(edited by Dashingsteel.3410)
vanilla gw2 did not require powerups(updrafts, mushrooms, wallows) to reach places…… Those are extra hoops you have to go through to get around competently in the HoT maps. Going from updraft to another updraft is just a time waster when in vanilla gw2 you could be moving directly to your destination.
I know some people enjoy this stuff but unfortunately I don’t
@Vayne….. I agree that HoT is not a platformer. That is why I specifically said movement skill based game.
Op never mentioned HoT as being too difficult
He rather pointed out that it was more a chore than fun to play. He expressed dismay at HoT turning the game into a movement skill based game filled with powerups(mushrooms, updrafts, wallows, etc.) which are just extra hoops you have to go though to traverse the map as compared to vanilla gw2. He didn’t seem to enjoy the rat in a maze experience that HoT delivers.
This is not a “git gud” problem. This has to do with gaming style not difficulty.
of course MMO’s change…… Anet also dreams big…… sometimes too big… Sometimes they say things before they realize the work involved…..
So, unless they use the words “this is a promise” or “we absolutely guarantee this”
take with a grain of salt
Moral of the story…… Always take what Anet says with a grain of salt
I agree Vayne…….. My original post in this thread was calling out an often overused trope in these forums….. you know the one…… it goes something like this…… “People who don’t like HoT hang out on the forums and complain while people who enjoy HoT are too busy playing the game to make posts”
It is a squirrelly way to claim that the pro HoT faction has greater numbers….
This is why I made these posts. To call out the ridiculousness of claiming to know which side has the greater numbers….
My whole point was that there is not a majority view on either side. Nobody knows the numbers unless one has the telepathic ability to read everyone’s mind who has ever played HoT.
Game director leaves after HoT….. Massive patch in spring of 2016 to Hot in attempt to coax players back into HoT maps….. Mike O’Brien delivers a new mission statement assuring the community that gw2 is back on track…………. “We’ve learned our lesson from HoT”(cryptic statement from shareholders meeting)
I know what conclusions I draw.
See we both draw our own conclusions about “numbers” but it doesn’t prove anything.
The op enjoyed it and that is the crux of the thread.
@Sigfodr…… How is it that you made it to the forum?? I thought you would be busy enjoying the game.
The spurious claims as to the numbers that like/dislike HoT seem to never stop on this forum . Claiming to have “numbers” on your side is a weak argument. Nobody has the numbers(as it would be impossible to know).
Op, even though I dislike much of HoT I am glad that your experience was a positive one.
Tedious and annoying pretty much sum up my thoughts about HoT as well.
It’s always funny to hear people complain they want challenging content. Wouldn’t it be more challenging to let a non meta player join you???? hmmmm
dps litmus tests are just sad and content that requires those things is sad as well
Perhaps the title of your thread should have been "Has Anet remembered their customers who enjoyed the core game and didn’t like HoT?
There are very few things I like about HoT. I have talked to other players who consider themselves casual that do like HoT.
There are so many issues you need to be specific…. for example
- concern that Anet is turning the game into a movement skill game a la Nintendo(memorization and map puzzles instead of clearly defined routes, powerups to reach certain platforms, introducing adventures)
- turning guild halls into cynical gold sinks playing the game in general no longer helps the guild
- repackaging core content and putting it behind paywall(guild boons and fractal rewards)
- increasing the importance of jumping puzzles(making them requirements for collections, skins etc.)
If you don’t specify what you want, everyone is going to draw their own conclusion.
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So you’re saying nobody can pinpoint exactly what casual is? This vagueness is exactly why I am complaining about this thread. How are the developers supposed to remember the casuals when they don’t know exactly which combined reponses are "TRUE"casual and other responses are not.
Give the developers specifics to address.
Perhaps Anet has remembered the casuals…….. but unfortunately they remembered their version of casuals and not the ops version…… After all, there seems to be at least 5 different definitions on this thread.
I did and there are a multitude of differing opinions on the subject. This serves to muddy the waters on what a casual actually is…… So how the heck are developers supposed to know
already been through it???? What did everyone decide the definition of casual is?
This thread is still a jumbled mess because everyone has their own definition of the word casual.
OP, could you please give specific things that the developers need to do to “remember the casuals”
This request is just too vague.
This trend towards a movement skill based game is what turns me off. Most of these skills(bouncing mushrooms, updrafts, mount skills, etc.) are necessary to reach platforms or vertical levels of maps. I don’t care for the Nintendo creep in the game.
In my opinion, the pinnacle of this game was during season 1 with the Marionette events and defend Lion’s Arch events………. This is the type of thing I am looking for from gw2.
How the hell is Anet supposed to remember the casuals when nobody really knows what casual actually means?
Again, this thread is useless because everyone seems to have a different meaning assigned to the word casual.
Op….. Please provide specific points as to what the developers need to remember!!!
HoT is a success story. It has succeeded in dividing the community.
Some people love it and some people hate it…. Does anyone truly have the numbers on either side? Is there an official record???
Because of this division, I think Anet is going to be kitten ed if they do and kitten ed if they don’t going forward…… and that applies for either side
I already see posts claiming PoF has abandoned HoT while I also have seen other posts claiming it is too much like HoT……… kitten ed if they do kitten ed if they don’t
This thread is not very helpful because the term casual is too broad. Everyone seems to have their own definition. Perhaps if op could bulletpoint what it is that the developers need to remember that would be helpful.
I ran warrior with greatsword/rifle and didn’t use the food buffs provided and made it through all the encounters. Just remember not to stand in one place too long. If your health is down past 50 percent run around until you can heal. Use ranged attacks while moving.
Now, if all the adds instantly focused on you and ignored the npc’s that would be an ai issue….. if that’s the case I would suggest trying the encounter again and see what happens this time.
@Illconceived When I talk about leveling your character I am meaning to its utmost power, I am including fully unlocked elite spec. I already mentioned it up above in another post but didn’t fully explain again in the entry that you posted.
In original gw2 there was no specific content needed to level your character to its most powerful fully unlocked state. Skill points weren’t necessary because of the skill point received everytime you leveled past 80.
If Anet would have 2 experience bars one for masteries and one general experience bar, it would be nice to receive a hero point everytime you lvl past 80 on the general experience bar to encourage player freedom………… I know this will never happen. This is how the game used to be.
I am aware this would take longer to fully complete your elite spec than just doing the hero points but it would be a nice extra to have.
Mastery system just eliminate the mastery points and allow experience to fill the bars to get the mastery would also allow for more player freedom.
These solutions would make the game harken more to its at launch state. I know it won’t happen but I think a lot of players would welcome those kind of changes.
@LimeSamurai …….. If you have played this game from launch in 2012, you would know that the leveling system has absolutely changed. The NPE added level gates to character leveling. The change from skill points to hero points and the loss of a skill point each time you leveled was a huge change.
These changes killed the play as you want aspect that was present at gw2 launch. Once again, before anyone chimes in I am not referring to Anet’s statement. I am just observing how the game was at launch compared to the game now.
(edited by Dashingsteel.3410)
I am not having trouble. I have many elite specs maxed out. That is not the point of this discussion. The point is that with at launch gw2 experience was all that was needed to max out your character. There was no specific content you had to do besides the intro scenario when you first make your character.
In current gw2 if you want to max out your character you are forced to do specific content. That is all I am pointing out.
Many people liked how gw2 at launch gave the players ultimate freedom to max out. I also get that many people like to be given “chores” to do….. With the NPE and later HoT, the players that like “chores” seem to be the ones Anet catered to.
My comments have nothing to do with Arena Net’s “play as you want” statement
My points are comparing gw2 at launch gameplay as compared to gw2 today. At launch, the player had a choice of how to level their character and today not so much.
To empower player freedom with the mastery system all that needs to be done is the elimination of mastery points and allow experience to fill the mastery bars to achieve the mastery.
Nope the NPE restricted where you could go and what you could achieve based on your current level.
so you are telling me without touching a single hero challenge you can get a fully developed tempest, berserker, etc…. ???
No that is not right. In the at launch game, you could fully develop your character to the most powerful levels without doing mandatory content. The player chose where and how to gain experience which was all that was needed back in the original gw2 game.
Now to get your character to the most powerful levels you HAVE to do mandatory content.
At launch, in 2012 the game was pretty much play as you want. Even the skill point challenges weren’t necessary as you would gain a skill point each time you leveled.
In 2014 the NPE launched and player freedom was diminished
Hero point challenges supplanted skill challenges…. leveling no longer gave you skill points and player freedom was further limited
2016 Hot was launched with the mastery system launched with arbitrarily assigned mastery points and player freedom was limited even more.
It is not that the genre isn’t for us. It is that Anet has diverted from the game that many players really enjoyed.
I think the op is referring to groups doing endgame activities wanting the group members to be on discord etc……. Instead of relying on typing in the chat box.
HoT has been successful in dividing the gw2 community. Some people love it and some people hate it. Gating content has garnered its fair share of complaints. I agree with many of your observations.
The game has been taken over by Nintendo geeks
The game is more and more about movement skills and gimmicks. Just look at how mounts are to be utilized in the upcoming expansion. The vertical maps have much more appeal to gamers who like platformers. Jumping puzzles, once considered an “extra” to be enjoyed are now becoming requirements.
Just look at the living story. Some of the boss fights are actually not fights. They are puzzles. The whole “fight” is figuring out the gimmick that will allow you to damage the boss. Once you have figured out the gimmick the actual fight is extremely lackluster.
Not a fan of these trends
Pro -Gorgeous artwork
new elite specs(more playstyles)
Con – 5 huge maps (must be some more HoTstyle multitiered minimap disasters)
– as someone mentioned above, the word puzzle was mentioned too many times
– mounts behind mastery system
@Illconceived ….. Please don’t cherry pick what the thread is about. If you will read the entirety of the Op’s 1st post he is complaining about the 2 ticket price being a cash grab. My posts addresses this portion of the ops complaint.
@Jack…. I agree… Season 1 events were great…. Easily the most enjoyable time I’ve had in gw2.
Anet is not a monopoly…… There are plenty of other games to play….
Sheesh!! all these new platforming requirements are making me a little jumpy about the future of the game.
I hear some players are hopping mad about them.
The only effective way to protest price markups is to not buy from the company.
@Pifil… Actually they didn’t deliver what they advertised as legendary journies has been scrapped for something less complex….. They also didn’t deliver on the regular intervals advertisement as the legendary weapons were delayed indefinitely for a time…… I do remember them saying that the next expansion wouldn’t hamper HoT ……. but again that was false because they wouldn’t have been “Stretched too thin” if they didn’t have 70 employees working on the next expansion
@ProtoGunner….. This may seem ridiculous to you but what if in the next expansion they decide to infinitely delay the feature that most interested you and while you sit there waiting for that feature you wanted Anet is busy working on yet another expansion while the feature you paid for gets ignored.
My posts are commenting on Anet’s moral compass…… your posts responding to me actually have nothing to do with the ops original post
I believe the op is right to question Anet’s moral compass when it comes to their business practices
I believe the company’s moral compass was questioned in the ops original post……. My entries are in regard to that…….. so I guess you are mistaken when you say that my posts have nothing to do with the topic creators post.
No conspiracy….. they pulled the legendary team off the project(that we had paid for) to help with living world while they had 70 extra employees working on a new expansion
They were put on hold because the team was pulled.
I am not wanting them to put the expansion on hold for the legendary weapons…. That ship has already sailed and Anet failed the test……. I just like to bring this up from time to time so nobody forgets how they operate. After all, they will be asking for pre-orders soon and I hope there aren’t anymore suckers like me out there.
I love it when customer complaints are characterized as whining. The fact is there were some very shifty business decisions made with HoT. People who paid FULL price for the core game but didn’t decide to buy HoT had core game features stripped from them and put behind a paywall. That is some real gratitude for a customer who bought your product.
I guess now days your just supposed to let companies do whatever they want and say “May I have more please?”
No thanks
No, the best solution would have been for Anet to pull people from the expansion team instead of the legendary weapons team back in early 2016. They didn’t do that. They already had our money.
What I want is some honesty in advertising. They hyped legendary journies and the set of 16 legendary weapons when they were trying to sell HoT. Once HoT comes out the legendary weapons get put on the back burner……. Why might you ask? because the staff was “stretched too thin”…….. Meanwhile while they are “stretched too thin” they have 70 employees working on a future expansion…… Instead of delivering on what they had sold(already had your money) they decided to delay doing that and work on something that they could sell you again……
Yeah, why bother delivering on what you advertised since only a few people care