Guild Wars 2

Cosmic Teapot.9162:

@Arheundel

I agree with everything you’ve said, but if removing the heal from evasive arcana would destroy elementalists in tpvp don’t you think that is poor design?

If elementalists are going to be balanced around having access to an additional base 1300 heal + condition removal every time they go water attunement why not just tweak all the water attunement weapon abilities to accommodate that. For example just reduce the cooldown on offhand dagger cleansing wave to 15 seconds. This way elementalists don’t lose any survivability and they aren’t pigeonholed into an evasive arcana build.

I’ve noticed one elementalist on the leaderboards using a semi glassy build in paids. At least prior to the last patch he was using water/arcana + berserker amulet. I find it absurd that he’s forced to use a build nearly identical to a bunker even though he is preforming an entirely different role.

To cover a few points 30/30 water earth for DD was always viable as a bunker. Staff needed ea staff EA is broken if you haven’t noticed (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-November-15-2012/first#post744278).

You seem to have vendetta against EA as you seem to be of the mindset that it should be useless. Not only have you not presented an alternate 30 point trait you seem to be suggesting that all of us should be forced away from arcane (which seems a little hypocritical to me). Now instead of dodging my question which I will continually ask. Why should EA be nerfed again?

I concede the dps trees need help but not at the expense of our survivability. Compared to other classes EA assistance in our capability to survive is a joke. If you played each class you would realize we have speed as DD and S/D but that about it all the healing in the world will not stop a burst. Considering how many of us want to see EA returned to some form of what it was I can only read your comments as some indictment against defensive and balanced builds.

To keep this direct. We do not need some nerf in survivability to have viable dps specs. If they fix the bugs and spec the trees for dps with useful traits, than players who choose that route will put points into it that they can’t put into earth, water, and arcane.

I also need to point out that every class some expectations attached and builds and roles are far from equal. Guardian and Ele were promised the capability to be strong support and we are. Others got strong burst dps and they. By no means should the role of support continue to be undermined by players who spec dps and nothing else.

I cant imagine why choosing to play anything other than pure dps is synonymous with asking to punished.

I point you to this thread so you realize nerfing EA again with be the death of the trait as it has died in the eyes of many already. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/So-no-more-blasts-on-evasive-arcana-Merged/page/10#post833684 There is no real alternative and considering how much distress our community has already faced I don’t see why its necessary or practical to nerf us majorly so we can be glass. Honestly I enjoy my plays ytle ankittenempted to tell you to go to every other class save guardian and ranger that has decent burst builds. We should not have to be cookie cuttered into generic dps number 8. There are 8 classes you have options why mess with ours?

I think because it was around so long that it just further points out how little Anet really gives a kitten about our class. To me it seems like one day some pointed out by chance that EA could blast finish and someone said that they will have none of that and got rid of it. The funny thing is since they don’t check up on us often it is likely it was one of us who reported the bug on blast finishers for every dodge roll.

Cosmic Teapot.9162:

TheGuy.3568:

Also I cant imagine why players should be punished for swapping. Its the harder playstyle and for doing it well we should be rewarded not punished.

I assume this is in response to the lingering elements nerf I proposed. I don’t really consider it a nerf, but rather a way to balance out the buff I proposed for it. If people could spec for +10% dmg in fire, +10% dmg in air, and +20% damage in water on vulnerable target they could potentially stack all three of those attunement bonuses and deal ridiculously high damage. By limiting the attunement bonuses it would prevent this but still be significant buff compared to what we have now.

As for the evasive arcana nerf, I would ask do you still think that the ability is mandatory? I don’t want the devs to balance elementalist survivability around the idea that we all have evasive arcana and water attune + dodge roll every time it’s off cooldown.

Arcana is not mandatory this is evident by the fact that many dropped it once it no longer capable of causing blast finishers. However those who kept it resoundingly kept it for one reason and that is the heal and wipe in water attunement. For swappers going 30 points is almost mandatory since any less would throw off our pace. However the 30 point skill we should act and behave like a 30 point skill. It should a a skill worth sinking near half of your skill points into one tree to get. If they removed the heal from EA what would be the point of getting it? What justification would there be for getting the skill at all? Considering they already nerfed it in spvp the only reason to nerf it again would be…..I honestly draw a blank. Your suggestion is that EA be nerfed so the devs don’t get the wrong idea that EA primary function as of now is its only function an extra heal. You also suggest that we be forced out of arcana because we are no diverse enough.

Now I may sound pissed here but that because I dislike short shortsightedness. Our bunker builds never used EA and never needed it. Realize that specing 30 into earth or arcana are nearly mutually exclusive because of Water. Our survivability never hinged on EA but an entire playstyle did and it was wiped away from the game. EA is a 30 point trait. Let me say it again EA is a 30 point trait that has already been nerfed to near uselessness.

You argue that some nerf needs to happen to our survivability so that our dps can get a buff. Let me point you to the threads below. Play the class more a realize we need no more nerfs our burst should have been buffed months ago regardless. We don’t need a balance for it as it is already owed to us. There need be no compensation in loss of survivability for burst. We should have received higher end dps traits that weren’t bugged and more useful in the first place.

Re read your list of nerfs and realize that you argue 1 point at the core. We should all be forced to spec more dps and farther away from survival. I am honestly tired of balanced middle of the road builds being targeted so that dps can feel better.

Your suggestion sounds more like an attack to me on things not dps. You even ask for a protection nerf. Think about it your mind was set on dps and dps alone. We are one of the few classes allowed to play balanced builds well why bother it when you have no good reason?

Any class with multiple immobilize can do. At least 2 with good timing will have the D/D eating damage head on . D/D can be kited but this is more difficult to pull off. Also it should be noted that Necros who spam many conditions beat an form of wiping the game offers.

A D/D ele who is willing to cut and run is nearly unbeatable but you can always force the retreat with burst and strong cc can ruin the quick get away.

Cosmic Teapot.9162:

-Something needs to be done about evasive arcana’s water roll, it promotes 30 arcana 15+ water builds that are all too common. I suggest removing the heal completely. This would be a massive nerf, but I think it would lead to build diversity which will be better for future balance overall.

Feedback appreciated.

If they did do that evasive arcana would become more useless than it is already. Even adding the combo to earth wouldn’t make up for that type of gut. While you see build diversity I would see the end of the road. The other trees aren’t strong enough to spec into for many and attunement happens to be a decent tree (not great0. With what has already happened to our healing why should it be nerfed yet again? No amount of build diversity would justify the flat nerfed we just received and the cap (limited to 5 allies total). Right now it has next to no utility as the dps in the other 3 elements is lack luster. Remember its a 30 point skill its should be phenomenal atm its still crappy why would anyone suggest making it worse?

Also I cant imagine why players should be punished for swapping. Its the harder playstyle and for doing it well we should be rewarded not punished.

Dahkeus.8243:

After testing in the mists, I found that wolves and wolf-like pets are best for moving targets. Jaguars come in close, but that’s only really because they are glass cannons.

Wolves keep up strong damage on moving targets because A ) they snare with cripple and B ) they have a fast attack speed with minimal attack animation.

Also, the runs peed doesn’t make a difference for most pets, but it does actually help a bit with wolves.

Also, birds are terrible at moving targets since their attack animation is so flamboyant.

Have you tested the ranged pets yet? I haven’t gotten around to doing much testing (been leveling this alt quite a bit).

As far as the canines I think you may have come to the same conclusion as Psychrome. As I thought about it it would seem that fast animation should trump all. I really will have to get around to how ranged pets stay on target. My hope is that by endgame I get a good feel for the pet I will use in PvE primarily. Likely bird or wolf depending on how tanky my spec is toward the end.

Ty guys for the info provided again it truly does help.

deepwinter.9015:

Birds are no different than the other pets when it comes to moving targets. There’s even a video demonstrating it here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qk5DiFJAtWQ

I don’t actually disagree but your video illustrates melee mechanics in this game at its core. This applies to players also. Whenever you enter a long animation if another player kites you while you use a melee weapon they can literally out of range you by moving away while in the animation (this can also happen at max range for ranged weapons during flight). The most notorious skill this happens to is 100b for warriors since you can walk out of it.

Considering that I do this on ele quite often vs pure melee classes I dont know exactly what to say. Afaik this is intended but I do agree the animation is slow. The analysis feels off as you could face this issue on the third skill of guardians hammer and numerous other weapon sets. The delay between the action and the affect is long enough for something to move away. Since this happens in general pve and pvp to players I am hard pressed to accept this. Without snares and movement this could happen to most melee across the board.

I don’t disagree that accuracy is an issue I just feel this was a bad example because I have seen this done to players and all form of npcs using a melee weapon. Once again I agree pet accuracy needs help but this seems to be more of a general issue for any skill that animation roots.

Yeah this keeps happening to me. Too many pugs with guys who type a word every second is giving me wall of text crits. In all seriousness I hope they fix this.

drkn.3429:

Contrary to popular belief, FotM is designed to bring people fun, not grind.
If you don’t find FotM fun, don’t play it. If you don’t find repeating FotM 5 times a day, don’t do it.
If you find fun in doing one phase of FotM every other day with your constant party of friends or guildies, go down that route. If you find fun in grinding relics, grind them; if you don’t – don’t!

Since the only ‘grind’ you need is ‘required’ to advance within the same part of the game as the ‘grindy’ one, if you don’t enjoy FotM you don’t have to ever set foot there.
If you do enjoy it, you shouldn’t feel it’s grind.
Perfect design!

However the ascended gear there is attainable through no other means. If one wished to have max stats they would have no alternative than to farm FOTM. On another note not all stats are represented in the drops thus some builds will be at a disadvantage stat wise strictly from a number perspective whether they run FOTM or not.

I agree that FOTM is not required in the general sense however this is a moot point. You aren’t required to do any of the content. It is a game you aren’t required to do anything. Literally you are free to buy the game and never play it as it is your money. However if you want the best gear or to follow the most commonly accepted route of progression past leveling (ie gear) you are required to go to FOTM.

Veltoss.9135:

Not sure if you understand what “grind” really is.

If you mean comparative grind like EQ vs FFXI vs WoW in terms of difficulty where you define “grind” as a specific term described with a number value ie number of hours, number of attempts etc. Then there is no way for me to describe it in away that would be applicable to all mmo experiences held by each individual. However, “grind” as a general term (repeatable content that must be repeated in order to receive a reward item level or otherwise ) applies here just fine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grinding_
Edit:

Hobocop.1508:

TheGuy.3568:

Hobocop.1508:

Not really feeling it. It’s possible to play around agony in the 10-19 bracket without needing resistance.

I’ll just be getting the infused backpiece that doesn’t require any T6 mats. Not much else to spend the tokens on besides obsidian shards, and saves T6 mats for my legendary.

I understand that logic. However the challenge of higher ranks past that (say 20+) still seems to be gated. Now if the only difference 20+ was that agony hits harder than I would argue that you are right since content would effectively be the same. However mobs (trash, etc) do change and become more difficult to deal with.

And? Somehow I doubt that a couple of silly rings and a backpiece that result in a total of +30 to their primary statistic over equivalent exotics is going to make or break having to deal with those enemies.

You missed my point. In order to take on those bigger challenges you much beat the bosses. If the content was the same across the board and agony being the only difference from level to level than content at level one would be just as challenging as content at level 20. However it isn’t the content gets progressively harder across the board from the boss to the trash. In order to under take that greater challenge you must progress past the boss. In order to progress past the boss you must progressively increase your resistant to agony. The armor has little to do with the trash but the gates to more difficult content ie the bosses.

It has nothing to do with the mobs just the bosses. Hope that clarifies my original comment.

Hobocop.1508:

Not really feeling it. It’s possible to play around agony in the 10-19 bracket without needing resistance.

I’ll just be getting the infused backpiece that doesn’t require any T6 mats. Not much else to spend the tokens on besides obsidian shards, and saves T6 mats for my legendary.

I understand that logic. However the challenge of higher ranks past that (say 20+) still seems to be gated. Now if the only difference 20+ was that agony hits harder than I would argue that you are right since content would effectively be the same. However mobs (trash, etc) do change and become more difficult to deal with.

@Malediktus
That sounds like a great solution but I don’t know if they would implement it since it seems that the rng maybe be permanent to delay the community as a whole.

I keep wondering this since Anet promised us they were moving way from this but know I wonder if FOTM, as good as it is, is just a modified endgame dungeon grind for stats so you can progress?

My argument is this. FOTM without agony could be considered a progression in skill solely rather than stats. Your stats don’t need to change but the difficulty will creating more of a challenge. While FOTM does do this it also requires you to “get lucky” to progress further into it. In order to test if you can handle more difficult content the dungeon creates barriers to entry not based on skill but the rng and finances. IE if you have access to massive funds you can progress your back piece faster thus minimizing you need for rings. However at some point you will need the rings which come from rng.

This creates an environment that does not account for skill as greatly as it does for ones capability to grind. This make the environment where grind>skill however it takes skill + grind + rng = Progress. Wouldn’t this make GW2 no different than any mmo before it?

Discuss. These are just my thoughts don’t lose your minds lol.

I understand what you mean since I sue cleric rings also. Honestly the rings are random so there is never a guarantee on getting the stats you want. That being said Anet should have had them in pace from the start. FoTM while a beautiful dungeon is a grind fest to its core. Sadly the grind is for stats.

Hmm. I will put it like this unless the melee dies or melee dps triggers anything to wipe the party than there is no reason to kick. Assuming that the skill of one player is equal to another is foolish and short sited. Noting how many ranged I have seen die on simple things I doubt one weapon set or another truly makes any difference.

That being said I have played D/D ele for a long time now and am usually the most survivable member of my team. Range is the most easily accessible form of survival however, it is not the best. In this game like many action MMO understanding when to dodge will trump all the range in the world. Its just that simple. Play TERA, DCUO or any game with an invulnerable dodge and you will figure it out.

The other thing is pugs are pugs so expect pug bullkitten. People will want you to run a build that is to their liking. They will expect you to be generic dps number 3 and that just how it goes. There is no reason to get upset about getting kicked since you could have seen it coming.

Edit: Since knowledge needs to be passed on

You gonna melee the dredge boss in FotM? I’d kick you right away.

As a point of interest I have always melee kited him since it holds aggro better. In many cases I have seen the aggro shift to the person on the lava so on many fights to force myself up the aggro table I have melee kited him. The only thing you really have to worry about are the bombs and the ground and pound agony if you use a vigor buff and dodge you can avoid the bombs ans a portion of the agony. Any invulnerable state will allow you to resist the agony all together. Also if you kick some one from fotm your stuck in a 4 man so its not a wise move.

Ravenmoon.5318:

P.S: IMO ANet should give every fractal boss a 20 second AOE on the outer ring to show those ranged noobs that they simply suck

They already do. Agony in many of the boss fights works that way including dredge.

all your question can be answered by visiting the wiki for each skill
1. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_the_Wild 7% to you 25% for pet

2. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rune_of_the_Dolyak no effect

3. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rejuvenation_ is just a http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Regeneration so 12.5%

@DiogoSilva

Warrior is not Op I agree. However it is the balance point. Almost any weapon set combo is good. That’s where warrior shines no matter the weapon its at least OK there isn’t a single bad one. In the same sense warrior can counter just about anything. It can fight any class its that class in this game the middle the one every other class is supposed to be balanced against.

For instance thieves are good burst dps OK at range with SB but P/P is usually kitteny and their support and bunker builds are crap. Guardian can do ti all but there range weapon scepter is lack luster and weak in PvP (the orbs move so slow). Mesmer is the troll of all troll class even past thief but its support is nearly never seen due to the fact that illusion builds shatter or other wise are so strong (when was the last time you saw a strong mantra build?). Bunker is non existent as the class has to absolutely move. In PvE strong aoe will ruin a shatter builds.

The thing is though ArmageddonAsh is right. All these classes have been gifted with being great in PvP. Warrior have one of the best max range weapons and the strongest melee aoe CC in the game (literally 2 of them could stun lock you to death even with breaks). Thief back stab stealth what more needs to be said. Guardian bunker. Mesmer shatter confusion stacking. The oter thing its most of these require little effort to execute properly.

On the other hand (I don’t want this wall to go much farther but to sum up). Ele attunement swapping is basically required no strong one or two element builds. ranger pet ai aoe damage taken and dps is lackluster. Stuck with condition damage builds power builds are beyond lack luster. They also can’t chase at all literally you can walk away.

Engineers are a story all of their own.

Torafugu.1087:

TheGuy.3568:

Torafugu.1087:

I dare ANY elementalist to solo my Mesmer. I don’t care how good you are or what you do. the Mesmer wins.

I dare your Mesmer to tank a champion and kill his adds, kill ten mobs at once, run faster than us, have 20 skills just for weapons, blah blah.

Good ele vs good mesmer if you wont lose I would leave its as simple s that. No good ele is going to fall victim to a class with very weak cc (beside a strong range on gs). It would likely be a draw.

Also what you do in PvP is inline with the strongest PvP class for ease of use and mechanics. While that is all well and good its not an I win button. We don’t have many duels and if we did mesmer would likely be a champion class at it. However if we were to list everything your class sucks at I doubt it would be worth winning 1 on 1.

Please exit our forums you have your own use them. Or you could go to SPvP everyone their knows for a fact their the best player in the world.

I have a level 80 Elementalist. I am merely pointing out the fact Mesmers don’t die while dead elementalists are fashionable battlefield decorations.

Elementalists do can run away amazingly fast as you pointed out

Than either you or the eles you play with aren’t very good or think they are supposed to win every 2 v1 and never need to kite. Fact is ele is very good in PvP in the hands of someone who knows what the hell they are doing. A memer wiped some guardian came after me and the scenario played out like that shatter evade into the mesmers you cant catch me. I simply walked away healed twice and waved adieu. The fail part of mesmer is for all the cc they have thy are near useless everywhere else. Beside the occasional portal and ether field what else does it bring to the table?

We all know mesmers are easy to play and rank up there with thieves infact my first toon was a mesmer is scrapped it I actually like a challenge. Half of the eles here realize the upper threshold of this class put just about every other to shame. So play a mesmer but don’t troll here you have your advantages I admit that but at the end of the day 1 ele is 10 times more useful overall.

Torafugu.1087:

I dare ANY elementalist to solo my Mesmer. I don’t care how good you are or what you do. the Mesmer wins.

I dare your Mesmer to tank a champion and kill his adds, kill ten mobs at once, run faster than us, have 20 skills just for weapons, blah blah.

Good ele vs good mesmer if you wont lose I would leave its as simple s that. No good ele is going to fall victim to a class with very weak cc (beside a strong range on gs). It would likely be a draw.

Also what you do in PvP is inline with the strongest PvP class for ease of use and mechanics. While that is all well and good its not an I win button. We don’t have many duels and if we did mesmer would likely be a champion class at it. However if we were to list everything your class sucks at I doubt it would be worth winning 1 on 1.

Please exit our forums you have your own use them. Or you could go to SPvP everyone their knows for a fact their the best player in the world.

Afaik this should work in PvE solo play because glass is fine there. However in parties you would just be a liability. The other day ran fotm with 2 staff ekitten th were dps glass both spent a lot of time downed. It got to the point that I was suiciding to rez everyone because they all went glass.

Glass has some very limited uses in this game because in many cases you have to deal with your own aggro and mobs. The problem with ele is our burst is not very bursty outside some boss battles. Vets packs etc will eat through you without some form of defensive stats. You don’t have to heal a party (your’e right its mostly a waist outside cleanses). The thing to remember is that our personal healing is on the very good/great side. You don’t need to change you build for the general but most glass builds like this are heavily dependent on support classes in group PvE.

C Blair.7810:

Muspilli.6273:

Eliminating the nerf of Support/DPS potential from the discussion/argument. This simple change has removed the enjoyment/FUN FACTOR from many builds.
This UNINTENDED mechanic allowed for one of the most immersive experiences I have ever had in any MMO to date.

It’s that simple, and Yes it could of been handled much much better.

I am one of the many considering D/D as illustrated by the view count of this post:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Tanky-DPS-Elementalist-Videos-11-14-12/page/6#post803151

It has risen from 10k to 50k over this week. We are still here! We enjoy this class immensly!

Please divulge your thoughts and desires of this change/fix ARENANET.

Having watched that video, I can imagine the next profession patch notes:

Elementalist

• Mist Form no longer allows the casting of finishers as intended
• Signet of Healing’s effectiveness has been reduced by 50% to scale with other healing skills
• Swiftness boons on the Elementalist have had their durations reduced by 33%

If they ever did that I would quit. Don’t give them ideas lol.

Forum ate my response the short version

Air 3,4,and 5 Water 3,4, and 5 Earth 4 and 5 Fire 3,4,and 5 are all survival tools. Underwater dps is low so your’e ool on that front. Acclimate yourself with the water bars and you’ll be just fine http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Trident.

For that mission let Forgal do most of the work.

Remember your chalk full of cc especially earth and air but every element has it use them.

Ty all for the info. I will stick with birds for now but will look more into devourers and spiders as I level but will likely stay with the former. When I start to pvp I will likely go with canines from the info you give it would seem that in melee range the quickness on swap would likely make the knock down a guarantee. Ty again.

Yeah I have been using birds and have found them mostly consistent I just wasn’t sure if that was the best, and since I haven’t got them all I have been wondering.

Canines I like the cc but sometimes they feel unresponsive.

How about spiders and devourers? Are there projectiles the type you can move away from or do you have to dodge?

I figured as much but I meant even with that animation speed range etc

Started a ranger alt and have liked it fine so far but I was wondering about this.

Ill tell you a simple truth that applies across all profs. Its never your parties job to set up for you. Asking someone to not lure the mob means you didn’t have aggro thus your asking them to sit still while you perform your main burst. Basically what you need is a tank. The sad reality is this is a kiters game. Very few people can sit still just so you can get your burst done. And while its true teamwork is key in many areas of this game there is no reason for your parry to need to do anything so you can dps.

I realized long ago that the mobs have a mind of their own and will go wherever they like. Its has noting to do with your team. What seems like kiting to you is likely surviving to them. Your going to have to learn to create your own dps opportunities or get a guild that will coordinate so you can PW comfortably.

it needs a cross server finder. If there was ever a dungeon that needed an automatic system to group parties it is this one. Since the scales vary so much and much of it is skill/ (and in many cases with disconnects) luck based we need some form if automation that allows us to look for others without spamming one form of chat or another.

Honestly I really like the design and feel of fotm but we shouldn’t have to advertise to get into it. I cant think of a legitimate reason not to have a dungeon finder for this. Last thing I think any one would want to see is players spamming for run ranging from 1-25 or more not able to get party all in lions arch.

Anet should probably consider adding a finder for the sake of us all.

Maybe we need to post more. I hope that we get a response at some point but I fear that they don’t look at our forums often.

Are you talking about dungeons or general pve?

Well I can try to address this more directly.

1 and 2 just don’t go together. The most survivable builds will have you swapping nearly off cd.

3 is in the eye of the beholder. At first attunement swapping is hard a week later it will be natural.

4 not knowing what your gf wants to run makes this difficult. However battle, corruption, bloodlust, and air are all good choices.

The logic is this (beside some bunker builds which are only useful in SPvP) your going to swap all 4 attunements at some point in a fight thats longer that 15 seconds. Each one gives you access to a new bar with pretty much lets you spam skills in a very organized manner (for most).

About 2 attunements only. Is it possible? Its possible. However PvE open world would be a pain. In dungeons you could do this on staff at max range with water earth but she would end up being a piss poor ele overall.

The best advice I can give you is to have her just learn to swap.

Honestly I get why your asking for an easy build. I had created an ele early on and deleted it because I found the swapping too hard. Eventually I got bored and saw a vid of an ele (daphoenix) soling a champ and 2 vets. I recreated an ele and leveled it to 80 in a week. Once I figured out the swapping I realized I was playing one of not the best PvE class there is.

I am going to point you to a few post that should help

Our Least broken weapon set right now is D/D the others are fine but D/D was hit the lightest by the patch:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Tanky-DPS-Elementalist-Videos-11-14-12/page/6#post689566

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Guide-Mastering-the-D-D-ele-11-17-12/first

Keybind Advice:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Keyboard-and-the-Elementalist

General guide:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Guide-Elementalist-101/first

Gl

Going to give you a little perspective as I have no precursor or legendary etc etc.

If everyone got a precursor it would have been a kittenupon the heads of all the legendary owners atm. For 3 hours work you get what took others weeks if not months? How does that seem fair. Now out of this the price on some precursors may drop a little bit so there is some net gain for all those seeking a legendary. The other thing to note is that while rare you can get one out of other big chest like Jormag etc so with this many people it should actually be expected. Also the whole precursor is rng with the forge anyways.

Now this is not a defense of anet. Precursors probably shouldn’t have dropped from the chest at such a high rate. Ti would have made more sense to guarantee on piece of ascended and call it a day imho. However the outrage about this is pretty much unfounded. kitten about the lag the execution or anything else but this wasn’t that big a deal.

Creslin.1758:

Navzar.2938:

Creslin.1758:

Dagger/dagger isn’t all that effected by its removal.

EA was good for comboing the fire fields to might stack.

That it is, and I did that frequently pre-patch. What I am saying is that a good d/d build does not depend on EA. it’s just an option. There are many other options that are just as good or arguably better.

Honestly Creslin has it right D/D was affected but in a very marginal way. Staff and scepter have been kittened quite a bit but primarily staff. D/D is good at it was before the patch. Being a good dps a good kite tank and an ok support.

Yeah was wondering the same thing

I am going to attempt to give you some perspective. As people level there will be more legendaries. Since the history of MMO’s the first people to level, get rare item, handle end game content etc have placed value on getting it done. However, if you play long enough you will realize many people will get it done. It is true the first generation of an item or content is hard second is easier and depending on the grind for items it should get even eiser still.

Now here’s no perspective, The value is not in the item but then when. Server first have always been a point of mention in PvE and will likely be that for some time as it is part of the mmo culture. Instead of worrying how easy it is for the next guy to get (as it will get inherently easier with time no matter what you do) focus on your personal achievement.

If you truly want to make point do other things other can not or will not (solo dungeons level guilds solo etc). At the end of the day all that matter is that you realize you did something of note with your time not others.

Lets end this garbage conjures tend to be kitten. Let me repeat since for some reason someone felt the need to point this out on our forums also ELE CONJURES ARE kitten! Most decent eles don’t use them because beside 1 massive aoe skill on frost bow their kitten. Let me say it again no really good eles use them because despite the buff their still kitten.

QQ all you like no one uses them. There is nothing to compare here. Any eles using conjures has just kittened themselves. Hammers for warrior are still one of the best cc weapons in the game. Useless vs Useful there really is nothing to compare here.

Lictor Alpha.3724:

TheGuy.3568:

Simple answer no. We can be glass but no cannon. Howsoever, despite our collective anger about the current patch Ele is still one of the strongest if not the strongest solo class around. I wont lie about or deny it. A ele speced into water 20+ points geared with enough toughness and hp can drop just about anything. We don’t burst as well as other classes but our sustained dps, defensive skills, cc, healing, and maneuverability are almost send to none. While it factually requires more effort to play ele with time attunement swapping become natural.

What we have not seen is an increase in burst dps or traits in the fire and air line reflect us having any capability to do so.

What are you useing D/D?

Funny how its in my sig lol :-)

For EA primarily? No. For the attunement reduction? Yes. Also water EA is part of how I play so I doubt I would be comfortable without it.

fixit.7189:

Eh D/D and S/D builds still ok. Certainly not as good as before but still does the job….

However, Staff ele is a total write off now. May as well go guardian if you like to support.

This is it in a nutshell. We (D/D and S/D) lost a bit of dps. If you used the exploit a lot of dps. One thing to note is that many of us will stay 30 arcane due to the fluidity of the game play we are used to. From what I have seen most D/D players are stance dancers and that reduced cool down is a big part of the play style. Also the heal from water EA is still the heal from water EA.

Simple answer no. We can be glass but no cannon. Howsoever, despite our collective anger about the current patch Ele is still one of the strongest if not the strongest solo class around. I wont lie about or deny it. A ele speced into water 20+ points geared with enough toughness and hp can drop just about anything. We don’t burst as well as other classes but our sustained dps, defensive skills, cc, healing, and maneuverability are almost send to none. While it factually requires more effort to play ele with time attunement swapping become natural.

What we have not seen is an increase in burst dps or traits in the fire and air line reflect us having any capability to do so.

Quite frankly it’s the challenge. While with time it becomes more natural, compared to other classes simply put we do more. We are one of the best kite tankers in the game, one of the best support, and we have decent sustained dps and cc. Fact is the reason I play ele is because it requires me to be more than generic dps number 1. They gave us a bag of tricks vs a few pew pew buttons.

Heimlich.3065:

TheGuy.3568:

Effectively Anet nerfed healing on staff.

In the general section of the changes, I saw this too:

Many skills, items, and traits were applying healing to an infinite amount of targets and have now been limited to 5 targets.

I haven’t tested this (and probably won’t bother), but it looks like an extra nerf to Ele’s support capabilities.

They nerfed our healing in general. I wont say it was unfair as it can be argued that our healing could be over the top at times. Its just the level of nerf they dealt to staff was excessive. this sort of meta game nerf can kill a class. However in this case it will likely kill a weapon. Staff ele often would pride themselves on their supportive play style as no other class can really compare. It may be shocking for some but nerfing EA to this point might make many shelve the weapon entirely.

Vs other classes we had no true dominant weapon set as each had their trade off and the benefit/losses we relatively the same. Right now without EA I don’t know what exactly the benefit of staff is anymore. It’s too reliant on good team players when there are so few. I think other eles might understand where I come from when I say its not that we want to do everything but that we have to do everything.

arcane retribution + vigor might be an ok idea. Honestly I am fine with the traits and though EA does not feel like a 30 point skill anymore carrying it for the heal cleanse in water is still a good idea.

Baladir.2736:

TWMagimay.9057:

Strang.8170:

Stationary target because you need to prepare your heal with eruption for it to be worth anything, and with cast times that´s good 2-3 second process. on top of that with recuded finisher amount, you´ll need to make sure people stay in your heals.

As opposed to before when you could see people on low health (usualy running franticly), throw a field towards them and cap off with dual finisher(dodge+arcane wave). Kept you both mobile, didn´t require recipient to set up a camp inside your heal and rewarded skillful play and observation.

Oh, I see. Because, obviously, team play is for noobs and not the skillful gameplay of 1 person doing everything. I always lay my fields on those who need them, they finish them themselves and magic happens. Guess I’m just not as good as you are. Point being, you created a playstyle that wasn;t supposed to exist based on a trait that was clearly bugged. And now it’s “harder”. -pause for a duhhhh-

I had to laugh at this exchange. As someone who just only found out a month or so ago that EA had a blast finisher, and someone who only plays a couple times a week and so never had much chance to use this “new” function, I can safely say I will not miss it.

I’ve never been one to read alot about other peoples builds, preferring to figure things out myself. So, the chances of stumbling upon undocumented “skills”, (exploits or bugs would actually be better words), are slim. The fact you guys have built entire builds around these bugs is understandable. That’s what many players do with bugs and exploits, exploit them lol. To recongnize we have to change is honest enough, but to whine about it just seems so…… like a little brat throwing a fit when he’s caught with his hands in the cookie jar and is told no more cookies for you.

Like you said you don’t play much so you wont get it. We (that’s right “we”) reported the bug. What we saw was that every time we would dodge roll we would gt a blast finisher no cd at all. Some (read that word) players exploited it. What we lost wasn’t a big deal for D/D and S/D we will cope. Effectively Anet nerfed healing on staff. The blast finisher they have access to has a very long cast to effect time ie it takes a while to proc. Its also a tricky combo to pull off. Considering how mobile everything in the game is it requires you to read mind rather than react on the spot.

Now I get you haven’t played much and don’t play often but you not realizing it worked that way doesn’t mean the rest of us should just stay quiet and take it. Many people here did the right thing and wanted the skill to be balanced. What they have now learned is that reporting a bug could lead to a trigger happy nerf which could hurt our class.

While i respect your right to have your own Opinion your incapability to see the far reaching implications of what was done upsets me. While its true I am one of those less effected by this change (since I play D/D) I still realize how big the impact is to the community at large. Perhaps you should try the same?

Another thing about the discussion you quoted

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blast_Finisher

If player understood that half the skills that carry a blast are nigh useless and that consistent blast lie in the hands of SB thief (rare) and hammer users. Our EA blast were useful all around.

It looks sound. The only thing is the gear setup isn’t there. Any build with 20+ in water is pretty much on the right path anyway aura are great since you can keep fury up for when you need it but looking at that build you’ll need some boon duration (for what you lose from arcana). Beside that and having enough crit chance to justify your crit proc skills it looks good imho.

One thing though the 20% cd reduction on air skills I am not sure about it. I don’t mean this as grand criticism (I think the trait is fine to carry) just wondering if one of the other traits might serve you better. Bolt to the heart and soothing winds look pretty good to me but I feel 20% is still Ok since UD will be on a better cd and so will your main aura.

raziel.8375:

we need 30arcane sadly cuz of rechagre time between attments do the math if ur running DD with boons u need to swap fast and with only 20 it throws everything off big time… iv been working on different builds but it feels stuck if u dont have 30 in arcane

For me this is the core issue it dropped my pace too much the 10 extra earth I really couldn’t feel the usefulness. EA is still half worth it for the extra heal/cleanse in water I cant deny that. Since I used to use EA for the blinds etc any its still integral in my playstyle but it doesn’t feel like a 30 point skill anymore. Its so weird. I still “need” it but it feel kittened to the point that I should drop it but I really don’t want to.

Lets call it what it is we had a skill removed. Everyone got dps increases/decreases etc but what we got was a skilled removed from the arsenal. It just reminds us that eles as a community aren’t really understood. This isn’t the same as a skill nerf but the removal of an entire style of play.

Also note so many of us said it was a bug. Many of us never exploited the bug (I for one was expecting the fix and didn’t want to use it). What we never expected was seeing probably one of out most useful traits get gutted to this point. This isn’t just taking away a toy some exploited. Right now ele are going to gt pigeon holed into more defensive specs. My fear is that D/D will become the only acceptable play style. Even S/D had ones of its blast finishers nerfed.

I know the devs are unlikely to come here and talk to us. I don’t want them to defend there reasons just explain them. We are one of the Hardest classes to play and most of us actually had to work at getting good.

Not to over exaggerated but EA’s usefulness was on par at times with stealth and clones for many builds it was the true core mechanic. I will admit my build will still work with EA not as a blast finisher my dps will take a small hit but for our staff family this was too much. Not realizing this shows a disconnect with our community.

fixit.7189:

I look forward to it.

Tried FGS tonight extensively and frankly I was not impressed.

I got owned so hard too, it was really pathetic.

Went back to D/D modified bunker build and did way way better.

Honestly I got rid of arcana and did this too. The realized I hate bunker so I went back got my arcana and called it a day. DPS and heal nerf all in one day I mean really lol.

Lets be honest here they are going to heard us into D/D bunker with this bs.

skinnyb.5920:

hey everyone. i’m about to hit level 80 with my elementalist and so far i can’t find a build that i enjoy playing. i want to focus on being a staff-based glasscannon with aoe damage and decent criticals but when i run dungeons or play wvw, i don’t seem to be very effective.

right now i’m trying out 20/30/0/10/10 and i’m dying a lot more than i’d like. granted, i’m still in level 65 gear (i’m waiting till 80 to buy new stuff. i’m thinking knights gear), it’s a bit ridiculous how squishy i am. even though all of my utilities are cantrips like mistform.

i’m looking for any suggestions that involve a staff or s/d playstyle. i see a lot of d/d builds but i don’t find that interesting at all. i chose elementalist because i wanted to be a ranged caster.

OP I am going to level with you. Glass cannon and ele really don’t mix. Staff and glass cannon don’t mix (maybe in PvE but in higher level ares you’ll be eating dirt often in PvP forget it no one will sit in your aoes). Your going to get at lot farther with a balanced build or a bunker build. Even if you went dps s/d you may survive but glass is glass and we sit with some of the lowest base defensive stats. I am sorry but this is the really of ele glass doesn’t really work well with up.

XodoK.8734:

Someone earlier mentioned that boon duration stacking was reduced as well. Could someone point me to the exact quote from the patch notes?

That was a general nerf to the duration of runes that increase boon duration (vs the ones that increase a specific boons’ duration ie Pack save the one mentioned above
) This is PvP only btw.

“Updated Rune of Water to provide 10% boon duration instead of 15% in PvP.
Updated Rune of the Monk to provide 10% boon duration instead of 15% in PvP.”

/Signed. I am with you all.

All the builds that didn’t use EA are still viable and there are quite a few.