I agree that both stone heart and blinding ashes have a more passive aproach. It will just happen on what you do. But it is part of active play and the build. when i swap between fire, air, earth it will absorb damage.
But i think its good to have somthing that doesn´t only rely on eles button mash, move like crazy and reaction playstyle. Thers alredy plenty of it. Good to have some more relaxed things too …
I don´t like the changes. Its a nice try but it stacks to easy for eles and what i read guardians.
I preferd the duration stackign and higher base damage, but i agree that not stackign damage from multiple players was anoying. The best thing would be to stack burn from multiple players but otherwise keep the old system, so each player has its own burning uptime.
I would like any “Nerf” that brigns up basic damage from burning, but greatly reduces stacking. It can also be done buy looking into each class. But then i fear it might just kill traits and builds if not done mindful :-/.
ah a post inbetween … I answered to SchmendrickTheMagician
agreed to the last.
Just: Enginieers and burning fits together.
Burnign stacks to fast from one plaer at the moment. But this is mainly a PvE issue. In PvP you can avoid much by just moving. But i might have a bad perception on that, becaust i use stop,doge,roll from the first second the patch came ^^.
Eles are the adaptive class! They require planing and skill in play, but then shine. I look at the Meta, adapt and beat it. Thats like a rock/siscor/paper play. I will be slaughtert buy a power build with condi cleanse and it is ridiculous hard to kill a necro or mesmer, but i beat zerkers (especially rangers/thiefs/engineers) into the dust, just by my build. And now guess who complanis ….
The reason i use scepter is the range and the blinds. The dagger offers good fire and much better water but air/earth in cepter does what i want with the sugar of phönix on top. I am a roamer and prefer small group fights avoiding zerg. So i build around that. My build is good at pining down a single target as active support, does moderate damage and has a high survivability. I love active support. I even dash trough 2-3 oponent to get their attention. I know i will survive that for at least 10 seconds even when all fire at me, and that will do funny things like reflecting back attacks, cripling them, burn all when i cleanse … The oponent fires his burst and initial CC on me and it goes pooof. Hoooray my teammate(s) zerker thief finishes the first one. I fire my healing (+protection) turn round an pin number two. Moving eles are great. Battle perception and keep moving. I usually die when someone unexpectedly shots in my back mid fight, especially when i just swaped attunement out of earth. But guess manny do ;-).
But i am still training to handle my ele. I am not long in Gw2, but the more i use him the more fun do i have with it. I don´t regret taking ele as my first character. What i love so much is, i can build heavy conters to the meta. Ele is adaptable. I might perish agains medicore players in power builds, or not being able to take down bunker builds, but i destroy zerker and the new burn builds with ease.
Elementalist is some kind of swiss knive. Adaptable like you want/need. If you don´t use its potential — squish with low HP. I had been sceptic is the low HP can survive, and yes it does. But you must move like a crazy chicken ;-).
Wit he -33% cast reduction staff eles are strong.
I play S/F an realy like it. Scepter has weak spots, focus has strong earth, good air and OK fire. Scepter phönix ist good (auto and dragon toth so/so), air is averal good, earth OK (Auto a bit weak), and water meh. General. Water is weak, i use it rarely. Just swap trough when a bit healing is needed for the team.
So against guards/npc or when friends are up front i start fire, usually i go earth for the fight, and swap to air for direct assaut/finishing someone off.
I am a S/F Build in dire armor with some power/vitality in the trinkets. Earth rune and acuracyin the weapons. Traveler in the armor.
ele is the jack of all trades. We can adapt to anny meta. They did not damage ele. We were kept sable as befor. So also most of the skills were just not adressed and stayed weak, this reduces build options, but we have enough good things.
I personaly am not happy about the burning got so powerful. And i hate the 5s ICD on burnign precision. Bleeding is a bit poor and our elite as usual … FSG for speed ….
And of course you can go for more ferocity in air like the build from Kodiak.
This and i would use the glyph variant and ad burn proc. But also a matter of tase.
It looks more then a backlin support blaster :-).
So go that route: Take arcane precision and bountiful power.
Use glyph of elemental power instead of arcane blast. And i woud prefer lighning flash instad of mistform buts its a matter of taste.
I would even consider using air instad of arcan for that build.
With air you move faster and can switch to superspeed for escape. You will proc vulnerabilits and do more damage wirth bolt to the heart.
add the glyp trait for the healing and power glyph.
Also consider burnign precision for blasting from the back.
You camp fire and if needed water for healing support. If you need to flee go air.
Firy greatsword is mobility, but with glyphs you also can run the elemental.
And my personal favorit is cleansing flame. But thats better when runing around like a crazy chicken ^^.
yep thats why i run water. Especially now. So much condi cleanse and cantrip buff with soothign disruption. I was tempted to run glyphs with air, but it feels like defensless.
My cleansing flame and stop,doge,roll are so great….
Conditions are not ment to burst, and if the do low damage needing a to long buildup and can be cleansed the are not good in teamfighs. I think its between 1+2.
That video cast is best case (if we talk abut the same). Usually you dodge the flame spam … And of course use a cleanse. He can´t reaply such a spam immidiately. Shure he can burn you for 5-10 stacks again. But he is very sqishy. His defence is a bit blinding and i think one arcane shield.
Of course he can try to disengage with superspeed when the shield fires on low HP …
But yes the stack application is crazy. You can counter it, but i think manny classes have a hard time.
i also think a small tweak on burning application, or like i suggestet cleansing, is all it needs. Rest is learning. Now condie will occour more often, because more valid builds out.
I have a possible solution that might be not to hard to implement.
Make a condi cleanse priority.
Let burning be the first one and bleeding the last to be cleansed.
Give bosses kitten 1 condi cleans.
Very bad change. On one side burning stacking shoots over and on the other bleeding gets wrecked … Cool balancing :-/
Water is usually the important part for surviving :-)
I am standing two players pretty well in earth. At least for a while. Nearly annytime a third adds on me i must flee or go down. I am playing S/F Fire/Earth/Water in rabid gear (traveler rune) + some power and vitality in trinkets using healing glyph, cleansing flame, earth armor, ligning flash and FSG.
I am not using lighning flash often, but it can be great. I will try glyph of elemtal power, but i know i will miss falsh it in certain situatons …
Oh an i love my cleansing flame, 3 burning stacks + regeneration + vigor + 4 condies cleansed…
Maybe the glimps is right, but the thing is, its not broken in wvw/pvp and bleeding even weak … Its about people must get used to condis are more useful …
OK burning, especially in PvE got out of hands ^^.
I play condi ele and the strong thing is not condi damage itself. Its my sustain from near endles coni cleanse :-). And Hannelore ist fully right.
The only thing that i am unese is the stacking of burning. An ele fire build can dish out burning that kills in seconds. But he is very sqhishy and i have no fear of such a build, i dodge out of the fire immidiately, cleanse and he dies … LoL …
a minute is so extreme long, the fight is usually decided befor … Also 2200 condi stat. Are you all using undead runes ?
thats true but condi has drawbacks.
1.) It ticks over time
2.) Its cleansable
3.) It has a duration ‘stat’
This more compensates for the two stats as long as condis don´t burst.
Of course if condi from on player kills on first tick there is something wrong…
Please split overal condi damage and burning… Saying all condi damage is OP when jsut burn stacking got out of control is not good.
I am not shure if its complete trash with the +20% burn duration. The bad thing is i did´t want to bulil a burn stacking fire ele. I wanted to add and keep a bit burnign up and ocasional blinds when not using fire attunement. And for that the 5s ICD is meh. The trait moved to be a burning spec trait and away from utility and i prefer the last. Its agin something that reduces build diversity. Burn stacking is out of hand annyway. So reduce that and remove the ICD in burnign precision.
If it is burning that kills you then yes. The stacking there opend pandoras box for some builds. There it needs either a per player stack limit or some overal soft cap like i suggested:
now: (7.5+(1.55*Level) + (0.155 * Condition Damage) * (Stack count))
new: (7.5+(1.55*Level) + (0.2 * Condition Damage) * (1+ln(Stack count)))
Each stack will add, but not straight and manny stacks won´t do much more.
This will do abot the same damage with two stacks as now. One will do more and stacking will not go off.
Of couse you can balace each class for burning but thats very hard work and not a fast solution.
Otherwise it feels fine. Bleeding should have the slighly buffed version announced.
Nice one. I would take arcane precision but thats a peronal thing. Also i am not shure if tornado is a good option. Maybe i try tornado. I use FSG and it is good to case or to escape. I pesonally would realy like a better option there. Mistform moved to elite slot with 4s instead of 3s would be a nice one.
I am not shure if it is already per target? This would be fine. The 5s CD on burning presicion is the bad thing :-(.
Bleeding got the short stick, burnin stacks to much from some classes alone.
Bleeding seemed weak and manny builds already lost 30% duration. removing the cap only impacts multiple players.
For bleeding the damage was fine/to low and a nerf makes no sense here.
I agree that eles, especially water and earth can stand surprisingly long for low HP. But such builds don´t kill fast.
It cripples the game for balance ;-)
Players must learn how to handle the new condi stacking.
I agree that standing in my firewall is deadly, as not cleaning condies hurts.
I did see a pure burn ele build. :-)
It is fire and arcane and i think air. It uses glyps and arcane skills using a dagger main hand. The build is squishy but shows how crazy it can be.
My ele is a Scepter/Focus Fire/Earth/Water build using healing glyph, cantrips and greatsword. I run mostly rabid gear so i am a condi ele. I can apply a lot of burning and i realy like my cleansing flame.
Was thinking trying air or arcane but it makes me squishy.
it´s the stacking not the condition or condition damage overal … They reduced burn damage and let burn stacking and opend pandoras box.
Well i am with Syviren. I have startet designing stategy games over 30 years ago and have experience with balacing browser games.(Nedless to say i am an IT guy and bord/online gamer for 30 years) He is right ;-).
And yes i can see that much can be done better but they did a good overal job with the new system. I hope the don´t panic and/or give in to emotions. Just do the math and improve it.
I don´t feel doing high condition damage unless i go for some crazy burning stacks. The thing is condi damage is not stronger after the patch, the stacking of burning is. Bleeding is about the same and not realy good but when you do 10+ stacks of burning it hurts and fire eles can do that very well.
I woul wish for better bleeding damage and more balanced burn stacking. Not the burn damage is the problem, its the stacking some can do.
Eles can burn down oponents quite hard now. Yes the glyphs are strong there. Also arcane helps.
I am not a heavy burning ele but i can also stack up a lot. I like cleansing flame and flamewall.
Use arcane healing,arcane blast, arcane traits that trigger burning and the glyphs. Lay down a fire field and blow your arcane skills (blast finishers) and the storm …. Of course you have burnign precision for +20% duration and an extra burn.
With dagger you can also breath fire.
No condi cleanse = ash
Oh wohoo i have Stop, Dodge and Roll ^^.
Just most are not used to it. Go out in Zerker without much condi clean… Fight a condi build and cry. I had such fights and players seemd to ignore the bleeding stacking, till they realized their life is low .. Then its to late and the are bolted down. Not by condi ….
Just do the math to create build diversity and counterplay. I can see they tried …
Aww. Wheres the edit.. sorry for bad typing.
I have the feeling high base damage and only stacking duration was fine for burning.
The problem here is that you want a noticable increase when multiple players fire on something or otherwise it makes no sense in group fights.
My suggestion for burning would be to scale down stacks like this:
now: (7.5+(1.55*Level) + (0.155 * Condition Damage) * (Stack count))
new: (7.5+(1.55*Level) + (0.2 * Condition Damage) * (1+ln(Stack count)))
Each stack will add, but not straight and manny stacks won´t do much more.
This will do abot the same damage with two stacks as now. One will do more and stacking will not go off.
I don´t know whats the goal. If it is intended to incinerate people and PvE monsters with large groups in a few seconds, then a straigt stacking is fine. direkt zerker damage does the same. If you need double the numer to nearly instantly pop someone with condies compared to direct damage it looks fine.
I feel the burnign change was not thought to the end. What looks viable for bleeding might have overshot in burning. For burning high base damage and duration stacking was OK.
very short thougt it would be the most horrible thing they can do. Intant death of condi damage and maybe 50% of viable build options. Balance must be done by looking deep into specs. Nerfing condi damage itself woul be like: OK there are some problems with bulds now. We don´t realy know how to handle it fast, so we take out the machine gun and shoot down 50%. For shure we hit the problem… And then: Oh we just smased half the builds and lost 10% players but it did´t help much in PvE.
I would say watch builds if theres some OP one. But nerfing condi damage itself is totally wrong, it needed a slight push. In PvE it got out of hands. There bosses need condi cleanse or resistance. But if you apply resistance to much condi will be useless again.
This looks like a blunt reaction to people crying condi is to strong. And balace wise its a totaly wrong way to go. ITs just: ok we go back to the old formular, that can´t be to wrong and its no real effort. :-/
There are builds with incredible burning stacks.
They work in PvE like hell. In PvP or WvW its another thing. An “Incinerate” elementalist is a flame bomb but will die on the spot in PvP. In PvP people now feel the condi stacking from more players and that can lead to death in 1-2 seconds. Just a second more then getting blasted by multiple players. Till now you had time to react to condie or even ignore them for a while, because no burning stacks and bleeding from more then two players was worthless. Now you die from it like you die from direct damage. Thats not a bad thing, that makes condies more viable in groups.
In PvP the change is a bit shoking and emotional reactions are logic. But from a balace side it might not be cruel. Shure it should be watched carefully if theres some OP build but for now let it settle down and players get a feeling that condis stack and so multiple oponents will kill just as being blown down.
New system is good. There are weak traits spead across the board but pushing them a bit for build diversity and its good.