You just need to practice without any points in Arcana. You’ll get used to it – and not having any Arcana will make you a better player.
For PvE, use one of the builds shown in the following link (I recommend Build F or G, since those have the most utility):
It’ll be difficult at first, and you’ll probably die a lot. But stick with it. After a week or two, you’ll get to the point where you can out-survive everything (mainly cause things die so fast, so you don’t need survivability anyway).
@ Neko: I always take Conjurer. I’m usually in Build F. I thought the same as you originally, but I tried it w/o Conjurer, and it actually worked very well.
The downtime on both LH and your might-stacking rotations w/o Conjurer is only a very small amount of time – a single Air AA channel with Scepter, during which time you augment the dmg w/ the Air 2 burst attack, then you start the next might-stacking rotation. It’s hardly significant. If you pre-stack might, then can kill the boss in less than the time it takes for you to:
use up your first 15-charge LH, stack might a 2nd time, use up your second 15-charge LH, stack might a 3rd time;
then not having Conjurer might actually end up as higher DPS than having it.
Also, S/F + LH (w/o Conjurer), assuming you kill the boss by your 3rd might-stacking rotation, is not only higher DPS than MH Dagger, but also stacks FAR more might than MH dagger. If you don’t need to stack might, then you might as well go Fire Staff – look at the diagram I attached to the first post, and you’ll see it shows exactly that.
(edited by Anierna.6918)
Updated the guide to incorporate the Dec 10th update and to include multiple LH builds based on what you need to do (eg. give might/fury/vuln), the gear/food/stacking sigils being individually optimized for each build to maximize that build’s Effective Power.
Dub and Zelyhn can now stop telling me that my builds aren’t optimal, because now they are, based on what you need to do for your group.
so the op is advocating 25/25/10/10/0, s/d, with LH, AB, and AS utilities. He’s wrong.
cursE proposes to fix the op’s build by changing it to: 30/20/0/20/0, still s/d, LH, AW, and either AB or AS (he didnt specify). with either scholars or divinities. he believes this build is highest dps, but is not viable because it has too little survivability. He is also wrong, on all counts.
Assuming you must provide perma fury and perma 25 stacks might to group, you should be using 30/10/10/20/0, s/f, not s/d as you two are using. I posted a vid of the proper s/f LH rotation for maximum might-stacking in a previous thread – scroll through my post history to find it. It was done on a practice dummy in LA, so dmg will be FAR lower than in dungeons, but the rotation is what you should be focusing on, not the dmg.
you should be using zerk/scholars in organized groups, since you can maintain perma 25 might if the party spams Embers. In pugs, you should use zerk/might durations (2x hoelbrak, 2x pirate, 2x strength), since most pugs are so bad they dont even know what Embers are. I used boon durations in the s/f vid I posted, but that was a mistake; I should have used might durations.
if you dont need to stack fury, since some other party member is giving it, go 0/20/25/25/0, or 10/10/25/25/0 if you want conjurer. both these are higher dps than 30/10/10/20/0, but dont give AoE fury
@ cursE: you should never use divinities in pve. dont even suggest it. glass ele builds are perfectly viable, since bosses die in under 10 secs, during which time you can avoid all dmg via 2x dodges, fgs 3, hiding inside wall/feedback, relying on aegis from guard, relying on blinds from lh/guard, perhaps using AS (although I dont need it), etc. survivability only becomes an issue if the group is too noob to be able to kill bosses ASAP, which only happens when group members run BS builds such as 30/20/0/20/0 s/d with divinities or (god forbid) some sort of “survivability” or “healing” build that screws the team.
(edited by Anierna.6918)
I agree with Spoq. My 4 sec Frost Bow kill was OP, and I believe it should be legit (not like I’m biased or anything). lol =D
lol. You used Fiery Rush + Lightning Flash, and it took you longer than it should have. Watch my vid of the 4 sec kill I did with Ice Bow. I also did an FGS kill in 3 secs.
Same as pre-patch. All the patch did was give the spec a slight buff.
30/20/10/10/0, or 30/10/10/10/10 if you want Renewing Stamina/Blasting Staff. The spec is in my guide. The staff section will probably remain unchanged once I update the guide this weekend.
Because the topic has nothing to do with economics. … You are the ones obviously exploiting less skilled players in a twitch based action style game. (y)
The funniest type of troll is the one who doesn’t even realize what it is he’s talking about, because he’s not even trolling: he’s just ignorant. Trolling is intentionally voicing an opinion you know to be crazy to provoke a violent response, but he’s not educated enough in economic/political theory to realize that what he’s saying is absurd. He actually believes what he’s saying, which makes it even more hilarious.
He’s formed a political opinion based on a perverted sense of “justice,” and is attempting to apply it to the economic system of a video game (focusing on the sale of dungeon paths), yet believes it has “nothing to do with economics.” Anyone else see the irony here?
I’ll just add that the debate is shifting towards economics.
Yep, and I’m still wondering whether or not the troll is qualified to speak on the subject. Come on, Raven, this is your chance to talk about yourself – why haven’t you jumped on it yet?
@ Ravenmoon: Just wondering, what exactly is your real-life experience with economic theory? And political theory? I’m guessing it’s not much, since any sophomore econ/poli-sci major could tell you that:
1) Anet would have a difficult time regulating/preventing dungeon sales, even if they were so inclined;
2) Regulating/preventing dungeon sales would be an impractical use of Anet’s limited resources, when so much else in the game needs fixing; and
3) Trying to be “Big Brother” in this matter is morally dubious. We’ve got freedom of contract here in the West – there’s no explicit coercion going on, and I can’t think of any Western legal institution that would find a problem with solo’ing a dungeon and selling the slots.
This is just the little I recall from years ago – I’ve forgotten most of it.
(edited by Anierna.6918)
There is no “great condition dmg based ele” in PvE. It does not exist. Considering the current state of the game and its mechanics, it cannot exist. Direct dmg will always net higher average DPS, as well as higher burst.
If you are looking for a condi-based class, try necro. If you are looking for a condi-based class in PvE, you might as well give up; there are none. Even necro goes power in PvE.
There are some great PvE direct dmg builds for ele, but I’m tired of linking them. If you’re interested, go through my post history and look for YouTube links.
LOL! That Lilith Ajit guy’s hilarious. Thank God you linked me that; I needed a laugh 
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Arah-P4-5/first#post3354476
You didn’t do too badly yourself 
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Arah-P4-5/first#post3357036
That’ll be easier then, having them swap a trait rather than respec. ty spoj.
One other thing I forgot to mention: I’m constantly reminding the wars to retrait 30/10/0/0/30 before runs, to spec out of Forceful GS. I have a deeply ingrained hatred of that trait. You have no idea how infuriating it is when your biggest job is to keep might capped, but the wars insist on screwing it up for themselves by using Forceful GS.
A side benefit of designating the jobs of fury and might stacking solely to the Ele is that it is very easy to designate blame if something goes wrong. Provided everyone used Embers and the Guard has PF/HG in reserve, if might isn’t capped, you know who to blame. In the few cases when I’m playing mes/war/guard instead of Ele, and might drops below 21-24 for any significant length of time, I know that the Ele in our group isn’t doing his job, and I can use that as a justification for swapping roles with him. It’s also very useful in assessing the ability of trial ele’s to the guild.
There’s almost never a ranger in guild runs, so I can’t count on that. And the 2x wars don’t usually bring FGJ. We pre-stack might with banner stomps, but once we engage, I’m the sole provider of fury and might for the group – which is fine, since I can upkeep perma fury and maximum might. This allows the wars to use something else in place of FGJ (OMM, power/prec signet, frenzy, etc). It also means the Mes doesn’t need to bring Sig of Insp, so can bring a mantra for an additional dmg modifier instead.
Using Comet and the blast heal in the rotation rather than a 2nd LH AA chain in the fire field lowers my own DPS, but it’s necessary since it gives an additional blast finisher within the same amount of time, and that additional 3 might is needed to upkeep maximum might, since I’m the only one providing it.
(edited by Anierna.6918)
It’s assumed you need to provide Fury as well. If I were just focusing on dmg, I’d go 0/20/25/25/0, or 10/10/25/25/0 if I wanted Conjurer. You lose DPS via Comet, but it’s also assumed that Comet is necessary to upkeep maximum might. You wouldn’t use it if pre-stacking.
Your war build is fine. I don’t know about thief – I haven’t looked at mine post-update, but it’s probably still the same as pre-update.
Your Ele build is way-wrong. it should be 30/10/10/20/0, s/f + LH, with this rotation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeRhQ40ckQ4. If you’re pre-stacking might, drop Comet from the rotation and summon your 2nd LH at the boss’s location (it won’t aggro him).
I used boon durations in that vid, which is what I use for pugs because they’re too stupid to give me fire fields, but in guild runs I use Scholars and can still maintain perma 25 might cause everyone’s spamming Embers and Guard has PF (guild runs are normally 1x ele, 1x mes, 1x guard, 2x war – all in DPS metas).
Your mes build is wrong as well. It should be sw/f + OH sw, either: 1) 10/30/0/20/10 (max reflect dmg) or 15/30/0/25/0 (higher phantasm dmg, + vuln via f3 and your daze mantra). Both assume you need 20 in the penultimate line for focus reflects.
(edited by Anierna.6918)
@ Ryn: Mesmers do NOT deal more damage than Ele’s, except in the very specific circumstances of:
1) Reflect damage (eg. Feedbacking Lupi and Malrona);
2) They have 3x phantasms up, and are using an Ele’s FGS against a wall; and
3) They have 3x phantasms up, and are using an Ele’s LH.
When a Mes is not using Ele conjures and reflects cannot be used to make the target kill itself, Ele will always have higher average DPS (mainly because bosses die so fast and Ele has higher initial burst), as well as the advantage of providing perma fury and max might for the group. This is mostly the case for the following reasons:
1) Groups pre-stack might prior to engagement, so the Ele is doing maximum DPS with LH right from the start. A mes, however, has to summon it’s phantasms, which take time to cast, and can only start with 2 (a swordsman and a warden), then must wait 16 secs to summon a 2nd swordsman. Bosses are usually dead before that 2nd swordsman is summoned.
2) Ele’s have FAR more damage modifiers; there is really no comparison between Ele and Mes in this regard.
I used the meta builds of s/f LH 30/10/10/20/0 for Ele, and sw/f + OH sw (both 15/30/0/25/0 and 10/30/0/20/10 builds) for Mes in my comparisons.
So, in your rankings, looks like it goes:
Ele (FGS):
Ele (Frost Bow):
Guardian:
Warrior:
Ele (LH):
lol
OK, it’s uploaded. Both my 5.9 and 4.2 sec kills are in the vid:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuMMbBZXu_k
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There were minor mistakes in both attempts. In the first one, I accidentally used Sigil of the Night on my OH dagger, even though it was day. In the second one, I shouldn’t have bothered with summoning LH – I should have just used Fire Grab, like I did in the first attempt. I could probably get it to 3.9 secs if I were to do further trials.
I’ve checked the link a dozen times, and half the time it only goes to 480p max. But when I refresh the page, the resolution option suddenly changes to 1080p max. I don’t know what’s up with the resolution on YouTube. It seems temperamental >.<
I just got a 4.2 sec kill with Frost bow. Uploading it now. I’ll post the link once it’s done.
The video for guardian shows him using hounds. I’d say go for it.
Yeah, he does – and he also buffs himself to 12 might before engagement with staff’s Empower, then swaps staff for GS via invent. I’m inclined towards getting a 6-7 sec kill by:
1) buffing myself to maximum might prior to engagement;
2) summoning hounds, ember, and ogre pet prior to engagement;
3) summoning ice bow prior to engagement, although I’m not sure about that. The Giant may not have a large enough hitbox. I’ll have to test.
It seems like the only thing I can’t do is FGS + Lightning Flash; is that right? And the timer only starts once the first tick of damage appears on the Giant?
PvE, you should not be using d/d. You should not be using Eagles. You should not be “focused on survivability, healing, and condition removal for myself and allies.” That is what the guard does, and he can do it better than you can.
In PvP, if you want to use d/d, go 0/0/30/20/20. Earth traits: protection of aura use, 10% dmg modifier in melee, immune to condi’s above 90% health. Water traits: regen when hit by crits, shorter cantrip CD’s. Arcana traits: Vigor on crit, boon on atunement swap. Force/Battle/Energy sigils on weps (choose 2 of the 3), clerics trinket. 2x monks, 2x waters, (2x divinities or 2x groves, although the groves seem to be bugged in PvP atm). Utilities are: Healing Signet, Armor of Earth, Cleansing Fire, Lightning Flash.
Keep your health above 90% at all times. This is easy to do: you have almost perma uptime on protection and 3x HoTs (Healing Sig passive, Regen boon, and Healing Mist). You’re basically an OP tank in this build. All condi-enemies are free kills; necros, condi-thieves, condi-engis, etc. If you’re fighting a minion necro, start off with Churning Earth + Lightning Flash to kill him minions, then he’ll be a piece of cake. Condi-thieves and engis you can basically ignore as if they were flies, and focus on a more dangerous direct-dmg opponent in the zerg that’s inevitably happening on the middle node.
I just recorded a 10 sec kill with Ele, in a spec specifically for it (30/30/0/10/0. I normally run 30/10/10/20/0). Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6IO9KXVFo4
I messed up once by accidentally doing a scepter water AA before summoning the LH. It would have been a 9 sec kill if I’d done it right. If I had pre-stacked might via blast finishers, it would have been an 8 sec kill (maybe 7), but I wasn’t sure if that was allowed.
I uploaded the vid in 1080p, and when I log into my YouTube account to watch it, it is in 1080p, but when I’m not logged in, it reverts to 480p max. I don’t know why. If you say I’m allowed to pre-stack might, I’ll re-record for an 8-sec kill, and hopefully the resolution won’t bug when I upload that.
EDIT: I could have also killed the Giant faster if I had used Hounds of Balthazar, an Ember, and an Ogre Pet Whistle. Are those allowed? The Ember would have been particularly helpful via LH blasts in fire fields.
(edited by Anierna.6918)
Stay as you are, with full zerk. If you swap to celestial, you will, as you put it, “lose tons of DPS and hit like a wet noodle.” I love that description =D
LOL! Reminds me of that vid called something like “most OP PvP ele” (can’t remember exact title). The guy logs out of his ele, makes a thief, and spams heartseeker =P
I recommend not dying. Or doing Arah with 2 necros. That part’s really important. lol
Soothing Wave should never be used in PvE, only in PvP or WvW. This thread is thus void.
The new meta is actually S/F, here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeRhQ40ckQ4
If you want S/D, same thing, except you do Earthquake instead of Magnetic Wave, and you skip Comet.
@ Dub: I tried it w/o the heal, but I can’t get 2x LH blasts in the field. I can only get 2x blasts in if I ditch either Magnet Wave or Comet. Meaning, if I wanted 2x LH blasts, I’d need to do one of the following rotations:
Dragon’s Tooth > Flamewall > Phoenix > Arcane Wave > Water Atune > Comet > Summon LH > 2x LH Chains in field
Dragon’s Tooth > Flamewall > Phoenix > Arcane Wave > Earth Atune > Magnetic Wave > Summon LH > Water Atune > 2x LH AA Chains in field
In both cases, I’m only giving out 18 might – whereas with the rotation in the vid, I’m giving out 21 might. Seems kind of obvious to me to me that the vid’s rotation is preferable. The other thing is that, in a proper group, everyone’s spamming embers, so every single one of my LH AA chains will blast in a fire field anyway.
I used Boon Duration runes in the vid because I was doing it solo, so there were no external fire fields from Ember spamming/ guard utilities/ warrior LB/ a second ele. In the guild runs I did with the build, I used Scholars instead, and I was still able to maintain perma 25 might. When I was pug’ing, though, I used Boon Durations like in the vid because pugs are too noob to give me fire fields.
I swapped to Fire when there were 8 charges left because I spec’ed into the +10% dmg while in fire (I think I showed that in the trait selection clip). Originally, I had used a 0/20/25/25/0 build with a dmg modifier in Air, and I was swapping to Air at 8 charges in that build, but with the 30/10/10/20/0 in the vid, it’s better to go Fire. You get increased damage from: your last 2x LH chains, Dragon’s Tooth, Flamewall, Phoenix, and Arcane Wave. Also, going straight from dropping your LH to using Dragon’s Tooth, since you’re already in Fire Atune, helps to speed up the rotation.
Pugs or organized parties?
That’s an odd question to ask. By definition, you can’t go zerk unless the entire group is zerk – if they’re all in PVT/clerics and noob healing specs, and you’re in zerk and maximum DPS spec, chances are good that you’ll be downed/dead a lot since fights will last FAR too long.
I’ve been practicing this build in guild runs today, and it works perfectly. Maximum group DPS, very fast runs. I’ve also been pug’ing with it, and it works great as well – although I force the pugs to ping gear and weps and type out their trait distribution, and I /kick if they’re not in metas for their respective classes, so it’s not “real” pug’ing. No shout-heal wars, clerics guards, GS mes’s, or necros/engis/rangers, for example =D
@ Ryuken: the link I posted previously also has a section on staff if you scroll down, the 30/20/10/10/0 and 30/10/10/10/10 builds. OP asked about PvE, for which (if you’re going to use staff) you should be using one of those.
HOWEVER, if you’re going more maximum group DPS (which includes both your personal DPS and the amount of might/fury you maintain for group), you shouldn’t be using staff at all. You ought to be using s/f LH, shown in the following vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeRhQ40ckQ4
From a similar thread:
As an ele, you can maximize group DPS (which includes your own DPS, plus fury and might for group) by using the build I show in this vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeRhQ40ckQ4
Although, since you’re just starting, I’d use the 30/10/10/10/10 variation of the build in that vid (with Piercing Shards and Renewing Stamina) so you: 1) get perma vigor; and 2) don’t have to worry about keeping your health at maximum. You can switch to 30/10/10/20/0 at a later point.
It’s best to go zerk/assassins + the meta build in the vid right away, so you don’t develop any bad habits (there are far too many experienced ele’s with terrible habits already). If you start off fresh to the class with a meta build, you’ll learn in just a week to be better at dungeons than most ele’s who have played for months.
I’ll post some more clips of the build in actual combat in the next few days (by Sunday at the latest).
As an ele, you can maximize group DPS (which includes your own DPS, plus fury and might for group) by using the build I show in this vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeRhQ40ckQ4
Although, since you’re just starting, I’d use the 30/10/10/10/10 variation of the build in that vid (with Piercing Shards and Renewing Stamina) so you: 1) get perma vigor; and 2) don’t have to worry about keeping your health at maximum. You can switch to 30/10/10/20/0 at a later point.
It’s best to go zerk/assassins + the meta build in the vid right away, so you don’t develop any bad habits (there are far too many experienced ele’s with terrible habits already). If you start off fresh to the class with a meta build, you’ll learn in just a week to be better at dungeons than most ele’s who have played for months.
I’ll post some more clips of the build in actual combat in the next few days (by Sunday at the latest).
(edited by Anierna.6918)
I just finished making a vid of the new meta rotation for Ele, shown below:
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EeRhQ40ckQ4
.
I haven’t yet updated my guide with the info shown in the vid, but I’ll get on that in the next few days (Sunday at the latest).
it’s just an extra blast finisher
^ This.
For PvE, it just means that every ele build out there will be able to give the group another 3 Might. Thank God for that! The healing component doesn’t matter in PvE anyway.
I can’t believe these guys are saying 10/25/x/x/x or 25/25/x/x/x. It’s painful just reading it.
Ele needs to give Fury to the group – that means 30 in Fire. Ele should also be keeping up perma 15+ stacks of might for group – that means s/x LH.
I’ll be updating it with the s/f LH build I’m currently using, among other things, after the patch hits today. As soon as I can get some stat numbers on ascended armor, I’ll be re-optimizing the zerk/assassins and the food/stacking sigils mix for each build as well.
@ Diogo: 30/20/10/10/10 that Dub mentioned is the correct build, if you need Renewing Stamina. Getting Blasting Staff instead won’t be nearly as beneficial. If you don’t need Renewing Stamina, the 30/25/25/0/0 will do more damage than 30/20/10/10/10 with Blasting Staff. The majority of your damage will be done against single-target bosses, so a bigger Fireball won’t help. Meteor Shower will do more damage, but the majority of your damage isn’t coming from that – it’s coming from Lava Font and Fireball, and it’s assumed the single-target boss you’re fighting is standing still so Lava Font is hitting every time regardless of Blasting Staff. Blasting Staff just isn’t needed in dungeon farming, since you’ll do more damage putting those 10 trait points into a more useful trait line.
Although, this is all academic, since you should be running an LH build anyway.
The problem I see is: what if you only get part-way through an AA chain? LH chain has 3 attacks – what if you’re interrupted on the 2nd attack? Will you still lose a charge, as if you had actually completed the entire chain? A better solution would be just to give conjurers more charges, either more as the base of make the trait give more than it already does. I can see this having an effect on the LH, but not on ice bow or FGS – if you’re spec’ed into Conjurer already, the timer usually ends before the 25 charges do.
What Neko said (the first 4 paragraphs at least; not the bit about d/f. LH is higher damage and keeps up higher might and fury for the group, which is all that matters when you’re running with 4 other zerkers, as you said you are).
Read the LH meta here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/The-Ele-Meta-Dungeon-Speed-Runs/first#post3112677
After the update hits today, I’ll be updating the guide with the s/f LH build (which is what I’m currently using) and vids of might-stacking rotations for both s/d and s/f. As soon as I can get some stats on ascended armor, I’ll redo the zerk/assassins gear mix and stacking sigil/food mix for each build as well. Thank god this update is happening – I finally have something interesting to do in-game. I was getting pretty bored of Tera. lol
What happened to your sig Anierna? :o
hm. im not sure. ill look into it once I get to a comp. I jusr checked the “forum profile” page and it was still in there. maybe it just needed to be reverified.
lightning hammer and fiery greatsword are huge parts of pve. an ele without an fgs in dungeons is an abomination. ill list the places you use it below (this is just what I remember off the top of my head – there are probably more):
ac: all paths: spider queen and kholer
ac: p3: last boss
coe: all paths: subject alpha (multiple appearances)
se: p1: first and last bosses
se: p3: personnel carrier and last boss
cof: p1 & p2: slave driver
ta: up: malrona &/or fyonna
ta: fwd: laurent
cm: (cant quite remember which paths): boss in the tunnels who throws the aoe bombs
arah: all paths: lupi, usually in p3
the lh is used in the meta build for stacking bosses/adds when you cant back thrm into a wall. fgs is used when you can back them into a wall.
sry for spelling – typing from phone
Zerk. Zerk, Zerk, Zerk. …. and maybe Assassins. 
No, they never worked and they will never work.
+1
You, the squishy ele, are only being hit for 9k with Backstab? Gahd, those are some noob thieves. Thank your lucky stars you haven’t fought a REAL thief 
It isn’t Ele … it’s E.L.E. (Extinction Level Event)
As in if we get one more bad patch the elementalist will be extinct.
Too true.
@ Zelyhn: that quote may indeed be sig-worthy 
Oh, and just for the sake of argument:
http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=Vk;4BJ-U0v4Z0kY0;9;49-9JT2;35;035-47AM;5udbTudbTu-k51;5VLVQWVX_2f3l42H0BV2q;5cW5PcW5P;9;9;9;9;1NV0;1VR-6J
You don’t actually want me to comment on that build, do you? Haven’t you had enough already? It’s starting to feel like I’m taking candy from a baby.
It’s because we’re a force of nature 