Plenty of other, cheaper fish in the sea. My husband is checking out Archage, and I’m having a look at The Secret World again, which had 11 comparable size expansions (priced between $5 and $10 per) since 2012. Maybe we’ll buy HoT when it reaches a similar price level… AND adds another character slot.
Value for money, or no deal.
Just a bit of advice, tried archeage, it is ok but a bit slow and not as well polished, also it is VERY farm heavy, but PvP farm heavy also. GW2 is better.
We’ve been in GW2 since beta… nothing here we’ve not seen or done yet. We’d love new content, we’re just not prepared to pay $60 per person for the content that HoT offers. Especially if that same money buys us 10x the content elsewhere.
I get that, I’m just saying Archeage isn’t actually that good a game. It’s a hype based thing, the combat is meh. Just saying it isn’t much of a replacement for GW2 and you would be better not spending your money on Archeage.
Think it’s a free game… at least, hubby didn’t mention paying anything. He’s sorta looking around right now. Thx for the advice though, I’ll pass it on. =)
You can’t really play Archeage as a free game. Not if you want to be competitive, and it is a PvP game. So if you want to compete, you’ll pay. Or you’ll be canon fodder for those that do pay.
That’s not really the point. The point is getting value out of what you DO decide to pay. If Archeage sucks, well, too bad, it won’t get a penny and there’s plenty of other games out there.
You’re 100% right. I’ve gotten more value out of Guild Wars 2 than any other game I’ve ever played….and I’ve played a bunch of them for a long long time. That’s why I’m happy to preorder. $50 or even $100 for the amount of hours I’ve played this game is nothing.
Just keep in mind, the grass is always greener on the other side. Many people on these forums went to Archeage, claiming it would kill Guild Wars 2. I’m not sure how many stayed, but both my sons had the same reaction, and both of them requested refunds for all the money they spent. Only one of them got that refund.
You’re not entitled. The company offers a product, you pay for it or you don’t. If you don’t, you don’t get it. If you do, you get the product.
But MMOs are a bit different from other products, because they’re supposed to evolve. This game is evolving. If you don’t like the direction of the evolution, you’re entitled to take your business elsewhere.
That’s pretty much all your entitled to.
Plenty of other, cheaper fish in the sea. My husband is checking out Archage, and I’m having a look at The Secret World again, which had 11 comparable size expansions (priced between $5 and $10 per) since 2012. Maybe we’ll buy HoT when it reaches a similar price level… AND adds another character slot.
Value for money, or no deal.
Just a bit of advice, tried archeage, it is ok but a bit slow and not as well polished, also it is VERY farm heavy, but PvP farm heavy also. GW2 is better.
We’ve been in GW2 since beta… nothing here we’ve not seen or done yet. We’d love new content, we’re just not prepared to pay $60 per person for the content that HoT offers. Especially if that same money buys us 10x the content elsewhere.
I get that, I’m just saying Archeage isn’t actually that good a game. It’s a hype based thing, the combat is meh. Just saying it isn’t much of a replacement for GW2 and you would be better not spending your money on Archeage.
Think it’s a free game… at least, hubby didn’t mention paying anything. He’s sorta looking around right now. Thx for the advice though, I’ll pass it on. =)
You can’t really play Archeage as a free game. Not if you want to be competitive, and it is a PvP game. So if you want to compete, you’ll pay. Or you’ll be canon fodder for those that do pay.
Realize that rather than being happy to get a big expansion that could breath a new breath into a (possibly) stagnating game that has the potential to revitalize the game altogether, you are mad because they said something (a while ago) and they did something else.
Did you see this amount of complaints before the E3? Anet originally promised that all content will be free and they weren’t planning to make an expansion.
Yet, 3 year later, they do just that. And even though they broke their promise, nobody really complains and are hyped for the new expansion. There were some grey spots here and there, but generally, the playerbase was happy.
It’s what followed that caused this uproar.
“You are mad because they said something (a while ago) and they did something else”
Are you saying it’s unreasonable to complain about a company showing how untrustworthy they can be? And then ask me to happily support them?
This is no charity. I’m a paying customer.
Did you miss the number of people on the forums demanding a paid expansion? Because I didn’t.
Businesses have intentions. Intentions can change based on circumstance. That’s life. You adapt or you get left behind.
Anet didn’t pull an expansion out of their kitten just to annoy you. They made an expansion because the fan base demanded one, loudly and for a long time.
I’d take gliding, and a new profession, plus new specalizations which add weapons to professions (something EotN didn’t do), over anything in EotN. Of course, I’ll still have the TP which Guild Wars 1 didn’t have at all, and I’d still have jumping puzzles and I’d still be able to play other races.
See it’s not just the amount of content, it’s the type of content. Eye of the North was a lot of fun for it’s time, but it’s time is gone.
For that matter, I prefer active combat to static combat. And I definitely prefer what I’ve seen of the Guild Halls in Guild Wars 2 to what we had in Guild Wars 1. Oh and I like Guild Missions, I heard they’re being updated.
I didn’t really have those in Guild Wars 1.
Did I mention an open world instead of an instanced world. Because I prefer that too.
3 months after hot launches, is too long to wait to play it even at half price, for some of us anyway. The 250 people in my guild aren’t going to sit around and wait for a sale to start leveling up masteries or play the new profession, or start working toward our guild hall.
You’re not being suckered in to buy something and get to use it. It’s the same with the electronics. They come out, and go down very shortly after. If you want it for the months before it goes down in price, you pay a premium.
Some people may not think that’s worth it and they can wait. But it’s hardly being a sucker to decide you want to play it sooner.
I agree with what you are saying but I have no issues either waiting or just not even purchasing. After the huge disappointment GW2 was for me compared to GW1 and it’s expansions, I will not be buying HOT until after it has launched and will know exactly what is being given to players and what is not.
Anet lied before and misled it’s loyal vets before with the previous GW2 launch with marketing and “when it’s ready” BS, so a lot of players are very cautious now knowing what to expect from this Anet2.0 company.
So if you don’t like the game, why buy it at all. I’m a Guild Wars 1 player and I feel neither lied to about Guild Wars 2, nor do I feel unhappy with my purchase. And judging from the number of GWAMM titles running around the open world, I don’t think I’m the only one.
There is certainly a percentage of Guild Wars 1 players who are dissatisfied with Guild Wars 2, but that doesn’t mean that there aren’t as many who are satisfied. For those of us who intend to play, most of us will buy to be there for launch day. For those who aren’t sure, of course they should wait. That’s pretty obvious.
HoT Price Feedback + Base game included [merged]
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Vayne.8563
Not the place to ask for advice for a new game. Go to a gaming forum for that. I’m relatively sure you can play stronghold without purchasing the expansion, btw.
3 months after hot launches, is too long to wait to play it even at half price, for some of us anyway. The 250 people in my guild aren’t going to sit around and wait for a sale to start leveling up masteries or play the new profession, or start working toward our guild hall.
You’re not being suckered in to buy something and get to use it. It’s the same with the electronics. They come out, and go down very shortly after. If you want it for the months before it goes down in price, you pay a premium.
Some people may not think that’s worth it and they can wait. But it’s hardly being a sucker to decide you want to play it sooner.
HoT Price Feedback + Base game included [merged]
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Vayne.8563
What are people actually saying when they say, “HoT is not worth $50?” They’re saying that they have not yet seen enough to justify that price. They’re comparing HoT to other products that are priced similarly and making a judgment. This is called comparison shopping.
What are people actually saying when they say, “HoT is worth $50?” It’s either, “I’ve seen enough to justify the price.” or “I trust ANet.”
The discrepancy between those who haven’t and those who have seen enough? That comes down to different individuals valuing different things and/or having different standards. It’s subjective and cannot be resolved by rational (or in some cases irrational) discourse.
If it’s, “I trust ANet” … then that’s also a personal decision. I no longer trust them, not because of this issue, but because they no longer seem to want to provide the things about their game that I value. That’s why I’m waiting. If I will not buy based on trust, then HoT is going to have to undergo the comparison shopping test.
You’re right. There’s not enough information for most people to make a fair judgement on the expansion. And that information is going to come over the weeks and months ahead.
I’m not sure why people think there is some requirement for a company to offer enough information for everyone when first offering it for sale, that’s my point. Obviously some people feel they do have enough information and those people now have the ability to put down their money. I don’t think that’s a bad thing.
Nor do I think it’s a bad thing to wait and see if the game will be worth preordering or purchasing later down the road.
HoT Price Feedback + Base game included [merged]
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Vayne.8563
I don’t know why people seem to think finally getting around to adding a feature that existed in the original game (ie Guild Halls) is such a big thing- they should have been in at the start.
Skill updates, etc should have been happening every month, instead they hold them all back.
Dumbing down the trait trees and restricting build choice and stat selection is being sold as an ‘expansion’.
Grinding for mastery points, 3-4 new maps which we know nothing about, a new race, the inevitable hugely buggy wvw map (first new map since launch) and one new spvp map and the usual spam 1 zerg fest mechanics.
Sounds well worth the money…..
I’ll be playing gw1 for the foreseeable future- you know, the game with guild halls, templates for builds, real teams, hard missions and no face palm one shot cheese mechanics.
I’m sorry but they’re not adding a feature like Guild Halls in the original Guild Wars 1. If it was just an instanced room with some merchants that you can squirmish in, you might be right. But it’s not.
They’re doing something very different here. Giving you an entire zone. Creating a fight for that zone. ALlowing you to build structures in that zone. Allowing you to decorate it and move stuff around in it and rotate it. Allowing you to duel and squirmish. What they’re doing here isn’t a Guild Hall like you have in Guild Wars 1 and probably shouldn’t be mentioned in the same breath.
No one is suggesting that people are daring to ask what they’re paying for. Some people, however, are suggesting they feel they know enough and if others don’t, they’re free not to buy it. It’s not like you need to preorder the game this second, there’s plenty of time to do that after you have more info.
The fact that some people are interested in the game with the information we have should be enough for people who don’t think we have enough to realize that Anet didn’t necessarily do the wrong thing by offering a prepurchase now. After all, people have been asking for it.
There’s nothing wrong with wanting to wait for more info. There’s also nothing wrong with preordering.
All i see here are drones that allow Anet to kitten them up the kitten and, like all the little idiots here, refuse to understand why we’re upset and simply write it off as “moaning, kittening and self entitlement”.
I don’t think I’m a drone. I bought something I felt had value to me. I’m not telling you to buy it.
You felt that a DLC with no release date and unconfirmed features was worth spending $50 – $100 on?
the logic in that is strong….
Sure I did. Just like I preordered the second Lord of the Rings movie on DvD before I saw it. I know its’ Lord of the Rings. I know the director. I wanted the set.
I don’t need a release date, because I’m not impatient. I’ll play it when it’s here. I know the features I’ve seen will give me entertainment. If I get 50 hours at of the expansion and I’m sure I will get at least that much, that means I’m paying 1 buck an hour for entertainment. That is logic.
HoT Price Feedback + Base game included [merged]
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Vayne.8563
Yep, bought the Ultimate edition and so did my wife. My son will be buying it closer to launch.
All i see here are drones that allow Anet to kitten them up the kitten and, like all the little idiots here, refuse to understand why we’re upset and simply write it off as “moaning, kittening and self entitlement”.
I don’t think I’m a drone. I bought something I felt had value to me. I’m not telling you to buy it.
People don’t even know what’s in the expansion. These forums are ridiculous
What do you mean we don’t know what’s in the expansion. Just for the guild stuff I’m in. The story continues. We know about masteries and specializations, if not in detail. We know there’s a new WvW map and a new PvP type.
What we don’t know is how much, which is not knowing what’s in it. The only thing they really haven’t covered is the challenging content.
Except the Megaservers aren’t ridiculously priced and bite older players who don’t want to buy the core game twice in the butt.
Try again.
You are literally not even kittening buying it.
It just comes as a bonus for people that don’t have it.
AGAIN.
YOU
ARE
NOT
BUYING
ITkitten
It costs ANet to give stuff out for free.
Somebody else has to pay more to recoup that cost.So on one level you’re right we aren’t buying the extra copies for ourselves.
We’re buying them for the new players. Huh, guess we really are the nicest community in gaming.We’re not buying the game for new people, Anet is simply not charging new people for it, The price is the same with or without the original game being included. Would you be happy if they offered just an upgrade for $50, because that was the original plan.
“Simply not charging people” is an opportunity cost that somebody has to bear. The expansion would not be priced at 50$ if they were not giving out copies, barring the possibility that arenanet is generous enough to take the loss but somehow not generous enough to take an equivalent loss (charslot=$10=basegame) for veterans.
Now I’m not saying the latter possibility isn’t an option. It’s probably the most likely situation given marketing benefits of generosity to new players and the relative lack of gains when extending those benefits to vets. However, I see alot of people coming out with the “but its just a gift” argument as a counter to people who are aggrieved by the difference in treatment, when really it doesn’t change a thing.
TL;DR: Either we’re paying for the new copies, or Arenanet is choosing to make less money off of them but not off of us. Either way they vets are getting shafted and only the first option makes sense from an economics standpoint.
Or Anet wants more people to have access to the gem shop, which makes them money.
Please show us where you answered, or attempted to answer, his question or concerns. I’ll make it easy. You didn’t. He didn’t ask you to address his reasoning, or defend your reasoning.
And yes, that’s a problem.
Sorry this is off topic, please keep your posts on topic. He had concerns, he said he had concerns and I gave him a possible way to alleviate those concerns. Period. If you think it’s off topic report it, it not….it’s completely irrelevant.
I’m trying to help the guy, you’re post adds NOTHING to this conversation.
One of the big issues almost all MMOs face in gaining new people is the barriers to entry and there are a lot of them. Anet has tried to fix this by including the original game in HoT. They are including it for free, because they want people to get into the world. This drives gem sales which funds the game between expansions.
By removing even a single entry barrier, more people enter the world which is good for everyone who plays the game. Giving away the game isn’t a slap in the face to Veteran players, it’s something that’s good for veteran players. Let’s say someone buys the game from this point on. I can bring them into my guild now. They can come to my guild hall. They can become part of my family.
The other way, every time I recruit someone I have to ask if they have Heart of Thorns. If they don’t, they won’t be able to be with the guild when the game launches.
There are so many barriers to entry for new players in MMOs. New players are years behind some of us in the acquisition of gold and skins. I can easily buy a 90 gold skin from the TP if I want, for a new player, those skins will be out of reach for a much longer time, and in addition to that, many of the skins aren’t even available anymore.
All the content in Hot and all the content that will be added moving forward is for veteran players, but the decision to include the game for free benefits veteran players as well.
I don’t get why this is so hard for people to understand.
If they had said they were giving the game away to new players and still left the option to buy the standalone game that would be fine.
As it is the purchase page says that HoT comes with the base game.
When you apply the serial key it tells you that you are getting the base game, even if you’re upgrading your base game. Then it says you don’t get it because you already have it.If they are giving the base game with HoT you shouldn’t lose out because you already have it. You should get an extra key you can give to a friend. Plus that would bring a lot of new players into the game that don’t want to spend $50 right now but still have the potential to purchase gems or HoT later. Anet is just being stupid.
It’s what most MMOs do after time. They don’t make you buy every single expansion up to the current one. It would be too much of a barrier to entry.
So how would you feel if they had two different versions, at the same price? It’s a ridiculous comment. They’re not charging more. It’s the same price anyway.
Plenty of us bought the expansion and are happy, OP.
Brilliant OP. Just brilliant. Made me giggle.
@sosen I think you missed the point. lol
You… DO realize they havent even touched on the pve content yet, right? I mean, even the guild halls are kittening huge. Plus you’re getting another 2100 gems worth of stuff too. Not to mention beta access.
Mind you, if you’ve spent the gems or redeemed the code, you’re probably SoL and will risk account closure to get a refund. Plus if you want a refund already, certainly you were less than 100% sure you were wanting to put the money into it?
I do realize they haven’t touched on all of it yet, which is why I realized that I felt weird about pre-purchasing. I’m buying something that I really don’t know much about, and paying $50 for it. In my mind, I was paying $50 for 4000 gems and bunch of cool collectibles, but it didn’t occur to me until afterwards that I was also paying $50 for a mystery expansion.
I don’t know. I’m debating hitting submit on the ticket. If the price is never going to decrease, then I guess the refund is pointless.
But I’m really hoping it’ll decrease after the betas are over.
The price will decrease but not until well after launch most likely. If you’re most likely going to buy it anyway, I guess I don’t see the problem, unless you’re short on money of course.
Well, yeah. The opinions of others have influenced my decision. They made me realize that the expansion is just a bit overpriced in terms of the content that’s actually going to be in it. I regret pre-paying for it. I may still buy it after release, but I feel stupid for pre-paying.
When you buy an MMO you’re not buying a game. You’re buying access to content. It’s not just about what’s in the box, it’s about what comes after too. If you really think what you get in the box is all the play time your’e going to get out of HoT, you’re probably mistaken. There’ll be the Living Story resuming again. There’ll be new stuff added.
You’re buying access with an MMO, not a game. Think of it another way. How much did you pay for the original game and how many hours did you play it?
I know I bought Tomb Raider for $60 bucks at got about 20 hours out of it. That’s not unusual for games. People buy console games for that price all the time.
Here you get hundreds of hours for your purchase. I’m not really sure why you’d listen to the naysayers. Most of them are going to end up buying it anyway.
Um . . . he hasn’t ‘accessed’ any content in the expansion as far as I know. Your argument made no sense. He asked if he could get a refund. Not your opinion on the matter.
I was responding to his reasoning, which was part of the conversation. If you have a problem with what I said, by all means, report it to moderation. But telling me this is off topic when I’m directly responding to a statement is pointless…and incorrect.
Well, yeah. The opinions of others have influenced my decision. They made me realize that the expansion is just a bit overpriced in terms of the content that’s actually going to be in it. I regret pre-paying for it. I may still buy it after release, but I feel stupid for pre-paying.
When you buy an MMO you’re not buying a game. You’re buying access to content. It’s not just about what’s in the box, it’s about what comes after too. If you really think what you get in the box is all the play time your’e going to get out of HoT, you’re probably mistaken. There’ll be the Living Story resuming again. There’ll be new stuff added.
You’re buying access with an MMO, not a game. Think of it another way. How much did you pay for the original game and how many hours did you play it?
I know I bought Tomb Raider for $60 bucks at got about 20 hours out of it. That’s not unusual for games. People buy console games for that price all the time.
Here you get hundreds of hours for your purchase. I’m not really sure why you’d listen to the naysayers. Most of them are going to end up buying it anyway.
Except the Megaservers aren’t ridiculously priced and bite older players who don’t want to buy the core game twice in the butt.
Try again.
You are literally not even kittening buying it.
It just comes as a bonus for people that don’t have it.
AGAIN.
YOU
ARE
NOT
BUYING
ITkitten
It costs ANet to give stuff out for free.
Somebody else has to pay more to recoup that cost.So on one level you’re right we aren’t buying the extra copies for ourselves.
We’re buying them for the new players. Huh, guess we really are the nicest community in gaming.
We’re not buying the game for new people, Anet is simply not charging new people for it, The price is the same with or without the original game being included. Would you be happy if they offered just an upgrade for $50, because that was the original plan.
The point I’m making is that, with everything Anet has done in the past that may have been unpopular, people complain then end up succumbing to what Anet has lay down as “this is how it’s going to be.”
I don’t think boycotting will change Arena Net’s mind or price. Boycott for a different reason but believe me they won’t change (or learn) from their mistakes.
I probably won’t be buying HoT because Anet doesn’t deserve my money with what they are doing or trying to do. But I don’t expect that they will change their price now because we complain. That will show they were wrong and boy, Anet sure doesn’t like to admit they were wrong that’s for sure. They just expect Everyone to conform to their parameters and we will because it’s their game.
Yes they’re trying to make money. What a horrible thing for a company to do. Oh the shame.
$50 is fine for an expansion. WoW charges that and also a sub. FFXIV charges $40 but also a sub. There’s no reason any AAA title shouldn’t charge $50 for an expansion.
In the case of Guild Wars 2, there’s also content that comes for free after the expansion. You’re not buying a game, you’re buying access to a world. That’s the difference between an MMO and a standalone game.
Since I’ve gotten thousands of hours for my initial purchase, I’m happy to make my second purchase. Anet isn’t doing anything wrong here. They’re simply removing a barrier to entry to that new people can play the game more easily which helps veteran player as well.
Strangely Star Trek Online is 100% free. You never need to spend a dime and and can have max gear. Last month I spent $120 on just fun stuff in Star Trek.
Zero for Guild Wars.
From Wikipedia about STO:
“Two subscription plans were originally available: Monthly Subscription was available for $14.95 a month with price breaks available for 3, 6 or 12-month payments. Lifetime Subscription was offered during the beta release as a promotion for $249.99 which waived the monthly fee as long as the account was not cancelled. Lifetime Subscriptions were also allowed two free character slots and unlocked ‘Liberated Borg’ as a playable species, both of which were not offered to players buying Lifetime Subscriptions after the Beta Test and Head Start access ended. After launch the Lifetime Subscription price rose to $299.99. In Season 1, a number of perks were added to all Lifetime players (pre- and post-launch) including primarily access to “The Captain’s Table”, a private joint-faction starbase exclusive to lifetime and veteran subscribers.
After Star Trek Online adopted a hybrid Free-to-Play model, a third, no-fee tier was added. Silver Class users have no monthly fee, but limited access to certain features. Gold Class users pay the subscription fee in exchange for perks not offered to the Silver Players and a monthly allotment of ZEN included. Lifetime players have the same perks as Gold Class players, including the monthly ZEN allowance and all of the veteran rewards issued immediately, without the monthly fee. All three tiers have access to the Z-Store. (See below.)"
For years the game wasn’t free to play and now it is, probably because it couldn’t sustain the sub business model. As a sub game I’m sure it had a huge springboard to dive off. The fact is, there are free to play games that have vast cash shops and that’s one business model.
But Star Trek, as a franchise feeds off a huge player base, because of five tv series, countless movies, books. I’ve never been to a Guild Wars convention, but I’ve been to many Star Trek conventions.
But yes, it did start off as a sub game it just happens to be free now. Don’t be surprised if Guild Wars 2 doesn’t go free in a couple of years.
I will say this much. Aion got a pretty big update yesterday and it was entirely, completely, free :-)
Sure after the game went free to play after years and years of charging a sub. Aion launched 7 years ago. When Aion was 3 years old, at this point, it still had a sub. So Aion after years of charging a sub, at $15 a month, now offers something for free after they feel they need to get players to stay in game or come back. Hardly inspiring.
I’m not so sure in another 4 years Guild Wars 2 won’t offer a free expansion. However, comparing apples to apples, at this point in Aion’s history, you’d have paid over $500 plus the price of the game just for the privilege of playing it.
But we know the name of at least two maps, so it’s not. lol
HoT Price Feedback + Base game included [merged]
in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns
Posted by: Vayne.8563
First of all $50 for an expansion is relatively normal. And since this isn’t a subscription game and you get more than just what you get in the box after you buy the box I don’t see the problem here.
As far as the game now being free, they were selling it for ten bucks anyway in sales. Ten bucks. All they’re doing here is removing a barrier of entry for new players. Veteran players shouldn’t be mad about this, they should be thrilled, because this is one of the biggest issues all MMOs face. Too many barriers to entry to attract new players. The more of these barriers that are taken down, the better it is for everyone…including veteran players.
One of the big issues almost all MMOs face in gaining new people is the barriers to entry and there are a lot of them. Anet has tried to fix this by including the original game in HoT. They are including it for free, because they want people to get into the world. This drives gem sales which funds the game between expansions.
By removing even a single entry barrier, more people enter the world which is good for everyone who plays the game. Giving away the game isn’t a slap in the face to Veteran players, it’s something that’s good for veteran players. Let’s say someone buys the game from this point on. I can bring them into my guild now. They can come to my guild hall. They can become part of my family.
The other way, every time I recruit someone I have to ask if they have Heart of Thorns. If they don’t, they won’t be able to be with the guild when the game launches.
There are so many barriers to entry for new players in MMOs. New players are years behind some of us in the acquisition of gold and skins. I can easily buy a 90 gold skin from the TP if I want, for a new player, those skins will be out of reach for a much longer time, and in addition to that, many of the skins aren’t even available anymore.
All the content in Hot and all the content that will be added moving forward is for veteran players, but the decision to include the game for free benefits veteran players as well.
I don’t get why this is so hard for people to understand.
OP, you gave me my first laugh of the day thank you.
You ask people not to have a go at people who want to wait for situation, while having a go with your title by calling the people who did prepurchase fools. Surely I’m not the only one who sees the irony in this.
I’ve not said one bad word about people who want to wait and see. I have probably said a couple of bad words about people who do nothing but attack. Or try to tell other people not to buy. See it’s one thing to say, I don’t think I’ll buy this yet and it’s another thing to say, no one should buy this. Because no one should speak for other people.
There has been far more attacking of people who like the game by people who don’t lately, than the other way around. Thanks for the laugh.
What EAnet owes us is non shady business practices. They charge $50 and then do not include a character slot so you can’t actually experience all of the content if you do not have one available to cynically wring another $10 buck out of you. They price it at $50 because of a captive audience; everyone that wants future content is required to have HoT, with the possible exceptions of content like halloween etc. never mind that you’re expected to drop the money with limited knowledge of what’s included.
Anyone dropping $50 is doing that with the information they have now. And I for one don’t consider what has been revealed so far worth $50.
Captive Audience? Really? Is this your first MMO?
If you play WoW, you can’t do the new content if you don’t pay the subscription AND buy the expansion. If you play something like Lotro or DDO, you have to buy each area and some professions. Those games take greed to a new level. Games are either pay to win, which which case they can afford to give you content for free, since you’re forced to pay anyway if you want to progress, or they lock parts of the game behind a paywall, or they charge you a monthly fee.
That’s the real world in MMO. Want to play FFXIV, be prepared to pay a monthly fee AND pay for an expansion. Want to play SWToR, sure you can, for free as long as you don’t want to do anything. It’s more like pay to walk. Most people who play it have the “optional” subscription. ESO had a sub fee milking people for an entire year, so if they come out with something now and it’s free, well, so what? Most players of that game paid over $150 to get there.
This isn’t some huge ridiculous cash grab. This is the realities of the industry and Anet is one of the lesser offenders.
As I said elsewhere, other games have no bearing on how I spend my money here. I consider the current pricing shady, with the double dipping for a character slot which excludes you from content you just purchased.
I would probably drop the $50 even though with the information available the xpac looks light to me. If I then see that players are being hit up for another $10 just to experience part of the content they just paid for, I’ll think twice.
Good for you that you’re happy with the way they went about it. I prefer to be a bit more discerning with my money.
if you could kindly stay away from the infantile ad hominems, that be swell.
First of all, in a game without a subscription you’re not just dropping $50 for the game, but all the content that comes out after the expansion as well. For the money I spent for the first Guild Wars 2 game, I got all of Season 1 and Season 2 of the Living Story, EoTM, 3 new maps, Fractals, a number of holiday events, and some great memories of playing. I’ve had a lot of fun for a lot of hours for my money.
I’m going to guess that Hot comes out, and I’ll be getting content updates moving forward from there, not just the price of hot but all the stuff that comes after. The first game was well worth it, I’m not sure why the second won’t be. People are literally arguing over $10. And if you do buy gems with any regularity, the people who are actually financially supporting the game regularly, you not only get a character slot but you get your next lot of gems at half price by buying the Ultimate Edition.
Saying other games have no bearing on whether you play this one is only slightly problematic. In a perfect world, that would make sense, but in the world of MMOs, where you don’t just buy a game by you buy access to a world, the landscape is different. Anet has 300 employees working on stuff five days a week around the year to bring you some of the content we’ve played between expansions. Other games, for the most part, don’t have this. Just MMOs. And those people have to be paid somehow.
People act like kitten price tag for a game like Heart of Thorns is this huge outlay of money for what you’re getting, forgetting about what we got for our first initial outlay. There are games in this industry that do give you more in expansions, but they also charge you a subscription fee each month and in some of them, you also get less content between expansions.
No matter what game forum you go to for an MMORPG, you’re likely to find a hostile fanbase, who are only interested in their own experience in that one game without wondering why the experience is like this.
$50 may seem like a lot of money for a one time purchase based on what we’ve seen so far, keeping in mind there’s still more we haven’t seen. But that’s not what we’re buying.
And no one can tell value if they don’t care it to something else out there. Value is a comparison of what’s available for the price.
OP, Wildstar and Aion both launched as subscription games. If Anet would have learned from their neighbors they would have charged us large amounts of money for many long months (and in Aion’s case years) before they went free to play. By the time those games were generous we’ve have spent hundreds of dollars. And if you think that Aion and Wildstar forums are a happy go lucky place compared to this, you obviously haven’t spent much time on them.
Hot is an expansion for Guild Wars 2 players. It’s the full game and an expansion for new buyers. The expansion is there, included with the original game.
tldr; There’s not enough info for me, so no one else should buy HoT. There’s enough information for some of us. Why do you care what we do?
You should watch this before making a decision: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Am9gVQB8gss
I have to say . . . that was scarily accurate. . . .
And I find it telling no one said Heart of Thorns alone . . . and this is GW2’s forums. Yeah . . . very telling.
Because I see this as a troll thread and thus no real point in replying to it. That’s all it really says.
I am relatively sure I’ll have a lot of fun with it and that I’ll get at least 50 hours of entertainment out of it, which is you know, a buck an hour.
And you are sure about that because…? Have you been told how many maps the expansion will have? How big each map will be? How many activities will be there? How many story instances there are in the game?
You don’t know any of those things. You are assuming everything will be bright and happy just because you want to assume everything will be bright and happy.
The matter of fact is – even now, when ArenaNet wants us to pay a very high price for the expansion, when they are asking us to judge how much it’s worth – they still haven’t talked about how much content the expansion will have. Merely the fact they are not using that information to sell the game is a strong hint that no, the game does not have that much content.
Calling someone dishonest because you’re feeling pressured to buy something there’s no pressure to buy doesn’t feel honest to me.
So, are you saying I’m dishonest?
I didn’t say you were dishonest. sorry if you inferred that. Something can feel dishonest and still be honest. You come off, to me as disingenuous, but that doesn’t make you dishonest. Just as Anet comes off as dishonest to you but it doesn’t make it so.
As for me knowing I’ll get 50 hours out of it, that’s easy to answer. I now know about Guild Halls and those will take time for me to build up. I know about masteries and those will take me time to unlock. Will I get 50 hours out of that. I guarantee you it’ll be more than 50 hours before I unlock all the masteries on a single character.
The SILVERWASTES kept me busy for more than 50 hours, so yes, I’m sure I’ll get more than 50 hours out of HoT.
If you’re buying the Ultimate pack, there certainly is reason to preorder. Let’s pretend I was going to buy 4000 gems. By preordering I get them half price, and still get a game I knew I was going to buy anyway.
And that is an excellent reason.
As usual, giving me food for thought my “white knight” Vayne.
You know a lot depends on where you are in life. Keeping a hundred bucks in my bank at this point, one way or another is meaningless. I’m retired, I’m doing okay, this is my main source of entertainment. Hell between Guild Wars 2 and Netflix, I don’t think I can get my entertainment any cheaper. Almost anything I do will cost more.
Hell, just going out for coffee with friends costs me more.
What’s the difference if I spent that money now, or spend it later, if I’m sure I’m going to spend it?
What EAnet owes us is non shady business practices. They charge $50 and then do not include a character slot so you can’t actually experience all of the content if you do not have one available to cynically wring another $10 buck out of you. They price it at $50 because of a captive audience; everyone that wants future content is required to have HoT, with the possible exceptions of content like halloween etc. never mind that you’re expected to drop the money with limited knowledge of what’s included.
Anyone dropping $50 is doing that with the information they have now. And I for one don’t consider what has been revealed so far worth $50.
Captive Audience? Really? Is this your first MMO?
If you play WoW, you can’t do the new content if you don’t pay the subscription AND buy the expansion. If you play something like Lotro or DDO, you have to buy each area and some professions. Those games take greed to a new level. Games are either pay to win, which which case they can afford to give you content for free, since you’re forced to pay anyway if you want to progress, or they lock parts of the game behind a paywall, or they charge you a monthly fee.
That’s the real world in MMO. Want to play FFXIV, be prepared to pay a monthly fee AND pay for an expansion. Want to play SWToR, sure you can, for free as long as you don’t want to do anything. It’s more like pay to walk. Most people who play it have the “optional” subscription. ESO had a sub fee milking people for an entire year, so if they come out with something now and it’s free, well, so what? Most players of that game paid over $150 to get there.
This isn’t some huge ridiculous cash grab. This is the realities of the industry and Anet is one of the lesser offenders.
If you’re buying the Ultimate pack, there certainly is reason to preorder. Let’s pretend I was going to buy 4000 gems. By preordering I get them half price, and still get a game I knew I was going to buy anyway.
you are being ignored. this is the same stuff they always say. “we read your thoughts”.
and now? do you think they will change anything? they wont, because money is all they care about.how many times have they talked about communicating with their players? how many times have they said they will improve it? and how many times did they actually improve it?
In the end I’m as cynical as you are. Only time will tell if they’re listening or not though. We shall see. I think the backlash is worse than what they thought it’d be honestly, so that may change things. It’ll depend on the pre-purchase numbers as well. If they’re coming in fast enough that they feel confident in meeting whatever arbitrary projections they had for the expansion they’ll probably do little, if it looks like sells will fall short, or future player retention will be adversely effected they may do something, who knows?
There’s ample evidence floating around that Anet has been listening to us all along. That doesn’t mean they kowtow to every demand, however. Listening is not obeying. Just ask my wife.
If you want to compare you have to compare EVERYTHING. Not just the little bits you want to compare to make your point.
I’ve compared WoW and WoW expansions to Guild Wars 2 and HoT from what we know so far.
I don’t enjoy playing WoW. The game is annoying and dated. It’s too focused on stuff I don’t care about. The community is toxic to me.
But I could get more in an expansion of WoW. All I have to do is pay $15 a month for two years and then I can get more in a $60 expansion.
Or I could be ESO and charge a sub for a year before going free to play so a million people paid me $150, and then go free to play.
People need to wake up. Even if you think the expansion is overpriced, it’s just not that bad compared to the overwhelming amount of options out there. The game isn’t pay to win. It doesn’t have a sub. And I like it better.
Compare it all, or not at all.
Hot maps won’t be included in map completion.
Yep, bought it myself and one for my wife as well. Bring on the beta!
Did you forget this is a B2P game? They are running the servers you play on for free, providing patches and content for free and do not require a subscription. Other MMOs require monthly $14 subs + $30 to $40 for expansion.
Remember.. B2P not F2P.
Fed up with this BS backing up? Did you even play at release?
Do you even remember the promises they made during release?
We’d have patches every month, we’d never see an expansion. It didn’t fit their buiseness model. The game would evolve arround living world
And here we are 3 years later
An xpac announced for nearly as much as the full game price.Here we are 3 years later
Still stuck in a boring world where patches are rare then obtaining legendaries materials ingameHere we are 3 years later
Where they discontinued living world updateds and resorted to price tagging story quests for season 2.So much for their promises.
I bought this game 3 years ago, knowing it would be B2P but without any idea we’d be ‘forced’ to shell out another 50 to continue progression and discover new lands in the world of tyria.
I expected, based on their glorious hyping, that after 3 years i would be able to log in and vendor off from where i left. No restrictions, available right from the go as you log in again.
I was a fool, but I’m not going to be fooled again.
Go ahead and feel proud on your pre-order
Go ahead and tell us how the pricing is fair to make your purchase more justifiyableI’m still a guy that knows hype means nothing, I’m still a guy that weights value to quality & quanity.
And from the little info we know about this xpac. it wouldn’t even justify a 40$ pricetag.
Anet can fool me once, twice, but i know when their desperate tactics for money are there, and this pre-order is one of them.
Silly, obvious and ruthless marketing strategy’s.
That is all i have to say about it.
Right because this forum wasn’t flooded with people demanding an expansion, with people threatening to leave if there wasn’t an expansion. If I told my kids they’d have eggs and bacon for breakfast and three of the four wanted to have pancakes, and I made pancakes instead, I wasn’t lying when I said we’d have eggs and bacon. The situation changed.
If you can’t deal with change, you shouldn’t be playing ANY MMO.
I get no extra character slot. Something that previously ALWAYS was included with n expansion or “new” game when linking the serials. This is just a bad move to make us pay 25 euro extra for a characterslot and some useless title and mini
Wasn’t included with the Guild Wars 1 expansion Eye of the North.
EoN didn’t have any new classes though..Nightfall and factions added 2 slots each time.. probably because they had 2 new classes for each release
If you are going to release a new class in an xpac.. its logical to add a character slot so players can you know….actually try the class?
Not a big deal for me anyways since I can happily delete my necro since that profession is absolute trash tier now lol.. but yea..a char slot should be given if you plan to add a class.. thats just common sense .. not something the community should have to beg for..stupid business decision on anets end here…
Nor did EotN have any PvP, but they still charged $45 for it back then. Each game comes with different stuff, but you can’t have everything.
Its actually called being objective. We dont even know the full extent of the content HoT carries how can anyone really evaluate value at this point?
Since ArenaNet is asking us to pay the full price of the game, they obviously think we have enough information to evaluate value.
Meanwhile, HONEST developers give people more information before allowing pre-orders, such as, I don’t know, the RELEASE DATE or something?
Anet is putting an item up for sale, with full knowledge that there’s no real reason to buy it now, but some people WANT TO. I bought the game, happy in the knowledge that I have the game. I am relatively sure I’ll have a lot of fun with it and that I’ll get at least 50 hours of entertainment out of it, which is you know, a buck an hour. Not too much for my entertainment.
Anet isn’t really pressuring anyone to buy it, since they haven’t even announced a date for a beta weekend yet.
Calling someone dishonest because you’re feeling pressured to buy something there’s no pressure to buy doesn’t feel honest to me.
I get no extra character slot. Something that previously ALWAYS was included with n expansion or “new” game when linking the serials. This is just a bad move to make us pay 25 euro extra for a characterslot and some useless title and mini
Wasn’t included with the Guild Wars 1 expansion Eye of the North.
Let them talk to customer service and see what can be done. Some adjustments are going to be made. Be polite and tell the story.