Guild Wars 2

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Sly.9518:

The build also dies to being focused so if a team actually rotates the player does quite easily in teamfights, but I understand this is Solo queue players expect only 1 person to manage the side nodes while everyone else feeds mid….

This just highlights how a lot of players just don’t know how to fight the build or are familiar with it.

No

The animation of the #6 tablet summon and the #10 explode are overlapping animations. You can’t reliably tell if someone is only summoning a tablet or if they are also immediately exploding it, which in that case the animation overlaps and you can’t see the distinction between 6 and 0.

This is extremely exploitable and it needs to be fixed.

When summoning the tablet There are no large vines that shoot from the ground and wrap up the Tablet at all, the tablet explosion has roots shoot out from the ground to engulf the already present tablet and slam it to the ground.

You said that Energy Explosion has no animation, when there is a very distinct animation that takes 2 secs to complete before the knockback ever happens….

All I said is there is an Animation.

OriOri.8724:

They apply revealed because its supposed to be a counterplay, and then deadeye is allowed to just remove revealed at will, on a skill with the ammo system no less.

That’s nothing more than pure kitten, and asking to ignore invuln as well just shows that thieves don’t give a kitten about balance.

On a skill with a 1/2 sec cast time and ammo system that has two separate CDs built into it and only two charges.

And one last time Stealth doesn’t negate damage.

Not even close to a Invuln

Also more and more classes are getting reveals hell some Thief skills reveal themselves at cast now before the attack even hits

Soooooo OP ooooh noooo

It’s not like every Thief desnes doesn’t have a hard counter… oh wait every Defense Thief has has a hard counter ooooh shucks.

Let’s see

Evades- Wards
Stealth-Reveal(let’s not forget revealed is being handed out like candy)
Block-Unblockable

/gg

OriOri.8724:

No. Deadeyes already get to ignore revealed with their elite, that’s more than enough.

But I agree that the passive application of invuln skills through traits needs to be removed. These skills are stupidly powerful, and should have to be manually cast.

Some Skills from deadeye apply revealed as soon as skill is cast before damage is done only one skill gets to reset revealed which has a cast time and is on a CD.

/gg

And revealed has zero to do with invulnerability… stealth doesn’t stop damage….

All I did was set the record straight on certain claims that were made provided proof showing how false some claims were. Just a saying.

But what happened to, never playing Thief? Just saying

Azukas.1426:

saerni.2584:

This is just a “nuhuh” “uhhuh” argument at this point.

I mean, I’m sympathetic to the fact most players don’t know how to fight this and die to it. When I face a team with a good S/D condi player I have to hope my team can handle the build. I tend to attribute that to experience though. Most people aren’t used to fighting a thief with hit and run attributes as high as sword can get.

Same for facing a good enemy thief on power who just assassinates my teammates. Hard to win when your guardian is getting instagibbed (because not good at the class) and the enemy thief keeps your team feeling the pressure.

Ranged pressure really screws up this build. It has a hard time getting stealth and the evade frames aren’t that good. But, that’s the thing. Most people don’t bring ranged pressure and let the thief string them along long enough for their health to disappear.

Let me spell it out for you.

1. I got plat playing s/d condi thief and I don’t play thief

2. The biggest person refuting that this build isn’t OP is Sly. He said he beat a top 70 player in like 20 odd duels w/out that player winning a single duel. I beat him with ease and I’m not a top 70 player or thief main. In fact when we both used d/p meta build and dueled I beat him at that too. How is that possible? I know someone here isn’t telling the truth and it ain’t me.

At this juncture in the thread the evidence I’ve provided shows this build is OP. The people refuting have zero evidence it is not, or have any of you countered my evidence. You’ve just used your opinion.

Sad I know more about thief….

Funny when someone doesn’t play Thief. Too bad screenshots can’t be posted currently, that’s when the real fun comes in play.

And on the S/D Condi you beat me once, the other 3 times you died when I was at 50% each time and you didn’t want to duel in the first place because of cleanses and you complained whenever I cleansed.
This shall suffice for now.

https://imgur.com/a/h6FJw

Trevor Boyer.6524:

I feel like people are looking at this incorrectly, concerning the discussion. A Ventari Rev is not a usual meta archetype. It is not DPS, Peel +1, or even Bunker/Support in the same way that a Tempest is. Ventari Rev is something I would label as Traffic Control. It does a few things that are important to note before a discussion as to if it is OP or not can take place:

• It has the ultimate control skill. A no animation AoE knockback CC, which occurs frequently and is able to easily decap a node 1v1, 1v2 or even 1v3 in some cases. This ultimate control skill if used wisely, is also better damage mitigation than a normal support with heals. The frequent knockbacks can halt full team bursting/cleaving/stomping, very easily.
• A good Ventari Rev is unkillable 1v1 amongst meta builds. The only way you are going to down a good Ventari in 1v1 is with some strange build designed completely around condi DPS, such as a full trap shortbow Druid wearing Deadshot or something. It is possible to kill it 1v1 but the build used to do it will be useless against other metas. Essentially, Ventari Rev has no practical class counters in the same way that every other class/build has. So we are talking about a build that can inevitably hold a node 1v1, in every match up that it is against. Even if he is losing to some custom build designed to kill the Ventari, he sure as hell can hold long enough for a plus and if he doesn’t get it, was the time invested by the custom build to kill the Ventari on the Ventari’s color even worth it?
• You can kill it fairly easily 2v1 but the time invested to do this usually isn’t worth it while you’re team is getting 3v4d. This leads to situations where someone has to peel off the Ventari 2v1 to assist in holding/winning nodes and team fights. Since it is rare that a build can 1v1 kill a Ventari, the remaining player will almost always be forced to leave the fight as well. This results in enormously wasted time. If the game is actually balanced, there is no time to leave your team in 3v4s because it generally results in losing the other two nodes while you and your partner were trying to 2v1 a Ventari on the Ventari’s color. It’s just a bad idea. So then players figure out to avoid the Ventari.
• Avoiding the Ventari and trying to 5v4 around him on the other two nodes sounds like a great idea. But the truth is that a good player on the Ventari isn’t going to setup a tent and camp his home point all game. The Ventari will peel and go to other nodes, resulting in the same above two situations. If the match is balanced, players realize they aren’t going to win a team fight on the node against the present Ventari. Again, it forces players to peel off and go elsewhere. The Ventari wins the node again. Now consider his team isn’t stupid and they know to support play the Ventari’s presence so when he shows up to mid, they leave 1 person to support him and the other 3 peel to defend the sides. Ignoring the Ventari and playing around him isn’t as easy as it sounds when the Ventari is aware of how to position his presence. This is especially full of kitten when he duos with a good Chronomancer and they know how to play portal entre.
• At advanced levels, the Ventari recognizes that he can easily redirect and control the traffic of the enemy team. This is something sort of new really. No other bunker/support role is quite as effective at this as a Ventari Rev and this is really what makes it OP. It’s presence alone, creates forced rotations for the enemy team. A Bunker Druid can 1v2 a node against competent players, sure. But it has to peel around to survive, sometimes off point, and it must stealth at times to survive, which eventually can lose a decap. The same sorts of limitations apply to Scrappers/Tempests. They may toss more heal/condi cleanse than the Ventari but these other bunker/supports have no where near the capability to plainly stop a burst before it even happens, against multiple opponents mind you, and all the while easily the node while doing it.

The game of conquest is about decapping and holding nodes. Honestly if you could stack 5 Ventari Revs on a team and have 2 sit home, 2 sit mid and 1 rotate to + where needed, how the hell would you ever decap those nodes to get 2 nodes, to be able to win a game? They would never need to deal any DPS to your team. They would simply bully you off point with CCs and hold the nodes, all game. Even if you could kill one of them every once in awhile, you wouldn’t kill them quickly enough to ever be able to take those nodes.

In the end, the Ventari Rev has too high of a floor and too high of a ceiling. It is too easy for a subpar player to begin using, while he dodges rolls for stability proc and pushes everyone off point. And it is too rewarding for experienced players to abuse it’s over tweaked functions for the purpose of conquest. I mean the build almost plays itself “show up to a node, win that node cause Ventari”.

*The AoE CC needs a longer cast activation and they need to add a tell of animation of the cast. Right now in its current state, that AoE CC is full of kitten *^^

Uhmm the AoE knocback has an Animation….. large vines shoot out of the Ground strap the tablet and pulls the tablet to the ground causing the explosion, this animation takes 2 secs from start to finish…….. just saying and I don’t play the build.

The build also dies to being focused so if a team actually rotates the player does quite easily in teamfights, but I understand this is Solo queue players expect only 1 person to manage the side nodes while everyone else feeds mid….

This just highlights how a lot of players just don’t know how to fight the build or are familiar with it.

Vaeo.4097:

Ramoth.9064:

Yeah I’m not too sure what happened with vault thieves, but at some point they all just tapered off. I think traditional D/P is still most deadly.

All of the builds I run so far deal with condition S/D easily.

I actually ran into two S/P thieves yesterday, after not having seen any for years. The build felt pretty good. Did lots of damage to my guard.

Yes, D/P is deadly. But D/P thieves must come to melee range to deal damage. So they can be beaten with any class (with more or less skill and luck), especially if Steal is evaded. Vault spammer almost never comes to melee range, because catching him between evades (1/4 sec frame as stated above) is extreamly hard for most classes.

And I don’t think animation of Bound and Vault is very different. I know about “Glows Bright Blue”. But in 3/4 sec of this glow, I need to see it, decide to evade and press evade. This requires extreamly high reflexes (don’t forget 80-100ms ping time).

Vault Animation is completely different the player literally vaults using the staff planted on the Ground they glow Bright Blue for 1/2 sec till the top of the arc. Bound the Character does a Tuck roll that’s a leap and No Bright Blue Aura, I don’t see how the Animations need to be anymore different when they are completely different as is. Especially with the Bright Blue Aura as a very large Tell, I sit at 90-120 ping, ping doesn’t stop the Aura from happening either. it’s not hard to see the Aura since it’s Bright Blue hell you can even catch screen captures of the Aura quite easily. And to make it even more consistent here’s a tip use Standard enemy Models. Then every enemy will use the Human Animation and be Human Sized.

And saying the Vault Spammer doesn’t have to be in Melee range lulz. If they have to travel the full 900 units of the Vault the travel time and Large Predictable animation path is easily Avoidable as in players can strafe out of it without using any skills or Dodges, it’s not like the skill locks on to players it goes to a predetermined ground targeted area.

OriOri.8724:

TexZero.7910:

OriOri.8724:

Honestly we’ll be extremely lucky to get 3k out of it. Don’t even dream of anything close to 8-9k

Out of curiosity i went and ran the math for unique AP released after HoT that is still obtainable.

Using those parameters got 2912 AP so if PoF is more of an expansion and less feature heavy then 3k is reasonable and probably not even out of the question.

You seem to be counting all of the AP that was released during HoT, and every release since then in the past 2 years. So in total, with both an expansion AND 2 years worth of content we got less than 3k AP.

So yes, its entirely unreasonable to expect 3k AP from PoF. Maybe from PoF + LWS4 + 2 years of current events (though a decent chunk of the AP added since HoT was in 1 time PvP achievs for the new class and the map specific ones (about 500 total), and we won’t see something similar for PoF).

He did say released after HoT not With HoT……

Ramoth.9064:

Yeah I’m not too sure what happened with vault thieves, but at some point they all just tapered off. I think traditional D/P is still most deadly.

All of the builds I run so far deal with condition S/D easily.

I actually ran into two S/P thieves yesterday, after not having seen any for years. The build felt pretty good. Did lots of damage to my guard.

2 Balance patches back to back they were nerfed hard across multiple traitlines and skills

Vaeo.4097:

Well, not exactly nerfed but changed to increase skill requirements and provide counterplay.

D/P or S/D thieves requires rather high skill (proper timing: to attack, to evade, to retreat) and can be killed if they made mistake or baited. But Vault spammer doesn’t require real skill.

Vault spammer breaks basic concept of “evasive” play for thief. And to compensate this vault doing ridicuolously high damage.

All “Vault spammer” is doing — bound, vault, bound, bound, vault.
Almost no risk: 3 vaults, 3 bounds to bait evades. And other classes have only 2 evades to block this, while taking 2 vaults is almost fatal.
The most annoying thing here is absence of counterplay for most classes.

So I think this build should be nerfed.
I’m not talking about nerfing vault damage. It would be better to make it harder to land vault.
For example, one of this (one, not all):

• Change “Bound” to make it’s animation clearly different from “Vault”.
• Increase Vault cast time to 1.5 sec.
• Make Vault interruptible mid air.

Or some other way to make it very dangerous for thief to miss vault.

If Vault deals high damage, risk should also be high.

A few things.

Last couple Balance patches have seen Vault spam build nerfed.

Vault has a clearly different animation from Bound i.e. the Thief Glows Bright Blue when Vaulting, this Bright Blue Glow is also an indicator of when the Evade Frame is active, it lasts till the top of the Arc.

On top of that Tell there is the large /long animation of the actual Vault, which can be Side stepped out of don even need to use a Dodge, it can be blocked, it can invulnerable through etc…

And again the Last couple Balance Patches have seen this build Nerfed so much it is hardly ever used anymore.

No, you have to make the other armor Weights.

Dungeons are no longer supported by Anet, Fractals fill the role of Dungeons.

It has been this way for years and has been reinforced by Anet’s statements.

New Dungeons will most likely never happen.

Crossaber.8934:

Tumult.2578:

Ok, my bad. Did this change, or did I misunderstand it from the start? I don’t remember it being an option when the game started, when I did most of my WvW.

There was no option to buy hero point from wvw at the launch. There is also no option to obtain batch of honor besides playing wvw at launch until achievement chest rework.

Now wvwer can gain hero point and reduce the needed required towards GoB. Pver can obtain batch of honor from achievement chest to do big spender daily towards GoB. Seems totally fair to both parties.

Also you can Use the Currency Condverters to get WxP and BoH

Tumult.2578:

“Needing to put in a few hours to complete the track is not in any way unfair. Players who attempt to complete the track, will. The vagaries of WvW matches will have little to no impact.”

So it’s ok that WvW players can buy tons of waypoints, even all of them, towards the PvE Gift of Exploration, using what they earned in WvW, but totally wrong that PvE players earn something in PvE and use it towards the WvW Gift of Battle?
Couldn’t disagree more.

First things first, WvW players unlock Hero Points not Waypoints.

Second PvE players can get the GoB without ever having to Enter WvW except to Purchase 25 badges worth of Items.

TopBadge.3569:

Sly.9518:

TopBadge.3569:

I’m really not sure what this does in terms of creating balanced games.

Lets say a gold or above player goes inactive for a while now they’re bronze 1 that player hasn’t suddenly become worse in the time they’ve been away. You might be thinking well no problem then they’ll be able to climb out fairly quickly right and sure assuming they dominate they will but that doesn’t take into consideration the players they’re unfairly pushing back down and players they’re unfairly pushing up in the process.

My thoughts behind all this is that the divisions function like a kind of MMR if the wiki is to be believed so maybe I’m completely wrong. hopefully we can have an interesting discussion.

Decay doesn’t affect Matchmaking in the Slightest it just affects the Leaderboard status, it is used in conjunction with the Minimum matches requires to keep an active Pvp population.

Source?

Evan Lesh posted about it a couple months back.

TopBadge.3569:

I’m really not sure what this does in terms of creating balanced games.

Lets say a gold or above player goes inactive for a while now they’re bronze 1 that player hasn’t suddenly become worse in the time they’ve been away. You might be thinking well no problem then they’ll be able to climb out fairly quickly right and sure assuming they dominate they will but that doesn’t take into consideration the players they’re unfairly pushing back down and players they’re unfairly pushing up in the process.

My thoughts behind all this is that the divisions function like a kind of MMR if the wiki is to be believed so maybe I’m completely wrong. hopefully we can have an interesting discussion.

Decay doesn’t affect Matchmaking in the Slightest it just affects the Leaderboard status, it is used in conjunction with the Minimum matches requires to keep an active Pvp population.

Turk.5460:

Sly.9518:

Lulz you won one duel out of 4, 3 of which you had less than 5% health and I had over 50% health, And those 3 duels were interrupted by a random Thief in the lobby. #funfacts

I showed up in a Da/Tri/Sa build because I was queuing up as that in unranked, I didn’t even use that build against you lulz. you say you don’t play Thief but everyone you are logged in you are on Thief in WvW. Funny how that works.

You mean the Duel where you Shadowshot Spammed the whole fight lol wooo you wouldn’t duel again after that last one.

Lulz.

You didn’t want to duel in the first place and only wanted me to sit and let Condis tick for you to prove how Op they are.

This reply sounds pretty far-fetched, especially adding in the “lulz.” I wouldn’t have believed you regardless, since you haven’t been actually replying to any of the tactics I’ve plainly layed out – but this kind of response probably won’t sit well with the rest of the readers here.

You haven’t proved anything, and since you, a thief main it seems, have lost to a non-thief main using this build – have only further strengthened our arguments of the build over performing.

Again, this conversation isn’t a Thief v. Thief conversation. Its about one thief build and how easy it is to play – vs all professions. Have you tried fighting against this build as one of the Thief’s usual counters? Such as Hammer Scrapper or Power DH? Try that and tell me how much they counter thief now.

If only I was making it up.

Having issues posting a screenshot to enlighten people. Will try later.

Again I posted how it’s no issue on quite a few classes I play their Meta builds, a few posts up. #readingcomp I don’t just play Thief.

Azukas.1426:

Turk.5460:

Sly.9518:

Turk.5460:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Why are people blaming s/d on a set that has 1 condi tick, torment from dancing dagger.

Its statements like this that make me wonder if many of the people on this forum even play Thief.

You use sword, which immobilizes (and adds 2 poison – 3 if using venom)
Immobilize prevents your enemy from dodging
You dodge immediately – while they are immobilized (and add 1 cripple, 1 torment, 2 bleeds – +4 poison if using venom)

If you land sword 2, the immobilize will much more than likely not be cleansed by the time you dodge.

-No, this build is not overpowered. It is, however, overperforming.
-Pistol mainhand cannot do the same as this, as its immobilize is A) not instant, not a shadowstep and C) a projectile.

The immobilize only lands on S2 damage being applied which has a Animation time (not instant) which is completely separate from the Shadowstep portion, almost any moving player won’t get immob’ed, the only time the Immob lands every single time is against stationary targets, and as was shown from someone in this thread when I dueled them they messed up the S2 quite a bit and dodged before the attack portion of S2 which means no Immob which also meant no poison.

Most claims made about the Build being OP/over performing try to make the claims as if the defending player is standing still and not actively fighting/cleansing/blocking/moving/ anything else a player does. Players aren’t Target Golems they move cleanse Dodge etc.

Your reference to the person who dueled you shows nothing but the inexperience or lack of mechanical skill of that player. S/D power is my main build for WvW roaming. I have zero troubles landing Infiltrator’s Strike. If I changed from power to condi, I’m not going to suddenly whiff all of my sword 2’s – and I don’t since my off-set go-to build is now S/D condi. Single targets don’t move any differently in WvW than they do in sPvP.

I’m also going to assume you were also on a thief? Yeah, Thief vs. Thief is not the end-all and be-all of comparing the effectiveness of a build. This mentality of “Well, META thief can beat this, so its obvious that nothing needs to change” needs to go.

I was hitting the dodge key too fast as I was up for LONGER than I should have been. That being said we did duel and he lost easily and had no chance to beat me.

He also showed up on a d/p SA, Trck, DD build.

We finally at the end did one D/P meta mirror duel and somehow this non thief player won that duel hands down too.

I rest my case, and listen to the fella above me who echoes my thoughts. Poison on panic strike is the problem. Remove that and all is well.

Lulz you won one duel out of 4, 3 of which you had less than 5% health and I had over 50% health, And those 3 duels were interrupted by a random Thief in the lobby. #funfacts

I showed up in a Da/Tri/Sa build because I was queuing up as that in unranked, I didn’t even use that build against you lulz. you say you don’t play Thief but everyone you are logged in you are on Thief in WvW. Funny how that works.

You mean the Duel where you Shadowshot Spammed the whole fight lol wooo you wouldn’t duel again after that last one.

Lulz.

You didn’t want to duel in the first place and only wanted me to sit and let Condis tick for you to prove how Op they are.

Daddicus.6128:

Vova.2640:

Ideally you should be using an EXP booster (50%) and your guild hall booster (10%) to get more reward track progress. Yes, there are other boosts but those are harder to get.

XP boosts don’t affect the reward track points. I tried them. They give you more XP, but that doesn’t seem to translate into more reward track progress.

Or, am I wrong?

You are partially correct, but wrong as well.

Only the Black Lion Booster, the Experience Booster and Heroic Booster (these two share the same buff) affect WvW Reward Track. All the others don’t.

You can stack the Black Lion Booster and the Experience or Heroic Booster with the WvW reward Boost from The Guild Hall.

Turk.5460:

Sly.9518:

Turk.5460:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Why are people blaming s/d on a set that has 1 condi tick, torment from dancing dagger.

Its statements like this that make me wonder if many of the people on this forum even play Thief.

You use sword, which immobilizes (and adds 2 poison – 3 if using venom)
Immobilize prevents your enemy from dodging
You dodge immediately – while they are immobilized (and add 1 cripple, 1 torment, 2 bleeds – +4 poison if using venom)

If you land sword 2, the immobilize will much more than likely not be cleansed by the time you dodge.

-No, this build is not overpowered. It is, however, overperforming.
-Pistol mainhand cannot do the same as this, as its immobilize is A) not instant, not a shadowstep and C) a projectile.

The immobilize only lands on S2 damage being applied which has a Animation time (not instant) which is completely separate from the Shadowstep portion, almost any moving player won’t get immob’ed, the only time the Immob lands every single time is against stationary targets, and as was shown from someone in this thread when I dueled them they messed up the S2 quite a bit and dodged before the attack portion of S2 which means no Immob which also meant no poison.

Most claims made about the Build being OP/over performing try to make the claims as if the defending player is standing still and not actively fighting/cleansing/blocking/moving/ anything else a player does. Players aren’t Target Golems they move cleanse Dodge etc.

Your reference to the person who dueled you shows nothing but the inexperience or lack of mechanical skill of that player. S/D power is my main build for WvW roaming. I have zero troubles landing Infiltrator’s Strike. If I changed from power to condi, I’m not going to suddenly whiff all of my sword 2’s – and I don’t since my off-set go-to build is now S/D condi. Single targets don’t move any differently in WvW than they do in sPvP.

I’m also going to assume you were also on a thief? Yeah, Thief vs. Thief is not the end-all and be-all of comparing the effectiveness of a build. This mentality of “Well, META thief can beat this, so its obvious that nothing needs to change” needs to go.

I was saying your reference to the ease of instant cast Immob, it’s only instant for the Shadowstep, the Immob applies on only on the attack and if someone is moving away or strafing IS doesn’t always land the Immob no Immob no Poison, as I clearly laid out in the post you quoted, this is especially true if the person is affected by swiftness or superspeed which are in abundance in most Meta builds.

S2 has to points of failure the shadowstep mechanic, and the actual damaging mechanic to apply the Immob/Poison, plus the skill can’t effectively be spammed since the skill requires 2 separate casts one with a cast time and it costs 1/3 of the total Initiative pool. But hey to get a full Condi Burst relies on 3-4 separate skills and a Dodge, which can easily be cleansed before any real damage is allowed to tick, But some people claim just S2 and Dodge will kill someone.

People try to claim this is OP and Overperforming but never try to show proof and when I prove them wrong they make excuses, if it’s OP or Overperforming it should be easy to post actual proof like gameplay videos of it overperforming.

One Person claims not to play Thief and placed at a decent rating claimed my its only due to how OP the build is, but whenever I see them online they are playing Thief in WvW, funny how that works. That same person dueled me and tried saying how OP the build is by me sitting there letting the Condis tick without cleansing, guess what happened when I actually fought them, that’s when the excuses start coming out.

I play Thief, Ele, Rev and DH. The Rev is the only one with Issues dealing with Condi builds. The other classes Meta builds have zero issues with S/D Thief, since it is shutdown by any knowledge of Condi management or use of Defenses.

But so far no one has posted any proof showcasing how the build is overperforming.

Turk.5460:

Fat Disgrace.4275:

Why are people blaming s/d on a set that has 1 condi tick, torment from dancing dagger.

Its statements like this that make me wonder if many of the people on this forum even play Thief.

You use sword, which immobilizes (and adds 2 poison – 3 if using venom)
Immobilize prevents your enemy from dodging
You dodge immediately – while they are immobilized (and add 1 cripple, 1 torment, 2 bleeds – +4 poison if using venom)

If you land sword 2, the immobilize will much more than likely not be cleansed by the time you dodge.

-No, this build is not overpowered. It is, however, overperforming.
-Pistol mainhand cannot do the same as this, as its immobilize is A) not instant, not a shadowstep and C) a projectile.

The immobilize only lands on S2 damage being applied which has a Animation time (not instant) which is completely separate from the Shadowstep portion, almost any moving player won’t get immob’ed, the only time the Immob lands every single time is against stationary targets, and as was shown from someone in this thread when I dueled them they messed up the S2 quite a bit and dodged before the attack portion of S2 which means no Immob which also meant no poison.

Most claims made about the Build being OP/over performing try to make the claims as if the defending player is standing still and not actively fighting/cleansing/blocking/moving/ anything else a player does. Players aren’t Target Golems they move cleanse Dodge etc.

The loss and gain of rating solely based on your personal rating vs the Average rating of the opposing team. So if your rating is higher than the opposing team you lose more if it’s lower you lose less. Remember it’s your actual Ratig vs an Average, more times than not your rating will be higher than the average of the opposing team.

And Op could be adding everyone in his matches to their friends list (doubtful) and waiting a day for them to populate in the Friends/Guild tab on the League tab.

Aira.7360:

When leg armor coming out, many people asking why leg armor only on pve, many people want it on pvp and wvw because they want it for the ability change sigil and they can’t get it cause the LI requiment, and now when they give pvp/wvw player to craft leg armor with same ability they want the skin?

The people that wanted the PvE Legendary without raiding (aka the people wanting Easy mode Raids) want the skin. Most people think the PvE skins are horrendous and the Pvp/ WvW players are fine with just the functionality.

ProtoGunner.4953:

Sly.9518:

Offair.2563:

Get some boosters and you are done in 6-7-8hours top. Try to complete as many dailies as possible and consume the potions. A full track is roughly 75 of those.

Edit; Horrible typos.

It’s 6-8 hrs without boosters, with Boosters it’s between 3-4 hrs to complete.

Also there is a way to get the GoB without ever doing any WvW besides going into Spawn and purchasing an item for WvW Big Spender it’s Called Karmic and Ley Line Converters.

So either do 3-8 hrs of WvW or due the Converter method that requires zero WvW.

3-4 hours? I want to see that. I use boosters and it takes 7-8 hours easily and I am mostly on tier 6.

Edited for clarity: edited again because forum didn’t save my edited post.

Let’s do some simple math, at full Participation with out boosters and without including the Reward Track XP from Skirmish Rewards or Daily Reward Potions.

GoB =20,000 Reward XP
T6 Participation= 195 Reward XP
Reward XP awarded every 5 minutes

((20,000/195)5)/60=8.55

So no boosters and nothing else (highly unrealistic) it takes 8.55 hrs

W/ 10% booster

((20,000/215)5)/60=7.75

7.75 hrs again Unrelaistic since Daily Rewards are a thing and Instant Reward XP from Skirmish Rewards(automatically given every Tier)

Now let’s look with Daily Rewards 4 potions total at 250 each and the 10% booster

((19,000/215)5)/60=7.36

Again Unrealistic due to skirmish rewards number will be lower

Let’s look at full Booster and Daily Reward Potions

((19,000/361)5)/60=4.39

Already at 4.39 hrs and agin hats unrealistic due to Not including Skirmish Rewards.

Skirmish Rewards have a plethora of variables to factor in on how fast you get them, but you can clear Wood tier in 2.8 hrs with only 3 pips each tick which awards an additional 125 Reward XP, that is the longest it will take to clear that chest where the server is always last place and they aren’t outmanned on any BL and they aren’t Bronze Rank.

A Bronze Rank Player in second place on an Outmanned BL can clear wood in 50 minutes, Bronze in and additional 60 minutes and silver in an additional 87.6 minutes altogether that’s only 3.29 hrs which awards 750 Instant Reward XP

So some Quick Math

((18,250/361)5)/60=4.2 hrs

That’s a more Realistic number since it includes the Daily Potions, Skirmish Rewards and Boosters. If the player’s server is in 1st place they are higher rank etc etc. the GoB comes faster and faster. Where you can break into getting a GoB between 3hrs and 4.4 hrs.

It’s not over performing though, it gets shutdown quite easily from all Meta builds since they have adequate Condi management, blocks, projectile hate and other defenses built in, just because there are people that die to 1 spammers doesn’t mean this build is Overtuned or OP, in anything above Gold 3 the build is less useful since by then players know better how to play, but even then there are people that die to 1 spammers.

All it takes to stop it is proper dodging,blocking and Condi management, the basis of a competent player.

Build is no different than other meta Condi build that apply Condis and going into a defensive rotation like Mesmer, warrior and Dragon Hunter

Oh no….. a map that allows for more inventive gameplay, the horror! Now people have to move around and be aware of their surroundings

You do know decay doesn’t affect who you are placed against right? It only affects your leaderboard status not the matchmaker.

lilypop.7819:

Time and time again I have seen 20+ peeps in WvW target and fail to kill a running thief.

I-Win OR I-Run just makes a mockery of everyone else’s gameplay. It’s as if the game designer wants to mock anyone foolish enough to play WvW. Whether its OP or not, it leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. End of.

Simple cure is to tag a ‘cannot de-target’ effect for a small period onto jump effects. Thieves are not the only ones who exploit the game’s dire targeting mechanism – which after five years still seems to have an unfair spew of micro-bugs.

Good thing Shadow steps don’t force people to de target…

And last I checked this is the Pvp Subforum not WvW.

MidoriMarch.8067:

S/d condi thief is actually quite viable.

I climbed up to top 133 in pvp last season with s/d condi though i stopped playing pvp right after i finished my backpack. I would have climbed up more if i was keep playing

and that was my first time playing s/d which clearly shows it is easy to play low risk high reward compare to power s/d.

btw whoever said s/d condi #2 only applies 6 stacks of poisons in total and 800 ticks thats totally bs dont forget u can add torment (trickery) + additional poisons torment bleeds from DA trait + via spam dodge caltrops/Lotus + switch weapon to proc geomancy doom sigils too thats easy 12+ stacks of both poison and bleed on top of torment + confusions with perplex runes.

And u can basically juke from 900 range and escape out from 1200 range mobility.

Of course its not an immortal build but it surely is an easy op build to play even with low skills/experience

[img]https://i.imgur.com/o1GyMNI.jpg[/img]
[img]https://i.imgur.com/N4v7C6J.jpg[/img]

If only Geomancy and Doom Sigils didn’t exist in Pvp………………

You are in luck the daily achievements provide 2gold that can be had in 10 minutes

Offair.2563:

Get some boosters and you are done in 6-7-8hours top. Try to complete as many dailies as possible and consume the potions. A full track is roughly 75 of those.

Edit; Horrible typos.

It’s 6-8 hrs without boosters, with Boosters it’s between 3-4 hrs to complete.

Also there is a way to get the GoB without ever doing any WvW besides going into Spawn and purchasing an item for WvW Big Spender it’s Called Karmic and Ley Line Converters.

So either do 3-8 hrs of WvW or due the Converter method that requires zero WvW.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

I got nothing. You win.

Look I provided all the proof needed. The build is overtuned and needs to be nerfed.

That’s fact. My screen shots show it, and you can’t refute it.

It’s fact.

Time to move on and let’s talk about how we can bring the build down a peg or two to balance it properly.

I would begin by removing the poison on immob. This is what makes the build shine and what needs to be removed. Take this away and you still maintain the poison upkeep that d/d has. This keeps D/D as a nice condi weaponset while maintaining a definite weakness, but it removes s/d condi which is needed.

So what say you Sly? Like my change? I’m pretty sure that change doesn’t affect s/d power, and keeps d/d a good choice for condi.

Signed,

A Mesmer who placed Plat using S/D Condi Thief

p.s. Yes having p/d nerfed is intentional as well.

Lulz those screens show nothing except a competent Pvp player placed in platinum, com on provide a VoD unedited of the OP build in action, but it won’t happen since it’s not OP. Burden of proof just saying.

Cute quote edit you did there, almost as cute as the ingame mail, must be grasping pretty hard right about now.

Welcome to the dark side Sly……

FYI everyone else reading inf strike in then dodge does 50% of a marauder thief’s HP if not cleansed. Steal and dodge if not cleansed will 100-0 you.

Sly can now attest to this.

I still stand by the assertion that anyone with a Meta build can handle a Condi Thief if they play competently, without having to run full clears. The Steal an Dodge still needed Spider Venom for the full Burst to 100-0 without any cleanse again this no different than letting a power player attack without Doing anything to mitigate the damage.

No you actually had to clear it to not die lol.

As for any meta build being able to handle it 1v1 that’s not the problem. The build isn’t a 1v1 build. You still decap and +1 accordingly, but you have better finish capability due to most ppl not having the needed clears to deal with your condi application. You also 1v1 better than the meta d/p build and can easily topple the d/p power meta build using this build.

The only sacrifice you make is dash. In an organized 5v5 i would expect d/p dash to reign supreme due to the nature of voice coms/etc. In regular day ranked queue though this build out performs d/p dash significantly. Unless ofc you have a player of Sind’s caliber, but even then I would assume Sind/Toker on s/d condi would be absolutely stupid in terms of results.

Oh you mean use the mechanics to mitigate Condi damage just like any other damage….oh no the horror! Good thing all Meta builds come with adequate Condi cleanse built in. Again players aren’t Target Golems they have cleanses to mitigate the damage lulz.

Letting anyone land their Burst and letting it do its work both power and Condi anyone will die lulz.

Again there are things skills called cleanses they keep players alive and evey Meta build has them since more than just Condi Thief use Condis.

Remember cleanses aren’t there to completely stop damage but to mitigate its like players can’t completely stop Power damage with Healing. It’s all about managing Cleanses and Dodges

SuperKorean.7345:

Thief Shortbow 5 is the most overpowered skill in this game.

Let me give you 1 Example =

A.

1. You encounter Thief.

2. Your health is low and your defensive skills are on cool-down.

3. The Thief will chase you down , you die , you have to wait for the re-spawn.

4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain more points.

B.

1. You encounter Thief.

2. The Thief makes mistake and the Thief’s health is low.

3. The Thief will run away with 20% health and go decap or +1 somewhere else.

4. Result = The Enemy Team will gain points.

Whether A or B happens, You encounter Thief. -> The Enemy Team will gain points.

Why ?

Because Thief has superior mobility.

If you make mistake , you will die. You cannot run away from Thief mobility.

If the Thief makes mistake , the Thief will run away and do something else.

You cannot chase down the Thief’s mobility.

Even if the Thief lose fights , the Thief can just run away from the fight,
and contribute points by decaping or +1 somewhere else.

Only the Thief can do this, the other 8 classes cannot do this.

If the other 8 classes lose fights, they die and they have to wait for re-spawn.

How to fix this?

Shortbow 5 Initiative cost should be increased. Or reduce the range down to 600.

And also, Shadow Step cooldown should be 60 sec. Or reduce the range down to 900.

And also, add 20 sec internal cool-down to the “Unhindered Combatant Dash” Trait

By the way, Thief is my most played class. I played Thief for more than 10,000 hours.

Been playing Gw2 for 9 years straigt aye on Thief alone Aye?

Let’s see /age of your thief

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

I got nothing. You win.

Look I provided all the proof needed. The build is overtuned and needs to be nerfed.

That’s fact. My screen shots show it, and you can’t refute it.

It’s fact.

Time to move on and let’s talk about how we can bring the build down a peg or two to balance it properly.

I would begin by removing the poison on immob. This is what makes the build shine and what needs to be removed. Take this away and you still maintain the poison upkeep that d/d has. This keeps D/D as a nice condi weaponset while maintaining a definite weakness, but it removes s/d condi which is needed.

So what say you Sly? Like my change? I’m pretty sure that change doesn’t affect s/d power, and keeps d/d a good choice for condi.

Signed,

A Mesmer who placed Plat using S/D Condi Thief

p.s. Yes having p/d nerfed is intentional as well.

Lulz those screens show nothing except a competent Pvp player placed in platinum, com on provide a VoD unedited of the OP build in action, but it won’t happen since it’s not OP. Burden of proof just saying.

Cute quote edit you did there, almost as cute as the ingame mail, must be grasping pretty hard right about now.

Welcome to the dark side Sly……

FYI everyone else reading inf strike in then dodge does 50% of a marauder thief’s HP if not cleansed. Steal and dodge if not cleansed will 100-0 you.

Sly can now attest to this.

I still stand by the assertion that anyone with a Meta build can handle a Condi Thief if they play competently, without having to run full clears. The Steal an Dodge still needed Spider Venom for the full Burst to 100-0 without any cleanse again this no different than letting a power player attack without Doing anything to mitigate the damage.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

I got nothing. You win.

Look I provided all the proof needed. The build is overtuned and needs to be nerfed.

That’s fact. My screen shots show it, and you can’t refute it.

It’s fact.

Time to move on and let’s talk about how we can bring the build down a peg or two to balance it properly.

I would begin by removing the poison on immob. This is what makes the build shine and what needs to be removed. Take this away and you still maintain the poison upkeep that d/d has. This keeps D/D as a nice condi weaponset while maintaining a definite weakness, but it removes s/d condi which is needed.

So what say you Sly? Like my change? I’m pretty sure that change doesn’t affect s/d power, and keeps d/d a good choice for condi.

Signed,

A Mesmer who placed Plat using S/D Condi Thief

p.s. Yes having p/d nerfed is intentional as well.

Lulz those screens show nothing except a competent Pvp player placed in platinum, com on provide a VoD unedited of the OP build in action, but it won’t happen since it’s not OP. Burden of proof just saying.

Cute quote edit you did there, almost as cute as the ingame mail, must be grasping pretty hard right about now.

Yet you haven’t provided any proof showing the build is OP. And you refuse to since it isn’t. And like I stated earlier I never recorded those duels. And you are the ones making the claims that something is OP so burden of proof falls on you.

It just seems like people are upset Thieves have more than one viable build now and have to guess at which is being used.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

snip

Snip

snip

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Lol any excuse.

He was in the top 70 saying how he was beating top20+ players easily while I wasn’t even top 250. And if the build is so OP like people claim it is he should have been able to beat me, also I let him get his Condi Burst rotation of IS/Steal/Dodge/with spider Venom on me and i let it tick before cleansing it only ticked for 1k so OP much damage with all those conditions on me lol.

Every Meta and viable off Meta build has counters pre baked into them to counter the build easily, it gets shut down by any semi competent player.

I provide pictures as proof & you are just saying some random top 70 player you beat. Please by all means link the thread where he admits you whipped him or videos. Something b/c when you say his condi burst you let tick and it only did 1k damage when the poison ticks alone from Inf strike will hit you for 2k I kinda file this in the “Ok sure thing” pile.

My experience is very different from your tale.

Where again are these pictures? They aren’t in this thread as far as I can see lol. You haven’t posted anything that shows how OP s/d Thief is in the slightest all you posted was a screen shot of you being in Platinum, where are the pics or video showing how op it is?

I sadly didn’t record or screen shot the fights since all I was doing was showing that player how wrong they were and if I post their name I will get infracted so yeah.

1. Well known I dont thief
2. Posted Plat pic and I used nothing but s/d condi
3. You didn’t post a single shred of evidence

I’m waiting.

Thanks

You posted Plat pic with zero shred of evidence of being on a Thief for all those matches, even if you placed Plat with it doesn’t mean it’s OP. Any competent player can place Plat .
Again no proof was posted of how OP it is yet you say you posted pics of how OP Thief is.

I’m waiting.

I suck at thief. I dont play thief. In fact I’ve said this from day 1 on this forum.

The simple fact I can perform with the build is telling enough.

You’re very defensive about this and condi thief in general. Why?

Again there is nothing showing you played hose placement matches on Thief at all, you could have played on your Mesmer and swapped over to Thief to take the Screen shot, not so far fetched of an idea. And again anyone that competent at Pvp in general can place platinum, hell las season I placed Plat 2 on D/D power just due to season Prior rating Inflation helping the placement.

Not defensive just stating that the build is far from OP and pointing out the obvious bias people have towards certain style of play/builds, since you know the build has to land the Burst which multiple defensive options pre baked into Meta builds to stop and to keep the Condis applied again multiple counters pre baked into the Meta builds to stop, I play Mara D/P because it doesn’t get completely shutdown by most Meta builds that are commonly played.

So instead of trying to claim to post proof when you clearly didn’t, show some proof of how Op it is.

Forgot to add:

Still waiting on your evidence of what you are saying.

Oh I see still no evidence of being op just that a competent player placed in Plat good to go.

Please show us a vid of how op the build is and those w/l ratio looks mediocre to average at best almost 50/50!there with 8 wins 6 losses nice job.

Put please show us how OP he build is.

Oh btw cute ingame Mail you sent me.

I don’t play thief and I was able to make plat solely playing condi s/d thief.

That right there is proof of it over performing.

You being in denial isn’t going to change the fact about it. It allows people to achieve higher results than they should. It carries.

That’s not proof of anything that just shows what being a competent Pvp player can do, as long as a player knows the role ashy are and how to properly Pvp they can place on most any class or build that’s viable, and I doubt you never Pvped with Thief before those placement matches. And again if it was so Op you would have had a better win ratio than almost 50/50.

I think I know why you posting any gameplay vids to prove how OP the build is, because it isn’t.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

snip

Snip

snip

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Lol any excuse.

He was in the top 70 saying how he was beating top20+ players easily while I wasn’t even top 250. And if the build is so OP like people claim it is he should have been able to beat me, also I let him get his Condi Burst rotation of IS/Steal/Dodge/with spider Venom on me and i let it tick before cleansing it only ticked for 1k so OP much damage with all those conditions on me lol.

Every Meta and viable off Meta build has counters pre baked into them to counter the build easily, it gets shut down by any semi competent player.

I provide pictures as proof & you are just saying some random top 70 player you beat. Please by all means link the thread where he admits you whipped him or videos. Something b/c when you say his condi burst you let tick and it only did 1k damage when the poison ticks alone from Inf strike will hit you for 2k I kinda file this in the “Ok sure thing” pile.

My experience is very different from your tale.

Where again are these pictures? They aren’t in this thread as far as I can see lol. You haven’t posted anything that shows how OP s/d Thief is in the slightest all you posted was a screen shot of you being in Platinum, where are the pics or video showing how op it is?

I sadly didn’t record or screen shot the fights since all I was doing was showing that player how wrong they were and if I post their name I will get infracted so yeah.

1. Well known I dont thief
2. Posted Plat pic and I used nothing but s/d condi
3. You didn’t post a single shred of evidence

I’m waiting.

Thanks

You posted Plat pic with zero shred of evidence of being on a Thief for all those matches, even if you placed Plat with it doesn’t mean it’s OP. Any competent player can place Plat .
Again no proof was posted of how OP it is yet you say you posted pics of how OP Thief is.

I’m waiting.

I suck at thief. I dont play thief. In fact I’ve said this from day 1 on this forum.

The simple fact I can perform with the build is telling enough.

You’re very defensive about this and condi thief in general. Why?

Again there is nothing showing you played hose placement matches on Thief at all, you could have played on your Mesmer and swapped over to Thief to take the Screen shot, not so far fetched of an idea. And again anyone that competent at Pvp in general can place platinum, hell las season I placed Plat 2 on D/D power just due to season Prior rating Inflation helping the placement.

Not defensive just stating that the build is far from OP and pointing out the obvious bias people have towards certain style of play/builds, since you know the build has to land the Burst which multiple defensive options pre baked into Meta builds to stop and to keep the Condis applied again multiple counters pre baked into the Meta builds to stop, I play Mara D/P because it doesn’t get completely shutdown by most Meta builds that are commonly played.

So instead of trying to claim to post proof when you clearly didn’t, show some proof of how Op it is.

Forgot to add:

Still waiting on your evidence of what you are saying.

Oh I see still no evidence of being op just that a competent player placed in Plat good to go.

Please show us a vid of how op the build is and those w/l ratio looks mediocre to average at best almost 50/50!there with 8 wins 6 losses nice job.

Put please show us how OP he build is.

Oh btw cute ingame Mail you sent me.

FrostDraco.8306:

Doggie.3184:

Most important re-balance is armor designs. Replace the designers please with people who aren’t anti-diversity.

Anti-diversity? I please hope this is in regard to armor, and not something political.

It’s about the blatant overuse of Butt-capes and Trenchcoats. Literally every non starter Armor/outfit released Falls into those two categories.

He Living Story maps

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

snip

Snip

snip

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Lol any excuse.

He was in the top 70 saying how he was beating top20+ players easily while I wasn’t even top 250. And if the build is so OP like people claim it is he should have been able to beat me, also I let him get his Condi Burst rotation of IS/Steal/Dodge/with spider Venom on me and i let it tick before cleansing it only ticked for 1k so OP much damage with all those conditions on me lol.

Every Meta and viable off Meta build has counters pre baked into them to counter the build easily, it gets shut down by any semi competent player.

I provide pictures as proof & you are just saying some random top 70 player you beat. Please by all means link the thread where he admits you whipped him or videos. Something b/c when you say his condi burst you let tick and it only did 1k damage when the poison ticks alone from Inf strike will hit you for 2k I kinda file this in the “Ok sure thing” pile.

My experience is very different from your tale.

Where again are these pictures? They aren’t in this thread as far as I can see lol. You haven’t posted anything that shows how OP s/d Thief is in the slightest all you posted was a screen shot of you being in Platinum, where are the pics or video showing how op it is?

I sadly didn’t record or screen shot the fights since all I was doing was showing that player how wrong they were and if I post their name I will get infracted so yeah.

1. Well known I dont thief
2. Posted Plat pic and I used nothing but s/d condi
3. You didn’t post a single shred of evidence

I’m waiting.

Thanks

You posted Plat pic with zero shred of evidence of being on a Thief for all those matches, even if you placed Plat with it doesn’t mean it’s OP. Any competent player can place Plat .
Again no proof was posted of how OP it is yet you say you posted pics of how OP Thief is.

I’m waiting.

I suck at thief. I dont play thief. In fact I’ve said this from day 1 on this forum.

The simple fact I can perform with the build is telling enough.

You’re very defensive about this and condi thief in general. Why?

Again there is nothing showing you played hose placement matches on Thief at all, you could have played on your Mesmer and swapped over to Thief to take the Screen shot, not so far fetched of an idea. And again anyone that competent at Pvp in general can place platinum, hell las season I placed Plat 2 on D/D power just due to season Prior rating Inflation helping the placement.

Not defensive just stating that the build is far from OP and pointing out the obvious bias people have towards certain style of play/builds, since you know the build has to land the Burst which multiple defensive options pre baked into Meta builds to stop and to keep the Condis applied again multiple counters pre baked into the Meta builds to stop, I play Mara D/P because it doesn’t get completely shutdown by most Meta builds that are commonly played.

So instead of trying to claim to post proof when you clearly didn’t, show some proof of how Op it is.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Lol any excuse.

He was in the top 70 saying how he was beating top20+ players easily while I wasn’t even top 250. And if the build is so OP like people claim it is he should have been able to beat me, also I let him get his Condi Burst rotation of IS/Steal/Dodge/with spider Venom on me and i let it tick before cleansing it only ticked for 1k so OP much damage with all those conditions on me lol.

Every Meta and viable off Meta build has counters pre baked into them to counter the build easily, it gets shut down by any semi competent player.

I provide pictures as proof & you are just saying some random top 70 player you beat. Please by all means link the thread where he admits you whipped him or videos. Something b/c when you say his condi burst you let tick and it only did 1k damage when the poison ticks alone from Inf strike will hit you for 2k I kinda file this in the “Ok sure thing” pile.

My experience is very different from your tale.

Where again are these pictures? They aren’t in this thread as far as I can see lol. You haven’t posted anything that shows how OP s/d Thief is in the slightest all you posted was a screen shot of you being in Platinum, where are the pics or video showing how op it is?

I sadly didn’t record or screen shot the fights since all I was doing was showing that player how wrong they were and if I post their name I will get infracted so yeah.

1. Well known I dont thief
2. Posted Plat pic and I used nothing but s/d condi
3. You didn’t post a single shred of evidence

I’m waiting.

Thanks

You posted Plat pic with zero shred of evidence of being on a Thief for all those matches, even if you placed Plat with it doesn’t mean it’s OP. Any competent player can place Plat .
Again no proof was posted of how OP it is yet you say you posted pics of how OP Thief is.

I’m waiting.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Lol any excuse.

He was in the top 70 saying how he was beating top20+ players easily while I wasn’t even top 250. And if the build is so OP like people claim it is he should have been able to beat me, also I let him get his Condi Burst rotation of IS/Steal/Dodge/with spider Venom on me and i let it tick before cleansing it only ticked for 1k so OP much damage with all those conditions on me lol.

Every Meta and viable off Meta build has counters pre baked into them to counter the build easily, it gets shut down by any semi competent player.

I provide pictures as proof & you are just saying some random top 70 player you beat. Please by all means link the thread where he admits you whipped him or videos. Something b/c when you say his condi burst you let tick and it only did 1k damage when the poison ticks alone from Inf strike will hit you for 2k I kinda file this in the “Ok sure thing” pile.

My experience is very different from your tale.

Where again are these pictures? They aren’t in this thread as far as I can see lol. You haven’t posted anything that shows how OP s/d Thief is in the slightest all you posted was a screen shot of you being in Platinum, where are the pics or video showing how op it is?

I sadly didn’t record or screen shot the fights since all I was doing was showing that player how wrong they were and if I post their name I will get infracted so yeah.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Lol any excuse.

He was in the top 70 saying how he was beating top20+ players easily while I wasn’t even top 250. And if the build is so OP like people claim it is he should have been able to beat me, also I let him get his Condi Burst rotation of IS/Steal/Dodge/with spider Venom on me and i let it tick before cleansing it only ticked for 1k so OP much damage with all those conditions on me lol.

Every Meta and viable off Meta build has counters pre baked into them to counter the build easily, it gets shut down by any semi competent player.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Well I don’t think it will happen due to the TOS being broken.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

It does use a completely separate system and their Division means absolutely nothing in Unranked.

Why does it matter if players are winning in Unranked in the first place? It’s not like there is any detriment since Unranked losses mean absolutely nothing.

And it doesn’t change the accessibility of Pvp to newer players since they can all access it and they can learn to better them selves in a semi competitive environment ( any gamemode that pits players against each other is competitive, since competing for a win is competition..)

And let’s not forget some people like to take a break from playing ranked.