I want to clarify one point I’ve been seeing expressed. This is one type of retention. There’s another type of retention where new players try the game and churn out before they even get to the point where they’re seeing the potential the game has to offer. Yes, a certain amount of people will just do that; they’ll log in to see what it’s about, have their curiosity satisfied, and move on. But we were seeing a lot of places where people who would otherwise have become active users were churning out prematurely because of the issues that we’re addressing with the NPE.
As Colin stated above, we can’t talk in detail about the ongoing development to drive retention for our veteran players, but I just wanted to make the point that the NPE was deliberately designed to address the early game retention issues, and ensure that Guild Wars 2 can benefit from a strong and steady influx of new players into the game.
I am a big supporter of the things you guys have done. I like both LS1 and LS2. And while I appreciate what you and Colin have said, even I don’t like what I see here on the new leveling experience. I love to level alts. It is part of the fun for me. And the changes certainly puts a damper on that experience for me.
Additionally, after playing for 2 years beginning with the head start, we get this HUGE build up from you guys about leveling for new characters? Sorry, but that is disheartening. And how does this keep a from-day-one person excited? I know you say you are working on things for the veterans, but even I am not feeling the love and I am a very patient guy.
I think it is great that you guys are trying to keep early game people playing, but where is the bone thrown to the loyal people who have played for two years?
Isn’t it funny that for nearly two years people leveled up from zero without complaining about it being to hard. Then they nerfed the trait system, and now the whole leveling process altogether.
Baffling.
Actually, it’s a lot harder this way! You need more time and a lot more patience before you can really start playing the game. And we all know that patience is very difficult to learn….
Um… That is what I was saying. It wasn’t hard to start with was my sentiment. There was no need to make it “easier”. Which they did not.
Making it easier is way better:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y
Thanks for posting that! Now I realize that the new system isn’t terrible, it’s just that I suck. LOL
Isn’t it funny that for nearly two years people leveled up from zero without complaining about it being to hard. Then they nerfed the trait system, and now the whole leveling process altogether.
Baffling.
You want me to be myself? OK, I think it is pretty awful that you are posting a thread that you know will cause hate and discontent.
It serves no purpose and can have nothing but a negative outcome.
Welcome to the game! GW2 is a great game to play IMO. It has its pitfalls and bugs like any game, but it is the best MMO I’ve played.
The forums on the other hand… LOL. You are right about it. My experience with forums is that they are mostly full of such people. There are some really great people playing the game who love it for what it is and don’t complain about it for what it isn’t. Most of them don’t frequent the forums I believe.
So I hope you enjoy GW2 as much as I have. I don’t think you have wasted your money at all.
I think many of the changes are good. Some not so much, but over all the patch is OK. I just can’t get excited about it. As one person said above, it feels like a patch to correct things.
So while I think the changes are mostly good, I really don’t see anything that actually excites me.
Maybe they should have their own completion achievement point reward apart from world completion.
Just so everyone is aware the first years Festivals were laid out and designed around the fact that they wanted content they could reuse as groundwork for the years after. This is how it will be most Halloween, Christmas, etc will be largely the same with small differences because that how ANet set it up from the beginning. They don’t’ wanna do massive overhauls of the event year after year.
I agree with this. The only problem I have is them taking away fun content like the mad kings dungeon. That sucked. If they thought it was too lucrative, they could have just adjusted the rewards and not done away with the content.
I don’t think it is childish. I think it is perfectly reasonable. Where does the sheath go? I’ve wondered that too.
A lot of people are white knighting saying it’s your characters birthday. If that were true, why the account wide minis? Why the account wide scrolls? Why the account wide birthday boosters? That argument becomes invalid when 3/4th’s of the entire birthday package is account wide in the first place.
True, birthdays were meant for that character alone, however; even in Guild Wars 1, the stuff you got was made available to transfer to all of your toons and even trade. So you’re argument isn’t valid when it was mostly common practice to reward the character for you to enjoy on your account. Not on that specific character.
Not only that, when the recent changes this year; mostly everything is being made account wide because the majority of the community had requested it. Account wide Legendary, Account Wide Commander Tag, Account Wide Wardrobe, etc. From the direction ArenaNet is taking, they are trying to make it so all of your work and progress you make effects all of your characters, not just one specific toon.
So, again. Where is your argument?
I almost always invalidates what a person says when they start using terms like “White Knighting” and “Fan Boy”. It is completely banal and trite. Those kinds of terms are used to try and insult others when they don’t agree with you. If you didn’t agree with at least some of what the developers of this game has done, why are you playing? I don’t understand why a person can’t make their argument without name calling.
To answer your question, there is no argument. The gun being soul bound is what Anet decided to do so deal with it. This isn’t “white knighting” it is accepting reality.
Because each character will get one when they have a 2 yr. birthday…..
^This. It is a reward for the character’s age not how long you have been playing. I can see some reasons for not making them account bound. I don’t have most of the characters I started with or deleted some and recreated. Only one from day one and I don’t play him much. I have no problem with this soul bound decision. I will wait until each character’s birthday and be happy about it.
^This. No matter what they say they get ripped apart for it. As I said elsewhere, if I was a dev and someone asked me a question about the game my permanent answer woudl be, “We can’t say anything about this right now.”
And then they would be kittened because you aren’t saying anything, and we’re right back here. “We can’t say anything about this right now” is stupid. I’m not saying they should reveal all their plans to the players, but they should be communicating more, and they should not be afraid to talk about features they may ultimately scrap. The mistake they made with precursor hunt/crafting was not saying they would and then not doing it, but saying they would and then not talking about it for months, answering questions about it vaguely, and not just coming out and saying “it’s not going to happen” or at least “it’s not going to happen the way you think it is.”
There is a fundamental lack of understanding at ANet about how to maintain effective and beneficial communication with the customer base. Of course they aren’t going to please everyone, but that’s not an excuse for not trying harder to please more people.
Thank you for proving my point. No matter what they say they get ripped for it.
As for what they “SHOULD” or “SHOULDN’T” do, who are you to determine what that is? The only thing they “SHOULD” say about anything is whatever they are willing to say. No more.
As for their “fundamental lack of understanding at ANet about how to maintain effective and beneficial communication with the customer base” that is purely your opinion. You have no idea what they do and don’t understand. It may seem that way from your perspective, but claiming that as fact is a pretty good indication of your level of understanding of proper communication.
“They won’t tell us what they are working on!”
Hmmm, I wonder why….
“2013 is over, did they keep their promises”
“2014 is now half gone”
“sn endgame being developed or what”
“Broken Intentions…”
“Anti-Hype Thread”And that’s just to name the first few threads that pop to mind where we rip the devs apart like they kitten in our Cherrios, when all they tried to do was give us some insight into things that might be coming or where they’d like to go with the game. There are many, many more.
They give some insight on a project and a soft projection as to when they might have it done, and we tear them a new one if something changes. “You lied” “You broke your promise”
They give us so much a teaser for upcoming content and we tear them apart for “over hyping” it.
^This. No matter what they say they get ripped apart for it. As I said elsewhere, if I was a dev and someone asked me a question about the game my permanent answer woudl be, “We can’t say anything about this right now.”
@GreenAlien That doesn’t address the issue of what you think people during interviews should say if they are not allowed to talk about something.
Until things are different, “We can’t say anything about that” is the only thing they CAN say. Is this a hard thing to understand?
Seriously? If they are not allowed to talk about a subject, then what do you want them to say? Do you just want them to stare blankly at the person asking the question?
This topic is just sad.
I don’t feel that I should be made to sacrifice combat effectiveness just so I can run faster.
I want to be independently wealthy and own an island in the Hawaiian Islands.
We don’t always get what we want, so we deal with what we have.
The Stone Summit would disagree that there are no mounts in GW lore:
1. They are not player characters.
2. Stone Summit are gone.
3. Wrong Guild Wars game.lol, lore doesn’t have to just apply to player characters to make it credible and GW2 is set after GW, inheriting much of the original game’s history in lore terms so the game is irrelevant too.
My point is, it wouldn’t be a ridiculous notion in the world of Tyria that people started using mounts as many are trying to suggest. It’s already happened with Dolyaks as I’ve shown, albeit admittedly in a limited scenario.
I understand what you are saying. What I was trying to point out is that that mounts were never incorporated there for player characters. We also did not have waypoints to get around quickly like we do in GW2. Also mounts, even for the Stone Summit, were not a means of a speed boost. It isn’t so much a lore breaker, as a non-necessity for the game. And in my personal opinion time that could be better spent on creating other things than mounts which are unnecessary.
The Stone Summit would disagree that there are no mounts in GW lore:
1. They are not player characters.
2. Stone Summit are gone.
3. Wrong Guild Wars game.
People that stood on the pillars outside of the bank in old LA trying to impress people with their armor, legendaries, and/or commander tags. Sad AND pathetic.
@jheryn Man youre kinda straw manning my argument. Your putting words in my mouth making my argument easier to attack. I said only two weeks. No more, maybe less if a resolution can be reached faster. And Im not talking about everything just the things that are blatantly wrong. How do you determine the things that are blatantly wrong. Well it seems pretty clear to me. The things the entire community cries out for like this tag thing, like the perplexity rune thing. Dont hit every single change. We obviously dont need to discuss the tool tip changes. Again, its going to take a little common sense and it will not be perfect but it would be better than what they did this time. I told you they already did it the right way the last time they rolled out a feature patch. They just need to do it they way they did it back in april. Thats the hilariousness of it all. Im just telling them to do what they did last time because what they did last time more or less worked. It wasnt perfect. They had some megaserver issues and they still do but atleast the community had a chance to talk with them and get them to roll back some things. They are rolling some things back here too and its great, but I am still concerned about the announcements that are still to come. I am concerned because we will have less time to talk with them about it.
You said two weeks then change this last time. The first time you said when you want to release something you need to give the community time to review it and make changes. So they would never get to release something if they had to get “permission” to do so every time because each revision would have to be discussed by your reasoning. But yes, you did say two weeks then change the last time.
And again though I have asked you before, who decides who or what is “blatantly wrong”? I suppose you are the determiner for right and wrong. You seem to hold your opinion as the gold standard to which we all must aspire since anyone that disagrees with you or does something you don’t like is “wrong”.
They absolutely did a good thing by changing the cost of the commander tags. I am glad they did that, but it isn’t, by any stretch of the most egotistical imagination, right or wrong to consult the community on what they release. That is simply your opinion. What they choose to let us know is a gift and we should take advantage when they do. We have no right to tell them how they should conduct their business.
Did it ever occur to you that they may NOT share some information for a reason?
Also how does this come off as scolding [SNIP]
Maybe scolding wasn’t the right word. Maybe patronizing, entitled or condescending would be better.
You said:
But, this should be a cautionary tale for you. If you didnt release the patch 4 days after you were done with announcing all the changes, you wouldnt have to work all weekend to fix your features the way the community wants them. We would have more time to discuss them with you and you could have more time to make the changes.
You also said:
In the future, layout all the features for us then give us a two week time to debate and discuss them with us then, after two weeks, roll the patch out.
Nope, leave scolding in there too. Can you not see how it is overbearing for you to say such things?
And I did way in on how I felt about what the commander tags cost. I said I didn’t think it would wind up costing 300g per color.
@jheryn.8390 I actually wasnt calling you a white knight man nor was I implying it. I do get how you could think that but I dont consider you to be one. The people who I am referring to are much worse than you. You seem to be able to put together coherent albeit wrong arguments. You say I need to stop justifying my position but all the evidence points to me being right. How do we benefit from less time to talk with the devs? Im seriously asking you a question here. You say they need to stop talking with us and just launch it already. I say we need some padding because of mistakes like these. Show me an example of you being right and Ill shut up.
Ok, so I’m not a white knight but if I don’t agree with you I am wrong? Seriously? Do you know how arrogant you sound saying that?
I already said it twice now, but at some point, they have to stop taking feedback and implement content into the game. I guess you don’t understand that 1. Not all people want or like what you want or like and 2. What you want or like isn’t always the “right” thing to do.
You said that they SHOULD inform us on what they want to implement in game two weeks before they do in order for players give feedback.
Whose feedback do they have to listen to and make changes based upon?
You want an example? There were those that were fine with 300g commander tags and those that hated it. Who are they supposed to listen to? So they listen for two weeks are they supposed to get your final approval after making their changes? That is two more weeks of listening again to feeback on the revisions? When does it stop? When you finally get your way? What if they listened to everyone for your infinite amount of two week feedback times and the community was split on what to do? What if they decided after that to still make each color cost 300g? Are they still wrong because they didn’t do what you wanted but the other 50% did.
Obviously there were very few (including myself) that would have been fine with 300g tag. But if the community is divided, when does the feedback stop and they implement something?
Another is maybe they try something just to see what feedback will be AFTER it is implemented. Another is what about those that want to be surprised? Feedback isn’t bad at all, but it doesn’t have to occur on everything they do. They don’t need our approval for anything they do, so you ought to be grateful that they let us give them feedback at all.
(edited by jheryn.8390)
@Savoy.6824 Did I say they didn’t change their minds? Anywhere? No.
I just said I didn’t believe that they would charge 300 for each color when it all came down.
As I said above, to many people were crying “The sky is falling” before they got the official word.
I honestly never believed that each color would cost 300g and nowhere was it said absolutely that was what was going to happen.
I’m excited for the change and think it is a great one!
watch the last minute of that video. It says exactly that, “if you have unlocked blue already that’s the one you have and you can go ahead and buy other colours”
Um yeah, I know that. I also said in one of these many commader tag kittenstorm threads that I didn’t believe it would be that way in spite of what was said.
As I said above, to many people were crying “The sky is falling” before they got the official word.
I honestly never believed that each color would cost 300g and nowhere was it said absolutely that was what was going to happen.
I’m excited for the change and think it is a great one!
If they deleted all the negative threads, there would be none left. Seriously, go to any thread under GW2 discussion and find one that isn’t.
Trying to find a completely positive or constructive thread is as difficult as getting a precursor.
So I hardly think they are making all the negative threads go away.
“Title: Something Positive, please be positive”
“Third post: This game is dying, one lung is collapsed and the other is coughing up water. Make expansions, where are my mounts.”
This made me laugh. Thanks for proving my point.
I’m pretty sure they merged them into previously existing threads on the same issues (tho the ones about protests DO violate the Forum rules, so those could have been deleted….but from what I see they were just moved (merged).
75% of what pops on this forum is NOT criticism, but a virtual lynch mob….
^This. ^This. ^This. ^This. ^This.
Truer words, my friend.
If they deleted all the negative threads, there would be none left. Seriously, go to any thread under GW2 discussion and find one that isn’t.
Trying to find a completely positive or constructive thread is as difficult as getting a precursor.
So I hardly think they are making all the negative threads go away.
If there is one thing that REALLY irritates me about gamers, is this idea that they are somehow owed, or should expect transparency or a road map. Gamers continue to push this narrative that they are somehow in a “relationship” or a “partnership” with the games and the developers.
You. Are. Not.
You are nothing more than a CUSTOMER. Period. One of millions of people. You are owed nothing but the product you purchased, a product you have been given for the money that has been exchanged. Anything you get beyond that is merely an added bonus.
Get it through your skulls. They do NOT have to listen to you. They do NOT have to do what you request. While it may certainly be a good idea to keep an ear on what your customers are saying, they are under ZERO obligation to comply to anything you say.
If you absolutely cannot accept the policies of a company, if you honestly think they are not listening to your wants and are actively ignoring you, you walk away and stop supporting that company.
THAT is your power. Nothing more.
No one is asking them to fulfill the communities request (I’m not at least lol)… we just want to know what on earth are they doing???
“We hear the players’ concerns. It’s currently on the radar, and we’ve been experimenting with several solutions, but we can’t really talk about it.”
Tune in for the next Ready Up tomorrow – where we talk about that other thing that we can’t really talk much about.
We also have new skins in the gemstore and updated tooltips even more."That’s anet communication in a nutshell. Thats apparently an OK form of communication to some ppl on this forum….
What on earth is the point of even doing a kitten interview if every answer is “idk, can’t talk about it”
With all due respect, it is much more than “we just want to know what they are doing.” These are demands filled with rudeness and disrespect. They border on the fanatic and hateful.
The title of this thread is a perfect example “Anet is out of touch”. That isn’t wanting to know what is going on, it is making judgments about a company and people, when they do not truly know what is happening with their process and timelines and goals, etc., etc., etc.
As far as the interviews go, they tell us what they can and if they can’t what do you want them to say other than “We cannot talk about that right now?” Do you just want them to stare blankly and not give a reply. Honestly when they do share something they are picked apart for whatever they say. If I was one of those employees, every word out of my mouth would be “I cannot talk about that right now.” No matter what they say, they get battered and bruised.
I’m not white knighting, I just am observant. IMO, a large majority on these forum are hateful and self-entitled. I often find it a sad commentary on people in general. Those people at Anet must have stainless steel skins to put up with the comments here.
Armors:
Heavy: Elite Templar, Elite Gladiator, Asuran (All Warrior)
Medium: Rawhide, Tyrian, Elite Studded, Shing Jae, Istani, Elite Sunspear, Ancient, Obsidian (All Ranger). Luxon, Elite Canthan, Deldrimor (All Assassin)
Light: Shing Jae, Elite Kurzick, (Monk). Fanatic, Elite Cabal, Elite Necrotic, (Necro). Tyrian, Courtly, Performer, Elite Rogue, Elite Enchanter, Elite Canthan, Elite Kurzick, Vabbian, Ancient, Primeval, Asuran, Monument, (Mesmer). Apprentice, Krytan, Elite Stormforged, Shing Jae, Luxon, Primeval, Deldrimor, Obsidian (Elementalist)
I never said they were obligated.
I didn’t say you did. But you did say they “should” let us critique their plans. All I meant by it is that no they should not. They can do what they want. They should do what they feel is right, not what you feel is right. I will send an email letting them know that they “should” consult you next time they want to introduce anything, however.
Again what idiot argues against more collaboration time with the devs.
Do you not understand that collaboration has to eventually end and something has to be delivered? With this community it would never end because no one would ever agree. What if we had that extra time and they did things you still didn’t like? “Stupid crap” were your words. Sorry, but people can talk until they are blue in the face. Eventually something has to be implemented.
BTW. It seems like you are attacking whomever doesn’t agree with you a little to harshly. It’s a game, not a life choice. Calm down.
They should release the patch after the players have had time to critique their plans, LIKE THEY DID WITH THE LAST ONE, end of story.
It really doesn’t matter if they did or not. And giving a couple of examples is hardly proof that they “should” or “need to” do anything. You are not going to get all players to agree with everything anyway. Maybe something you like someone else hates. Most of the time on these forums opinions are universally divided. So it doesn’t matter what you think they should do. They are going to do what they see best. They don’t need anyone’s input. They don’t need anyone’s permission. They are not under any obligation to act under the premise of “Here’s what we would like to do. Is that OK with you guys? I know it isn’t perfect so would you guys correct our shoddy work.”
Bottom line: They are under no obligation or even a feeling of necessity to tell us anything. That they listen to and consider our opinions is amazing enough. You should take anything they give you as a gift.
You don’t speak for all players. I usually find just as many people who will hate what you like and vice versa. So I would calm down about what you think is owed to you.
@jheryn The last feature pack also came out a month after they had announced all the details on it giving the players time to correct the mistakes they had initially made. Hence why it was ‘ok’. This one is not. Its coming out 4 days after they announce the balance changes to the final two classes. Now were going to be stuck with commander tags that cost 300 gold for every color because they didnt listen to the precious CDI you keep throwing around. Had they listened it would be “buy a tag for 300 gold and change the color of the tag to any color in our list of options on the fly whenever you want”.
And exactly what were those sweeping changes they made to the last feature pack due to player input after they said what it would be? How was it different than what they originally posted?
They made those changes because of the CDI’s as well as other player input, NOT because they released what they were going to do a month before it happened in order for players to tell them to adjust. Please… “Everybody tell us what you think and we will get it all handled 10 minutes before release so everybody can have everything they want!”
I don’t remember anywhere in the WvW where someone said “Don’t charge 300g for aceount bound commander tags.” I saw a lot of suggestions, but that wasn’t one of them. I won’t like it if each color is 300g, but I am not going to snivel about it until it actually happens. Not even then. It is a colored mark for heaven’s sake. I don’t have a problem following commanders when they are all blue.
And as I said on another thread, we do not know that each color after the first is going to cost 300g. It will cost, but they haven’t said each was 300g after you already have one. That may turn out to be the case, but we don’t know yet.
Ascended armor, fractal reset. More examples of how well Anet listens
All of which happened before the CDI’s. The last feature pack had many examples of how they listened.
I did the same thing OP. I’m just working on AP’s to get to the level where I can choose again.
Why would they want feedback when they have done many CDI’s to lead up to this and have reading feeback on forums etc for a long time now. If we discussed every little thing every time there would be no updates. Just a lot of “I want this and that”.
You really didn’t burst my bubble at all. Yes it does say you have to purchase each. But it says nothing about what a color may cost beyond the first. Again this is just speculation right now. It may indeed cost 300 per color but we don’t know that. All it says is that we will have to purchase each color. Not what the final cost will be. Again, wait and see what happens. Outrage, uproar and threats before you know something is 100% the case is dumb.
You may be right, however as he didn’t specifically mention that additional colours after the first would be cheaper I think it’s reasonable to assume they will cost the same as the first (especially as they will more than likely be sold the same way as they are now, as a book).
And you could be right as well. But we don’t know if you already have a tag that additional colors might be at a reduced price. I don’t know of anyone that would pay 300g for just being able to change colors. Surely they are smart enough to see that as well? Maybe they aren’t, but I just hate the whole ‘crying wolf’ thing.
But isn’kitten little premature to get bent out of shape? We don’t actually know yet whether or not we have to pay for each color. That is just speculation. So if it actually happens that way, maybe it is Anet giving the bird, but until you know I wouldn’t get mad just yet.
I’ve been playing WvW for 2 years and I will wait to see what happens. As far as an account wide commander tag costing 300g. I’m actually good with that. I have four toons I like to play in WvW. Now when I get the urge to buy a tag it will cover all of them.
Sorry to burst your bubble…
“Yes, so each color is purchased individually, and it is important to note that there is no hierarchy for colors so that you have to purchase blue and then have to go to red or yellow or whatever.”
You really didn’t burst my bubble at all. Yes it does say you have to purchase each. But it says nothing about what a color may cost beyond the first. Again this is just speculation right now. It may indeed cost 300 per color but we don’t know that. All it says is that we will have to purchase each color. Not what the final cost will be. Again, wait and see what happens. Outrage, uproar and threats before you know something is 100% the case is dumb.
In all seriousness, would you really quit the game over a that?
You have to think about it this way. Everyone who has been playing WvW for 2 years have been waiting for these little QoL changes that they have been asking for(none of which is hard to implement for anyone with a brain) and finally when it looks like they will start to get them, Anet gives them the middle finger like this. It’s BS and the person who thought this up should feel ashamed.
But isn’kitten little premature to get bent out of shape? We don’t actually know yet whether or not we have to pay for each color. That is just speculation. So if it actually happens that way, maybe it is Anet giving the bird, but until you know I wouldn’t get mad just yet.
I’ve been playing WvW for 2 years and I will wait to see what happens. As far as an account wide commander tag costing 300g. I’m actually good with that. I have four toons I like to play in WvW. Now when I get the urge to buy a tag it will cover all of them.
Each colour will cost you 300g apparently. If this is true then i’m going to quit GW2. Thats a completely ridiculous idea..
In all seriousness, would you really quit the game over a that?
My last two keys gave me 4 scraps. I have no limit on the amount I wish to collect, it’s just an on-going activity. Some play the TP, I buy skins and sell them later…or keep them for my characters (rarely).
I might collect enough to buy something that costs 7 tickets, if I ever save up that amount….but it is unlikely as it’s too tempting to buy skins at one ticket and sell them later.
I do the same. I sell the skins. Have only purchased one for myself so far. I only buy skins when they are 1 ticket each.
26 runs from Friday thru Monday. 3 tickets 19 scraps.
Opinion.
None of the above are reasons why Anet needs to grant you mounts.
Okay, so you want to settle for mediocrity, instead of enhancing the gameplay, which could make GW2 even better. At least admit that, because that’s what you are saying. This is why even developers hate their own fanboys, because they try to defend the inexcusable, while others try to be constructive for the betterment of the game.
I actually laughed out loud when I read this. Settling for mediocrity? Really? Are you seriously saying that adding mounts would make GW2 the pinacle of MMO game play? Why should Nerelith admit to anything of the sort? She isn’t settling for mediocrity. She has very clearly pointed out that she doesn’t want mounts. That isn’t settling for anything. It is in her opinion (and mine) that it would actually cheapen the game.
The part that kept me laughing is that when someone, in this case Nerelith, point out that they enjoy something the way Anet has made, those people cannot think of valid arguments so they start calling them fanboys or white knights, or carebears, or Anet groupies or any other host of like names. If your arguments were solid, you would never resort to name calling. Unless you are under 13 years old and then you shouldn’t be playing this game according to the rules.
It’s ironic, that waypoints were supposed to lessen the burdens of travel, and be more convenient, when in fact, they are less convenient in how players travel. Switching out weapons, traits, and sigils for Swiftness boons, everytime for traveling, isn’t convenient at all. It’s an inconvenience of flawed gameplay design. Rumor has it, that the next feature pack will introduce saved builds, such as those found in SPvP. If true, that destroys your whole argument that this is how Anet wants the game to be played. In fact, the SPvP builds destroys your entire argument by itself. Anet didn’t want players to constantly switch out their traits and sigils, etc., because it is inconvenient.
Actually saving builds is just a feature from GW1 that hasn’t been implemented yet.
Why should everything be ‘convenient?’ As was stated a couple of times in other posts, if you want speed in your build it is a positive feature that has to be sacrificed for another positive feature. If I got every single thing I wanted in a build the skill bar would be 25 skills long. You could just about have everything that way. You wouldn’t have to sacrifice anything and everything would be convenient to me. That isn’t the way the game works. You design the best build you can with the parameters you’ve been given. We all have to deal with it.
You know you’ve lost the argument when you resort to telling others not to play the game, even when they offer valid reasons as to why the current game isn’t enjoyable to either them, or others, but still want to offer solutions for a better game. It sounds like the old argument, “go back to wow!”, which is nothing but a shallow attempt to defend their argument.
Two things are wrong with this. 1. You haven’t lost the argument in any way by suggesting such. Because the pro mount people are so passionate about their position they lose sight of the fact that mounts don’t exist in GW2. Suggesting that they play something that gives them what they want is just being practical since they are not getting that here. 2. As I and others have pointed out ad nauseum, no valid or compelling arguments have truly been made for mounts. I have see these so-called arguments in favor of mounts constantly debunked as “I want” or “It would be cool”. Even the added revenue argument was countered above.
(edited by jheryn.8390)
You are creating made up scenarios…the game already forces you to equip traveling weapons/utils/traits to get to events quickly, but even this is barely felt due to the wp system. So no you would not be forced to do anything.
You obviously only read what you want things to say and twist things to suit your own agenda, so I will address these two things. I did create a very real scenario that could happen if given mounts that increase speed. It would be ANOTHER thing people would feel forced upon them. That you cannot see that is sad.
As far as creating scenarios I guess that saying in one posts that we already have mounts in the game and that I need to accept that and then saying in this last post that you know there are no mounts actually isn’t creating a scenario but does qualify as revisionist history or just making stuff up the first time to suit your arguments.
Just saying you dont want to see mounts is just as selfish as banning pink dye from armor because you dont like the color, noone is forcing you to color your armor pink but you want to limit what everyone else can do because you dont like pink armor. You are free to feel this way, but I can guarantee that is not an attitude shared by Anet.
Were you not the one telling me and everyone else that they have no idea what Anet does, or wants or has plans for or has ANY clue about because we don’t work there? Accusing people of one thing and then doing it yourself is hypocritical and makes debate with you worthless and boorish.
Can you atleast be genuine? Kites are boosters in the same way mounts in other games are speed boosters, you are playing semantics
Calling something a gimmick does not invalidate it as evidence
As far as the kite goes, it is a skin that already existed in the game that they added a speed boost onto it. It isn’t semantics. Other than you, I have never heard anyone refer to it as a mount, probably because it isn’t. I don’t recall anyone other than you saying "Hey give us a costume that lets us move faster and we will call it a mount.
Even you can see that the pro-mount people are talking about things they can ride not just items that make them move faster. It isn’t semantics, it’s using my vision and intelligence.
Ok fine. The word ‘gimmick’ out. I will call it what they call it, A Toy. It is not a mount. It is a device for costume brawling. Not something to get you across a map.
GW2 used/uses many conventions of past MMOs and tailored them to their game, it was not made on some island without any outside influence
You don’t say? You used the past tense correctly. Tailored. As in it other things were used and it is done now. There are many things that didn’t make it into the game from other games. One of them I can think of is, let’s see, oh yes, Mounts. Most MMO’s incorporate elements of others. If mounts were so obviously the boon and draw that you say they are, why weren’t they implemented from the start?
Maybe you/they should actually read the posts you are replying to then?
I personally have stated Mounts would/could
+provide a time/gold/money sink
+revenue for Anet
+a new crafting experience
+even further character customization
+fun
+allows players the option to travel the map quickly, or more easily if speed is equal to speed boots plus movement skills without having to use the wp system , which can be immersion breaking for some, while at the same time not mandatory.
+adds to the level of creativity the community can express, in video, pictures, machinima
I’ll give you this, the first two are the only actual reasons they would add mounts. Bravo. But again, why wouldn’t they add such a great money maker in the beginning and add new ones if it would have deemed a huge revenue source?
The third is not an encompassing or even compelling reason if an actual reason at all. People don’t just want crafted mounts. They want creature mounts as well. There will be no horse and camel crafting stations.
The rest are just all personal desires of yours, not reasons. I don’t want to “customize” my character around a mount or be forced to use one to get to an event before it is over for those that have them. It would not be fun for me. Having them in game would be immersion breaking for me in that I don’t want them or have to look at others using them because they would feel out of place to me. So just like my dislike for them your last few ‘reasons’ are not reasons at all. Just personal preferences.
And I find it funny that many of the complaints are due to experience in other games, and how their mounts were implemented and yet all i hear is GW2 is not those games.
You are right, so stop basing your opinion of mounts in this game by those games then…as I feel many of those things can be fixed/done better by Anet
First, there are no mounts in this game. Second, the only person bringing up other games is you. I am not basing ANY of my dislike for mounts based on other games. I basing my dislike for mounts on the fact that I dislike mounts. I couldn’t possibly care less what other games do. WoW is the only experience I have with mounts. I used to like WoW somewhat. Mounts are a part of that game and I accept that. I think that is your main problem. Acceptence. GW2 does not have mounts. I have the ability to accept that. I also have the ability to intelligently grasp that they are most likely not going to happen. Some people are obviously having issues with both of those things.
We can only present what we want and why and hope they are compelled in our favor.
The want part is evident, it is the why part beyond “They are really super cool” that is missing.
People in this very post have presented evidence, just because you personally dont see it kitten does not mean it hasnt been done.
Apparently many others have missed it as well. I see more than myself replying to your post saying there is no evidence other than a gimmick that happened on Halloween almost two years ago. BTW, the kite isn’t a mount. It isn’t evidence. It is a booster. I have yet to see anyone ride one.
Some people here have expressed disdain for even cosmetic mounts, which are ALREADY in the game—-this is evidence btw
Again, evidence of a gimmick they presented almost two years ago with Halloween. It is a toy for costume brawling. It is not a mount. Next.
The reference to WOW (an MMO) which GW2 also is, was to illustrate the evolving nature of the genre nothing more….your bias is not needed nor helpful
And I was using your comparison of WoW as a means to remind you and others that this is a different game and that it doesn’t matter what other games have done. That such comparisons are worthless and not needed nor helpful.
I’m pretty sure I did. From Merriam-Webster “making usually unjustified or excessive claims”. You have no idea if everyone not wanting mounts are airing personal grievances or not. Both unjustified and excessive.
I was , i thought, obviously speaking to the reply in this post, never mentioned speaking for all of anything, as many of the posts fit into my assessment, it is neither unjustified or excessive….
Really? I believe your exact words were:
people are just posting up personal grievances vs personal desires instead of having a real dialog about the best way to do mounts IF/when Anet decided to add them
“People are just posting up personal grievances” is not addressing the poster. In context of your sentence you are implying that people who do not want mounts are offering up their personal gripes about mounts versus people who want them. It isn’t directed at just the OP, it is a universal statement. It most certainly encompasses “all” of a group. So yes, unjustified and excessive.
Well the added Kites for one…broomstick etc. many could make an argument that Anet is testing the waters with these items
Assuming Anet wont add them is fair, but it is just that ….an assumption
As far as them not being in yet as evidence….how long did it take before WOW added flight to their game after launch?
I could probably make and argument to justify testing of almost anything in this game. But as Nerelith and others have adroitly explained, there is no evidence that mounts are coming to the game.
The examples you given, in my opinion, are hardly things I would consider as “testing the waters”. The kites and broom are gimmicky certainly. One even gives a speed boost. But so do boosters and skills. These two things are largely just cosmetic.
Again, Nerelith and many others have pointed out, until there are compelling arguments for mounts cosmetic or otherwise, they have no real reason to add them. Give them actual compelling arguments and even I will listen. “I want”, “I like them”,
“Gimme”, and “I’ll quit if I don’t get one” are not compelling arguments.
Yes, it is a fair assumption. I was the one that said it. Along with the fact that there is no evidence and absolutely nothing to indicate that mounts are on the table.
By the way, the comparisons to WoW are old and stale. This isn’t WoW (thank goodness). I don’t want it to be WoW. It will never be WoW. Who cares what WoW did? Who cares about WoW’s implementations and timelines? If I wanted the things in WoW, I would play WoW.
Pretty sure pretentious doesnt mean what you think it mean, as i clearly stated each side was on the same ground, sorry if my word choice was confusing.
I’m pretty sure I did. From Merriam-Webster “making usually unjustified or excessive claims”. You have no idea if everyone not wanting mounts are airing personal grievances or not. Both unjustified and excessive.
I also clearly stated it was up to Anet, not either side having more clout than the other
Not wanting mounts is just as fine as wanting them, asserting your opinion as fact is the problem, and atleast personally, ive seen more people in favor of mounts be honest at the fact that they are indeed unnecessary and something they would enjoy if added to the game, and not standing behind scenarios of server stability or class travel balance etc…things that Anet would have surely resolved before implementation of mounts anyway
Of course, it is up to Anet whether or not mounts happen. No one said otherwise. However, it has been two years and there hasn’t even been an indication that mounts would EVER be included in the game. I would say it is a great educated and evidenced assumption on anyone thinking persons part that mounts are unlikely to ever happen. What could possibly make anyone believe that they WOULD add mounts? You may know a lot of people who want them but I know a lot of people who don’t. Many who are avidly opposed in fact. Why would they add something that would upset a large portion of the players who don’t want them?
Also, I agree that Anet would do what they had to in order to implement mounts if they were going to, but it changes many mechanics of the game not just travel. Not just in one zone but all.
So, in my opinion, it is completely fair for people to assume Anet doesn’t want mounts. When you have any kind of evidence that mounts are being considered, then make your claims that people have no clue what Anet wants. Until that time, those saying they think Anet doesn’t want mounts clearly have evidence on their side.