What is a hipster? I assume it is an attempt at somehow disparaging a group of people that have a different viewpoint of what GW2 is or was supposed to be based on the pre release information made available by the company.
If you want to know what a hipster is, go here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hipster_%28contemporary_subculture%29
If you want to know how internet views hipsters, go here: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/hipster
In internetese, basically a hipster is someone that likes anything as long as it’s not mainstream, for example, liking a music band when it’s little know indie, but stop liking it if they make it big and everyone listens to them (“I liked them before….”).
Applied to GW2: non hipster: “I don’t think feature X would work in GW2 because of Y”… hipster “I don’t want X because WoW has it, you might as well go play WoW”.
It’s interesting that humans seek to identify themselves into particular groups while also simultaneously distancing themselves from other groups. So many people wish to express their individuality and then seek out others who also share similar ideas of what it means to be a individual and then use confirmation bias to express to others at how they are different. I am curious if humanity will ever develop the capacity to see through it’s own self deception.
Thanks for the write-up, OP. It’s nice to be able to read it in full.
On that note, it honestly just feels like one big fancy commercial.
And while we’re on the subject of posting things said by devs, my favorite piece has to be the one by Jeff Strain, “How To Create A Successful MMO”: http://www.guildwars.com/events/tradeshows/gc2007/gcspeech.php
That speech was an extremely interesting read. Thank you!
Here is why:“An MMO must deliver content at three distinct stages: the early game, which is the first twenty hours, the mid game, which is the first few hundred hours, and the late game, which is at a thousand hours and beyond.”
Now compare it against the last PAX interview, given by Colin:
During this interview, Colin essentially explained that they made a mistake in their development of the game. He said that they had not expected players to reach the exotic tier gear so quickly, which is essentially why they introduced the ascended stat tier.
Now put 1 and 1 together. In order to fix their mistake, and remain a succesful MMO, they had to make a choice:
1) make a change to the “late game”, so that GW2 would have the necessary ingredient they considered essential for any succesful MMO. Namely, that your game should be designed such that players will reach the late stage of the game after having played it for more than 1,000 hours; or
2) distance themselves from the manifesto, and disappoint players that thought they had already reached the “late game”. In order to ease this pain, and to keep the old customer base happy, new content was promised on a 2-weekly basis, which admittedly is something no MMO to date has been able to pull off.They had to make a very tough choice. It could well be that they made this choice based on the future. Let’s not forget that this future includes, amongst others, attracting millions of new players from Asia.
Wrong.
Having BiS gear by level 80 was intended from the beginning. In no way was it a mistake. It was a conscious decision. This is the Eurogamer quote from Johansen that is floating around.
If a mistake was made, then it was making it too easy to get to level 80 in the first place. I recall in launch week, when someone got to level 80 in 2 days via crafting, Anet called her an “exploiter” and later had to apologize. So clearly they had not expected people to level so quickly.
If that was problem, then where Ascendeds the best solution?
Short term maybe, but not long term. Best long term to solution to easy leveling is raising the level cap, and make the leveling from old level cap to new harder.
But you can’t raise the level cap 2 months after launch, so they went with the short term solution of gear grind at the current level cap.
It’s all assumption really, obviously Anet wants people to keep playing their game. The more time someone spends in the game and the more time it takes to obtain a item either through rng or timegating or whatever implementation is used, the more likely it becomes that people will open up their wallets. From a business perspective it makes complete sense, however why they could have not simply applied the time factor into obtaining more skills or replaceable traits etc etc is beyond me. Introducing a gear chase just to satisfy a base of players that can’t see progression through any other means than inflated stats boggles the mind when they could have gone in so many other directions. Now that ascended gear is in the game, if they do not increase statistical difficulty of the enemies you face then the higher statistics of ascended becomes largely wasted developer resources. As it stands now ascended is little more than a carrot on the stick, that Anet said they wanted to avoid. I know Colin J has given reasons as to why they don’t just release all the ascended gear at once, but personally I would rather it be done that way as opposed to this structured release schedule they have now since the end result is the exact same as releasing new tiers it keeps you constantly chasing.
Gonna break the trend, I tend to listen to this kind of stuff
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBdTVmSVq14
What is a hipster? I assume it is an attempt at somehow disparaging a group of people that have a different viewpoint of what GW2 is or was supposed to be based on the pre release information made available by the company.
Think of it like this, the tool belt skills are our utility slots and the actual utility slots are what we use to put in additional functionality either by adding more weapons or what have you. The main difference is that we don’t get to pick our utilities since they are tied directly to what we pick for our additional functions. What you are saying about the tool belt being our primary class mechanic is technically correct, but you really cannot compare it to other class mechanics because ours is unique to engineer.
You basically just said that our profession mechanic is that we don’t get to choose our utility skills.
Why am I the only one who see this as a problem?
Because I don’t view the engineer tool belt mechanic to be essential to the success of the class. It seems to me that you don’t like using kits (which that is perfectly fine to not) but knowing that they are a huge part of the class it would seem to me that if you don’t like using kits you would be happier playing something else. Please don’t take that as a snarky comment because I don’t mean it to be, it just seems that you are quite distraught over how you perceive what the class was meant to be versus what it currently is and just trying to save you some frustration.
Actually I’ve been playing a kit based engineer for about eight months now. I started out loving it, but now I’m just freaking sick of it. I want to change my build, but nothing else is viable, so that is getting a bit frustrating.
Do you primarily sPvP, WvW or PVE? The reason I ask is we certainly do have “viable” alternatives to kits, like a sd build, or a elixir based build, of course they are not “viable” for all areas of the game though. As an example I wouldn’t run elixirs in dungeons, or sd in a zerg scenario in WvW but either one of those work perfectly fine in other aspects of the game. I don’t often run tourney pvp so I can’t really advise there, but I do know that quite a few classes get pigeonholed into using one type of build in the tourney pvp meta which is why I primarily avoid it.
Bah, I hate pvp and only ever do 1v1 with my fiancee to settle disputes or make…ahem “fun” bets. I like the idea of WvW, but my current computer can’t really handle the zerg, so I generally avoid it. Finally I spend most of my time in PvE open world stuff, living story and map completion mostly. I do dungeons only if I’m looking into a specific reward skin, or to complete each path (once) with each of my characters. I’ll probably try out the updated versions as they roll out, but I don’t really bother with them beyond doing them just so I could say I did them.
Have you tried a rifle sd build? You can pretty much drop any normal mob with your opening burst, it is pretty glassy compared to some of our other options but man is it effective if you are good at positioning and the like. It’s pretty straight forward and easy to use, but it can be a lot of fun obliterating a target in 3 seconds give or take heh. When I am feeling saucy I use it to solo roam in WvW, admittedly it takes catching people unaware, and getting them isolated but you can even drop players in the blink of an eye once you get the hang of it, it’s kind of the ultimate risk vs reward playstyle.
Let me elaborate for those who aren’t familiar with what I mean:
Classes are divided into different levels of base health.
Right now, Warriors and Necros have the highest tier of health, the medium tier consists of Engis/Rangers/Mesmers, and the lowest tier consists of Guardians/Thieves/Elementalists.
My question is: Should Engineers be raised up to the next Health tier?
I think they should, and hear me out before you tell me to “L2P nub”.
1. Our builds tend to involve directly tanking damage
The most popular armor set for our class to use is, of course, Rabid, which boosts Toughness. The most popular trait line for our class is Alchemy, which boosts Vitality. One of our perks, Juggernaut, gives 200 toughness while wielding the flamethrower. Of course, not EVERYBODY uses one of those, but many people do.
2. We usually need to be up close
Most of our weapons and kits are close-to-mid-range, which puts us in a position where the enemy can easily fight back and damage us. Our only real long range option takes immense skill to use properly at its maximum range.
3. We’re limited in options for escape
Yes, we have Elixir S, Rocket Boots, Slick Shoes, and Super Speed (which is broken, by the way), but we’re still not that mobile. Slick Shoes can be easily avoided by someone who pays attention, and Rocket Boots doesn’t get you that far. Elixir S doesn’t last very long. Our class depends more on taking damage than running away.
What do you think?
Personally, I’m of the opinion that we should have been a Soldier class, but that’s not really an option at this point. This is a much more likely change.
I am assuming this is from a pvp (I include both sPvP and WvW in this since you play against other people) perspective? I will say that with the amount of dodges we can have through on demand vigor, blinds, blocks, and other general control options, engineer has more than enough active defenses to stay in close pretty comfortably. Now if we are talking tourney pvp, options become more limited obviously because meta dictates the way you build as part of your team. But as balance patch changes classes, so to does the meta shift. It’s primarily why I don’t do a lot of tourney pvp and prefer to solo/small group roam in WvW where we are more free to exercise build choice. But engi does have plenty of ways to keep themselves alive.
Think of it like this, the tool belt skills are our utility slots and the actual utility slots are what we use to put in additional functionality either by adding more weapons or what have you. The main difference is that we don’t get to pick our utilities since they are tied directly to what we pick for our additional functions. What you are saying about the tool belt being our primary class mechanic is technically correct, but you really cannot compare it to other class mechanics because ours is unique to engineer.
You basically just said that our profession mechanic is that we don’t get to choose our utility skills.
Why am I the only one who see this as a problem?
Because I don’t view the engineer tool belt mechanic to be essential to the success of the class. It seems to me that you don’t like using kits (which that is perfectly fine to not) but knowing that they are a huge part of the class it would seem to me that if you don’t like using kits you would be happier playing something else. Please don’t take that as a snarky comment because I don’t mean it to be, it just seems that you are quite distraught over how you perceive what the class was meant to be versus what it currently is and just trying to save you some frustration.
Actually I’ve been playing a kit based engineer for about eight months now. I started out loving it, but now I’m just freaking sick of it. I want to change my build, but nothing else is viable, so that is getting a bit frustrating.
Do you primarily sPvP, WvW or PVE? The reason I ask is we certainly do have “viable” alternatives to kits, like a sd build, or a elixir based build, of course they are not “viable” for all areas of the game though. As an example I wouldn’t run elixirs in dungeons, or sd in a zerg scenario in WvW but either one of those work perfectly fine in other aspects of the game. I don’t often run tourney pvp so I can’t really advise there, but I do know that quite a few classes get pigeonholed into using one type of build in the tourney pvp meta which is why I primarily avoid it.
Considering that the Engineer is so much harder to play, it should be noticeably more powerful than other professions. I’m not getting that.
Mesmers are that way. A good Mesmer is properly rewarded by roflstomping entire parties.
It was a cold and blistery day, as we setup camp when I noticed upon the ridge what at first appearance could only be described as a man with intent in his eyes. That man lunged into our group bereft of consideration for his own safety, it seemed he was everywhere and nowhere at the same time. Shouts and cries of my comrades filled the air as they were stricken down one by one and for every one there were three more. Some shouted “He moves in unnatural ways”, others shouted “there are three of them!” but I quickly recognized the vile chaos that was being visited upon us. I ran quickly for the nearest cover since obviously there was no stopping this demon even with far superior numbers, better to run and live to fight another day! I watched the horror being visited upon the brave men from my sanctuary, they never had a chance…for they were against no ordinary man, but a mesmer!
Think of it like this, the tool belt skills are our utility slots and the actual utility slots are what we use to put in additional functionality either by adding more weapons or what have you. The main difference is that we don’t get to pick our utilities since they are tied directly to what we pick for our additional functions. What you are saying about the tool belt being our primary class mechanic is technically correct, but you really cannot compare it to other class mechanics because ours is unique to engineer.
You basically just said that our profession mechanic is that we don’t get to choose our utility skills.
Why am I the only one who see this as a problem?
Because I don’t view the engineer tool belt mechanic to be essential to the success of the class. It seems to me that you don’t like using kits (which that is perfectly fine to not) but knowing that they are a huge part of the class it would seem to me that if you don’t like using kits you would be happier playing something else. Please don’t take that as a snarky comment because I don’t mean it to be, it just seems that you are quite distraught over how you perceive what the class was meant to be versus what it currently is and just trying to save you some frustration.
Hmm, well I agree grenades can hit very hard I probably shouldn’t have said they “are not a power kit”. My stance is that given the 3 kits that were mentioned, I would build grenades first for conditions (to me it’s not even close) and last for power. Grenades can work for both, but my comments were mostly made with the idea that your other options were specifically FT and bombs.
For pve going power is definitely the way to go for any kind of group activity. You really want the the ability to front load large amounts of damage in short time spans as opposed to having the ramp up time of condi damage or the possibility of being overwritten. I use them as condi based in wvw/spvp mostly because I want the toughness from the rabid type stats.
Don’t worry about it, I’ll provide a visual aid so everyone knows exactly what traits I am speaking of. Please direct your attention to the attached jpg.
What you’re looking at is a copy of every profession’s fifth trait line, with a particular passive bonus received for investing points in said line highlighted with a red box. You’ll first notice that every one of those bonuses is even represented by that profession’s unique thumbnail icon. Now if you check a wiki or skill/trait builder web site you will notice that in every instance that bonus apples a small statistic buff (not an additional or altered function) to that profession’s unique mechanic, and that said bonus even relates directly or indirectly to the functionality that profession has linked to pressing one or more of the function (F#) keys. This is true across the board and without exception, even to in the case of the engineer, as the engineer’s bonus directly applies to the Tool Belt skills, and not in any way to kits.
It seems like you’re just bent on making the small narrow case that because kits are not F# mechanics that they are not a core part of gameplay. Sadly, I don’t see how this makes sense unless you made the analogy that the 5th trait line in other classes (outside of Ele) had something to do with beefing up alternate weaponsets.
But the real thrust of the problem with this argument, Arkham, is that you seem to be saying “Engineers are not like everyone else. And that’s a Bad Thing!” I don’t see that as cause for concern at all. Treat kits like alternate weapon sets, which is a core function (I would still hazard to say core mechanic) of other professions’ playability. You don’t want a second weapon set? That’s ok. But it would be disingenuous to believe that the profession should be expected to have the greatest degree of flexibility, optionality and diversity in play as if you did use it.
Well here is my issue, firstly if you insist on ignoring the F# argument, there are still five other points raised n my opening post you are not addressing. Secondly, and the major issue here, is that for every profession in the game the primary mechanic is not optional, it is a part of your character that you cannot change or go without. For engineers this is the tool belt, and kits provide the function of utility skills only. Now if this was our profession mechanic it is very poorly implemented, as that would make us the only profession in the game that has to sacrifice a utility skill slot in order to make use of our profession mechanic.
Finally some clarification; if kits were our profession mechanic I wouldn’t have a problem with it. If nothing else it would give more legitimacy to the reasoning why we can’t use actual weapon swapping, and explain why our profession is so strongly balanced to rely on kits. However what I take issue with is the fact that our profession is so strongly balanced around an optional utility skill type, and that means Arena Net’s poor balance forces us to sacrifice at least one utility slot on kits. Furthermore I take issue with players dismissing this problem with the false explanation that kits are our primary profession mechanic.
I concede that kits are a mechanic of our profession, and even a strong and important one. No different from warrior banners, guardian wards, mesmer mantras, elementalist glyphs, or thief venoms. But again I stress that these professions are not balanced with the assumption that they will be using these skill types, and have a much higher number of viable builds without those skill types than engineers have without kits.
As I said in my post to you in that other thread, it is painfully obvious that kits were supposed to be our primary mechanic. And they probably were at some point in development. But that doesn’t change the fact that they are not currently our primary mechanic, and our being balanced to use them almost to the exclusion of everything else is a very real problem with this profession, and a problem you are doing nothing to resolve and everything to propagate by passively insisting that our reliance on kits is somehow acceptable. If we don’t complain Arena Net will never fix this.
Think of it like this, the tool belt skills are our utility slots and the actual utility slots are what we use to put in additional functionality either by adding more weapons or what have you. The main difference is that we don’t get to pick our utilities since they are tied directly to what we pick for our additional functions. What you are saying about the tool belt being our primary class mechanic is technically correct, but you really cannot compare it to other class mechanics because ours is unique to engineer.
We’re way too dependent on kit switching. We need more traits like Juggernaut that reward the use of a single kit.
Why would you want to encourage people to stay in a single kit more? I mean there is already incentive in the way builds are made that you will favor certain kits over others but I don’t understand why anyone would want to sit in one kit. I can make assumptions to why, but I would rather not do that.
Perhaps so you don’t feel like you’re gimping yourself by picking a gadget or elixir over a second or third kit?
In most cases you would still be “gimping” yourself by reducing the amount of variety of skills you have available to you. Buffing staying in one kit won’t ever fix that problem, and some cases would make the other kits far too strong depending on what incentive they provide.
What about making the main weapons more meaningful that would provide a substantial alternative to remaining in kits the majority of time?
Basically if I am understanding correctly the argument is that people want alternatives to having to be so active with their kit management. I will say this and someone will probably jump on me for it but understand I mean no malice, but why play a engineer then? What I mean is, if someone wants to basically limit themselves to using two weapon skill bars, why not play another class that is already strong in such a scenario? Part of what makes the engineer strong is the ability to have a large range of skills available to them, it’s fairly evident if you look at the traits that gadgets are meant to be supplemental and not have a build based on them. Turrets have trait support (although turrets are a mess), elixirs have trait support, kits have trait support…gadgets have one cd reduction trait
I saw a tweet from the GW2 team saying to report anyone selling paths.
As for consequences of reporting, thats for the support team to decide, You would have to ask them directly about that.
Proof? Can you link?
https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/380793184047366144
Basically, report people that are selling spots through the LFG tool. Selling spots isn’t against the rules, but this would be abusing the tool to use it as an ad service.
Thank you good to know, looks like gw2lfg will still be fairly active heh.
We’re way too dependent on kit switching. We need more traits like Juggernaut that reward the use of a single kit.
Why would you want to encourage people to stay in a single kit more? I mean there is already incentive in the way builds are made that you will favor certain kits over others but I don’t understand why anyone would want to sit in one kit. I can make assumptions to why, but I would rather not do that.
Perhaps so you don’t feel like you’re gimping yourself by picking a gadget or elixir over a second or third kit?
In most cases you would still be “gimping” yourself by reducing the amount of variety of skills you have available to you. Buffing staying in one kit won’t ever fix that problem, and some cases would make the other kits far too strong depending on what incentive they provide.
Thing about bomb autoattack, i am not sure it takes into account Forceful Explosives. So if you have that trait active, you may be able to hurt someone but not see the autoattack happen. Never mind that they need to be in your arc of attack…
As for autofire on holding a button down with grenades, i strongly agree. I guess we will see how the “hold to aim, release to fire” option that will come in a month will work out.
Confused what you are saying about this. Do you mean that the explosion animation does not match the radius increase? Also it is a full 360 degree attack so they just need to be inside the radius of the attack and can be in any direction from your location.
Every skill has a attack range. if your target is within that range and in front of your character, and the skill is set to auto-attack (gold border), the skill will continue to fire on completed recharge.
The thing is that while the explosion radius of the bomb skills change with forceful explosions, i am not sure the attack range changes. I have more than once found myself tapping bomb kit #1 over and over because a mob took one step back and so ended up outside of attack range. But i was still hurting said mob because i had forceful explosions traited.
I got ya now, yeah I noticed this as well. I just got into habit of manually using 1 anyhow since many times I won’t even bother having a target selected if there is a group of mobs I am fighting. Against single enemies I am usually close enough that it is rarely a problem for me but it would be nice if Anet got around to fixing it some day to be sure!
Also, grenades are certainly not a power kit. They just apply too many conditions to be considered a power kit. Out of the kits you listed I would build both FT and bombs for power before grenades.
.Nades most certainly can be considered a power kit as its power scaling is very strong. For example we agree that the Rifle #1 skill is a pretty hard hitting power skill. It scales off power at a .65 coefficient. Nades #1 skill meanwhile has something like a .33 coefficient, however you throw 3 of them at a time (provided you trait for it). So if you manage to land all three nades, you’ll be getting the full return out of your power. That’s not including the other 2 nade skills that scale even better.
^this… also if you notice condi duration is in the power line, it’s for a reason. Helps make the vuln stacks stick around longer which benefits direct damage, and still allows conditions (if not cleared) to do a significant amount of additional damage over time through increased duration rather than increased effect.
Thing about bomb autoattack, i am not sure it takes into account Forceful Explosives. So if you have that trait active, you may be able to hurt someone but not see the autoattack happen. Never mind that they need to be in your arc of attack…
As for autofire on holding a button down with grenades, i strongly agree. I guess we will see how the “hold to aim, release to fire” option that will come in a month will work out.
Confused what you are saying about this. Do you mean that the explosion animation does not match the radius increase? Also it is a full 360 degree attack so they just need to be inside the radius of the attack and can be in any direction from your location.
We’re way too dependent on kit switching. We need more traits like Juggernaut that reward the use of a single kit.
Why would you want to encourage people to stay in a single kit more? I mean there is already incentive in the way builds are made that you will favor certain kits over others but I don’t understand why anyone would want to sit in one kit. I can make assumptions to why, but I would rather not do that.
Do we have the ability to put people on ignore? If they intend on releasing the LFG tool, at least give us a way to shield ourselves from abusive people.
Preferably, make it an account wide ignore.
Yes you can block people
But it doesn’t block them from ending up in another group with you.
I dunno, I am probably not the best person to talk to about this since I literally never block anyone. If someone for whatever reason decides to talk trash in a private message for example I just agree with whatever they are saying and they usually stop once they realize you literally could care less what their opinion is heh. I just don’t see a need to have all these tools for blocking/ignoring/avoiding what have you. Admittedly I have met people in other games that like to grief encounters and do stuff like intentionally get people killed so I guess it could be useful in that situation to be able to avoid those players, but really other than that…what do I care what some random says or thinks.
+1000, well done!
Do we have the ability to put people on ignore? If they intend on releasing the LFG tool, at least give us a way to shield ourselves from abusive people.
Preferably, make it an account wide ignore.
Yes you can block people
I saw a tweet from the GW2 team saying to report anyone selling paths.
As for consequences of reporting, thats for the support team to decide, You would have to ask them directly about that.
Proof? Can you link?
Both power and condition damage scale linearly. Critical damage and damage modifiers are what makes the difference.
Yeah it seems to me they should apply the damage modifiers to condition damage as well. If I had to guess the reason it doesn’t is to avoid “double dipping” since many skills do both power and condition damage. If they did ever add it that way classes like engineer or necro would be ridiculously strong in rampager gear.
So not necessary and would be ridiculous, secondly it wouldn’t make a difference in PvE because of condition caps.
I agree with you, conditions need a rework for pve. Problem is there is no solution to it without a complete redesign of how they function. Currently damage calcs are handled server side, this is why there is a cap on conditions. It would take far too much processing and bandwidth to have to calculate 100 people doing 25 stacks of bleeds that would be 2500 calculations per second that needs to have information sent back and forth between client and server and that is just for bleeds. To be honest I am not sure why they don’t allow damage calcs to be done on client side, other than perhaps it’s a security thought in that people can’t hack how much damage they do or possibly to lower the processor requirements for the individual users . Of course the numbers I used are just for demonstration purposes to make the math easy and I am not trying to suggest that there would ever be 100 people maintaining a full 25 stacks individually.
Both power and condition damage scale linearly. Critical damage and damage modifiers are what makes the difference.
Yeah it seems to me they should apply the damage modifiers to condition damage as well (excluding crit damage of course since condi damage doesn’t crit) . If I had to guess the reason it doesn’t is to avoid “double dipping” since many skills do both power and condition damage. If they did ever add it that way classes like engineer or necro would be ridiculously strong in rampager gear.
(edited by ShadowPuppet.3746)
@Shadowpuppet
Even if i conceded that rangers bring as much dps as a warrior and ONLY dps, it still doesn’t warrant giving them a spot since the utility they bring doesn’t surpass the utility other classes can bring as well as having the same dps. The thing about fitting in, sure a ranger might fit in IF they melee and stay with the group but since most of the ones I’ve grouped with are off in the back, if i play anchor guard for my group, that’s one less person i can use to heal myself off of and keep the boss planted so the rest of the group can go full out. And again i won’t even start with the ones who do that AND drop healing spring in the back on themselves and completely miss the other 4 people around the boss…..
I’ve met some very good rangers but 90% of them I’ve grouped with might as well be a bot since all they do is sit in the back about 50 miles from the group and pewpew…and still manage to somehow get downed…..
Bottom line is if you want to play a ranger, go for it. Get 80 and do dungeons and see how it goes from your own experience. If you pug, don’t be surprised if you get kicked. I know it still happens cause 2 days ago I was in a group where it was me as guard, another guard, warrior, Mesmer and a ranger and they booted the ranger to replace him with another warrior. Needless to say the run went smooth but I still see rangers getting kicked. But those thinking of rolling a ranger, go for it. It’s not like it costs anything and worst case, you will have an xtra char to farm Ori and Ancient wood with :P
They don’t bring a lot of group might that is for sure, they also won’t maintain a lot of vuln in melee, but they can add to fury and spotter and frost stack with warrior banners as an example. That is all I am getting at, they do comparable damage themselves when their pet is alive using a 1h sword. Spotter and frost spirit is something that no other class can bring (so it is clear I just mean that the warrior buffs that are similar don’t stack with another warrior buff but rangers buffs will stack with warrior buffs). Hopefully with the implied improvements to pets per J sharp, not only will the pets be more survivable but their f2 effects are getting a look see as well.
I do agree with you about a lot of rangers doing the exact thing they shouldn’t be doing, if you have a melee group you better run melee also or be darn close to melee. I see engineers do the same thing all the time and I literally want to pull my hair out. But as usual the problems lay more with the players themselves than what the class is actually capable of. Now that isn’t to say that the ranger class is free of actual problems, it’s just that many of the problems people associate with the class are actually related to players not adjusting properly for the scenarios they encounter.
(edited by ShadowPuppet.3746)
Possibly biased because engi is by far my favorite class and the one I play the most but…..I gotta agree with ukuni, there are very few times when I ever feel like I don’t have the tools I need to win. I mean sometimes you get people that just outplay you, or have a favorable build matchup to what you are using at the time but I find the unpredictability that we can bring to a fight makes it difficult for people to really get a read on what we are gonna pull out of our bag of tricks next.
They exist for PvP and WvW.
And in these environments glass cannon builds can still avoid damage incredibly well with invulns/stealth/etc. Who do you have more difficulty killing? A tank geared Warrior/Necro or glass cannon Thief/Ele? Considering the damage output of the glass cannon builds the survivability is remarkably similar. In many cases all out avoidance of damage is far superior than soaking damage. Either evasion is too strong or soaking is too weak.
The value of statistical mitigation versus active avoidance goes up with the amount of targets you are facing. In a 1v1 or 1v2 active avoidance will always trump stat mitigation, but start adding on larger numbers of opponents and value of statistical mitigation will increase since you can not possibly avoid all of the incoming damage.
On my guardian i have decided to go all out on toughness, healing power and power and to be honest… it doesnt work, AT ALL! I have more than 2000 toughness without using foods or any sort of buffs and i dont feel any tougher than the ele in my group that has less than 1000. I dont really notice that i have increased my healingpower in any way so that stat is most likely useless in any given form it comes. What i wanted to do with my guardian was to actually be a guardian but the direction this game is taking i highly doubt that is ever going to happen.
I love to play tanky/healing classes in game because it allows me to help others instead of being the attention kitten with the massive crits flying around the place, but when it comes to GW2 i feel that as a guardian wanting to guardian anything is like a very bad and embaresing 60’s english failed comedy.
That is because there is no such thing as traditional tanks or healers in this game. The way you “guard” people in this game is through the use of protection, aegis, reflect walls, removing conditions, so on and so forth. All of those types of things can be done in whatever gear you are wearing so you might as well just go full on damage provided you know the encounter well enough and know what to actively mitigate and what you can soak. The trinity of damage/support/control, exists in each class and each person playing will be doing all three of those things at any given time. It is not separated to where each person has a defined role like person A is damage, person B is control, person C is support, but rather person A is d/s/c, person B is d/s/c, person C is d/s/c.
Fair enough. Then why do all these stat combos even exist if they’re not viable? If we’re not meant to soak damage and just avoid it, why have toughness? If we’re not meant to be able to effectively heal allies, why have healing power?
As Colesy stated pvp, wvw. But also in pve they are useful for people who don’t yet know an encounter, or people with poor connections/computers etc etc. I know a lot of people throw that word “viable” around, but often it is used like it is synonymous for “optimal” which is a complete separate meaning. What I mean is, viable is a subjective term, because it will vary from one person to the next. You can complete any content in the game (with a few exceptions) with whatever gear you want to use so if your goal is simply to complete dungeons then any gear is “viable”. In terms of efficiency, there really is no comparison to using zerker gear once you know an encounter well enough though.
This is just my opinion, but I personally feel like what many people miss is that when Anet was speaking about this game before it was released, they touted explorable mode as basically being the equivalent of a raid in terms of needing to be organized to complete the content. What has happened though is that unorganized groups try do the content and all build for their own personal survivability as opposed to building around being a member of a organized group. I am sure I will get flamed for saying this but if I do actually pug something I very rarely run full glass cannon unless I can be sure that the people I am running with are all on the same page in terms of playstyle and build interactions. If I have one more solitary person standing at max range while the rest of the group is up in melee range tell me “Look I told you bearbow ranger too strong I am the last one left alive” I might possibly snap heh. That last part was a bit of comedy, but there is a lot of truth of why you see so much bitterness over things like that.
(edited by ShadowPuppet.3746)
Explosions are stupid. An Engineer is about creation, not destruction.
Im here for the turrets.TeamFortress2, Global Agenda, Tabula Rasa, Payday2, Warhammer online, even back in Perfect Dark with the laptop gun. Doesnt matter the game I always play the guy with the turrets.
So you are this guy eh?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NCERdh_-j4
On my guardian i have decided to go all out on toughness, healing power and power and to be honest… it doesnt work, AT ALL! I have more than 2000 toughness without using foods or any sort of buffs and i dont feel any tougher than the ele in my group that has less than 1000. I dont really notice that i have increased my healingpower in any way so that stat is most likely useless in any given form it comes. What i wanted to do with my guardian was to actually be a guardian but the direction this game is taking i highly doubt that is ever going to happen.
I love to play tanky/healing classes in game because it allows me to help others instead of being the attention kitten with the massive crits flying around the place, but when it comes to GW2 i feel that as a guardian wanting to guardian anything is like a very bad and embaresing 60’s english failed comedy.
That is because there is no such thing as traditional tanks or healers in this game. The way you “guard” people in this game is through the use of protection, aegis, reflect walls, removing conditions, so on and so forth. All of those types of things can be done in whatever gear you are wearing so you might as well just go full on damage provided you know the encounter well enough and know what to actively mitigate and what you can soak. The trinity of damage/support/control, exists in each class and each person playing will be doing all three of those things at any given time. It is not separated to where each person has a defined role like person A is damage, person B is control, person C is support, but rather person A is d/s/c, person B is d/s/c, person C is d/s/c.
It was a figurative example. Of course it does not on every mob in the game, but I am not wrong about drawing the comparison. I know you like the ft Phin, and more power to you. But you yourself even state in your guides that the ft is not a dps weapon right? At least not compared to other options available to the engineer.
That’s a bit more of a sweeping dismissal of the kit than I intended with my post.
My FT/EG build is designed around a balanced playstyle offering good DPS with good support through condition removal, area healing, and group boon stacking (Might and Fury primarily). But you could very easily swap out Altruism runes for Scholar runes and dish out over 3.5K direct damage a second with the FT/EG combo (2K from Flame Jet, 1.5K from Acid Bomb).
My post is more so a response to the claim that the Flamethrower’s auto-attack, Flame Jet, does “terrible” damage—something several users, including you, have claimed in this thread.
No seriously FT AA is terrible for damage.
Flamethrower auto sucks. It’s horrible. Don’t use it, ever.
Do you really think my assertion of promoting a balanced setup with the FT/EG is even remotely close to the claim that Flame Jet is not worth using in any capacity or by definition does “terrible” damage?
The general point (actual numbers aside because it is too late to start breaking out skill coefficients) is that the ft auto really does not perform a function that another setup could not do better.
People always say this, but I don’t see any builds posted that come close to the strength of the natural hybrid of an FT/EG Engineer.
You can pretend putting an Elixir Gun on your bar without Fireforged Trigger means you’re offering as strong support as my build does, or that you’re offering the same boons with zero points in Alchemy, but in reality: you’re not.
There are offsets to everything, and you cannot continually lambast the Flamethrower for its loss of 300 Power not speccing into Explosives while pretending at the same time that 20% Boon Duration or 20% cooldown reduction on Super Elixir doesn’t matter at all.
It’s selective reasoning/confirmation bias at its finest, which…
Now listen I admit, my view is based entirely on doing as much damage as possible while still providing support through group might and vuln and clearing conditions through the eg if need be, but I don’t need to trait for the condi clear part to work.
…Is something you admit yourself, in more or less words. You found a build that works to the playstyle that you desire. And that’s great. I’m glad for you. Keep running what you think is the optimal setup for what you want out of your Engineer.
Just please stop insulting my build at the same time. Thanks.
Phin, it is not an insult to your build. It is a criticism of the flamethrower auto attack in terms of doing damage. The skill coefficient of ft auto is 1.5 total for a 2.5 second channel, compare that to grenade kit at .33 per grenade, or bomb auto at 1.25 both on .5 second cast times. That means that even if it were to take 1 full second because of aftercast for each of those attacks, you can still get 2 full attacks off in the same amount of time. Your build works perfectly for what it is intended to do, but it is not competitive dps compared to our other kits or other classes, ft auto does not keep up. The qualifier for this is if you are concerned with doing as much damage as possible or not. Can you complete content in any build you want? Absolutely, heck you can run dungeons or do other content naked half the time if you know the encounter well enough. But in terms of doing damage, I will state it again FT auto is terrible full stop.
Engineers: How do you get ANYTHING done?!
Simple – We make the best of it. We are absolutely wracked with bugs, and believed mediocrity compared to the other classes. You can roll a bad thief and still do okay. Likewise, a bad warrior could probably still get a few kills in. You cannot survive as a bad engineer.
Because of this, I almost see our believed mediocrity as a blessing. I KNOW my class.
Probably makes no sense, but that is just my opinion.
Pretty much how I feel, I am perfectly content with people not understanding engineer. Once people go to other classes it keeps our secrets safe heh.
I wish I was a tester. No, it’s from the leaked patch notes. There’s a buff to every minion health (except mesmer minions since they already got the same buff). It’s mentioned at the start of the pastebin as opposed to the ranger section, since it applies to all minions.
Not just the leaked unofficial patch notes, but also from J sharp.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/October-15th-balance-skills-updates-preview/first
Turrets are for pvp (rifle and healing work for pve though). Flamethrower auto sucks. It’s horrible. Don’t use it, ever. Grenades don’t do damage till level 60. Don’t autoattack with flamethrower. Bomb autos are strong if you like being all in your face, just make sure to use explosives III so they can hit. Stop using flamethrower autos, it may look cool, but it is not good for dealing damage. Rocket boots are like, awesome mobility. Make sure you have swiftness when using them for a further jump. I can tell you’re using flamethrower autos. What did I say about flamethrower autos?
Someone doesn’t know how to properly use the flamethrower.
Hint: There is a reason the trait line that effects the flamethrower just so happens to be the precision line.
No seriously FT AA is terrible for damage. I mean possibly if you wan’t to make it proc bleeds or burns but um…. grenades will still do that better lol. I like the playstyle of the ft/eg combo so don’t get me wrong but yeah the aa is garbage for damage.
Going from “terrible for damage” to “don’t use it” displays a pretty big lack of understanding of what the skill is for. Yes; the damage is less than impressive (unless….), but that doesn’t mean you should just outright say “never use flamethrower autos” because the skill actually is extremely useful if you have the right build and know what you’re doing.
I wasn’t the person you originally were responding to. The point still stands though (especially in pve) where it literally is a damage loss over any other option we have except maybe pistol auto. It is not particularly useful as a vuln stacker, or condition applier compared to grenades. It is however great for tagging mobs easily, but that is seriously the only reason to use the ft aa in pve. Juggernaut is a selfish trait in terms of adding might since it only applies to you, and requires that you spend more time in the ft than needed to maintain those might stacks. As an example the ft when traited and at 25 might and vuln you might get 7-8k damage from the entire 2.5s channel? Bomb auto can do 8.5k in the same circumstances per .9s attack (yes I know the bomb is .5s cast time but there is a .4s aftercast. Now since you have said multiple times that if someone knows how to use the ft correctly or knows how to build, perhaps you can explain the situation where ft aa is useful that isn’t simply for tagging mobs for loot in a zerg.
And how much is that damage when you factor in the constant burning and ever growing bleed stacks? Then when you add a nice on-crit sigil, what happens? If you’re only using the might and vulnerability you’re not reaching your full potential. Plus you have to factor in how much easier it is to strike multiple foes with the flamethrower than the bomb kit. In my opinion the raw damage to ease of use ratio should be considered when determining a given skill’s overall viability.
Bomb is a full 360 degree attack you don’t even need to aim just be in the general vicinity. Yes the burning and bleeding add some damage but c’mon, you really think it is going to match up to 8.5k? Seriously ft aa is horrible hands down don’t use it.
The Bomb Kit does not auto-attack for 8.5K on every mob in the game. Please stop using it as a goalpost for other kits to strive towards.
It was a figurative example. Of course it does not on every mob in the game, but I am not wrong about drawing the comparison. I know you like the ft Phin, and more power to you. But you yourself even state in your guides that the ft is not a dps weapon right? At least not compared to other options available to the engineer. The general point (actual numbers aside because it is too late to start breaking out skill coefficients) is that the ft auto really does not perform a function that another setup could not do better. Now listen I admit, my view is based entirely on doing as much damage as possible while still providing support through group might and vuln and clearing conditions through the eg if need be, but I don’t need to trait for the condi clear part to work.
Turrets are for pvp (rifle and healing work for pve though). Flamethrower auto sucks. It’s horrible. Don’t use it, ever. Grenades don’t do damage till level 60. Don’t autoattack with flamethrower. Bomb autos are strong if you like being all in your face, just make sure to use explosives III so they can hit. Stop using flamethrower autos, it may look cool, but it is not good for dealing damage. Rocket boots are like, awesome mobility. Make sure you have swiftness when using them for a further jump. I can tell you’re using flamethrower autos. What did I say about flamethrower autos?
Someone doesn’t know how to properly use the flamethrower.
Hint: There is a reason the trait line that effects the flamethrower just so happens to be the precision line.
No seriously FT AA is terrible for damage. I mean possibly if you wan’t to make it proc bleeds or burns but um…. grenades will still do that better lol. I like the playstyle of the ft/eg combo so don’t get me wrong but yeah the aa is garbage for damage.
Going from “terrible for damage” to “don’t use it” displays a pretty big lack of understanding of what the skill is for. Yes; the damage is less than impressive (unless….), but that doesn’t mean you should just outright say “never use flamethrower autos” because the skill actually is extremely useful if you have the right build and know what you’re doing.
I wasn’t the person you originally were responding to. The point still stands though (especially in pve) where it literally is a damage loss over any other option we have except maybe pistol auto. It is not particularly useful as a vuln stacker, or condition applier compared to grenades. It is however great for tagging mobs easily, but that is seriously the only reason to use the ft aa in pve. Juggernaut is a selfish trait in terms of adding might since it only applies to you, and requires that you spend more time in the ft than needed to maintain those might stacks. As an example the ft when traited and at 25 might and vuln you might get 7-8k damage from the entire 2.5s channel? Bomb auto can do 8.5k in the same circumstances per .9s attack (yes I know the bomb is .5s cast time but there is a .4s aftercast. Now since you have said multiple times that if someone knows how to use the ft correctly or knows how to build, perhaps you can explain the situation where ft aa is useful that isn’t simply for tagging mobs for loot in a zerg.
And how much is that damage when you factor in the constant burning and ever growing bleed stacks? Then when you add a nice on-crit sigil, what happens? If you’re only using the might and vulnerability you’re not reaching your full potential. Plus you have to factor in how much easier it is to strike multiple foes with the flamethrower than the bomb kit. In my opinion the raw damage to ease of use ratio should be considered when determining a given skill’s overall viability.
Bomb is a full 360 degree attack you don’t even need to aim just be in the general vicinity. Yes the burning and bleeding add some damage but c’mon, you really think it is going to match up to 8.5k? Seriously ft aa is horrible hands down don’t use it.
Bombs are also close range, the flamethrower attacks from distance and keeps you safe. And again; yes the flamethrower auto attack is bad for damage, but that doesn’t mean you have to use it for damage. It is a buff/debuff attack depending on what kind of on-crit procs you have.
I guess I am just one of those zany engineers that spends their time in melee range even when using grenades. Perma vigor is my friend! As far as buff/debuff goes, yes technically speaking because of the large amounts of hits that happen per second it is good for proccing since you will be guaranteed to get a proc, but almost every sigil and trait has a cd on crit effects. Precise sights does not and sharpshooter does not,but again gk vuln and bleed stacks better when built for it and. incendiary powder is a single target only. You can use the swift on crit to trigger invigorating speed for vigor, but chances are if you are running 0/25/0/20/25 you will have speedy kits. I just am not seeing the usefulness of the aa. But look if you like using it go ahead and do so, people can play how they wish, just be aware that not all options are created equal.
Turrets are for pvp (rifle and healing work for pve though). Flamethrower auto sucks. It’s horrible. Don’t use it, ever. Grenades don’t do damage till level 60. Don’t autoattack with flamethrower. Bomb autos are strong if you like being all in your face, just make sure to use explosives III so they can hit. Stop using flamethrower autos, it may look cool, but it is not good for dealing damage. Rocket boots are like, awesome mobility. Make sure you have swiftness when using them for a further jump. I can tell you’re using flamethrower autos. What did I say about flamethrower autos?
Someone doesn’t know how to properly use the flamethrower.
Hint: There is a reason the trait line that effects the flamethrower just so happens to be the precision line.
No seriously FT AA is terrible for damage. I mean possibly if you wan’t to make it proc bleeds or burns but um…. grenades will still do that better lol. I like the playstyle of the ft/eg combo so don’t get me wrong but yeah the aa is garbage for damage.
Going from “terrible for damage” to “don’t use it” displays a pretty big lack of understanding of what the skill is for. Yes; the damage is less than impressive (unless….), but that doesn’t mean you should just outright say “never use flamethrower autos” because the skill actually is extremely useful if you have the right build and know what you’re doing.
I wasn’t the person you originally were responding to. The point still stands though (especially in pve) where it literally is a damage loss over any other option we have except maybe pistol auto. It is not particularly useful as a vuln stacker, or condition applier compared to grenades. It is however great for tagging mobs easily, but that is seriously the only reason to use the ft aa in pve. Juggernaut is a selfish trait in terms of adding might since it only applies to you, and requires that you spend more time in the ft than needed to maintain those might stacks. As an example the ft when traited and at 25 might and vuln you might get 7-8k damage from the entire 2.5s channel? Bomb auto can do 8.5k in the same circumstances per .9s attack (yes I know the bomb is .5s cast time but there is a .4s aftercast. Now since you have said multiple times that if someone knows how to use the ft correctly or knows how to build, perhaps you can explain the situation where ft aa is useful that isn’t simply for tagging mobs for loot in a zerg.
And how much is that damage when you factor in the constant burning and ever growing bleed stacks? Then when you add a nice on-crit sigil, what happens? If you’re only using the might and vulnerability you’re not reaching your full potential. Plus you have to factor in how much easier it is to strike multiple foes with the flamethrower than the bomb kit. In my opinion the raw damage to ease of use ratio should be considered when determining a given skill’s overall viability.
Bomb is a full 360 degree attack you don’t even need to aim just be in the general vicinity. Yes the burning and bleeding add some damage but c’mon, you really think it is going to match up to 8.5k? Seriously ft aa is horrible hands down don’t use it.
Turrets are for pvp (rifle and healing work for pve though). Flamethrower auto sucks. It’s horrible. Don’t use it, ever. Grenades don’t do damage till level 60. Don’t autoattack with flamethrower. Bomb autos are strong if you like being all in your face, just make sure to use explosives III so they can hit. Stop using flamethrower autos, it may look cool, but it is not good for dealing damage. Rocket boots are like, awesome mobility. Make sure you have swiftness when using them for a further jump. I can tell you’re using flamethrower autos. What did I say about flamethrower autos?
Someone doesn’t know how to properly use the flamethrower.
Hint: There is a reason the trait line that effects the flamethrower just so happens to be the precision line.
No seriously FT AA is terrible for damage. I mean possibly if you wan’t to make it proc bleeds or burns but um…. grenades will still do that better lol. I like the playstyle of the ft/eg combo so don’t get me wrong but yeah the aa is garbage for damage.
Going from “terrible for damage” to “don’t use it” displays a pretty big lack of understanding of what the skill is for. Yes; the damage is less than impressive (unless….), but that doesn’t mean you should just outright say “never use flamethrower autos” because the skill actually is extremely useful if you have the right build and know what you’re doing.
I wasn’t the person you originally were responding to. The point still stands though (especially in pve) where it literally is a damage loss over any other option we have except maybe pistol auto. It is not particularly useful as a vuln stacker, or condition applier compared to grenades. It is however great for tagging mobs easily, but that is seriously the only reason to use the ft aa in pve. Juggernaut is a selfish trait in terms of adding might since it only applies to you, and requires that you spend more time in the ft than needed to maintain those might stacks. As an example the ft when traited and at 25 might and vuln you might get 7-8k damage from the entire 2.5s channel? Bomb auto can do 8.5k in the same circumstances per .9s attack (yes I know the bomb is .5s cast time but there is a .4s aftercast). Now since you have said multiple times that if someone knows how to use the ft correctly or knows how to build, but have not said what your scenarios are in which the ft auto is useful, perhaps you could explain the basis for your assertion?
(edited by ShadowPuppet.3746)
Turrets are for pvp (rifle and healing work for pve though). Flamethrower auto sucks. It’s horrible. Don’t use it, ever. Grenades don’t do damage till level 60. Don’t autoattack with flamethrower. Bomb autos are strong if you like being all in your face, just make sure to use explosives III so they can hit. Stop using flamethrower autos, it may look cool, but it is not good for dealing damage. Rocket boots are like, awesome mobility. Make sure you have swiftness when using them for a further jump. I can tell you’re using flamethrower autos. What did I say about flamethrower autos?
Someone doesn’t know how to properly use the flamethrower.
Hint: There is a reason the trait line that effects the flamethrower just so happens to be the precision line.
No seriously FT AA is terrible for damage. I mean possibly if you wan’t to make it proc bleeds or burns but um…. grenades will still do that better lol. I like the playstyle of the ft/eg combo so don’t get me wrong but yeah the aa is garbage for damage.
Why do we need 50% faster endurance regen when we can have permanent vigor from kit swap or on crit with a 20 pt investment in lines that most players will run anyhow? That trait does not stack with vigor, the only time that trait is useful is if you are running a sd build which most likely you will be going 30 in tools anyhow.
Even then you would still be better off taking another trait instead of adrenal implant and spending a few more points on alchemy if u wanted faster regen.
Consider that even if you forget to put up swiftness for half the time you play, invigorating speed would still be on par with adrenal implant.Anyways we have some game changing skills, but there are other skills I would like to see completely changed.
Auto bomb dispenser: If you need defense for when disabled, protection injection (and stabilized armor to an extend) does it way better on a much much shorter cooldown.
Adrenal Implant: People have already stated why its not grandmaster worthy
Armor Mods: I’m actually half and half on this one….I guess aegis might save someone but at the same time it feels underwhelming. Maybe have a cd reduction on it.
On demand vigor is on par with 50% endurance regen since when? Seriously if someone can’t figure out how/when to use vigor on demand effectively the issue is with the player not the trait. I should have been more clear in my post when I was saying that adrenal implant is mostly useless, but there are certain situations in which it can be of value. Either way the person I was responding too was complaining that engi’s 50% endurance regen is a 25 point and ranger’s is a 5 point. I was trying to draw attention to the fact that there is no need in trying to compare the two since we can literally have permanent vigor whenever we want with a 20 point investment. Don’t get me wrong there are some traits that are a bit out of place or under performing but that holds true for literally every single class.
you’re level 20 crying for buffs.
next thread.You say the same thing when a level 80 asks for buffs.
Why are you on these forums if you have nothing to contribute to discussion?
Our traitlines DO suck.
-One of our MAJOR GRANDMASTER traits is a MINOR ADEPT TRAIT for Rangers. 50% faster endurance regen IS NOT GRANDMASTER MATERIAL.
-Infused Precision is the same as Furious Speed (Warrior), but triggers half as often and lasts half as long.All of our Grandmasters are pretty bad, but there are also many other traits (like Scope) that are even more useless.
Why do we need 50% faster endurance regen when we can have permanent vigor from kit swap or on crit with a 20 pt investment in lines that most players will run anyhow? That trait does not stack with vigor, the only time that trait is useful is if you are running a sd build which most likely you will be going 30 in tools anyhow.
(edited by ShadowPuppet.3746)
Meh, if you are willing to run 1h sword and get good with it, you can bring some serious dps to a dungeon group (easily on par with a warrior), add in spotter and frost spirit and enjoy.
I disagree… warriors come with more base armor and hitpoints. Warriors can go full zerk and have as much survivability as a PVT ranger while dishing out a significantly higher DPS. Even zerk against zerk my Ranger cannot compete DPS wise with either my thief or warrior.
Tell me then if you would be so kind, how are you computing your dps values? I mean actual damage per second not damage per activation.
Easiest way, do a run with 4 rangers and then do a run with 4 warriors and see which is faster and smoother.
~snipped~
That literally still does nothing to prove a dps calculation. The reason it would not work with 4 rangers as well as it would with 4 warriors is because of the difficulties in maintaining might and vuln with the rangers. I never made a claim that ranger brings anything to a party except comparable dps using a 1h sword and spotter and frost spirit. If a party can maintain might and vuln at 25 stacks with the other 4 classes brought, then it is worthwhile to bring the ranger along for spotter and frost. Is it a pug friendly class? No obviously not as much as a warrior is, but there are several guilds that realize the value of having what the ranger can bring to the party. This is why I said what I did in my original post that was only partially quoted and mostly what you are responding too. It is a matter of perception and understanding how classes can fit together with a bit of planning.
Meh, if you are willing to run 1h sword and get good with it, you can bring some serious dps to a dungeon group (easily on par with a warrior), add in spotter and frost spirit and enjoy.
I disagree… warriors come with more base armor and hitpoints. Warriors can go full zerk and have as much survivability as a PVT ranger while dishing out a significantly higher DPS. Even zerk against zerk my Ranger cannot compete DPS wise with either my thief or warrior.
Tell me then if you would be so kind, how are you computing your dps values? I mean actual damage per second not damage per activation.
Meh, if you are willing to run 1h sword and get good with it, you can bring some serious dps to a dungeon group (easily on par with a warrior), add in spotter and frost spirit and enjoy. I will agree that ranger may not be the most zerg friendly profession but it is far from useless even there. It does have some issues with pets being one shot against certain mechanics but hopefully the oct 15th patch that adds increased pet health will help some with that. That is not to say that ranger does not have some problems, but all classes do and many times the players who will say x or y class are terrible, simply have not tried to take the time to learn the class or adapt to a play style they may not like for themselves. This is why you will always see some people say a class is terrible and someone else come along and say no it’s not because largely it’s a matter of preference. Can you contribute to a team? Absolutely, it just depends on if you are willing to use certain things in order to achieve that and learn how to properly use those certain things to their best effect.
So um, since tequatl needs players at various areas like defending the cannons and such cant you just stay away from the waves and still get credit? I mean that is assuming people can ever actually get organized enough to down the kitten thing lol
“Because Zerks rhymes with Jerks! Therefore anyone who runs zerker gear must be a kitten by default.”
This is basically the logic that many people use. Unfortunately certain members of our community really enjoy trumping themselves up. When people speak of zerker gear being the most efficient it’s technically correct (provided the player and group can manage it), but sometimes that assertion is also followed by a insult. It makes the message get lost and people stop focusing on the factual information in terms of it being efficient and focus on what is then perceived as a personal attack against them.
This is a solo example, and could actually have had slightly better times if offhand axe was also used for path of scars. In a group situation where you are getting sustained might and vuln, dps for this setup is really quite good, the only downside is of course that it requires that everyone in your party is running max dps and melee to be as effective as it can be since your survivability is linked directly to stuff dying quickly.
No that is not the problem. Try the following:
Go to the Mists and get within melee range of a test golem.
Turn off sword autoattack.
Hit #1 twice. This will do a regular attack, then a leap attack.
Immediately after the leap attack finishes, hit dodge.You won’t dodge. For some inexplicable reason, you can’t dodge for about 1 sec immediately after you finish a leap attack (might be true of all leap attacks, I haven’t tested). The problem isn’t during the leap, it’s after.
It’s an unnecessary restriction because if you tap a movement key immediately after the leap, then you can dodge immediately. It’s only if you try to go straight from leap -> dodge that the game imposes the ~1 sec lockout.
Exactly this, if they got rid of that lockout period I would be completely satisfied with the sword. Obviously someone should not be able to evade mid leap, but anytime between a leap they should be able to.
“Ascended weapons, preventing skin cancer one grind at a time”
I don’t understand the use of “butter” in describing a games performance. I do get that it is being used in a positive way based upon context.
So um, what does it all mean?
Think of the texture of butter as being smooth.