And those massive mid fights are exactly where your healing and CC will be appreciated the most.
Not exactly, but you’d be at a certain disadvantage at times.
Except no one actually used either tome.
P/P, signet of malice and assassins reward on acro. Take trickery for the added initiative if you’d like, but crit strikes and deadly arts = a ton of damage. Signet of malice and assassins reward heal for about 1.5k per unload. Have a necro share that leech aura and you can quite literally face tank anything that isn’t intended to one shot you AND deal a ton of damage.
Except none of these things apply when the mesmer can basically insta kill the target. Also, entangle is probably one of the most telegraphed skills in the game.
I guess we’ll just have to wait and see what goes on in the tournaments after HoT drops.
Don’t forget the /dance after you win.
The thing about true shot is that it finally gives guardians something they’ve been desperately needing for a long time and that is the ability to bait dodges/defensive CDs. You basically give the opponent 3 choices when you start charging true shot (assuming you wait until they dont have enough time to LoS).
They can do the following:
1- take the damage, which only slightly shies behind a full WW.
2- burn a dodge/escape
3- burn an offensive interrupt when they weren’t planning to.
And then you give them that set of options again in 4s. Idk about you guys, but I’m certain every optimal non-guardian spec has access to only a few (1-3 passive/active) forms of damage mitigation and dodges don’t recover that quickly (even with vigor). Being able to properly pressure a target at around 900-1000 range (cuz as was already mentioned, 1200 range is too easy for the enemy to avoid) combined with all of our defenses, teleports, etc is a very potent combination. Are there stronger things in the game? Definitely. Could there be improvements done? Of course, but I personally prefer they don’t try tweaking things since their “tweaks” usually screw up the class entirely either for the people using the class or the people facing the class (see burn guard rage threads all over PvP).
^its things like this that give me hope in players. Get creative and find aloooooot more solutions.
i regret my purchase so much i am now entirely opposed to capitalism as a whole-tier
- Dragonhunter
- Daredevil
These are the only two specs I’m actually looking forward to T.T.
Idk man, glint/ventari come with a similar amount of boon support, aoe healing, only with reveal and an asston of CC. All I’m seeing here that bunker guard can do that bunker rev can’t is dedicated res support.
Pressure the unholy kitten out of the ranger. Always get the first hit. Remain aware of the situation. When a team fight is going on and I see a mesmer or ranger hiding at the sidelines, I jump the ranger with such quickness. If you get hit by the taunt regardless, I burn shadowstep a decent distance away, watch for the wolf running to you for the fear and steal into the ranger. Start cutting him and return to your original spot. Wolf tries following again, shadow shot into ranger and continue pressure. Look out for the rangers knockback, since they’ll try to pin you down for the fear to land and then its basically GG. Just gotta see into their attacks before they actually land. Unfortunately, thief doesn’t have many get out of jail free cards, so your eyes have to be sharp and your movements even sharper.
Bunker guard is about to die off thanks to ventari and druid. If you enjoy cleric guardian, pick one of those two. Entire landscape is changing anyways.
-snip-.
Ranger, without tricking pets out for taunt, only has LB knock back. Assuming GS and not some boring shoutbow build, warrior has two quick (and very powerful) gap closers and GS toss. Taking stances and the stance line (defense, iirc) gives warrior access to nearly 10s of invuln and balanced stance(while ticking signet). This isn’t considering the other two utilities and elite, or his other two trait lines. If he brings hammer with his GS, the ranger may as well just run back to spawn and save himself the struggle and time wasted. I’m not mentioning ranger’s GS since tangoing with a warrior in melee without a consistent form of damage mitigation is a death wish. SoS would basically prolong the inevitable.
Idk what you guys do wrong, but the mesmers I know nearly insta kill anyone with under 20k HP who isn’t ready. Like, its not even a fight. If the target survives thanks to a passive proc, they stealth and either wait until they can burst again or swap to their alt set and go to town.
For guard, don’t assume burn. Burn is far too easy to counter if the guard doesn’t bring a million mini condis to cover the burn. A power guardian, on the other hand, will thank you for the free might and basically pound you into dust. If the guard can land any one of his 1million forms of damage mitiagation to avoid the knock back, the following rapid fire doesn’t land then GG.
You speak about decent level. What level is this? I know our definitions of decent differ greatly since there’s a reason why ranger hasnt been meta for over a year now.
I suppose I should’ve specified builds for my previous response, but oh well.
@Rogue
You go stealth. Ranger uses sic em. You stay in stealth and try running around and then get hilariously rekt or……use steal or basilisk venom and start pressuring early. All it’d take if running the meta d/p is steal > heartseeker > stabstabstab > blind the knock back and Dodge the rapid fire. At that point, the ranger would be severely distressed and popping all of the invulns and heals trying to stay alive. If you catch the ranger before the sic em takes effect, you could shadowshot and back stab before the sic em takes effect THEN get your combo going.
Its not rocket science and I know the better thieves out there have even more ways of taking care of such a simple spec.
Also, for the people looking to make comparisons, we have warriors’s pin down doing the same with an equally powerful effect. Don’t see warriors complaining about that skill eh :P?
I have. In fact, all I’ve BEEN playing is thief for the last month, getting my skills up to snuff before HoT. Also, I HAVE run into a game of 2/3+ rangers in one team. The usual burst rotation is more than enough to down one instantly. It also helps incredibly that they’re one trick ponies and their stuff is so easy to evade. Since all of the rangers are too busy shooting at the people they can see, steal+w.e burst combo you prefer from behind a wall when they don’t expect it is the eeeeasiest thing to do.
Naturally, this only works when the targets are spread out. If they’re clustered together? Your team can’t bomb three tightly packed squishies? Hell, mesmer could make ridiculously easy work of that. Also, if your class has access to it, take a reflect if you see that many rangers. It isn’t rocket science, really.
There’s a reason why rangers see almost no play at higher levels.
All it takes is one guardian, thief, mesmer, or warrior to completely shut that ranger down.
Matchmaking thought you were good enough to face a top tier player…..or three. Matchmaking believes in you, about time you believed in yourself.
Trapper is a certainly a nasty surprise the first time around, but once you see the ranger pretty much remaining static inside the boundaries of the point, you know when their traps are ready. Like a lot of people have said, heavy range pressure (p/p teef, lb ranger/DH, mesmer, cele signet necro) will make the ranger’s day a lot harder. TBH, I’m scared of the trappers who realize that getting creative with their traps instead of squatting on the point all day would increase their effectiveness 10fold.
Stop trying to crush my dreams you kittens T.T. Bow gerdian and jumpteef op.
But have it play exactly like necro, but more mobility?
Passives are unhealthy. Yet they keep being pilled on. Makes no sense.
Agreed.
Or rather, I’d like add my own elaboration to that. Passive RNG or passive invulns are unhealthy. My warrior build, for instance, relies on heightened focus and the signet trait to land an unblockable 100b to do a whopping 17k damage on targets with any damage reduction boons or utilities. These are all passive procs I KNOW are going to happen and when. If you see me nail you with a bulls rush and get quickness, you better have saved a stun break.
Things like passive elixir s or vampire runes, or on crit sigils, make the game ridiculous. I should not be firing one pistol shot from my thief without might or vuln and randomly hit 5k and finish you while you were escaping.
Bow beats scepter every time. THERE SHALL BE NO FURTHER DISCUSSION ON THIS TOPIC.
Whether relying on stealth or evades to cleanse condis and avoid damage is more efficient has yet to be seen, but with all of the reveal and how stealth won’t stop that reaper or tempest from aoeing you to kingdom come my bet is on the evades providing a more powerful impact. Simply put, DD gives thieves the tools they need to actually tango with an enemy that core thief does not. May not be overpowered, but almost seems mandatory.
I suppose my opinion just isn’t shared by the rest of you guys, ah well.
I wouldn’t consider the black blurs they do to be smokey. I’ll agree that theives do use shadow magic, but to turn thief into another tanky shadow based caster that nukes whole parties isn’t the way this class should go. If that’s what you want, necro and reaper await. Hell, even mesmer suits the stealthy caster role better than thief would.
Daredevil may have retained the aesthetic, but the theme behind it (and behind most of thief’s skills in general) is speed and evasion. S/D (and staff to a lesser extent) is dedicated entirely to that. We now have TWO trait lines dedicated to evasion.
I understand the nostalgia a good game could bring about (I was too young and broke to enjoy GW1), but trying to bring a game’s mechanics with entirely different functions and mechanics around to a game like GW2 is exactly what we SHOULDNT be doing. We need less homogenization of classes while still aiming to make them different while certain game modes obviously cater more to certain classes. I understand everyone’s desire to make thief better, but making them like other classes isn’t the way to go. Why not try suggesting something that plays on thief’s strengths (or weaknesses, without making them facetankers).
That’s the problem. If you want to look at it thematically, thieves aren’t characterised by their stealth. They’re characterised by their subtlety and/or deftness of their fighting style. Mobile, quick, accurate and precise. The stealth just feeds into that. Having them run around with gray/black smoke and blowing things up kinda looks like…..
Necros death shroud.
If you want to suggest something tied to stealth (I have no idea why anyone would want to do this, what with all of the reveal flying around), have it tied to this sort of stealthy teleport barrage. Have the thief start in a location and, like S/D, teleport towards their target, strike, drop two markers before/after/during the strike and have the thief teleport to the marker of his choosing, stealth and then repeat the flurry until he either misses, is blocked, or is blinded. Each two successive markers placed have even less range and even less duration but increased stealth duration and damage per strike. If the thief is fighting more than one enemy he can choose to continue and follow up on that new target with a 50% increase in damage (after all of the boosts) that should one shot the next enemy. The increasing ramp up of damage is meant to reward the thief for actually landing all of these hits, but counterplay, aside from guessing when a stealthed target is about to strike, lies in smashing the markers or using some of the copious amounts of reveal that will be running around in the game in less than 48 hours.
Thoughts?
Sounds great buuuut all of this death shadow business kinda seems more up necros alley x.×.
What is, generally, the amount your average micro transaction must reach when it gives you an advantage for it to be considered pay2win?
It’s not the amount of micro transactions… it’s something that’s readily available for purchase via micro transactions that gives a clear advantage. Another example is say there were “VIP” weapons that you could buy (ofc they expire after x days or don’t and just VIPv2 weapons come out) that had a 20% stat increase on ascended gear.
So…
Something readily available for purchase….
That gives an advantage….
Like HoT?
HoT is a mixed basket.
In terms of Necro -> Reaper, yes it is Pay-2-Win…I haven’t steam rolled anyone in PvP using a Necro before. Reaper with 100% crit chance and applying 12 stacks of Vulnerability is definitely a definition of pay to win.
However, DD is hardly a pay to win, nor is Tempest, nor is Dragon Hunter. Berserker is meh.
So overall, it even itself out.
Hey, I love DD and DH T.T.
DH gives guard a universal gap closer that immobilizes and heals when traited and looks kitten cool. They also get even smarter usage of their VoC which is just so sweet. I’m on the fence for the VoJ since it only REALLY does something for condi guards and even then, it requires a lot of traiting.
DD gives thieves the option of actively negating damage (tons of evade when traited) AND a rather acceptable way of cleansing conditions (imagine how many condis a guard would cleanse FOR you with WW xD?). Not to mention that dodges don’t remove cap contribution meaning that thieves that want to avoid damage/cleanse AND hold a point 1v1 are capable of doing so. Are specs like reaper deadly as balls? Sure, but I’ve seen enough DDs humiliate a reaper in melee range to know that DD may not fit into the current meta, but they’re plenty strong.
Personally, I can only see positives coming from my swapping a trait line out for DD and DH respectively.
What is, generally, the amount your average micro transaction must reach when it gives you an advantage for it to be considered pay2win?
It’s not the amount of micro transactions… it’s something that’s readily available for purchase via micro transactions that gives a clear advantage. Another example is say there were “VIP” weapons that you could buy (ofc they expire after x days or don’t and just VIPv2 weapons come out) that had a 20% stat increase on ascended gear.
So…
Something readily available for purchase….
That gives an advantage….
Like HoT?
What is, generally, the amount your average micro transaction must reach when it gives you an advantage for it to be considered pay2win?
Pay 50$ to not get rekt. Sounds pay2win, unless there’s an actual textbook definition for it
Its obviously pay2win kek. They finally make dd ele balanced (it honestly is) right before they release scrapper/reaper which is absolutely hilarious. I’m not saying what they’re doing by leaving core specs in the dirt is OK, since their focus is to move forward and change all of PvP in general, but I AM saying that the way elites interact with the other elites kinda even out the playing field.
Also, idk about everyone else, but I intend to run acro AND DD for all of the super sweet evasion.
I also heard somewhere (I don’t remember where) that elite specs would be available to everyone in sPvP. I don’t know if this is true, but if it is then the base game players would at least have that going for them.
Lmfao.
On a more serious note, would you guys think I’m crazy for thinking DD would put thief in a good spot x.x?
First world PvP pro problems.
@OP
Yea, the new finishers seem veeeeeeeery over the top. I like the detail and they’re very polished, but this isn’t something you just ignore in the middle of a fight. I’ll put my support behind a slider option.
Says he’s new to PvP.
Calls someone out for cheating.
Logic?
Also, you can’t JI+MB as efficiently anymore (really small opening to do it), so you have enough time to dodge.
2k armor is also the base. Also, I’m guessing he would’ve had to proc SoW+smite+air+fire+glacial heart+MB and all of them would have to crit to down a 25k HP target (and even then I’m still not sure guards can burst that hard). You obviously need to pay better attention is all.
Isn’t the double gun flame a glitch?
I have a better guide than this.
Everyone play a ranged spec with 1 bunker guard. Enjoy your wins.
If I’m not mistaken, you can max out most of your current trait lines and utilities using nothing but the points you get from leveling. I’m sure what’s left on the overworld maps would be enough for at least traits and utilities.
Brother, its because S/F fresh air is pretty much a medi guard without the damage mitigation and half the heal (or less). You play D/P. You HAVE to know how easy S/F fresh air is to kill by a stealth gank or someone who doesn’t get one shot by their main burst(S/D is even easier due to literally 0 defense skills unless the gut their utilities).
Eles either shouldn’t get a hit to their sustain or should get a hit but have more active forms of damage mitigation.
If leveling is the issue and you just want to rush to 80, eotm and not being bad at sPvP are better ways. You only really need waypoints to dungeons and that shouldn’t take longer than an hour if your using lions arch
Then make a rune of the guardian that grants 2s of block on heal use, since guard is all about blocking.
Trickery, or rather, steal is rather useless for a ranged build. I only steal when my target is lobbing a skill at me and I don’t wanna waste a dodge so I can quickly displace myself and evade it. I’d replace trick with acro (or DD). Signet of malice is an interesting one. I’ve toyed with this for a bit. You take acro, take assassins reward as your GM, and basically heal for 1.5k per unload. Its a very nice zerg and PvE build, but there are better options for sPvP (namely withdraw). Also, for utilities, I can never NOT run without roll for initiative and shadow step, these two make life so much easier (not many can keep up with your DPS after you open the gap between them 4 whole times). Your third utility can be w.e, but I recommend tripwire. Its so good combined with the trap on heal, your target would essentially need 6 gap closers to keep up with you. It isn’t uncommon for me to walk out of a fight vs a warrior or guardian with full HP (assuming I dodge the guards teleport/burn burst).
I agree, OP. Currently, in my power burst build, I prefer devourer over Drakes venom since the immob is plenty more powerful. The chill CAN be of use vs skill spam classes like ele and engi, but that’s about it.
I play S/D and find thief to be a little odd. I can kill most classes 1v1, but I find that if my team can’t hold off the enemy for a moment or two in an outnumbered situation, all is lost. Thief was meant to be centered around high mobility, tons of evasion, and great burst. I believe DD will come around and alleviate some (a lot) of the pain, but people need to realize that stealth shouldn’t be the only form of sustain they stat for. For instance, with acro, DD and crit strikes, you gain a ton of rewards for proper dodging, a ton of dodges to dodge with, and great damage to boot. We can now count on reaper to take care of boon manipulation since necros can actually handle a bit of focus fire now and people won’t find it to be an exercise of masochism, so thieves can focus on being super mobile and loaded with a ton of damage. Some people might not be able to let go of trickery and that’s fine, but the landscape is changing entirely and people need to accept that.
Idk, maybe you’ve shared a lol. Maybe they were in your previous team and liked your skills.
I carry p/p in my inv for quick equipping when I need to roll through a necro, warrior, and guard. S/D still works on rangers, other thieves, mesmers (assuming you dodge the opening burst). Engis can be taken with w.e weapon set you prefer. Gotta remain versatile, since some classes thrive on you getting close to them and others are hindered by it.
Remove the ICD on swindlers equilibrium and upper hand so that there’s better synergy with daredevil and that they’re no longer useless traits. Swindlers ICD isn’t ridiculous, but its competing with the far superior Hard to Catch, so the pot needs to be made sweeter. I also believe these are good changes because anet, apparently, is aiming for theives to rely more on speed and evasion over anything else for survivability and having swindlers recharge steal faster while dodging allows steal to come up faster for more endurance.
Thoughts, guys?
Wait, we asking for thief nerfs or what…?
Zerging? Anet doesn’t need to do anything, you just need someone with speed to back cap (thief, mes, or engi do this best, in descending order). When I’m on my thief, I love zergers. I feel kinda bad that im not there, trying to kill people for my team, but when the zerging team wonders why they lost, they’ll know it was the guy with 0killa/deaths and 150 points :P.
I’ve recently picked up a bit of a homebrew condi thief build and have been loving it. Not having too much trouble, but if grabbing a few tips from lord condi himself would probably be real sweet. Some time today a few hours from this post would be great, cuz uni is reking me for the rest of the days T.T.
On an unrelated note, ANET better put HoT on sale during christmas T.T.
(edited by SlayerSixx.5763)