Guild Wars 2

I have a metabolic primer active on one character. Food eaten has the same timer on it as it normally does.

When the food timer is exhausted, the buff from it is gone. The metabolic primer appears to be doing nothing but provide an Icon.

How is this any different than Eir’s “son” dropping in from the ether and the painful, strained retcon of that.

All this story shows is that the same people wrote it.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

What if I have no friends or guild? How am I supposed to do Elite Instanced content?

One might make the same point about Teq or Wurm. The answer for those events is that not all content has to be accessible with no effort to all players.

That’s where you’re wrong. Tequatl and the Mega Wurm is available for ALL players. It may be made for the Hardcore players, but that doesn’t mean Casuals are blocked from participating should they choose to do so. Thus the reason such content is made in the Open World.

While not really a lie, this statement is far from presenting the truth of “all” players being able to complete Teq or Wurm and anyone familiar with either knows this.. or should.

Semantics ftw.

An advance scout. Sadly, I was unable to damage her minion.

How long do you really have to experience MMO’s to learn that any content that can be griefed, will be.

Developers should know better. This is one reason hard content became instanced.

The grief mechanic is there, so expect it, you have no control over it. Blame the team that shortsightedly brought it in.

What do you name callers actually know about the people you single out and belittle? Most of the time you have never seen them before, and won’t again.

I’ve done 5 platforms, with a Ranger. 4 finished with little problem, including one with just two of us. Most I have had on a platform was 5.

The single fail was my last trip to this toxic mess. I took forever to load, loading in half dead to see the other two players downed. Skill lag on my rez spirit, calling it failed. Eventually downed and game over for everyone. Felt terrible.

Now, in spite of succeeding far more than failing. the ’better than thou" crowd took this opportunity to blast me with every stupid generalization about baddies, pve, rangers, blah blah blah. I was hit with the bitter backlash of small minded players looking for the “goat” to release vitriol upon, not knowing or even caring what my actual experience, knowledge or prior success had been. They saw a ranger die.. and so, I had to be what they assumed was the worst.

You know.. I don’t care what the content is. If I have to be around the toxicity that are these events now, I’ll go someplace else. There is no reward worth being around a toxic and small minded population casting blame and epithets.

Half of the posts here need infracted… unless I am unaware that namecalling is now “OK”

Often I think GW2 playerbase is pretty ignorant about what has been done in the MMO genre. These “new” events are not “new”.

Everquest 2 “open world” boss quests that worked, and worked well for everyone.

Please note the scaling.. of both rewards and difficulty.

http://eq2.zam.com/wiki/Public_Quests_%28EQ2%29

Several issues with this whole concept.

I’m all for harder content. Optional, instanced, and controllable.

Marionette is a key part of your so called living world story content.. and that content should be open for everyone interested in it. Not gated by time, by population, by random shuffles of who gets on a platform or not.

You aren’t going to “make” people better at the game by forcing a “higher” level upon them to finish story content. Provide optional content for this. Instanced raids do allow a learning curve, since no experienced raid team is forced to team up with randoms to accomplish a thing. They can bring in a few, teach, or they can learn as a guild by working their way up tiers. No way is this happening here.

You don’t make players “better” by vitriol and namecalling. This thread shows plenty of it. So does the after “fail” map chat. Baddies, Casuals, PvE’rs, Noobs, Underlevels.

I’ve seen fails blamed on Zerker builds.. on Cleric builds.. on Rangers.. on anyone under level 80… on anyone not on TS….. on and on.

And then there is the “community building” phase of comments after. “You need to uninstall GW2, scrubs… This server takes fail to new levels of kitten. You bads need to stay out of the zone. If you aren’t on TS thanks for helping us fail” on and on.

A large portion of commentary in map chat would not survive being typed here.. because of “community standards”, so why a system that provokes and promotes this behavior?

You don’t build by being toxic. You don’t make better players by ridicule. You don’t make stories inclusive by being exclusive.

Anet developers need to be watching failed attempts to see just how poorly this has been implemented.

Note that I am not commenting on Wurm or Teq, both somewhat sideshows to the main story. I do think that non-instanced implementation is wrong, and scaling is a joke.. but its non-interesting content to me. I’ll fire up my EQ2 chars to raid if I ever feel like it again.

You made that? Very good job!!! You look very Norn

Note that it is per char, not per acct. You will only see the text and star on the same char that did marionette.

Crystal Reid.2481:

This was a crazy marathon to watch with so many servers/guilds competing for this. You guys have built some truly amazing communities through these difficult encounters.

Congratulations Desolation! Well deserved!

Yes, congratulations.

Community building? Really.
Abandon your own server, your guild, join some megagroup.. out of the few there are..

Ripping community. Gating open world content. Most of the server “communities” will never experience this.

Log into a server that has already abandoned this to see “community”, and the harsh commentary usually directed at their own server for not having people there.

I played on Valcyn server SWG which had a ToG player city and a lot of active people.. 9 years ago. Nice guild with a long history.

thefantasticg.3984:

I thought guilds like TTS were using the overflows as a psuedo instance anyway for Teq… when you think about it… that’s exactly what they’re doing.

This, exactly. They are creating an instance.

For this content to work for all, it has to scale, realistically. I, personally, would not care if the reward scaled down as well, Everquest 2 did that with the Public Quests and it worked fine. Full zones get the full hard version… and the better reward, no loss to the hard core. Servers that can put 30-50 people in for Wurm and Teq get more time, less adds, scaled down trash, less HP.. but no change in basic mechanics – they would still have to learn the strat. Less people/less reward, I’m fine with that, if scaling allows more inclusive participation by Server.

Instancing would not be needed then. As it stands now, we have “de facto” instancing, a limited means to experience finishing the content, less servers doing the content, and gates in the way both time wise and server population wise.

For people claiming that this is not splitting the game population.. not buying the argument, not at all. That is exactly what this is doing.

Congratulations Anet. You have managed to bring in the Raider Elite mindset lock, stock and barrel into your “different” MMO.

Too bad you didn’t finish the job and bring in the instanced mechanics.

Can’t claim World First on just one phase, bugged or not.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/madness/Great-Jungle-Wurm-Head-Phase/first#post3539328

Vol.7601:

Mimizu.7340:

Vol.7601:

Godzilla.7629:

The embers may have caused some lag but was the solution really adding a 30min timer?!

Well what other solution could they have provided? They could have reskinned the ember to have less graphical movement, they could have retraited its skills to be less graphical and calculation-intensive…or they could have done the quick and reasonable fix of putting a timer so people wouldn’t spam them.

They could also just add a tickbox to the Graphics Options to cull them, just like we have the ability to do with ranger pets and minions and other players.

This should have had a client-side fix, it’s a performance is (in this case) a client-side issue.

Can we cull specific objects? AFAIK we can only change object quantity and quality. We can’t pick and choose who or what to cull.

Particle Effects Slider. It’s not a new concept. EQ2 had one at launch. One was begged for here in beta. Client side options would have solved this, and a lot of other performance related issues.. client side.

Vayne.8563:

Kaiyanwan.8521:

It is not the event, it is the placement.

The placement is bad game design. For all the flaws listed.
We know, Vayne, that you will defend everything for the sake of defending it. That is OK, but you loose credibility if all you do is praising the Lord (ANet).

Completely offensive, not to mention demonstrably untrue. The Tequatl fight is what I’m talking about, and it’s fine. It works. People do it. You don’t do it. You keep bringing it up like it was a failure…if no one did it, it wouldn’t be there. Anet would have to change it.

It hasn’t changed because people do it.

In fact, I got one of the cool looking pistol skins from there last week for my thief.

The game does not have to have a zillion easy roll over events, just because a challenge scares some people and they don’t want to take the time and effort to do it. People have been begging for harder content. I’m happy Anet is producing harder content.

And the more you say I never say anything negative about Anet the more credibility you lose because I have said quite a few negative things about Anet.

That doesn’t mean I don’t defend the game when I think someone has it wrong. Saying no one does Teq….definitely wrong.

On Fort Aspenwood, no one does Teq. Fact. “lots of times” on a very few servers does not a success make. Now… feel free to tell me what I “really” stated.

Alukah.2063:

“In EQ2 it is 24 people, in an instance, all knowing their roles, skills, knowledge of scripting, tells, etc. They also know what mechanics to look for. There are no randoms wandering in, no players who just “happened” to be there. In that context it is appropriate to force the learning of the “strat”. Everyone in a serious Raid is expected to know exactly what where when and how to do things.”

Have you ever done a raid when it’s first released? (aka “exploration mode”)
Don’t people use online guides to know what mechanics to look for, to know what to do and where to do it?

Or do you expect people in that game to know exactly what to expect from the AI without reading about it or without previous practice, even if the raid was just released?

+5 for snipping my post out of context. Experienced Raiders will learn raid strats far faster then 24 random people who wander into an area. Raiders know, or should know, when they enter that instance it is not going to be “tank n spank”. This is not the situation in open, everyone welcome content. People will, and should be expected to wander into this prepared to stack and spam 1111 and not much else, why not.. works everywhere else.

Raiders go into new content prepared and expecting to “learn the Strat”. Once learned and posted, expected to “know the strat”.

This is never, ever, going to apply in open world content where anyone and everyone can wander in knowing nothing and expecting to complete it like most of the “boss” content in game.

Galen Grey.4709:

Judge Banks.9018:

The biggest problem is the MASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSIVE lack of backstory for all of their characters. On top of gaping plot holes both in the living and personal story, it’s just bad. . . there’s no other way to explain the quality.

Based on your statement I am going to assume you missed:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/short-story-what-scarlet-saw/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/delegation/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/short-story-evon-gnashblade-disembarks/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/a-shipwreck-how-ellen-met-magnus/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/brahams-story/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/marjorys-story-the-last-straw-part-1/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/canachs-story-an-after-hours-meeting/

Those are backstories for the characters there is more for lore and events here:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Category:Tales

Oh yes, because in a game there should be very little clues or story plot available “in the game” and should always be out of game resources. Riiight.

zMajc.4659:

Wow, just wow.

Did you ever play any other MMO and did any sort of raid content at all? Raids are supposed to be figured out by players. It’s usually the hardest content available in a MMO.

What did you expect a guide how to kill a world boss in patch notes? jeez.

In EQ2 it is 24 people, in an instance, all knowing their roles, skills, knowledge of scripting, tells, etc. They also know what mechanics to look for. There are no randoms wandering in, no players who just “happened” to be there. In that context it is appropriate to force the learning of the “strat”. Everyone in a serious Raid is expected to know exactly what where when and how to do things.

This boss is open world content, in a game that promotes and encourages spontaneous participation. You cannot expect everyone to know scripts, to know where to be and not be, and you cannot expect universal voice communication. You CAN expect the clueless. You cannot expect raid type coordination. This is Casual content.

You cannot even remotely compare this with raiding, no matter how much the psuedo raiders would like to do so.

In Game hints. “protect the golems!” “watch the ledges”. Perhaps a conversation with a Vigil Tactician. Anything to help prepare the player who doesn’t live on forums, reddit, dulfy and any other venue and just logs in to play a game.

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

So Scarlet is the one and only character in this whole Living Story?

What about the new character Taimi? What about what is going on between Rox and Braham? Is Rox going to join the Stone legion and say goodbye to Braham? What about Kasmeer and Marjory? Are they the gay couple that I thought they would always be? Who is E?

If you actually gave a single crap about the story you would know that there is more to it than just little old Scarlet.

You play an RPG but you don’t even RP……

What, if anything, have these cliche, cardboard cutout characters done that is even remotely interesting? Or have anything to do with roleplaying?

Or is this target market so young and uninformed that a couple of females holding hands is some great “story” somehow.

No, it’s not just Scarlet. The entire story reeks. And now.. lets add in a precocious, comedic and irreverant child wonder… oh my, just what Tyria needed.

It is opinion, taste, playstyle. You will never “make” something attractive to people who find the base option unattractive.

I like hamburgers. I do not like veggie burgers. Nothing done to a veggie burger will make me want one. The simple fact that I like hamburgers does not carry over.

Anet keeps trying for some reason. They would be better off insuring that the quality of different content appeals the most to people who WANT to do that content and realizing not everyone will.

Ashabhi.1365:

The trinity in other games meant standing around for long periods of time looking for tanks and healers. It also meant that those who play “healing classes” but chose to spec for damage or general support (buffs, CC, DoTs) were kicked as soon as the group leader found out that Cleric A was a Battle Cleric and not a Healbot.

I see no good that could come from making the trinity a viable mechanic in GW2. Mesmers, Rangers, Thieves, and Engineers would immediately become obsolete without a complete rework. Everyone would be Warriors, Guardians and Eles. Damage and Toughness/Vitality would become “king” and poor Necros would simply fade away, as they don’t do enough damage to DPS, and they don’t have enough health to tank.

I would much rather see support roles that actually mean something other than standing around waiting for the DPSers to wear down the boss so they can get in a couple of hits in order to get some sort of reward. As much as everyone dislikes the upcoming nerf to zerker gear, people are going to have to think for themselves and make some new builds. Maybe a new playstyle will come of this.

Haven’t really played much of the actual games have you. Pretty obvious. No need for DPS, cc, offtanks, wards, etc. All things a serious Raid group needs beyond “healer and tank”. Also the “standing around doing nothing” is a player choice. So is waiting for the “perfect” group.. and “standing around waiting for a group” is still in GW2 for people who cannot comprehend there is more than one way to play “any” game. That won’t change no matter what mechanics are involved.

People get groupkicked all the time in GW2 for being the “wrong” class and build. What has changed?

It would change nothing. The content does not require it. Having a more healing focused option than there is now would only add another option for players.

Trying a traditional Tank being healed and holding aggro in this game would be as fail as trying to do Heroic/Epic content in EQ2 with GW2 groups.

Furthermore, in the Trinity MMOs I have played, the “Trinity” is not needed for a vast part of the game. People solo, Duo, and level to Endgame without it. It is needed for the areas that absolutely require it. Trinity is not needed in the open world at all. DPS and Control/self heal small groups do open dungeons as well as a small group with a dedicated healer… the only thing missing is rez.. and the answer to that is. “don’t die”. Anyone can rez here so that is a non-issue.

A pair of Shadowknights can take on content easily that noob groups with a healer fail at. Right now, in EQ2, people can take a mercenary to “solo” with. The overwhelming choice is DPS mercs, SK, even if you are a DPS class for most of that content.

And what kind of healer? I think you all are assuming some pure squish. Big difference between that and an EQ2 Inquisitor that can heal and turn out impressive DPS while not dying if looked at wrong.

In PVE here, if a dedicated healer class was implemented, they would be the one crying LFG. They aren’t needed. They would be in demand as much as a Ranger is. The DPS meta would not change at all.

A dedicated healer would add a lot to pvp and wvw. Trinity has never “worked” on people AI. Trinity in pvp has never been hold aggro on a stupid bag of HP who ignores backlines.

Biggest reason for no? Manipulation. Given we can rep multiple guilds, a guild could create two guilds, basically declare war on itself, and kill each other for rewards and ranking.

Guilds in SWG did this to their alts, they just created a separate faction guild, put their alts in it, and murdered them for rank and GCW rewards.

Add this to the aforementioned other issues.

If something can be cheesed for rewards, it will be.

Stark.1350:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

I am amused by the constant comparisons to just one game, GW1, and the attempts to justify the glacial pace of actual new expansion content by pointing out all the things GW2 has to do that GW1 didn’t.

Compare it to a real MMO. Everquest 2 launched in 2005. It had underwater content, combat. Quite a lot of it actually. It had jumping and content that required it. 24 classes. Far more races. More dungeons, more quests, more overland area. Housing. Raids. Open instances. Open world bosses. Actual in-depth crafting. More graphics options. Flexible UI. Far more guild management tools. Mounts. World events. Seasonal Events. And with all of that, SOE has managed to release full boxed expansions on an average of once a year, and has expanded the “features” of that game with every single one of them.

That is what GW2 is going to have to do to have the longevity, in this genre, as the Everquest franchise has had, and continues to have. GW2 needs to step up to the plate to play in the big leagues.

In so many ways ANET has the potential to be a force in the MMO world for many years.. IF they take the changes they have made mechanics wise and then adapt and adopt what has been very successful for the industry as a whole as well.

Living World isn’t going to cut it. Not in the long run. It’s not new, only the pace is. I’ve done temporary “World Events” in Everquest 2 since it launched.. it is their name for it. It is something to do.. between new expansion content. Temporary content is no replacement for an expansions worth of permanent content, not there, and not here.

“Edit to add this link http://www.tentonhammer.com/opinions/developers-should-steal-more”

This is an extremely poor example. I was an avid Everquest 2 player for a very long time, and their expansions were all the same. “Here’s a new area. Here’s some new railroad questing and some new levels. And here’s 10 new abilities to add to the 500 you already have. Some new raids.” I cleared each expansion in a month. Which left me 11 months of not seeing anything new.

Shrug. And there are those here who see the LS as a few new Achievement checkboxes, a few new skins, a couple of temporary instances they clear in a day, with 13 whole days of not seeing anything new.

Difference being.. the permanent content added here is miniscule and little remains for Alts, people who play at a slower pace, and people new to the game. Furthermore, little is gained, so far, featurewise…. unless you love the Gem Store. Unfortunately, the Gem Store isn’t selling new classes, new races, new starting areas, new trades, UI flexibility, Guild Management tools, or a host of other things.

Interesting to me that you found expansions as vastly different as EoF as compared to DoF to be “all the same”. Even the game mechanics changed radically for some expansions. But w/e. If you ground out EQ2 expansions, fully, in 30 days then I assume you will need LS updates every 3 days or so.

I am amused by the constant comparisons to just one game, GW1, and the attempts to justify the glacial pace of actual new expansion content by pointing out all the things GW2 has to do that GW1 didn’t.

Compare it to a real MMO. Everquest 2 launched in 2005. It had underwater content, combat. Quite a lot of it actually. It had jumping and content that required it. 24 classes. Far more races. More dungeons, more quests, more overland area. Housing. Raids. Open instances. Open world bosses. Actual in-depth crafting. More graphics options. Flexible UI. Far more guild management tools. Mounts. World events. Seasonal Events. And with all of that, SOE has managed to release full boxed expansions on an average of once a year, and has expanded the “features” of that game with every single one of them.

That is what GW2 is going to have to do to have the longevity, in this genre, as the Everquest franchise has had, and continues to have. GW2 needs to step up to the plate to play in the big leagues.

In so many ways ANET has the potential to be a force in the MMO world for many years.. IF they take the changes they have made mechanics wise and then adapt and adopt what has been very successful for the industry as a whole as well.

Living World isn’t going to cut it. Not in the long run. It’s not new, only the pace is. I’ve done temporary “World Events” in Everquest 2 since it launched.. it is their name for it. It is something to do.. between new expansion content. Temporary content is no replacement for an expansions worth of permanent content, not there, and not here.

“Edit to add this link http://www.tentonhammer.com/opinions/developers-should-steal-more”

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

You must have pretty low standards, because the story in Guild Wars 1 was cliche too. Whether you liked it or not, if you can’t admit it’s cliche there’s not much else to talk about.

Like when you got to Kryta, you didn’t know the White Mantle where bad guys? You didn’t know the Shining Blade was good? You trusted Vizier Kilbron?

I find that hard to believe.

I have a differing opinion than you, therefore I have “pretty low standards”. Amusing and predictable. Done.

Yargesh.4965:

knives.6345:

tomlin.8204:

Run dungeons – for what purpose?
Farm gold – for what purpose?
Champ trains – lol
WvW – for what purpose?
PvP – for what purpose?

This is exactly how I feel after playing for around an hour.

I mean, I like the game, but there seem to be no purpose. No synergy between those said above.

I mean, yeah, we killed the champ. We got loot. What impact does it have on the world? none.

Yeah! Server is tier 1 on WvWvW! And? Oh we brag blah blah…

What have other games done that make you feel like you have changed the world that they created?
Is there anything that actually can be done without changing the world for people that come after you.

You can add content that actually changes the world? Not just a pile of rubbish in a trashed new player Zone.

In Everquest2 there was a world event to unlock a race. World events to provide travel to new continents, world events to build and rebuild transportation systems. Events that provided a lore background for introduced new classes. World events to unlock Guild halls and other desired content. Etc Etc. While later players did not experience the “Event” they were able to enjoy the perks the events heralded.. because the outcome of the Events were permanent content.

Another example of “Living World” would have been both Pre and Post NGE SWG.. in Pre NGE a lot of content was player created. Events were. Shops, vendors.. all player. World PvP depended on player created fortresses that could be destroyed by other players. Things changed daily.. totally based on players. Post NGE.. the GCW period, your factional control and score changed hourly.. solely driven by players changing the worlds. No reset. Nothing changed unless players made it change.

These things are not happening here. This world isn’t “living” save WVW, and that resets.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

So are you saying Guild Wars 1 had a good story that you couldn’t put down? That wasn’t formulaic? I can’t name many MMOs that have a good story I couldn’t put down. This is because MMOs aren’t books.

When I want literature, I read. When I want game play, I don’t find it at the library.

There may somewhere be an MMO with a story I couldn’t put down, but I haven’t found it in WoW, or Rift, or Perfect World or DDO, or Lotro. I didn’t find it in AoC or Warhammer.

Games are centered generally around gameplay. Even TSW as good as the writing was, was something I felt I could easy put down. I didn’t try SWToR, because though it might have had good writing due to the Bioware influence, nothing else about the game appealed to me at all.

Yes Vayne, I am stating my opinion. Mine. An opinion that is every bit as valid as yours. Period.

I did each step of the “storyline” campaigns in GW1 eagerly, and War in Kryta, Winds of Change, Hearts of the North. Not talking about great literature, but a good story. And then I did them again. and Again.

Depth of Lore, story and continuity of story is far far superior in Everquests.. and they have managed to do it for 13 years or so. I have at least 300 books collected in EQ2.. all telling a bit of the “story” and that is just the tip of the iceberg.

I do not need your short laundry list of games you have supposedly played. I do not need your definitions. I need nothing from you to form and hold an opinion. Sorry to break that to you.

No matter when they plan to expand crafting, they should have reset all disciplines to 500 max at the same time and reset discovery. Every Exotic I created/create in disciplines that did not receive the higher exp cap were a waste of exp, because I could not earn it.

Raise the cap now, and bring the recipes when they are ready.

ChaosKirin.1328:

I seem to be the only one on this forum that knows how a story works. I’m so excited that this game actually has one that lasts, rather than being released all at once and then having nothing for two years.

I LOVE the living story. I pity the poor person who had to change their vision for the living story because of impatience on the part of the players. Releasing a little bit of story every two weeks is an amazing idea, and it seems that people here can’t connect the dots enough to realize that these story pieces aren’t random – they’re all part of a larger whole.

What I’m getting is that not only do most people not understand that the conclusion of the story is forthcoming, but that they want all their story at once, and then they want to repeat it over and over and over for a year until more story comes out. Then they can repeat that over and over.

I am legitimately confused. Why does this have to be all instant gratification? Why can’t we all just relax and let the story come as it does?

Because a good story is hard to put down, and you eagerly look forward to each chapter. This is not a good story. If this had been a book, I would have tossed it right after Scarlet appeared.

I want it over with, because until it is, this is all we are getting. I don’t care any more about the “finale” of this badly written formulaic pulp than I would care about the ending of a book thrown in the trash.

I’m still looking for the next chapters of the Tyrian story I started in GW1. Mordant Crescent. Joko. Cantha. Elona. What became of the Canthan empire, Luxons, Kurzicks. Evennia. Livia. The Sceptre of Orr. I’ve waited patiently for those things, the things they hinted in “The Changing of the World”, because those are compelling stories,.. or could be.

Note that I didn’t even mention Dragons. Far more than Dragons have been ignored to promote this Stale Story.

darkace.8925:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Not impressed by the interview, since he pointed out WvW season 1 as a “success”.

All that did was bring in a mass of fairweathers who checked off boxes on an achievement list, skewed the rankings, and then logged out to never play again till offered another shiny carrot. Pretty much an example of how poorly the achievement system in general impacts the game… once the boxes are checked, the content is abandoned in favor of the next set of checkboxes.

WVW issues were not touched, nothing was done for long term WvW players, and tbh Season 1 was just a blip to be forgotten about.

Again, it all comes down to what the developers value. If they’re simply after metrics…the number of players logging on…then the WvW Season 1 was a huge success. I don’t play WvW, so I’ll give you the PvE side of things. If they’re after log in metrics, then I’m sure the Living Story with it’s ever-refreshing Achievement Point checklist has been a success. If they’re after fun, engaging gameplay, however, then I’d argue the Living Story has been a resounding failure (even if it did have an occasional bright spot).

And that is the issue with metrics. When you make, say, JPs a must do on an achievement list it then you cannot point at the number of people doing them as an indication of how “popular” they are. Just how often they are done.

JPs are popular with those who enjoy that sort of thing, but metrics also include the number of people who loathe them, and just get them over with for a checkmark.

It is not a measure of success, quality, or popularity unless you measure the content alone.. with it not required for any other reason.

Not impressed by the interview, since he pointed out WvW season 1 as a “success”.

All that did was bring in a mass of fairweathers who checked off boxes on an achievement list, skewed the rankings, and then logged out of WvW to never play it again till offered another shiny carrot. Pretty much an example of how poorly the achievement system in general impacts the game… once the boxes are checked, the content is abandoned in favor of the next set of checkboxes.

It brought the achievement farming mentality to wvw. Don’t flip this camp, we are farming yaks. Don’t upgrade this, we get achievement if we lose it and take it back. We need to lose some keeps so I can destroy walls. etc etc. People not there for WvW, but for a checkbox.

WVW issues were not touched, nothing was done for long term WvW players, and tbh Season 1 was just a blip to be forgotten about.

Wasbunny.6531:

‘Skill’ is not just having tools available to spam, or how fast you can spam them. It’s when to use those tools/abilities…in any game. It’s timing.

Even in games like bowling, where you have one skill (roll the ball) you have to know when to put some ‘english’ on it to get that 7-10 split or just hurl it as fast and as accurate as you can to get a strike.

Skill is not how many abilites you have.
Skill is not how fast you can use them.
Skill is not being the overwhelming outnumbering force.
Skill is reactive, knowing when to do something at the right time.

I’m done with this thread since it seems to boil down to the basic definition of ‘skill’ is for some reason lost on some people. Just please, either look up the definition of skill or post a video link showing how you completed any of the content by using no skill.

And btw, if anyone says it takes no skill to play a thief, they have never played a thief.

I can guarantee you that there are thieves… with none of what you define as “skill”, who have legendaries, ascended, piles of gold and 10k+ achievements. Nothing in this game is gated based on your “skill” definition. It is not a skill based game, period. The absolute worst thief in game can gain as much in the whole sphere of the game as the best can. It takes little skill to blob content, gank yaks and run from players in wvw, grind maps, mats, do JPs and hit F repeatedly. And this goes for any class in this game.

TheDaiBish.9735:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

This is not a skill based game. It is a level and gear based game. Simple.

Pre NGE SWG was a skill based game. Eve is a skill based game. TSW is a skill based game. GW1 was a semi skill based game, far far more than this one.

In skill based games your char is defined by the skill sets chosen from a large pool and not limited to a given profession or level. Power of weapons and armor are dependant on skills invested in them, not level. In a skill based game, how you invest skill points are far more important than profession or weapons choice.

It is a very basic game concept that has nothing to do with button mashing “skillz”

When referring to skill-based, I don’t think they’re referring to the main focus being on skills, but that the game has a greater focus on player-skill and less on numbers in the back (block chance, parry chance ect).

In that context the conversation is meaningless. There is no base level player “skill” required to succeed in this game, other level based games, or in skill based games.

There are “skilled” players in every type of game. There are “unskilled” players as well.
Game companies do not set a standard of “skill” to play a game, they sell to a broad demographic. They do not base games on some arbitrary player skill standard.

Skill based is a description of a mechanic, no more. While it may salve some peoples ego to assume a game takes more “skill”, they don’t. A player’s skill level can make games easier, but is not required to be successful in any MMO I have played. Earth And Beyond, SWG, WoW, LoTRO, STO,GW1, AoC, Everquest 1 and 2, CoH, EVE, etc etc etc.

I play this with a severe manual dexterity handicap. I do not wasd. I rarely dodge. I don’t run about like a headless chicken. My chars are set up to be passively tough, and that gives me enough time to mash buttons with my one functional left finger. I have 9 level 90s with no problems doing whatever it is I want to do, in spite of lacking the “skillz” people here are going on and on about.

Knowledge is the only “skill” necessary. People fail in games by not understanding mechanics, period. Physical dexterity is only needed in certain forms of PVP.. and the most dexterous person on earth can be beaten by latency and bad connectivity… or, by someone who simply knows the mechanics better.

The greatest dodger and mover in this game will fail in GW1 trying to use those “skillz”. Does that make GW1 harder? No. No more than dodging makes this game harder. Not understanding the mechanics of either game will make them harder.. and that is it.

This is not a skill based game. It is a level and gear based game. Simple.

Pre NGE SWG was a skill based game. Eve is a skill based game. TSW is a skill based game. GW1 was a semi skill based game, far far more than this one.

In skill based games your char is defined by the skill sets chosen from a large pool and not limited to a given profession or level. Power of weapons and armor are dependant on skills invested in them, not level. In a skill based game, how you invest skill points are far more important than profession or weapons choice.

It is a very basic game concept that has nothing to do with button mashing “skillz”

The main focus of NGE was dumbing down a very complex game into a limited, directed, simple MMO like wow, with less skills, less thinking, less variety in playstyle and build.

This game launched that way.

ANET had the solution to the DPS/rogue stealth issue. No stealth. http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Assassin

They changed a lot of things skill wise in this game supposedly for “balance”, and then for some reason felt compelled to bring in a mechanic, stealth, that undoubtedly has caused the most balance problems in the history of all MMO type PvP.

Either they arrogantly assumed they could fix what no one else could, or worse, they knew full well the issues, and went with attracting the lolrogue demographic knowing what they were getting into.

Whatever. Assassin as implemented in GW1 was innovative and removed the stealth controversy. Thief is just another iteration of “everyrogue” with all the baggage attached.

A pretty big step backwards.

Honest question, as I personally witnessed this, having arrived as the ballista was finishing building, and having both cannon taken out by single shots before I was able to fire either.

Both were new and had no prior damage.

Not a cheating accusation, just never saw this before.

Asudementio.8526:

Nice open field ballista and arrow carts FA, really showing off those siege skills y’all have, all that silver league practice.

This coming from a server that drops an AC if they stop to farm an iron node.

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

You might need to stick to pve buddy.

And miss moments like yesterday?

TC blob rips through paper S hills gate. Rips through inner. Bravely charges the 4 or so militia at Lords………….

And stops to build siege on the bridge.

You can’t buy moments like that. Bravo.

Nickthemoonwolf.1485:

I’m almost certain that using ACs to hit stuff behind a gate isnt cheating, but they HAVE been known to use any less than respectable trick they can whenever possible. AKA invuln spot siege, camping in invuln spots off the cliffs. I dont usually actually dislike any enemy in this game, but some of FA have shown themselves to be both poor losers AND winners.

Pot, meet Kettle.
Hilarious.

Draknar.5748:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

The current LS system makes this the MOST Alt-unfriendly game I know of. Nothing is really repeatable on many alts given the time gating and account based achievement system.

One small example. In GW1 I was able to do WIK 14 times, for the same reward, on all characters. The “meta” reward was not by account, but by character. The content was/is permanent, and available to be played eventually by any new character created.

Permanent content is alt-friendly. Temporary is not, and you can’t spin it any other way.

I assume you mean the achievements and not the content, because I completed the most recent LS content on every one of my alts. They all went up the Nightmare tower and killed the Hybrid. So how is that unfriendly again? Because I can’t replay it? That has nothing to do with alt-friendliness. If you had one character you still wouldn’t be able to replay it.

I guess it is alt-unfriendly if you have 12+ alts. But with 8 characters I was easily about to get them all to kill hybrid before the 4 weeks was over…. in fact 4 of the characters I did on the same day. So, uh………yea….I guess you can spin it another way.

And the character you create next week? Good luck. And that is the difference. All alts.. not current alts. The freedom and ability to play added permanent content as you create and level alts over the life of a game.

So.. what did you do with the 8 meta rewards…. oh, thats right.. you didn’t get 8. You got one. How did sharing the reward out among 8 characters go for you?

To be honest, I don’t know the LS anymore, don’t care to, don’t see a reason to know.

The writing and scenario for Flame and Frost was trite and dreadful, the characters canned and unoriginal. The alliance was a strained concept, to say the least.

And sadly, Flame and Frost was the “best” of the Scarlet storyline. It hit bottom, and then they grabbed shovels and dug the hole deeper.

I’ve gone from simply not participating to actual resentment of the story, writers, and continuance of it when I see the destruction they have wreaked upon Kessex and the intrusion of this “story” into WvW.

The current LS system makes this the MOST Alt-unfriendly game I know of. Nothing is really repeatable on many alts given the time gating and account based achievement system.

One small example. In GW1 I was able to do WIK 14 times, for the same reward, on all characters. The “meta” reward was not by account, but by character. The content was/is permanent, and available to be played eventually by any new character created.

Permanent content is alt-friendly. Temporary is not, and you can’t spin it any other way.

I play WvW because the idiotic LS for the most part goes away. Annoyed that they seem to be trickling more of it in each update.

Really do not enjoy yak and sentry ganks by Scarlets pokemon.

Dustfinger.9510:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

I would say, in my opinion, some facets of the “new” lore are being sourced anywhere but GW1.

Go to GW wiki. Search Ley Lines. Then go to WoW wiki. do the same. Come to your own conclusion.

I’d agree with the first sentence here. But not the implication afterwards. Ley lines are a common element in fantasy universes.

Yes, a very common “explainitall” element used to explain any paranormal, depending on the fantasy genre involved. I am not saying she pulled the lore from Wow, just pointing out that Wow used it from the start, it has a background, the game lore was built around it, from the magic perspective.

GW did not, in either version. There is no mention of it in either game. The sole utterance of “Ley Lines” was an out of game interview by a single writer. That is hardly “lore” and certainly no reason to grab the element and run with it, kitten many are doing here now.

Yes. For a max player to tell an appropriate level new player to “suck it up, it’s supposed to be hard” they should self-handicap.

Level 20-25 green gear. No elites. Respec traits to a max a level 25 would have. Cut slot skills to what a 25 would have. Then tell them to “suck it up” from the correct perspective.

Every time I read “ley lines” I want to cringe, literally.

It is a tired, old, overused “explainitall” popping up in writing since the 60s in relation to magic, shamanism, ancient astronauts, paranormalism, vampires.. oh god.. anything and everything. It first cropped up in the twenties..as sheer speculation based on the locations of prehistoric structures.. nothing to do with “magiks” then.

In spite of the ’concept" being well established in a ton of mostly mediocre fiction, Anet, wisely, chose to ignore it when creating a “magical” world when they wrote GW1. Blizzard embraced it wholeheartedly.

And now, we have it here. No basis, no history, no mention prior… in spite of Asura being able to track things that “bleed magic” (Vekk, on the location of the CTC)

This is just pulling stock, one size fits all common “lore” off a shelf. It’s not good writing, its not imaginative writing, and it is shoehorned into Tyria thoughtlessly and needlessly.