Guild Wars 2

If you have an argument to make as to why thief actually is not destroyed you are allowed to post. But make a good argument. Do not give me some “omg insane crit” BS I know all that also spare me all your +1 spvp BS, spvp is a hopless game mode and thieves are just a liability there, also spare me all that venom share BS.

Stop derailing my thread, this is the NOT thread, if you want to “appreciate” post in an appropriate thread.

In my oppinion this pofession got destroyed and daredevil does not change anything about that. I want to know if there are people who think about this the same way as I do.

This is what this threadis about. So stop posting off topic.

Concerning this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Karl-McLain-Appreciation-Thread

This is the not thread, zero appreciation here.

Thief got totally messed up, everything that worked and was fun was either totally destroyed or removed, mindlessly stacking damage multipliers is all that is left.

Daredevil is just a weaker form of stuff we had and that got removed, it is the stupid attempt to introduce warrior like gameplay for thieves, this will not work and get you killed faster than you will “appreciate”.

Mindless AoE damage everywhere, utilities that are basically the same as certain weapon skills, zero appreciation here.

Do not get me started on a healing skill that makes you unable to move.

No access to resistance, still no access to stability….

Appreciation level sub-zero.

It also means aoe dmg on dodge, every white critter or clone or pet hit is going to reveal you, no dodging in stealth….

Turn on your brain you just got Karled.

Nivik.2961:

@Zero Day HOLY PATRONIZING…..I’m not even mad, that’s just impressive haha

yeah man, I know the Acro nerfs hurt. From where im standing, this Elite spec is an honest attempt at getting the thief to where we want it. Im excited and I dont think its right that people are getting so negative about it when it hasn’t even been released. That’s all.

What a pathetic failure at guerilla marketing…

The only one looking bad is a certain dev, who I am not going to name.

Anyway arguing is pointless.

Thers is some sort of bug where you deal more damage, it happens on other proffessions aswell and it also happens in PvE and WvW.

Either the game fails to check armor or messes up with multipliers or does not clear temporary stat increases correctly so those addup (25 stack of might on top of those from last time etc.).

Personally I think it is the last option seeing that in wvw effects persist on occasion even after they timed out (but who knows).

Ascended (purple) equipment is the best tier in this game, you can get the rings etc. with laurels at the vendor weapons, armor and backback need to be crafted. Both has a very low drop chance from chests and bags.

There are only 2 places you would need that over exotic (orange) equipment currently n the game those are wvw roaming and high level fractals. Everywhere else exotic gear will do. You do not need to optimize the equipment except for those 2 sections of the game. However in wvw roaming you will need the best gear you can have if you really want to stand a chance. If you do fractals you will aquire the necessary stuff while progressing here.

If you want to go for ascended gear get the rings etc 1st, then craft the weapons, then aquire the armor bit by bit.

Currently the only kind of gear that really works for thief is berzerker and valkyrie gear (valkyrie is there to get you some more hp so you mix both). Weapons should be berzerker.

Double fire sigil on the bow….

Rage sigil on the dagger….

Sigils of the same kind do not benefit eachother, quickness reduces the leap on heatseeker (known bug since forever).

Blinding powder used while revealed and nobody near to blind…

Fights miles away from any objective, 3v1 chase and your team fails to cap anything….

Quality game play and really knowledgeable stuff all around, thieves are fine….

Darn…

I could go on forever (sigh). But I would get banned again….

I am having a blast with this http://dulfy.net/gw2traits#build=AgMF_AKsA9g~ in spvp and wvw, sw/t and sc/f focusing on pull and f3 interrupts.

When there are few projectiles to be expected I switch in blinding dissipation over evasive mirror, spvp I use a rampager amulet, speed runes, and fire energy sigils. Same runes in wvw but with a suboptimal mix of sinister celestial and other stuff.

Melting faces is the name of this build. It is everything thieves should be…

Simple awnser to a simple question:

To guys named Karl and Josh did, they also thought thatburning as it is would be cool ’cause condi guadian you know…

I experince serious pathing issues in LA especially in the JP.

Pathing errors seem to accumulate the longer I stay in the JP and general performance drops, this leads to occurences of the “instant death phenomenon” if I log out and restart the client inside the JP I enter LA at random spots and not where I was when I logged out at times I end up in the water under the map.

The issue seems to get worse the longer I stay logged in.

The JP is unplayabe for me now.

Regarding SPvP: This will not last, Guardians and Warriors die, they will nerf mesmers into the ground, it has already started.

Regarding WvW: Same as above.

Mesmers have builds other then all out shatter and viable strategies other than pop everything on the opener and then hope that some guardin can ress you now, this will not last enjoy it while you can you got another week at best.

+ 10000 to this, and I am a main thief.

The changes are really well designed, traits interact a lot and support eachother, all the broken and annoying stufff that needed workarounds got removed. Awesome.

Now, please Sir, get a baseball bat and move over to Karl knock him out and take over responsibility for thieves…

Something positve:

f2 changes and changes to traps are really nice less fighting against my own skills and less workarounds for broken stuff.

The lock target marker at max. range option is really helpful.

The new LA is awesome.

In the spvp games I played the only instagibs I saw where by warriors and eles, I played those on a rampager mesmer and thieves where no big deal, certain warrior builds though…. (I saw a bunker guardian getting instagibbed by a warrior).

1. I prefer utility and being able to mess other people’s game up over raw damage so I like this a lot. 30303 with a mix of dire, sinister and bererker d/p and sb for me in wvw.

2. Actually it is rather good but you can not really trait into it. SA and Trickery are the best lines and you need to have those at the moment (at least with mainhand dagger) since thieves get all their much needed utility and defense there. Which leades to the question DA or Crit and that is decided by mug, mug is insanely strong and increases your overall healing by 30-40% and you need that healing to keep up with the other classes.

3. I accidentally tried acro ( since I did not realise that wvw got seperate template now). I like it, but the same point as with the crit line in 2. persists. I can see d/d working with 00333 though. I will try that some time.

4. I run a hybrid build now with about 500 condi damage (for poison obviously). I like dagger training a lot but mug is a must have, I like poison trap on healing a lot but mug is a must have, torment on interrupt sounds nice but it is in the same place as bountyful theft and that is among the best utility in the game and thief’s only way to get essential boons reliably. You see the problem I guess.

5. Improvisation, more utility is always more fun than a passive damage multiplier.

6. To trait those you would have to give up slight of hand who would even think about that. I used to run daggerstorm before the patch now with double interrupt on it in use bsilisk venom about 75% of the time.
Thief’s guild sucks even if traited the cd is way to long for what it does (just compare it to rampage…), basically 2 phantasms on a huge cd you can have those almost permanenty on a mesmer.

Generally thieves got really messed up when it comes to traits, there is nice ideas but due to the must haves to deal with the inherent weakness of the class (low armor hp and no access to the important boons) you can not really take those.

Nerfs everywhere, sold as buffs….

The only buffs thet happend happend to stuff that did not need those and was strong anyway and all the fun stuff got screwed over.

SB nerfed again, impossible to keep poison up for healing reduction with it now, 2 stacks of poison for 9 sec. compared to the burn spam and uptime in the game now was considered to strong, do not get me started on what I think about the skills and balance team…

Nobody wants sb 4 for damage it is needed for healing reduction.

Mesmer is good now, though. Untill they destroy them again (loads of nerfs already) because some 2 button warrior starts a qq fest.

Absolutely amazing, all the little details in the artwork and dialogs, the whole scenario and THE JP.

Stuff like this is the strong point of the game, this is what will make me buy the xpac if it is done in that spirit.

Again the JP is amazing I spent 6h straight on it and was having a blast.

Look at the vid this guy is right, basically what happened is they removed the clear on entry of stealth them count 3 sec and remove a condi, so if you do not trait into SA the stealth will drop before any condi removal and if you trait into SA yo will get 1 condi removed after 3 sec.

Again thanks for the buff skills and balance team, you are awesome, especially Karl and Josh.

You may consider this another thief buff, with it the skills and balance team shows it’s apprechiation of you playing this game and provides you with a reason to buy HoT.

This is the next step in thief buffs after the mug-hidden thief buff and the fun stealth buff event recently.

The buff was not posted because it would only cause non-thieves to qq over how overpowered thieves are.

All glory goes to the skills and balance team and our awesome Guardian overlord….

I totally disagree with the OP, nerfs everywhere while the stuff that is already strong against thieves on other proffessions got buffed.

The changes to poison will make it a lot harder to keep it up for healing reduction and now powerbuilds will lose significant damage on all the “hybrid-skills” like cluster bomb and death blossom etc.

Our falling damage reduction trait got moved from adept to grandmaster (all the other professions have it on master). This probably was totally op on an adept level…

Resilience of shadows, another nerf in context with the imunities and protection available to other professsions this is just a joke now, especially since they removed the “get might in stealth trait”, which it now replaces.

And do not get me started on the fact that engineers can have almost 50% uptime on revealed now. And it gets applied with no tell at all.

Buffs to the burning spam, haha….

And that is just the tip of the iceberg.

Good luck developing, ’cause you need it.

No need to think about 400 stacks of bleeds, 3-5 stacks of burning will have killed you already before the bleed stacks go past 10.

In group fights, against more then one opponent applying burning, burning is already a major factor, wait untill it stacks in intensity and you will be Bar-b-Q in seconds.

Also in conjunction with taunt this will be insane, condi on guards will be the thing, the dev said it..

00666 builds for thieves inc, else you will be dead. Have fun being a venom bot.

Karl McLain.5604:

apharma.3741:

Any idea on how much of a rework stolen bundles are getting?

In the 3 hour AMA when we got to thief there was mention of changes to the stolen items.

Can we expect the same items just rebalanced a bit to be more fair or are we talking almost completely different things in some cases?

Great question!

There will be a couple of changes to items stolen mainly from players (though these do exist in PvE as well). This is mostly out of necessity due to the changes with Improvisation and in how you’re able to use a stolen item multiple times. Some examples:
The necro fear skull is going from 3 seconds maximum, to 2 seconds maximum. The guardian mace daze will be reduced from 4 to 3 seconds for daze. The ranger’s Healing Seed will have a reduced duration (10s -> 5s), but pulse twice as fast (2s pulse -> 1s pulse).

Needless to say, it’s not the goal to remove viability of using a stolen item once. There’s just a few cases in which using the stolen bundle twice does just a little too much.

Thanks for the feedback and for keeping things civil, everyone.

-Karl

Trying to sell nerfs as buffs again! Selling fixes to broken stuff as buffs and breaking more stuff, being generally clueless “dagger training gives a 5% damage increase on poisoned targets now, we changed that from,,, I do not know… I think it required a condition to be persent… It is a buff anyway…”

How often have you reitroduced the hidden thief + mug buff, now 3 times?

Darn you people suck at marketing.

After 1 year of boycotting this gamemode I gave it another try. Let’s give them another chance I thought, it is bound to be better with a new map I thought, they can not mess it up more anyway I thought.

I was wrong, I am so out of spvp again, this absolutely no selling point for an xpac.

I decided to play 20 games on the new map, to say that I am disappointed is putting it politely.

The map is to open, especially the lord’s room. There is absolutely no meaningful interaction with the terrain, no cover, no y-axis etc.

The lord’s room and the supply depot are to small it is next to impossible to avoid aoe with positioning and movement when inside, proffessions with invunerabilities and heavy armor are baltantly at an advantage (but I will not start on proffession balance that is a dead horse since forever).

Getting shot through closed gates, pathing errors aplenty, players being obstructed in open areas, invalid pathing errors everywhere….

There are no Dead Ends, only missed opportunities:

Further down the road a Dead End:

One painful transformation into a panecake later:

And still way to go….

Some twists and bends later:

Follow me, how high can you get up?

Exclusive footage of places only the most crafty of thieves can get to, do you have abilities that compare to such legendary thieves as Slith and Nuth, wll you will need those to follow my footsteps in the silverwastes.

-Hey chief, look at that a comprehensive list of wanted criminals and information on their whereabouts on the internet.

-Really now? OMG Sergeant you are right, call SWAT we are going in NOW! let’s get those suckers.

Malediktus.3740:

Dawdler.8521:

Besides, doesnt everyone want to stop zerging?

Not really, I literally see 100s of people every day who enjoy zerging.

BrickFurious.7169:

For once I actually agree with everyone defending this. Do you think Alexander the Great would have complained about pin sniping? Seriously, this is war, war is dirty, and it’s definitely not cheating, so deal with it.

I am not sure how it was during the time of Alexander the Great, but there have been times in history where honor played a big role and you did not try to kill the commanders first. It was often frowned upon to kill the king of the opposing faction and often more or less just happened by mistake in the heat of the battle.
But I guess nowadays people find it ok to kill people with drones from thousands of km away, so I am not suprised people like this commander sniping tactics.

That’s total BS, honor in war is total fiction, usually imposed on historic events a long time after they happend.

The reason why the leaders usually do not get killed is because they stay away from the actual fighting. This is specifically stated in treatises on how to fight wars since the renaisance period when they describe what a commanders part in war is, and non of the roman sources on war ever mentions a leader fighting heroicly. Even in mediveal fictionous texts like the “nibelungen lied” or “the gral legend” the kings are usually not the people heroicly battling in melee.

So please stop making incorrect historic arguments to support your gaming preferences, stupidity is contagious and some poor kid might get infected.

Yeah, how dare they use their brains and take out high profile targets, commanders should be immortal.

Also any blue haired Charr guardian with a super spikey haircut should be immortal….

Also all super sparkling female norn guardians whose heavy plate armor protects about 0.1% of their body and especially not any vital parts should be immortal…

Who needs ranks and nameplates to figure out the enemy commander? I sure do not.

Leaps are affected by slow and cripple (distance halfed), no melee skill that is not teleported at you will hit you ever. 10s cd becomes potentially 20s with slow, while your cds will be halved. Mesmers will be insanely powerful in HoT. Sword/shield and scepter/focus and you will kite like a boss.

The effect will trigger normally but you will not gain stealth. This means that in the case of the trait triggering blinding powder (e.g. decent of shadows) you will still blind enemies close to you and get a blast finisher which might trigger combos but you will not turn invisible.

Focus

Because of the key shaped foci in the game, it would be awesome to run our signature set knive/focus as displayed in the proffession icon.

5 skill: combo field dark, size like pistol 5, up to 5 allies inside get reflection, applies weakness to up to 5 emenies upon entering, persits for 4 sec. Name: Point of Refuge. Initative cost: 5.

4 skill: create a duplicate of youself gain stealth for 3 sec, the duplicate uses your weapon set and has your hp at time of creation it attacks your target , only one duplicate may exist at any given time, initiative cost 5. The skill has a 2nd stage swap position with your duplicate and lose 1 condition, range 900, initiative cost 1. Name: Shadow Clone.

3 Dagger: Throw a dagger at your foe range 900, apply weakness and cripple and a marked status for 3 sec, initiative cost 3. 2nd stage pull the marked target to you range 900 in itiative cost 3. Only one target can be marked at any given time. This is a proectile finisher. Name: Shoge.

3 Sword: Thrust at your target and roll backwards for 600, if the skill hits pull your target with you and apply cripple and 5 stacks of vunerability. Initiative cost 4. Name: Controling Strike.

3 Pistol: Fire 2 full mantle projectiles at your target, for each condition present on the target those proectiles ignore 7% of your targets armor, inititive cost 5, the 2nd proectile removes a boon. These shots do not bounce, even if traited. The 1st shot is a projectile finisher. Name: Armor Piercing Rounds.

…

I would like to repeat myself here and shamelessly bump this thread:

Something is seriously wrong with status updates in this game now.

I just capped a wvw camp, I killed the guard and capped it and was stuck in combat and slowed (though no cripple Icon was displayed anymore) even after I capped the camp and new guards spwaned. I was not in combat with any critters. It took about 20 sec after the cap to get out of combat.

Say hello to total and utter dominance of nightcapping, once you get into the game you will always find all structures put to t3 by the 10 guys on the most perstistent nightcrew.

This is utter BS and shows again that the devs have no idea what is actually happening in their game. Metrics are all nice and shiny but you need competent people to interpret then and the again competent people to act on that interpretation. Guess what the key factor here is…

Post stealth fix patch impressions:

Still pathing issues, less of them though.

The load screen on destroy shadow trap is gone.

Enemy attack still follow me past dodges and hit after the dodge roll, this concerns projectiles and leaps.

I also still get the strange “slow” effects at random.

My ping is decent, but is was pre patch aswell.

And another one, I just failed to crit a backstab with Hidden Killer traited.

P.S.: This might be an instance of the status update problen described above, the log says I glanced the guard, however the weakness was not pressent on my screen it got removed by Shadows Embrace the UI displayed ths correctely but the effect of the condition remained.

Expanding the list:

No status updates after repairing broken gear, atm I use traveler runes, my gear broke after reparing the 6 piece bonus did not get reapplied to me.

P.S.: Dying again resolved the issue.

Apart from the stealth disaster….

Destroy shadow trap puts me on a 5-10sec loadscreen.

I got hit today by rapid fire from 10k range, I saw the ranger comming used destroy shadow trap and ate the full burst at 10k range.

Pathing is totally messed up, teleports fail more than they work especially shadow trap and shadow step, this means not “no vialble path fail” but sipply not working.

Random drastically increased skill cast times.

The “time” in game gets randomly “slowed” you can track that easily on your cds compared the seconds to a clock next to you screen.

Pathing errors, pathing errors and pathing errors, e.g. deathblosom moving you away from the target instead of close to it….

No viable path for teleports also I can clearly walk there without jumping.

Got from about 50% health to death with nothing in the log…

Lauren Kamieniecki.6245:

stone.6201:

When is about the fix for the Stealth Bug?
Thanks

A little delayed but getting there.

Soon™….

Lauren Kamieniecki.6245:

Mal.1670:

Lauren Kamieniecki.6245:

Well the fix looks pretty good so far, and we’re on track soooooooo…

“supa soon” is all I am going to say here. If it fails last minute please don’t poison my coffee… I need it for life ._.

Don’t get too comfortable, poisoning is what thieves do best

nuuuuuu my coffee ._.

No need to worry, thief’s poision is midly intoxicating at best. You might actually find the effects exilerating and enhancing the flavor of your coffee.

OP is 99% on spot in my opinion. They probably accidentally patched in HoT test files, this change will go live for sure, leaving stealth will reveal you.

This will be horrible since other stealth users on your side will then be a huge risk, have fun getting reveald by your team mates…

What remains to be seen is if stacking will be possible or not atm you get reveald 3 sec after entering stealth no matter what, even inside SR.

We will have to play with this for a loooonnnnngg time, severly broken thief skills take a looonnnng time to fix, months, years even.

My guess is they patched in HoT test files accidentally and repeatedly….

To quote the dev: Thieves tend to QQ […] well QQ harder…

And also:

Certain people, like myself, want to play stealth centric builds, for a lot of players this is actually the whole reason to pick thieves in the first place.

Frankly if I wanted a toon who is able to go face to face in a melee and walk tall like she owns the place I would play warrior.

To the OP:

You can not “turtle” in stealth you will take full damage, other than s/d evades combined with acrobatics extra dodge thieves have no other defensive mechanism no “oh snap” buttons. Thieves can not turtle, you die in less than 2 sec if you do not evade stealth is just a distraction.

In regards of “promoting a more agressive play style” without drastic changes to passive survivability this will NEVER EVER work, especially in group settings, less HP less armor less damage than all other melee centric proffesions will show.
All the odds are against thieves in that regard.
Just look at the current s/d meta build you have to trait fully into defense to make that set work. Full acro full trickery and extra healing by mug, why, because an agressive thief build will kill you.

Josh Davis
Competitive Events Manager

I don’t think this is intended, but I’ll need to follow-up with the skills team in the morning to be sure. Either way, I started an email chain about this. Thanks for the reports.
aka Grouch

This got to be a joke.

Not only does this “bug” break several skills that stack stealth if used together like blasting blinding powder into a smoke field it also breaks non combo applications of stealth via shadow refuge. It breaks a freaking passive trait aswell (4sec stealth now reveals you).
Also Hidden Thief in conjuncture with Mug reveals again, you keep reitroducing this bug over and over again.

The whole stealth system just got broken and the answer we get is: We do not know if the skills team intended this, yet, we will discuss it with them.

WAY TO GO IN TERMS OF PROMOTING YOUR XPAC.

This guy was probably using some sort of “lag switch”, manipulating the data he sends to the server maybe even the time stamps on the data, this will “displace” him and will make skills behave in ways the should not. Basically he will not be where he is shown on your screen and out of sync with you and the server so your stuff will not happen if it concerns him and his stuff will happen in “weird” ways like several abilities firing at the same time. A good indication for this is if “weird” stuff happens with regularity at convenient times in regards to your interaction with him but the game behaves normal in regards to other interactions. Typically you can not hit him but the guy next to him.
Might not be a cheat but a connection problem so it is next to impossible to detect and verify.

I am using air and intelligence on d/p, intelligence and generosity on sb, intelligence and fire on the rare s/d adventures.

I hate rng so those guarantee’d crits are my favorite at the moment, I dropped bloodlust because I was worrying about my stacks to much, s/d is aoe spam anyway so I use fire there.