and dislike. But we playing b/c usually the like out way the dislikes. I want to see what I dislike about this game and see if it will hold my interest this time, at least until WildStar comes out. lol
[/quote]

Ok, I Just wanted you to make an informed decision. It’s a good game and a nice distraction. If you’re just killing time until Wildstar releases then all the better. I think a lot of people are doing that. Enjoy yourself and have fun.

I got an expensive backpiece skin from a wooden chest. I don’t remember which, but it sold for 10g. I was pretty broke at the time.

Also “Truth” dropped for me from a chest while I was leveling low level a necro who uses an axe. It wasn’t worth very much or an outstanding skin. It wa a free exotic axe though. I stored it for probably 30 levels and equiped it when I was 80.

I have gotten abyss and white dye to fall as well.

DusK.3849:

SHM.7628:

DusK.3849:

Any answer to the title other than “because there wasn’t intended to be any ‘endgame’, and that’s okay” comes solely from uninformed consumers.

I don’t buy that. Who ever said that there would be no end game? You’d be stretching to even say it was hinted at.

Not really. The pre-release ANet blog posts showed us exactly what we were getting, and even inspired other bloggers to summarize months before the game released because they knew that the lack of endgame would be a hard pill to swallow for typical MMO gamers still stuck in old conventions.

Some may have (accurately) deduced that there would be no endgame. There was no necessity that there be no endgame.

Example- there could have been some epilogue maps in each region. (Say level 80-82) Where you could complete a story objective and test your higher stats and gear.

This would be endgame (to me). It by no means ruins or clashes with their game model. I don’t think that it was predestined (or inevitable) that this model have no endgame by virtue of what it is.

DusK.3849:

Any answer to the title other than “because there wasn’t intended to be any ‘endgame’, and that’s okay” comes solely from uninformed consumers.

I don’t buy that. Who ever said that there would be no end game? You’d be stretching to even say it was hinted at.

If Anet auto upgraded exotics to be on par with ascended (infusion slots and all) I think everyone (but a select few) would be happy. Ascended would then be skin items. Persue or craft them if you want.

I agree The hardcore need something to chase. Give them all the skins to chase they want. While your at it, How about giving them some good looking skins? I have not seen even one mindblowing skin in this game.

Pariah.8506:

EnemyCrusher.7324:

The 3% of players who complain about ascended gear on the forums would ecstatic, 20% wouldn’t care, and everyone else would be really mad.

So 77% of the players have Ascended equipment?

May I ask your source on this information? Did you run a survey? Do you have access to inventory data?

probably just thinks everyone else agrees so made up numbers to justify his opinion. Nonsense really. 90% of the player base probably wants ascended removed. I’ve come across very few who want ascended to stay.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

narrock.6890:

a t s e.9614:

I would be happy with the rest of the player base (who are not WoW fanboys) .

i play wow all i can say is your being insulting and rude with disgusting post like this GW2 is not the end all be all game.

He’s probably upset over the fact that WoW is beginning to do what GW2 promised to do and WoW is doing it better. Ignore the haters because WoW bashing is the fashionable thing to do these days.

Lets be fair here here. This is Guild wars 2. They had a locked in audience. That audience in large part pre-purchased the game in good faith. They promised one thing in the manifesto and delivered quite another by 2 months in.

I have nothing against WoW. (I’ve never played it actually.)I have seen a significant minority requesting a WoW like experience. (mounts, raids, vertical progression, etc) If they would have told me they were going in that direction at pre purchase, i would have never bought the game.

mtpelion.4562:

I kind of wish that Ascended gear was no different from Exotic other than the extra infusion slot (to be used for Agony Resistance only).

I’m with you on that if they allowed you to somehow obtain the slot on your exotic as well. They could make the skin nicer on the ascended so people feel like they didn’t lose out if they have it already. Plus it would give some people a reason to obtain it.

Sirendor.1394:

SHM.7628:

Sirendor.1394:

Draco.2806:

I would like it gone.

In fact I’d like Exotics (stats, not looks) gone as well.

Less grind. More room to experiment.

Yep. I would play this game a lot more (and actually do things I like) if there wasn’t something like gear progression in this game. For WvW I have 7 classes. I try tons of builds on them, and I need different stat combos (and runes/sigils) for most. It’s really costly.

I think exotic is ok as top tier. They could remove rares. I think they should keep it whites, blues, greens, and exotics.

Exotics are quite expensive still. I never had 100g at the same time to be honest, and some exotic stats are very expensive: dire (10g per armour piece). I think they should just add more karma traders for armour and maybe make exotic drop some more. I think I got less than 10 exotic drops in nearly 1,5k hours of playing.

You’re right that certain stats are expensive. That is mostly upgrades though. If that was the end of the line for armor progression I could live with it easilly, becuase you could get a cheap set or buy one for karma. there’s different stats at different temples. Or you could mix and match. the skins are the same.

I would only go along with this if they allowed you to gain the infusion slot on your exotics some way. perhaps pay a nominal gold amout for it/ perhaps a mission to infuse.

Just leaving the slot on ascended makes it more desirable that exotic, which defeats the purpose.

Leave the ascended stuff for skin or bragging rights = ok

but truth be known, I just want it gone.

Sirendor.1394:

Draco.2806:

I would like it gone.

In fact I’d like Exotics (stats, not looks) gone as well.

Less grind. More room to experiment.

Yep. I would play this game a lot more (and actually do things I like) if there wasn’t something like gear progression in this game. For WvW I have 7 classes. I try tons of builds on them, and I need different stat combos (and runes/sigils) for most. It’s really costly.

I think exotic is ok as top tier. They could remove rares. I think they should keep it whites, blues, greens, and exotics.

Doon.2364:

So what if Arena finally admit the mistake of Ascended Gears and decides to reverse their decision and remove the gears entirely? Would people be happy or would people be upset at this point?

I personally would be happy if they got rid of them, even though I have all ascended stuff already. Just compensate by giving us gold for each ascended piece.

I have a follow up question. How many people would reward Anet with a cash shop purchase if they did remove it?

How about $50? I’d do it.

Galen Grey.4709:

SHM.7628:

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

There is so much to be done that I dont know where to start…. the big thing is you might have all the map open but you have definitely not experienced every dynamic event… so one option is to go back an experience them, see what story they tell… you can do that with your main or create a new alt.. up to you.

You can go explore find some of the secrets hidden in the game

you can do jumping puzzles

you can try to complete the various achievements

you can do WvW / PvP

Go for a particular Armor set (temples might not be open but thats the whole point… get a group together and go open them, it shouldnt be about the reward but about game play that gets you to the reward so this is actually a good thing imho)

level up crafting

collect some of the rare crafting recipes

discover crafting recipes

craft legendary / named weapons

do dungeons / fractals and get the unique skins they offer

do world bosses / Champions and get the unique skins they offer

Do variations of the personal story to fill in the blanks

play mini games

simply explore

level alts and equipment them

there is plenty to do to fill 1 week every 2 if you’re done with the living story in 1 week.

Thanks for the reply Galen. I’ve done a lot of what you said. 7 toons at 80 & geared already and 1 left. I never said there was nothing to do I said there was no endgame. Like you said these are great time fillers. I don’t find myself with a lot of extra time to kill. Some of the stuff you suggested is too time consuming or frankly boring. (especially this far along in the game.)

I want it gone. I would start making cash shop purchases if they made such a decision.

They took MF out of the game the world didn’t end. yes, I paid a lot for runes that I basically lost, but that is ok. It wa a bad mechanic and needed to go.

If they admitted their mistakes and made corrections, It would go a long way to promoting good will. Removing DR and fixing the camera are 2 examples fixes that would promote goodwill.

When I am happy = I spend.

killcannon.2576:

SHM.7628:

killcannon.2576:

The simple truth is that there is no endgame here as found in traditional MMOrpg’s.

The creators wanted an inclusive game where all content was accessible by everyone with a minimum amount of playing effort involved. Most other MMO’s practice exclusivity, where progression is required and one of the easiest ways to make things exclusive with as little work as possible is by gear gating content.

They could have progression related endgame content here if they so choose, without relying on gear progression gating, but they have chosen to not go that route. I don’t believe we will ever see true end game progression here, outside of chasing better particle effects. It’s good for some players, for some it’s not.

This truly is a game for casual MMO players, and it will always have a place in the market I believe.

But for players who desire conventional end game progression, this game just doesn’t have it. The good news is that there is a game coming that is the flip side of this coin, hopefully, with Wildstar. Will just have to wait and see.

I think when all is said and done, you hit the nail on the head.

My opinion is that this game has tried to be too many thing for too many people and has fallen short as a result in almost every area. Often they vacillate between extremes without finding a good balance. It’s a game of paradoxes.

-They offered a low grind game then put 80 levels and a gear grind in it.

-One minute there’s almost no karma gain. The next it’s raining karma jugs, then its dry again.

-Then they say play how you like, then you get slapped with DR when you do.

Frankly, I think they should separate PVE and PVP/WvW completely. It’s caused more balance problems than anything else. Bouncing back and forth for rewards has only made maps empty. They also mishandled how guesting works.

They have tried to gather diverse groups of differing play styles together and keep them happy. For the most part, I don’t believe it has worked out quite as well as they might have hoped it would. They may have been better served to just have bled the initial players who wanted more gear progression, and stayed true to their original ideas.

One of the things I feel is truly lacking in the game is a unified vision of who exactly they want to play their game. WoW tried going down the same path and lost a lot of subscribers because of it. They have successfully (arguable) weathered the storm because they had already had a huge initial install base, but the longer they don’t have a clear focus as to who their target audience is, they will continue to bleed. GW2 doesn’t quite have the same kind of wiggle room. While wanting to be all things to all gamers looks good on paper and to statisticians, it doesn’t always play out too successfully when implemented.

The dichotomy we see in GW2 is mostly because of these divergent groups of players. By instituting one change in a certain direction, they veer away from one group, then they almost always over correct back in the other direction, or just institute something on a wildly different tangent. People wanted better rewards for champs (they did indeed need something better than nothing), and they went too far and made them too profitable and now that is all people do. It seems that everything looks like a nail because the only thing they know how to use is a hammer. We have seen very little finesse in the first year of GW2.

I’m not sure if they ever will achieve a satisfactory balance without making some drastic changes that will lose them a portion of their audience. But in the end, they may be better off if they do.

You’re right. In the end I think they’ll favor the players most likely to use the cash shop. Probably the hardcore. The only thing I ever bought from the cash shop was karma boosters with in game gold.

I’d throw them the occasional bone if they had something I wanted. (IE something useful) However, I decided not to make any real money purchases when they implemented DR. When they added ascended gear I realized that I made the right decision.

Honestly, I feel like I’ve been jerked around a lot by bad decisions made since Beta. As much as I like GW2, that is no way to get me to spend more cash

killcannon.2576:

The simple truth is that there is no endgame here as found in traditional MMOrpg’s.

The creators wanted an inclusive game where all content was accessible by everyone with a minimum amount of playing effort involved. Most other MMO’s practice exclusivity, where progression is required and one of the easiest ways to make things exclusive with as little work as possible is by gear gating content.

They could have progression related endgame content here if they so choose, without relying on gear progression gating, but they have chosen to not go that route. I don’t believe we will ever see true end game progression here, outside of chasing better particle effects. It’s good for some players, for some it’s not.

This truly is a game for casual MMO players, and it will always have a place in the market I believe.

But for players who desire conventional end game progression, this game just doesn’t have it. The good news is that there is a game coming that is the flip side of this coin, hopefully, with Wildstar. Will just have to wait and see.

I think when all is said and done, you hit the nail on the head.

My opinion is that this game has tried to be too many thing for too many people and has fallen short as a result in almost every area. Often they vacillate between extremes without finding a good balance. It’s a game of paradoxes.

-They offered a low grind game then put 80 levels and a gear grind in it.

-One minute there’s almost no karma gain. The next it’s raining karma jugs, then its dry again.

-Then they say play how you like, then you get slapped with DR when you do.

Frankly, I think they should separate PVE and PVP/WvW completely. It’s caused more balance problems than anything else. Bouncing back and forth for rewards has only made maps empty. They also mishandled how guesting works.

Kimyrielle.3826:

SHM.7628:

Kimyrielle.3826:

Xae Isareth.1364:

Whether it has an endgame or not, every game needs progressive difficulty with a purpose for it.

I stopped reading there, because I totally disagree with that. That’s YOUR opinion and not the law of nature you make it sound as.

I think you did yourself a disservice by not finishing his post right there. He was starting to make a a pretty valid point. The game progresses until about level 70, and then progression grinds to a halt.

I am by no means hardcore and finished the maps by the level 75 with green level 70’s gear. If I’m an average player then where does that leave everyone else?

I hit 80, bought my exotics, but I had no were new to go with them. What was the point? Perhaps if there were some level 80-85 maps? Or a purpose to play on with my geared 80? Not sure, but something was missing.

Look, some of the things you say make me wonder if your basic problem with this game is that you wrongly assume game design approaches from other games to make any sense in GW2 when they are not even meant to. Like…gear progression. Yes, you’re absolutely right, there is no content in the game you totally -need- Exotics for. Which you think is a problem, but in isn’t, for GW2 isn’t about gear progression and the devs repeatedly said so. Yes, there -is- gear progression in the game (we have got Ascended and Legendary tiers, after all), but it’s just…vanity. You get legendary weapons for no other purpose than having a legendary and it being pretty. In WoW, you needed whatever their equivalent for legendary weapons was to get certain content done, for WoW was designed around vertical gear progression, while GW2 is designed around vanity.

I realize that some people will find this less than satisfying. Me? I love it. Which is why there are games catering to both groups and GW2 seems to be catering more to me than you, perhaps. What I don’t get is that people continue to complain about GW2 not being what it’s not even meant to be. It’s like buying a BMW and then complaining about it not being a Mercedes.

I do see where your coming from. However I don’t think that GW2 gets the balance right.

There is a gear grind in this game. Ascended gives stat bonuses That is in my opinion a problem. I don’t want to be a hardcore elite dungeon runner. Yet I don’t also think I should be discluded from having top tier specs on my armor.

If on the other hand there is in fact no need for exotics or above then they should be removed entirely. All they do is create elitists in dungeon running. skins are fine I’m of the opinion that there’s too much armor in this game anyway. Crafting and armor are a convoluted mess.

If I work for my exotics/ascended why shouldn’t I have a viable PVE environment (endgame) in which to test and use them?

IndigoSundown.5419:

Kimyrielle.3826:

Xae Isareth.1364:

Whether it has an endgame or not, every game needs progressive difficulty with a purpose for it.

I stopped reading there, because I totally disagree with that. That’s YOUR opinion and not the law of nature you make it sound as.

I don’t play games to be challenged and brag with my loot, but to get entertained. I don’t mind difficult content in the game for the people who want that (GW2 has that!), but I totally mind being offered ONLY difficult content from a certain point on and every worthwhile reward being offered ONLY there. Which most ‘endgames’ do, for most often there is nothing to do except raids, raids, raids. Which is why I end up quitting these games.

There is room in the same game for players who want progressive difficulty and those who don’t play for challenge. However, the loot issue always rears its ugly head. Then, it turns out the demographic that wants challenge is actually composed of both players who just want challenge, and players who want the challenge to be a qualifier to getting the best loot unless you face that challenge.

GW handled this better, imo, than most games. There was challenging content with exclusive rewards. None of the loot was stat improvements, which defused a lot of the objections. The best skins could be sold, providing another outlet for those who wanted the skin and could farm — but who were unlucky with RNG (or whatever). Also, the elite instances could be completed by almost anyone with friends, but the less skilled weren’t speed running them. Hard mode added even more challenge, but the rewards were usually just a better chance at the skin, not an exclusivity barrier.

Personally, I think the GW model did a better job of appealing to multiple types of players than either raid games or GW2.

I agree 100%.

Kimyrielle.3826:

Xae Isareth.1364:

Whether it has an endgame or not, every game needs progressive difficulty with a purpose for it.

I stopped reading there, because I totally disagree with that. That’s YOUR opinion and not the law of nature you make it sound as.

I think you did yourself a disservice by not finishing his post. He was starting to make a a pretty valid point. The game progresses until about level 70, and then progression grinds to a halt.

I am by no means hardcore and finished the maps by the level 75 with green level 70 gear. If I’m an average player then where does that leave everyone else?

I hit 80, bought my exotics, but I had no were new to go with them. What was the point? Perhaps if there were some level 80-85 maps? Or a purpose to play on with my geared 80? Not sure, but something was missing.

Danikat.8537:

SHM.7628:

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

What do i want? I’d like to be fully geared and leveled before I hit 80 and all the content is done. What’s the point of finishing everything first? That is like getting all warmed up before a nap.

Huh? How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap? And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet? This makes no sense to me.

Your questions: How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap?

I’ve pretty much unlocked all PVE maps from stater areas to cursed shore by the time I ding 80. I did it equipped with level 70 greens and weapons. I hit 80. I get the gear and I am all dressed up with no place to go. No hard mode and no additional maps.

You might have ‘unlocked them’ in the sense that you’ve been to the map and the name now shows up on your world map, but you can’t seriously claim to have done everything – 100% on all the Explorer titles, 100% World Completion (these two are different) and played through all or most of the dynamic events before you got to level 80. I haven’t done the maths but I’m pretty sure that’s impossible because even a fraction of that would give you enough XP on it’s own to get to 80.

If you think ‘unlocking’ a map is all there is to it then that’d be a big part of your problem with this game – you’re not seeing, or ignoring, a very large chunk of the content.

Think of it more like Skyrim (and the other Elder Scrolls games) – there you only have one (overworld) map and as soon as you’re out of the tutorial you can wander freely around it. But no one would seriously say “Well I’ve unlocked the map so I don’t have anything left to do except the stupid side quests” would they?

Have you helped out the Bunny Acolytes in Wayfarer Foothills? Found a way into Guutra’s Steading in Lornar’s Pass and found out what her secret is? Completed the Flame Temple Tombs in Diessa Plateau? Become the champion of the Battle Pit in Gendarran Fields? No? Then you haven’t done everything. And those are just random examples off the top of my head, there are many, many more events and activities I could have used as examples.

I have maxed out 7 toons. have i gotten every achievement with every toon? No! and I don’t want too! I am not one of those players. If you’ve my posts on this thread, youd see that i am not complaining about a shortage of content. There’s plenty of content, it’s just not in the endgame.

I think this is more about progression and grating than it is about specific content. BTW, you gave some very good examples. Yes, I visit in on that stuff sometimes. Am I going to do it 8 times? No.

Does stuff that I’ve done in lower levels ungeared qualify as endgame? For me it doesn’t. Perhaps this is could turn into philosophical debate on what endgame is. I’m sure different people have different ideas on that.

Perhaps this is a pitfall of a sandbox game? You get thrown in and you do whatever. It’s not truly a sandbox game in that it’s so level based. You can’t do whatever you want. You are still bound by 80 levels .

Xae Isareth.1364:

There is an endgame, but that endgame is not satisfying. What people want with endgame content is a challenge, like the final boss of a game, where you use everything you learnt so far to conquer it and have your skills tested to the limit.

That exists in GW2. Arah, FotM, etc all do that. But you get nothing out of beating that challenge. There’s nothing you can’t get in P3 which you can’t get in the other paths, and theres nothing desirable you can get exclusively from very high fractal levels (40+) even after the update (tonics are not very popular).

Yes, for some people the challenge is the reward but this is a MMO. MMOs have always largely have been about the loot and there is not enough loot in endgame content to justify doing them.

As much as a lot of people would like to disagree with you, I think you’re right. MMO players are loot minded. The last 2 living storiies (Halloween and the nightmare within) They got the mini’s and achievements from them fast and then they sat untouched.

I liked the nightmare tower instance and mad king laberinth. After a week they were just frustrating to do. Most of the PVE sits empty until a meta event begins and then it is flooded. They don’t flood it for the event the flood it for the chest/ loot bag. Or they zerg train champs in queensdale. Mindnumbingly boring, but it’s for loot.

I agree, fixing loot would help a great deal with end game. It certainly wouldn’t fix everything, but its a good start.

Star Ace.5207:

SHM.7628:

Basharic.1654:

Clockwork Bard.3105:

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

This right here is dead on. I’ve been playing since beta, and I know I’m in the ball park of 2500 hours played. 2 k of which is on my main. And I still love the hell out of this game.

It retains my interest through living story, WvW, and sPvP, all of which I do depending on my mood. I have all that time in and STILL not even close to significant rank in PvP, nor a dungeon master title. I hate plugging and my guild is both small and often busy irl.

The key is I never do anything that doesn’t really interest me. It creates this positive feedback loop where every time I Iog in I’m entertained or challenged in some way. Which keeps me logging in.

Yet somehow while playing this game in ways the “uber” players would consider stupid and inefficient, I’ve managed to enjoy the hell out of this game to date, AND still have plenty left to do.

You make some very valid points. You should only do what you enjoy. I’d never enjoy a great deal of what this game has to offer because much of it is for the uber player. I find what i like and I do it too.

Anyway, the intent behind my post is that I like to PVE. I put in the hours get to 80 nad I’ve done all the PVE I enjoy already. I think it’s more a question of the content not being grated properly than it being bad per se.

I am not a gear chaser either. There’s really only one set of gear you are going to focus on That is your top tier 80 gear. But why? I’ve run through the content without it. The same could be said about crafting. Why bother?

Ironically, the so-called uber player detest this game for catering to so-called casuals (which you seem to be and isn’t and actual pejorative, as many take for granted), so evidently both of you hate the game for exactly the opposite reasons. Who is right? Perhaps both are wrong by focusing in areas of the game that weren’t necessarily meant for the kind of players they are.

There’s plenty to enjoy for your type, but it’s also fair not to love what’s available-that doesn’t mean the game is a failure but that it may not be for you. either that or you must approach it differently, accepting it for what it is rather than for what you wish it was.

Here’s the funny part. I don’t dislike the game. I have to be truthful and say the game has been mishandled quite a bit, but failure? No. As you so aptly put it, I am a casual player. I realize that I can’t expect everything in the game to be for me. I’m not getting legendaries or culteral armor. That’s fine.

Example: Look at crafting.I like crafting. I would never have the real life time to sink into it to master it. I felt unfairly discuded from halloween crafting by the material demands. Obviosly if I am not hardcore, I won’t have the materials or the gold to buy them.

Anyway, I just think people are right when they say there’s no endgame. Seems to be a consistent theme throughout the game that its fun, but there is ultimately no payoff. That can be frustrating.

Summing it up: I like GW2 but the end is anticlimactic.

Moshari.8570:

Have you seen your achievements tab?

End game. Go get your achievements….done every mini dungeon? done ever goggles? done every jumping puzzle? done your slayer achieves? Dungeons can be done with LFG…I only PUG dungeons and have never waited more than 10 minutes for a group…even during living story. Fractals? Got your world explorer?

People who complain about no endgame haven’t actually looked. I have found more to do here than in WoW because I don’t need a group of 40 people to do GW2 “endgame”.

Yes, I’ve seen the achievemnts tab. I’v got close to all of slayer done. That is because I like that one. Plus It gets done by in the normal course of playing However, I don’t go in for all that mindless busy work. Of course I didn’t go for GWAMM in this games predecessor either. That stuff is for the hardcore, not me. Busy work is not endgame.

IndigoSundown.5419:

SHM.7628:

There’s no necessecity for a toon to be 80 to wear max gear. look at GW1. You could buy max gear as soon as you could get to it and afford it. By the time I was doing my alts i could get max gear at very low levels.

To be fair, the stats on gear in GW make up a lot less of your character’s capabilities than it does in most MMO’s, including GW2. Still, I’d have to agree that I found the GW gear method more fun than I find the GW2 method, or the WoW method for that matter.

I liked the GW gear method better too. Not to say it wasn’t without its costs. You paid for it and if you wanted the fancy stuff then you really paid for it.

I just liked the progression better in GW. You need to unlock skills and learn to use them. You unlocked your heroes. You set your skills on everyone. You runed an armored everyone. It was more of a process. You got better over time.

It was never about paying for stats. You got to max level and armor relatively quickly. You became good from mastering the game, not from your armor.

Tongku.5326:

SHM.7628:

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

When you leveled and geared, you played solo and at best pugged some dungeons or did some zerg events. In order for you to find the “end game” here, you need to look at your community and your guild. Maybe you need to switch guilds.

Get on your servers voice chat, there are many options for the so called end game. Organized WvW, dungeon runs, various bosses. To me, best end game is to beat faces in WvW in the most shiny and stylish way possible with my legendary and completely geared out toons yours may vary, but either way, if you do not get involved in your community or leave a dead guild if you are in one, then your game is pretty much over except maybe become a T6 farmer for legendaries.

TY for the suggestions but WvW/PvP is not my thing. I despise gear chasing too. I have neither the time nor the will for that. When I play I just like to do my PVE thing, some living story and my daily/mothly achievements

I probably wouldn’t make a good guildmate now because my RL schedule has gotten even more busy as of late.

I wasn’t even really complaining about no there being endgame, just musing. I don’t really think there is an end game. Ironicly, I think its more about bad structure than it is about lack of content.

ArchonWing.9480:

Not sure why people complain about no temple armor. Just guest on a server that has it.

if you were talking about me. It took me three days of guesting to get the specific armor I wanted. the whole “nightmare within” living story had Orr pretty empty. It’s far from impossible to do. It was a pain though at that specific time.

Zelyhn.8069:

There was an endgame: playing fotm 70+, but they are taking this away from us.

Particularly since ascended gear was introduced I shy away from anything in this game that requires a huge time investment. They can just suddenly decide to pull the rug out from under you and you’ve lost your progress. ( like fotm, )

-You can pour time into a legendary and they can nerf the weapon you’re using.

-removing the karma jugs daily/monthly was a huge issue. New players come along and they have to grind it all out.

-crafting? new tiers/materials levels

-Magic find? the gear and runes were expensive then one day poof = its gone.

I would just PVE, get my temple armor and exotic armor and I stop there.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

Dante.1508:

There is no End Game….

Spoon boy.8932: Do not try and play the end game. That’s impossible. Instead… only try to realize the truth.

Neo.0001: What truth?

Spoon boy.8932: There is no end game.

Neo.0001: There is no end game?

Spoon boy.8932: Then you’ll see, that it is not the end game that plays, it is only yourself.

Anet Smith1976: Did you know that the first GW2 was designed to be a perfect gaming world? Where none grinded, where everyone would be happy. It was a disaster. The hardcore refused to accept the program. Entire guilds were lost. Some believed we lacked the programming language to describe your perfect MMO world. But I believe that, as a species, MMO players define their reality through suffering and misery. The perfect world was a dream that your primitive cerebrum kept trying to wake up from. Which is why the GW2 world was redesigned to this: the peak of WoW civilization.

Seras.5702:

SHM.7628:

I just finished leveling a necro and it dawned on me. I grinded away to 80 It’s finally time to get get my gear, but I did everything. The maps entierly open. By 80 your build is pretty etched in stone.

Of course, I can’t get any temple armor because good luck getting one open durring a living story event. I would like to do get the temples for fun anyway. Let’s face it, Orr is a graveyard anyway. (no pun intended.)

Yes there’s living story, but that is dead in a week after release. Plus it further kills the other maps. Personal story? Once you don’t need the XP what is the point? Its usually an unrewarding pain.

If you only play 1 build then you’re only limiting yourself. Try other styles.

If you leveled 1-80 exploring the world then now might be time to jump into some dungeon groups.

Have you done fractals? Nope, cuz they’re 80 only. And they’re getting an update soon so there will be more to love.

WvW. Now that you’ve got your PvE build sussed out, try giving WvW a shot and finding your build for that. And gear…you’re gonna need new gear so that’s something to work toward. And despite the fact that WvW is accessible at level 2, you really aren’t competitive until around 80.

Want to do Orr but it’s dead (pun intended)? Then organize a group. Gather guildies, gather first-timers, gather random Lions Archers and lead your assault on the temples.

And most people find the Personal Story to be a highlight of the game. If you don’t like it you don’t have to play it, but many like it. It’s not always about the rewards, but the journey.

You can’t complain about no end game if you just don’t want to do it. It’s there. That’s like complaining that Papa Johns doesn’t have any topping selection because you only like pepperoni.

Its not that i don’t like what they are offering (Your Papa John’s analogy) I like the PVE a lot. (I am a straight up PVE player.) It’s more of a question of How its all laid out opposed it it being “bad”.

Some of what you said is true. I don’t really care for PVP. (Its not like I’ve never done dungeons) Obviously I haven’t done fractals on this toon because It just hit max level. I have leveled 7 toons to 80 already for the record though. Fractals and dungeons are not my thing. even less so in GW2 with its wonky camera.

You brought up living story. Yes, some of it was amazingly enjoyable. It’s either super fun or super annoying. The first week its a super fun and easy. After the zerg dies out its ridiculously difficult.

GW2 seems to only have 2 dificulty levels. Toddler easy and impossibly difficult. For example the halloween crafting was near impossible to do without purchasing the mats. High level crafting, legendaies, gear chase and map completion fall into this catagory for me too.

Basharic.1654:

Clockwork Bard.3105:

A lot of the GW2 community kind of reminds me of that one kid at Chuck E. Cheese’s.

See, when you go to Chuck E. Cheese’s, you eat pizza and you play games (or I guess you could spend your whole day in the urine-soaked ball pit). Some games give out tickets. Those tickets can be exchanged for little gifts. To complete the experience, it’s nice to at least go home with a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles pencil topper.

But there’s always that one kid who knows the trick. He knows that skee-ball pays out way more tickets than anything else, if you’re good at it. And he’s good at it. So that’s all he plays for 6 hours straight, with only a quick break for pizza. By the end, he’s probably sick of skee-ball. But the tickets! He’s going home with pencil toppers of all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles!

There’s a lot more to do in the game when you’re not chasing the tickets.

This right here is dead on. I’ve been playing since beta, and I know I’m in the ball park of 2500 hours played. 2 k of which is on my main. And I still love the hell out of this game.

It retains my interest through living story, WvW, and sPvP, all of which I do depending on my mood. I have all that time in and STILL not even close to significant rank in PvP, nor a dungeon master title. I hate plugging and my guild is both small and often busy irl.

The key is I never do anything that doesn’t really interest me. It creates this positive feedback loop where every time I Iog in I’m entertained or challenged in some way. Which keeps me logging in.

Yet somehow while playing this game in ways the “uber” players would consider stupid and inefficient, I’ve managed to enjoy the hell out of this game to date, AND still have plenty left to do.

You make some very valid points. You should only do what you enjoy. I’d never enjoy a great deal of what this game has to offer because much of it is for the uber player. I find what i like and I do it too.

Anyway, the intent behind my post is that I like to PVE. I put in the hours get to 80 nad I’ve done all the PVE I enjoy already. I think it’s more a question of the content not being grated properly than it being bad per se.

I am not a gear chaser either. There’s really only one set of gear you are going to focus on That is your top tier 80 gear. But why? I’ve run through the content without it. The same could be said about crafting. Why bother?

Qaelyn.7612:

SHM.7628:

What do i want? I’d like to be fully geared and leveled before I hit 80 and all the content is done. What’s the point of finishing everything first? That is like getting all warmed up before a nap.

Huh? How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap? And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet? This makes no sense to me.

Your questions: How can you be fully leveled when you haven’t hit the level cap?

I’ve pretty much unlocked all PVE maps from stater areas to cursed shore by the time I ding 80. I did it equipped with level 70 greens and weapons. I hit 80. I get the gear and I am all dressed up with no place to go. No hard mode and no additional maps.

And how can you wear gear when you haven’t reached its level yet?

There’s no necessecity for a toon to be 80 to wear max gear. look at GW1. You could buy max gear as soon as you could get to it and afford it. By the time I was doing my alts i could get max gear at very low levels.

Fixes? Gear could max out at level 20 for example. Perhaps there could be maps higher than level 80. perhaps a hardmode.

Lastly, i thinjk there’s too much gear in this game anyway.

Kootje.9271:

SHM.7628:

Pets are a delight.

I’d like to disagree.

Pet’s can be usefull and handy, but they’re not a delight. They have problems with moving targets. Their reaction time makes them easily dodgeable.
Also they will happily stand in each aoe and get their kitten whooped..

So noted about disagreeing. You said it yourself a lot of the fixes you propose would overpower rangers. Obiously PVP with thinking humans will be different.

In PVE though, I can hurt most targets pretty badly while my pet distracts and tanks. I often times go untouched. If you’re looking for them to be the primary source of you damage then you’re probably out of luck.

mtpelion.4562:

SHM.7628:

You can be dismissive if you want to be but i am completely serious. This very well may be the first time I ever defended Anet on anything. 99.99% of the time the pets work how they are supposed to work. They draw agrro on the mob I attack.

I can totally understand if your a dungeon runner and want a more permanant type of stow pet function. However to say pets are broken is absurd. You think pets are a problem? Roll a mesmer see how you like clones. Up until they fixed minions they were a mess too.

I for real thought you were being sarcastic. Either you’re still joshing me here or you don’t have a ranger over level 5. Pets have so many bugs that they are essentially useless in anything other than the most basic boss fights (i.e., where the boss doesn’t move and isn’t an “object”).

Ranger is my primary and my favorite toon . I think ranger gets a bad rap a lot of the time. It’s ok to disagree. You clearly don’t like them or their pets that’s fine. I hear everyone rave about W’s. My W was the first toon i rolled. I like my W, but they feel flat and one dimentional to me. That is ok, different strokes for different folks.

I’ve never had any problems with my pets. They are sturdy and hold aggro. They can take a beating even against strong bosses. Plus very useful if you are in a downed state. I have no idea what bugs you are talking about. Care to elaborate?

Zardul.3952:

When pets are on passive they give a random Effect to the RANGER for example,

Jaguar = " +5% dmg, "
Jungle cat = " 50% on hit to grant might "
Snow leopard = " Chance to do chill and condition duration increased"
Drake Ice Drake = " attacks do chill "
Drake Salamander = " attacks do fire dmg "
Drake River = " attacks have 20% chance to cause lightning strike"
Drake Reef = " Attacks cause confusion"
Polar Bear = " Gain Vitality and chance to chill "
Brown/ black Bear = " Gain Vitality and toughness "
Eagle / Hawk = "Bleeds are 10% more effective "
Raven = " chance to blind on Hit "
Devourer = " Attacks have a chance to hit twice"
Moa = " Gain Random Boon per 10sec"
Wolf= " Crowd controll are 20% more effective"
Pig = " gain Healing power"
Warthog = " gain precision"
Boar = " gain power"
Siamoth = " gain condition dmg "

What do you guys think? they are sort of like Preparations from Gw1.

the pet will always be visible, but not active. soo it stays true to the ranger Bio. " has a companion pet"

just gives us a chance in pvp and pve to not lose efficiency, due to the pet dieing or causing issues

Pets in PVP are probably a waste of time. In pve pets don’t cause issues.. In PVE are you trying to have them tank a metaboss champion or something? Of course they will die if you don’t controll them and heal them. Mine rarely die. When they do I can usually switch them out seemlessly.

Pets are a delight. If you were complaining about clones, jumping puzzles, or perhaps the camera I’d be fast to agree. however, you’re complaining about the one thing that is working.

Again i wouldn’t be against some extra buffs when stowed/ inactive. However if you hate pets that much prhaps you should rerol an engineer or a thief.