Guild Wars 2

My ele was my first class when the game launched I got him to 50 and stopped leveling him and played mesmer, then I made a thief to 80, after that a warrior. I just recently got my ele to 80 about a week ago.

It sounds like from you post you are talking about WvW. It really depends on what you want to do. I never played ele before these nerfs so I can’t comment on how much things changed. Really only thing that I can even notice before was alot of Ele’s used ether renewal with mist form. That isn’t possible anymore but I never played it pre-nerf so I can’t really comment on it but I can see how it would be really effective.

Honestly though the classes are different I will say that imo from the classes I have at 80 I recognized in seconds that Ele was the hardest to play. If you like active playstyle the thief and ele both are pretty equal they just go about things a differently.

On my thief kitten is more possible and hilarious at times it can be fun so far from what I can tell the Ele is also. I don’t play my thief much anymore but not because its boring just because I am learning ele atm. Really make both or level your ele or start a thief and level that.

There is nothing wrong with having alts unless your really into the whole brand/class loyalty thing.

Just finished getting my ele to 80. It was my first character when the game came out but I stopped playing it when I started Mesmer, the 3 other toons made it 80 before my ele.

I like to read up on classes see people’s thought then go from there. I’m running the standard 0/10/0/30/30.

The one thing I see is there is no general consensus on which heal is best which is always good.

I’ve been using ether ATM but I like glyph since I have 70% boon duration without food.

My question is what is generally accepted as a base minimum of healing power for d/d ele? I am at 455 right now.

Lol finally I had a khilbron set way back when they first popped on TP. I have different runes in them since I replaced them. I noticed this too I would always get jagged horrors occasionally and never figured out why till this day. I tried to reproduce it by letting myself get hit never thought it was spawning from phantasms.

Not anything we can do about it except not wear khilbron but this bug has been around for a long time.

Yea I am pretty sure weapon swap sigils internal cooldown will put the on crit on cooldown also.

Well If you wanted to go all out on might stacking going for duration would be better, by boon duration runes or might duration since you can get 60% 100% might duration is easy to get. Then you have the might on dodge food probably would want to run staff for the bounces from WOC i think you can get that to 10 secs of might from WOC also. GS would allow good might stacking to from Mirror blade. I tried this method with shatter I was able to get around 15 stacks of might pretty easily if the fight lasted more than 10 secs.

Wonderer.1790:

So what your saying is leave phantasm as the basically win all 1v1’s build and while also leaving it as a horrible group play build in zerging, and pvp gameplay. K, I really don’t care that much anyways. I don’t even duel behind the windmill thing haha.

Also, Yes I realize other Mesmer builds use phantasms and nerfing them would effect those builds. But building around phantasms SHOULD be an option that is viable in more than just 1v1’s. You yourself even mentioned those thief threads about stealth. I wouldn’t mind if stealth was toned down as well, and I play a thief. It would incur more play around D/D and other builds rather than just D/P in WvW. If this kind of balancing was done around all classes the game would become not just more diverse, but more balanced as well..

But I can see your stuck and will probably say, A net just doesn’t balance that way blah blah. Well they should, and it would create a more diverse build perspective with increased balance across every class. You might actually see builds built around phantasms in group play and in dueling, not just only in 1v1’s as it is at the moment.

I never said Phantasm build isn’t balanced maybe if you looked at the phantasm themselves and not the build then you to can see that phantasms are balanced. Some of them need a buff like iMage and Disenchanter.

Look at the mesmer builds that are out there including shatter spec. Do those builds not summon phantasms? Even glamour spec summoned a phantasm occasionally even if they want to shatter it after it does its attack.

Alot of builds in this game take an aspect of a class and basically build around it. I am not going to think about building around stability boon on my mesmer or thief since they have access to that with just 1 ability. I can with my warrior its like elementalist build around boons, guardians and mesmers can a thief would have a hard time building around boons. I havent seen many 2 water, 2 monk, 2 major water thieves running around.

You can build around certain unique parts of your class to make good builds. Phantasm is built around phantasms, Shatter builds around f1-f4. Thieves can build around stealth, warriors can build around their burst or adrenaline mechanic or might boon.

So Phantasms are balanced they just happen to be good 1v1 dueling if you build around them. In essence that is a by product of the build. P/D condition thief is good 1v1 and dueling it needs to be nerfed 1v1 by your logic because bleed stacking is OP so we need to nerf runes.

Wonderer.1790:

I don’t understand why you would be against this. Phantasm Mesmer should obviously be nerfed in 1v1 capability but buffed for group play. Why would anyone even debate otherwise? The same people crying at the ones who are saying “nerf phantasm Mesmer whilst increasing viability in group play” can only be abusing the build in 1v1’s or roaming/duels in the first place. Otherwise why would you even care if they nerfed phantasm for 1v1’s when they themselves are saying the game isn’t built around 1v1’s.

Honestly don’t care though kittenter is still the better spec. Its the last survivable burst build in the game in my opinion.

Have you ever heard something balanced around 1v1 in this game? If so please I would like to know. Things are done around group play not around behind the windmill dueling.

Seriously if 1v1 nerfing is what your asking for then every bunker build should be nerfed as they are usually the ones that show up at duels anyway. You think the RTL change to ele was made because of 1v1?

Nerfing in 1v1 setting rolf what is that? You have to realize that in essence 1v1 does not exist in this game its something that people do. You ever seen a nerf or buff done to something in this game revolving around Role Playing?

Phantasms are apart of the Mesmer mechanic (see thief nerf stealth threads) even shatter builds usually pop duelist and let him unload before shattering him.

Lol nerf something based around roaming, nerf everything with mobility then lol.

Rashagal.5867:

To those trying to destroy the truce between BP and AR by stating that AR “gains nothing” from it: perhaps you haven’t caught on to the notion that AR doesn’t really care about ratings

If this truly was the case that AR doesn’t really care then either AR or BP would just give their stuff away to their partners.

If you really don’t care and its about having us lose ratings and you don’t care about ratings. AR just give BP all of your keeps and your home bl. All you do is push Ehmry home Bl and if you lose stuff to BP don’t worry about it by combining your lands as one then you can triumph. This is of course as you say you don’t really care.

Vice versa BP gives all of their home bl to AR so that either BP or AR actually can come in first of course that means faster that darkhaven will catch up to either of you but that shouldn’t matter if you don’t care.

The OP mentions sPvP (hotjoins) everything else calling the build OP refer to it in duels. Not much to really discuss its a duel its hotjoins both of which don’t really matter much. Its not like its breaking the game.

Especially threads like this are why I hope Anet never makes a dueling mode because it will give voice talking about I can’t beat x 1v1 its OP. Everyone knows pretty much what the best dueling/small group builds there are and people usually bring those to duels this is for all classes.

Mesmer’s and thieves have long time been considered the best dueling classes in the game no matter what build you are running really because they have enough things to prepare for just about every classes and every build swap some utilities and there you go your ready.

ExVoodoo.7586:

testpig.5018:

Mention Borlis Rock, Post Borlis Rock Picture, Say “pay2win” three times out of context, Talk about how Ehmry is bad because they can’t hold 100k leads against two servers, Be stupid, Post one illegible sentence

That picture is out of date. Right now Borlis is red and Anvil is blue. >:

Oh soon it will be correct on friday because Anvil decided to let Borlis be blue again for some strange reason.

One day someone from Anvil Rock will realize that Brolis Rock alliance benefits nobody except Borliss Pass smh. I don’t get it.

See Anvil Rock can beat BP decides to ally while BP reaps all the benefits and passes AR in ratings. Result Ebay still keeps a 100k ratings lead like we have for many weeks. AR moves down in Rating behind BP. Darkhaven on them heelz!!!

Reinforcments.5713:

The alliance is a false sense of equalization.

Those 3 servers are not going to remain in the same place forever.
And if AR and BP have to team up to fight EB, they do not belong in their tier, period.

Unless you’re trying to keep those servers forever in a twilight zone.

Thread winner!! This dude gets it and he is on AR. Anvil this guy should be your new spokesman.

Your alliance basically allowed BP to pass you in rating next week instead of improving your own. You had about a 9k lead on BP now you will end up trailing them by about 2k(there is still time to save yourself). Ebay has a 100k rating lead on whoever finishes second this week and its pretty much evened out there for the past few weeks.

Cateran.9360:

oZii.2864:

Dat Server coming to replace one of you shortly

Darkhaven – 1 290.642

Unless something major has changed in the last couple months, you’re not going to have any more fun with them than either AR or BP. When they came up to T6 high on weeks of victories, they got trounced the first week by BP (who then moved up) and then by AR the next two weeks (who also moved up). They put on a good showing on reset but their all around coverage was patchy at best.

We fought darkhaven before it doesn’t matter its a new name, with new people. Thats what really motivates alot of the masses in WvW. A new _ invader/recruit/scout person to kill.

Rinzler.8072:

Well Ebay, all your advanced tactics, 300 man teamspeak, etc only earns you 1 rank higher than us. Doesn’t seem worth it.

Ide rather have fun and play in lazy mode and be one rank lower.

Just proves Anvil rocker players are better skilled, we can hang 1 rank behind you without even having to try.

Translation I have no clue how the Glicko system works I just know 1,2, and 3.

These are the numbers that matter Rating.

Ebay – 1 489.858
Anvil -1 362.433
Borliss- 1 352.966

In order to catch us in Rating (the number that matters) it would take well even more weeks, which require stamina. At the beginning of fighting a new enemy all the WvWers put on their best shiney’s and new shoes. The first 2 weeks aren’t as important as when it gets that “stale” taste. Eventually the smaller servers people get burnt out its the way the matchup works when there is a large enough population difference.

You guys found a spark in a post when we had 695 PPT big hurrah. Its about maintaining it. Eventually you wont be able to maintain it and then your forum people will say we don’t care about rank. See thats what seperates us blah blah the usual forum stuff everyone spouts when they start losing or facing the inevitable

Dat Server coming to replace one of you shortly

Darkhaven – 1 290.642

Borlis pass is glad that you allied with them because it allows them to stay in this tier longer.

Projected Rating For next week.

Ebay- 1 468.970
BP- 1 368.504
AR- 1 366.512

You been run amuck, led astray

So now instead of having about a 10k lead on BP and improving your rating, like you had before you guys are married and allowed them to pass you in Rating.

Dat logic O.o letting some dude who posted a score on his first time posting on the forums got your server all motivated to essentially go to as you put it down 1 rank.

So in 2 days Anvil Rocker dude your skill will move you 2 ranks behind us as you like to call it. rofl

Meanwhile…….

Dat Server Moving on up to the Eastside

Darkhaven – 1 307.367

Kardiamond.6952:

If you take forum as a valid sample,

Killed the post right there stopped reading at that point.

Lets see Kalkz is on BP and talks alot on the forums, don’t know Kalkz I just know what the character looks like and when its dead I am suppose to put a “Ram on it” uh oh oh oh oh oh oh

Peter aka Skullclamp is on BP. Peter is my homey

Richard Z Rhal and Necrethius (*SP) both on BP that I have met during this matchup both really cool people. Forum not valid sample

Wonderer.1790:

All I see are Guardian, Mesmer, and Thief roamers.

This guy doesn’t see elementalist which isn’t normal for me. Its all different for everyone.

If you like roaming in WvW you will gravitate towards classes that allow you to do so. I have a thief, mesmer, and a warrior. 2 of which have very good mobility warrior is capable of roaming but you have to pick your fights a bit more. Mesmer doesn’t have as good mobility as the other 2 but its decent and has enough get out of jail cards to allow for escapes.

The roaming classes that are seen the most allow you to escape if you need to you have a way out when 50% of your stuff is on cd after you just got in a fight and you notice a zerg coming.

1v1 = Buildwars

Are warriors weak in 1v1? Well depends on what build your running and what your facing.

Take peter for example who I am friends with. If I am on my P/D condition thief then I can’t out dps his warrior. I can’t kill him fast enough before he can heal again and he has at times -60% condition duration. If I go and get S/D change my build then the fight is different.

So 1v1 are build wars I enjoy them but they are terrible for a basis for balance.

A warrior 1v1 is fine as long as he has the right build which is the case for all classes some more so than others. Most people that build for 1v1 try to factor in as much as they can from other classes like conditions, stuns, etc. Warrior doesnt have a build that can “handle every build” like say a d/d elementalist(until they run into a condition mesmer even post nerf)

Well I have apothecary set, rabid set, and a direct damage set. So the builds are different for all of them.

The apoth and rabid are condition damage builds but different style of play. I made some adjustments actually to the apothecary build so no more illusionary persona.

Yea I like the duration runes better reason I go for more duration is you can keep uptime on them higher. I did the math before and the +20% from Mad King and Lyssa is good enough for duration while still getting the extra boon duration from water. anything more would be wasted unless I wanted to go bleed duration but since I don’t have 15 pts in dueling for bleeds from crits I dont feel like the extra bleed duration is worth it. The main damage is the staff and clone conditions and Retal damage.

The reason I don’t go 30 points in inspiration though I tried it is the scaling on the heal on shatter isn’t awesome if you have more than 1 clone out. So I like IP for the distortion basically and extra stun break/get out of jail card. I do use confusing cry sometimes for extra retal uptime and the might from shatter is good for extra power and condition damge. More power=more retal damage. I also feel like regen keeps me up enough and I can cast from prestige, or I cast MOR in chaos storm or when I have protection up.

I was thinking about mantra of pain to see how it works but everytime I come into a fight against more than 1 person I feel like defender would have held me up if I die he makes a big difference 1vX.

Protection is -33% damage + idefender -50% + illusionary defense -9% with 3 illusions out. The only thing better than that much defense is a ability that makes you invulnerable.

Every class is like this DPS warriors put points into Arms for critical chance and the secondary is condition damage.

Non condition thieves will go 15 points into trickery for the extra 3 initiative and kleptomaniac trait the secondary is condition damage.

Apothecary trinkets are expensive but if you happen to have a set of apothecary I can see this working.

This is what i have been running its tanky with good condition duration, boon duration, and healing.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/mesmer/?4.0|6.1b.h1h|b.1f.hf.f.1m.h1h|1f.7g.1f.7g.1f.71h.1f.71h.1f.7i.1f.7i|1f.66.21m.0.1f.66.1f.66.1f.66.1b.62|0.0.k4a.k4a.u57b|30.d|32.36.3l.3d.0|e

The best way I can describe it is a condition damage version of the Immortal mesmer build.

70% condition duration with scepter/torch 80% burn duration with scepter torch I havent found anything else except smoldering to put on the torch tbh. 70% and 80% will both yield 5 seconds of burning from prestige so its not really worth it.

93% duration on confusion with scepter/torch

60% duration with staff

35% boon duration

You basically play it similar to immortal mesmer except you use mage to keep retal up since he gets boon duration now. I run this with phantasmal haste so he casts 4.8 secs to keep it up. If you move 30pts to chaos or slot signet of midnight or use the boon duration food then you can get 5 secs of retal from mage.

So ideal openers 1vX is prestige pop mage, pop defender go to work with staff while they take double retal damage everytime they hit you. Then you have condition duration on top of it with decent condition damage even with low power the retal damage is pretty good I believe it procs for 281 with this build. So thats 281*2 on top of whatever else you putting on them. 5 secs of confusion from mage and 9 secs of confusion from scepter.

You cant chase anyone down but you wont die and anyone greedy you can kill. Really the only thing that gives me problems 1v1 is a phantasm mesmer running duelist or sword/sword and they are power based.

Ok so people that didn’t follow mesmer didnt realize that the tooltip for signet of illusions was bugged and it always gave 200% so it was no problem.

They fix some text on a tooltip and now some people are upset. I don’t even understand this…. non problem.

If you didn’t kill the phantasms before you aren’t killing them now so it makes no difference. The biggest thing signet of illusions does is make idefender good assuming he is summoned when the signet procs otherwise you gave 2 utlility slots 2 take hits of half damage.

Cempa.5619:

Hi,

Could you share what you think about this build please:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQNAW7flwzqpXUTmGb9IipHBHyBcoU0dZXJF22FC-jkyAIthMTLgpKBjKgkDLiGbVsIasKZioa1NmBPQ28lVDA-w

Thanks

Hmm well I did mess with a similar trait setup and it works with torch. You also get the regen and protection procs with prismatic understanding(I love protection boon).

So the chaos traits work the random condition is a good trait also.

The only thing I would change is distortion grants reflection to confusing cry. Since you have clone on dodge you will have plenty of ability to shatter if you chose to.

I would go with master of misdirection and confusing cry.

Your power is low but your retal should proc around 180 extra damage.

You would probably be looking at 1000 damage with 5 stacks of confusion and if they are hit by your retal. You are pretty beefy so it can help with the thieves spamming on you. I am assuming you would use the +40% duration food so your confusing images would be 7 secs. You could also go with master of misdirection which would give you 9 seconds on confusing images if you wanted to go that route.

Those are just some ideas but what you have there definitely should work.

Asuka Shikinami.5462:

After spending hours dueling against this build (well a variation but still similar) I can confirm it is lethal. You have so much to consider when trying to fight it you end up getting overwealmed in one way or another. The weakness is keeping burst and sustained damage up on the mesmer, though a skilled player can migrate that with our usual utilities.

Regardless, goof fights mates. Now please leave my keep alone, it’s supposed to be red not green. – Richard.

Thanks you guys are pushing us hard right now so we are on our heels at the moment.

I just woke up fell asleep before reset. Wow.

Crossplay.2067:

I use to run rabid armor and it is great for dueling and soloing camps. I even had one proud moment where it took 3 npcs and 4 to 7 players about 3 minutes to chase me away from a supply depo. However, the armor set has one huge flaw; you’re pretty much useless against anything that doesn’t take condition damage. You can forget trying to take out siege weapons on your own and might as well not even bother with walls and gates.

Yea that is true but thats pretty much the same for all condition gear maybe outside of carrion.

Sebrent.3625:

Nice to see you haven’t completely retired your Mesmer, Sinnacle :-p

Why use it with apothecary gear though? I’m a bigger fan of it with Rabid due to the precision + sharper images … though that isn’t a factor with your traits.

Yea I have gotten back into it well I have rabid set and apothecary and wanted to do something with apothecary but I love the 15 pt traits in chaos and inspiration to much so I wanted to take advantage of that with a tanky heal build but still able to kill people so I found that burning works well for this. I dropped back a bit on duration so I have 35% boon duration and 70% burn duration for this build.

Wanted to chime in I did some tinkering and I was skeptical of investing in burn duration on a mesmer it just doesn’t seem like it would work.

My motto is you don’t know until you try.

So I messed around with 0/0/20/20/30 full apothecary gear. veggie pizza, 2 runes balthazaar, 2 Flame legion 2 lyssa. Trait for bounce and you get almost 4 secs of burning just from staff auto attack. If you can get the additional 20% condition duration by moving the points for torch like you have then 6 secs for prestige. 2 secs for staff 4 secs of burning from auto attack

I can’t part with the protection procs for chaos tree so I moved back down to 20 pts there so I have 90% burn duration on scepter torch and 80 on staff. Its beefy tankish because of the apothecary but it kills.

I just tested it on a friend running -60% condition duration and it worked well. Just wanted to throw this in there incase you wanted to check it out. Its really the only thing I have found I like for my apothecary set.

If I had SE tokens I would definitely pick up the full set of forge runes or full set balthazaar could be interesting also.

Just adding the video to the thread. 2 small clips of me using this setup. This is 2 krait, 2 afflicted, and 2 lyssa runes

Well a hybrid style Phantasm bleed build can work. This is a little video of just 2 clips as I havent been able to get anything really good solo roaming. Since I have been messing with another build not using rabid gear.

The first clip is just me and a guildy we are running the exact same build as he asked me for something different from his zerk setup. The utilities are whatever you like I was just messing with signet of illusions and defender as I had never really ran them before or a phantasm build before I mostly just did confusion shatter build with GS sword/pistol.

The main point why I put this vid together was from this thread.

You can see that duelist can stack 6-7 bleeds on its own. This is 81% crit chance for duelist since he has fury. The confusion from scepter is just complimentary damage to go with bleeds for more pressure. The bleeds last for 9 secs for any illusion crit the staff is there for kiting and the usual goodies staff gives but the main damage is from duelist basically traited 1200 range let 1, 2, or 3 do the work for you.

This is all rabid gear the condition damage is actually lower than normal mine is at 1149 but you don’t need a truck ton of damage for bleeds and the returns are low for the amount of condi damage you have to put in.

1149 gets me 100 damage per tick on bleeds 1550 will get you 120 why duration > damage imo. You can as other said take Rampager gear to give you more crit so you can go deeper if you like into the illusion tree. I wouldn’t say deceptive evasion is a must but more clones = more bleeds so I would say 20 points is good to go for the extra crit 25 if you want the extra condition from shatter.

Basically your filling up the condition removal que for passive condi removal so there are so many conditions they can’t wipe all of them especially the important ones. Like engineers mask their confusion behind poisons etc. This works well with sword main hand too since your clones strip boons, apply bleeds, vulnerability and when they die lay conditions and act as fodder for more conditions.

Wipes are less effective if you can constantly stack bleeds over and over again. I also have traited clone death causes confusion, random condition, and recently I added the cripple on death also not in the video though.

zhi.6170:

Shout out to the 2 GH mesmers at dane (we were in a 3v2). I’m actually not a very good mesmer, in fact I think you two are real good xD

Thanks shout out to you too!! We will probably be in eternal again around the bp spawn

idefender and sig of illusions work good together against melee types. The problem with signet of illusions is the way it activates I believe its 12 secs global cd. So you can spawn a defender and he wont get the buff and he dies quickly. Then you spawn another and it gets it right away. So its hit or miss in the end if you try it out sometimes you will love the setup and other times you wont. As mambastik said its a lot different playstyle you have to be tanky to make him work since he gets your toughness. It is a different playstyle though 2 utility slots for 1 phantasm basically without sig of illusions then he is basically good enough to survive a CnD from glass thief then he dies right away.

ExZee.8109:

Palu.3405:

ExZee – Thank you for your feedback, but I’m not sure you fully grasp what this build is about. First of all, some people like the Mesmer and enjoy this particular playstyle enjoyable. I for one am content with having massive survivability, even if I don’t get kills as frequently as others might. I also think you are mistaken in concluding that this build can only kill “noobs.” What this build lacks in burst, it makes up for in survivability, and as such, with patience one can bring down most players. If you don’t have that patience or want more burst, then I absolutely think you should try something other than this build because this build is not for you.

Also, the second video is now uploaded, featuring a 1 vs Many scenario. I’ll post the other two later today.

lol naw, I only know too much what this build is about, since it’s pretty much THE build I’ve mastered for over 7 months. It’s the poor man’s attempt at trying to do damage without heavy confusion pressure/burst using a variation of FLIMP’s build, and with patience you might just kill yourself out of boredom from how long a single fight is going to take. Even before the confusion nerf, 1v1 or even 1vX against good players took me forever (or was a complete stalemate) because 1) they were smart enough to not take confusion damage 2) they simply ran away to reset the fight when they were low hp, since the condition Mesmer has no stopping power and 3) they were using Lemongrass. The only way to kill a fellow condition Mesmer using similar builds was to be better at bursting confusion. Using the sword over the scepter was a huge sacrifice to damage, which any good condition Mesmer realized, and now it’s simply become the preferred choice since the scepter literally does no damage. The word “patience” you’re referring to here is the kind that would make a road rage driver into a Buddha, and I’ll just leave it at that to put your usage of the word into perspective.

As for the other guy, Lyssa runes on this build is essential because it’s the only other one of two condition removals that this build has. The other comes from utility and anyone worth posting in a build thread should know by now conditions are the condition Mesmer’s greatest weakness. A P/D Thief doesn’t make the same sacrifices for getting +bleed duration runes, so your “ala P/D thief style” comparison isn’t exactly fair nor comparable.

And the issue of burst was never compared to with a P/D Thief. The lack of specifically mentioned confusion burst was to compare the condition Mesmer to itself between pre and post nerf, not to compare it with another profession. Reading comprehension is your friend.

Now you jumping to condition removal your original post states that if you want to do bleeds go P/D and they stack more bleeds than a bleed mesmer can which they cannot. There is no sacrifice at all you should really read up on your builds a bit more.

If you go the popular lets say wild bill build P/D condi. Your 20 points into Deadly arts you run your krait, afflicted etc, there is your condition duration. You do the same on a mesmer the reason thieves don’t give up much is because your 10 point shadow art trait. The best passive a mesmer has for condi removal is 30 points in inspiration.

No matter what the build is nothing a mesmer can do can match a thieves passive condition removal it is one of the best in the game. Not all classes are identical.

Your original suggestion was that if you want to do bleeds on a mesmer P/D thieves do it better which isnt the case there just want a reason before to actually go bleeds as a mesmer when confusion was 100% better.

Its like trying to make a condition build for a thief that focuses poison when bleeds are 100% better. If they nerfed bleeds or P/D reduced duration to 2 secs or something then thieves would have to come up with something else. This is essentially something else.

ExZee.8109:

I don’t normally post on build threads but all these attempts at trying to be a condition Mesmer without confusion (and those with is even more lol) is just… sad. That video is definitely within top 5 of the most boring GW2 gameplay videos I’ve seen so far and against any good player the lack of burst is simply fatal.

I was a (real) condition Mesmer since I started playing GW2 but I knew where to draw the line after this kitten nerf. I buried my Mesmer (sigh… I really did love my condition Mesmer) and made a P/D condition Thief and trust me, P/D Thieves can stack more bleeds (and hit harder) than a staff Mesmer with 3 clones. Not to mention condition Engineers can stack burning/bleeding/poison/+ other non-damaging conditions much better also (and hit harder). Random bleeds/burns just isn’t good enough to be competitive without solid confusion bursts. Have fun killing noobs though.

If you do duration (which P/D is all about) a duelist and a mesmer or staff mesmer can stack more bleeds than a P/D thief. A P/D thief base bleed duration is 4 secs, staffs is 7 secs, sharper images trait is base 5 secs.

So 5 attacks with sneak attack (requiring stealth) and 3 auto attacks and you have 8 stacks of bleeds. At 60% chance to crit which is 80% with phantasm fury trait duelist will land 6-7 stacks on his own. If you go for 100% duration ala P/D thief style and happen to have phantasmal haste trait 1 duelist can stack 12-14 bleeds on its own thats not counting the mesmer because the first stack wont wear off before he fires again this is all with 1 duelist. I have a semi similar build I put together but I use pistol off hand as the main bleed stacking.

P/D thieves don’t have any burst at all. 0/0/30/20/20 or 20/0/30/20/0 neither have any burst the best burst you can get out of those is to take leeching venoms (venoms are lulz) Death blossom spam bleed build is not good at all also only noobs stand in caltrops.

conflict.6539:

Anet, can you please redo all of the warriors weapon skills? Its so boring to be pigeoned holed into a certain weapon. Nerf its damage for all I care but make some viable weapon options, besides greatsword please.

Great Sword; pretty much keep as is, but either increase 100B recast time, or lower its damage, in conjunction with increasing the base damage the auto attack does, to make it more balanced.

This makes no sense your title says boring so you want a nerf to 100 blades but leave GS like it is BUT the big change you want is increase the damage of the auto attack (which it already does alot of damage) so you want to be able to stay on GS the whole time not switching weapons.

The problem with greatsword is the auto attack speed not its damage. It does alot of damage already. All the attacks on GS deal respectable damage some are bugged (rush) Blade trail can hit 5k easy if both parts hit. Damage on GS is fine. If you want to tweak it just make it moveable like fiery gs which is same animation as greatsword minus the last hit.

After playing a Warrior since head start you finally decided to play another class and are now a expert on what is balanced and overpowered. NO

My story is like your but kind of reverse my original class was mesmer. I was second on my server to have twilight loved mesmer remember the QQ back then about mesmers. I rolled thief in December. Rolled a Warrior about March.

My Favorite class is my warrior then my mesmer and then my thief. I even took my twilight and gave it to my Warrior.

The perspective is when I play my Warrior with the build I have now the only classes that give me trouble are a Mesmer with staff doesnt matter the build just staff. If they have a GS and whatever else I have no problem. Guardians.

So when I am on my Warrior 2 classes I dont like are Guardians and Staff Mesmers

When I am on my Thief 2 classes I don’t like are Bunker Guardians, Bunker eles (havent played it since S/D got a buff) bunker engi’s.

When I play Mesmers classes I don’t like are thieves, glass engi’s.

The classes I dont like are all the classes that can give me a hard time.

Morale is you should play more classes every class pretty much has 1 or 2 other classes that can give them trouble. I good well necro can do work on you since he can sit in his wells etc fear your clones and phantasm really lowering your dps while you eat conditions with condition removal on a long cd. There arent alot of those necros (or good ones) running around that I see so I don’t really say I don’t like necros.

WvW
So we go nerfed for confusion so trying to make it work but dont want to farm new gear.

After messing around with gear alot I came up wth this build.

0/30/20/15/5

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/mesmer/?4.0|b.1b.h1.a.1b.h5|6.1b.h1j|1b.712.1b.712.1b.712.1b.7i.1b.7i.1b.7i|1b.9b.1b.9b.1b.9b.1b.9b.1b.9b.1b.9b|0.u29a.k4a.f4.5|30.7|31.39.34.3d.0|e

Small clip of build I havent gotten many solo clips running this as I have been trying to figure out a build using my apothecary gear also.

Its all Rabid its still scepter its still condition damage.

Highlights: 8 sec bleeds from clones and phantasms with scepter/pistol 7 second bleeds from clones with staff you can get 8 if you put sigil of agony on staff. 7 1/2 sec confusion from confusing images 4 second confusion from clone death and cry of frustration (if you decide to shatter)

Burning damage is at 668 base

Fighting style: Attrition through conditions. Prenerf it was put confusion on them let them spam and kill themselves shatter or through glamours. With this build you let your clones do all the work. Duelist puts on great pressure with 1200 range and since he is 100% projectile finisher with trait through chaos storm and null field you can get 8 stacks of confusion follow with confusing images for 5 more stacks. The main damage is through bleeds with duelist firing every 5.4 seconds the first stack of bleeds will still be on target when Duelist unloads again as long as they are in range of him. If your enemy doesnt wipe 1 duelist can maintain at least 6 stacks on his own getting as high as 12 stacks more duelist means more stacks.

This is basically a condition Phantasm build.

The reason why condition duration > condition damage when it comes to bleeds is investment in condition damage vs return isn’t really great in many cases.

level 80 @ 1150 condition damage its 100 damage per bleed tick
for 400 condition damage jumping up to 1550 your bleeds are 120 per tick.
400 stat points for 20 extra damage per bleed.

7 stacks of bleeds and they both get wiped at the same time at 7 secs @ 100 damage per tick 4900 damage vs 5800 @ 120 damage per tick.

980 extra damage for 400 stat points.

If there is no wipe at 7 stacks running the full course of 8 seconds = 5600 damage @ 100 damage per tick

If you stacked no duration at all and had the base 5 second with 7 stacks bleed @ 120 damage per tick = 4200 damage

Gear:
Armor & Trinkets: Rabid everything can be swapped with some rampager if you like. Damage reduction is 32% with 2.7k armor.

Runes: 3x Krait (15% bleed duration) 3x Lyssa (10% condition duration)

Slot skill: Null field, Decoy, Blink; You can slot signet of illusions if you like but with everything being ranged I dont feel its necessary and signet of illusions has that weird bug ICD to it.

Food: Maintenance oils and Rare veggie pizza.

Pros: Pressure through bleeds and confusion

Cons: No direct damage.

Traits

Dueling: II,IX,X

Chaos: IV

Inspiration: Mender’s Purity and regen which procs protection boon and protection is awesome.

Ilusions: Illusionist Celerity

Vs particular classes I haven’t honestly had any trouble with any class so far a Necro heavy in conditions can be trouble but that is more to do with our condi removal. The pesky thieves have to eat unload as soon as they exit stealth. Down players like mist forming elementalist duelist will go charge and unload.

PS: This is my first attempt at writing up a build there maybe errors Ill keep looking to tweak the write up.

You can always up your bleed duration more if you like personal preference is I like seeing at least triple digits on bleeds so 100 is always my threshold. An additional sigil of agony on either Scepter or Pistol doesn’t yield an additional second you need +20% bleed duration to get an additional second with Scepter/Pistol.

Embolism.8106:

An important thing to keep in mind is that if your condition gets cleansed, +Duration would basically have no benefit, while with +Damage you would at least get some extra damage in before it was cleansed. Of course, this only applies to longer conditions, and things like 1s > 2s Burning are unlikely to suffer from this.

That is true but I feel like investment for return isn’t that good if your going for bleed damage and duration is 9 out of 10 times better.

level 80 at 1150 condition damage its 100 damage per bleed tick

for 400 condition damage jumping up to 1550 your bleeds are 120 per tick.

You could put those 400 stat points somewhere else and come out way better.

If we both stack 7 stacks of bleeds and they both get wiped at the same time at 7 secs @ 100 damage per tick 4900 damage vs 5800 @ 120 damage per tick. 980 damage for 400 stat points I dont think its really worth it.

Shield mastery trait rework is awesome. I love shield mastery and last stand its why I can’t part with 30 points in defense. Missile deflection seems odd to anyway as a trait on its own and imo not good enough to take over the other traits especially with dogged march in there now. Also mighty defense should gain adrenaline like someone else suggested as opposed to the 7 sec? It is now.

I don’t know about the conversion to boon I think just losing them would be fair though getting a bar of adrenaline isnt difficult it would also make embrace the pain on par with dogged march in the same tier.

Spiked armor is ? Retal is supposedly nerfed though I can’t tell but I havent tested but I have seen some 300 retal damage procs often from guardians. Maybe bump that up to 10 secs of retal if it procs still keep the 15 sec icd? I could still see moving that down a tier and it would be one of those attractive hmmm I can take this or take that traits both are pretty good.

Yea condition duration>condition damage for bleeds or confusion.

I am not one for making a build with a fancy name and writing out a big post on it but this is what I came up with after messing around all day yesterday trying to make something work for condi.

0/20/15/30/5

I like this alot better than running a staff clone bleed type build. This is 9 sec bleeds from duelist usually around 6-7 stacks. Staff is 9 secs. The bleeds tick for 100 per. Have to have the rampager jewels I find anything less than 50% chance to crit and duelist will only do about 4-5 bleed stacks.

1 duelist can put up 11-12 stacks since the first stack doesnt wear off by the time he fires again. The confusion from scepter is just extra on the top since it doesnt do much damage now when stacked with 7 bleed stacks it works pretty good.

http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/mesmer/?4.0|b.1o.h5.a.1o.h9|6.1b.h1h|1b.712.1b.712.1b.712.1b.714.1b.714.1b.714|1b.63.1b.63.1b.63.1b.63.1b.63.1b.63|0.k29.f4.u47b.5|30.7|31.3l.34.3d.0|e

I can’t really think of anything else to really focus on for condition duration outside of bleeds and you need crits for bleeds.

Not bad buuut if I would to tweak it I would not go runes of lyssa and go with 3 krait 3 afflected for +30% duration to bleeds combined with food for +40%.

If bleeds are the main purpose of your build you would want to find a good balance between condition damage and duration. I have been messing around with a phantasm bleeding build I kind of whipped up with 9 seconds of bleeding from illusion bleeds with 53% chance to crit with phantasms have fury = more bleeds.

I think with your setup though you dont have to have fury on phantasms I’m running scepter pistol and duelist can stack 12 bleeds on his second attack since the first stack of bleeds havent worn off.

Just a suggestion though for runes I messed around in the mist and tried something with burning but its random proc so I didn’t think it be good to try and do anything with that so I see the benefit of lyssa there.

Yea like i said just a suggestion though you can go 2x krait, 2x afflicted, 2x mad king is another option or mix in sigil of agony for + duration or givers weapons. With bleeds duration > damage since like confusion it stacks intensity.

Soo further testing what I get is if your phantasm causes a condition iMage, iZerker then they are affected by condition duration anything else is on clone death traits or sharper images which are also affected by condition duration.

Quick video showing the test.

Also so far from quick tests staff clones benefit from the bleed duration but only of mirror images. Confusing Combatants benefits from condition duration also.

The staff clones wont have 15s bleeds but instead 9 from the sharper images trait this was using the 2 krait, 2 afflicted, 2 centaur and 30 pt dom setup.

Just confirmed that condition duration now is passed on to clones.

CONFIRMED::

Go to mists 2 krait, 2 afflicted, 2 centuar 9 sec bleed from sharper images!!
also put 30 points in to domination obviously +70% bleed duration

This is awesome

Baa.4582:

Just noticed these with the sPvP golems:
- sharper images can last longer than 5s now with condition duration
- phantasmal healing(regen) can last more than 3s per proc now with boon duration. Previously your regen would refresh right as it ran out, now it builds up

I think illusions now benefit from condition/boon duration.

I didnt look at bleeds but I was looking at confusing combatants trait according to the wiki its suppose to be 3 secs but mine are 5 secs I was just telling my friend this like 2 minutes ago.

If there is some passive added or maybe a buff to shrug it off (which would mean possible buff to shake it off) I feel like it has to be 20 points into tactics. Passive condi removals like shadows embrace make it so you basically don’t have to have condi removal on your bar.

Mesmers get a good passive at 30 points in inspiration remove condition on shatter and from my testing the other day if you have 3 clones out and shatter it each one represents a condition that gets removed if it connects. If you have no target then your hurting or they get killed but you do have distortion that doesn’t require a hit. Thats just for passive comparison sake.

So I think 20 pts into tactics or something in tactics would be good. If the passive was good like shadows embrace or ele passive and it was only 10 points in tactics I don’t know that might be borderline opish. I would give up 10 points in defense for that all day there is no hard choice at 10 points in tactics unless you absolutely love leg specialist its great but not a must have.

I can’t see it in anywhere else except maybe brawn some kind of way but I actually like the DoTE suggestion to move to brawn. I think if it is 1 or 2 conditions with the way shrug it off is now then moved to 10 points in tactics I think thats fair but if it gets buffed to shadow embrace or ele condi removal effectiveness it has to be 20 points into tactics imo.

Protection is awesome.

I get alot of access to it on my mesmer. 30 points in chaos stealth skill and you can get it to stack 2 times, mass invis possible 3 times.

Dogged march proc protection instead of regen or Dolyak signet gives protection instead of stability. If they do give Dolyak signet the stun breaker as Jon Peters was saying I can’t see a reason to take balance stance anymore. 180 toughness and stability and stun breaker unless they want use to be stability warriors with balance stance, dolyak, last stand trait.

I wish I was getting 360 hp/s from adrenal health. I can dream though

Like Warlord said Axe auto attack is about the same DPS as 100B. There is a post here on the forums with the math.

Just from some quick searching Axe beats GS on sustained and GS beats Axe for burst because of 100Bs. 100 blades optimal dps is if a mob is up against a wall. Missing a part of 100Bs then it doesn’t beat Axe. Either way from the threads I just looked at the numbers are so close that it’s negligible. For the dps PvE warriors anyway are running both.

Sooo nerf axe damage and eviscerate and nerf 100 blades would be more correct if thats what some of you really want.

You know what would happen if they nerfed 100 blades and listened to some of this crazy suggestions? People would build for axe more than GS and still out dps your thief while still face tanking. Then you would have to come back and ask for a nerf to axe. This is just in reference to the whole nerf 100 blades its holding us back argument.

Thief is get in do good damage quickly get out.

You can’t face tank on a thief, if a thief could face tank better than a warrior then why bring a warrior? Then you would have better burst and since you could face tank better and almost as good sustained with pistol whips built in evasion. You wouldn’t need stealth anymore because well you could face tank, spec assassin’s reward for healing and signet of malice.

Your always going to have people that want the best class for a specific role. I am not saying warriors aren’t strong in PvE they are just good at what they do in PvE because stuff just doesn’t dodge roll or move.

Most people in the thief forums know that its weak in PvE, heck is weak in tPvP too. It shines in WvW.

As far as 100 blades I can’t see why people think that warrior’s wont get PvP buffs because 100 blades. People that PvP and WvW know that 100 blades is well not very good.

Look at confusion. Its weak in PvE right? Was weak in tPvP/sPvP and now they made it weaker in WvW while not even touching its damage at all in the PvE environment.

So if you apply that to 100 blades. Strong in PvE, weak in tPvP/sPvP because well people dodge and kiting a warrior isn’t hard. Buff warriors signets passives, give DoTE and dogged march.

Just from those 2 it seems that they try to take into consideration all aspects of the game and not just 1 mode holding another mode back.

XII.9401:

Nuorus.8415:

XII.9401:

Nuorus.8415:

Been warrior since headstart. Love it. Tried to make other classes lvl80, only succeeded on mesmer. Otherwice I just miss my warrior and change back. In WvW I find warrior the best class. After the patch either I have only faced bad guardians/eles/mesmers or the new traits are so freaking awesomely good I can take two d/d eles at the same time. I did loose to them cuz they got me on downed stage while I tried to finish them. In tPvP I had most score and overall enemy teams seems just to rage quit. I killed almost everything there. Had still hard time againts beastmaster Rangers. Axe/shield + Longbow on PvE/tPvP/WvW. Disclipine trait line seems to like axes

Overall I feel stronger in tPvP and WvW now. Specially in WvW. We still lack dirty tricks :P

Sigh..another person who thinks if they can beat bad players then they are A-ok. Have fun in high end competitive tourneys since you won’t even get a team that doesn’t want to carry you.

Sigh… maybe you should try to read again what I wrote and don’t mix your imagination to it. If you can’t do that I can tell how you just failed big time.

Edit: Also I readed your other post where you whined about condi mesmer. If you go WvW you can use food to make condis to become useless. In PvP it’s still hard to kill those sneaky … mesmers

I like how you use the word ‘fail’ in your replies. Do you also use terms such as learn to play etc?.

How can you make confusion useless when it pops immediately when you attack? I fail to see your logic. Condition duration won’t help you much against a mesmer if they burst it on you well timed.
Check the mesmer forums. They are reporting they are still one-2 shotting people with confusion post nerf. Don’t tell me that you as PVE warrior -judging from your posts- know better than the players playing their own class in pvp or wvw?

Judging from your posts you love to PVE which is cute and all but we are talking about going against other classes.

As I said,you did not run into good players. Give me your name and I will meet up with you in an Arena with a good mesmer, engy, ranger or thief and frap it. I’d love to see how well you do.

I’m sorry but if you are happy as a PVE warrior that is cute and all but the rest of us want a fighting change against other classes played by good players.

There is nothing wrong with loving the class and playing it but you shouldn’t assume it is in good standing with other classes.

Huh? I have a mesmer and I am still running confusion in WvW its still good but its not 1-2 shotting people. Its a 50% nerf to the damage its alot no way to get around it. You can still run glamour and spec Im at 123% duration for condition with scepter/torch but you arent 1-2 shotting people unless they are some glass with low HP pool spamming grenades (see engi)

Also the nerf to blinding befuddlement is a big hit to chaos shield. Confusion still works but it definitely isn’t 1-2 shotting people. You would have to hit scepter 3 all stacks drop your glamours and they have to run in and out of it.

8 stacks of confusion at 1500 condition damage is 1420 damage per skill use with this nerf. Thats less than my warriors axe auto attack.

What you see in the mesmer forums are people still realizing you can kill people with confusion just not as fast like before i.e. 1-2 shotting as you put it.