Guild Wars 2

Can someone explain to me why any hard CC (Knockdown, Launch, Stun, Daze, Fear, Moa/Polymorph) over 1 second duration and/or no diminishing returns is acceptable? I can’t justify a CC higher than 1 second because at that point you aren’t interrupting a rotation, you are holding them down while they get beat senseless. Having shorter duration CCs, I would argue, requires more skill to use and always for more build diversity. The only two classes I can breathe with atm is scrapper and guard. Both have an absurd amount of stab/stunbreaks/evades. I can barely play my necro with all the CC being thrown out.

One thing I loved about GW2 SPVP at launch, coming from WoW PvP, was the shorter duration CCs. WoW’s 4+sec hard CCs have left a sour taste with long duration CC. HoT introduced more long duration CC and it is barely enjoyable at this point.

I expect the “git gud” trolls will love this thread.

I’ve been running frontline scrapper since the start of HoT in 15-60 man groups. Toss Elixir B has been enough stab to get me into the push and passive stab from scrapper did a decent job. I’ve been test the same thing with Holosmith and the photon forge 3 skill with trait does a decent job as well. Only thing I don’t like it being locked out of stab gen for too long after I suicide bomb or need to let heat go down. Try runing Toss Elixir B and if you plan on playing engi you should def get used to aiming the tosses.

From the 5/16/17 patch notes:
“Skills and traits that previously granted pulsing stability now grant a block of stability up front in order better allow for counterplay through boon removal.”

Skills that have pulsing stab:

• Engineer – Juggernaut trait || Elixir X elite skill
• Warrior – Eternal Champion trait || Balanced Stance utility || Rampage elite skill
• Necromancer – Infusing Terror shroud ability || Plague elite skill || Lich Form elite skill
• Ranger – Strength of the Pack elite skill
• Elementalist – Tornado elite skill
• Thief – Dagger Storm elite skill

Similar but diffferent:

• Revenant – Inspiring Reinforcement utility
• Guardian – Hallowed Ground utility
• Necromancer – Well of Power utility

Don’t make a statement as broad as the one used in the patch notes when the intention was to only affect balance in SPvP. The three pulsing stability skills nerfed were used in the top meta builds for SPvP which we all know took a massive population hit with the lack of change in season 6. These changes should have been “in PvP only” changes as such.

leviathan.2148:

OP, I agree with you but don’t hold your breath. Many people have suggested this and many other ways to fix gyro pathing/AI since the scrapper release and see how many changes they got.

Aye, it was sad watching Scrapper development from the start. I and others said that if these function like necromancer minions they will have limited uses due to pathing and survival. Re-raised those concerns after release for play test and still nothing. Absolutely unacceptable for class design to over look these issues.

The gyros need to be locked to the player character, and/or copy the boons from the player to the gyro when they are summoned. Gyros cannot follow you on uneven terrain and cannot keep up with you without swiftness. The healing gyro will obviously need to have the healing balanced if the gyros are allowed to lock to the player. Too many times I end up having to chase the stealth gyro to cover myself in WvW and SPvP which obviously doesn’t end well. Utilities need to be able to function, within reason, in all game modes.

Without fail the oasis causes map wide lag. Been the same kitten since HoT launch. Just turn it off and its guild weeklys till a fix is found.

You shouldn’t try to justify a imbalanced concept because something in game is more imbalanced. We already have long duration pets with the turrets. The Gyros should function as our group support utility. They just come short of that role due to their inability to lock to the scrapper and their lack of survivial. We should not have to rely on boons applied to the gyros for their survival when we aren’t able to give them the boons they need without RNG elixir boons.

So far I’ve only tested with a thief running Bountiful Theft but after the Dragonhunter F3 Aegis is stolen it doesn’t reapply after the interval. Even after popping the F3 and using renewed focus it did not refresh.

So far I’ve only tested with a thief running Bountiful Theft but after the Dragonhunter F3 Aegis is stolen it doesn’t reapply after the interval. Even after popping the F3 and using renewed focus it did not refresh.

Do you think waiting 3 months for this balance patch was acceptable?

I personally don’t believe so because the tweaks to the classes don’t look like 3 months worth of in-depth testing and balancing across PvE, PvP and SPvP.

I like amount of changes but I’d sacrifice a ton of changes for having balance tweaks every week until each class has a few viable builds in each gamemode, and bugfixes every week. Postpone the leagues, the WvW seasons, and the expansion. There should at least be a team for class balance and an entirely separate team for bug fixing that strive to release changes/fixes each week. Obviously don’t do all the classes at once but at least focus on one class each week and act on feedback

First, it needs to be made abundantly clear to ANet that these quarterly class balances are unacceptable.

Gyros unbuffed cannot keep up if the scrapper is going greater than base running speed.
Solution: When any gyro is summoned add an unremoveable buff that applies
speed equivalent to swiftness or superspeed. Also, allow gyros to cast while moving.

Gyros can have buffs applied to them currently. In a SPvP situation that feels too strong for something like Stronghold.
Solution: Make gyros immune to boons. Adjust base toughness and vitality. This
would require at least weekly tweaks till a nice range is found.

Shredder Gyro feels too niche.
Suggestion 1: Reduce gyro duration to 6 seconds and raise damage to be on the low
end of other damage wells. The whirling finishers in this game aren’t enough
compensate for the low damage.

Suggestion 2: Change the ability to a directional attack like Warrior GS 3. Increase
damage to low end of those abilities. Have it make at least two passes in the
designated area before self-destructing.

The dragon maw nerf is good, but how could you over look the Hunter’s Ward on Longbow? It is literally the same effect FIVES TIMES. If stability were to return to its former glory sure, leave Hunter’s Ward as is. At the very least have the duration of the effects reduce with more targets.

Some fight guilds from T1 moved to YB. Word was they wanted to start up a six server rotation. Here is when they moved http://mos.millenium.org/na/matchups/history/299 . TC was the weakest link so they fell.

Honestly don’t see how the six server idea would have worked without the top 6 servers having relatively even timezone coverage. There’s just not enough players populating those servers and pushing hard on points.

20 minute cooldown is too low for this type of tactic. A minimum CD of 30 minutes would be acceptable. Honestly ANet, play your own game. All modes of your game. There is no way this was thoroughly play tested.

If you want a prime example of why it is not balanced come to T1 EBG while JQ is in control of SMC. Hardened Gates, Iron Guards, Chilling Fog, Dragon Banner, and Airship Defense combined with superior siege. What amazes me is that you can have all of that on a paper SMC. The balance logic there boggles the mind.

You’re talking one aspect of WvW. Roaming took a hit from HoT balance patch. Zergs got kittened by the HoT balance patch and stab changes. Objective claimers got kittened by the guild hall system and auto upgrades.

Video

I don’t know if this was the invulnerable bug that was supposedly fixed in the patch today but while SMC was reinforced the two noninteractive walls were taken down. The wall that was damaged in the video was noninteractive while SMC was reinforced.

In the HoT Annoucement Trailer we see a better version of Rocket Charge that is much more fluid. Why was this version replaced with the clunky version we have now?

The CoR change is a step in the right direction but the primary issue is still the damage, which was not addressed. I can still hit 5 people in WvW for 8k+ every 2 seconds with negligible cost. They need to adjust the damage coefficients to something like (1.25/1.50/1.75) instead of (1.25/1.75/2.25) for the 1st/2nd/3rd cascades respectively. The CDs on hammer need to be adjusted because even with that damage nerf it is effectively a necro well every 2 seconds so increasing hammer CDs to x/8/12/15/20+ for skills 1/2/3/4/5 respectively, would further balance it. Contributing to the hammer’s absurdly high AoE pressure are the herald facets and numerous percent damage increases that can all be ran in a single build example. Yes, the example is a glass cannon but because of the Hardening Persistence trait, Infuse Light, protection uptime, Shiro legend and evades/blocks from this build I can do some stupid things that a glass Ele or Necro wouldn’t dare do.

Glint legend facets also need to be looked into to address the damage. 2 revs running the example can stack permanent 25 might, fury and swiftness. Facet cooldowns and durations allow for revs to keep facet of strength on while dishing out max damage and using facet of nature on CD while in combat keep the other boons active.

I don’t know how anyone could justify locking down a player in PvP for more than 1 second. Hard CCs should be used to interrupt rotations not pin them down while you spank them to death.

With the breakbar changes in PvE the longer durations are nice but if that is going to be the case, split the durations in PvP vs PvE or give more classes access to 5+ stacks of stability.

It concerns me that there is an increase in hard CC availability and durations for most classes after HoT release. I played WoW for 10 years and I grew to loathe the hard CC durations. I’m sure the increase in availability and durations are partly due to the break bar system but you should stop and consider now whether or not you want to go down the path WoW did where a big part of the meta is locking a player down for most of the fight. IMO that isn’t fun gameplay but to each their own.

Looks like Rapid Regeneration is bugged? Before the Nov 17 patch I got the heal from swiftness and quickness but not it is only one at a time. With quickness heal having priority.

Don’t forget Defiant Stance for Warrior. It is the exact same as Infuse Light.

Is it just me or is there no way other than an SPvP track to farm the Heavy Supply Bags required for this upgrade? The wiki says you could get them from the Alpine Borderland centaurs which are no longer available.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vdQQFASlUUhqrYnXw+KQ7FLTGF9cX37t4zUABw46VBRAA-TVCEABJcABcS50WKBZSJjiq/0mOCAeQAPcBAiZ/BSBwkyI-w

I commanded with this during the last beta weekend. Scrapper is more than capable in the frontline. You just have to know how to position yourself.

Even after change Healing gyro doesn’t keep up. It honestly feels like it is a bit slower. Haven’t gotten the others unlocked but I’m willing to bet they are the same speed.

ANet, WvW is about coverage, sure NA servers means most of the players are in NA but for WvW we’ve needed round the clock coverage. Upper tier servers would recruit all the SEA/OCX they could find. The current reset time allows NA, SEA, and OCX to work together during a reset. The new proposed time is only convenient for NA and EU players. A time in the morning for NA, say 2pm UTC (making 1pm UTC reset during daylight saving) would allow NA, EU, SEA and OCX to work together on reset. For perspective I’m central NA. I know a lot of NA don’t fancy the idea of morning reset but lets face it. ANet wants reset moved to sometime during the weekend. Better it be at a time where the four timezones can work together on reset rather than fight at half strength.

John Corpening.9847:

Hello All,

There are a couple of reasons for the change to reset time. One is for the overall quality of the game. The last few years we have been careful to not disrupt the WvW reset time but this has at times made it difficult for our team to address issues during reset day. This change will give our team an extra day of the week that they can use to respond to issues that may occur with WvW or any other area of the game if it is necessary. In the early days we wanted reset to be during a weekday to ensure we had people available to monitor the game at reset time, but at this point we have seen the ongoing stability of World vs. World and resetting on a weekday is no longer necessary.

Another reason is the emergent gameplay that has come from reset. It has become one of the most exciting times for WvW and we would really love for more players to have the opportunity to experience it. We have many more players logging in on Saturday than on Friday which means with this change many more people will be available to experience the rush of claiming objectives for their world during reset.

However, given the concerns posted here we will be moving the Saturday reset to earlier in the day to give most players the majority of the day to enjoy the start of the new match. Immediately after launch the new time will be 11am PDT / 2pm EDT (6 pm UTC) for NA and 11am BST / 12 pm CEST (10 am UTC) for EU. Keep in mind that the following week with the end of Daylight Savings Time / Summer Time the reset times will be pushed even earlier to 10am PST/ 1pm EST and 10am GMT / 11am CET.

Thank you for your feedback. We realize that no time we pick is going to work for everyone but this change is going to benefit even more players overall while at the same time giving us a little more breathing room to improve the quality of the game during the week.

Thanks,
John

Since WvW is as stable as you say and you want to move the reset time to a weekend time slot, why not allow the WvW community to vote on a new time slot?

If you are going to change reset why pick Saturday? I’ve seen a lot of justification about the match being pretty much set for the week by the end of the weekend. If you are trying to mitigate that why not pick Wednesday for reset? That puts the weekend in the middle of the reset cycle and should be more than fair for servers to gain ground before the end of cycle.

Irenio CalmonHuang.2048:

• Several Gyros received increased movement speeds to help keep them close to you as you move and some skill changes to make them more effective at their jobs, like increased range on their abilities.

Care to elaborate on the exact changes to each gyro? Seems silly to just make a general statement like that when the other change posts went into detail about the changes.

Here’s hoping medic gyro can cast while moving now.

Changing the way facets tick for Share Empowerment will just get it nerfed. Currently, with Facet of Nature, Facet of Strength and a rune set like Strength you get 12 stacks of permanent might. Just increase the ICD to 3 seconds and call it a day.

archmagus.7249:

Sarmach.1547:

archmagus.7249:

Isn’t reconstruction field a stun break? It’s got no cast time. Just like bulwark gyro, purge gyro, and medic gyro.

It is not. Next time pull up gw2skills.net or some other build editor if you’re unsure about an ability/trait.

gw2skills.net has a few inaccuracies (not counting the ethereal combo fiend generated by streamlined kits from the mortar kit, having ascended giver’s equipment) and it’s not uncommon for them to leave something out of a description in game, especially in a beta event like this. You can use reconstruction field, bulwark gyro, purge gyro, and medic gyro while stunned, because they have no activation time. Look at the wiki’s page on stun https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stun.

Granted on the inaccuracies but the comment was about them being stunbreaks NOT them be able to be used while stunned.

Think they should split the ability into a 3 chain attack. Click 3 times for the full leap distance with cooldowns being 4/8/12 seconds. Damage is fine imo because it is more for utility and damage is just icing on the cake.

lorddarkflare.9186:

Basaltface.2786:

Well of course it would be nice to get this mess fixed… but we got a 3 year record that shows that drastic fixes like this are something engineers never got. Im fully aware that this is pessimistic but just look at the class. We just now got the magnet fixed and it still doesnt work proper. Look at the turrets… how long where the hitboxes broken? Kit visuals? How long? 2,5 years to get the backpieces away and still are not up to par with other classes in visual eyecandy…not even if they add an entire kit, look at the mortar and tell me this looks good. Bomb kit restoration? How long did that need and it “only” was in numbers not mechanics? And so…soooo much more. To re-work an entire mechanic before HoT hits? This is certainly out of question…not with the “dedication” a-net got if it comes to engineer issues…if it would be roy with the revenant my look at things would be completely different cause he and his team actually work extremely fast on the class and it went from a zero to hero in a rather short period of time…just compare beta weekend 1 and weekend 2 and 3, that was a 180 if i ever saw it.

Of course it would be amazing to get something like glenndevis suggested… id embrace this without any complains like most of the already suggested mechanic re-works cause this is actually awesome and cool…but like i said.. im very pessimistic at this point. Ireno and his team also got the druid…and even if it got its kinks its certainly the spec that got more attention in development then we here…so yea.

I dont want to be the pessimist here.. specially not with engineer beeing my favourite class… but the odds are against us here… Made myself sad now

I think it is more productive to improve the current vision that A-Net has for the class rather than redesign it from scratch.

It is MUCH too late for such complex mechanic changes. Even with all the feedback that suggests that this is exactly what they should consider.

Expecting drastic changes is setting yourself up for disappointment.

With you on this one. Though they should start working on a mechanic change now for a later overhaul.

In the short term:
- Lock gyros to player character
- Copy boons from player to gyros
- Give them a base toughness, vitality and maybe make them uncritable.

In the long term:
- Overhaul class mechanic to utilize a fuel system with gyros
- In light of class mechanic overhaul, remove function gyro

archmagus.7249:

Isn’t reconstruction field a stun break? It’s got no cast time. Just like bulwark gyro, purge gyro, and medic gyro.

It is not. Next time pull up gw2skills.net or some other build editor if you’re unsure about an ability/trait.

I expected this to be similar to the necromancer’s well of suffering and it met expectations. The stun locks them down enough to get some ticks before they inevitably hop out. I think the range is a bit too far though for a ranged skill on a melee weapon on a jack of all trades class. I’d expect to see it drop to 900 range or even 600 range. If we do get a stun duration increased I’d also expect a 10-20% damage nerf to follow.

Demented Yak.6105:

Sarmach.1547:

Demented Yak.6105:

How the kitten do you get a 10k hit with hammer?

I want to do that!

Go to my post history, in the thread about the hammer in WvW I posted the WvW build and the SPvP build I ran.

Oh. WvW. I thought you were being serious.

I love how people in this forum seem to be 70% SPvP and want the revenant balanced around that. Combat in this game should be balanced around PvE and PvP (which includes SPvP and WvW whether you like it or not). Is it not ridiculous to allow imbalance in one third of the game just because it works in the other two thirds?

Demented Yak.6105:

How the kitten do you get a 10k hit with hammer?

I want to do that!

Go to my post history, in the thread about the hammer in WvW I posted the WvW build and the SPvP build I ran.

nacario.9417:

Kungi.3645:

Revenant is way too op atm..If you think its normal to just run around and 1 shot ppl then your not an true player. End of story.

But thats the point of beta test,we can all hope devs will see it and adjust it.
Otherwise Gw2 will be P2W game and im not gonna waste my time and money on that kind of game.

Rev nor any class cant one shot. Judging by that comment and ur posting history it’s hard to give you any credibility. And here I am weeding you out

I want to see most of the classes shake off a third cascade from the hammer for 10k damage. Loved opening with hammer 2 spam on team fights this weekend and watching the downs pile up.

The hammer skills 2-3 are high reward at low cost.

ANet won’t truly get the message though till launch. Will be comping 1-2 glass revenants into each backline group in WVW. I’d like to see the kitten storm it causes to finally get ANet to balance this kitten.

Solori.6025:

Sorry—
You’re basing you complaint on a skill that -

Can be side stepped to miss-
Easily evadable because it’s slow
Needs to be used in a situation where the other player is oblivious ( 3v3 +)
Has to be at max ranged to fill it’s damage potential OR have the person back into the 2 and 3 hit’s sweet spot.

And your evidence of why this skill is too powerful is-
Zerg combat in WvW where buffs from different players and the world can effect your overal DPS
On random people who may be upleveled
On people who are also debuffed with vuln because Zerg.

You want a skill balanced because in a zerg-getting buffs-with guard stacks
It hits hard?
With a blatantly obvious red line traveling towards you?
That is completely shut down when the weapon is pushed in melee range
On a build that is completely shut down by any meta cele or condi

……….
Can we nerf swiftness too, I think the zerg has too much access to it and it makes traveling around the map too powerful

Let us not forget that ideally (I hope) ANet wants to balances skills across PvE and PvP (Which is both SPvP and WvW). It is absurd to allow an imbalance in one area of the game just because it works in other areas of the game.

Addressing from the top:

Can be side stepped to miss-
Easily evadable because it’s slow
Needs to be used in a situation where the other player is oblivious ( 3v3 +)
Has to be at max ranged to fill it’s damage potential OR have the person back into the 2 and 3 hit’s sweet spot.

Point 1, 2, and 3 – Granted, but you must be fully aware of the revenant(s) during a fight. As more players are factored in the possibility to side step/evade lowers.

Point 4 – The second cascade still hits for 4k-6k on a 2 second cooldown. Definitely not something to scoff at.

Solori.6025:

You want a skill balanced because in a zerg-getting buffs-with guard stacks
It hits hard?
With a blatantly obvious red line traveling towards you?
That is completely shut down when the weapon is pushed in melee range
On a build that is completely shut down by any meta cele or condi

Point 4 – The revenant is dishing out 1-5, 7k-12k, crits every 2 seconds till all the enemy dies or the revenant dies. I’d like to see any buffed up zerg classes try to even get close to that.

Point 5 – See points 1-3

Point 6 – Then you pull out that oh so balanced sword 3. No revenant with a brain will run hammer in melee if they have a better option on the weapon swap.

Point 7 – Granted, in a 1v1 situation it will falter against cele and get trashed by heavy condition builds. In any group situation, be it SPvP/PvE/WvW, you can rely on your team to keep the condition pressure to a minimum while you provide the devastating muscle.

Moving the stability from the Thrown Elixir B to the utility Elixir B seems like it would be a reasonable compromise. The thrown elixir is either bugged or the tooltip is wrong but it is giving 5 stability stacks instead of 3. I would prefer the former if it is moved to the utility but if it was intended to be 3 stability stacks then so be it. Just move the stability to the utility.

Misguided.5139:

Sarmach.1547:

Misguided.5139:

Honestly not sure what we are supposed to see. The frame rate makes it tough.

According to the wiki, Engineer Rocket charge hits the same number of enemies for more damage on a shorter cooldown. Have you complained about that one?

That is why I have the combat log open for everyone to confirm what they see. Watch on HD and pause to see the exact numbers.

As for Engineer rocket charge. It doesn’t increase damage with distance and hits as hard as the first cascade from hammer 2. That isn’t a substantial amount of damage. The third cascade is what is doing stupid amounts of damage.

No, the numbers on the wiki (which could be wrong, of course) say it does more damage than the second hit.

I main Engineer and ran frontline solider scrapper this weekend and can tell you it is the total damage split into 3 hits (which each hit for about the amount of CoR first cascade) on a 10 second cooldown. Also look at Gw2skills.net and the dulfy livestream notes to confirm what I wrote.

Synosius.9876:

have you nvr been hit with a 10k dragon tooth or 6.8k meteor shower tics? zerk necro wells pulse at 4k and death shroud AA 6k also pierces.

rev dmg seems on par with the rest of the crap flying around in wvw. this vid is not rly the rev dmg, your running in a group catching all kinds of might and class buffs then the execute trait adding on 20% dmg to targets under half hp. those big crits were probably on up lvls too.

Coalescence of Ruin: 5 energy, long range, on a 2 second cooldown, short animation that is on the ground and bound to the ground (cannot be reflected).

Dragon Tooth: blatantly obvious animation.

Meteor Shower: Granted it can be hard to see mid fight so I will give you that, but an elementalist cannot drop a meteor shower every 2 seconds (meteor shower CD is 30 seconds untraited).

Necro Wells: Same as Meteor Shower, you don’t see necromancers dropping those high damage wells every 2 seconds.

Death Shroud AA: Can be reflected. If you’ve been in a T1 WvW fight you should know the amount of reflections up makes it hard to actually land those DS AAs.

Uplevels: I ran this in EOTM and I was getting 15k-18k crits on uplevels. In testing I hit 80s for no more than 12k.

ronpierce.2760:

This is why no one takes WvW serious. You guys love your buffs and stuff, but it’s impossible to balance. I’d be furious if anything got nerfed over WvW, frankly…

Granted, I can still take this into SPvP and hit for about the same on hammer. Comboing the hammer damage with that of sword/axe I just dish out a ton of direct damage with little cost on short cooldowns. As with all the other revenant builds I still get trashed by heavy condition builds.

Misguided.5139:

Honestly not sure what we are supposed to see. The frame rate makes it tough.

According to the wiki, Engineer Rocket charge hits the same number of enemies for more damage on a shorter cooldown. Have you complained about that one?

That is why I have the combat log open for everyone to confirm what they see. Watch on HD and pause to see the exact numbers.

As for Engineer rocket charge. It doesn’t increase damage with distance and hits as hard as the first cascade from hammer 2. That isn’t a substantial amount of damage. The third cascade is what is doing stupid amounts of damage.

For WvW Ill will be using revenant as main backline until they nerf the hammer.

The build

Video example 1 (Starts out low FPS but gets better)

Video example 2

Considering Hammer 2 and 3 are buggy this will be even more powerful once their pathing is fixed and they hit where their animations go 100% of the time.

Please look into reducing the damage on at least Hammer 2 and 3. They are low cost, and low cooldown for such stupid high damage. Hammer 2 may also need to have the number of people affected reduced. Currently, you can hit up to 15 people across all three cascades. There’s a reason we needed AoE caps.

Gyro suggestion:

• Lock them to the player character
• Give them a base toughness and vitality (Currently the Bulwark is softer than the other gyros)
• Copy boons on the player to the gyros (Currently they have the same priority as a player. Honestly ANet, what were you thinking? Players should ALWAYS have priority over pets.)

Immediately after patch it worked once. I couldn’t invite someone to the squad so i disbanded it and tried from scratch and it reset back to live commander tag.

aaaand the new squad UI is already broken again?